Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Norm]

27 minutes ago, kila said:

Who are they going to vote for instead? The Tories who also did lockdowns and would fall under your definition of oppression?

 

SNP do so well because there isn’t much competition. There still isn’t. 

Hard core Nats will vote SNP regardless so the other parties need to hope they can grab the floaters.

 

The Tories have had as shit a time as the SNP with Covid so unlikely they'll win anything. 

 

Libs are pretty much at the level of the Green party nowadays so unlikely there. 

 

Leaving Labour who might, just might, grab some votes. 

 

But really, while Covid has been a shit show, I think a lot of folk are still beeling about being taken out the EU and that will also have a big bearing on the votes. 

 

Basically, I don't think the Covid mess will be enough to do any major damage to the Nats. I still see them being the dominant party at Holyrood although maybe not the absolute whitewash it was going to be. 

[jack D and coke]

2 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

I tend to agree, any party in power during this cluster**** is due a kicking from the populous, with some exceptions such as NZ. However there  isn’t a viable alternative at present. 

 

In the Lothians the electoral map looks like this https://www.parliament.scot/PublicInformationdocuments/YMSP_Lothian_Eng.pdf

Whilst not trying to get involved in this political bun fight what are they supposed to do? It’s the same everywhere? All over the world basically. You have to look at who’s making all the noise here. Its the same posters who bombard every thread where they think they can give the SG a doing. This thread hasn’t really been about covid for months now.
It’s half a dozen posters trying to bore everyone to death. 

[Shanks said no]

3 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Whilst not trying to get involved in this political bun fight what are they supposed to do? It’s the same everywhere? All over the world basically. You have to look at who’s making all the noise here. Its the same posters who bombard every thread where they think they can give the SG a doing. This thread hasn’t really been about covid for months now.
It’s half a dozen posters trying to bore everyone to death. 

you are right, this was originally the Covid thread and has lost its way. There will be plenty of election threads to come. 
 

I would much rather concentrate on the lack of speed in the vaccination programme or what the figures are for traffic volume, an early lockdown measure that seems to have been forgotten. 

[jack D and coke]

Just now, The Frenchman Returns said:

you are right, this was originally the Covid thread and has lost its way. There will be plenty of election threads to come. 
 

I would much rather concentrate on the lack of speed in the vaccination programme or what the figures are for traffic volume, an early lockdown measure that seems to have been forgotten. 

Well good luck with that on this thread bud 😐

[The Real Maroonblood]

11 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Whilst not trying to get involved in this political bun fight what are they supposed to do? It’s the same everywhere? All over the world basically. You have to look at who’s making all the noise here. Its the same posters who bombard every thread where they think they can give the SG a doing. This thread hasn’t really been about covid for months now.
It’s half a dozen posters trying to bore everyone to death. 

[Shanks said no]

4 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Well good luck with that on this thread bud 😐

I know, hence why I like many others have stayed away

 

heres the transport figures ( I cant open off my phone) 

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/transport-use-during-the-coronavirus-covid-19-pandemic

[Taffin]

"This thread has been ruined about people talking politics"...proceeds to talk politics. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

 

It's a hugely political topic and very difficult to separate. If we only talked about the parts not linked to politics there wouldn't be much to talk about.

[frankblack]

1 hour ago, kila said:

Who are they going to vote for instead? The Tories who also did lockdowns and would fall under your definition of oppression?

 

SNP do so well because there isn’t much competition. There still isn’t. 

 

I would expect people voting tactically in SNP held seats for whoever was runner up last time.

 

The Lib Dems are now pretty safe in Edinburgh West in both WM and Holyrood after the SNP had it with Michelle Thomson I think her name was. She got thrown under a bus by her party due to some investigation into personal business (which she was later cleared of) and the seat left pretty much vacant.

[frankblack]

13 minutes ago, Taffin said:

"This thread has been ruined about people talking politics"...proceeds to talk politics. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

 

It's a hugely political topic and very difficult to separate. If we only talked about the parts not linked to politics there wouldn't be much to talk about.

