More Tory lies

[Geddyalexneil]

Being gammon is a choice. 

Simply don't be a greeting faced racist/ xenophobe/homophobe . 

The term is mainly used for the behaviours of certain (and I say "certain" as not all folks who vote Conservative or right wing parties behave this way) right wingers who complain about things which help those who are perhaps either disadvantaged or are in groups which traditionally have been the recipients of bigotry or hate.

I am white but not gammon as I don't get all red in the face when confronted by things which point out racism/homophobia etc so don't fall into the category of "gammon". Not difficult to work out!  

[Geddyalexneil]

21 minutes ago, jonesy said:

So there’s no link between the choice of the word gammon and the colour of the people it is aimed at’s skin tone?

Gammon is the colour that angry people go. It is not a natural skin colour.  

Anyone who is angry at the term is probably part of the problem!

[Jeffros Furios]

I'd rather get called porky than gammon.  

[manaliveits105]

Proper pork

[Jeffros Furios]

1 minute ago, manaliveits105 said:

Proper pork

I AM NOTHING LIKE THAT FAT HIBS WELT !! 

[Cade]

Just because you keep crying "gammon is racist" does not make it so.

 

It's not.

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

This is a terrific article about the evolution of the term " gammon" . Its also very humorous .  I remember that edition of "Question Time" when poor Jeremy Corbyn got crucified for not fully committing to pressing the Nuclear button .  " How dare you be afraid to kill me . my family my friends and everyone i know " came from most of the., well " Gammon" .  The article concludes  that the term is not  racist but most " gammon" are white . Indeed  99% plus.  I wouldn't use it though. 

 

"Basically, we all know what we’re talking about when we describe a person as ‘gammon’. It’s more about their awful political views, their mistaken belief that we want to hear them, and their obliviousness to their own privilege, than it is about the colour of their skin. BUT — it is important to note that it is almost always white men that think and behave like gammons. It is, sadly, a product of whiteness. And it’s important that we acknowledge that." 

 

 

Is ‘Gammon’ a Racist Term?. Gotta love those rhetorical questions… | by Katy Preen | Medium

 

 

Edited November 15, 2021 by JamesM48

[Alex Kintner]

24 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

This is a terrific article about the evolution of the term " gammon" . Its also very humorous .  I remember that edition of "Question Time" when poor Jeremy Corbyn got crucified for not fully committing to pressing the Nuclear button .  " How dare you be afraid to kill me . my family my friends and everyone i know " came from most of the., well " Gammon" .  The article concludes  that the term is not  racist but most " gammon" are white . Indeed  99% plus.  I wouldn't use it though. 

 

"Basically, we all know what we’re talking about when we describe a person as ‘gammon’. It’s more about their awful political views, their mistaken belief that we want to hear them, and their obliviousness to their own privilege, than it is about the colour of their skin. BUT — it is important to note that it is almost always white men that think and behave like gammons. It is, sadly, a product of whiteness. And it’s important that we acknowledge that." 

 

 

Is ‘Gammon’ a Racist Term?. Gotta love those rhetorical questions… | by Katy Preen | Medium

 

 

So it’s not racist? Cool 👍🏻

[JudyJudyJudy]

18 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

So it’s not racist? Cool 👍🏻

Not according to the article but its still meant as an insult and a derogatory term i would say. 

[Japan Jambo]

1 minute ago, JamesM48 said:

Not according to the article but its still meant as an insult and a derogatory term i would say. 

 

It is without question a pejorative term. One article is not the definitive word on this and opinions do differ. 

 

On the Brexit front though some good news today;

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59288593

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

3 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

It is without question a pejorative term. One article is not the definitive word on this and opinions do differ. 

 

On the Brexit front though some good news today;

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59288593

 

 

👍

[Alex Kintner]

41 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Not according to the article but its still meant as an insult and a derogatory term i would say. 

I’m very cool with the fact it’s insulting and derogatory. I have no qualms about insulting people I believe are racist.

[Alex Kintner]

36 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

It is without question a pejorative term. One article is not the definitive word on this and opinions do differ. 

 

On the Brexit front though some good news today;

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-59288593

 

 

Why’s that good news on the Brexit front? They’re moving from a dual Dutch/British base to a solely British base for tax benefits and to avoid more stringent environmental rules in Holland.

[JudyJudyJudy]

13 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

I’m very cool with the fact it’s insulting and derogatory. I have no qualms about insulting people I believe are racist.

Does that not drag you down to their level then ? 

[Japan Jambo]

2 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Does that not drag you down to their level then ? 

 

The irony of using a racist term to describe a racist is lost on some people.

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

The irony of using a racist term to describe a racist is lost on some people.

👍

[Japan Jambo]

14 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

Why’s that good news on the Brexit front? They’re moving from a dual Dutch/British base to a solely British base for tax benefits and to avoid more stringent environmental rules in Holland.

 

Get the distinct impression that it wouldn't matter what happened you'd still find fault with it. Regardless of the motives is it not good for the UK that a major European company has decided that the UK is the environment they wish to operate in?

