Sturgeon shelves plan for quick second Scottish independence referendum

[Old Hearts]

You can decipher then [emoji106]

 

Look it up in a newspaper. Don't forget to post us a link as usual though, because they are so insightful and balanced.

 

 

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[Space Mackerel]

 

You can decipher then [emoji106]

 

Look it up in a newspaper. Don't forget to post us a link as usual though, because they are so insightful and balanced.

 

 

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Just posted a link to the Telegraph, the Tory bible.

 

 

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[JamboX2]

Brexit tax rate for Apple, undercut Ireland by 0.001% some strategy! [emoji23]

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/30/apple-ordered-to-pay-11bn-after-european-union-tax-investigation/

 

 

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Much like the manifesto for independence to undercut the UK with corporation tax cuts. And APD.

 

Meanwhile further cuts to local government are coming thanks to the SNP government in Scotland.

[Space Mackerel]

Much like the manifesto for independence to undercut the UK with corporation tax cuts. And APD.

 

Meanwhile further cuts to local government are coming thanks to the SNP government in Scotland.

Further cuts induced by the block grant from Westminster?

And made up to local councils by the SNP.

 

And they are allowed to raise Council Tax by 3 percent now.

 

Councils needed reigned in spending wise, especially Labour ones.

 

 

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[Thunderstruck]

So h1b5 like [emoji23]

 

http://www.scottishconservatives.com/2016/09/activists-to-mark-indyref-anniversary-with-demand-to-drop-re-run-threat/

 

 

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Woo-Hoo, Party Time!

 

Time to mark the second anniversary of that glorious day in 2014 when the common sense of the Scottish People triumphed over the Parcel of Rogues, Scoundrels and Snake-oil Salesmen.

 

Hope you'll feel able to join in.

[Space Mackerel]

Woo-Hoo, Party Time!

 

Time to mark the second anniversary of that glorious day in 2014 when the common sense of the Scottish People triumphed over the Parcel of Rogues, Scoundrels and Snake-oil Salesmen.

 

Hope you'll feel able to join in.

 

Mind yer hats

 

 

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[Thunderstruck]

 

Mind yer hats

 

 

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I'll take that as an "MRU". Probably just as well, you might put a damper on the festivities.

[aussieh]

No. Not at all. Why are they all the same? Under a shambolic opposition in labour you have a leader more "liberal" than your pals at the SNP? How is he then the same?

 

No offence to you mate, but I get frustrated at nationalists just peddling sound bite after sound bite. It's political and not fact based. For me the only factual argument is economic and economically my family and my children are better as part of the U.K. Does my heart want Scotland to be independent? Perhaps, in a way. Do I seriously think Scotland and my family would be better off? Absolutely not. In fact should Scotland go down that route it would break my heart but we would move down south.

Bye britz

[Mister T]

and Ball

 

 

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Did you have a wee chuckle to yourself when you did that? Do you impress even yourself with your wit, wisdom and the speed of your pithy put downs? What a bore you are.

[aussieh]

But they don't want independence. They want devolution of power within the bigger whole. A variation of power.

 

I'm happy with devolution for Scotland. I don't want independence. I don't see the sense in breaking away from a bigger whole of people who in more ways than not ARE LIKE US.

Not a chance in hell, never, no way whatsoever.

 

 

 

You voted Yes, aye sure you did.

[JamboX2]

Further cuts induced by the block grant from Westminster?

And made up to local councils by the SNP.

 

And they are allowed to raise Council Tax by 3 percent now.

 

Councils needed reigned in spending wise, especially Labour ones.

 

 

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Much like the Scottish government csn raise tax?

 

Councils are the front line in providing some of the most needed child support, public health and anti-poverty programs to fight inequality. By slashing their budgets whilst retaining regressive policies like a council tax freeze and a cut to APD we will see inequality rise not fall in Scotland.

 

It'll be interesting to see how this affects the proposed school reforms (academisation by the back door). Afterall if Schools are run separately from councils, but wider child support - support for disabled children, support for children with learning difficulties, support for poorer families - is still council run then we could see a massive post-code lottery appear in provision.

 

Frankly, it's all good saying "they spend too much" but that ignores the harsh truth of what happens when you cut spending. Education is the great enabler. It transforms lives and breaks the cycle of poverty. To me, education deserves year on year increases to its budget not health. And the majority of funding still comes from local government.

[JamboX2]

Not a chance in hell, never, no way whatsoever.

 

 

 

You voted Yes, aye sure you did.

