Sturgeon shelves plan for quick second Scottish independence referendum

[Arnold Rothstein]

To be fair, if there was a vote for independence, do you really think there would be the call for a referendum on a union with another country?

 

Would there be the will?

 

I doubt it.

The U.K. is quite a unique situation and if it was a 55/45 split for yes I could see a demand for a second vote. The U.K. Would likely tell us to GTF though.

[Space Mackerel]

Wait a minute, wait a minute.

 

People are going off course here, the SNP's manifesto at the Scottish Elections 2015 clearly stated that there might be another referendum if there were clear materialistic changes or words to that effect.

 

There has been, that's a given, so all this talk about not accepting the referendum is a smoke screen, I had accepted it and moved on, Brexit changed everything. To say otherwise is frankly nonsense given the political limbo down South in Westminster.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Thunderstruck]

Wait a minute, wait a minute.

 

People are going off course here, the SNP's manifesto at the Scottish Elections 2015 clearly stated that there might be another referendum if there were clear materialistic changes or words to that effect.

 

There has been, that's a given, so all this talk about not accepting the referendum is a smoke screen, I had accepted it and moved on, Brexit changed everything. To say otherwise is frankly nonsense given the political limbo down South in Westminster.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Wait another minute...

 

The SNP didn't gain a majority of seats on the basis of its manifesto. In fact, Ms Sturgeon managed to turn a majority to a minority.

 

Perhaps the incessant whining about a referendum p****d-off some earlier support.

[Space Mackerel]

Wait another minute...

 

The SNP didn't gain a majority of seats on the basis of its manifesto. In fact, Ms Sturgeon managed to turn a majority to a minority.

 

Perhaps the incessant whining about a referendum p****d-off some earlier support.

The Scottish Parliament was DESIGNED so not one party had an overall majority, how many times has this got to be drummed into people's thick heads?? It's not a Firtst Past the Post system.

 

And her share as a percentage went UP, yes up. Have you conveniently forgotten that too?

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Space Mackerel]

Wait another minute...

 

The SNP didn't gain a majority of seats on the basis of its manifesto. In fact, Ms Sturgeon managed to turn a majority to a minority.

 

Perhaps the incessant whining about a referendum p****d-off some earlier support.

This is what you get under your supposed beloved FPTP system, do I need to explain further?

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Space Mackerel]

Wait another minute...

 

The SNP didn't gain a majority of seats on the basis of its manifesto. In fact, Ms Sturgeon managed to turn a majority to a minority.

 

Perhaps the incessant whining about a referendum p****d-off some earlier support.

This is what you get under the Additional Member System used in the Scottish Parliament.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Thunderstruck]

The Scottish Parliament was DESIGNED so not one party had an overall majority, how many times has this got to be drummed into people's thick heads?? It's not a Firtst Past the Post system.

 

And her share as a percentage went UP, yes up. Have you conveniently forgotten that too?

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Can she act alone if all other parties oppose her? Mrs May on the other hand...

 

She, unlike you, knows the game is up as all that is left is grievance. The financial benefits (the greed part of the equation) are burst balloons.

[Boris]

Can she act alone if all other parties oppose her? Mrs May on the other hand...

She, unlike you, knows the game is up as all that is left is grievance. The financial benefits (the greed part of the equation) are burst balloons.

Time will tell.

 

One May goes into full on right wing policies, just like ukip according to the recent defector, it will be interesting seeing Ms Davidson trying to justify that at a General Election.

 

Pretty sure there will be a lot of people with a lot of grievances come then!

[Space Mackerel]

Can she act alone if all other parties oppose her? Mrs May on the other hand...

 

She, unlike you, knows the game is up as all that is left is grievance. The financial benefits (the greed part of the equation) are burst balloons.

Tell you what, why don't you ask yourself why the Scottish Parliament went with the Additional Member System in the first place?

 

Then come back with more claptrap as you normally do.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Thunderstruck]

Tell you what, why don't you ask yourself why the Scottish Parliament went with the Additional Member System in the first place?

 

Then come back with more claptrap as you normally do.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I'm sure you know but I will remind you that it was designed to bring consensual government without the wild swings usually associated with FPTP.

 

Sadly, It has saddled us with a party that blends incompetence with timidity while expending most of its energy tilting at the independence windmill.

