Pyramid Leagues Superthread

[Footballfirst]

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

[Sooks]

24 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

Would be nice if the SPFL took as firm a stance

[John Findlay]

38 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

Tough shit on Sevco.

[Jambo in Bathgate]

57 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

Must have been earner for Rangers. 

[WheatfieldWarrior]

1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

 

I think it shows a lack of understanding by Rangers of how amateur football works. 20 odd guys who do not make their money from football can't simply turn up on a different date - they have work commitments, childcare and all those life things to deal with.

 

Strange that Rangers weren't willing to make things work with the players that they have though.

[The Treasurer]

They will have known about this tournament for months, funny how they never mentioned it when negotiations were taking place about them entering a team in the LL

[SMJ_1874]

Does anyone know if we will be playing our home games at Tynecastle or up at the Orium? I’d love to take in a few of these games especially with all the Sunday fixtures we’ll have 

[Footballfirst]

7 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

Does anyone know if we will be playing our home games at Tynecastle or up at the Orium? I’d love to take in a few of these games especially with all the Sunday fixtures we’ll have 

At Whitehill Welfare's Ferguson Park in Rosewell

[RustyRightPeg]

21 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

Does anyone know if we will be playing our home games at Tynecastle or up at the Orium? I’d love to take in a few of these games especially with all the Sunday fixtures we’ll have 

Whitehill. They have recently taken on the guy who looks after the Newtongrange (& a few others) pitch so it will be well maintained in in great condition all year. 

[Mikey1874]

This one of things supposedly being tightened up for next season. 

 

Not postponing games. 

[Sooks]

1 minute ago, Mikey1874 said:

This one of things supposedly being tightened up for next season. 

 

Not postponing games. 

Yes it was in the article that had the conditions laid out ………. would be nice if the governing bodies of the professional game would do like wise 

[SMJ_1874]

1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

At Whitehill Welfare's Ferguson Park in Rosewell

 

1 hour ago, RustyRightPeg said:

Whitehill. They have recently taken on the guy who looks after the Newtongrange (& a few others) pitch so it will be well maintained in in great condition all year. 

Thanks guys, appreciated. I’ll be taking a trip out to watch a few of these games and hope we get good crowds behind our B team. Be interesting to see what crowds we get when playing the ugly sisters. 

[Yoda]

14 minutes ago, SMJ_1874 said:

 

Thanks guys, appreciated. I’ll be taking a trip out to watch a few of these games and hope we get good crowds behind our B team. Be interesting to see what crowds we get when playing the ugly sisters. 

It will be the only time some local Midlothian glory hunters, get to see their teams.  They'll no doubt turn up in their 7-day-a-week football tops and leave when their team is getting beat by us.

[Hmfc1965]

3 minutes ago, Yoda said:

It will be the only time some local Midlothian glory hunters, get to see their teams.  They'll no doubt turn up in their 7-day-a-week football tops and leave when their team is getting beat by us.

Last year's Lowland League crowds looked clearly bigger when the Colts teams were playing but only by a couple of hundred or so.

[Footballfirst]

The Scottish Junior FA attempting to be relevant again.

 

Successful Scottish Junior Football Association AGM today.

Biggest thing to go through was the opening of the Scottish Junior Cup to any team tier 5 and below who wish to enter.

It’s about small steps and I don’t expect a major influx from teams straight away but my plan includes an up to £80,000 prize pot with payouts to last 16 possibly 32.

There is no denying that the association has struggled to move forward but hopefully this is the first step moving on.

We’ve said it continuously that we are more than willing to work with other associations at our level if they are.

Another that was in my report to our members is the proposal put forward to the pyramid working group of the SFA, we have proposed a new set up at tier 5 sitting alongside the highland league and lowland league.

We feel the timing is right for such a move and again would be happy working with the others roundabout us.

We aim to fill a 16 team league with licensed clubs from the midlands league, the West of Scotland Football League and the East of Scotland league.

At the top end of it all depends on SPFL clubs changing there format, at the bottom end if the three leagues are in the winners if licensed automatically go up and the bottom three down, the fourth bottom of central league will play in a playoff with all three leagues second placed teams if licensed for the fourth promotion/relegation place.

A proper way for promotion and relegation.

