Alien spaceships are impossible.

[maroonlegions]

No it is not research. It isn't even close. Your comparison between sitting an exam and your cutting and pasting is so wide of the mark it beggars belief.

 

(My response, ML)

You seem to be taking what i am saying well out of context.Right i will explain again.A researcher researchers and comes up with information ,that information is put forward to be seen by others.Now i am one of the others and i read and asses it from OTHER REPORTS that i have assessed and do some RESEARCH on possible outcomes or explanations on what it could be. You say that just because i copy and paste certain information that i do NOT research it first.

 

Any attempt by my own students to regurgitate what they have read will not be a good answer as you seem to think. It would be exactly the opposite. The purpose of the examination is so that the students can demonstrate an UNDERSTANDING of what they have read. Therefore, I would expect to see some understanding of the context of the question, temporally and spatially. I would then expect some assimilation of the data and some comparison to other work. I would then expect some understanding of the importance and some critical thinking about where the subject may be lacking.

 

Please see above my answer.(ML)

 

Simply repeating what they had read would attract zero marks. Simply repeating what you have read attracts the same view of your level of thought.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

It all depends on what the nature of the exam is about, say arithmetic ,does simply repeating that 2+2=4 from a revision book attract zero marks if 4 is given for the answer. :nah:You are simply generalising in cleaver terms the methods used in research.

 

 

I?ll take another point from your last post. The bulk of the rest of the post borders on paranoia.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

PROVE THAT QUOTE OR IS IT JUST PURE SPECULATION ON YOUR BEHALF OR BECAUSE YOU HAVE NO REAL IDEA HOW TO ANSWER IT BECAUSE ITS JUST A PERSONAL VIEW YOU HOLD BASED ON ONLY YOUR VIEWS BUT NOT ON ANY REAL BASES.

 

 

This is not an attack on religion but we can expand on what you mean.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

WHAT IS NOT AN ATTACK ON RELIGION, THE FACT THAT MOST RELIGIONS DO NOT AND I REPEAT DO NOT RECOGNISE OR EVEN MENTION ANY FORM OR REFERENCE TO EXTRATERRESTRIALS NEVER MIND THE POSSIBILITY OF THEM. You seriously saying that if the powers at be announced tomorrow that they have been in contact with several extraterrestrial intelligences that this would have no baring on most religious belief systems or have great consequences for most religions.Now that beggars belief

.

 

You are saying that despite very little actual evidence these people hang on to these mystical beliefs in supernatural powers.

 

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

Sorry i never said that i view religious people as believing in supernatural powers or in the correct terminology , psychic awareness or occult understanding and advancement.I view them as cleverly manipulated to believe in a man made concocted slavery programme of moral bondage.

 

 

 

That millions of people believe in these mystical powers and many thousands have ?proof? of religion in the form of visits from god or jesus, hearing voices, seeing visions in the sky.

 

(MY RESPONSE ,ML)

Is that your view cos it ain't mine see above answer to you last quote.

 

But what you want is for us to ignore their ?evidence? in favour of your ?evidence?. In other words, we should all realise that exactly the same ?proofs? that you set so much store in are all the imaginations of deluded religious believers. BUT you want us to believe your ?evidence? and unsubstantiated claims so that their ?evidence? will be debunked.

 

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

Could you post any proof that these people have in fact had visits from god, hearing voices and are not possible suffering from delusions, temporal lobe anomalies or have mental issues.Like the proof that you say is so anonymous

in proving that SOME UFOs could possibly be alien in origin.When use say "unsubstantiated claims", could you list any that you claim are unsubstantiated claims .

 

Do you mean all claims that include credible witnesses such as military pilots, doctors, lawyers, people with academic back grounds, ex NASA personal including some whistle blowers in that organisation .Does that also include Nick Pope the ex British MOD OFFICIAL who's job it was was to collect , surmise and investigate all UFO reports from the public, military sources and civilian air line pilots??

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

Do you honestly think that he is in your category of unsubstantiated claims", do you feel you could persuade him that his RESEARCH:10900:, of which is available in his books and talks around the world that i have read and listened too and after check myself to see if they match other known reports and sightings from around the world, sorry but i view that as research may be if you do not.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

As i asked you before what if any research have you done on this subject to justify why i should accept your views and you character assessments of me in the form of you doubting my credibility.??You your self have failed and not answered my requests for you to say or list any research you have done on this subject, but you feel its fair to doubt my research techniques and credibility.Either provide these research materials or admit you have done no real digging or research to justify your claims of "unsubstantiated claims"and "no real proof to suggest that some UFOs might have a alien origin".You could also provide you proof for your claim that i am delusional too.

 

It?s all exactly the same sort of ?evidence?. It?s all from people who WANT to believe in something. But you will not see this.

 

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

No it is not all the same,you show me a picture of God,Jesus or visions in the sky or evidence to suggest that people who heard voices are NOT delusional.I CAN SHOW YOU PICTURES OF UFOS THAT HAVE BEEN AUTHENTICATED.I can provide written texts from people like DR John Mack a well respected psychologist who has found no mental anomalies or illnesses or delusions in the patients he treated who claimed contact with Ufos and the intelligences behind them.Do you in fact include this sort of man and his unfathomed credibility and expertise and findings in your unsubstantiated claims file??I WOULD NOT BE SURPRISED IF YOU DID.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

You will not see that to try and link this kind UFO belief or experience with religious claims is not the same in either investigation techniques, photo evidence and credible witness statements or sightings.The 2 are not in hindsight or even in historical terms the same but deviated on several important and very relevant points and realities. Do you know or can you show me were these important differences or deviations are and what the real outcomes are pointing too??

