Hybrid Pitch

[graygo]

6 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

In the summer, over cuttting in winter depletes energy strores and weakens the roots.. 

 

Not true, cutting improves the density of the swards. You cannot overcut grass, you can cut it too short though. I would bet that if you stay in the ground after the game on Wednesday you would see the ground staff cutting the grass.

[kingantti1874]

Growing grass isn’t exactly limited to the groundsmen, literally thousands of people know how to do it - the same science applies no matter the grass.

 

now I don’t know what our grounds man are doing, but it DOES LOOK like they are scalping it, it may be becuase the club are arranging 5 games a week + training on it therefore the ground men are left no choice - I dunno 🤷‍♂️ But whatever they are doing.. they need to stop it.. it’s not ****ing Astro they’ve laid

[graygo]

3 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Sorry no offence - think we are all frustrated what is going on at Tynecastle these days. 

 

That's certainly true.

 

Also when folk have a difference of opinion it's very difficult to debate it online, I'm sure that over a pint we would be fine. 👍

[kingantti1874]

Just now, graygo said:

 

Not true, cutting improves the density of the swards. You cannot overcut grass, you can cut it too short though. I would bet that if you stay in the ground after the game on Wednesday you would see the ground staff cutting the grass.

I’ve been growing grass for 25 years.. and this is simply not right. To prove my point literally my first google search

 

Cutting too short shocks the grass, makes it harder for the plant to absorb the sun's rays, and can easily damage the crown of the grass plant. Cut the blade too short and your grass may go hungry over the winter and will likely spend the spring recovering from shock.

 

 

[Thomaso]

2 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

That's certainly true.

 

Also when folk have a difference of opinion it's very difficult to debate it online, I'm sure that over a pint we would be fine. 👍

We are all passionate Hearts fans and feelings do spill over. ❤️👍

[graygo]

3 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

I’ve been growing grass for 25 years.. and this is simply not right. To prove my point literally my first google search

 

Cutting too short shocks the grass, makes it harder for the plant to absorb the sun's rays, and can easily damage the crown of the grass plant. Cut the blade too short and your grass may go hungry over the winter and will likely spend the spring recovering from shock.

 

 

 

In just about every post I've made I've stated that cutting it too short is not good.

 

Thanks for proving my point.

 

I even said it in the post you quoted.

Edited December 16, 2019 by graygo

[Thomaso]

3 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

I’ve been growing grass for 25 years.. and this is simply not right. To prove my point literally my first google search

 

Cutting too short shocks the grass, makes it harder for the plant to absorb the sun's rays, and can easily damage the crown of the grass plant. Cut the blade too short and your grass may go hungry over the winter and will likely spend the spring recovering from shock.

 

 

We are all shocked at the state of our pitch - including the grass!! 😳

[kingantti1874]

1 minute ago, graygo said:

 

In just about every post I've made I've stated that cutting it too short is not good.

 

Thanks for proving my point.

 

I even said it in the post you quoted.

Ok, no idea what I’m arguing about then. Apologies

[graygo]

Just now, kingantti1874 said:

Ok, no idea what I’m arguing about then. Apologies

 

 

At least we can all agree something's not right with it.

[Thomaso]

6 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

Growing grass isn’t exactly limited to the groundsmen, literally thousands of people know how to do it - the same science applies no matter the grass.

 

now I don’t know what our grounds man are doing, but it DOES LOOK like they are scalping it, it may be becuase the club are arranging 5 games a week + training on it therefore the ground men are left no choice - I dunno 🤷‍♂️ But whatever they are doing.. they need to stop it.. it’s not ****ing Astro they’ve laid

Again if you look back the thread on the old pitch when I was regularly at the stadium during the stand construction, I expressed concern that every day the groundsman was shaving the grass down to within an inch of its life.

It looks like the hybrid pitch could be getting the same treatment.

The usual suspects on here shot me down in flames - no doubt they will do the same again.