[Alex Kintner]

Just now, jonesy said:

Absolutely, me too, on both points.

 

But until a larger number of enlightened folk acknowledge that gammon is a term used, consciously or unconsciously, with casually racist intent, the weaker the stance of those insulting the racists will be.

Nah. Not got a racist bone in my body and absolutely despise racists, especially those who turn pink during their racist rants

[Konrad von Carstein]

8 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Absolutely, me too, on both points.

 

But until a larger number of enlightened folk acknowledge that gammon is a term used, consciously or unconsciously, with casually racist intent, the weaker the stance of those insulting the racists will be.

 

utter tosh...

[Konrad von Carstein]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

As usual, you’re probably right Herr Von K, but just sharing how I see it.

 

 

Ja, Herr Goebbels, promoting lies and misinformation is becoming your "jam"

 

 

[Alex Kintner]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Good to hear. I don’t believe many, if any, of the folk who laugh it up at the gammonati believe themselves to be racist, nor are they racist in the sense of wandering about kicking lumps out of ethnic minorities or burning crosses.

 

Perhaps it is more a form of implicit bias. But when that implicit bias takes the form of identifying people ‘turning pink’, then don’t pretend there is not a skin colour/racial element to the insult.

For me gammon simply saves me the time of writing out “racist English bar steward”. The skin part is fairly irrelevant. 

[Alex Kintner]

3 minutes ago, jonesy said:

As usual, you’re probably right Herr Von K, but just sharing how I see it.

 

 

To be fair to you Jonesy, you do post in a very amiable way and it’s difficult to get too annoyed at you even when you’re arguing such a daft point 👍🏻

[Konrad von Carstein]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

Scurrilous accusation 
 

The intolerance of the more ‘progressive’, Uber-tolerant types on here is something to behold, especially given their otherwise impressive intelligence and wit. 

 

*fireworks in the sky*

 

 

 

^^^^^Most definitely funnier in my head

[Alex Kintner]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Happy to discuss such things with gentlemen such as yourself, Alex, even if we disagree.  

👍🏻

[Victorian]

The purpose of the gammon 'insult' is about attitudes and beliefs.  It doesn't seek to insult,  discriminate against or demonise someone or a defined group of people because of the colour,  complexion or pigmentation of skin,  their race,  heritage,  religion.  It merely makes a casual reference to a complexion or temporary hue of skin as a peripheral stereotype.  There is no defined race or minority group 'the gammons' to be discriminated against or insulted on the basis of their race,  skin colour,  heritage,  etc.

 

Not racist.  Please,  for the love of God,  desist from this bammery.

[Konrad von Carstein]

4 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

To be fair to you Jonesy, you do post in a very amiable way and it’s difficult to get too annoyed at you even when you’re arguing such a daft point 👍🏻

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

12 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

For me gammon simply saves me the time of writing out “racist English bar steward”. The skin part is fairly irrelevant. 

 

[Alex Kintner]

2 minutes ago, Konrad von Carstein said:

 

He’s a lovable rogue🤷🏻‍♂️

[Konrad von Carstein]

Just now, Alex Kintner said:

He’s a lovable rogue🤷🏻‍♂️

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

10 minutes ago, Victorian said:

The purpose of the gammon 'insult' is about attitudes and beliefs.  It doesn't seek to insult,  discriminate against or demonise someone or a defined group of people because of the colour,  complexion or pigmentation of skin,  their race,  heritage,  religion.  It merely makes a casual reference to a complexion or temporary hue of skin as a peripheral stereotype.  There is no defined race or minority group 'the gammons' to be discriminated against or insulted on the basis of their race,  skin colour,  heritage,  etc.

 

Not racist.  Please,  for the love of God,  desist from this bammery.

 

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Change some of the words in there to include casual references to other ethnicities, nationalities, gender(s), or sexual orientations and  you’d end up skating on terrain glissant.

 

There is no defined group of people,  the gammons,  recognised as an ethnicity,  nationality,  gender,  sexual orientation.

[Victorian]

If gammon were to be declared as racist because of the casual and practically irrelevant reference to skin,  it's not that far removed from it being racist to make comments about people with fair,  freckly complexions.  Gingers,  etc.

 

Stop the descent into utter mentalness.

[JudyJudyJudy]

Still waiting to see a social media rant from  a young gay,  black “ gammon “ . 

[JudyJudyJudy]

8 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Well, like, duh, dude. Although I think yer average Top Gear studio may have been a temporary micro state…

 

I could rattle off a list of other pejoratives, used to describe certain ethnicities, nationalities, genders and sexual orientations. There would be no defined group of people strictly definable by those terms, either. However, their immutable characteristics would still have been modified, exaggerated or in some way latched onto in order to create the insult.

 

Look, I understand, no decent people, which you all are, like to come to the realisation that they may have been using racist language while, simultaneously, having a self image that is at odds with such low-level behaviour. The logical step of denial followed by mockery/anger is as obvious as it is unhelpful. It’s okay, lads. Nobody is perfect.

