Nicholson leaving - deal with Minnesota close to completion

[maroonnicky63]

Same guys that make every excuse under the sun for a late developer from the conference down South, makes little sense. Anyway, off to watch the match

you just spout nonsense because you love to slate players '' simples'', oh and by the way I know how football works looking at your bile is clear you don't, now get back to sleep like a good wee boy

[kingantti1874]

Genetics is a huge part. Paterson genetically pre-disposed to gain muscle easily, Nicholson not so much.

 

Look at England players yesterday. Fair enough they are in the gym, but they are selected in the first place, because they have the genetics that allow them to gain muscle easily.

 

 

I agree with you on Paterson, part of the reasons he's been such a standout Is because he's the best athlete we've had.. It makes several aspects of the game so easy for him,gives him the foundation to play..

 

But I don't read stories about sam burning it up in the gym, or staying back to work on deaballs, free kicks or shooting practice..

 

Im not just having a go at sam here.. There are others. It's poor it really is..

 

First time I saw Sam was at the inv 9 man defeat at easter Road. He stood out immediately, knew how to control and receive a ball.. Beyond disappointing that I'm not that fussed if he goes

[Bungalow Bill]

Why do players not look at players like Ronaldo Ronaldo and go, if I work on my game like that I could turn myself from a 2k per week SPL player to a 15-20k per week player.. I don't get it.. How can you still be as weak, and still have the weak points in your game that you had at 17.. Lazy.

I thought the same when I saw the Ajax team that lost to Man Utd last month. They looked very strong physically compared to our younger players, Paterson aside. Technical ability is one thing, but surely the ability to match a team at a physical level is more achievable.

[kingantti1874]

I thought the same when I saw the Ajax team that lost to Man Utd last month. They looked very strong physically compared to our younger players, Paterson aside. Technical ability is one thing, but surely the ability to match a team at a physical level is more achievable.

Yep, look at England yesterday.. Like a different species almost.. There is a point about genetics but unless we think Scottish people have bad genes we should be much closer..

 

Much more likely our players just don't dedicate themselves to their profession and live their lives in the right way..

[JJ1984]

you just spout nonsense because you love to slate players '' simples'', oh and by the way I know how football works looking at your bile is clear you don't, now get back to sleep like a good wee boy

No you don't mate, you talk utter guff in an agressive way. Now off you pop ya prick.

[By the light]

Yep, look at England yesterday.. Like a different species almost.. There is a point about genetics but unless we think Scottish people have bad genes we should be much closer..

 

Much more likely our players just don't dedicate themselves to their profession and live their lives in the right way..

There is also a pack mentality/culture and a desire to fit in. Led by the Kris Boyd type attitude of this is how it works so fit in or be an outcast. Immersing yourself 100% Ronaldo style wouldnt fit the mould. Rising above it gets you branded an odd ball or arrogant. It's all about being a 'good lad'.

[buzzbomb]

Aye, fair enough re the technical aspect.

 

I was making a general point re the role of genetic side of things. I've heard recently that the French are taking tissue samples that allow them to get an indication of athleticism before accepting kids into their academy program.

 

 

I agree with you on Paterson, part of the reasons he's been such a standout Is because he's the best athlete we've had.. It makes several aspects of the game so easy for him,gives him the foundation to play..

 

But I don't read stories about sam burning it up in the gym, or staying back to work on deaballs, free kicks or shooting practice..

 

Im not just having a go at sam here.. There are others. It's poor it really is..

 

First time I saw Sam was at the inv 9 man defeat at easter Road. He stood out immediately, knew how to control and receive a ball.. Beyond disappointing that I'm not that fussed if he goes

[stranraer-jambo]

Aye, fair enough re the technical aspect.

 

I was making a general point re the role of genetic side of things. I've heard recently that the French are taking tissue samples that allow them to get an indication of athleticism before accepting kids into their academy program.

 

 

 

Which will bring a totally different/dangerous slant to the "you're not going to make it because you are too wee", unfortunately!!!

[Elias Henry Furst]

I agree with you on Paterson, part of the reasons he's been such a standout Is because he's the best athlete we've had.. It makes several aspects of the game so easy for him,gives him the foundation to play..

