National rail strikes planned by RMT

[Dazo]

8 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

You're confusing how I've retorted to you when you've posted as a self entitled ignorant whingebag with how I feel about customers. You don't have the first clue how I feel about my customers.

 

Understand that you don't exist as a customer if we lose this fight. We lose this and you're a number on a seat/in a vestibule with your face in an armpit. There won't be anyone in a ticket office to help you or anyone left on a train to help if your journeys gone wrong. You won't even be able to buy a bottle of water on a 6 hour journey. I'm the guy that bitches at control and refuses to take a service until they swap a short formed train back to what it should be(this gives another 300 people a chance of a sitting in their booked seat). That guy won't exist if that have their way. Understand that if we lose this vulnerable people will be more at risk on trains. A larger number of people in wheelchairs will be left on platforms, a larger number of people in wheelchairs will miss their stops (regularly). A larger number of people that need assistance at their destination just won't get that help they need. I'm sure you don't fit into any of the above but good luck to you if you do and we lose this fight.

You gloated about taking the car to work  during the strike and didn’t care how other people managed. Yep got a fair idea of how you feel about your customers. The rest is just a pile union noise. You’re always angry about something IJ, think it’s the left wing inside you. 

 

[frankblack]

11 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

If you're going to look at one specific quarter, only fair to include all the information.

 

https://dataportal.orr.gov.uk/media/2124/passenger-rail-usage-apr-jun-2022.pdf

 

"Strike action

In the latest quarter, strike action by the RMT union took place on 21, 23 and 25 June. In response a reduced timetable was put in place on the strike days and the days between (22 and 24 June). Compared with the equivalent days in the week before and the week after the strikes, the trains planned in Great Britain were down by around 80% on the strike days and by around 25% on the days between the strike days."

 

So 3 days operating at 20% and 2 at 75%

 

I see that actual usage was 75.8% compared to 3 years earlier despite losing such a chunk.

 

Turnover is actually the key figure here as that is what pays salaries and funds pay rises.

 

That link I posted showed 30% decrease from 3 years ago.

[The Real Maroonblood]

18 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

We've had some poor pay rises around the 1% mark in the previous 10 years which has seen our wage fall way behind the level it used to be at. We've never been on strike over pay or been treated how we're being treated just now though. There's every chance we would be on strike just over pay just now but it just happens that there are many more important things at stake along with it.

 

👍

[Unknown user]

3 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Turnover is actually the key figure here as that is what pays salaries and funds pay rises.

 

That link I posted showed 30% decrease from 3 years ago.

 

You were talking about usage I believe, not turnover.

[Unknown user]

14 minutes ago, Dazo said:

You gloated about taking the car to work  during the strike and didn’t care how other people managed. Yep got a fair idea of how you feel about your customers. The rest is just a pile union noise. You’re always angry about something IJ, think it’s the left wing inside you. 

 

 

He's given you a fair answer, why turn to personal attacks?

[IronJambo]

16 minutes ago, Dazo said:

You gloated about taking the car to work  during the strike and didn’t care how other people managed. Yep got a fair idea of how you feel about your customers. The rest is just a pile union noise. You’re always angry about something IJ, think it’s the left wing inside you. 

 

I was hardly gloating about driving to work. I don't particularly enjoy driving along the M4 at 4am. I don't like making it difficult for my Mrs to get the kids to school/nursery. Costs me £15 in fuel and around the same in taxi's. 

 

What sort of oddball are you that could read what I said and interpret it as a boast?

 

And that's the only thing you pick out front the post you've just quoted? There's something wrong with you, you clearly just want to troll.

[fabienleclerq]

28 minutes ago, Dazo said:

To be fair the thread has moved on from the thread title to covering the strikes all over the rail network. 

Your last sentence is balanced and fair enough. Inflation as the barometer is all a bit hypocritical  for me as no one is screaming for 1% rise when inflation is low. 

 

This is true however we are talking about people who have gone several years with no increase.

 

The government is taking advantage of the living crisis to try squeeze out the terms and conditions. I don't actually think there's a plan other than fight the unions and make cuts to up profits.

 

 

 

[Dazo]

3 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

I was hardly gloating about driving to work. I don't particularly enjoy driving along the M4 at 4am. I don't like making it difficult for my Mrs to get the kids to school/nursery. Costs me £15 in fuel and around the same in taxi's. 