I did. But after two years of reflection and of seeing what the SNP's promises amount to I'm glad we avoided independence. Especially given the economy.

 

And if there are people the Scots are most like in the world it's English, Welsh and Irish.

[aussieh]

I did. But after two years of reflection and of seeing what the SNP's promises amount to I'm glad we avoided independence. Especially given the economy.

 

And if there are people the Scots are most like in the world it's English, Welsh and Irish.

your mirrors decked, but you're just a bitter labour loser. Maybe you should take some of your own advice and stop Blaming the SNP for labours mess.

 

 

Oh we're more like our European and N. American friends.

 

 

Debt and assets are about the same, so we'll start from scratch. No debt plenty of assets.

[reaths17]

your mirrors decked, but you're just a bitter labour loser. Maybe you should take some of your own advice and stop Blaming the SNP for labours mess.

 

 

Oh we're more like our European and N. American friends.

 

 

Debt and assets are about the same, so we'll start from scratch. No debt plenty of assets.

do you and the space cake have idiot stamped on your heads ? naw wait "Scottish idiot"

 

I don't know how you 2 get away with destroying every political thread on here, unless your mods/bum chums of mods

you offer nothing to a conversation, just wee bitter snipes that you'd expect from sore losers.

 

still you'se do more damage to the independence cause with every stupid ersole comment so it has a plus side

[reaths17]

Who appear to be quite happy not being part of the Union.

really.....

 

the irish economy has been screwed for years needed a huge bale out to stay afloat, thanks to the EU, the SNP's go to gang to support their independence.

 

you picked a great example with that, theres no much happiness in Ireland when it comes to their economy.

[Old Hearts]

That is exactly the point, no matter how the economy is performing they have at no point wanted to re-join the UK.

But they will happily indirctly accept and take UK money via an EU bailout.....

[reaths17]

That is exactly the point, no matter how the economy is performing they have at no point wanted to re-join the UK.

I don't actually recall Ireland ever being part of the union !

 

and your quite happy for Scotland to get the begging bowl/knickers out/off and prostitute itself to the germans ?

 

just to screw over the English/ get one over westminster

[XB52]

I don't actually recall Ireland ever being part of the union !

 

and your quite happy for Scotland to get the begging bowl/knickers out/off and prostitute itself to the germans ?

 

just to screw over the English/ get one over westminster

wow, ignorance in your first line, casual racism in your second line and the old 'we hate the English' rubbish in your last line. What a good start to the day for you

[JamboX2]

The proposed cut in APD is to do with Scotland's more remote location and is therefor seen as a hindrance to tourism etc. Is not to do with big business or the airlines as you seem to be suggesting.

Scotland, Edinburgh in particular, is the most visited part of the UK after London. What possible benefits are there to this on the tourism front?

 

The people who are likely to benefit from this are those who can afford to fly and airlines will reap the profits on top of that. Added to this is the additional costs which will be paid to the environment with increased air traffic.

 

Those who will suffer are those who are poorest who will see no tangible benefits and will see an extra ?250m vanish from Scottish government coffers.

 

All in all it's a pretty regressive policy.

[JamboX2]

Who appear to be quite happy not being part of the Union.

Inclusive of the Northern Irish as well. Equally the historic reasoning and parallels to Irish independence are massively different to that of Scotland. Scotland was always viewed and viewed itself as a partner to the Union. Ireland not so much.

[JamboX2]

No its not, Edinburgh is not a Country bound in Union by Treaty.

What do historic identities matter in civic nationalism. If the good people of Edinburgh or Shetland or Newcastle, Paris, New York, New Brunswick, Tasmania or Alaska view it as beneficial to them and their peoples to go it alone then why shoukd they be denied independence?

 

Does it merely boil down to an historic nationhood? Or is it down to the fact that Scotland can self determine her future as a whole but not her constituent parts?

[reaths17]

wow, ignorance in your first line, casual racism in your second line and the old 'we hate the English' rubbish in your last line. What a good start to the day for you

another separatist, with a sniping comment and nowt else, oot in force today.

 

if you can come up with just one economic reason to dispel the "we hate England" reason, i'll be shocked

[Space Mackerel]

do you and the space cake have idiot stamped on your heads ? naw wait "Scottish idiot"

 

I don't know how you 2 get away with destroying every political thread on here, unless your mods/bum chums of mods

you offer nothing to a conversation, just wee bitter snipes that you'd expect from sore losers.