 

[Fire_At_The_Disco]

40 minutes ago, Taffin said:

"This thread has been ruined about people talking politics"...proceeds to talk politics. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

 

It's a hugely political topic and very difficult to separate. If we only talked about the parts not linked to politics there wouldn't be much to talk about.

Exactly mate, I literally drop in here to read RedJambos daily figures and skip the plastic politicians. 

[GinRummy]

Just now, Lord BJ said:

Where to people think we will be this time next year, with COVID?

Covid 19 will be over but Covid 20 will be in full swing. 

[jack D and coke]

42 minutes ago, Taffin said:

"This thread has been ruined about people talking politics"...proceeds to talk politics. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

 

It's a hugely political topic and very difficult to separate. If we only talked about the parts not linked to politics there wouldn't be much to talk about.

Not sure if aimed at me but there’s a difference between talking about politics, decisions and outcomes and just carpet bombing a thread because you literally can’t function properly when the SNP are involved. 

[kila]

1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

Where to people think we will be this time next year, with COVID?

 

Hopefully the Oxford vaccine will be the one to restore normality because it is so cheap and easy to store. It is no good some countries being fully vaccinated while others not and mutations still happening.

 

My worry is the vaccination rollout will divide the world as poorer/conflicted countries get left behind, and the vaccine passport idea will accelerate that division.  No flights to parts of the world because they cannot afford to the vaccine, or are struggling to deploy it. Which will feed radicalisation.

 

[Victorian]

20 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

Where to people think we will be this time next year, with COVID?

 

Very hard to forecast.

 

If things go really well,  involving vaccinations to be scaled up and rolled out quickly + vaccinations proving to prevent onward infection,  the recovery to a tier 1 like state of play could be achieved and sustained from early summer.  The longer,  more drawn out thing will be the transition from 'near normal' to absolute normality.  This could be another 18 months or so.

 

One interesting thing is that they are now trialling what appears to be a post-vaccination programme,  post-infection antibody therapeutic.  An injection of antibodies to treat people unfortunate enough not to have been protected from their vaccine shots and who have contracted the virus.  Also to be used to deal with localised outbreaks.  These antibody therapeutics are very costly so it looks like something to be used as an emergency intervention rather than population immunisation at scale.

 

Poor performance by the vaccines in preventing onward infection presents a number of headaches for the recovery.  All sorts of implications that could prolong strict suppression measures for years.  All the more reason for virtually every person to do their bit by taking their vaccine.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Victorian

[Taffin]

19 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Not sure if aimed at me but there’s a difference between talking about politics, decisions and outcomes and just carpet bombing a thread because you literally can’t function properly when the SNP are involved. 

 

It's not aimed at anyone particularly but we've seen it throughout the thread. People talking politics whilst complaining about the thread being heavily political.

 

Yes, the Tories and the SNP evoke tit for tat from their supporters and opponents but given they're the governments in questions it's sort of to be expected on a thread that so closely linked to whatever actions or inactions they're involved in.

 

It's also not a dig at anyone either, I'm just surprised when people appear surprised a political topic is political.

[jack D and coke]

2 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

It's not aimed at anyone particularly but we've seen it throughout the thread. People talking politics whilst complaining about the thread being heavily political.

 

Yes, the Tories and the SNP evoke tit for tat from their supporters and opponents but given they're the governments in questions it's sort of to be expected on a thread that so closely linked to whatever actions or inactions they're involved in.

 

It's also not a dig at anyone either, I'm just surprised when people appear surprised a political topic is political.

I’d be much more likely to dig them out were they not all pretty much doing the same things give or take. We’ve had some tighter restrictions and some looser. Look around the world we’re really no better or worse off. I’ve done what I like for basically months now but get little reminders this is very real at times. A very fit guy I know had a dose recently and has completely changed his tune about it all. 
If all we only had to worry about was an election or brexit etc that would be great. 