 

 

 

You will probably not understand what Karl Popper was getting at here but I'll try it;

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

Nice to see you are continuing to try and cast doubt on my creditability with the above quote. I am aware of this man believe it or not and understand what he is saying trying to say.

 

?No rational argument will have a rational effect on a man who does not want to adopt a rational attitude?.

 

(MY RESPONSE, ML)

I Will respond with this, "THERE NOTHING MORE EASILY MANIPULATED THAN GENUS THAT IS NOT STREET WISE"

 

(MY RESPONSE ,ML)

You tell me were you showed in your posts any form of rationality in your arguments and creditability and character attacks on me, when you have constantly refused to say if you have done any real research on the UFO subject.I ask you this because if you have done no real digging and research or reading from well known investigators then how do you expect me to take you seriously when you do NOT know the whole picture on this subject.

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

Are you even aware that as well as MUFON in the USA ,a UFO organisation that is semi government backed there is also a British EQUIVALENT.BUFORA or British Unidentified Flying Object Association.This organisation has been at the fore front of this subject here in Britain and has and have credible personnel on board. Can you name any recent or past UFO reports that to this day after serous investigations have been rubber stamped as GENUINE UNKNOWNS that displayed serious advanced technological capabilities??

 

(MY RESPONSE,ML)

The question here for me has not changed. Why listen to people who have no real experiences or have not done nearly enough back ground research or even the basics like know how a UFO report is investigated from day one.Do you know the processes that are involved in any given UFO report that is reported to serious organisations like MUFON or BUFORA?? I will tell you one of these processes below.

 

 

It involves contacting any involved air port to asked about known civilian commercial jets or planes that could have been or where in the vicinity or flight path of a UFO that was sighted in that area of sky.Then the MOD is contacted, then weather conditions, then the witnesses creditability or mental heath is investigated can you name any more??

 

Just one last thing my good man, in reference to your quote on paranoia i take it it was on my point of a possible cover up on UFOs by the powers at be.If so could you tell me what D-10 NOTICE IS, who issues it and in what circumstances is it issued .Also what is its purpose.

[Ulysses]

That's the way, ML - keep it short and to the point.

 

[Munch]

You mean you were never really sure if they could not exist but decided to name this thread as "ALIEN SPACESHIPS ARE IMPOSSIBLE ".

 

For the last time i will ask ,PROVIDE PROOF OR EVIDENCE THAT ADVANCED EXTRATERRESTRIALS DO NOT EXIST.

 

PROVIDE PROOF OR EVIDENCE THAT THESE INTELLIGENCES HAVE NOT, COULD NOT HAVE OVERCOME WHAT WE CURRENTLY KNOW ABOUT PHYSICS AND TECHNOLOGY.?? Do we seriously take this question as a legitimate fact or is it never considered because it seriously damages this argument of the impossibility in advanced intelligences that are way beyond us in evolutionary terms, understanding and technology achievements??

 

No matter the circumstantial evidence provided by military personnel witnesses,radar operators, fighter pilots and the thousands of highly classified UFO documents that have been released by our country and many other countries Ministry of Defences its never enough is it. Take a good look through these documents and see if they provide enough insight to the facts that our governments in the past and recently have always denied that they do not take the UFO reports seriously because it does not contain any real threats to our NATIONAL SECURITY. That statement from our governments in the past is blown wide open and seen to be a massive lie when you RESEARCH AND STUDY these documents.They did and always have taken every report ,especially if it involved military personnel or from commercial air line pilots very seriously indeed.This was hammered home when the below question was raised by a researcher and investigator,

 

"HOW COME THE FACT THAT A GOOD NUMBER OF THESE OBJECTS HAVE BEEN ABLE TO ENTER AND LEAVE RESTRICTED BRITISH AIR SPACE AT WILL AND OUT MANOEUVRE AND EVADE, (SHOWING ADVANCED DISPLAYS OF TECHNOLOGY), MILITARY JETS AND THIS IS NOT REGARDED AS A THREAT TO OUR NATIONAL SECURITY???? THE FACT THAT THESE OBJECTS CAN COME AND GO AS THEY PLEASE AND THE BRITISH MOD AND GOVERNMENT CAN DO NOTHING ABOUT IT.":stuart:

 

The amount of information on this subject is massive and sometimes complex. To say out right just now that they are impossible on what we CURRENTLY UNDERSTAND JUST NOW is rather hasty and not all together logical to say the least. Not having a go mate but really, the amount of witnesses and (especially the credible ones, military, astronomers, doctors,lawyers ect), objects caught on film and photos since the early forties is enough smoke to produce a very big fire. In fact it goes back further than that to the Sumerian and Inca texts and paintings that depict possible objects and star systems.The Mayans had drawings of star systems that to this day are thought to depict astronomical realities at the time of their drawing.A ancient Mayan text:10900: was said to have included a 12 PLANET OUT SIDE OUR SOLAR SYSTEM ,this was mocked and laughed at until recently NASA discovered the possible existence of a 12 planet JUST OUT SIDE OUR SOLAR SYSTEM.Were these races contacted in the past, there seems to be a bit of supporting circumstantial evidence like the above to suggest that they well mat have but who knows eh, does anyone really?? Keep it open and keep it possible. that if you want to that is.

 

I Have got to hand it too you some of this stuff is credibale, what you really need to prove your point is for an Alien flying saucer to crash land, and we find the thing still intact.

 

If the little green Aliens are brown bread inside, that would be a shame, but this would prove your point once and for all.

 

Perhaps there is such a thing in a hanger in Area 51 near Roswell in the USA, just like in the film with Will Smith in it Independance Day.

 

Perhaps you can give us a longer explanation to the above points with more information and actual credible witness reports.

 

we shall see.

