Brexit?

[i8hibsh]

But does she think people might not have noticed that she is a woman?

 

Actually, i'm not too sure.

[AlphonseCapone]

Gender gap where? I have never seen it in my working life. Even as I look around my office now I do not see it. There have only been 5 (not including acting) First Minister?s in Scotland and 1 has been female. 2 out of the past 6 UK PMs have been female.

 

Men tend to make better leaders, I know this will sit uncomfortably with some (the name callers) but it is kinda fact. Like it or not women in general do not command the respect that men do in high up positions, even from women who tend to hate each other by nature. Men also do not have children, for this blame no-one but nature.

 

I see a lot of affirmative action out there and it is horrendous. To employ someone because they are a certain sect, race, gender etc is as wrong as to not employ someone for it. I look around the world and it is becoming almost fashionable to have a female as leader now. I hope all for reasons that they are the best suited but I fear not.

 

What female do you think should have been Scotland?s first Minister before Wee Nip? Who has been unfairly overlooked because of her sex? Please tell me.

The country is much bigger than I8's office though isn't it? The gender gap is well documented and evidenced, you seriously can't be disputing it based on your office.

 

As for the men are more respected, that simply proves my point, why are they more respected? You telling me there is a biological reason men are better leaders or is it opportunity?

 

2 of the last 6 PM's is a Daily Mail type stat, chosen because it looks good for your point. The fact is there have been 2, period.

 

We've covered the affirmative action shit already and you know I don't agree with it. Stop bringing unrelated shit into the conversation to defleft from the points.

 

Your last question is also simplistic, the point is why aren't there more when the population split is 50/50?

[AlphonseCapone]

But does she think people might not have noticed that she is a woman?

 

I don't remember Thatcher or Merkel banging on about being the first female.

Merkel while standing on stage the other day with the female Norwegian leader made quite a few comments about the gender gap. Maybe your attention is selective.

[i8hibsh]

The country is much bigger than I8's office though isn't it? The gender gap is well documented and evidenced, you seriously can't be disputing it based on your office.

 

As for the men are more respected, that simply proves my point, why are they more respected? You telling me there is a biological reason men are better leaders or is it opportunity?

 

2 of the last 6 PM's is a Daily Mail type stat, chosen because it looks good for your point. The fact is there have been 2, period.

 

We've covered the affirmative action shit already and you know I don't agree with it. Stop bringing unrelated shit into the conversation to defleft from the points.

 

Your last question is also simplistic, the point is why aren't there more when the population split is 50/50?

 

 

No the fact there has only been 2 does not deserve a period!  You simply can not bring prior generations into this.  We all know how things were back in our grandparents days.  The fact women did not get a fair deal in these days is not relevant today ok. I look around the world and I do not see gender gaps due to ability in the year 2016.  You desperation to be liked, respected and though of as a nice person is nauseating. 

 

And the only one that reads the Daily Mail here is most evidently yourself as I could not even tell you what is "Daily Mail type chat" as I have never read it.

[Francis Albert]

Merkel while standing on stage the other day with the female Norwegian leader made quite a few comments about the gender gap. Maybe your attention is selective.

I didn't suggest she shouldn't talk about the gender gap.

 

But to make in her biog the fact that she is a woman the lead item seems to me perhaps to detract from the real qualities that got her to that position and enabled her to bridge the gender gap. Thatcher and Merkel were/are formidable politicians first, females second. At least that's the way they came/come across to me.

[Nookie Bear]

Simplistically speaking, women are more likely to miss 6-12 months of their careers in their 20s and 30s which is probably when most careers start to flourish.

 

If a woman has 2 kids then it could be 3 years of stagnating (in career terms) in between having the first baby, maternity, a few months to settle back in and then off again on maternity.

 

After that, the woman is much more likely to be the one who either has to go part time to accommodate nurery and school pick ups and, although this is accepted in the modern work place, it does not lend itself to career progression, whereas a man is more likely to be able to work late and travel and generally look good to their employer.