[Nucky Thompson]

27 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Not sure if aimed at me but there’s a difference between talking about politics, decisions and outcomes and just carpet bombing a thread because you literally can’t function properly when the SNP are involved. 

It's a two way thing JD. There are also people on here who constantly defend the SNP to the hilt no matter what.

 

Some of the things posted the other night were disgusting, saying it's your own fault for putting your relatives into care homes.

 

You were critical of some of their decisions up until a few weeks ago. What's changed?

[jack D and coke]

Just now, Nucky Thompson said:

It's a two way thing JD. There are also people on here who constantly defend the SNP to the hilt no matter what.

 

Some of the things posted the other night were disgusting, saying it's your own fault for putting your relatives into care homes.

 

You were critical of some of their decisions up until a few weeks ago. What's changed?

I didn’t see that about the care homes thing so not sure what’s went on there. There is pathetically staunch defenders of them I’m well aware but this just isn’t the time for it all for me. 
I was critical but had to stop getting raging about it all it wasn’t doing my head any good at all. I’ve got family in different parts of the country and they’ve had it worse than here. Outbreaks of the disease and harsher restrictions/lockdowns etc. I just try not think too much about it all now. Raging about things doesn’t make me feel better. 

[spirt of 98]

2 hours ago, Randy Marsh said:

I won a bet at Ladbrokes (betstation in shop) on a football acca on the 23rd of December.  Around £300.  I was planning on just using these winnings for a bumper boxing day football acca.  It just never occurred to me till yesterday morning that I won't have access to the winnings now during this lockdown.   The bet I planned to go for yesterday would have come in too winning over a grand.🤦  Thanks a lot Nicola. 😂

Why blame Nicola? Why not blame all the rule breakers? As it’s been them that’s spread the virus beyond control. 

[Nucky Thompson]

6 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

I didn’t see that about the care homes thing so not sure what’s went on there. There is pathetically staunch defenders of them I’m well aware but this just isn’t the time for it all for me. 
I was critical but had to stop getting raging about it all it wasn’t doing my head any good at all. I’ve got family in different parts of the country and they’ve had it worse than here. Outbreaks of the disease and harsher restrictions/lockdowns etc. I just try not think too much about it all now. Raging about things doesn’t make me feel better. 

Fair enough. 

I don't think I can take much more of this shite. I won't be taking things for granted ever again.

 

My worry is that after this is over, they might not want to let go of the power and control.

We might be facing future restrictions on pubs in the name of public health. Just my opinion 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

39 minutes ago, kila said:

 

Hopefully the Oxford vaccine will be the one to restore normality because it is so cheap and easy to store. It is no good some countries being fully vaccinated while others not and mutations still happening.

 

My worry is the vaccination rollout will divide the world as poorer/conflicted countries get left behind, and the vaccine passport idea will accelerate that division.  No flights to parts of the world because they cannot afford to the vaccine, or are struggling to deploy it. Which will feed radicalisation.

 

 

The WHO have aquired nearly 2 billion doses of different vaccines through it's COVAX programme and is confident that it will aquire many more additional doses as and when they become available, there are currently 190 countries taking part in this programme, which includes many if not most of the World's poorest nations, which will have access to vaccines through the COVAX programme.

https://www.who.int/news/item/18-12-2020-covax-announces-additional-deals-to-access-promising-covid-19-vaccine-candidates-plans-global-rollout-starting-q1-2021

[DETTY29]

2 hours ago, kila said:

Who are they going to vote for instead? The Tories who also did lockdowns and would fall under your definition of oppression?

 

SNP do so well because there isn’t much competition. There still isn’t. 

And Leonard and Rennie have been ***** throughout.

[jack D and coke]

Just now, Nucky Thompson said:

Fair enough. 

I don't think I can take much more of this shite. I won't be taking things for granted ever again.

 

My worry is that after this is over, they might not want to let go of the power and control.