[maroonlegions]

I Have got to hand it too you some of this stuff is credibale, what you really need to prove your point is for an Alien flying saucer to crash land, and we find the thing still intact.

 

If the little green Aliens are brown bread inside, that would be a shame, but this would prove your point once and for all.

 

Perhaps there is such a thing in a hanger in Area 51 near Roswell in the USA, just like in the film with Will Smith in it Independance Day.

 

Perhaps you can give us a longer explanation to the above points with more information and actual credible witness reports.

 

we shall see.

 

 

 

 

Seek and ye shall find and ask and ye shall receive, knock and the door shall be opened.

 

 

 

Link for live an up to date UFO reports from around the world http://www.ufostalker.com/?mufon=true

 

link for field investigators reports http://www.mufon.com/InvestigatorForms.htm

 

link for photos and findings. http://www.mufon.com/library.htm

 

 

Link for the facts not the myths on UFOs http://www.mufon.com/fastfacts.htm

 

 

link for past reports on investigators findings http://www.mufon.com/bobpratt_frame.htm

 

Mufon is a scientific study of UFOs, no tinfoil hats on any of these people.

 

You will see there is a wealth of information and findings here.Take a look and see for your self.Will post more information witnesses reports and their creditability but for now i think you have a lot of studying to do.

[Ulysses]

Seek and ye shall find and ask and ye shall receive, knock and the door shall be opened.

 

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

Perhaps you can give us a longer explanation to the above points

 

 

 

with more information and actual credible witness reports.

 

I'm lovin' your comedy style.

[maroonlegions]

 

 

http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/classic.html'>http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/classic.html

 

 

http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/classic.html

 

http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/belgium.html

 

http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/howhigh.html

 

Just a few links to creditable sightings from creditable witnesses and governmental sightings as well.

Check the links and see for yourself.

[maroonlegions]

 

 

 

 

I'm lovin' your comedy style.

 

Here is one very credible witnesses report One instance occurred in March 1951 and involved the U.S.S. Dyess, a Navy destroyer on picket duty about one hundred twenty five miles southeast of Cape May, New Jersey. http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/howhigh.html

[maroonlegions]

http://www.mufon.com/bob_pratt/berryon.gif

 

[Ulysses]

Here is one very credible witnesses report....

 

Of what?

 

(Keep your reply under 100 words, thanks - and no links)

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Maroonlegions, I sincerely hope that something incredible happens during our lifetimes so that you can say "I told you so", you would deserve it.

 

The evidence you link us to from this thread is so tempting and thought provoking.

[maroonlegions]

Maroonlegions, I sincerely hope that something incredible happens during our lifetimes so that you can say "I told you so", you would deserve it.

 

The evidence you link us to from this thread is so tempting and thought provoking.

 

 

Well thank you for those kind words.I supose the last thing that is on my mind is to go na,na na,na,na, told ya.Hate coming across as a smarty pants or people perciving me in that way but i do get your point. This information below is very interesting , water on the moon never,pigs will fly next eh.

 

Chandrayaan's big discovery, water on the moon.

 

Pallava Bagla, Thursday September 24, 2009, New Delhi

 

India's maiden mission to the moon, Chandrayaan, found first evidence of water on the lunar surface before it terminated. A joint Indo-US study published in the prestigious American journal Science has revealed this startling finding. link source http://www.ndtv.com/news/sci-tech/chandrayaans_big_discovery_water_on_the_moon.php

[Gigolo-Aunt]

ML...

 

Do you support the theory that UFO's activity increased around the time of H bombs etc, that UFO's could detect this progress by mankind and were wanting to observe just what we were up to with this power?

[maroonlegions]

Posted by Prakash Palakasseril on Sep 24, 2009

 

"This is just the beginning of lot more discoveries that are yet to be done and we Indians are very sure that Indian missions would top the list in the future.":2thumbsup:

 

Just a wee quote from the last link i provided on the discovery of water on the moon.I wonder what the cowboys have to say:nah:.Well done India ,hopefully they will be a lot more open on any other discovery's in their future missions.

[spud]

As i started this id like to know if my initial posting was right, what do you think "ALIEN SPACESHIPS ARE IMPOSSIBLE "

 

Was i right ?

 

Saying that they are impossible is beyond scientific thought and into the realms of speculation. The word impossible also implies proof. As you probably know science can prove nothing. So we accept falsifiable hypotheses with some degree of confidence.

 

Given the number of galaxies, I would have to say that it is not impossible and reject your hypothesis. However, this is only based on probability and not on any physical evidence or statistical testing of data.

 

Sorry about the formality of my answer.

[Ulysses]

ML...

 

Do you support the theory that UFO's activity increased around the time of H bombs etc, that UFO's could detect this progress by mankind and were wanting to observe just what we were up to with this power?

 

Dunno, but this seems like a more plausible explanation (to me at any rate).

 

 

 

 

[Gigolo-Aunt]

hahahaha

 

 

Another thing that gets me...

 

You have all this weird **** going on at these "secret army bases in the desert" - claims they are UFO's down to people saying we are not advanced enough for what these crafts are doing.

 

How do these people know just how advanced the American military is?

[maroonlegions]

Space probes find water on the moon 2009/09/24

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/N...cle/index_html

 

 

- Water particles have been detected on the surface of our Moon by three missions, including an Indian probe.

- The evidence, disclosed in new scientific papers, overturns the long accepted view that lunar soil is dry.

- They estimate that each ton of lunar soil consists of 25 percent water.

- Samples of lunar rock and soil brought back to Earth by Apollo astronauts in the 1960s also contained traces of water.

 

 

- ?To some extent, we were fooled,? said Taylor, who has studied the original Apollo missions. ?Since the boxes leaked, we just assumed the water we found was from contamination with terrestrial air.?