[jambos are go!]

Tell you what, why don't you ask yourself why the Scottish Parliament went with the Additional Member System in the first place?

Then come back with more claptrap as you normally do.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The AMS was put in place by Westminster when Holyrood was set up. To suggest otherwise is claptrap.

[Space Mackerel]

I'm sure you know but I will remind you that it was designed to bring consensual government without the wild swings usually associated with FPTP.

 

Sadly, It has saddled us with a party that blends incompetence with timidity while expending most of its energy tilting at the independence windmill.

 

 

Aye right enough, it was the Scottish Parliaments fault now that the SNP got 50% of the vote.

 

What a beamer.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Space Mackerel]

The AMS was put in place by Westminster when Holyrood was set up. To suggest otherwise is claptrap.

Tony Blair said it was to be AMS then

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[jambos are go!]

We did have a vote and No won.  Fair play.

 

But the margin of victory was not emphatic and, given the increased numbers voting SNP at elections since, it would be fair to say that another one will be on the agenda.

 

Regards "getting on with the day job"...as I posted earlier, it appears to me (at least) that the one banging on most about this is Ms Davidson.  Shouldn't she be getting on with her role as leader of a very small opposition?

 

FWIW, although I voted Yes in th eindy ref, I did not vote SNP at the last Holyrood elections.

Most democrats would say 55:45 is an empatic victory. Particularly with an 84% turnout.

[jambos are go!]

Tony Blair said it was to be AMS then

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

So you agree your post was claptrap?

[Thunderstruck]

 

Aye right enough, it was the Scottish Parliaments fault now that the SNP got 50% of the vote.

 

What a beamer.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Deliberately or naturally obtuse - it's hard to tell.

 

I hope you are not working with precision equipment if you think the SNP win 50% of the vote - that's quite a bit of "rounding".

[JamboX2]

Not a mention of Alastair Campbell and he's wee Tory pal getting a riddy off John McDonnell and the rest of the QT audience?

I've time for Corbyn. McDonnell is odious. Not much more likeable than Campbell. Two of the worst people in the party.

[Space Mackerel]

I've time for Corbyn. McDonnell is odious. Not much more likeable than Campbell. Two of the worst people in the party.

That was a car crash last night, I'm sure AC was brought in at the last minute to replace some other Labour person? Did former Bullingdon Boy Dimbelby not say that at the start?

 

Looks like a BBC stitch up on Corbyn and McDonell with the losers being AC and that Tory bint.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Space Mackerel]

Mooth Davidson all over the shop, again. How many times now? What an embarrassment!!

Using NHS figures from England to have a pop at the Scottish Government. Utterly clueless! [emoji23]

 

Wee Ginger Dug again.

 

It's a tough life being the hero of Scottish Unionism, a position more hyped than an X-Factor contestant's new single and generally equally short-lived. The current incumbent is Ruth Davidson who receives plaudits in the press that you more generally associate with the discoverer of a cure for cancer, the guy who single handedly brings peace to Syria, and the woman who solved the world hunger crisis, all rolled into one. Ruth might not walk on water, but she certainly goes for a walk on a buffalo, and that's the next best thing. Ruth took over from the last Great Shite Hope of the Union, Jim Murphy, who likewise was going to single-handedly defeat the forces of separatism and deliver Scotland into the sunny uplands of a bunting bedecked Royalist street party. That turned out well, didn't it.

 

This week the papers were full of the heavenly sound of praise for Ruthie's performance in an opinion poll. She's actually more popular than the person who cured cancer solved Syria and defeated hunger. And she's doing a better job than Nicola Sturgeon too. Which is grand. All over social media there were Unionists crowing that Ruthie was putting the boot into the SNP and she was more popular than that evil splittist Nicola. It's only a matter of time before Scotland realises it's been terribly misled all this time, and will stop with all this nonsense of imagining that it could possibly become a normal country that's capable of doing things for itself. Look, there's a photo op of Ruth with a big fish, and she's just sent a funny tweet on Twitter. That proves it.

 

The only problem with this scenario is that if you want to compare something and you want to offer an objective as opposed to a subjective opinion, you really need to compare like with like. That's one of those basic tenets of science, the kind of thing that our Unionist masters rarely bother their bullafo riding heads about. Yet the question in the opinion poll didn't do that. Respondents were asked whether they thought Ruth was doing a good job as leader of the Tories, but were also asked whether they thought Nicola was doing a good job as Furst Meenister.