Congratulations also go to Norman McKay, Bobby McNamara, Gordon Ronney and Felix McKenna on gaining life membership of the association, your service to the Scottish Junior FA is greatly appreciated.

Felix McKenna also received an honorary Vice President certificate.

Alex McDowall

Chief Operating Officer

Scottish Junior FA

[Yoda]

55 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Last year's Lowland League crowds looked clearly bigger when the Colts teams were playing but only by a couple of hundred or so.

I think most LL teams will be pleasantly surprised by the Hearts fans that turn up to these games, especially when our first team are playing on the Sunday. 

 

There are loads of Hearts fans within 3-4 miles (Penicuik, Loanhead, Bonnyrigg, Dalkeith, Gorebridge) of Rosewell that don't go to away games and would possibly go along to the B games.

 

Can see Hearts B being the best supported Team in the LL next season.

[Hmfc1965]

1 minute ago, Yoda said:

I think most LL teams will be pleasantly surprised by the Hearts fans that turn up to these games, especially when our first team are playing on the Sunday. 

 

There are loads of Hearts fans within 3-4 miles (Penicuik, Loanhead, Bonnyrigg, Dalkeith, Gorebridge) of Rosewell that don't go to away games and would possibly go along to the B games.

 

Can see Hearts B being the best supported Team in the LL next season.

Here's hoping  

[DETTY29]

53 minutes ago, Yoda said:

I think most LL teams will be pleasantly surprised by the Hearts fans that turn up to these games, especially when our first team are playing on the Sunday. 

 

There are loads of Hearts fans within 3-4 miles (Penicuik, Loanhead, Bonnyrigg, Dalkeith, Gorebridge) of Rosewell that don't go to away games and would possibly go along to the B games.

 

Can see Hearts B being the best supported Team in the LL next season.

Edinburgh University less than 5 minute walk for me.

 

Obviously that benefits them not Hearts being most supported club.

Edited June 18, 2022 by DETTY29

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

The Scottish Junior FA attempting to be relevant again.

 

Successful Scottish Junior Football Association AGM today.

Biggest thing to go through was the opening of the Scottish Junior Cup to any team tier 5 and below who wish to enter.

It’s about small steps and I don’t expect a major influx from teams straight away but my plan includes an up to £80,000 prize pot with payouts to last 16 possibly 32.

There is no denying that the association has struggled to move forward but hopefully this is the first step moving on.

We’ve said it continuously that we are more than willing to work with other associations at our level if they are.

Another that was in my report to our members is the proposal put forward to the pyramid working group of the SFA, we have proposed a new set up at tier 5 sitting alongside the highland league and lowland league.

We feel the timing is right for such a move and again would be happy working with the others roundabout us.

We aim to fill a 16 team league with licensed clubs from the midlands league, the West of Scotland Football League and the East of Scotland league.

At the top end of it all depends on SPFL clubs changing there format, at the bottom end if the three leagues are in the winners if licensed automatically go up and the bottom three down, the fourth bottom of central league will play in a playoff with all three leagues second placed teams if licensed for the fourth promotion/relegation place.

A proper way for promotion and relegation.

Congratulations also go to Norman McKay, Bobby McNamara, Gordon Ronney and Felix McKenna on gaining life membership of the association, your service to the Scottish Junior FA is greatly appreciated.

Felix McKenna also received an honorary Vice President certificate.

Alex McDowall

Chief Operating Officer

Scottish Junior FA

It should allow for semi finals to be played between those competing for div 2 place. That said, don't really like junior clubs so I would tell them to piss off.

[Tasavallan]

6 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

They may be B team or U19 but they are full-time professionals getting paid to play football. LL teams are amateur and need to fit work around game-time.  Guests need to heed the house rules.

 

This is just Rangers throwing its weight around as a bully.

[jamboinglasgow]

7 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Rangers are unhappy with the LL because they won't allow them to postpone their first league fixture, to enable their U19s to play in an invitational youth tournament over in Germany.  As a result Rangers has been forced to turn down the invitation.

 

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-hit-lowland-league-roadblock-27267756

 

I thought the whole point of B teams was to have their players face adult teams rather than other youth sides. I'm sure that they have enough players to play two teams simultaneously, if they felt strongly enough about it.