 

So it's not surprising that men generally earn more, on average.

[coconut doug]

I have said this before, but rather than sending letters to Trump on US-Scottish relations or jet off on non-official meetings with the junior ministers of Germany and Belgium on Brexit, she should get on with governing.

 

If she was to use and harness devolution to make Scotland better and practiced what she was preaching about an inclusive, socially just and open society then she might in 5 years time win an independence vote and be able to be a social justice campaigning PM.

 

As it stands, she's shouting in a hurricane. Even if we were independent right now the likes of Hollande, Merkel, Putin and Trump would hardly be interested in her views as none of their politics align with hers (albeit I think the SNP since 2014 have increasingly lost direction and seem more like what they opposed than what they were).

 

Whilst I didn't vote for Brexit, there's a huge opportunity for more powers for her government with it. She should be pushing more here than maintaining her current path.

Surely the pinnacle of delusion for Labour loyalists is to advise the SNP on how to be successful at the polls. I don't think the SNP will be asking for John McTernan's help.

 

 

Labour are the ultimate example of what not to do in almost every situation.  Perhaps if they had just one coherent policy with widespread support in their own party they could claim some credibility but they can't even support their leader who was misrepresented "dancing at the cenotaph". Those responsible for that story should be sacked but they would most likely find employment misrepresenting reality, and causing division in the Labour Party where their former Scottish editor is doing exactly that.

 

I'm not sure why the SNP are not "inclusive, socially just and open society". Perhaps the ex DM man now labour's press chief could explain. I'm sure the SNP have a lot to learn on these matters from DM hacks.

 

It is as always illuminating to know that  "Hollande, Merkel, Putin and Trump would hardly be interested in her views" because they "do not align". I'm sure Nicola will bear this in mind and amend her thoughts accordingly.

 

Shouting in a hurricane, that's Kez isn't it?

 

Nicola shouldn't be writing to Trump and communicating with EU leaders. Much better to leave that to the big boys with the diplomatic skills like Johnson and Fox and Farage. Was it Varoufakis who called them intellectually limited?

 

SNP bad.

[Francis Albert]

They didn't put council tax up then, I must've dreamt that.

Could always go and crush, I mean sit in tanks or clean carpets.

Fair enough. I was thinking of the unused right to vary income tax, but you are correct on council tax.

 

I still think the fact that the SNP has to be a broad coalition if it is to achieve its primary aim means it and hence the Scottish Parliament is somewhat neutered on other issues.

[coconut doug]

Fair enough. I was thinking of the unused right to vary income tax, but you are correct on council tax.

 

I still think the fact that the SNP has to be a broad coalition if it is to achieve its primary aim means it and hence the Scottish Parliament is somewhat neutered on other issues.

Higher earners pay more income tax in Scotland too.

[AlphonseCapone]

No the fact there has only been 2 does not deserve a period! You simply can not bring prior generations into this. We all know how things were back in our grandparents days. The fact women did not get a fair deal in these days is not relevant today ok. I look around the world and I do not see gender gaps due to ability in the year 2016. You desperation to be liked, respected and though of as a nice person is nauseating.

 

And the only one that reads the Daily Mail here is most evidently yourself as I could not even tell you what is "Daily Mail type chat" as I have never read it.

You got anything to dispute the evidence and studies, or just more of your hyperbole?

[i8hibsh]

You got anything to dispute the evidence and studies, or just more of your hyperbole?

 

 

You want to explain how you know what is considered "Daily Mail type chat" if you do not read it.

 

A. You just go Baaaa Baaaaaa and say "Big bad Daily Mail" as it is fashionable to do so.

[AlphonseCapone]

I didn't suggest she shouldn't talk about the gender gap.