 

Directly comparing like with like would have been to ask respondents whether they thought Nicola was doing a good job as leader of the SNP. Since the SNP is considerably more popular than the Tories, that might have produced a very different result. Actually Vlad the Impaler was more popular than the Scottish Tories, and he'd probably have scored very high in a Transylvanian opinion poll about how well vampires thought he was doing his job. Say what you like about that Vlad, but he once impaled an entire brigade of palace guards on sticks for going for a wee wander about the village instead of guarding his castle. Brings a whole new meaning to the term a wee daunner kebab so it does.

 

The job of Furst Meenister is a complex and demanding task requiring the juggling of many different subjects at once, all of which are equally vital to the well being of an entire country and its political future. By comparison the job of leader of the Scottish Tories involves posing for photo opportunities and snarking once a week at FMQs. The only similarity is that both jobs are held by politicians. You'd be as well asking who was doing a better job, a neurosurgeon or Vlad the Impaler, because both involve inserting implements into parts of the human anatomy. When you don't compare like with like a comparison is as meaningless as just about anything that issues from the beardy gob of the Fluffmunster, and as irrelevant as Wullie Rennie's views on anything other than the bus timetable of the number 17 to Kelty.

 

Sadly for Ruth, she did exceptionally poorly in her job this week. That's the part of her job that involves Furst Meenister's Questions, not the bit that entails posing on the backs of ungulates or shooting off witty 140 character ripostes. That NHS is pure rubbish, so it is, Ruth said accusingly at Nicola. Here's this report that says that parts of the service are facing meltdown, said Ruth with an expression that would fry a pound of mince at sixty paces. Then she sat down all smug in the expectation of the SNPbad headlines that would most assuredly follow.

 

Unfortunately, the report that Ruth was relying on wasn't about the NHS in Scotland. It was about the NHS in England. Those areas of meltdown that she is so concerned about, the service that's teetering on the verge of collapse, that's all entirely down to the mismanagement of the health service in England by her own party. Oops. Vlad the Impaler is much better at skewering.

 

As the realisation dawned, Ruth still had a face that could fry a pound of mince at sixty paces, on this time her ire was directed at whatever hapless aide had fed her the information in the first place. If you could hear the sound of distant screams in Edinburgh yesterday, that's probably what it was. You'd think that if Ruth really was doing such a great job, she'd have checked before making a very public fool of herself. Still, now we know that the NHS is in crisis and near meltdown under Tory management, because the leader of the Scottish Tories has told us so. During a session of Parliament, no less. She really should stick to the buffalos, or at least the impaling of eejit aides.

 

The Unionist establishment is desperately in need of a hero, because Unionism is such a joyless, dreary and miserabilist ideology. Ruth is merely the current holder of the crown, but it's likely that her shelf life will be as short as the previous holders. As a Tory, Ruth is incapable of appealing to a majority of Scots. Ever since the Holyrood elections she's been exposed as the apologist for the failures of her colleagues in Westminster to respect the will of the Scottish people. This week's spectacular own goal from her showed that her expertise lies in photo ops and press calls, and that's where it's going to stay. Scotland is going to continue its movement towards independence, and there's nothing Ruth can do to stop it.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JamboX2]

That was a car crash last night, I'm sure AC was brought in at the last minute to replace some other Labour person? Did former Bullingdon Boy Dimbelby not say that at the start?

 

Looks like a BBC stitch up on Corbyn and McDonell with the losers being AC and that Tory bint.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

AC was brought on as a back up to a Liberal (apparently).

 

Dimbleby is genuinely a good host of the show.

 

McConnell is an arse. He's Corbyn's weak link and shouldn't be Shadow Chancellor. He's dreadful and he's just a liability. Videos of him saying things that undermine his party, colleagues and his leader's chances of winning an election are slimmer with him at the top of cabinet. Absolute farce. His biggest mistake so early on was McDonnell to the Treasury portfolio. Massive own goal.

[JamboX2]

Mooth Davidson all over the shop, again. How many times now? What an embarrassment!!

Using NHS figures from England to have a pop at the Scottish Government. Utterly clueless! [emoji23]

 

Wee Ginger Dug again.