 

But I don't read stories about sam burning it up in the gym, or staying back to work on deaballs, free kicks or shooting practice..

 

Im not just having a go at sam here.. There are others. It's poor it really is..

 

First time I saw Sam was at the inv 9 man defeat at easter Road. He stood out immediately, knew how to control and receive a ball.. Beyond disappointing that I'm not that fussed if he goes

The point above about genetics is spot on. Sam isn't a natural athlete and if he were to spend time in the gym like Paterson clearly did, his game would suffer, he'd likely lose a yard of pace and playing the position he does, it could finish him.

 

I agree with your point generally though, If I were Sam I'd be on the training ground doing extra work on the things he can improve upon.

 

Unfortunately I don't think he's got the desire to do so. He may well get himself a move this Summer that will earn him decent money but I fear that his career may stall and he's unlikely to develop into the player we all hoped he would.

[Jamboelite]

ok then let me explain , he is 22 and still developing,some on here have tried to compare him with Hayes of Aberdeen who is 29 FFS. Just look at Armstrong of Celtic because last season everyone wanted him out because according to them he was shite. We are in far to much of a hurry to write players of just read what some on here have been saying about young Smith who IMO is a very good prospect, Walker is another one I rate very highly he will come good with his consistence but unfortunately it wont be at Hearts if we are to believe what is going on.

As always there are exceptions of course , if Walker and Nicholson go ( and I hope they both sign ) I think they will be a huge miss as I firmly believe we have not seen the best of them yet and as the old saying goes be careful what you wish for

That all being said...and you defend young players like they are your children, what exactly has Nicholson done to be kept on?

 

He cant hold down a regular place because he doesnt deliver a consistent performance, he doesnt have the strength that Walker has added to his game (but could do more) so is therefore unable to retain posession and he has not progressed and inch in 3years.

[Bauld]

Another thing with Nicholson, moving away from the physical side of things, is the mental side of it.

 

He hasn't progressed as a footballer mentally. He can't read the game, spot when he needs to defend, see the runs he has to make, play the balls into the correct areas.

 

A player who has developed a good footballing brain doesn't play the ball to the striker. He plays it to the spot where the striker is going to be seconds later. Nicholson doesn't have that. Every ball is crossed it or floated at random.

 

He still looks and acts like the school boy instead of the experienced pro he should now be.

[buzzbomb]

Like it or not the game is increasingly moving in that direction and in my opinion it's not necessarily for the best in terms of football as the beautiful game..

 

Which will bring a totally different/dangerous slant to the "you're not going to make it because you are too wee", unfortunately!!!

[h-e-a-r-t-s]

Genetics is a huge part. Paterson genetically pre-disposed to gain muscle easily, Nicholson not so much.

 

Look at England players yesterday. Fair enough they are in the gym, but they are selected in the first place, because they have the genetics that allow them to gain muscle easily.

 

 

Don't agree with this. Harry Kane played his debut against Hearts and didn't stand out versus our young lads at the time in terms of physique. Gareth Bale was built like a pencil in his youth. Both are absolute stallions now because of hard work not genetics

[buzzbomb]

We'll have to disagree..

 

Don't agree with this. Harry Kane played his debut against Hearts and didn't stand out versus our young lads at the time in terms of physique. Gareth Bale was built like a pencil in his youth. Both are absolute stallions now because of hard work not genetics

[stranraer-jambo]

Like it or not the game is increasingly moving in that direction and in my opinion it's not necessarily for the best in terms of football as the beautiful game..

 

 

Agree.

 

On a similar vein where would Messi have been if he hadn't received the hormone treatment funded by Barca from a very young age?

[o1djambo]

You just have to look at Leigh Griffiths to see what hard work can achieve. He has greatly improved his phyisical condition and stamina and free kicks like his do not happen by accident. Hours of practice went into these two goals yesterday. Very dissapointing that Sam and other players are unable or unwilling to put in the effort. Instead they just fade away into lower leagues.

[buzzbomb]

Yeah, agree. I'm also pretty sure some of these players are getting 'help' to build their physique.

 

Agree.

