Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Fun Boaby said:

Perhaps. Just doesn't seem fair that someone more vulnerable will have to wait whilst someone less vulnerable is vaccinated due to lucky geography

 

I get what you mean but the health vulnerability groups are in the first stage of roll out.  All of the most vulnerable should be covered along a similar timeframe to the 1 million by end of January.  The mass population part would be covered in the next stage and that's where Scotland may have an advantage.

[graygo]

10 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

They know it protects the vaccinated person.  Prevention of onward transmission is completely unknown so far.  If it doesn't stop transmission then the vaccine only really protects each individual.  If it also prevents virus transmitting from a vaccinated and protected person then we're golden.

 

Got you, I wasn't aware that preventing transmission was even an option. Like you say, that would be incredible news if it transpires.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, graygo said:

 

Got you, I wasn't aware that preventing transmission was even an option. Like you say, that would be incredible news if it transpires.

 

Yep.  That scenario offers up the possibility that you need only vaccinate about half the population.  It would effectively disarm the virus from spreading.  R0 number changes to about 1.  Any outbreaks easily clobbered.

[Governor Tarkin]

52 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

I was just wondering about that.

 

Artificially ambitious target date to shorten the perceived time we have to go before we see the end?   Maybe something from the behavioural boffins to help compliance?

 

I would have thought that setting yourself a really high bar to clear would be a bit risky.  If things go awry then the targets might be missed quite badly and they'll be liable to severe criticism.  I would have thought that a bit of wiggle room would be built into the timetable.

 

4.5m by spring.  Spring could mean end of May.  Just over 6 months so maybe it can be achieved,  depending on the vaccine stocks arriving in time.

 

It's a gamble, but if non compliance continues or increases throughout the winter then criticism will be the least of the goverments worries come spring.

 

Anyhow, this is the news we've all been waiting for so fingers crossed that they (and us, collectively) can pull it out of our hoops. 

 

It feels like so long since we were on the front foot.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

It's a gamble, but if non compliance continues or increases throughout the winter then criticism will be the least of the goverments worries come spring.

 

Anyhow, this is the news we've all been waiting for so fingers crossed that they (and us, collectively) can pull it out of our hoops. 

 

It feels like so long since we were on the front foot.

 

Amen to that.  I can almost taste the 35 Cuba Libres I'm having on my first night out.

[JudyJudyJudy]

26 minutes ago, weehammy said:

Great. So it now appears every kid having a strop due to not getting their own way is actually a victim. I’ll get me coat!

No I didn’t say every kid I said perhaps people shouldn’t just judge other individuals circumstances 

[manaliveits105]

30 minutes ago, weehammy said:

Wow, political opportunism! Someone should teach Sturgeon that trick.

Mrs Murrell is above that during a pandemic

 

[Ray Gin]

In light of this ray of hope, people have taken to moaning about stuff that hasn't happened now instead. Excellent work, chaps.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

In light of this ray of hope, people have taken to moaning about stuff that hasn't happened now instead. Excellent work, chaps.

 

Ken.

 

[gjcc]

1 hour ago, kila said:

Vaccinating the population in time for packed stadiums for Euro 2021 would be

 

Then BANG!
 

COVID-20. 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

Ahem. While I applaud your choice of drink - and a little worried that we might have more in common - I'd appreciate a bit of compliance please, Vic:

 

Guidelines also recommend that everyone should have at least 2 alcohol free days per week, and should not binge drink ( HM Government 2007, Scottish Government 2009).

 

https://www.gov.scot/publications/getting-priorities-right/pages/4/

 

**** that.  Never believe the science.

[AlimOzturk]

I reckon a lot of countries will require a Covid 19 proof of vaccination before they will allow me you entry. This will probably make the take up of the vaccine pretty high. 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

 

Damn tootin'.  I wonder if any of my west end sookeries will survive.  

[CavySlaveJambo]

2 hours ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

 

we have very reliable mature data on the flu and the like - we know that the jab does not protect a proportion of those at risk as 10s of 1000s die every year

 

 

A vaccine that protects against a an organism with one known antigen (Covid/Measles etc) really cannot be compared to one that has a massive variety of antigens (H1N1, H3N2 are saying what those antigens are)

 

In the spring they have to make a decision about what the most prevalent strains are.  Normally they use those circulating in the southern hemisphere. 