 

It's a tough life being the hero of Scottish Unionism, a position more hyped than an X-Factor contestant's new single and generally equally short-lived. The current incumbent is Ruth Davidson who receives plaudits in the press that you more generally associate with the discoverer of a cure for cancer, the guy who single handedly brings peace to Syria, and the woman who solved the world hunger crisis, all rolled into one. Ruth might not walk on water, but she certainly goes for a walk on a buffalo, and that's the next best thing. Ruth took over from the last Great Shite Hope of the Union, Jim Murphy, who likewise was going to single-handedly defeat the forces of separatism and deliver Scotland into the sunny uplands of a bunting bedecked Royalist street party. That turned out well, didn't it.

 

This week the papers were full of the heavenly sound of praise for Ruthie's performance in an opinion poll. She's actually more popular than the person who cured cancer solved Syria and defeated hunger. And she's doing a better job than Nicola Sturgeon too. Which is grand. All over social media there were Unionists crowing that Ruthie was putting the boot into the SNP and she was more popular than that evil splittist Nicola. It's only a matter of time before Scotland realises it's been terribly misled all this time, and will stop with all this nonsense of imagining that it could possibly become a normal country that's capable of doing things for itself. Look, there's a photo op of Ruth with a big fish, and she's just sent a funny tweet on Twitter. That proves it.

 

The only problem with this scenario is that if you want to compare something and you want to offer an objective as opposed to a subjective opinion, you really need to compare like with like. That's one of those basic tenets of science, the kind of thing that our Unionist masters rarely bother their bullafo riding heads about. Yet the question in the opinion poll didn't do that. Respondents were asked whether they thought Ruth was doing a good job as leader of the Tories, but were also asked whether they thought Nicola was doing a good job as Furst Meenister.

 

Directly comparing like with like would have been to ask respondents whether they thought Nicola was doing a good job as leader of the SNP. Since the SNP is considerably more popular than the Tories, that might have produced a very different result. Actually Vlad the Impaler was more popular than the Scottish Tories, and he'd probably have scored very high in a Transylvanian opinion poll about how well vampires thought he was doing his job. Say what you like about that Vlad, but he once impaled an entire brigade of palace guards on sticks for going for a wee wander about the village instead of guarding his castle. Brings a whole new meaning to the term a wee daunner kebab so it does.

 

The job of Furst Meenister is a complex and demanding task requiring the juggling of many different subjects at once, all of which are equally vital to the well being of an entire country and its political future. By comparison the job of leader of the Scottish Tories involves posing for photo opportunities and snarking once a week at FMQs. The only similarity is that both jobs are held by politicians. You'd be as well asking who was doing a better job, a neurosurgeon or Vlad the Impaler, because both involve inserting implements into parts of the human anatomy. When you don't compare like with like a comparison is as meaningless as just about anything that issues from the beardy gob of the Fluffmunster, and as irrelevant as Wullie Rennie's views on anything other than the bus timetable of the number 17 to Kelty.

 

Sadly for Ruth, she did exceptionally poorly in her job this week. That's the part of her job that involves Furst Meenister's Questions, not the bit that entails posing on the backs of ungulates or shooting off witty 140 character ripostes. That NHS is pure rubbish, so it is, Ruth said accusingly at Nicola. Here's this report that says that parts of the service are facing meltdown, said Ruth with an expression that would fry a pound of mince at sixty paces. Then she sat down all smug in the expectation of the SNPbad headlines that would most assuredly follow.

 

Unfortunately, the report that Ruth was relying on wasn't about the NHS in Scotland. It was about the NHS in England. Those areas of meltdown that she is so concerned about, the service that's teetering on the verge of collapse, that's all entirely down to the mismanagement of the health service in England by her own party. Oops. Vlad the Impaler is much better at skewering.

 

As the realisation dawned, Ruth still had a face that could fry a pound of mince at sixty paces, on this time her ire was directed at whatever hapless aide had fed her the information in the first place. If you could hear the sound of distant screams in Edinburgh yesterday, that's probably what it was. You'd think that if Ruth really was doing such a great job, she'd have checked before making a very public fool of herself. Still, now we know that the NHS is in crisis and near meltdown under Tory management, because the leader of the Scottish Tories has told us so. During a session of Parliament, no less. She really should stick to the buffalos, or at least the impaling of eejit aides.