 

But to make in her biog the fact that she is a woman the lead item seems to me perhaps to detract from the real qualities that got her to that position and enabled her to bridge the gender gap. Thatcher and Merkel were/are formidable politicians first, females second. At least that's the way they came/come across to me.

I don't see anything wrong with her bringing her gender into it. I'm sure we'd all agree it's a remarkable achievement for any women to reach the top of any position of power so if going on about it inspires young women then fair play.

 

Seeing Obama become the first black president was fantastic, but we all know he didn't get there because he was black, it was despite it, same story for anyone in power who isn't a white male.

[i8hibsh]

I don't see anything wrong with her bringing her gender into it. I'm sure we'd all agree it's a remarkable achievement for any women to reach the top of any position of power so if going on about it inspires young women then fair play.

 

Seeing Obama become the first black president was fantastic, but we all know he didn't get there because he was black, it was despite it, same story for anyone in power who isn't a white male.

 

I don't think I have ever read a more condescending post in my life.  Especially that highlighted.

[AlphonseCapone]

You want to explain how you know what is considered "Daily Mail type chat" if you do not read it.

 

A. You just go Baaaa Baaaaaa and say "Big bad Daily Mail" as it is fashionable to do so.

Hyperbole.

 

You're utterly incapable of seeing anything beyond the narrow confines of your own head.

 

I've read the Daily Mail plenty times btw, I read across all the papers, it's how I can establish the truth from the half-truths they print. The difference is I don't read them and take it as gospel. You lap up anything you agree with and dismiss anything you don't.

[Cade]

Scottish Govt only ever had the power to raise the basic rate of income tax.

 

That would hurt the poorest the most so it was never used.

 

New powers coming through soon will allow the Scottish Govt to vary the bands and, crucially, the thresholds of income tax.

[AlphonseCapone]

I don't think I have ever read a more condescending post in my life. Especially that highlighted.

Still no substance from you.

[i8hibsh]

Still no substance from you.

 

 

Do you tap a woman on the head and say well done after a promotion - bet you do.

[i8hibsh]

Hyperbole.

 

You're utterly incapable of seeing anything beyond the narrow confines of your own head.

 

I've read the Daily Mail plenty times btw, I read across all the papers, it's how I can establish the truth from the half-truths they print. The difference is I don't read them and take it as gospel. You lap up anything you agree with and dismiss anything you don't.

 

 

So I am like pretty much everyone else then?  We are the absolute antithesis of one another with regards to our views but we, like everyone else does the highlighted so don't start.

 

I just don't start calling people racist and sexist as they have different views and throwing in the old Daily Mail or Hitler nonsense for good measure. 

[Boris]

Scottish Govt only ever had the power to raise the basic rate of income tax.

 

That would hurt the poorest the most so it was never used.

 

New powers coming through soon will allow the Scottish Govt to vary the bands and, crucially, the thresholds of income tax.

 

This.

 

The initial tax raising powers of Holyrood were a pig in a poke.  Set up so no one would use them.  

[AlphonseCapone]

Do you tap a woman on the head and say well done after a promotion - bet you do.

Stil no substance. Keep going though, if a monkey could eventually type out Shakespeare given enough time, I'm sure you'll stumble across a decent point too.

[i8hibsh]

Stil no substance. Keep going though, if a monkey could eventually type out Shakespeare given enough time, I'm sure you'll stumble across a decent point too.

 

 

AC you are simply not intelligent enough to keep condescending people. 

[JamboX2]

The SNP government does not even make much use of the powers it has, because the SNP is a one issue coalition, which has to avoid upsetting the left, right and centre because voters across the political spectrum contribute to support for independence. So the SNP does easy things that won't offend anyone (tuition fees, care for elderly) especially when they don't cost voters anything. The SNP for example cannot use its existing tax raising powers to help deliver social justice because it would lose votes for independence.

 

So Nicola keeps herself busy and in the headlines by making meaningless gestures on matters on which the Scottish Government has no say.