We might be facing future restrictions on pubs in the name of public health. Just my opinion 

I don’t think any of us will mate, it’s been a proper crap time. I was maybe a bit like you a few months back, literally seething and fuming at every restriction and rule change. They’ll no tell me what to do and that kind of attitude. The sooner I let it go and tried to forget it the better I felt. Avoiding this thread helps a lot as well, it’s toxic and destroyed by a small number of posters imo who try to make it all about something else entirely just compounding the misery of a shite situation we’re all in. 
 

[JFK-1]

I read somewhere that the biggest spreaders of the virus are the early 20's group. Who will be among the very last to get the vaccine. It occurred to me that given they're the ones predominately keeping it circulating perhaps a rethink may be fitting regarding who gets vaccinated when.

[Dawnrazor]

2 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

I read somewhere that the biggest spreaders of the virus are the early 20's group. Who will be among the very last to get the vaccine. It occurred to me that given they're the ones predominately keeping it circulating perhaps a rethink may be fitting regarding who gets vaccinated when.

Are they not in the age group who suffer the least when they get it though?

 

[Victorian]

People are entitled to criticise the SG.  No two ways about it.  Some of it is hysterical but that's their right.  People are equally entitled to disagree with criticisms and to 'defend' the SG.  Pretty much every defence is characterised as some kind of blind faith,  cultist denial that criticism is legitimate.  It isn't.  Often it is reasonable,  practical acceptance that SG actions are necessary or understandable.  

 

If you want the freedom to criticise the SG and be respected then perhaps you should respect those who have a different viewpoint and drop the dishonest characterisations.

[Taffin]

26 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It's a two way thing JD. There are also people on here who constantly defend the SNP to the hilt no matter what.

 

Some of the things posted the other night were disgusting, saying it's your own fault for putting your relatives into care homes.

 

You were critical of some of their decisions up until a few weeks ago. What's changed?

 

The main issues arise from both sides who will defend them (Tories or SNP) to the hilt and attack the other regardless.

 

I posted earlier in the thread about how it's a lazy stereotype to view it in such a way.

 

I'm a Scot, living in England, pro-independence, vote SNP but only as a vehicle to independence. I'm left wing, anti-conservatism yet still anti-lockdown. Boxing folk up in a way that suits such a binary narrative is stupid, people are more complex than that.

 

Would I support heavy state interference in a less capitalist system that was aimed at supporting redistribution of wealth and health? Absolutely.

 

We don't live in that system though, so whilst our only way to prosper is to play the capitalist game then I cannot support arbitrary interference when it suits and for very specific and narrow reasons. Lots of people are getting extremely rich (richer) on the back of these measures and those in the already most difficult situations are having that made worse. This state interference to 'protect us' is only harming us long term and concentrating wealth and outcomes even more so than it already is.

 

All imo, of course. I don't believe it's a hoax, I don't believe it's a grand conspiry or any of that other bollocks but I do believe it's a slow creep towards authoritarian governance but with the clear aim of increasing disparity, not reducing it.

[JFK-1]

4 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Are they not in the age group who suffer the least when they get it though?

 

 

Yes, which is probably why they don't give the proverbial feck about spreading it. The thing is the scientists are saying the immune system of the vaccinated will quickly kill off any contraction of the virus vastly reducing the spread.

Thus might it make sense to push these super spreaders up the list.

Edited December 27, 2020 by JFK-1

[JFK-1]

Just now, JFK-1 said:

 

Yes, which is probably why they don't give the proverbial feck about spreading it. The thing is the scientists are saying the immune system of the vaccinated will quickly kill off any contraction of the virus vastly reducing the spread.

Thus might it make sense to push these super spreaders up the list.

 

[Taffin]

5 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

I read somewhere that the biggest spreaders of the virus are the early 20's group. Who will be among the very last to get the vaccine. It occurred to me that given they're the ones predominately keeping it circulating perhaps a rethink may be fitting regarding who gets vaccinated when.

 

Even once vaccinated they'll still spread it. Get those who need the vaccine vaccinated and then get on with living again please.