 

The Unionist establishment is desperately in need of a hero, because Unionism is such a joyless, dreary and miserabilist ideology. Ruth is merely the current holder of the crown, but it's likely that her shelf life will be as short as the previous holders. As a Tory, Ruth is incapable of appealing to a majority of Scots. Ever since the Holyrood elections she's been exposed as the apologist for the failures of her colleagues in Westminster to respect the will of the Scottish people. This week's spectacular own goal from her showed that her expertise lies in photo ops and press calls, and that's where it's going to stay. Scotland is going to continue its movement towards independence, and there's nothing Ruth can do to stop it.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

If this weegingerdug is the answer to decent political reporting now I'm utterly despairing.

 

We will go nowhere with lumping all nationalists and all unionists as one group each. We need to move past that! Left-right, ideas on how our nation actually works and how we make it better. Not what the nation is.

 

That stuff is the rantings of a mad man. It's parochial crap.

[Space Mackerel]

AC was brought on as a back up to a Liberal (apparently).

 

Dimbleby is genuinely a good host of the show.

 

McConnell is an arse. He's Corbyn's weak link and shouldn't be Shadow Chancellor. He's dreadful and he's just a liability. Videos of him saying things that undermine his party, colleagues and his leader's chances of winning an election are slimmer with him at the top of cabinet. Absolute farce. His biggest mistake so early on was McDonnell to the Treasury portfolio. Massive own goal.

I'm not so sure about Dimbleby these days, he's got his past Tory links, that's pretty clear. He might be slick but his mask slips far too much now. Bringing in AC at the last minute instead of a Liberal, well, there's your answer then. A media stitch up.

 

As for AC, it's about time he slipped off with Blair, everyone knows his past games and nonsense too. He was Blairs puppet master. He knows the game inside out, but everyone can see what game he is playing.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JamboX2]

I'm not so sure about Dimbleby these days, he's got his past Tory links, that's pretty clear. He might be slick but his mask slips far too much now. Bringing in AC at the last minute instead of a Liberal, well, there's your answer then. A media stitch up.

Not really. Depends on who can appear at short notice. Wouldn't go so far as to say stich up. It's also hard to find someone to host a political show with no political past.

 

As for AC, it's about time he slipped off with Blair, everyone knows his past games and nonsense too. He was Blairs puppet master. He knows the game inside out, but everyone can see what game he is playing.

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

He helped Labour win two landslides. He's a good media operator. Corbyn could use some top media advice. Seamus Milne is another arse who's more a liability than a strength. The SNP had Kevin Pringle spinning, the Tories Steve Hilton and Lynton Crosby. You need a good spin doctor to get good press. Corbyn doesn't get his message out because he's not got good media operators in his top team. You need to use media to win. Mainstream media. Not blogs, tweets and facebook posts.

[Space Mackerel]

Not really. Depends on who can appear at short notice. Wouldn't go so far as to say stich up. It's also hard to find someone to host a political show with no political past.

 

 

He helped Labour win two landslides. He's a good media operator. Corbyn could use some top media advice. Seamus Milne is another arse who's more a liability than a strength. The SNP had Kevin Pringle spinning, the Tories Steve Hilton and Lynton Crosby. You need a good spin doctor to get good press. Corbyn doesn't get his message out because he's not got good media operators in his top team. You need to use media to win. Mainstream media. Not blogs, tweets and facebook posts.

Dimbelby and his brothers belong in that by-gone era of stiff upper lip 1950's -60's time. Sorry, my mistake, it still goes on today in the BBC, just under a different guise. McDonnell was stitched up last night, it was a set up in my eyes and New Labour were out to get him. Are you sure they couldn't have found another Liberal to take his place? AC was just happening to be in Salisbury or wherever it was at the time?

 

As for AC, I know he's clearly your Labour hero but he and Blair were also responsible for the demise of Labour 100%, nothing to do with Corbyn and his pals. They never lost the last 2 elections and have swelled the Party membership to over 600 thousand.