Indeed. Like her predecessor. However, boldness is what she needs to win. Not talk.

[AlphonseCapone]

So I am like pretty much everyone else then? We are the absolute antithesis of one another with regards to our views but we, like everyone else does the highlighted so don't start.

 

I just don't start calling people racist and sexist as they have different views and throwing in the old Daily Mail or Hitler nonsense for good measure.

Again, you're wrong. Other folk do actually change their minds and are willing to listen to other viewpoints.

 

Love how you edited to throw in some more hyperbole. Beyond parody.

[AlphonseCapone]

AC you are simply not intelligent enough to keep condescending people.

Keep trying.

[i8hibsh]

Again, you're wrong. Other folk do actually change their minds and are willing to listen to other viewpoints.

 

Love how you edited to throw in some more hyperbole. Beyond parody.

 

 

So you listen to the viewpoint of a Trump voter and a leave voter (Brexit) yeah?  You are so fake the smell of bullshit is coming through my monitor.

 

And yes more hyperbole.

[AlphonseCapone]

So you listen to the viewpoint of a Trump voter and a leave voter (Brexit) yeah? You are so fake the smell of bullshit is coming through my monitor.

 

And yes more hyperbole.

Exactly. I fully understand why many folk voted to leave, I just disagreed overall and thought remaining was for the best. No big deal really, leave won, it is what it is, the world goes on.

 

Whereas to you, I'm fake because you disagree.

[Francis Albert]

Higher earners pay more income tax in Scotland too.

I may be missing something but someone forgot to tell the HMRC if their website an anything to go by.

[Francis Albert]

Scottish Govt only ever had the power to raise the basic rate of income tax.

 

That would hurt the poorest the most so it was never used.

 

New powers coming through soon will allow the Scottish Govt to vary the bands and, crucially, the thresholds of income tax.

Fair point.

[coconut doug]

I may be missing something but someone forgot to tell the HMRC if their website an anything to go by.

Cade is correct but the decision to deviate from the UK threshold was take some time ago and will be implemented at the earliest opportunity (2017/18).

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-35864248

 

This is, of course more redistributive than the 1p on the rate proposed by Labour.

[Space Mackerel]

Gender gap where?  I have never seen it in my working life.  Even as I look around my office now I do not see it.  There have only been 5 (not including acting) First Minister?s in Scotland and 1 has been female. 2 out of the past 6 UK PMs have been female.

 

Men tend to make better leaders, I know this will sit uncomfortably with some (the name callers) but it is kinda fact.  Like it or not women in general do not command the respect that men do in high up positions, even from women who tend to hate each other by nature.  Men also do not have children, for this blame no-one but nature. 

 

I see a lot of affirmative action out there and it is horrendous.  To employ someone because they are a certain sect, race, gender etc is as wrong as to not employ someone for it.  I look around the world and it is becoming almost fashionable to have a female as leader now.  I hope all for reasons that they are the best suited but I fear not.

 

What female do you think should have been Scotland?s first Minister before Wee Nip?  Who has been unfairly overlooked because of her sex? Please tell me.

 

Disnae like Scotland, disnae wimmen. :-/

[deesidejambo]

Fair point.

When does that start? Could be a watershed moment.

[i8hibsh]

Disnae like Scotland, disnae wimmen. :-/

 

 

Oh ffs how do I not like women? For the love of ****. You do know it is people like you, yes you that is causing this huge switch to the right in the Western World yeah? Well done.

[Francis Albert]

When does that start? Could be a watershed moment.

april next year. But reading the link it is based on george osborne's plans to raise thresholds and scotland not follwing that.

i guess os

borne's plans may be in some doubt now. But yes it will be interrsting to see the reaction if some scots are paying more income tax than thjeir equovalents o the resy of the uk. It won't just ne the super rich either. Forgive the typos - onmy phone

[AlphonseCapone]

april next year. But reading the link it is based on george osborne's plans to raise thresholds and scotland not follwing that.

i guess os

borne's plans may be in some doubt now. But yes it will be interrsting to see the reaction if some scots are paying more income tax than thjeir equovalents o the resy of the uk. It won't just ne the super rich either. Forgive the typos - onmy phone

We should pay more tax.

