National rail strikes planned by RMT

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, Jeffros Furios said:

 

I've never been so angry as I  have been these last few years ..the Tories are self serving cheating thieving scum .

Amen to that. 

1 hour ago, Victorian said:

 

Barclay's comments are vile.  Boy's a cretinous scumbag.  

 

Playing beautifully to his audience, the culture wars stoked Nazi/Express reading halfwits. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

14 hours ago, Nucky Thompson said:

I think it was the Unions that Harper was accusing

 

And by implication the members of said unions, imo.

[ri Alban]

 

[Thunder and Lightning]

17 hours ago, Jeffros Furios said:

The public should be protesting in the streets not just the workers  , 100's billions spunked in the last few years.. services decimated and working conditions eroded .. The economy's ****ed and Brexit has been a disaster .

These jokers need kicked out and let Starmer try and negotiate a deal with the EU re workers and trade .

The Daily Mail and GB News need closed down as they keep brainwashing the easily led bigots and thickos .

I've never been so angry as I  have been these last few years ..the Tories are self serving cheating thieving scum .

 

And breathe 

 

 

You have never been so angry, but what have you done about it?  Now, before you get upset, that's not aimed at you, it's aimed at us all.  Why do we continue to sit here and take it?

 

What is there we can do (apart from vote) if something more, how do we do it and what do we do?

 

 

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Thunder and Lightning said:

You have never been so angry, but what have you done about it?  Now, before you get upset, that's not aimed at you, it's aimed at us all.  Why do we continue to sit here and take it?

 

What is there we can do (apart from vote) if something more, how do we do it and what do we do?

 

 

Well let me think 🤔 Too late! 

 

 

 

 

Yes independence 2014. 

[Thunder and Lightning]

1 minute ago, ri Alban said:

Well let me think 🤔 Too late! 

 

 

 

 

Yes independence 2014. 

 

Here he is, ri Angry.

 

how long till you get banned from this thread?

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

14 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

 

Excellent. 

[ri Alban]

 

[AlimOzturk]

1 hour ago, ri Alban said:

 

Last year we clapped. This year they are murderers for wanting fair pay. If people die the blood is on this tory government not unions or nurses/ambulances. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

3 hours ago, AlimOzturk said:

Last year we clapped. This year they are murderers for wanting fair pay. If people die the blood is on this tory government not unions or nurses/ambulances. 

 

That's only part of it, alongside pay and perhaps even more importantly is safe staffing levels.

In fact I would hazard an educated guess that if you offered nurses, for example, a pay rise of say 5% with the absolute guarantee that there would be safe staffing levels adhered to immediately, then I think they would go for that.

 

The media only wants to concentrate on the pay side of things, is it just a coincidence that that's what the government PR machine only wants to talk about as well.  The government doesn't want to talk about people dying everyday in wards, on trolley's, in the back of ambulances stuck outside of A&E's because there are often simply not enough staff to care for them, no, the government don't want to talk about that, instead they want to label NHS workers as wanting to harm patients.

 

Steve Barclay should be sacked for that comment.  Health care workers will long remember what he said.

 

[il Duce McTarkin]

6 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Steve Barclay should be sacked for that comment.  Health care workers will long remember what he said.

 

 

A late contender for understatement of the year.

 

[jack D and coke]

23 hours ago, ri Alban said:

 

The govt must be spewing that there is a guy like Mick Lynch who doesn’t get flustered, doesn’t mince his words and they can’t land a glove on the guy. 
Wankers like Kwarteng and that thick ******* Truss can cost the country over £70billlion in about a week yet they’ve got the guns on nurses, doctors and teachers and rail workers etc. 
Without the working class the country or even the world ceases to function as we know it. 
Im almost at the point of protesting and I’ve never gave that shite a thought my whole life  

I’m sick to death of the people in govt and the media that facilitates it. 