 

still you'se do more damage to the independence cause with every stupid ersole comment so it has a plus side

 

 

Complains about sniping but his whole post is one big snipe

 

Cmon, We are waiting for something coherant from you. Im all ears

[Seymour M Hersh]

Any chance wee nippy could "shelve" herself?

[XB52]

another separatist, with a sniping comment and nowt else, oot in force today.

 

if you can come up with just one economic reason to dispel the "we hate England" reason, i'll be shocked

your first line is hilarious and your second line makes no sense whatsoever. What has 'hating the English' got to do with economics??  Come on, I know you hate Scotland but there are many of us who love the country and just want us to be the same as every other country in the World. Hating people south of the current border has nothing to do with it. if you can show me somewhere I, or the SNP, have stated any hatred for England then please do so. Just because you hate the SNP for being successful doesn't mean that we are full of hate

[XB52]

do you and the space cake have idiot stamped on your heads ? naw wait "Scottish idiot"

 

I don't know how you 2 get away with destroying every political thread on here, unless your mods/bum chums of mods

you offer nothing to a conversation, just wee bitter snipes that you'd expect from sore losers.

 

still you'se do more damage to the independence cause with every stupid ersole comment so it has a plus side

oh you are getting better. Adding homophobia to your earlier racism. Good way to add support to the unionist cause????  

[reaths17]

oh you are getting better. Adding homophobia to your earlier racism. Good way to add support to the unionist cause????

the unionist don't need any help "they won" just as well seeing as the black gold has went ttits up and the English, welsh n northern irish are here to bale us out.

 

77,000 unanswered calls for help to nippy nickys Police Scotland, yeah great job the seperatists are doing.

[Radio Ga Ga]

I see that Therea May and Ruth Davidson are both now more popular in Scotland (approval ratings) than Wee Nippy, I thought that all of Scotland hated the Tory's and everything they stood for? #StillNo

[Boris]

I see that Therea May and Ruth Davidson are both now more popular in Scotland (approval ratings) than Wee Nippy, I thought that all of Scotland hated the Tory's and everything they stood for? #StillNo

 

Hahaha - depends on the question being asked!

[Space Mackerel]

Todays article from WGD

 

 

   

According to the Tory Culture Secretary speaking on Thursday in the Commons, a key part of the renewed BBC charter is "supporting greater cohesion between the nations of the UK". You might think that the words culture and Tory were mutually exclusive, because that certainly seems to be the case as far as Scotland is concerned. The Scottish Tories spend their time either denying the existence of Scottish culture, or denying that key parts of Scottish culture like our own languages are deserving of state support. The only culture that the Tories are interested in is the culture of privatisation, the culture of educational segregation, and the culture of money.

It also seems to be the case that the BBC isn't especially comfortable with the existence of Scotland as a nation and a culture. Normal countries which are self-governing or autonomous have their own public service broadcaster as well as the service proper to the state as a whole. The BBC thinks that Scottish culture and politics can be more than adequately served with a series of hauf-airsed opt-outs from the "main" service. As far as public service broadcasting is concerned, Scotland only exists as a set of minor divergences from a Great British menu.

It's reasonable to ask how a public service broadcaster which has a key goal to support greater cohesion between the nations of the UK can properly cover a population which doesn't want to be a part of the UK at all. How can a broadcaster dedicated to the principle of greater cohesion between the different countries of the UK accurately and fairly report on an independence campaign in one of those nations? The answer is, it can't.

Already sources in Westminster, according to the Herald, have confirmed that because of the new charter commitment, proposals for a Scottish Six news programme are dead. Because the BBC is dedicated to the principle of erasing any Scottish distinctiveness, we're not even going to be permitted to have an hour long news programme that's an opt-out from the main 6 O Clock news. Instead we're to sit through interminable discussions of educational and health policies which are of minor relevance to Scotland, a whole lot of verbiage about the progress of the England cricket team, and a weather map that makes Scotland look smaller than Dorset.

The Scottish Six was only ever a sop, even though it was described by a certain Unionist commentator as the holy grail of the Scottish independence movement. Because what all those SNP, Green, and Rise party members, what all those people who work their socks off in Yes groups and CommonWeal groups up and down the land are really striving for is an extra half hour of Jackie Bird. We were permitted to discuss the possibility of an extra thirty minutes of news about the UK and the rest of the world presented from Scotland as a distraction from the real question. Why doesn't Scotland have a national broadcaster of its own?