 

People want their cake (great services) and to eat it (lower taxes). You simply can't do it without sky rocketing debts.

[deesidejambo]

We should pay more tax.

 

People want their cake (great services) and to eat it (lower taxes). You simply can't do it without sky rocketing debts.

How would you do it? Increase the higher rate band or change the levels or a combination?

[i8hibsh]

We should pay more tax.

 

People want their cake (great services) and to eat it (lower taxes). You simply can't do it without sky rocketing debts.

 

 

No we should not.  Most people pay enough.

 

In my opinion and if I lived at number 11 what should be done to get back in the black is (not that it will ever be possible):

 

• Stop all loopholes for avoidance
• Ensure big business pays what it should
• No illegal immigrants consuming but not contributing 
• Cut ALL benefits for the workshy
• Cut ALL benefits for those that continue to have children they can't afford
• Control the influx of immigration so it does not exceed the outflow
• Cut foreign aid.  I believe a great deal in foreign aid but when you really see what goes out and to who it is quite ridiculous
• Encourage and support more private schools and healthcare
• More jails and far more severe sentencing for scumbags (they cost more out than in if you break it down)
• Tax all religions at normal income tax rate (every penny 'in' is at the end of day income)
• Significantly cull the amount of organisations, Churches, school etc getting 'Charitable status'
• Bring back the windfall tax for 'large windfalls'  - say 30 % on 1 million or above (note this will not include inheritance)
• Increased taxation for Banks income (we make **** all off our own money whilst they make billions)
• Tax cold callers on the amount of calls they make (this purely for selfish reasons)

All the above would just be to wet my whistle  - I would change much more.

[AlphonseCapone]

How would you do it? Increase the higher rate band or change the levels or a combination?

A combination. Make anyone earning below the median exempt. Then have an incremental increase for every standard deviation above the median you are.

[Space Mackerel]

Oh ffs how do I not like women? For the love of ****. You do know it is people like you, yes you that is causing this huge switch to the right in the Western World yeah? Well done.

Disnae like Syrians, disnae like democratic peaceful protest.

[AlphonseCapone]

No we should not. Most people pay enough.

 

In my opinion and if I lived at number 11 what should be done to get back in the black is (not that it will ever be possible):

 

• Stop all loopholes for avoidance
• Ensure big business pays what it should
• No illegal immigrants consuming but not contributing
• Cut ALL benefits for the workshy
• Cut ALL benefits for those that continue to have children they can't afford
• Control the influx of immigration so it does not exceed the outflow
• Cut foreign aid. I believe a great deal in foreign aid but when you really see what goes out and to who it is quite ridiculous
• Encourage and support more private schools and healthcare
• More jails and far more severe sentencing for scumbags (they cost more out than in if you break it down)
• Tax all religions at normal income tax rate (every penny 'in' is at the end of day income)
• Significantly cull the amount of organisations, Churches, school etc getting 'Charitable status'
• Bring back the windfall tax for 'large windfalls' - say 30 % on 1 million or above (note this will not include inheritance)
• Increased taxation for Banks income (we make **** all off our own money whilst they make billions)
• Tax cold callers on the amount of calls they make (this purely for selfish reasons)

All the above would just be to wet my whistle - I would change much more.

1 and 2, agree completely.

 

3, illegal immigrants can't consume anything, they can't claim benefits if they aren't meant to be here.

 

4, agree in principle but you'd need a robust system to adequately categorise people. Based on how bad it is currently, it'd likely turn into an excuse to punish everyone.

 

5, agree. You should receive support for a first child from the state, the rest you should provide yourself.