 

Just goes to show that even experts can be fooled like the above quote from Taylor . What other misinterpretations have been formulated on and not just the moon but other extraterrestrial body's and planets.We in fact get it wrong on occasions and that is just with the moon never mind this vast and imaginable universe. What's next that they will have to re-evaluate or get wrong MARS the planet that NASA is currently studying and has probes on its surface sending back stunning pictures.

[maroonlegions]

ML...

 

Do you support the theory that UFO's activity increased around the time of H bombs etc, that UFO's could detect this progress by mankind and were wanting to observe just what we were up to with this power?

 

 

I do think that there was a sufficient increase in activity around the time you mention , yes that is correct.From the first time a civilian pilot named Kenneth Arnold observed shiny saucer shaped objects,(this is were the media got their terminology from, as he described them as saucer shaped), following his private plane one day i think before Roswell happened there was sufficient increases in activity that started to get the USA military s attention and that started a long history of denial from them.Now Roswell happened not long after the H bomb testing and up to the events leading towards the Roswell incident there was reported military sightings around military bases of apparently unknown objects displaying advanced technology.It is very interesting to note that the pre Roswell activities were not as savagely debunked or explained away until Roswell happened. These objects were reported and seen before Roswell even happened.Its strange that of all the country's releasing their official secret UFO files through the freedom of information act the USA still to this day refuses to do so.I must say that your point raised in your post was a very good shout.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Space probes find water on the moon 2009/09/24

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/N...cle/index_html

 

 

- Water particles have been detected on the surface of our Moon by three missions, including an Indian probe.

- The evidence, disclosed in new scientific papers, overturns the long accepted view that lunar soil is dry.

- They estimate that each ton of lunar soil consists of 25 percent water.

- Samples of lunar rock and soil brought back to Earth by Apollo astronauts in the 1960s also contained traces of water.

 

 

- ?To some extent, we were fooled,? said Taylor, who has studied the original Apollo missions. ?Since the boxes leaked, we just assumed the water we found was from contamination with terrestrial air.?

 

Just goes to show that even experts can be fooled like the above quote from Taylor . What other misinterpretations have been formulated on and not just the moon but other extraterrestrial body's and planets.We in fact get it wrong on occasions and that is just with the moon never mind this vast and imaginable universe. What's next that they will have to re-evaluate or get wrong MARS the planet that NASA is currently studying and has probes on its surface sending back stunning pictures.

 

The Japanese have spent some considerable resource on this subject and appear to be sure that there is enough H2O in moon rock to make the moon a viable construction site and staging post for more ambitious space exploration (the bulk of fuel used by Apollo type spacecraft and Space shuttle missions is just to get it beyond the Earth's gravatational pull). It may not be Space 1999, but we are getting there.

[spud]

 

Just goes to show that even experts can be fooled like the above quote from Taylor .

 

Or is it just you?

 

I honestly did try to plough through some of your latest posts. One point I did get is that you wanted some photographic "proof" of god or jesus or something.

 

Well here is a couple (jesus in a kitkat and jesus in marmite). I think they are ridiculous, you probably think so too. But many people believe that these are true representations and messages from a higher power. The people who believe have been studying their subject for years and many of them have postgraduate degrees. They have their own webs sites and their own followers who belief just as much as you do in your faded, out of focus evidence.

 

But just like your experts, they have published nothing in any peer reviewed journals. Journals which have in the past published thousands of article which have changed the way human's think or questioned the fabric of society. In the field of physics alone, Relativity, Quantum Physics, String Theory, the lists are endless.

 

And why do these "experts" not publish? Because there is a government conspiracy against creationists, crop circlists, alien landing believers, take your pick. All of them have enormous amounts of evidence but the powers that be are all trying to shut them up. Notice that it is always the powers that be or some such. When pressed they cannot name these people, they only know that there are loads of them and they are all really powerful. They don't have any hard evidence, they just know that there is this huge body of unknown people acting in secret to thwart the truth.

 

Now, what do you call someone who thinks that there are lots of unknown people who are out to "get him?"

 

Of course there is another reason that they do not publish in any credible journal. Because they know that their "evidence" would get the reception it deserves.

 

Before I leave this subject, did you know that there is a creationist organisation which offers 1 million dollars to anyone who can "prove" Darwin's theory of evolution? Did you know that no one has won the money?

 

Does this negate the theory? No. It is impossible to win because no matter what evidence is produced, the judges shift the goal posts. Like yourself. One of your standard answers is "can you prove that there is no government conspiracy". This sort of statement is utterly laughable, of course I can't. Can you prove that there are not little green men who live in the heads of humans? Can you prove cups don't have conversations when you leave the room? If my dog barks and it rains, can you prove that my dog cannot predict the weather?

 

All of these statement have one thing in common.

 

"In so far as a scientific statement speaks about reality, it must be falsifiable; and in so far as it is not falsifiable, it does not speak about reality." The Logic of Scientific Discovery, Karl Popper, 1934.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

I do think that there was a sufficient increase in activity around the time you mention , yes that is correct.From the first time a civilian pilot named Kenneth Arnold observed shiny saucer shaped objects,(this is were the media got their terminology from, as he described them as saucer shaped), following his private plane one day i think before Roswell happened there was sufficient increases in activity that started to get the USA military s attention and that started a long history of denial from them.Now Roswell happened not long after the H bomb testing and up to the events leading towards the Roswell incident there was reported military sightings around military bases of apparently unknown objects displaying advanced technology.It is very interesting to note that the pre Roswell activities were not as savagely debunked or explained away until Roswell happened. These objects were reported and seen before Roswell even happened.Its strange that of all the country's releasing their official secret UFO files through the freedom of information act the USA still to this day refuses to do so.I must say that your point raised in your post was a very good shout.