[Japan Jambo]

29 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

The govt must be spewing that there is a guy like Mick Lynch who doesn’t get flustered, doesn’t mince his words and they can’t land a glove on the guy. 
Wankers like Kwarteng and that thick ******* Truss can cost the country over £70billlion in about a week yet they’ve got the guns on nurses, doctors and teachers and rail workers etc. 
Without the working class the country or even the world ceases to function as we know it. 
Im almost at the point of protesting and I’ve never gave that shite a thought my whole life  

I’m sick to death of the people in govt and the media that facilitates it. 

 

could swear that number keeps going up. are you using the Seville calculator jack? 😜

[jack D and coke]

43 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

could swear that number keeps going up. are you using the Seville calculator jack? 😜

Seen it at £74🤷🏽‍♂️😂

Point bring they can make **** up after **** up and then claim there no enough money to pay people a decent wage. 
They’re aw sound though eh👍🏼

[milky_26]

scottish government to impose 7.5% pay rise on nurses after the nurses rejected the pay offer

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64076644

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 hours ago, milky_26 said:

scottish government to impose 7.5% pay rise on nurses after the nurses rejected the pay offer

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-64076644

 

Some of the nurses, not all, as Unite, Unison (the largest healthcare union) & the CSP unions accepted the 7.5% pay deal.

 

With I believe the majority of nurses in Scotland accepting the pay deal I really don't see how the RCN, RCM & the GMB unions think they could get more from the Scottish Government, they would never pay them more than the amount already agreed with the other unions, for to do so they would then have to pay the same to the Unite, Unison & CSP members or those unions would call industrial action. 

[ri Alban]

16 hours ago, jack D and coke said:

The govt must be spewing that there is a guy like Mick Lynch who doesn’t get flustered, doesn’t mince his words and they can’t land a glove on the guy. 
Wankers like Kwarteng and that thick ******* Truss can cost the country over £70billlion in about a week yet they’ve got the guns on nurses, doctors and teachers and rail workers etc. 
Without the working class the country or even the world ceases to function as we know it. 
Im almost at the point of protesting and I’ve never gave that shite a thought my whole life  

I’m sick to death of the people in govt and the media that facilitates it. 

What!? I thought the entrepreneurs made the world go round.  

 

 

 

I had it with the lot of them, a long time ago. It's time to burn the thing down. 

 

 

Lobbying should be a criminal offence. And the expenses fraud(cause that's what it is, fraud) should be abolished. £80 odd grand and these ***** are claiming all sorts. Rayner claimed £200k in expenses, the so called working class hero. 

 

 

Hopefully Mone gets wiped out and begs to come back to Scotland.

Edited December 24, 2022 by ri Alban

[Captain Sausage]

1 hour ago, ri Alban said:

What!? I thought the entrepreneurs made the world go round.  

 

 

 

I had it with the lot of them, a long time ago. It's time to burn the thing down. 

 

 

Lobbying should be a criminal offence. And the expenses fraud(cause that's what it is, fraud) should be abolished. £80 odd grand and these ***** are claiming all sorts. Rayner claimed £200k in expenses, the so called working class hero. 

 

 

Hopefully Mone gets wiped out and begs to come back to Scotland.

Agree with most of this, but I think MP ‘expenses’ is a bit of a misnomer. It covers the constituency office and staffing, the London flat for attending Westminster and covers all costs relating to travel (hence most cabinet ministers having higher expense claims than the rest). 
 

When I was working my last job, I spent 8 months travelling to a new location every day to visit vendors. My expenses were around £100k, but I didn’t see a penny. It was just the costs associated with doing my job. 

[ri Alban]

7 minutes ago, Captain Sausage said:

Agree with most of this, but I think MP ‘expenses’ is a bit of a misnomer. It covers the constituency office and staffing, the London flat for attending Westminster and covers all costs relating to travel (hence most cabinet ministers having higher expense claims than the rest). 
 

When I was working my last job, I spent 8 months travelling to a new location every day to visit vendors. My expenses were around £100k, but I didn’t see a penny. It was just the costs associated with doing my job. 

Ok Boris. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Merry Christmas 🎄 👍

[Captain Sausage]

44 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Ok Boris. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Merry Christmas 🎄 👍

Merry Christmas Aussieh 

[manaliveits105]

15 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Some of the nurses, not all, as Unite, Unison (the largest healthcare union) & the CSP unions accepted the 7.5% pay deal.