[kila]

So to recap the likely causes so far:

 

- Not using undersoil heating to aid growth in winter

- Overuse of undersoil heating and roots weakened

- Not using enough light rigs

- Overuse of light rigs and grass isn't getting enough 'night time' to process the captured energy

- Grass is diseased

- Cutting the grass too short/too often in winter

- Too many games in a period of time including training use

 

 

Edited December 16, 2019 by kila

[graygo]

14 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Again if you look back the thread on the old pitch when I was regularly at the stadium during the stand construction, I expressed concern that every day the groundsman was shaving the grass down to within an inch of its life.

It looks like the hybrid pitch could be getting the same treatment.

The usual suspects on here shot me down in flames - no doubt they will do the same again.

 

I'm going to bow out of this thread but not before saying it again.

You can't cut the grass too often, you can cut it too short. I'm not 100% sure but I think the recommended height is 25-28mm.

The groundsman cutting it every day as you say kind of backs me up too.

 

 

Edited December 16, 2019 by graygo

[kingantti1874]

12 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Again if you look back the thread on the old pitch when I was regularly at the stadium during the stand construction, I expressed concern that every day the groundsman was shaving the grass down to within an inch of its life.

It looks like the hybrid pitch could be getting the same treatment.

The usual suspects on here shot me down in flames - no doubt they will do the same again.

I think we are all agreeing bud - violently with graygo 😂, .. cutting it very frequently and leaving it too short.

 

whatever the reason someone needs their balls booted.. the ground man for pishy care or the club for forcing the pishy care by overusing it.. 

[Bad Religion]

16 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Again if you look back the thread on the old pitch when I was regularly at the stadium during the stand construction, I expressed concern that every day the groundsman was shaving the grass down to within an inch of its life.

It looks like the hybrid pitch could be getting the same treatment.

The usual suspects on here shot me down in flames - no doubt they will do the same again.

 

I think I can speak on behalf of us all in wishing you’d spent more time concentrating on the windows. 

[Hot since 86]

24 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

We are all shocked at the state of our pitch - including the grass!! 😳

Too many grasses at club imo

[kingantti1874]

3 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

I'm going to bow out of this thread but not before saying it again.

You can't cut the grass too often, you can cut it too short. I'm not 100% sure but I think the recommended height is 25-28mm.

The groundsman cutting it every day as you say kind of backs me up too.

 

 

The only thing I will say is, the grounds man - who is a member on here, called me out when I slammed the state of the pitch 3 years ago!! I think I still have the PM.. told me they aren’t cutting the grass after the game, more like hoovering it to make the blades stand up.. true story.. 

 

would love him to come back on an explain this shambles

[Thomaso]

8 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

I'm going to bow out of this thread but not before saying it again.

You can't cut the grass too often, you can cut it too short. I'm not 100% sure but I think the recommended height is 25-28mm.

The groundsman cutting it every day as you say kind of backs me up too.

 

 

I’m not arguing about regular cutting IN THE GROWING SEASON.

My point was that it looked like he was shaving it to the wood.

[Thomaso]

8 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

 

I think I can speak on behalf of us all in wishing you’d spent more time concentrating on the windows. 

“Us all”

 

ie. the happy Clappers, Levein fanboys and Club apologists. 

[Bad Religion]

4 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

“Us all”

 

ie. the happy Clappers, Levein fanboys and Club apologists. 

 

You don’t have much of a sense of humour do you. 

Edited December 16, 2019 by Bad Religion

[sac]

This type of surface has a minimum cut height which the ground staff will be aware of(or should be)

[3fingersreid]

1 hour ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Do you live in Florida? 🌞🏖

I bloody wish I did 🌞🌞

but just old Edinburgh 

[jambocub]

55 minutes ago, Noah Claypole said:

 

As she doesn't draw a wage then yes, she is exempt from criticism.

No chance she admitted she was to stubborn to get rid of the last manager surely shes part of the blame for the  mess were in

[Thomaso]

6 minutes ago, Bad Religion said:

 

You don’t have much of a sense of humour do you. 