 

6, much more complicated than that. What if the outflux is 2,000 electrictians because we've too many but we are short 10,000 doctors?

 

7, cut I don't necessarily agree. Better handle on where it goes or use it to directly do things in these countries rather than actually hand over the cash, definitely.

 

8, state shouldn't pay a penny to private healthcare or schools. Folk can set up their own if they wish.

 

8 and 9, religion should absolutely not get any tax breaks.

 

10 and 11, would support some form of this.

 

12, I'd rather we outlawed them tbh.

[Cade]

No we should not.  Most people pay enough.

 

In my opinion and if I lived at number 11 what should be done to get back in the black is (not that it will ever be possible):

 

• Stop all loopholes for avoidance
• Ensure big business pays what it should
• No illegal immigrants consuming but not contributing 
• Cut ALL benefits for the workshy
• Cut ALL benefits for those that continue to have children they can't afford
• Control the influx of immigration so it does not exceed the outflow
• Cut foreign aid.  I believe a great deal in foreign aid but when you really see what goes out and to who it is quite ridiculous
• Encourage and support more private schools and healthcare
• More jails and far more severe sentencing for scumbags (they cost more out than in if you break it down)
• Tax all religions at normal income tax rate (every penny 'in' is at the end of day income)
• Significantly cull the amount of organisations, Churches, school etc getting 'Charitable status'
• Bring back the windfall tax for 'large windfalls'  - say 30 % on 1 million or above (note this will not include inheritance)
• Increased taxation for Banks income (we make **** all off our own money whilst they make billions)
• Tax cold callers on the amount of calls they make (this purely for selfish reasons)

All the above would just be to wet my whistle  - I would change much more.

What a lovely picture of a Fascist dictatorship you paint, ya bam

[Francis Albert]

We should pay more tax.

 

People want their cake (great services) and to eat it (lower taxes). You simply can't do it without sky rocketing debts.

If you mean by "we" those who can afford it, I agree. I for one should pay more tax.

 

What I am not sure about is how popular it will be. It would certainly be a test for the theory (which FWIW I think is bollocks) that Scots as opposed to say the English are warm cuddly tolerant and egalitarian people who are happy see their income further syphoned off for benefits to people with fake disabilities ... and so on - I won't repeat the list I8hibsh has provided.

 

I8hibsh obviously goes OTT but it is a fact that everyone knows people who play the system and steal your tax money and my tax money but to point that out is to be a "daily Mail reader" and to try to do anything about it brings out an army of bleeding hearts.,

 

Under the SNP plans nearly 400,000 working people (and their families) would pay more income tax compared to the Osborne plans. That would have included a lot of voters which the SNP has to switch from No to Yes.

 

The SNP proposals are also a major retreat from squeezing the really rich, for whom they not long ago proposed a 50% top rate (still modest compared to both Labour and Conservative tax rates in previous times).

[i8hibsh]

What a lovely picture of a Fascist dictatorship you paint, ya bam

Hmmm not too sure you understand what that word means there fella.

[i8hibsh]

Oh I get it, I mentioned the 'I' word.

[Space Mackerel]

No we should not.  Most people pay enough.

 

In my opinion and if I lived at number 11 what should be done to get back in the black is (not that it will ever be possible):

 

 

• Stop all loopholes for avoidance
• Ensure big business pays what it should
• No illegal immigrants consuming but not contributing 
• Cut ALL benefits for the workshy
• Cut ALL benefits for those that continue to have children they can't afford
• Control the influx of immigration so it does not exceed the outflow
• Cut foreign aid.  I believe a great deal in foreign aid but when you really see what goes out and to who it is quite ridiculous
• Encourage and support more private schools and healthcare
• More jails and far more severe sentencing for scumbags (they cost more out than in if you break it down)
• Tax all religions at normal income tax rate (every penny 'in' is at the end of day income)
• Significantly cull the amount of organisations, Churches, school etc getting 'Charitable status'
• Bring back the windfall tax for 'large windfalls'  - say 30 % on 1 million or above (note this will not include inheritance)
• Increased taxation for Banks income (we make **** all off our own money whilst they make billions)
• Tax cold callers on the amount of calls they make (this purely for selfish reasons)

All the above would just be to wet my whistle  - I would change much more.