 

With I believe the majority of nurses in Scotland accepting the pay deal I really don't see how the RCN, RCM & the GMB unions think they could get more from the Scottish Government, they would never pay them more than the amount already agreed with the other unions, for to do so they would then have to pay the same to the Unite, Unison & CSP members or those unions would call industrial action. 

SNP administration  oot 

Sturgeon - BOO ! - oot  

not fit for purpose and can’t be trusted 

 

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

24 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

SNP administration  oot 

Sturgeon - BOO ! - oot  

not fit for purpose and can’t be trusted 

 

 

 

I fail to understand what any of this has to do with the way members of one union vote as opposed to the way members of another union vote.

What's that got to do with Sturgeon or the SNP?

[Francis Albert]

21 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Some of the nurses, not all, as Unite, Unison (the largest healthcare union) & the CSP unions accepted the 7.5% pay deal.

 

With I believe the majority of nurses in Scotland accepting the pay deal I really don't see how the RCN, RCM & the GMB unions think they could get more from the Scottish Government, they would never pay them more than the amount already agreed with the other unions, for to do so they would then have to pay the same to the Unite, Unison & CSP members or those unions would call industrial action. 

There is a parallel with the rail strikes. I believe all of the unions have accepted the latest offer except for the RMT which represents among the highest if not highest paid staff involved. 

And there were dire warnings of chaos yesterday as a result of the  Border Control staff strike. Military called in and most passengers seem to have found passing through the airports much better and quicker than usual. Source ... The Guardian!

Border Control has always seemed to me among the most officious and up their arses group of people interacting with the public. Not just here ... the US is particularly bad despite ESTAs. 

 

[IronJambo]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

There is a parallel with the rail strikes. I believe all of the unions have accepted the latest offer except for the RMT which represents among the highest if not highest paid staff involved. 

And there were dire warnings of chaos yesterday as a result of the  Border Control staff strike. Military called in and most passengers seem to have found passing through the airports much better and quicker than usual. Source ... The Guardian!

Border Control has always seemed to me among the most officious and up their arses group of people interacting with the public. Not just here ... the US is particularly bad despite ESTAs. 

 

Way off the mark there. The other unions involved that have made deals represent management and office based staff. They've accepted pay rises with no conditions attached 

 

RMT represent staff on gatelines, platforms, ticket offices and on board staff. Many (not all) on the lower end of the pay scale. RMT and it's members couldn't possibly have accepted what was on "offer" as it would have been throwing most of the jobs away. The 4% increase for this year and 4% for next year would amount to 8% of nothing for many as it's acceptance was on condition of accepting job losses.

 

ASLEF represent drivers who are probably at the higher end of the scale and they've not accepted any deals either. They are also against the extension of driver only operated trains. 

 

Edited December 24, 2022 by IronJambo

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

There is a parallel with the rail strikes. I believe all of the unions have accepted the latest offer except for the RMT which represents among the highest if not highest paid staff involved. 

And there were dire warnings of chaos yesterday as a result of the  Border Control staff strike. Military called in and most passengers seem to have found passing through the airports much better and quicker than usual. Source ... The Guardian!

Border Control has always seemed to me among the most officious and up their arses group of people interacting with the public. Not just here ... the US is particularly bad despite ESTAs. 

 

It's irrelevant whether they're the highest paid.

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

Merry Christmas Aussieh 

[benny]

I may have missed it but are the Labour party doing anything to put pressure on the Tory government.

[manaliveits105]

1 hour ago, benny said:

I may have missed it but are the Labour party doing anything to put pressure on the Tory government.

No they are just leaving it to their comrade puppet masters in charge of the unions then mouthing off as usual 

[ri Alban]

2 hours ago, benny said:

I may have missed it but are the Labour party doing anything to put pressure on the Tory government.

Nothing. Useless. They should be promising the world, even if they can't deliver it, not backing up this scum Tory government. 