Apologies sometimes is hard to spot the trolls on here. 👍

[Thomaso]

28 minutes ago, sac said:

This type of surface has a minimum cut height which the ground staff will be aware of(or should be)

It’s not just the height the grass is being cut at - the grass coverage on our pitch is so thin and sparse - unlike similar hybrid pitches down south where the pitches have a carpet of thick turf.

[graygo]

3 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

The only thing I will say is, the grounds man - who is a member on here, called me out when I slammed the state of the pitch 3 years ago!! I think I still have the PM.. told me they aren’t cutting the grass after the game, more like hoovering it to make the blades stand up.. true story.. 

 

would love him to come back on an explain this shambles

 

He's right, It exposes the blades which the grass then directs all it's energy to refreshing. That's the theory anyway.

 

2 hours ago, sac said:

This type of surface has a minimum cut height which the ground staff will be aware of(or should be)

 

Correct.

Edited December 16, 2019 by graygo

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Just preparing for Celtic 

[Paolo]

5 hours ago, Bad Religion said:

 

😂

Laugh away.  It is a fair point.  I am sure organisations looking for such a service will do their research.   If we are not following the correct maintenance rules, and therefore damaging the pitch, it won’t look good on them. 
 

It is perhaps a little dramatic, but doesn’t warrant laughing over.   

[Phil Dunphy]

4 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

The only thing I will say is, the grounds man - who is a member on here, called me out when I slammed the state of the pitch 3 years ago!! I think I still have the PM.. told me they aren’t cutting the grass after the game, more like hoovering it to make the blades stand up.. true story.. 

 

would love him to come back on an explain this shambles

 

You know why people like the ground staff or young team don't come on here to explain anything? It's for two reasons.

 

1) They're not beholden to the people of Kickback. They have people to answer to and total strangers on the internet are not among those people.

 

2) Why should they come and explain themselves to folk who're downright antagonistic and have no intention of using the platform for anything other than to publicly belittle them.

[Newton51]

They shouldn’t be training on the pitch the day before a match. That’s what the training facility is for

[The Treasurer]

10 hours ago, Newton51 said:

They shouldn’t be training on the pitch the day before a match. That’s what the training facility is for

It's common practice to train on the pitch the day before the game.

A £1million pitch should be able to stand up to being used twice in a week.

 

[Armageddon]

There must have been a failure in the management/maintenance of our pitch, I always assumed too much rain would never be an issue, the heat lamps, the drainage, the cutting and the treatment all being monitored from the Moon by the sound of things:

 

Advanced monitoring system

There is, however, far more to the pitch than meets the eye. We are delighted that Tynecastle now boasts the first full scale deployment of a state-of-the-art environmental monitoring system. This means that the pitch at Tynecastle Park will be one of the most monitored in the world, allowing us to use the very latest agronomic tools to ensure the surface is maintained to the highest possible standard. The software will enable our grounds team to automatically gather data on the live moisture levels across the pitch, air temperature around the stadium and light levels for grass growth. This will provide the grounds team with detailed insights into the condition of the pitch whilst also allowing our support staff to tweak the surface to optimise player performance and fitness.

The new Tynecastle Park pitch in numbers:

 

17,000,000 hybrid insertions
40,000 km of yarn
27 km of undersoil heating pipes
1500 tonnes of gravel
26 irrigation sprinklers
4600 tonnes of sand

What is a hybrid pitch?

 

In essence, it is a playing surface consisting of 95% grass and 5% synthetic materials. It is very much a natural turf surface, typically constructed on a sand dominated, free draining profile that is supplemented by synthetic fibres inserted vertically to a depth of 180 mm below ground, with 20 mm protruding above ground. 