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JamboX2]

Worth a read: https://wakeupscotland.wordpress.com/2014/09/15/ewan-morrison-yes-why-i-joined-yes-and-why-i-changed-to-no/

[Space Mackerel]

Worth a read: https://wakeupscotland.wordpress.com/2014/09/15/ewan-morrison-yes-why-i-joined-yes-and-why-i-changed-to-no/

"I joined the Yes camp hoping for a debate"

 

First sentence...

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[tcjambo]

The simple question that no-one ever asks or answers is what is fundamentally different between Scotland and other component parts of the UK? Could some Independence lover out there please just answer that?

[Gorgiewave]

The simple question that no-one ever asks or answers is what is fundamentally different between Scotland and other component parts of the UK? Could some Independence lover out there please just answer that?

 

This is an excellent question. The only significant difference that emerges from polls is in attitudes to nuclear weapons.

 

There is a huge difference between Scotland's self-image as a well-educated, socially democratic, egalitarian place and the reality as seen in polls of attitudes to matters taken separately and, of course, the socioeconomic reality of Scotland.

[Space Mackerel]

The simple question that no-one ever asks or answers is what is fundamentally different between Scotland and other component parts of the UK? Could some Independence lover out there please just answer that?

Back to elementary [emoji106]

[Space Mackerel]

This is an excellent question. The only significant difference that emerges from polls is in attitudes to nuclear weapons.

 

There is a huge difference between Scotland's self-image as a well-educated, socially democratic, egalitarian place and the reality as seen in polls of attitudes to matters taken separately and, of course, the socioeconomic reality of Scotland.

back to elementary too [emoji106]

[tcjambo]

This is an excellent question. The only significant difference that emerges from polls is in attitudes to nuclear weapons.

 

There is a huge difference between Scotland's self-image as a well-educated, socially democratic, egalitarian place and the reality as seen in polls of attitudes to matters taken separately and, of course, the socioeconomic reality of Scotland.

Thanks. There is no point in taking a high-principled position on nuclear weapons if all that happens I they move 200miles south into Cumbria with exactly the same threat facing the Clyde with none of the benefits.

 

The same difference in social attitudes probably exists between Liverpool or Bradford and London/South East and, dare I say it, Glasgow and Edinburgh - a point I've tried to make on other threads before taking abuse.  

[Thunderstruck]

This is an excellent question. The only significant difference that emerges from polls is in attitudes to nuclear weapons.

 

There is a huge difference between Scotland's self-image as a well-educated, socially democratic, egalitarian place and the reality as seen in polls of attitudes to matters taken separately and, of course, the socioeconomic reality of Scotland.

The Boomers aren't really an issue in Scotland -

 

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/poll-suggests-scots-back-keeping-trident/?utm_source=FB&utm_medium=FacebookPage&utm_campaign=social

[Space Mackerel]

Thanks. There is no point in taking a high-principled position on nuclear weapons if all that happens I they move 200miles south into Cumbria with exactly the same threat facing the Clyde with none of the benefits.

 

The same difference in social attitudes probably exists between Liverpool or Bradford and London/South East and, dare I say it, Glasgow and Edinburgh - a point I've tried to make on other threads before taking abuse.

As a matter of interest, why doesn't the U.K. shove Trident in Liverpool docks?

[Space Mackerel]

The Boomers aren't really an issue in Scotland -

 

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/poll-suggests-scots-back-keeping-trident/?utm_source=FB&utm_medium=FacebookPage&utm_campaign=social

And a wee banner pic of "Lord" Sugar [emoji23][emoji23] at the top.

[tcjambo]

Back to elementary [emoji106]

No idea what you are getting at?

[JamboX2]

Dimbelby and his brothers belong in that by-gone era of stiff upper lip 1950's -60's time. Sorry, my mistake, it still goes on today in the BBC, just under a different guise. McDonnell was stitched up last night, it was a set up in my eyes and New Labour were out to get him. Are you sure they couldn't have found another Liberal to take his place? AC was just happening to be in Salisbury or wherever it was at the time?

 

Not the shows producer. Can't speak to that. How about you write to Points of View?

 

I don't view it as a stich up. McDonnell and Campbell are arseholes who don't like each other and both are thoroughly unlikeable. End of story.

 

As for AC, I know he's clearly your Labour hero but he and Blair were also responsible for the demise of Labour 100%, nothing to do with Corbyn and his pals. They never lost the last 2 elections and have swelled the Party membership to over 600 thousand.