 

Do you happen to have to hand any information on how far our earliest radio waves will have travelled by now?

[Gigolo-Aunt]

I do think that there was a sufficient increase in activity around the time you mention , yes that is correct.From the first time a civilian pilot named Kenneth Arnold observed shiny saucer shaped objects,(this is were the media got their terminology from, as he described them as saucer shaped), following his private plane one day i think before Roswell happened there was sufficient increases in activity that started to get the USA military s attention and that started a long history of denial from them.Now Roswell happened not long after the H bomb testing and up to the events leading towards the Roswell incident there was reported military sightings around military bases of apparently unknown objects displaying advanced technology.It is very interesting to note that the pre Roswell activities were not as savagely debunked or explained away until Roswell happened. These objects were reported and seen before Roswell even happened.Its strange that of all the country's releasing their official secret UFO files through the freedom of information act the USA still to this day refuses to do so.I must say that your point raised in your post was a very good shout.

 

 

 

Cheers for that, interesting stuff.

 

Read this a few months back, if you have not read it, would recommend it.

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Need-Know-UFOs-Military-Intelligence/dp/0330442961/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1253993880&sr=1-2

[maroonlegions]

UFO photographed over Devon

An amateur astronomer has captured pictures that appear to show a UFO hovering over Devon.

 

Published: 11:32AM BST 24 Sep 2009

Lee Betts, 29, spotted the glowing red shape hovering 1,000ft up in the night sky from his bedroom window.

 

 

 

Betts took this photograph with the help of his telescope from his bedroom window Photo: APEX

 

source link

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/ufo/6226201/UFO-photographed-over-Devon.html

source link.

 

Looks kinda HAZY but a amateur astronomer feeling that this was amazing and unexplained.

[maroonlegions]

Cheers for that, interesting stuff.

 

Read this a few months back, if you have not read it, would recommend it.

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Need-Know-UFOs-Military-Intelligence/dp/0330442961/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1253993880&sr=1-2

 

Yes, Tim Good a friend of a Lord Admiral who was chief of staff of her majesty's Royal Naval Fleet who came out and attacked the MOD for failing to reveal their reports of what is happening and came to the conclusions that some UFOs are in fact of unknown origin. He is a very good researcher and have read some of his books ,Above Top Secret was a classic, he was once interviewee on a Nicky Campbell radio programme in the 90s and had dozens of call from listeners describing their sightings.He revealed the levels of military security clearances that range from 1 to 10 and the compartmentalisation of a need to know bases on classified UFO documents and reports.I remember him saying that in the scales of 1-10 in security clearances the present prime minister of any given time only has a security clearance off 2.. Tim GOOD IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED FOR PEOPLE COMING INTO THIS SUBJECT FOR THE FIRST TIME. He has invaluable research material and contacts high up in the military who want this stuff out in the open.

[Gigolo-Aunt]

Yes, Tim Good a friend of a Lord Admiral who was chief of staff of her majesty's Royal Naval Fleet who came out and attacked the MOD for failing to reveal their reports of what is happening and came to the conclusions that some UFOs are in fact of unknown origin. He is a very good researcher and have read some of his books ,Above Top Secret was a classic, he was once interviewee on a Nicky Campbell radio programme in the 90s and had dozens of call from listeners describing their sightings.He revealed the levels of military security clearances that range from 1 to 10 and the compartmentalisation of a need to know bases on classified UFO documents and reports.I remember him saying that in the scales of 1-10 in security clearances the present prime minister of any given time only has a security clearance off 2.. Tim GOOD IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED FOR PEOPLE COMING INTO THIS SUBJECT FOR THE FIRST TIME. He has invaluable research material and contacts high up in the military who want this stuff out in the open.

 

 

Pretty sure the Admiral chap pops up in the book.

 

Probably not the right thread, but...

 

Ever read up on the JFK assassination? Any thoughts on who was behind it?

[22HMFC22]

Never realised there were 10 ! thought there were only 4 in the UK. Interesting

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Maroonlegions, I am curious about your view on Governments and their possible cover-ups.

 

What do you think the reaction of the proloteriat would be to a definate encounter? Would a cover up be possibly appropriate to avoid panic? I know that this might sound like a 1950's film, but the reality is that a very large part of the world's population is not very intelligent.

[maroonlegions]

Well this thread has been a bit busy and interesting,time for a nice cold beer.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Well this thread has been a bit busy and interesting,time for a nice cold beer.

 

Indeed!

[spud]

Yes, Tim Good a friend of a Lord Admiral who was chief of staff of her majesty's Royal Naval Fleet

 

Wow, so a rear admiral had a friend who said something on the radio. And this impresses me how? I have attended meetings with Alistair Darling. Does this empower me to comment on the economic health of the country?

 

who came out and attacked the MOD for failing to reveal their reports of what is happening and came to the conclusions that some UFOs are in fact of unknown origin.

 

What an amazing conclusion; these UFOs are of unknown origin. Does that mean that they are unidentified so their origin is unknown?? I'm shocked.

 

He is a very good researcher and have read some of his books ,Above Top Secret was a classic, he was once interviewee on a Nicky Campbell radio programme in the 90s

 

Well why have you not told us about this guy in the past? The Nicky Campbell radio programme eh? Not just any radio programme then? Did he mention all the journal articles that he has published?

 

and had dozens of call from listeners describing their sightings.

 

Dozens of them? If he revealed that we had been visited by aliens and everybody took it seriously, surely the fabric of our society would be threatened, religions would crumble? But he only had dozens of callers? Ah well, maybe it was a slack time for Nicky Campbell?