 

[Unknown user]

4 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Not according to the article but its still meant as an insult and a derogatory term i would say. 

It's not intended as a term of endearment.

[JudyJudyJudy]

22 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Don’t know about his preference for innies/outies, but I doubt this English lad’s going to be liking any Farage Facebook posts any time soon.

 

 

You are more brave than me searching for “ black gammon “ on Google 

[JudyJudyJudy]

21 minutes ago, Smithee said:

It's not intended as a term of endearment.

Clearly 

[NANOJAMBO]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

Change some of the words in there to include casual references to other ethnicities, nationalities, gender(s), or sexual orientations and  you’d end up skating on terrain glissant.

"The purpose of the gammon 'insult' is about attitudes and beliefs."

 

It's that simple. You know it. 

[Cade]

Meanwhile, back in the real world, the arsehole's arsehole, Christopher Chope MP single-handedly stopped the ratification of the standards committee report on Owen Paterson's abuses of the lobbying system.

 

The Government was hoping it would go through on the nod so they could try and make people forget they attempted to get Paterson off the hook (and abolish the standards committee).  

 

Chope shouted "OBJECT", which caused the motion to fail and will have to be re-submitted later.

 

Chope has previous form when it comes to single-handedly stopping parliamentary business, also having objected to things like blocking  a measure to protect 3rd world nations from vulture funds, objecting to the pardon bill for Alan Turing, objecting to a bill banning wold animals being used in circuses, objecting to a bill banning revenge evictions, objecting to a bill restricting car parking charges for health workers among many, many others.

 

The guy is widely hated even in his own evil party.

 

 

[Savage Vince]

7 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:

For me gammon simply saves me the time of writing out “racist English bar steward”. The skin part is fairly irrelevant. 

 

It is quicker granted but the seethe it brings to the racist is a joy to behold. This thread being an example. 😊

[Alex Kintner]

6 hours ago, Cade said:

Meanwhile, back in the real world, the arsehole's arsehole, Christopher Chope MP single-handedly stopped the ratification of the standards committee report on Owen Paterson's abuses of the lobbying system.

 

The Government was hoping it would go through on the nod so they could try and make people forget they attempted to get Paterson off the hook (and abolish the standards committee).  

 

Chope shouted "OBJECT", which caused the motion to fail and will have to be re-submitted later.

 

Chope has previous form when it comes to single-handedly stopping parliamentary business, also having objected to things like blocking  a measure to protect 3rd world nations from vulture funds, objecting to the pardon bill for Alan Turing, objecting to a bill banning wold animals being used in circuses, objecting to a bill banning revenge evictions, objecting to a bill restricting car parking charges for health workers among many, many others.

 

The guy is widely hated even in his own evil party.

 

 

He’s ok by me on this occasion as I think it now needs to be debated in the house which gives a chance for more Tory misery

[Victorian]

Suddenly and with some relish,  every person once insulted because of their ruddy complexion,  or leathery weather beaten appearance,  or acne scarred coupon is contemplating filing a police complaint for racism.  Because it's about skin,  yuh?  

 

 

[The Mighty Thor]

2 full pages of peddling a myth with zero takers. 

 

 

[Dazo]

So this is where the grown ups are hiding, defending their right to insult people. 😂😂😂

[Unknown user]

9 minutes ago, jonesy said:

 

Christ almighty… you hold a mirror up to some folk and, after their initial terror-filled recoil, they then proceed to hate on the mirrorsmiths. It really doesn’t reflect well on them.

 

Aye very good, fake calls of racism only reflect badly on you though chief

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

54 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

2 full pages of peddling a myth with zero takers. 

 

 

Two pages of deflecting from the gammon party.

[Unknown user]

14 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Fair enough. I understand how you see it that way, and totally get why folk don’t like or agree re the racism within the term gammon. 
 

Just tired of years of hypocrisy from folk who seem quite happy to deploy double standards while, at the same time, decrying double standards.

 

Yeah but that's shite, there is no racism in the term gammon, white people calling white people a name because of their actions isn't racist.

 

I've no idea why you're so into this intellectual pose and blanket accusation, it's very un-Jonesy. Can we not just go back on topic with the understanding that you think a whole bunch of people on here are racist hypocrites guilty of double standards?

[Victorian]

Jonesy has performed the role of gallant advocate quite splendidly.  Now it is time to cast adrift this most lost of lost causes.

 

 

[Savage Vince]

39 minutes ago, jonesy said:

 

 

Christ almighty… you hold a mirror up to some folk and, after their initial terror-filled recoil, they then proceed to hate on the mirrorsmiths. It really doesn’t reflect well on them.

 

Give it up Jonesy. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

24 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Fair enough. I understand how you see it that way, and totally get why folk don’t like or agree re the racism within the term gammon. 
 

Just tired of years of hypocrisy from folk who seem quite happy to deploy double standards while, at the same time, decrying double standards.

AT least Enzo is getting a break from it all................ 😄