 

it does not protect against every single strain of flu that is circulating. just those that are perceived to be the main circulating strains that year. 

 

if they put the wrong strains in... big trouble

 

[AlimOzturk]

If and when things begin to return to normal I hope this thread is consigned to the depths of the forum never to found again. I want to forget this mess ever happened. 

[Victorian]

Just now, jonesy said:

Ha! The NHS will survive Covid only to go over the edge with the liver disease patients lined up around the block.

 

Could actually be a thing that.  If not liver disease,  maybe the other effects of 'alcohol liberalism'.  

[AlimOzturk]

5 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Or... gives me another good excuse not to have to visit the in-laws in China. Call me anti-vaxxer if you like, I'm just trying to avoid the misery of a fortnight in darkest Shaanxi.

Am not an anti vaxxer but I am not one for putting things into my body I don’t necessarily need. Pretty confident of my bodies ability to fight off Covid without it. 
 

Obviously if it was a requirement of going on holiday I would have to change my tune. 

Edited November 19, 2020 by AlimOzturk

[Dawnrazor]

10 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

Am not an anti vaxxer but I am not one for putting things into my body I don’t necessarily need. Pretty confident of my bodies ability to fight off Covid without it. 
 

Obviously if it was a requirement of going on holiday I would have to change my tune. 

I'm sort of like this, I'm quite happy ti be at the back of the queue and see how things go.

[Victorian]

Going to watch The World At War at 10.  Just to get back in the doom monger mindset.  

 

I wonder if in the future there will be an equivalent for CV.  The World On Furlough.  Narrated by Jamie Theakston.

[AlimOzturk]

1 minute ago, Dawnrazor said:

I'm sort of like this, I'm quite happy ti be at the back of the queue and see how things go.

The vast majority have a vaccine then surely with numbers like 95% effectiveness being branded about then the virus would be eradicated anyways or is that not how it works?

[Victorian]

Just now, AlimOzturk said:

The vast majority have a vaccine then surely with numbers like 95% effectiveness being branded about then the virus would be eradicated anyways or is that not how it works?

 

Yes.  It would only need a majority take up.  Maybe 50 to 60% if it proves to prevent transmission.  Not that that will prove out in time for this vaccine but it might be known later if vaccinations need to occur again or periodically.  If the vaccines don't prevent virus transmitting around then it's probably a better idea to have it.  

[JudyJudyJudy]

45 minutes ago, jonesy said:

It's like that exhilarating game where you find a lump of brown stuff on the living room carpet. Ladies and gentlemen, are you ready to play shite or chocolate?

 

 

 

15:01

'It will be safe' says health secretary

Ms Freeman says it is not yet known which vaccines will be approved for use or when doses of the vaccines will reach us.

 

The details about the characteristics of the vaccines are still unknown, she stresses.

 

The health secretary says it may take months for the facts to be known.

 

The first vaccines will require two doses, three weeks apart, but we don't know yet if boosters will be required, she says.

However, the vaccines will provide some protection, even if we don't know exactly how much.

 

"And it will be safe," she says.

 

"So when we get in touch with you please go for the vaccine," says the health secretary.

Is this a spoof ? 

[JudyJudyJudy]

36 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Ha! The NHS will survive Covid only to go over the edge with the liver disease patients lined up around the block.

Like I said the impact of any prescribed meds on the liver can be well deadly ! The vaccine will be of a certain strength so god knows what impact that may have on the liver 

[Dawnrazor]

16 minutes ago, AlimOzturk said:

The vast majority have a vaccine then surely with numbers like 95% effectiveness being branded about then the virus would be eradicated anyways or is that not how it works?

I'm not sure mate but it sounds sensible.

[Victorian]

4 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Was more worried by Vic knocking back 35 cuba libres in an evening, and thus clearly not sticking to binge drinking guidelines as set out by the SG. Compliance, as we know, is key.

 

Fingers crossed the CV vaccine has no side effects.

 

Tbf I would probably stretch it out over a longer time.  Maybe head oot at lunchtime.  Maybe grab something from Subway as a healthy eating offset.  