 

On a similar vein where would Messi have been if he hadn't received the hormone treatment funded by Barca from a very young age?

[kingantti1874]

You just have to look at Leigh Griffiths to see what hard work can achieve. He has greatly improved his phyisical condition and stamina and free kicks like his do not happen by accident. Hours of practice went into these two goals yesterday. Very dissapointing that Sam and other players are unable or unwilling to put in the effort. Instead they just fade away into lower leagues.

Yep.. Has improved massively.. We can day what we want.. The guy has worked for his success

[Taffin]

You just have to look at Leigh Griffiths to see what hard work can achieve. He has greatly improved his phyisical condition and stamina and free kicks like his do not happen by accident. Hours of practice went into these two goals yesterday. Very dissapointing that Sam and other players are unable or unwilling to put in the effort. Instead they just fade away into lower leagues.

Good point.

 

Leigh is definitely not what you would call a natural athlete but hard work and practice has paid off for him.

 

He's no adonis but he doesn't get pushed off the ball easily and can play at a high level for 90 minutes.

[Rudolf's Mate]

A player who has developed a good footballing brain doesn't play the ball to the striker. He plays it to the spot where the striker is going to be seconds later. Nicholson doesn't have that.

 

Or he plays the ball to the space the player was seconds previously (slightly behind).

 

Totally agree with what you're saying though. He's just not good enough.

[socrates82]

Genetics is a huge part. Paterson genetically pre-disposed to gain muscle easily, Nicholson not so much.

 

Look at England players yesterday. Fair enough they are in the gym, but they are selected in the first place, because they have the genetics that allow them to gain muscle easily.

 

 

It's not genetics. Berra was a lanky so and so when he went south. Within a season he was an absolute unit.

 

It's all about the culture in scotland and a lack of self belief and drive to do better, not just in football.

 

Also money obviously. The english teams have huge resources to improve fitness and nutrition.

[Section Q]

Look at Paterson at 17 and compare it to now. He's the only young player I can think of in recent years who's made the effort to improve his strength and fitness levels.

Nicholson has a lot of talent but will always struggle with the physical side of the game in British football. It's not fair to just single him out though, the same could be said for Billy King and a few others in recent years.

The lack of strength and fitness in the team in the second part of last season was a big factor in so many defeats.

Templeton all over again.

[buzzbomb]

Berra didn't look as big or powerful as most of the English players. Does that mean he hasn't worked as hard as them or are they just genetically pre-disposed to put on muscle easier. Hard work is a given for top pros, but getting back to the original point of Paterson vs Nicholson, if you give them the same time in the gym and the same program, Paterson will put on muscle that Nicholson won't. That's genetics.

 

 

It's not genetics. Berra was a lanky so and so when he went south. Within a season he was an absolute unit.

 

It's all about the culture in scotland and a lack of self belief and drive to do better, not just in football.

 

Also money obviously. The english teams have huge resources to improve fitness and nutrition.

[maroonnicky63]

That all being said...and you defend young players like they are your children, what exactly has Nicholson done to be kept on?

 

He cant hold down a regular place because he doesnt deliver a consistent performance, he doesnt have the strength that Walker has added to his game (but could do more) so is therefore unable to retain posession and he has not progressed and inch in 3years.

I defend young players because they deserve support and as already stated I have seen it through the years , how many on here were calling Paterson shite and wanted him hounded out ?? now all of a sudden he is the greatest thing since slice bread , look back I fully supported him and I knew he would come good '' not progressed an inch is 3 years '' will just let others decide on this comment because it is utter rubbish, lets see where he ends up if it's lower than the SPFL or higher. I would rather he stay, 

[Mr Rabbit]

I defend young players because they deserve support and as already stated I have seen it through the years , how many on here were calling Paterson shite and wanted him hounded out ?? now all of a sudden he is the greatest thing since slice bread , look back I fully supported him and I knew he would come good '' not progressed an inch is 3 years '' will just let others decide on this comment because it is utter rubbish, lets see where he ends up if it's lower than the SPFL or higher. I would rather he stay,

He doesn't want to stay though.