 

He revealed the levels of military security clearances that range from 1 to 10 and the compartmentalisation of a need to know bases on classified UFO documents and reports.I remember him saying that in the scales of 1-10 in security clearances the present prime minister of any given time only has a security clearance off 2..

 

The prime minister only has a 2? What does that mean? Does he get told that there are UFOs but we can't tell you any more than that? Or does he get told about some UFOs and not others? I'm genuinely intrigued by what a 2 level is. But wait, a 2 would mean that there is 8 levels above the PM??? I didn't realise the extent of the coverup. And these people are so powerful that they let Tim go on a radio progamme and reveal all this? I'm even more shocked. I am really disappointed in these people. They are supposed to look after my thoughts and views and they let some researcher, albeit a very good one (Thanks ML) reveal the nations secrets on a radio programme??? I'm more than shocked.

 

Tim GOOD IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED FOR PEOPLE COMING INTO THIS SUBJECT FOR THE FIRST TIME. He has invaluable research material and contacts high up in the military who want this stuff out in the open.

 

Oops a bit of a caps lock scare there. Highly recommended?? By you, of course. And he has contacts high up in the military that want all this revealed? Would that be the same people high up in the military that keep all this a secret? Or are we now talking about different people high up in the military?

 

Its all so confusing. Keep posting to keep us all on the straight and narrow. Oh what am I saying. Of course you will keep posting, so that you can tell us about our closed minds, and the coverup and the out of focus photos and the :sleeping::sleeping:

[maroonlegions]

Maroonlegions, I am curious about your view on Governments and their possible cover-ups.

 

What do you think the reaction of the proloteriat would be to a definate encounter? Would a cover up be possibly appropriate to avoid panic? I know that this might sound like a 1950's film, but the reality is that a very large part of the world's population is not very intelligent.

 

Exactly and a good shout.There are many pontifications and theory's on the reasons why there would be a cover up of massive proportions and you have raised one of them.The implications for this getting out or being disclosed is massive if you take into account the affects it would have on science ,religious moral , political and social issues. Peoples views or beliefs in the latter would have to be either changed or re-evaluated to accommodate this world shattering news.Can you imagine the majority of the peoples realisation that in fact we do not know all there is to know about every thing and the possible elation from certain groups on a non religious persuasion that would call on why all religions have failed to even address these intelligences in their religious doctrines and question the very doctrines their religion was based on. That is a very possible probability of why this is so ruthlessly denied by those factions at the helms of religious, political and military power. Panic is a very possibility and i for one do not blame the governments for holding back, the timing has to be right.As we evolve more and understand more it could also bring better understanding and less of a panic attack or shock.Who is to say that through our past and present governments there has been not been a determined education programme from these intelligences , slowly revealing themselves to us over the years and increasing communications through chosen mediums like our governments or scientific establishments who will act as the go go-between so to speak.The scientific establishments will be the first to comprehend or start to understand more in the nature of these education programmes but the timing or time might not yet be right to openly admit that we have or have been for a long time been in direct contact with these intelligences.A cover up in these lights can be viewed as a necessary evil so to speak , time will tell as always but there are good and maybe evebn bad reasons for a possible cover up.Time for another beer.

[Munch]

Having now read all your links i conclude you are are paranoid, i would recommend you seek medial help.

 

I Conclude my original post, your evidence is non conclusive, unless you can conclude a longer story.

[Ulysses]

...i would recommend you seek medial help...

 

A good way to treat excessive lateral thinking, IMO.

[maroonlegions]

Wow, so a rear admiral had a friend who said something on the radio. And this impresses me how? I have attended meetings with Alistair Darling. Does this empower me to comment on the economic health of the country?

 

 

 

What an amazing conclusion; these UFOs are of unknown origin. Does that mean that they are unidentified so their origin is unknown?? I'm shocked.

 

 

 

Well why have you not told us about this guy in the past? The Nicky Campbell radio programme eh? Not just any radio programme then? Did he mention all the journal articles that he has published?

 

 

 

Dozens of them? If he revealed that we had been visited by aliens and everybody took it seriously, surely the fabric of our society would be threatened, religions would crumble? But he only had dozens of callers? Ah well, maybe it was a slack time for Nicky Campbell?

 

 

 

The prime minister only has a 2? What does that mean? Does he get told that there are UFOs but we can't tell you any more than that? Or does he get told about some UFOs and not others? I'm genuinely intrigued by what a 2 level is. But wait, a 2 would mean that there is 8 levels above the PM??? I didn't realise the extent of the coverup. And these people are so powerful that they let Tim go on a radio progamme and reveal all this? I'm even more shocked. I am really disappointed in these people. They are supposed to look after my thoughts and views and they let some researcher, albeit a very good one (Thanks ML) reveal the nations secrets on a radio programme??? I'm more than shocked.

 

 

 

Oops a bit of a caps lock scare there. Highly recommended?? By you, of course. And he has contacts high up in the military that want all this revealed? Would that be the same people high up in the military that keep all this a secret? Or are we now talking about different people high up in the military?

 

Its all so confusing. Keep posting to keep us all on the straight and narrow. Oh what am I saying. Of course you will keep posting, so that you can tell us about our closed minds, and the coverup and the out of focus photos and the :sleeping::sleeping:

 

I will answer all of your points when you answer my questions i have put to you on previous posts to you namely this.Please list or say in what capacity you have researched this subject or admit you have little knowledge of this subject, can you have the decency to a least acknowledge this question.Please also remind me of the proof you have provided in successfully persuading me to accept your rather ignorant views of why there is not one shred of evidence or circumstantial evidence to why i should take your points seriously when you cannot answer my questions without any coherent honesty??