[Dawnrazor]

2 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Yes, which is probably why they don't give the proverbial feck about spreading it. The thing is the scientists are saying the immune system of the vaccinated will quickly kill off any contraction of the virus vastly reducing the spread.

Thus might it make sense to push these super spreaders up the list.

Perhaps.

[JFK-1]

1 minute ago, Taffin said:

 

Even once vaccinated they'll still spread it. Get those who need the vaccine vaccinated and then get on with living again please.

 

I'm not condoning any changing of the order of those to be vaccinated. Merely repeating a thought that was put into my head by the experts. Who completely contradict what you're saying about the vaccinated still spreading it.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Yes, which is probably why they don't give the proverbial feck about spreading it. The thing is the scientists are saying the immune system of the vaccinated will quickly kill off any contraction of the vaccine vastly reducing the spread.

Thus might it make sense to push these super spreaders up the list.

 

The original plan was to immunise the vulnerable groups and work back through the age groups to 50.  That would prevent well over 90% of the deaths from serious illness.  It does now make good sense to also work from the other end to immunise a group who may be responsible for much of the continuing spread.  Take up of vaccinations in this group would be patchy to say the least but it would help.  Availability of vaccine will determine if this occurs.

[JFK-1]

4 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

The original plan was to immunise the vulnerable groups and work back through the age groups to 50.  That would prevent well over 90% of the deaths from serious illness.  It does now make good sense to also work from the other end to immunise a group who may be responsible for much of the continuing spread.  Take up of vaccinations in this group would be patchy to say the least but it would help.  Availability of vaccine will determine if this occurs.

 

And that's another issue. It's suspected that this group of super spreaders may not turn up en masse to be vaccinated. If that turns out to be true they're going to continue being infected and widely spreading it.

Now the first thought of most would be well who cares. The vulnerable will be vaccinated and safe. And while that will be true initially the more this demon bug is allowed to circulate the more readily and rapidly it's going to mutate into potentially more deadly forms.

Which as well as being more deadly may become resistant to our vaccines. 

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

And that's another issue. It's suspected that this group of super spreaders may not turn up en masse to be vaccinated. If that turns out to be true they're going to continue being infected and widely spreading it.

Now the first thought of most would be well who cares. The vulnerable will be vaccinated and safe. And while that will be true initially the more this demon bug is allowed to circulate the more readily and rapidly it's going to mutate into potentially more deadly forms.

Which as well as being more deadly may become resistant to our vaccines. 

 

It's one for the epidemiologists and virologists to study and monitor on a constant basis.  This virus will need to be monitored until such time as it eradicated,  which may never happen or take decades.

 

A virus evolves in order to gain the advantage of finding hosts to exist in.  Whether that becomes more troublesome if it has been suppressed to micro levels or if a larger reservoir is allowed to exist is a highly complex matter for qualified people to discover. 

[Taffin]

21 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I'm not condoning any changing of the order of those to be vaccinated. Merely repeating a thought that was put into my head by the experts. Who completely contradict what you're saying about the vaccinated still spreading it.

 

If I've missed onwards transmission being prevented apologies. I've not seen it in the press though that it's been proven which I'd have assumed would be huge news and excellent news, but I'll be delighted to be wrong on that!

[JFK-1]

Just now, Victorian said:

 

It's one for the epidemiologists and virologists to study and monitor on a constant basis.  This virus will need to be monitored until such time as it eradicated,  which may never happen or take decades.

 

A virus evolves in order to gain the advantage of finding hosts to exist in.  Whether that becomes more troublesome if it has been suppressed to micro levels or if a larger reservoir is allowed to exist is a highly complex matter for qualified people to discover. 

 

Definitely a case for the experts to be mulling over all possibilities which i'm more than confident they already will be. And regarding the young super spreaders being tardy when it comes to being vaccinated there may already be an answer to that in the pipeline.

I have a suspicion that many employers are going to insist that all employees and most definitely any new hires be vaccinated. It may become a requirement just to get a job.