 

You're using an example that fits your point. I'm sure you would have been the same about King, McKay, McHattie, Mullen, Carrick etc. Sometimes these players don't make it despite showing some promise.

 

There's no issue supporting the players but when it takes precendent over the club you're suppose to support it's just a bit strange IMO.

[luckydug]

I defend young players because they deserve support and as already stated I have seen it through the years , how many on here were calling Paterson shite and wanted him hounded out ?? now all of a sudden he is the greatest thing since slice bread , look back I fully supported him and I knew he would come good '' not progressed an inch is 3 years '' will just let others decide on this comment because it is utter rubbish, lets see where he ends up if it's lower than the SPFL or higher. I would rather he stay,

 

 

He doesn't want to stay at Hearts.

So no point in banging on about him.

Time will tell if we have missed out.

[wavydavy]

Berra didn't look as big or powerful as most of the English players. Does that mean he hasn't worked as hard as them or are they just genetically pre-disposed to put on muscle easier. Hard work is a given for top pros, but getting back to the original point of Paterson vs Nicholson, if you give them the same time in the gym and the same program, Paterson will put on muscle that Nicholson won't. That's genetics.

 

 

 

You may be correct about the muscle however you don't have to be physically like a body builder to hold players off. I always think back to Defoe when he was at Spurs when we played them and was impressed at how well he was able to hold players off.

 

He is quite small and has a lower centre of gravity which helps but Nicholson has never improved this aspect of his game so far as I can see. Maybe it will progress his game when he moves on but I think it is down to the attitude and committment of the individual and I don't think he has that at the moment.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

Genetics?!? Going to make some argument that there's a line at the border that differentiates, genetically, Kane, Dier, and Sterling on one side of the border and Griffiths, Berra, and Anya on the other?!?

 

England's players look the way they do because of the diet and training regimes that are in vogue at English academies and English clubs.  I'm not even sure we want to be following that model -- look at Messi, Iniesta, Neymar, Xavi, Chicharito, and so on.  Or for that matter just look at Juve's starting Xi in the CL final. They have a couple of big bodies but otherwise many of them don't look that different in build from Nicholson.

 

Somehow someone's gotten the idea that bulking up bicep and pec strength is necessary for playing football.  I don't get it.  Just build up the core strength and the rest will take care of itself.  Yes Sam could do with some time on the torso rotation machine but I don't see any great need for him to bulk up.

[maroonnicky63]

He doesn't want to stay at Hearts.

So no point in banging on about him.

Time will tell if we have missed out.

 

He doesn't want to stay at Hearts.

So no point in banging on about him.

Time will tell if we have missed out.

correct

[JamboJen]

Why do players not look at players like Ronaldo Ronaldo and go, if I work on my game like that I could turn myself from a 2k per week SPL player to a 15-20k per week player.. I don't get it.. How can you still be as weak, and still have the weak points in your game that you had at 17.. Lazy.

Completely agree. I've seen a few posts on he over the last few months saying things like, "the club should have had Nicholson/Walker in the gym" as though we don't look at all of those aspects. The sports science side of the club looks at all of those things and the players all have programmes to work on but just like working on their technical skills, working on the physical side is 100% down to the effort and application of the player himself.

 

CP is the shining example of an academy player who has worked on all aspects of his play and his physique and has got himself a great move on the back of that dedication. Too many players in Scotland are happy swimming around the top of our goldfish bowl, because it means they don't have to change their diets or lifestyle or put in the hard graft they'd need to succeed in England.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

.

[Thomaso]

He doesn't want to stay at Hearts.

So no point in banging on about him.

Time will tell if we have missed out.

 

The only thing I worry about is missing out on the ?400k development fee.

[tian447]

I don't see any great need for him to bulk up.

 

Bigger players will be harder to push off the ball.

 

Football, regardless of the way it seems to be going, is still a contact sport.  There is a lot of pushing, shoving, and shouldering out the way of other players, and sometimes you need to be able to muscle your way through, both when attacking and defending.  Skill and speed only gets you so far.

 

A player built like a twig versus one with a fair bit of muscle mass in a 50/50?  There's only ever going to be one winner when they both get to the ball at the same time.