What was confirmed today is that the UK and the Westminster parliament refuses to countenance any news or current affairs production in Scotland that is not controlled and mediated by them. We can have our parochial little productions about items of strictly local interest, but when dealing with the wider world we have to go through London. Scotland cannot and will not be permitted to develop its own perspective on the world. We are to remain firmly an adjunct of a BBC controlled and produced from London. Remember your place Scottish people. Get back into the Great British shortbread tin.

It cannot be stated often enough. I've said it before frequently. Other self-governing nations have their own public service broadcaster, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are the odd ones out. It's not unreasonable, it's not outrageous, it's not unconscionable for Scotland to demand something that other self-governing countries take for granted. It's a symptom of how much we've allowed the Unionist parties to control the debate on this topic that there isn't greater public pressure in Scotland for something every other self-governing country possesses.

So screw yer Scottish Six BBC, we want an SBC. We want a Scottish Broadcasting Corporation that's based in Scotland, funded by Scotland, broadcasts to Scotland, and is answerable to Scotland. We don't want a Scottish Six. We want an SBC that broadcasts in English to the whole of Scotland. We want a Scots language TV service to sit alongside our existing Gaelic channel. And we want what the Catalans have got - we want a 24 hour, 7 day a week Scottish news channel.

Catalonia has its own broadcasters. The Basque Country has its own. Galicia has its own. The 60,000 people of the Faroe Islands have their own public service broadcaster. The 30,000 S?mi speakers in the far north of Norway have their own dedicated broadcast service. Even the tiny autonomous territory of Gagauzia, 150000 people in the poorest corner of Moldova, the poorest country in Europe, on a scrap of land smaller than Ayrshire can have their own national broadcaster. And yet the 5 million people of Scotland, with our rich culture and ancient history and rich heritage and political distinctiveness, in what we're always being told is one of the richest countries in the world, well we can make do with a half hour of murrderrs, fitba and wee cute kittens after the really important news about educational policy somewhere else that doesn't affect us.  That's not a public service broadcaster.  That's taking the piss and making us pay to be pissed on.

The only reason Scotland can't have its own national broadcaster is because Westminster and the Unionist parties don't think it's in their own interests to allow us to have one. Again, as so many times before, the Unionist establishment and the Unionist parties put their own interests and their own needs before those of the people whom they claim to serve. The truth is that they only serve themselves, and they serve themselves at our expense. When you vote Unionist, you're voting to for a party that puts its interests before your own. You're voting to be held in contempt. You're voting to be sidelined. You're voting for irrelevance.

Of course we all know the real reason why the Westminster establishment refuses to countenance even the token recognition of Scotland as a nation that a Scottish Six represents. They claim that a Scottish Broadcaster would be under the thumb of the SNP, and that's why it shouldn't be allowed. But by making that claim they implicitly acknowledge that the BBC is under the thumb of the Unionist establishment, because under the Westminster system an SBC would be set up and governed by a similar charter to the charter the BBC operates under. The BBC is the propaganda arm of the British state. It's what allowed the Better Together campaign to determine the narrative of the last independence referendum, and that's exactly what Westminster intends to do the next time too. The BBC is not a public service broadcaster. It's a Union service broadcaster.

[Radio Ga Ga]

Hahaha - depends on the question being asked!

 

Got the information from here -

 

 

http://glasgowunihumanrights.blogspot.co.uk/2016/09/unpopular-or-what-snp-leader-nicola.html

 

Might be rubbish?

[Space Mackerel]

I see that Therea May and Ruth Davidson are both now more popular in Scotland (approval ratings) than Wee Nippy, I thought that all of Scotland hated the Tory's and everything they stood for? #StillNo

 

 

Hahaha - depends on the question being asked!

 

 

http://wingsoverscotland.com/dissatisfaction-guaranteed/

[Radio Ga Ga]

http://wingsoverscotland.com/dissatisfaction-guaranteed/

They're a real hot bed of impartiality aren't they! I know you love her, but in my peer group most of them can't stand her, although we are all Unionists to be fair!

[Space Mackerel]

They're a real hot bed of impartiality aren't they! I know you love her, but in my peer group most of them can't stand her, although we are all Unionists to be fair!

You mean they've blown the argument apart.

 

 

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[XB52]

the unionist don't need any help "they won" just as well seeing as the black gold has went ttits up and the English, welsh n northern irish are here to bale us out.

 

77,000 unanswered calls for help to nippy nickys Police Scotland, yeah great job the seperatists are doing.