 

What sort of oddball are you that could read what I said and interpret it as a boast?

 

And that's the only thing you pick out front the post you've just quoted? There's something wrong with you, you clearly just want to troll.

You like to chuck the insults about eh. Look at your post, you couldn’t care less how other people got about when the strike is on because you could drive to work. What exactly is anyone to take from that ? I think it’s closer to not giving a shit about your customers than you care to admit and you don’t like that pointed out to you especially in the middle of strikes. 

[Dazo]

6 minutes ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

This is true however we are talking about people who have gone several years with no increase.

 

The government is taking advantage of the living crisis to try squeeze out the terms and conditions. I don't actually think there's a plan other than fight the unions and make cuts to up profits.

 

 

 

Everyone is taking advantage of the cost of living crisis. Governments, Unions and Retailers. 

[IronJambo]

10 minutes ago, Dazo said:

You like to chuck the insults about eh. Look at your post, you couldn’t care less how other people got about when the strike is on because you could drive to work. What exactly is anyone to take from that ? I think it’s closer to not giving a shit about your customers than you care to admit and you don’t like that pointed out to you especially in the middle of strikes. 

Hand on heart, I've never ever been anywhere that you can only get to by train. 

[Unknown user]

1 hour ago, Dazo said:

You like to chuck the insults about eh. Look at your post, you couldn’t care less how other people got about when the strike is on because you could drive to work. What exactly is anyone to take from that ? I think it’s closer to not giving a shit about your customers than you care to admit and you don’t like that pointed out to you especially in the middle of strikes. 

 

More personal attacks?

[il Duce McTarkin]

1 hour ago, IronJambo said:

 

Understand that you don't exist as a customer if we lose this fight. We lose this and you're a number on a seat/in a vestibule with your face in an armpit. There won't be anyone in a ticket office to help you or anyone left on a train to help if your journeys gone wrong. You won't even be able to buy a bottle of water on a 6 hour journey. I'm the guy that bitches at control and refuses to take a service until they swap a short formed train back to what it should be(this gives another 300 people a chance of a sitting in their booked seat). That guy won't exist if that have their way. Understand that if we lose this vulnerable people will be more at risk on trains. A larger number of people in wheelchairs will be left on platforms, a larger number of people in wheelchairs will miss their stops (regularly). A larger number of people that need assistance at their destination just won't get that help they need. I'm sure you don't fit into any of the above but good luck to you if you do and we lose this fight.

 

Good post. 

 

1 hour ago, Dazo said:

You’re always angry about something IJ, think it’s the left wing inside you. 

 

Factual conclusion.

 

[Dazo]

56 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

Hand on heart, I've never ever been anywhere that you can only get to by train. 

Me either, not sure of relevance though as not everyone can drive or has a car though. Travelling by bus is brutal compared to train imo. 

[IronJambo]

11 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Me either, not sure of relevance though as not everyone can drive or has a car though. Travelling by bus is brutal compared to train imo. 

You're not sure the relevance? The relevance being that people can easily take a bus, drive, get a lift, take a taxi, cycle, walk, fly....... The train was never ever the only option if you drive or not.

[Dazo]

5 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

You're not sure the relevance? The relevance being that people can easily take a bus, drive, get a lift, take a taxi, cycle, walk, fly....... The train was never ever the only option if you drive or not.

What is easy to you or even me isn’t easy to everyone or cost effective. My wife and I spend thousands on train travel every year for work and leisure. For none of the reasons you listed earlier incidentally. She wouldn’t be driving to Glasgow or Newcastle for meetings during strikes. Because I have a bad back I use the train as I can get up and walk about, I’m not driving for 6 hour round trips instead of fairly comfortable 4 hour train journey. 

[IronJambo]

19 minutes ago, Dazo said:

What is easy to you or even me isn’t easy to everyone or cost effective. My wife and I spend thousands on train travel every year for work and leisure. For none of the reasons you listed earlier incidentally. She wouldn’t be driving to Glasgow or Newcastle for meetings during strikes. Because I have a bad back I use the train as I can get up and walk about, I’m not driving for 6 hour round trips instead of fairly comfortable 4 hour train journey. 

I get that. It's not cost effective for me to be on strike either. 