[ri Alban]

32 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

No they are just leaving it to their comrade puppet masters in charge of the unions then mouthing off as usual 

[BlueRiver]

35 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Nothing. Useless. They should be promising the world, even if they can't deliver it, not backing up this scum Tory government. 

 

If they're saying nothing then how are they backing the Tories? 

 

We're still years out from an election...let the Tories hang themselves. There's very little need for Labour to promise anything at all that could be used as a stick to beat them if they then couldn't deliver it. 

[Francis Albert]

6 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

It's irrelevant whether they're the highest paid.

Not sure the low paid who are disproportionally suffering from strikes would agree.

[Francis Albert]

7 hours ago, IronJambo said:

Way off the mark there. The other unions involved that have made deals represent management and office based staff. They've accepted pay rises with no conditions attached 

 

RMT represent staff on gatelines, platforms, ticket offices and on board staff. Many (not all) on the lower end of the pay scale. RMT and it's members couldn't possibly have accepted what was on "offer" as it would have been throwing most of the jobs away. The 4% increase for this year and 4% for next year would amount to 8% of nothing for many as it's acceptance was on condition of accepting job losses.

 

ASLEF represent drivers who are probably at the higher end of the scale and they've not accepted any deals either. They are also against the extension of driver only operated trains. 

 

Apologies. I got ASLEF and RMT confused.

But trying to preserve uneconomic jobs and oppose new technology does not work. Remember when we had shipbuilding, a car industry,, the "print" in Fleet Street and elsewhere., Docklands, coal mining, etc. All might have died anyway but restrictive practices killed them.off sooner than necessary. Awful management equally to blame of course. The postal service  will be gone before long. 

As for driver only operated trains I remember the unions outrage when the Docklands Light Railway was built with  driverless trains. They seem to work and be as safe if not more so than other trains.

 

[IronJambo]

9 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Apologies. I got ASLEF and RMT confused.

But trying to preserve uneconomic jobs and oppose new technology does not work. Remember when we had shipbuilding, a car industry,, the "print" in Fleet Street and elsewhere., Docklands, coal mining, etc. All might have died anyway but restrictive practices killed them.off sooner than necessary. Awful management equally to blame of course. The postal service  will be gone before long. 

As for driver only operated trains I remember the unions outrage when the Docklands Light Railway was built with  driverless trains. They seem to work and be as safe if not more so than other trains.

 

Remember when people were getting caught in train doors and dragged down platforms and/or onto the track and under a train. Oh yeah, that still happens with DOO services. 

 

Did we all forget it was the train manager that stopped the sleeper train with the failed brakes a few years ago?

 

Don't fool yourself into thinking that jobs are uneconomic because they might not be seen to make money. How much is a life worth? 

 

DOO can easily be sold as safe but put a guard on there and it's even safer. 

 

DOO aside, this government wants to strip things to the bones. Safety is no longer a priority for them.

 

 

[il Duce McTarkin]

10 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

 

DOO aside, this government wants to strip things to the bones. Safety is no longer a priority for them.

 

 

 

Which is why rivers and waters around the UK are full of sewage.

[Francis Albert]

15 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

Remember when people were getting caught in train doors and dragged down platforms and/or onto the track and under a train. Oh yeah, that still happens with DOO services. 

 

Did we all forget it was the train manager that stopped the sleeper train with the failed brakes a few years ago?

 

Don't fool yourself into thinking that jobs are uneconomic because they might not be seen to make money. How much is a life worth? 

 

DOO can easily be sold as safe but put a guard on there and it's even safer. 

 

DOO aside, this government wants to strip things to the bones. Safety is no longer a priority for them.

 

 

Put two guards on and it would be safer still. It is a trade off. How much does current staffing levels cost and could that money be spent on better safety measures. I don't know.

 

 

 

 

 

[William H. Bonney]

12 minutes ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

 

Which is why rivers and waters around the UK are full of sewage.

 

2bn litres were dumped in the Thames over two days. 

[IronJambo]

4 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Put two guards on and it would be safer still. It is a trade off. How much does current staffing levels cost and could that money be spent on better safety measures. I don't know.