Edited November 19, 2020 by Victorian

[Bull's-eye]

15 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Was more worried by Vic knocking back 35 cuba libres in an evening, and thus clearly not sticking to binge drinking guidelines as set out by the SG. Compliance, as we know, is key.

 

Fingers crossed the CV vaccine has no side effects.

 

 

Victorian.........

 

A. Couldn't afford 35 Cuba Libres.

 

B. On his arse with 3.5 Cuba Libres.

 

C. 2 tins of Tennants will never constitute binge drinking.

 

Happy to set you straight jonesy. 

Edited November 19, 2020 by Bull's-eye

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

I'm with you, MMM. Basically we're writing off October-April of each year from now on. Stay indoors, don't socialise. With any luck, the effects of this annual lockdown will result in significant deaths from isolation, lack of Vitamin D and suicide. The NHS will be given some much needed breathing space as a result.

 

Don't forget, too, that travellers from the southern hemisphere may well bring the flu into the UK in our summer given their increased likelihood of exposure. Therefore, I'd suggest we ban all inter-hemispherical travel IDC.

 

Then there's this: https://inews.co.uk/news/health/air-pollution-kills-64000-people-in-the-uk-every-year-268508 I, for one, propose an immediate ban on all cars and ICE vehicles. Stuff waiting another ten years to stop selling them. This needs action now. Basically anyone on this board that drives a fossil fuel powered car is as much of a murderer as the unmasked caffeine-fix seekers in whichever branch of Nero Omiya's missus serves up her frothy lattes in.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

why would it not be considered ?

 

this year students kept way from grand-parents next year party-on share the cold and flu about and don’t forget to go and visit granny

 

the numbers die every year it’s no shock to anyone in fact would be a shock if they don’t die - why not learn from this and save more lives - think someone on here said one life was worth more than one job - we should take this forward

 

covid while horrible and clearly tragic for many should be an experience we learn from in particular to protect the elderly and more vulnerable as we will all become if we’re lucky enough to live to an age

 

lots of uncertainty this year has been one of the biggest issues - we know more about the flu the key months etc - the sacrificies would be more short-term and durations with more certainty to allow planning

 

i don’t believe there are many on here wouldn’t be prepared to lockdown on an annual basis for a couple of moths to save maybe 10000 of our aged or vulnerable

 

if we carry on as normal 10s of 1000s dying rarely at the forefront of the mind of anyone unconnected then that too is a tragedy

 

wee jimmy k is close to tears most days when she’s reading out the stats do you really think this hasn’t fundamentally changed mindsets even the likes of boris (albeit possibly because he experienced it)

[Lone Striker]

10 minutes ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

You could be on to something there, Jonesy lad.    There's a vacant place on SAGE just waiting for you  😜

[Morgan]

18 minutes ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

Some theory, J.

 

As long as folk don’t think you’re being sarcastic, this is a winner.

[Enzo Chiefo]

35 minutes ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

Exactly. This virus has made politicians think they can control the public, in order to effectively eliminate death. By all means take precautions in order to reduce risks but by trying to eliminate death, effectively we are eliminating living.  Governments need to accept that life is all about risk. Nobody wants to solely exist.

[luckydug]

2 hours ago, jonesy said:

It's like that exhilarating game where you find a lump of brown stuff on the living room carpet. Ladies and gentlemen, are you ready to play shite or chocolate?

 

 

 

15:01

'It will be safe' says health secretary

Ms Freeman says it is not yet known which vaccines will be approved for use or when doses of the vaccines will reach us.

 

The details about the characteristics of the vaccines are still unknown, she stresses.

 

The health secretary says it may take months for the facts to be known.

 

The first vaccines will require two doses, three weeks apart, but we don't know yet if boosters will be required, she says.

However, the vaccines will provide some protection, even if we don't know exactly how much.

 

"And it will be safe," she says.

 

"So when we get in touch with you please go for the vaccine," says the health secretary.

That last bit got me wondering there will be the usual weird folk with heads full of conspiracy theories, who will resist accepting vaccination. 

Folk should be issued with a vaccination proof of identity card.

Once the vaccination process is complete.