 

Not many people need to travel for meetings these days but I hear you. There are certainly buses to Glasgow and Newcastle though and neither of them take much longer than a train. The bottom line is there's certainly an alternative option open to you instead of the train whether you like it or not. 

 

Serious question, who's going to find a seat for you when your backs playing up on a full and standing train when there are no guards left or even any staff on board? I'm not calling you vulnerable but you're tipping into that territory where you just might need some help. I help that many people on trains on a daily basis that I need to think hard to remember what I done for people as I forget about it as soon as it's done. 

 

You throw cheap shots on here about the strikes and shout about how we don't care. The email I posted a screenshot of on Sunday of the "offer" they gave us basically says we'd be giving up our jobs if we accepted it. That leaves no help for anyone, be careful what you wish for. 

[BlueRiver]

It'll hurt the average commuter but I hope they direct their anger where it should be directed. 

 

This isn't on the strikers, it is on the bosses offering deals that no one with a functioning brain would consider acceptable. 

 

Unfortunately the press want to focus too much on the base pay increases and completely ignore that a lot of this comes down to the terms and conditions as well. 

[Dazo]

3 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

I get that. It's not cost effective for me to be on strike either. 

 

Not many people need to travel for meetings these days but I hear you. There are certainly buses to Glasgow and Newcastle though and neither of them take much longer than a train. The bottom line is there's certainly an alternative option open to you instead of the train whether you like it or not. 

 

Serious question, who's going to find a seat for you when your backs playing up on a full and standing train when there are no guards left or even any staff on board? I'm not calling you vulnerable but you're tipping into that territory where you just might need some help. I help that many people on trains on a daily basis that I need to think hard to remember what I done for people as I forget about it as soon as it's done. 

 

You throw cheap shots on here about the strikes and shout about how we don't care. The email I posted a screenshot of on Sunday of the "offer" they gave us basically says we'd be giving up our jobs if we accepted it. That leaves no help for anyone, be careful what you wish for. 

Your first sentence we’ve already covered, you’re not working so you’re not getting paid. You absolutely have the right to strike, I’m not arguing otherwise. Don’t bleat about pay though as disgruntled customers aren’t interested especially the ones who are impacted financially or otherwise. 
 

There are other options but that doesn’t mean it’s okay or people aren’t impacted. Face to face interaction or team meetings are important for mental health alone for a lot of people never mind anything else. 
 

Ffs I’m not that bad mate. 😂 As I’ve said none of the things you do currently assist me and I’m not playing down your job here but I’m perfectly fine dealing with any issues. 
 

Cheapshots ? People in glasshouses IJ. This is kickback, it’s a playground for arseholes mainly. Signed Oddball. 😊

[Nucky Thompson]

36 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

I get that. It's not cost effective for me to be on strike either. 

 

Not many people need to travel for meetings these days but I hear you. There are certainly buses to Glasgow and Newcastle though and neither of them take much longer than a train. The bottom line is there's certainly an alternative option open to you instead of the train whether you like it or not. 

 

Serious question, who's going to find a seat for you when your backs playing up on a full and standing train when there are no guards left or even any staff on board? I'm not calling you vulnerable but you're tipping into that territory where you just might need some help. I help that many people on trains on a daily basis that I need to think hard to remember what I done for people as I forget about it as soon as it's done. 

 

You throw cheap shots on here about the strikes and shout about how we don't care. The email I posted a screenshot of on Sunday of the "offer" they gave us basically says we'd be giving up our jobs if we accepted it. That leaves no help for anyone, be careful what you wish for. 

It takes 40 minutes getting to Berwick on a train or 2.5 hours by bus travelling through all those wee east coast towns 

[Japan Jambo]

1 minute ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It takes 40 minutes getting to Berwick on a train or 2.5 hours by bus travelling through all those wee east coast towns 

 

can't put a caravan on a train though Nucky 🤷‍♂️

[The Real Maroonblood]

8 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It takes 40 minutes getting to Berwick on a train or 2.5 hours by bus travelling through all those wee east coast towns 

That’s terrible.

Thoughts and prayers to all those who it may affect.

[Nucky Thompson]

25 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

can't put a caravan on a train though Nucky 🤷‍♂️

I'm sure someone will be along with a photo soon enough to prove otherwise 

[Nucky Thompson]

19 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

That’s terrible.

Thoughts and prayers to all those who it may affect.