 

You are also very wrong about The Admiral, he had very high clearances and was privy to highly classified information , he had to be being a commander in chief of the Royal Navy.So your point in say he was merely a friend is entirely mis leading as all of your posts have been to me. I WILL ANSWER ALL OF YOUR POINTS AS I EXPLAINED EARLIER but you have to hurry as one is getting sightly board with your constant and apparent lack of knowledge and meanderings speculations, one is resigned to yet another beer.ALL OF YOUR POINTS RAISED IN THIS POST ARE WRONG AND DISPLAY IGNORANCE ON THIS SUBJECT.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Exactly and a good shout.There are many pontifications and theory's on the reasons why there would be a cover up of massive proportions and you have raised one of them.The implications for this getting out or being disclosed is massive if you take into account the affects it would have on science ,religious moral , political and social issues. Peoples views or beliefs in the latter would have to be either changed or re-evaluated to accommodate this world shattering news.Can you imagine the majority of the peoples realisation that in fact we do not know all there is to know about every thing and the possible elation from certain groups on a non religious persuasion that would call on why all religions have failed to even address these intelligences in their religious doctrines and question the very doctrines their religion was based on. That is a very possible probability of why this is so ruthlessly denied by those factions at the helms of religious, political and military power. Panic is a very possibility and i for one do not blame the governments for holding back, the timing has to be right.As we evolve more and understand more it could also bring better understanding and less of a panic attack or shock.Who is to say that through our past and present governments there has been not been a determined education programme from these intelligences , slowly revealing themselves to us over the years and increasing communications through chosen mediums like our governments or scientific establishments who will act as the go go-between so to speak.The scientific establishments will be the first to comprehend or start to understand more in the nature of these education programmes but the timing or time might not yet be right to openly admit that we have or have been for a long time been in direct contact with these intelligences.A cover up in these lights can be viewed as a necessary evil so to speak , time will tell as always but there are good and maybe evebn bad reasons for a possible cover up.Time for another beer.

 

Thanks for taking the time to respond. Enjoy your beer, personally I might put the DVD of Close Encounters on, as they say, fiction is sometimes closer to the truth than fact. Goodnight.

[spud]

ALL OF YOUR POINTS RAISED IN THIS POST ARE WRONG AND DISPLAY IGNORANCE ON THIS SUBJECT.

 

What? You mean someone was impersonating Alistair Darling? Could it be??

 

Anyway, what is grade 2 clearance for UFO landings? Please explain as I remain intrigued. Does the PM get told that there might be UFO landings? Or that they did land but not told the location?

 

Does grade 3 clearance mean you get told the landing site but not that they landed? Or maybe that they had their landing gear down but changed their minds?

 

And what about grade 1 clearance?? Will that will be where you are told that you have grade 1 clearance but not told anything.

 

I have never heard of anything so patently ridiculous in all my life. Actually I have. The fact that someone could believe this utter tosh.

 

PS. I greatly apologise for sounding dramatic, but revealing the subject I work on would also reveal my identity, especially to a grade A researcher like yourself.

[spud]

You are also very wrong about The Admiral, he had very high clearances and was privy to highly classified information , he had to be being a commander in chief of the Royal Navy.So your point in say he was merely a friend is entirely mis leading as all of your posts have been to me.

 

So now he's an admiral not a rear admiral and as you were writing he got promoted to C in C of the Royal Navy???

 

But surely his clearance etc is not relevant. You said it was his friend who was on the radio revealing the state secrets. It was you who said he was a friend, not me. I haven't heard of any of them so exactly why I am misleading you?

 

Who was on the radio? The admiral or his friend. It seems that you aren't too sure now.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

So now he's an admiral not a rear admiral and as you were writing he got promoted to C in C of the Royal Navy???

 

But surely his clearance etc is not relevant. You said it was his friend who was on the radio revealing the state secrets. It was you who said he was a friend, not me. I haven't heard of any of them so exactly why I am misleading you?

 

Who was on the radio? The admiral or his friend. It seems that you aren't too sure now.

 

 

Why do you call yourself Spud? Are you a potato or do you just look like one?

 

How do you grow? Being a potato, typing must be very difficult for you, how can you prove that it is you doing the typing?

 

I have seen lots of photographs of potatoes, but they don't seem to prove that you exist. Maybe if I see you make a speech in the Whitehouse or Westminster I will know that you are real.

[dale8809]

This is balls

[maroonlegions]

So now he's an admiral not a rear admiral and as you were writing he got promoted to C in C of the Royal Navy???

 

But surely his clearance etc is not relevant. You said it was his friend who was on the radio revealing the state secrets. It was you who said he was a friend, not me. I haven't heard of any of them so exactly why I am misleading you?

 

Who was on the radio? The admiral or his friend. It seems that you aren't too sure now.

 

 

I really do not know how you can be confused on which man i said was on the radio .It was Tim Good who was on the radio, here is a little bit about him.

 

 

Ufological career

 

In addition to his background in classical music, Good grew up with a strong interest in aviation and space which became an interest in UFOs in 1955 after he encountered the writings of Major Donald Keyhoe. In 1961, after reading a book by U.S. Air Force intelligence officer Captain Edward J. Ruppelt, Good began conducting his own research into the UFO phenomena, eventually becoming a well known authority on the subject.