Only people who can provide proof of vaccination should be allowed in to events like football,theatre etc when these places reopen. 

 

 

[CJGJ]

Can anyone explain why I should have to suffer another lockdown just so people can go here, there and everywhere for Christmas spreading the risk of infection and that will include areas who are currently living with very low levels ?

 

It's not as if the majority of the population are even religious to any great extent and actually celebrating a religious season...they've just got a holiday and are going on a few visits to many people they normally would avoid

 

A real sign of weakness from government should they give in to this

[JyTees]

5 minutes ago, luckydug said:

That last bit got me wondering there will be the usual weird folk with heads full of conspiracy theories, who will resist accepting vaccination. 

Folk should be issued with a vaccination proof of identity card.

Once the vaccination process is complete.

Only people who can provide proof of vaccination should be allowed in to events like football,theatre etc when these places reopen. 

 

 

 

Okay Stalin. 👍🏻

[JudyJudyJudy]

3 hours ago, jonesy said:

It's like that exhilarating game where you find a lump of brown stuff on the living room carpet. Ladies and gentlemen, are you ready to play shite or chocolate?

 

 

 

15:01

'It will be safe' says health secretary

Ms Freeman says it is not yet known which vaccines will be approved for use or when doses of the vaccines will reach us.

 

The details about the characteristics of the vaccines are still unknown, she stresses.

 

The health secretary says it may take months for the facts to be known.

 

The first vaccines will require two doses, three weeks apart, but we don't know yet if boosters will be required, she says.

However, the vaccines will provide some protection, even if we don't know exactly how much.

 

"And it will be safe," she says.

 

"So when we get in touch with you please go for the vaccine," says the health secretary.

Where do I start ?
 

“ not yet known “

 

“ the characteristics of the vaccine are still unknown “ 

 

“ it may take months for the facts to be known “ 

 

“ but we don’t know yet if boosters will be required  “ 

 

“however the vaccine will provide some protection” 

 

“ even if we don’t know exactly how much “ 

 

it’s not exactly an inspiring confidence, boosting statement to the nation to convince them about the efficacy snd safety measures of a brand new vaccine 😂

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 hours ago, jonesy said:

Was more worried by Vic knocking back 35 cuba libres in an evening, and thus clearly not sticking to binge drinking guidelines as set out by the SG. Compliance, as we know, is key.

 

Fingers crossed the CV vaccine has no side effects.

To be honest I’ve never heard of Cuba libers but assume they are shots ! 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

For some deep seated psychological reason this year , we collectively became scared of dying , which is odd because it’s the only certainty in our lives . ! 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Exactly. This virus has made politicians think they can control the public, in order to effectively eliminate death. By all means take precautions in order to reduce risks but by trying to eliminate death, effectively we are eliminating living.  Governments need to accept that life is all about risk. Nobody wants to solely exist.

Well said . 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

I prefer her take on life and death 

[JudyJudyJudy]

33 minutes ago, luckydug said:

That last bit got me wondering there will be the usual weird folk with heads full of conspiracy theories, who will resist accepting vaccination. 

Folk should be issued with a vaccination proof of identity card.

Once the vaccination process is complete.

Only people who can provide proof of vaccination should be allowed in to events like football,theatre etc when these places reopen. 

 

 

That doesn’t make sense. Those vaccinated would face no risk from those not vaccinated. Only those not vaccinated would face risk from each other ! 

[JFK-1]

26 minutes ago, CJGJ said:

Can anyone explain why I should have to suffer another lockdown just so people can go here, there and everywhere for Christmas spreading the risk of infection and that will include areas who are currently living with very low levels ?

 

It's not as if the majority of the population are even religious to any great extent and actually celebrating a religious season...they've just got a holiday and are going on a few visits to many people they normally would avoid

 

A real sign of weakness from government should they give in to this

 

I'm in the US where in the era of Trump there is a culture of covid denial. A denial that's heading to be ever harder to continue. Cases are rising exponentially hospitals are becoming overwhelmed.

But getting back to Scotland isn't that the main reason they're introducing increased levels of restriction? Because they're heading to be overwhelmed by cases?