Doesn't affect me as I couldn't sit on a bus that long 

 

Made my daughter jump on it one time though to make use of Sturgeon's free bus pass 

[The Real Maroonblood]

5 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Doesn't affect me as I couldn't sit on a bus that long 

 

Made my daughter jump on it one time though to make use of Sturgeon's free bus pass 

👍

[Japan Jambo]

4 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Doesn't affect me as I couldn't sit on a bus that long 

 

Made my daughter jump on it one time though to make use of Sturgeon's free bus pass 

 

More comfortable on the yacht anyways, no drinking and steering issues. 😉

[Dazo]

21 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Doesn't affect me as I couldn't sit on a bus that long 

 

Made my daughter jump on it one time though to make use of Sturgeon's free bus pass 

Bus pass isn’t free Nucky. 😊

[frankblack]

5 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

You were talking about usage I believe, not turnover.

 

Yes, but I realised turnover is the key as season ticket sales or lack of due to hybrid working are better reflected.

[Unknown user]

8 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Yes, but I realised turnover is the key as season ticket sales or lack of due to hybrid working are better reflected.

 

The key to what? You were saying that train use is down 25%, but it isn't. The quarter you gave to back yourself up included a working week affected by strike action during summer and was 75.8%, but that obviously doesn't reflect demand for the services.

[IronJambo]

3 hours ago, Dazo said:

Your first sentence we’ve already covered, you’re not working so you’re not getting paid. You absolutely have the right to strike, I’m not arguing otherwise. Don’t bleat about pay though as disgruntled customers aren’t interested especially the ones who are impacted financially or otherwise. 
 

There are other options but that doesn’t mean it’s okay or people aren’t impacted. Face to face interaction or team meetings are important for mental health alone for a lot of people never mind anything else. 
 

Ffs I’m not that bad mate. 😂 As I’ve said none of the things you do currently assist me and I’m not playing down your job here but I’m perfectly fine dealing with any issues. 
 

Cheapshots ? People in glasshouses IJ. This is kickback, it’s a playground for arseholes mainly. Signed Oddball. 😊

Yeah mate those things mentioned might not effect you but they do effect many others. Get rid of all the train and those people are stuffed. You rightly said "What is easy to you or even me isn’t easy to everyone or cost effective". 

[kila]

For all the train customer concern Dazo shows during the strikes, he sure doesn't care about the customer when the Tories are hacking our services to bits. Too quick to blame the worker rather than the policy maker.

 

 

[frankblack]

3 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

The key to what? You were saying that train use is down 25%, but it isn't. The quarter you gave to back yourself up included a working week affected by strike action during summer and was 75.8%, but that obviously doesn't reflect demand for the services.

 

Don't think you are helping yourself here with a flawed argument.

 

A service riddled by strikes is not going to increase its turnover.  Its called biting the hand that feeds.

[Unknown user]

4 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Don't think you are helping yourself here with a flawed argument.

 

A service riddled by strikes is not going to increase its turnover.  Its called biting the hand that feeds.

 

You were claiming that demand for services was down and quoted a 75% figure.

 

I'm not putting forward any argument, I'm just saying that train usage isn't generally down 25%, and that usage was affected in that particular quarter due to industrial action.

[Dazo]

13 hours ago, kila said:

For all the train customer concern Dazo shows during the strikes, he sure doesn't care about the customer when the Tories are hacking our services to bits. Too quick to blame the worker rather than the policy maker.

 

 

Not sure the government has much input in hacking to bits the railways these days Kila. Anyway I wouldn’t say I was concerned about customers more about strikers attitude to customers. As such a person I feel it’s okay to have an opinion on my experience as a customer.  Not looking to blame anyone but if you are striking not everyone is happily patting them on the back. 

[Nucky Thompson]

According to the Guardian, Christmas party cancellations are nearing Omicron levels 

 

The rail strikes are going to cost the hospitality sector £1.5 billion.

[The Real Maroonblood]

18 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

According to the Guardian, Christmas party cancellations are nearing Omicron levels 

 

The rail strikes are going to cost the hospitality sector £1.5 billion.

The last sentence is nonsense.

How will that stop people spending money in the hospitality sector?

[Nucky Thompson]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

The last sentence is nonsense.

How will that stop people spending money in the hospitality sector?