 

We don't need to be a team of Bodybuilders, but a (dare I say it?) team of strong, physical players makes all the difference!

[By the light]

Bigger players will be harder to push off the ball.

 

Football, regardless of the way it seems to be going, is still a contact sport.  There is a lot of pushing, shoving, and shouldering out the way of other players, and sometimes you need to be able to muscle your way through, both when attacking and defending.  Skill and speed only gets you so far.

 

A player built like a twig versus one with a fair bit of muscle mass in a 50/50?  There's only ever going to be one winner when they both get to the ball at the same time.

 

We don't need to be a team of Bodybuilders, but a (dare I say it?) team of strong, physical players makes all the difference!

Being able to stand your ground when the ball is in the air (particularly in Scotland) and generally shield the ball require a lot of strength. Being strong is fundamental to being successful. Messi may be small but he is very very strong.

[bauld willie]

Why do players not look at players like Ronaldo Ronaldo and go, if I work on my game like that I could turn myself from a 2k per week SPL player to a 15-20k per week player.. I don't get it.. How can you still be as weak, and still have the weak points in your game that you had at 17.. Lazy.

That's also what Paterson did.

[maroonnicky63]

The only thing I worry about is missing out on the ?400k development fee.

ahh don't worry everything will work out fine ya wee worrier that you are

[Rudolf's Mate]

for that matter just look at Juve's starting Xi in the CL final. They have a couple of big bodies but otherwise many of them don't look that different in build from Nicholson.

 

 

Buffon

Barzagli

Bonucci

Chielleni

Alves

Pjanic

Khedira

Sandro

Dyballa

Higuain

Mandzukic

 

The **** were you watching the game with? Wrong end of a telescope!

[Robbo-Jambo]

Its not just about working extra hours in the gym though is it.

 

You have got to have drive, ambition and hunger to succeed in life.

 

Paterson has it, Nicholson doesn't.

 

Two different animals when you compare the two.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

Bigger players will be harder to push off the ball.

 

Football, regardless of the way it seems to be going, is still a contact sport.  There is a lot of pushing, shoving, and shouldering out the way of other players, and sometimes you need to be able to muscle your way through, both when attacking and defending.  Skill and speed only gets you so far.

 

A player built like a twig versus one with a fair bit of muscle mass in a 50/50?  There's only ever going to be one winner when they both get to the ball at the same time.

 

We don't need to be a team of Bodybuilders, but a (dare I say it?) team of strong, physical players makes all the difference!

 

Some strength is needed to be sure but IMO there's no need for the bulking up in the arms and pecs the way you see on the England squad.  Core strength is vastly more important but the "weightroom" mentality that's currently in vogue in UK (and US) sports in general is a lot of wasted effort.

 

This isn't the squad pic from Saturday (obviously) but it's a typical England side.

 

 

Look at the forearms and biceps across the front -- that's weight room training to get there.

 

Compare with this Juventus squad photo

 

 

Certainly some tall players and I guarantee those men are strong in the legs and core but their arms are about half the size of the typical England player's. Have a look at the German national team's photos or Bayern's squads and you'll see the same thing.

 

England's national team is a pathetic underachiever.  England's clubs are the richest in the world and are getting bounced from European tournaments with clockwork regularity.

 

Why should Scotland be emulating them again?

[Mac80]

.

[Shanks]

Remember thinking at the time how big the Tottenham squad was compared to ours. Even someone like Defoe who is tiny in the English league looked big!

 

Imagine Nicholson down south look like a wee ball boy.

[Haken]

Remember thinking at the time how big the Tottenham squad was compared to ours. Even someone like Defoe who is tiny in the English league looked big!

Imagine Nicholson down south look like a wee ball boy.

Yep. Same with the Everton team that came up a couple of seasons back for a friendly.

 

We're not talking about a team of Schwarzeneggers, but there is definitely scope for Sam to work on his physicality. However that would require real effort and adherence to a proper diet. For Scots, I get the impression that we really struggle with the eating bit of the equation. We're more likely to think, I did really well at the gym today that I deserve a tub of Luca's ice cream.

[Pasquale for King]

Yep. Same with the Everton team that came up a couple of seasons back for a friendly.