Then there's other activities like simply boarding a plane. The airlines have already begun insisting that passengers carry proof of vaccination. Nation states around the world may insist anyone entering their country carry proof of vaccination.

Such restrictions may radiate out to all manner of everyday activities making it a necessity to be vaccinated if you want to take part in life.

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

I tend to agree, any party in power during this cluster**** is due a kicking from the populous, with some exceptions such as NZ. However there  isn’t a viable alternative at present. 

 

In the Lothians the electoral map looks like this https://www.parliament.scot/PublicInformationdocuments/YMSP_Lothian_Eng.pdf

With Baroness Brass Neck leaving the Tories are likely to lose Edinburgh Central, but Angus Robertson doesn’t fill most with much confidence. Hamilton must lose his seat too surely.  Ash and Ben will be fine. 
But the roll out of the vaccine and who gets it, along with whatever happens with tiers etc might well influence the outcomes. 

Edited December 27, 2020 by Pasquale for King

[Pasquale for King]

11 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

It's one for the epidemiologists and virologists to study and monitor on a constant basis.  This virus will need to be monitored until such time as it eradicated,  which may never happen or take decades.

 

A virus evolves in order to gain the advantage of finding hosts to exist in.  Whether that becomes more troublesome if it has been suppressed to micro levels or if a larger reservoir is allowed to exist is a highly complex matter for qualified people to discover. 

Indeed. 

 

7 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

If I've missed onwards transmission being prevented apologies. I've not seen it in the press though that it's been proven which I'd have assumed would be huge news and excellent news, but I'll be delighted to be wrong on that!

You’ve not missed anything, no vaccine stops the spread of a disease. 
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/COVID-19-vaccination-and-prioritisation-strategies.pdf

 

https://vk.ovg.ox.ac.uk/vk/disease-vaccinated-populations

Edited December 27, 2020 by Pasquale for King
More info

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

If I've missed onwards transmission being prevented apologies. I've not seen it in the press though that it's been proven which I'd have assumed would be huge news and excellent news, but I'll be delighted to be wrong on that!

 

It's not a thing that can be known about either way.  Strong evidence should present itself either way over the course of the vaccination programme but it will always be liable to change because there's no telling how the virus will evolve in the future.  My own guess is that the vaccines will reduce the amount of onward infections but that the virus will inevitably evolve to escape this disadvantage and that science will need to be nimble enough to stay a step ahead.

[jack D and coke]

6 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Definitely a case for the experts to be mulling over all possibilities which i'm more than confident they already will be. And regarding the young super spreaders being tardy when it comes to being vaccinated there may already be an answer to that in the pipeline.

I have a suspicion that many employers are going to insist that all employees and most definitely any new hires be vaccinated. It may become a requirement just to get a job.

Then there's other activities like simply boarding a plane. The airlines have already begun insisting that passengers carry proof of vaccination. Nation states around the world may insist anyone entering their country carry proof of vaccination.

Such restrictions may radiate out to all manner of everyday activities making it a necessity to be vaccinated if you want to take part in life.

All sounds so depressing 😣

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

I think they believe the Oxford vaccine will

prevent onward transmission but the proof will be in the pudding 

 

The key difference with the AZ vaccine is that it is designed to prevent a person being infected at all.  To that end,  onward transmission will be prevented if the vaccinated person is never infected.  But it isn't an absolute on a permanent basis because evolution of the virus may escape the purpose of the vaccine.  It seems to be a claim made on the basis of the virus here and now,  not in the future.

[JFK-1]

2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Indeed. 

 

You’ve not missed anything, no vaccine stops the spread of a disease. 
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/COVID-19-vaccination-and-prioritisation-strategies.pdf

 

https://vk.ovg.ox.ac.uk/vk/disease-vaccinated-populations

 

Well i'm certainly not going to read all that trying to filter out whatever you're claiming is in it. Which I suspect you didn't either since if you did quoting whatever you're getting at would have been the easy way to go.