And I would agree with you on Xmas. Last I heard only around 6% of the population regularly attend any religious services. Xmas is simply traditional but so are Xmas lights. I doubt that during WW2 they were changing blackout rules to accommodate it just for the traditional Xmas season.

This pandemic is a national emergency which requires restrictions across all levels including traditions if the country is ever to emerge from this nightmare with as many as possible still alive with no permanent damage to their health.

[graygo]

30 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

That doesn’t make sense. Those vaccinated would face no risk from those not vaccinated. Only those not vaccinated would face risk from each other ! 

 

There would still be a risk although a very much reduced one. 

He's not given a thought to anyone who might not be able to have the vaccination for whatever reason, injection phobia, allergic reaction to whatever is in the vaccine etc.

 

Still, at least the minks are not getting us. 👍

 

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-denmark-mink/mutated-coronavirus-from-mink-in-denmark-most-likely-extinct-health-ministry-says-idUKKBN27Z1B5

[manaliveits105]

4 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Where do I start ?
 

“ not yet known “

 

“ the characteristics of the vaccine are still unknown “ 

 

“ it may take months for the facts to be known “ 

 

“ but we don’t know yet if boosters will be required  “ 

 

“however the vaccine will provide some protection” 

 

“ even if we don’t know exactly how much “ 

 

it’s not exactly an inspiring confidence, boosting statement to the nation to convince them about the efficacy snd safety measures of a brand new vaccine 😂

Like Nicky I would never bring politics into a pandemic but the SG statement is along the same lines as their Indy approach - no really sure !

[Heartsmad1874]

16 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

I don’t subscribe to all that baloney but am concerned regarding any long term side effects of any such vaccine 

Oh no, not long vaccine too  

[ri Alban]

A wee bit of optimistic propaganda with vaccine targets is alright in my book. Good luck to everyone involved. 

[ri Alban]

7 hours ago, jonesy said:

Thanks for the info, BE. After some of the exchanges on here in the past few months, I don't think he'd ever accept a beer from me, anyway , so guess I'll just have to take your word for it.

Why? It's good to disagree. It should Never! stop people having a beer. 

[OBE]

7 hours ago, jonesy said:

The figures prove that death is the biggest killer of otherwise living people. I demand governments ban death and that we start a real and frank discussion about something heretofore under-discussed: long death. Official statistics prove that it starts, in the vast majority of cases, at birth. 

 

On the whole, I've thoroughly enjoyed the inevitable death process, getting a wee bit more challenging now though.

[kila]

8 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Exactly. This virus has made politicians think they can control the public, in order to effectively eliminate death. By all means take precautions in order to reduce risks but by trying to eliminate death, effectively we are eliminating living.  Governments need to accept that life is all about risk. Nobody wants to solely exist.

It’s about stopping the NHS getting overwhelmed. Folk die all the time, and death cannot be stopped completely. But the flow of sick patients can be mitigated until we have a vaccine. And it really sounds like we’re mere months away from this nightmare being over. Unless the vaccine causes Leith-like attributes (teeth loss etc). 

[DETTY29]

8 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Where do I start ?
 

“ not yet known “

 

“ the characteristics of the vaccine are still unknown “ 

 

“ it may take months for the facts to be known “ 

 

“ but we don’t know yet if boosters will be required  “ 

 

“however the vaccine will provide some protection” 

 

“ even if we don’t know exactlyhow much “ 

 

it’s not exactly an inspiring confidence, boosting statement to the nation to convince them about the efficacy snd safety measures of a brand new vaccine 😂

Is there anything in what she says not true?

 

It does seem there is a bit of leap of faith with the vaccine, especially for long the immunisation lasts that I don't recall having heard with any certainty via media channels.

 

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by DETTY29

[Ron Burgundy]

11 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Is this a spoof ? 

It should be, that's incredible. Folk lapping it up as great news even more so.

[Governor Tarkin]

4 hours ago, ri Alban said:

A wee bit of optimistic propaganda with vaccine targets is alright in my book. Good luck to everyone involved. 

 

This.

 

4 hours ago, ri Alban said:

It should Never! stop people having a beer. 

 

Nicola has already seen to that.

 

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

Perhaps a wee tattoo for those who opt out? Or a wee yellow star stitched onto their clothing?

 

I approve of this sort of thing in general.