Scotland crime rate at a 40 year low and detection rates going up every year. terrible job the Police are doing right enough.

[Radio Ga Ga]

You mean they've blown the argument apart.

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They will still NEVER win the argument for Independence, not going to happen, thank feck!!

[Space Mackerel]

They will still NEVER win the argument for Independence, not going to happen, thank feck!!

48% now and going up and up.

 

 

 

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[HaymarketJambo]

Scotland crime rate at a 40 year low and detection rates going up every year. terrible job the Police are doing right enough.

 

Unemployment down in Scotland.

 

SNPBad.    

[Radio Ga Ga]

48% now and going up and up.

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Keep trying to convince yourself, after the Brexit vote, the SNP thought the Yes vote was going to go through the roof, never happened. Don't ever right off the silent majority, some of the posts on this thread are a perfect example of aggressive Nationalism.

 

Of course I know a few Yes voters, but hand on heart, the vast majority of my friends and family would vote No again tomorrow and I swear I do not know one person who has changed from No to Yes, I do however know one colleague who has changed from yes to no.

[Radio Ga Ga]

Unemployment down in Scotland.

 

SNPBad.

 

Unemployment down in rUk too by 37,000, what's your point?

[HaymarketJambo]

Unemployment down in rUk too by 37,000, what's your point?

 

 Well if unemployment had been up in Scotland I'm sure the anti SNP brigade on here would be blaming the SNP for it. 

[Radio Ga Ga]

Well if unemployment had been up in Scotland I'm sure the anti SNP brigade on here would be blaming the SNP for it.

 

OK, we will agree that unemployment has fallen across the U.K., what's your thoughts on Scotlands attainment levels v rUK

[Space Mackerel]

Keep trying to convince yourself, after the Brexit vote, the SNP thought the Yes vote was going to go through the roof, never happened. Don't ever right off the silent majority, some of the posts on this thread are a perfect example of aggressive Nationalism.

 

Of course I know a few Yes voters, but hand on heart, the vast majority of my friends and family would vote No again tomorrow and I swear I do not know one person who has changed from No to Yes, I do however know one colleague who has changed from yes to no.

So the poll yesterday was wrong in The Scotsman?

 

 

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[Hasselhoff]

48% now and going up and up.

 

 

 

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In your head maybe, not when you look at the stats - it's getting further apart. 

 

[Space Mackerel]

In your head maybe, not when you look at the stats - it's getting further apart.

 

Lovely scaling and lines to try and kid on the Unionists.

 

Off Lionheart news or some crap site like that I guess [emoji23]

 

 

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[Hasselhoff]

Lovely scaling and lines to try and kid on the Unionists.

 

Off Lionheart news or some crap site like that I guess [emoji23]

 

 

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Source is at the top of the graph. WhatScotlandThinks. Professor Curtice, you will have seen him on the news as major player in polls analysis.

 

Plotting a line along points on a graph is hardly witchcraft! Typical response though.

[Space Mackerel]

Source is at the top of the graph. WhatScotlandThinks. Professor Curtice, you will have seen him on the news as major player in polls analysis.

 

Plotting a line along points on a graph is hardly witchcraft! Typical response though.

 

From his page:

 

"However, there is not any evidence of a post-Brexit swing in favour of the Union in the detailed tables for these polls. As many as 15% of Ipsos MORI?s respondents say that the outcome of the EU referendum has affected the way they would vote in a second ballot on independence. However, rather more (55%) of this group now say they would vote Yes, than state they would vote No (45%). Meanwhile, amongst the 6% of the sample who say that they are now undecided about how they would vote, 36% say they supported No in advance of the EU referendum, while only 14% state that they backed Yes. Between them these figures would seem to imply that, contrary to initial impressions, there might have been a small swing to Yes in the wake of the Brexit vote."

[deesidejambo]

Support for another referendum within 2 years at 41%.       Not going to happen any time soon.  

[Space Mackerel]

Support for another referendum within 2 years at 41%. Not going to happen any time soon.

Aye, because the average person with a brain in their head knows it's not a guaranteed victory.

 

Like I've said before, let the old codgers die off, the younger generation through and it's tatty bye UK.

 

 

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[Radio Ga Ga]

Aye, because the average person with a brain in their head knows it's not a guaranteed victory.

Like I've said before, let the old codgers die off, the younger generation through and it's tatty bye UK.

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Aye because it's only No voters that die off right enough (Vladimir Stupid) and all the younger generation are all Yes sheep too (Double Vlad Stupid)