A hybrid pitch provides the benefits of both a natural grass surface and a synthetic surface and allows:

• Stability within a sand dominated profile that would otherwise naturally be very loose and unstable
• Improved stability for the players and retention of a level playing surface
• Provision of additional anchorage for the grass to grow and take hold
• Increased wear tolerance throughout the season, particularly during winter months when pitch quality typically reduces
• Improved appearance when grass loss does occur

The SIS Grass installation at Tynecastle Park involved a laser-guided machine that inserted the yarn at 20mm x 20mm centres. The process was completed in around eight days at the end of June/early July and the club was able to host its first fixture on the new surface on July 24th. Whilst the pitch was less mature than ideal at that stage, the hybrid system allowed the match to be played without compromising player safety or quality of football.

[Francis Albert]

12 minutes ago, Armageddon said:

There must have been a failure in the management/maintenance of our pitch, I always assumed too much rain would never be an issue, the heat lamps, the drainage, the cutting and the treatment all being monitored from the Moon by the sound of things:

 

Advanced monitoring system

There is, however, far more to the pitch than meets the eye. We are delighted that Tynecastle now boasts the first full scale deployment of a state-of-the-art environmental monitoring system. This means that the pitch at Tynecastle Park will be one of the most monitored in the world, allowing us to use the very latest agronomic tools to ensure the surface is maintained to the highest possible standard. The software will enable our grounds team to automatically gather data on the live moisture levels across the pitch, air temperature around the stadium and light levels for grass growth. This will provide the grounds team with detailed insights into the condition of the pitch whilst also allowing our support staff to tweak the surface to optimise player performance and fitness.

The new Tynecastle Park pitch in numbers:

 

17,000,000 hybrid insertions
40,000 km of yarn
27 km of undersoil heating pipes
1500 tonnes of gravel
26 irrigation sprinklers
4600 tonnes of sand

What is a hybrid pitch?

 

In essence, it is a playing surface consisting of 95% grass and 5% synthetic materials. It is very much a natural turf surface, typically constructed on a sand dominated, free draining profile that is supplemented by synthetic fibres inserted vertically to a depth of 180 mm below ground, with 20 mm protruding above ground. 

A hybrid pitch provides the benefits of both a natural grass surface and a synthetic surface and allows:

• Stability within a sand dominated profile that would otherwise naturally be very loose and unstable
• Improved stability for the players and retention of a level playing surface
• Provision of additional anchorage for the grass to grow and take hold
• Increased wear tolerance throughout the season, particularly during winter months when pitch quality typically reduces
• Improved appearance when grass loss does occur

The SIS Grass installation at Tynecastle Park involved a laser-guided machine that inserted the yarn at 20mm x 20mm centres. The process was completed in around eight days at the end of June/early July and the club was able to host its first fixture on the new surface on July 24th. Whilst the pitch was less mature than ideal at that stage, the hybrid system allowed the match to be played without compromising player safety or quality of football.

To be fair I believe that was the spiel from one of the contractors. It may be they oversold id it but hard to believe it could have got to its present state without maintenance failures of some sort

[Francis Albert]

2 hours ago, The Treasurer said:

It's common practice to train on the pitch the day before the game.

A £1million pitch should be able to stand up to being used twice in a week.

 

But when it becomes obvious it is not standing up to it maybe an idea to not use it the day before a game. It is not as if the team has demonstrsted the benefit of recent familiarity with the pitch!

[hmfc2011]

16 hours ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

You know why people like the ground staff or young team don't come on here to explain anything? It's for two reasons.

 

1) They're not beholden to the people of Kickback. They have people to answer to and total strangers on the internet are not among those people.

 

2) Why should they come and explain themselves to folk who're downright antagonistic and have no intention of using the platform for anything other than to publicly belittle them.

Check out MR KNOW IT all here. Maybe this is the grounds man in disguise guys. Better watch out. 

[Phil Dunphy]

12 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Check out MR KNOW IT all here. Maybe this is the grounds man in disguise guys. Better watch out. 

 

I'd say Mr Knows More Than You, but that wouldn't say very much. What you don't know could fill a warehouse.

[hmfc2011]

38 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

I'd say Mr Knows More Than You, but that wouldn't say very much. What you don't know could fill a warehouse.