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I said two posts up i think he's thoroughly unlikeable. But i see you are playing the ball not the man here on the wider topic of spin doctors. Not surprised.

 

Blair and Campbell never fought the last two so never lost them either to be fair.

 

Corbyn's grown the membership... superb. He's been behind in every poll bar 3. That's shite. Like Yes Scotland and Labour in 2015, the party isn't reaching out beyond it's core support. To win an election you need to appeal broadly. Corbyn is not doing that. He needs a good spin doctor to sell his vision because John McDonnell and Seamus Milne are crap at it.

[Gorgiewave]

The Boomers aren't really an issue in Scotland -

 

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/poll-suggests-scots-back-keeping-trident/?utm_source=FB&utm_medium=FacebookPage&utm_campaign=social

 

A good fact. I like Putin and co. being put off by more than skinny, pale, undernourished Scotsmen thinking they're hard men.

[Space Mackerel]

No idea what you are getting at?

Back to start of thread then?

[Space Mackerel]

Not the shows producer. Can't speak to that. How about you write to Points of View?

 

I don't view it as a stich up. McDonnell and Campbell are arseholes who don't like each other and both are thoroughly unlikeable. End of story.

 

 

So it was a coincidence that Campbell ended up on that episode the other night?

 

Button up the back springs to mind.

[tcjambo]

Back to start of thread then?

Nothing to enlighten me there I'm afraid

[JamboX2]

So it was a coincidence that Campbell ended up on that episode the other night?

 

Button up the back springs to mind.

I'm not prepared to go into some paranoid fantasy land like you. These shows always have back ups on stand by. Campbell is freelance politically.

 

Labour were represented by McDonnell. Campbell was just there.

 

Why him? I don't know. I'm not a BBC QT producer.

 

What I will say is John McDonnell can make enemies in an empty room and is a thoroughly unlikeable man. He has been at the core of Corbyn's failings not his successes. Equally, Alastair Campbell is a thoroughly unlikeable person.

 

As far as I'm concerned two egos had a go at each other.

 

Put Angus Robertson and Tommy Shepherd or Gove and Osborne up on stage together snd they'll tear lunps out of each other.

[tcjambo]

People in Scotland need to think of independence as partition of the British Isles because effectively that it is what it would be . Only three islands in the whole world that I am aware of have separate sovereign governments - Papua & New Guinea , Dominican Republic & Haiti and NI and Eire and none of these are  disadvantaged geographically as badly as Scotland would be with independence and a hostile southern neighbour. 

[JamboX2]

https://wakeupscotland.wordpress.com/2014/09/15/ewan-morrison-yes-why-i-joined-yes-and-why-i-changed-to-no/

[Space Mackerel]

I'm not prepared to go into some paranoid fantasy land like you. These shows always have back ups on stand by. Campbell is freelance politically.

 

Labour were represented by McDonnell. Campbell was just there.

 

Why him? I don't know. I'm not a BBC QT producer.

 

What I will say is John McDonnell can make enemies in an empty room and is a thoroughly unlikeable man. He has been at the core of Corbyn's failings not his successes. Equally, Alastair Campbell is a thoroughly unlikeable person.

 

As far as I'm concerned two egos had a go at each other.

 

Put Angus Robertson and Tommy Shepherd or Gove and Osborne up on stage together snd they'll tear lunps out of each other.

He was certainly "freelance political" on QT the other night.

 

Give it up please.

[Space Mackerel]

People in Scotland need to think of independence as partition of the British Isles because effectively that it is what it would be . Only three islands in the whole world that I am aware of have separate sovereign governments - Papua & New Guinea , Dominican Republic & Haiti and NI and Eire and none of these are disadvantaged geographically as badly as Scotland would be with independence and a hostile southern neighbour.

Do you live in Scotland?

[tcjambo]

Do you live in Scotland?

Yes - are you on the same planet as the rest of us?

[Space Mackerel]

Yes - are you on the same planet as the rest of us?

Yes, I'm thinking if I'm worse off than papa New Guinea now

[tcjambo]

Yes, I'm thinking if I'm worse off than papa New Guinea now

You may well be with independence my friend

[Space Mackerel]

Faroe Islands too to keep it geographically [emoji106]

[Space Mackerel]

You may well be with independence my friend

Worse off? Explain?