Just quoting what's being reported

 

Christmas party cancellations ‘near Omicron level’ as UK rail strikes loom – business live (theguardian.com)

[fabienleclerq]

28 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

According to the Guardian, Christmas party cancellations are nearing Omicron levels 

 

The rail strikes are going to cost the hospitality sector £1.5 billion.

 

Think of the tax money the government could save by giving the workers a wee pay rise and removing the ridiculous conditional offer.

Edited December 8, 2022 by fabienleclerq

[Victorian]

If there are economic consequences to result out of various public sector industrial disputes then the solution is to adequately invest in services and people.  Make a reasonable effort to settle pay negotiations.

 

The hard line approach to pay demands is 100% a political choice to pander to right wing arseholes,  both within the party and elsewhere.  The choice to award real terms pay cuts and oversee decline in services is the choice of the government.  Consequences arising are the fault of the government.  Nobody else.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Just quoting what's being reported

 

Christmas party cancellations ‘near Omicron level’ as UK rail strikes loom – business live (theguardian.com)

Surely people will still spend their money in the pubs.

Try booking in Edinburgh city centre just now and you’d be lucky to get a reservation.

[il Duce McTarkin]

19 hours ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

can't put a caravan on a train though Nucky 🤷‍♂️

 

19 hours ago, Nucky Thompson said:

I'm sure someone will be along with a photo soon enough to prove otherwise 

 

Your Mrs burn the toast again, Nucky?

 

 

 

[Nucky Thompson]

5 minutes ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

 

 

Your Mrs burn the toast again, Nucky?

 

 

 

Vola! 

[il Duce McTarkin]

4 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

Vola! 

 

I'm predictable AF tbf.

[BlueRiver]

1 hour ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Surely people will still spend their money in the pubs.

Try booking in Edinburgh city centre just now and you’d be lucky to get a reservation.

 

I guess some of them may end up cancelled depending on folks ability to get into and out of the city at later times? 

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, BlueRiver said:

 

I guess some of them may end up cancelled depending on folks ability to get into and out of the city at later times? 

They could visit somewhere near their home and get pished.

🍺🍷👍

[BlueRiver]

20 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

They could visit somewhere near their home and get pished.

🍺🍷👍

 

Aye but you can hardly have your work night out centred around one person's local village 40 mile from the city the work is in. 

[Dazo]

31 minutes ago, BlueRiver said:

 

I guess some of them may end up cancelled depending on folks ability to get into and out of the city at later times? 

Hardly a guess that’s the exact reason. Not everyone has a work night out with local people in a local location. Financial sector alone have teams spread all over the country. **** them though, just have a pint in your local. 😂

[SectionDJambo]

If the rail strikes cause a significant amount of office Christmas parties to be cancelled, that would almost certainly result in a wee respite for the already very busy A&E staff in hospitals. Maybe a good thing for hospital staff.

What seems to be missed here, in my opinion, is that these workers who are now going on strike have been seeing the real value of their take home pay reduced significantly over the last 10 years. Now we have a situation where an unexpected sharp rise in inflation has seen these workers decide that enough is enough. The government has just assumed that low inflation would continue and the gradual erosion of workers take home pay would continue. Remember Johnson saying that there was no chance of inflation rising sharply? As with covid, no planning for the unexpected happening. 

This is a situation that has been at risk of happening for a long time. In the meantime, we hear of management bonuses and share dividends, sometimes fuelled by government subsidies, which bear little or no comparison to the reduced rewards that the workers have received for their efforts. 

Genuine question, how much have MPs salaries and expense allowances gone up in the last 10 years, in comparison to the nurses?

[Nucky Thompson]

2 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Hardly a guess that’s the exact reason. Not everyone has a work night out with local people in a local location. Financial sector alone have teams spread all over the country. **** them though, just have a pint in your local. 😂

As long as the workers are getting it up ra toaries eh

 

The Tories don't give a feck and ordinary people are collateral damage 

[Dazo]

1 minute ago, Nucky Thompson said:

As long as the workers are getting it up ra toaries eh

 

The Tories don't give a feck and ordinary people are collateral damage 

Maybe they can all drive to their works night out, that or hoverboard apparently. 😂

[Harry Potter]

4 hours ago, Dazo said:

Maybe they can all drive to their works night out, that or hoverboard apparently. 😂

Better avoiding works nights oot, 😬, chance of making a clown of ones self lol