Very much doubt that. Which degree did you get to make you qualified? 

[Thomaso]

57 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Check out MR KNOW IT all here. Maybe this is the grounds man in disguise guys. Better watch out. 

👍😂

[Phil Dunphy]

16 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Very much doubt that. Which degree did you get to make you qualified? 

 

Make me qualified to what exactly? Do you ACTUALLY think I'm one of the ground staff?

 

Christ, you're even less informed than I thought you were.

 

10 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

👍😂

 

Still waiting for the Mods to take action against me mate  Seems like they don't take you seriously either  

[Thomaso]

Just now, Phil Dunphy said:

 

Make me qualified to what exactly? Do you ACTUALLY think I'm one of the ground staff?

 

Christ, you're even less informed than I thought you were.

 

 

Still waiting for the Mods to take action against me mate  Seems like they don't take you seriously either  

😂😂😂😂

[hmfc2011]

3 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

Make me qualified to what exactly? Do you ACTUALLY think I'm one of the ground staff?

 

Christ, you're even less informed than I thought you were.

 

 

Still waiting for the Mods to take action against me mate  Seems like they don't take you seriously either  

Well I have Level 2 Practical Horticulture Skills. So I can imagine I know a lot more than what your talking about. 

[the Hearts way]

19 hours ago, Sir Gio said:

Just preparing for Celtic 

Aye mind the grass was too long according to Rogers, just blame Levein. 

"he's cut it with a fecking combine harvester" 😜

[The Hogfather]

12 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Well I have Level 2 Practical Horticulture Skills. So I can imagine I know a lot more than what your talking about. 

 

It's highly unlikely that Phil Dunphy is one of the ground staff, so trying to wave your qualification in his face as if it's relevant to his point is a little pointless.

[Phil Dunphy]

18 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Well I have Level 2 Practical Horticulture Skills. So I can imagine I know a lot more than what your talking about. 

 

So you're more qualified to look after the pitch than the current ground staff at Tynecastle then? Perhaps you should fire in a CV.

[Thomaso]

23 minutes ago, hmfc2011 said:

Well I have Level 2 Practical Horticulture Skills. So I can imagine I know a lot more than what your talking about. 

BOOM! 👍😂

[Thomaso]

11 minutes ago, Nunya Business said:

 

It's highly unlikely that Phil Dunphy is one of the ground staff, so trying to wave your qualification in his face as if it's relevant to his point is a little pointless.

hmfc2011 was responding to being told that the poster in question knew more than him about growing grass!

[The Hogfather]

Just now, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

hmfc2011 was responding to being told that the poster in question knew more than him about growing grass!

 

Could you show where he said that? All he did was say he knows more than the poster in question, he never mentioned anything to do with growing grass?

[Justin Z]

On 16/12/2019 at 15:23, Francis Albert said:

Thinking about it, after re-reading the extravagant claims of the contractors who installed the new pitch, if we have failed to maintain it properly they may even have a claim against us. The reputational damage to them of it being shown on TV in its present state must be pretty substantial.

 

As a lawyer, please allow me to analyse this legal claim:

 

 

Edited December 17, 2019 by Justin Z

[Phil Dunphy]

Cruickshank for Scotland is only lurking on this thread to respond to what other members are saying to me

 

Clearly still ****ing GUTTED that I didn't take him seriously when he name dropped the boy who collects all the golf balls at the local driving range  

[Thomaso]

4 minutes ago, Nunya Business said:

 

Could you show where he said that? All he did was say he knows more than the poster in question, he never mentioned anything to do with growing grass?

The thread is about state of the Hybrid pitch.

He termed himself “Mr knows more than you” when debating with a qualified horticulturist...

[Thomaso]

5 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

Cruickshank for Scotland is only lurking on this thread to respond to what other members are saying to me

 

Clearly still ****ing GUTTED that I didn't take him seriously when he name dropped the boy who collects all the golf balls at the local driving range  

😂😂😂😂