 

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

 

Shouldn't be too shocked that Rangers thought they could treat the Lowland League with such disrespect considering the SPFL brought in the ability for a clubs to move one game in August so they can play a lucrative friendly just to appease the Old Firm. Rangers probably expected the same treatment.

 

Hopefully Hearts show a lot more respect to the league than the Old Firm did.

[Unknown user]

On 09/06/2022 at 18:50, Footballfirst said:

I saw this on another forum:

 

"Speaking to davie innes (tranent chairman) today, they'd lined up a friendly against hearts who'd promised to field a strong line up. He put up a statement on social media stating Tranent were very much against the guest teams. Hearts pulled out of the friendly."

 

Sending a strong team to East Lothian is a favour, what did he expect if he publicly tells us to **** off?

 

7 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Let's hope the LL rubs salt in their wounds by designating Rangers as the "free team" of the 19 team league in the first round of fixtures, when they are announced next week.

 

[Yoda]

22 hours ago, DETTY29 said:

Edinburgh University less than 5 minute walk for me.

 

Obviously that benefits them not Hearts being most supported club.

I think all the Teams in the LL will benefit from Hearts fans following the B Team.  But the home games should be well supported, so long as they don't clash with home games for the big Team.

[Locky]

Quite amusing to see the reluctance from L2 chairmen to opening up the pyramid and making promotion from tier 5 easier. I'm pretty sure these chairmen will make a complete 360 turn if their club ends up down there. Just ask Brechin, Berwick, Cowdenbeath and East Stirling.

[Jarhead]

On 18/06/2022 at 21:26, Footballfirst said:

The Scottish Junior FA attempting to be relevant again.

 

Successful Scottish Junior Football Association AGM today.

Biggest thing to go through was the opening of the Scottish Junior Cup to any team tier 5 and below who wish to enter.

It’s about small steps and I don’t expect a major influx from teams straight away but my plan includes an up to £80,000 prize pot with payouts to last 16 possibly 32.

There is no denying that the association has struggled to move forward but hopefully this is the first step moving on.

We’ve said it continuously that we are more than willing to work with other associations at our level if they are.

Another that was in my report to our members is the proposal put forward to the pyramid working group of the SFA, we have proposed a new set up at tier 5 sitting alongside the highland league and lowland league.

We feel the timing is right for such a move and again would be happy working with the others roundabout us.

We aim to fill a 16 team league with licensed clubs from the midlands league, the West of Scotland Football League and the East of Scotland league.

At the top end of it all depends on SPFL clubs changing there format, at the bottom end if the three leagues are in the winners if licensed automatically go up and the bottom three down, the fourth bottom of central league will play in a playoff with all three leagues second placed teams if licensed for the fourth promotion/relegation place.

A proper way for promotion and relegation.

Congratulations also go to Norman McKay, Bobby McNamara, Gordon Ronney and Felix McKenna on gaining life membership of the association, your service to the Scottish Junior FA is greatly appreciated.

Felix McKenna also received an honorary Vice President certificate.

Alex McDowall

Chief Operating Officer

Scottish Junior FA

At the time that the first eastern juniors were moving over to the seniors, I mentioned to a juniors coach that I thought a pyramid was ultimately a good thing. He was actually only bothered about no longer being in the junior cup. 
Probably as I was so focused on Hearts that I don’t appreciate what a big deal that cup was to those involved. 
I have no issues with the junior cup expanding again but we certainly don’t need another league at tier 5 but we do need the bottleneck at that level opened up. 

[RobboM]

On 18/06/2022 at 21:26, Footballfirst said:

The Scottish Junior FA attempting to be relevant again.

 

......

There is no denying that the association has struggled to move forward .......

 

 

Another that was in my report to our members is the proposal put forward to the pyramid working group of the SFA, we have proposed a new set up at tier 5 sitting alongside the highland league and lowland league.

 

First I'd seen of this FF

SJFA admits it has struggled to move forward then sticks the car into reverse 🙂

[skinnybob72]

On 18/06/2022 at 19:18, Mikey1874 said:

This one of things supposedly being tightened up for next season. 

 

Not postponing games. 

I’m sure I saw a post on Whitehill’s FB page that said they never had a single game P-P last season after money was spent on their pitch / drainage last summer. 