After the end of the cold war, and the collapse the Soviet empire, Good became the first Western Ufologist to be interviewed on Russian television. He was also invited to the Pentagon in 1998[citation needed], and at the headquarters of the French Air Force in 2002[citation needed], to discuss UFOs and other related matters, and has acted as consultant for several U.S. Congress investigations.[citation needed]

Timothy Good is probably best known among ufologist's for his ground breaking book "Above Top Secret" Which is an eye opening look at the structure of sensitive top secret info that is kept under wraps in various Governments around the world. According to ufologist Timothy Good (in his books Alien Liaison and Alien Contact), after Jackie Gleason's death his wife reported that one day in 1973 Gleason had come home extremely shaken. He confided to her that because of Gleason's interest in UFOs, U.S. President Richard Nixon, who was a friend of his, had arranged for him to view bodies of extraterrestrials at Homestead Air Force Base, Florida, under conditions of extreme secrecy. Gleason had found the experience very troubling.

 

 

As you said you no very little about these men, well will you now admit that you no very little about who relevant these men are to this subject.Also i take it you also no very little on UFOs judging by your complete lack off response on my questions relating to what and if any research you have done on this subject.Yet you feel that you are qualified enough to make uneducated statements on this subject ,how would you response if one of your students was making uneducated assumptions and speculations on a subject they have NOT studied. Of course his clearances are relevant , these clearances allowed him to have accesses to highly classified documents, this is the Admiral ,chief of staff i am talking about just to let you know.

 

Also this Admirals credibility was not in doubt and the fact he wrote a preface for Tim Goods book Above Top secret is very important here.You my friend are the one who is coming across as not sure, given the facts that you no nothing of Tim Goods research and the Admirals involvement with Tim. On the subject of security clearances do you or do you not admit that the information Tim received from the Admiral IS VERY IMPORTANT here as well as this Admirals CREDIBILITY. Do you also want me to explain a D-10 notice to you as well on your point of paranoia??

 

 

TimGood

 

Timothy Good is considered one of the world's leading experts on the UFO phenomenon and last spoke to BBC WM in July 2008.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/birmingham/realmedia/timothy_good31809.ram

 

I would listen to this programme and if you do then i can have a educated conversation with you on this subject.

[maroonlegions]

Some more information on Tim Good and the Admiral.

 

 

 

Timothy Good's first book, Above Top Secret: The Worldwide UFO Cover-up (1987) became an instant bestseller, and is regarded widely as the definitive work on the subject, together with the fully revised and updated book replacing it, Beyond Top Secret: The Worldwide UFO Security Threat (1996), which remained for five weeks on the Sunday Times bestseller list. Alien Liaison: The Ultimate Secret (1991) spent thirteen weeks on the same bestseller list. Alien Base: Earth's Encounters with Extraterrestrials (1998) went to No.4 on the Guardian bestseller list. His book, Unearthly Disclosure: Conflicting Interests in the Control of Extraterrestrial Intelligence (2000) was serialized in the Daily Mail. He has also edited a number of books on the subject, including the bestselling Alien Update (1993).

 

 

Four of these books have a foreword by Admiral of the Fleet The Lord Hill-Norton, former Chief of the Defence Staff and Chairman of the NATO Military Committee. THERE IN BLACK AND WHITETHE ADMIRAL LORD HILL-NORTON.

 

 

His latest book is Need to Know: UFOs, the Military and Intelligence, now published in paperback in the U.K. (July 2007) and in the U.S. and Canada (September 2007

 

SOURCE LINK http://www.timothygood.co.uk/

[Frankenstein Jambo.]

Can someone please post the link again. The OP one is not working.

[Munch]

Saying that they are impossible is beyond scientific thought and into the realms of speculation. The word impossible also implies proof. As you probably know science can prove nothing. So we accept falsifiable hypotheses with some degree of confidence.

 

Given the number of galaxies, I would have to say that it is not impossible and reject your hypothesis. However, this is only based on probability and not on any physical evidence or statistical testing of data.

 

Sorry about the formality of my answer.

 

Yes i hear what you are saying, however with all these thousands of sightings of UFOs you would have thought that at least one would have crashed and been captured.

[Munch]

Maroonlegions, I am curious about your view on Governments and their possible cover-ups.

 

What do you think the reaction of the proloteriat would be to a definate encounter? Would a cover up be possibly appropriate to avoid panic? I know that this might sound like a 1950's film, but the reality is that a very large part of the world's population is not very intelligent.

 

No chance of a cover up in todays world, the evidence would be on youtube in seconds.

[Ulysses]

Yes i hear what you are saying, however with all these thousands of sightings of UFOs you would have thought that at least one would have crashed and been captured.

 

I don't think spud is proposing that "UFOs" are "alien spacecraft".

 

I think - and if I'm wrong I'm sure he will correct me - that spud is saying that given the sheer size of the universe and the number of stars and planets it has, it's not statistically impossible for other intelligent species to exist, and not statistically impossible for some of them to have developed a technological capacity for space exploration.

 

But just because "alien spacecraft" aren't statistically impossible doesn't mean that they are statistically probable either. So we can't say (i) that they actually exist or (ii) that any have made it to this neck of the woods.

 

One of the problems with people who blur the lines between science and science fiction is that they cannot get their heads around two very big numbers. One is the size of the universe; the other is the length of time for which it has been in existence.

[Ulysses]

Do you happen to have to hand any information on how far our earliest radio waves will have travelled by now?

 

Yes he does.

 

So why is he not saying? Is he part of the cover-up?

[scott_jambo]

If we take the scientific theory that the universe is infinite, then doesn't that statistically almost guarantee that there is more than us out there?

[Ulysses]

If we take the scientific theory that the universe is infinite

 

The universe isn't infinite. It's just really big.

[scott_jambo]

The universe isn't infinite. It's just really big.

 

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

On a serious note, in scientific terms, both are theories until you can prove either way.

 

The latest theory is that the universe is a doughnout shape, so it feels infinite because it is a circular shape, and you can leave the doughnout shape and re enter at another part - the 4th dimension - which leaves room for the idea of time travel.