 

We're not talking about a team of Schwarzeneggers, but there is definitely scope for Sam to work on his physicality. However that would require real effort and adherence to a proper diet. For Scots, I get the impression that we really struggle with the eating bit of the equation. We're more likely to think, I did really well at the gym today that I deserve a tub of Luca's ice cream.

Have a quick look at their social media and you will see that diet is definitely a problem. Look at the difference between Ronaldo/Ibrahimovic and Rooney for example, two great examples and another finished at 31 which is young these days.

[siegementality]

Has he not fecked off yet? I'm pretty keen to hear about people that want to be at Hearts rather than the likes of Nicholson. We'll lose a development fee, and his bad attitude. I'm satisfied with that outcome.

[Granite95]

Aberdeen fan here, from what I'd heard Nicholson to Aberdeen is very likely. Once McIness's future is sorted out (meant to be signing a new deal soon) both Greg Stewart and Nicholson will be new signigns to follow with Hayes leaving (un-sure wether to the Tims or down south).Consensus from our fans is that he has his moments where he looks quality but can often fade out of a game

 

For me, similar ish to McGinn, on his day could be the best player on the park, just never finds the consistency needed to make it at the top level

[rudi must stay]

Aberdeen fan here, from what I'd heard Nicholson to Aberdeen is very likely. Once McIness's future is sorted out (meant to be signing a new deal soon) both Greg Stewart and Nicholson will be new signigns to follow with Hayes leaving (un-sure wether to the Tims or down south).Consensus from our fans is that he has his moments where he looks quality but can often fade out of a game

 

For me, similar ish to McGinn, on his day could be the best player on the park, just never finds the consistency needed to make it at the top level

For me, he isn't a team player and hasn't ever really been for Hearts. Liked him when he broke through but he has always thought, IMO, he was too good for us. He'll probably be the same for Aberdeen, a shame because he can do genuinely jaw dropping skills with the ball at his feet

[OTT]

For me, he isn't a team player and hasn't ever really been for Hearts. Liked him when he broke through but he has always thought, IMO, he was too good for us. He'll probably be the same for Aberdeen, a shame because he can do genuinely jaw dropping skills with the ball at his feet

 

Not strong enough

Corners are poor (IMO King was much stronger at corners)

Bit greedy 

poor attitude

 

Vs

 

Capable of scoring rakers occasionally.

Spits at linesmen ()

 

He really hasn't improved since he came through. I've always found it disappointing Nicholson was given so much opportunity yet King wasn't despite being (IMO) technically better. If Aberdeen are replacing McGinn with Nicholson I think we can consider Aberdeens best of the rest period over.

[cosanostra]

Aberdeen fan here, from what I'd heard Nicholson to Aberdeen is very likely. Once McIness's future is sorted out (meant to be signing a new deal soon) both Greg Stewart and Nicholson will be new signigns to follow with Hayes leaving (un-sure wether to the Tims or down south).Consensus from our fans is that he has his moments where he looks quality but can often fade out of a game

 

For me, similar ish to McGinn, on his day could be the best player on the park, just never finds the consistency needed to make it at the top level

Can fade out of games is being wildly optimistic.

Can sometimes fade into games is more accurate.

He'll look a player 3 or 4 games a season though.

[wavydavy]

Completely agree. I've seen a few posts on he over the last few months saying things like, "the club should have had Nicholson/Walker in the gym" as though we don't look at all of those aspects. The sports science side of the club looks at all of those things and the players all have programmes to work on but just like working on their technical skills, working on the physical side is 100% down to the effort and application of the player himself.

 

CP is the shining example of an academy player who has worked on all aspects of his play and his physique and has got himself a great move on the back of that dedication. Too many players in Scotland are happy swimming around the top of our goldfish bowl, because it means they don't have to change their diets or lifestyle or put in the hard graft they'd need to succeed in England.

Have we replaced our Sports Scientist who left to join MK Dons ?

[Captain Canada]

Diet is obviously really important - this article on Ryan Fraser at Bournemouth is interesting:

 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.mirror.co.uk/sport/boxing/ryan-fraser-reveals-ditched-diet-9664536.amp