 

 

 

 

 

Eurostar has two guards.

 

Guards bring in over 50% of what they "cost" in revenue takings at the TOC I work for. Regardless, safety shouldn't be about money. I'm not sure what you mean really, if they get rid of guards, ticket offices, and catering staff that money will just be turned into more profit. It won't go towards a magical safety system that doesn't exist. 

 

[skinnybob72]

7 hours ago, benny said:

I may have missed it but are the Labour party doing anything to put pressure on the Tory government.

Labour don’t need to get involved or say anything. They will win the next GE by simply not being the Tories. Best to keep their mouth shut and let the Tories get on with becoming even more unelectable. 

[Francis Albert]

21 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

Eurostar has two guards.

 

Guards bring in over 50% of what they "cost" in revenue takings at the TOC I work for. Regardless, safety shouldn't be about money. I'm not sure what you mean really, if they get rid of guards, ticket offices, and catering staff that money will just be turned into more profit. It won't go towards a magical safety system that doesn't exist. 

 

Of course safety is about money. Otherwise we would still have men with red flags in front of every motor vehicle.

[Captain Sausage]

I live 25 minutes from Waterloo. A peak return costs me £18. Eighteen ****ing pounds. For 25 minutes on a sardine tin of a train. 
 

The price of public transport in this country is an absolute disgrace, particularly given the lack of reliability or space on the train. 
 

How on earth can Europe get this so right, yet we are getting absolute fleeced?!

[fabienleclerq]

9 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

Apologies. I got ASLEF and RMT confused.

But trying to preserve uneconomic jobs and oppose new technology does not work. Remember when we had shipbuilding, a car industry,, the "print" in Fleet Street and elsewhere., Docklands, coal mining, etc. All might have died anyway but restrictive practices killed them.off sooner than necessary. Awful management equally to blame of course. The postal service  will be gone before long. 

As for driver only operated trains I remember the unions outrage when the Docklands Light Railway was built with  driverless trains. They seem to work and be as safe if not more so than other trains.

 

 

Uneconomic jobs? Do you not notice the quotes in the media about how much strikes cost the economy?! They must be doing something right if them not working costs the economy so much.

 

Which technology are they refusing specifically? 

 

Doo trains aren't near as safe and it puts more responsibility on the driver who doesn't need any more. If a Doo train rocks up and there's no guard How's a person in a wheelchair getting on a nd off? Bearing in mind they want to bin station staff.

[fabienleclerq]

3 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

I live 25 minutes from Waterloo. A peak return costs me £18. Eighteen ****ing pounds. For 25 minutes on a sardine tin of a train. 
 

The price of public transport in this country is an absolute disgrace, particularly given the lack of reliability or space on the train. 
 

How on earth can Europe get this so right, yet we are getting absolute fleeced?!

Because they invest more in public transport and don't franchise out everything so shareholders take the profits.

[The Real Maroonblood]

22 minutes ago, fabienleclerq said:

Because they invest more in public transport and don't franchise out everything so shareholders take the profits.

[kila]

10 hours ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

Which is why rivers and waters around the UK are full of sewage.

England rather than the UK. 

[IronJambo]

9 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

Of course safety is about money. Otherwise we would still have men with red flags in front of every motor vehicle.

We still have and most likely always have red flags in the front and rear driving cabs in trains as well as in drivers and guards kit bags. 

Edited December 25, 2022 by IronJambo

[Japan Jambo]

12 minutes ago, IronJambo said:

We still have and most likely always have red flags in the front and rear driving cabs in trains as well as in drivers and guards kit bags. 

 

how quaint ! Are they trained in semaphore too?

[fabienleclerq]

19 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

how quaint ! Are they trained in semaphore too?

You do know there's semaphore in use all over the place?

[IronJambo]

2 hours ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

how quaint ! Are they trained in semaphore too?

I am yes. Quite common, not just in Sodor 🙃

[IronJambo]

2 hours ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

how quaint ! Are they trained in semaphore too?

Worcester Shrub Hill says hello.