 

You should change your name on here to Theresa Trump!

[Francis Albert]

1 and 2, agree completely.

 

3, illegal immigrants can't consume anything, they can't claim benefits if they aren't meant to be here.

 

4, agree in principle but you'd need a robust system to adequately categorise people. Based on how bad it is currently, it'd likely turn into an excuse to punish everyone.

 

5, agree. You should receive support for a first child from the state, the rest you should provide yourself.

 

6, much more complicated than that. What if the outflux is 2,000 electrictians because we've too many but we are short 10,000 doctors?

 

7, cut I don't necessarily agree. Better handle on where it goes or use it to directly do things in these countries rather than actually hand over the cash, definitely.

 

8, state shouldn't pay a penny to private healthcare or schools. Folk can set up their own if they wish.

 

8 and 9, religion should absolutely not get any tax breaks.

 

10 and 11, would support some form of this.

 

12, I'd rather we outlawed them tbh.

A reasoned response rather than a knee jerk and ignorant "FASCIST!" response. I agree with most of it.

[i8hibsh]

A reasoned response rather than a knee jerk and ignorant "FASCIST!" response. I agree with most of it.

Yup fair play to AC.

[AlphonseCapone]

If you mean by "we" those who can afford it, I agree. I for one should pay more tax.

 

What I am not sure about is how popular it will be. It would certainly be a test for the theory (which FWIW I think is bollocks) that Scots as opposed to say the English are warm cuddly tolerant and egalitarian people who are happy see their income further syphoned off for benefits to people with fake disabilities ... and so on - I won't repeat the list I8hibsh has provided.

 

I8hibsh obviously goes OTT but it is a fact that everyone knows people who play the system and steal your tax money and my tax money but to point that out is to be a "daily Mail reader" and to try to do anything about it brings out an army of bleeding hearts.,

 

Under the SNP plans nearly 400,000 working people (and their families) would pay more income tax compared to the Osborne plans. That would have included a lot of voters which the SNP has to switch from No to Yes.

 

The SNP proposals are also a major retreat from squeezing the really rich, for whom they not long ago proposed a 50% top rate (still modest compared to both Labour and Conservative tax rates in previous times).

I do mean, 'we' as in people who can afford it. As I said in reply to someone above, anyone below the median salary should be exempt but the rest of us who can afford it should.

 

The system is currently broken, from anyone at the bottom abusing benefits to those at the top abusing tax loopholes. It all needs fixed.

[Francis Albert]

I do mean, 'we' as in people who can afford it. As I said in reply to someone above, anyone below the median salary should be exempt but the rest of us who can afford it should.

 

The system is currently broken, from anyone at the bottom abusing benefits to those at the top abusing tax loopholes. It all needs fixed.

Sorry to nitpick but why "anyone at the bottom" and "those at the top"? Do you think there are not many at the bottom and many in the middle and even some at the top who abuse benefits?

[AlphonseCapone]

Sorry to nitpick but why "anyone at the bottom" and "those at the top"? Do you think there are not many at the bottom and many in the middle and even some at the top who abuse benefits?

There wasn't any intention behind my language, I probably used any one because benefit fraud we think of individuals but tax avoiders we think companies.

[Francis Albert]

There wasn't any intention behind my language, I probably used any one because benefit fraud we think of individuals but tax avoiders we think companies.

Fair enough.

 

AS an aside, the benefit fraudsters I personally know are not at the bottom - they are in the respectable middle or even upper classes, the latter highly skilled at hiding their wealth from the tax man while sponging off the state (ie us). The media mostly ignores that sort for some reason.