But that aside no one is claiming that vaccines completely eliminate the spread of a virus. What the eggheads I heard discussing it said was that it vastly reduces the spread.

The reason being the immune system of the vaccinated quickly closes in on in and closes down the activities of the virus. Effectively eliminating it thereby reducing it's ability to spread.

Peoples bodies are doing it right now even without a vaccination but taking much linger to do so. Which is exactly why anyone testing positive is quarantined for two weeks.

In two weeks their body has eliminated the virus. The bodies of the vaccinated say these scientists will do the same thing much faster. Thus vastly reducing the time the virus has to spread.

[CavySlaveJambo]

18 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

It's one for the epidemiologists and virologists to study and monitor on a constant basis.  This virus will need to be monitored until such time as it eradicated,  which may never happen or take decades.

 

Yes, and there is every chance it is not eradicated but it becomes a normal winter common cold virus.  There are 4 other coronavirus species that have actively made the jump to humans and are now common cold viruses.  That is also another end point 

 

5 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I think they believe the Oxford vaccine will

prevent onward transmission but the proof will be in the pudding 

Yes, the early peer reviewed data suggests it prevents infection and onwards transmission.

 

15 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Then there's other activities like simply boarding a plane. The airlines have already begun insisting that passengers carry proof of vaccination. Nation states around the world may insist anyone entering their country carry proof of vaccination.
 

Cruise lines are also actively looking in to this possibility as well.  Or rather Cruise lines want to make it mandatory and are seeing if it will be legal to enforce. 

[Taffin]

7 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I think they believe the Oxford vaccine will

prevent onward transmission but the proof will be in the pudding 

 

I'd hope the proof will be in the testing rather than hoping it's working as unless they are monitoring those who get it, how will they know if it's preventing transmission or not from them? 

 

Sounds encouraging though, but really I'd expect this to be known by now if we're close to rolling it out.

[JFK-1]

1 minute ago, CavySlaveJambo said:

Cruise lines are also actively looking in to this possibility as well.  Or rather Cruise lines want to make it mandatory and are seeing if it will be legal to enforce. 

 

Don't see there being much in the way of legal barriers to prevent them doing so. Not much different from the pub thing of "we reserve the right to refuse"

And in this case I don't see the government being in the mood to assist vaccination dodgers.

[Victorian]

Just now, CavySlaveJambo said:

Yes, and there is every chance it is not eradicated but it becomes a normal winter common cold virus.  There are 4 other coronavirus species that have actively made the jump to humans and are now common cold viruses.  That is also another end point 

 

 

 

Yep.  It is an interesting point regarding which end state is better or worse.  Virtually zero virus existing or a larger reservoir.  It could be that a larger reservoir presents less of a risk of serious virus mutations.  Some scientists describe it as 'stable' in terms of it's evolution.  Perhaps a micro level existence will eventually lead to a more serious mutation.  A wider reservoir could build up a level of natural population protection.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

3 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I'd hope the proof will be in the testing rather than hoping it's working as unless they are monitoring those who get it, how will they know if it's preventing transmission or not from them? 

 

Sounds encouraging though, but really I'd expect this to be known by now if we're close to rolling it out.

 

It will be known, but won't be in the public domain for fear of putting the regulators under undue pressure to pass it quicker.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

6 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Don't see there being much in the way of legal barriers to prevent them doing so. Not much different from the pub thing of "we reserve the right to refuse"

And in this case I don't see the government being in the mood to assist vaccination dodgers.

 

I don't see a problem with this, proof of a covid vaccine could easily be part of the Cruise Lines T&C's, you book a cruise you agree to the T&C's.

[Taffin]

5 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

It will be known, but won't be in the public domain for fear of putting the regulators under undue pressure to pass it quicker.

 

I don't get that line of thought, they're already under immense pressure to pass it. If it prevents onwards transmission we should be screaming that from the roof tops as it would surely encourage people who don't feel they need it for themselves to get it in order to protect others.

 

As it stands, I won't take the vaccine but if it would stop me passing it to others I'd get it happily.