[Chuck Berry]

On 20/06/2022 at 10:07, Locky said:

Quite amusing to see the reluctance from L2 chairmen to opening up the pyramid and making promotion from tier 5 easier. I'm pretty sure these chairmen will make a complete 360 turn if their club ends up down there. Just ask Brechin, Berwick, Cowdenbeath and East Stirling.

 

They'll be even more reluctant now if the tier below them are letting in B teams for a fee.

[Bob Loblaw]

When does the LL campaign begin?

[BM1874]

9 minutes ago, Bob Loblaw said:

When does the LL campaign begin?

23rd July

 

fixtures due out on Monday 27th june 

[Bob Loblaw]

2 minutes ago, BM1874 said:

23rd July

 

fixtures due out on Monday 27th june 

Cheers.

[Rockwell]

On 19/06/2022 at 00:03, Tasavallan said:

They may be B team or U19 but they are full-time professionals getting paid to play football. LL teams are amateur and need to fit work around game-time.  Guests need to heed the house rules.

 

This is just Rangers throwing its weight around as a bully.

LL teams are not amateurs most are semi professional and get payed for playing.

[XXX]

Will Hearts B be played at Tynecastle or somewhere else?

[Sooks]

What do we think our B team will be based on current eligible players

[Sooks]

7 minutes ago, The Spy Who Loved Me said:

Will Hearts B be played at Tynecastle or somewhere else?

White hill Welfares ground

[XXX]

2 minutes ago, Sooks said:

White hill Welfares ground

 
Thanks, I will have a look at the stadium layout.

[jbee647]

On 22/06/2022 at 16:41, Rockwell said:

LL teams are not amateurs most are semi professional and get payed for playing.

Not much more than expenses 

[Rockwell]

46 minutes ago, jbee647 said:

Not much more than expenses 

Rubbish most get payed not fortunes but most teams pay there players

[Ford Prentice]

On 18/06/2022 at 21:26, Footballfirst said:

The Scottish Junior FA attempting to be relevant again.

 

Successful Scottish Junior Football Association AGM today.

Biggest thing to go through was the opening of the Scottish Junior Cup to any team tier 5 and below who wish to enter.

It’s about small steps and I don’t expect a major influx from teams straight away but my plan includes an up to £80,000 prize pot with payouts to last 16 possibly 32.

There is no denying that the association has struggled to move forward but hopefully this is the first step moving on.

We’ve said it continuously that we are more than willing to work with other associations at our level if they are.

Another that was in my report to our members is the proposal put forward to the pyramid working group of the SFA, we have proposed a new set up at tier 5 sitting alongside the highland league and lowland league.

We feel the timing is right for such a move and again would be happy working with the others roundabout us.

We aim to fill a 16 team league with licensed clubs from the midlands league, the West of Scotland Football League and the East of Scotland league.

At the top end of it all depends on SPFL clubs changing there format, at the bottom end if the three leagues are in the winners if licensed automatically go up and the bottom three down, the fourth bottom of central league will play in a playoff with all three leagues second placed teams if licensed for the fourth promotion/relegation place.

A proper way for promotion and relegation.

Congratulations also go to Norman McKay, Bobby McNamara, Gordon Ronney and Felix McKenna on gaining life membership of the association, your service to the Scottish Junior FA is greatly appreciated.

Felix McKenna also received an honorary Vice President certificate.

Alex McDowall

Chief Operating Officer

Scottish Junior FA

Sorry if this is a Peebles moment. Just catching up after holiday and saw this. Does this mean our B team can enter the Junior Cup?

[Footballfirst]

4 minutes ago, Ford Prentice said:

Sorry if this is a Peebles moment. Just catching up after holiday and saw this. Does this mean our B team can enter the Junior Cup?

Technically yes assuming that we also made an application to join the SJFA. It won't happen.

[Ford Prentice]

Just now, Footballfirst said:

Technically yes assuming that we also made an application to join the SJFA. It won't happen.

Thanks FF. Shame - already had it in the Trophy Cabinet.

[Footballfirst]

Just now, Ford Prentice said:

Thanks FF. Shame - already had it in the Trophy Cabinet.

The only cup that the B Team can enter is the SPFL Trust Trophy (formerly the Challenge Cup).

[Locky]

6 hours ago, Rockwell said:

Rubbish most get payed not fortunes but most teams pay there players

Most clubs in that league will barely pay players at all. Maybe not expenses but little more tbh. The likes of East Kilbride, Cowdenbeath obviously and maybe Broomhill, as well as the B teams, will probably pay quite well, but players for the likes of Gretna, Gala, Cumbernauld and the Uni teams are probably barely on a wage.

[Footballfirst]

1 hour ago, Locky said:

Most clubs in that league will barely pay players at all. Maybe not expenses but little more tbh. The likes of East Kilbride, Cowdenbeath obviously and maybe Broomhill, as well as the B teams, will probably pay quite well, but players for the likes of Gretna, Gala, Cumbernauld and the Uni teams are probably barely on a wage.

I'd say that there is quite a big variation in payments, even within clubs.  There have been a raft of players who have joined LL clubs in recent years who could quite easily play at SPFL L1 or L2 level but have received better offers at Tier 5. 

 

I spoke to a LL player just last weekend who confirmed to me that he had two years left on a contract that he was happy with. I didn't ask him specifically how much he was getting, but it has been reported elsewhere as £180 a week. It's a nice little earner for doing something you enjoy that is in addition to your full time job.

 

I would expect that the top earners at EK, Tranent, Broomhill, Berwick, Cowdenbeath, East Stirling, Spartans and Bo'ness will be earning £200-£300 a week if not more, while others may get as little as £50 a week.  It's likely that signing on fees make up a fair proportion of a player's earnings if a club has a benefactor.

 

The B team players are all full time so will be earning a decent wage for someone in their teens, or just left school.

[Footballfirst]

Addendum to my previous post.

 

Berwick Rangers is a PLC so submits full accounts to Companies House.

 

Their wage bills for the last four years were:

2018 - £230k

2019 - £193k

2020 - £181k

2021 - £139k

 

The last two years were affected by covid, but their latest figure should be indicative of them settling down to what they can afford to pay in the LL.  The wages will cover all their staff including players, coaches, admin staff and cleaners. They have reported that they have 21/22 employees in the last two years so you can work out the average.

[Rockwell]

6 hours ago, Locky said:

Most clubs in that league will barely pay players at all. Maybe not expenses but little more tbh. The likes of East Kilbride, Cowdenbeath obviously and maybe Broomhill, as well as the B teams, will probably pay quite well, but players for the likes of Gretna, Gala, Cumbernauld and the Uni teams are probably barely on a wage.

I understand most teams in lowland league and Highland league are not paying players fortunes, but these teams aren't amateurs as someone called them earlier .most play to a good standard and not pub teams on a public park on a Sunday morning 

[Sooks]

Might not be enormous once it is divided by sixteen but an one hundred and twenty thousand from the three B teams will help with paying lowland league players I would have thought even if the full amount is not divided between the individual clubs 

[part_time_jambo]

On 20/06/2022 at 10:07, Locky said:

Quite amusing to see the reluctance from L2 chairmen to opening up the pyramid and making promotion from tier 5 easier. I'm pretty sure these chairmen will make a complete 360 turn if their club ends up down there. Just ask Brechin, Berwick, Cowdenbeath and East Stirling.

No sympathy with the lowland league in this case until they change their 1 up 1 down policy at the other end of the table.

[part_time_jambo]

17 hours ago, jbee647 said:

Not much more than expenses 

Shouldn't comment on subjects you obviously know very little about.

[Saint Jambo]

9 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

I'd say that there is quite a big variation in payments, even within clubs.  There have been a raft of players who have joined LL clubs in recent years who could quite easily play at SPFL L1 or L2 level but have received better offers at Tier 5. 

 

I spoke to a LL player just last weekend who confirmed to me that he had two years left on a contract that he was happy with. I didn't ask him specifically how much he was getting, but it has been reported elsewhere as £180 a week. It's a nice little earner for doing something you enjoy that is in addition to your full time job.

 

I would expect that the top earners at EK, Tranent, Broomhill, Berwick, Cowdenbeath, East Stirling, Spartans and Bo'ness will be earning £200-£300 a week if not more, while others may get as little as £50 a week.  It's likely that signing on fees make up a fair proportion of a player's earnings if a club has a benefactor.

 

The B team players are all full time so will be earning a decent wage for someone in their teens, or just left school.

 

How often do LL players train?

 

I would think that a club paying £50 per week was in danger of failing to pay the minimum wage, unless they were 20 or under.