Taffin Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 What are people's thoughts on the rumoured cost cap breach? Minor breach/material breach etc, potential punishment? I reckon RB are playing a bit of a game and will have overspent nearly exactly the amount it cost them to replace Max's car after the Copse incident and will argue they shouldn't be penalised from a reduction to their available spend by damage caused by 'reckless' driving from other teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Taffin said: What are people's thoughts on the rumoured cost cap breach? Minor breach/material breach etc, potential punishment? I reckon RB are playing a bit of a game and will have overspent nearly exactly the amount it cost them to replace Max's car after the Copse incident and will argue they shouldn't be penalised from a reduction to their available spend by damage caused by 'reckless' driving from other teams. If that's allowed for in the cost cap, then fine. If it's not, which it isn't, then they've broken the rules/laws. I imagine that the sanctions haven't been properly thought through but it should be severe if they want the cap to mean anything. 25 point cut for every $1million they've gone over the cap. Declared interest: I like Horner far less than I like any other team manager and Max Verstappen is my least favourite driver since I started watching the sport in the days of Gilles Villeneuve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 43 minutes ago, I P Knightley said: If that's allowed for in the cost cap, then fine. If it's not, which it isn't, then they've broken the rules/laws. I imagine that the sanctions haven't been properly thought through but it should be severe if they want the cap to mean anything. 25 point cut for every $1million they've gone over the cap. Declared interest: I like Horner far less than I like any other team manager and Max Verstappen is my least favourite driver since I started watching the sport in the days of Gilles Villeneuve. How can Max be your least favourite with guys like Latifi on the grid?!?! 😂😂 The cost cap feels totally worthless imo given what's excluded from it, particularly around salaries and travel. An interesting question about least favourite though, I'd never really thought about my favourite to least favourite before. Drivers probably something like: Vettel Verstappen Bottas Lando Leclerc Alonso Albon Tsunoda Perez Zhou Magnusson Sainz Schumacher Hamilton Ricciardo Russell Ocon Gasly Stroll Latifi Team managers; really don't care or know enough about them if pushed: Favourite - Vasseur seems pretty funny Least favourite - Lawrence Stroll Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 12 minutes ago, Taffin said: How can Max be your least favourite with guys like Latifi on the grid?!?! 😂😂 The cost cap feels totally worthless imo given what's excluded from it, particularly around salaries and travel. An interesting question about least favourite though, I'd never really thought about my favourite to least favourite before. Drivers probably something like: Vettel Verstappen Bottas Lando Leclerc Alonso Albon Tsunoda Perez Zhou Magnusson Sainz Schumacher Hamilton Ricciardo Russell Ocon Gasly Stroll Latifi Team managers; really don't care or know enough about them if pushed: Favourite - Vasseur seems pretty funny Least favourite - Lawrence Stroll If you’ve watched the F1 series on Netflix Gunther Steiner at Haas is a real character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 12 minutes ago, Tazio said: If you’ve watched the F1 series on Netflix Gunther Steiner at Haas is a real character. I totally forgot about Gunther!!! "Okay Gene" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 Be less painful to lose last year's Championship after being brilliant this year. If indeed Red Bull have messed up or cheated. You never know the politics but Ferrari still have a lot of power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 8 hours ago, Taffin said: What are people's thoughts on the rumoured cost cap breach? Minor breach/material breach etc, potential punishment? I reckon RB are playing a bit of a game and will have overspent nearly exactly the amount it cost them to replace Max's car after the Copse incident and will argue they shouldn't be penalised from a reduction to their available spend by damage caused by 'reckless' driving from other teams. It's just Hamilton greetin again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted October 6, 2022 Share Posted October 6, 2022 5 hours ago, Taffin said: How can Max be your least favourite with guys like Latifi on the grid?!?! 😂😂 The cost cap feels totally worthless imo given what's excluded from it, particularly around salaries and travel. An interesting question about least favourite though, I'd never really thought about my favourite to least favourite before. Drivers probably something like: Vettel Verstappen Bottas Lando Leclerc Alonso Albon Tsunoda Perez Zhou Magnusson Sainz Schumacher Hamilton Ricciardo Russell Ocon Gasly Stroll Latifi Team managers; really don't care or know enough about them if pushed: Favourite - Vasseur seems pretty funny Least favourite - Lawrence Stroll Favourite driver. Cobra F9 Seriously tho. David Coulthard is my favourite driver. Least favourite Lewis Hamilton. By a distance. He's probably the reason I don't watch it anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 8 hours ago, ri Alban said: Favourite driver. Cobra F9 😂😂 Very good! 8 hours ago, ri Alban said: Seriously tho. David Coulthard is my favourite driver. Least favourite Lewis Hamilton. By a distance. He's probably the reason I don't watch it anymore. It was great watching Coulthard!! He's up right up there for me across the eras, I was just getting into it back then and it was cool to have him to support! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 17 hours ago, Taffin said: How can Max be your least favourite with guys like Latifi on the grid?!?! 😂😂 The cost cap feels totally worthless imo given what's excluded from it, particularly around salaries and travel. An interesting question about least favourite though, I'd never really thought about my favourite to least favourite before. Drivers probably something like: Vettel Verstappen Bottas Lando Leclerc Alonso Albon Tsunoda Perez Zhou Magnusson Sainz Schumacher Hamilton Ricciardo Russell Ocon Gasly Stroll Latifi Team managers; really don't care or know enough about them if pushed: Favourite - Vasseur seems pretty funny Least favourite - Lawrence Stroll Oh, it's completely irrational; I'll admit that. From the flat peak on his cap to his big old fishy lips going via his tremendous arrogance (which I realise is a quality that all the very best drivers have to have). Latifi doesn't bother me because he doesn't feature in anything other than the occasional spin which spices up the race. By and large, they're just machines with no human appeal. Vettel has become better as his career has declined; Ricciardo seems fun to have a pint with and most of the rest seem like nice, privileged young chaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 1 minute ago, I P Knightley said: Oh, it's completely irrational; I'll admit that. From the flat peak on his cap to his big old fishy lips going via his tremendous arrogance (which I realise is a quality that all the very best drivers have to have). 😂😂 I'll give you that!! 1 minute ago, I P Knightley said: Latifi doesn't bother me because he doesn't feature in anything other than the occasional spin which spices up the race. By and large, they're just machines with no human appeal. Vettel has become better as his career has declined; Ricciardo seems fun to have a pint with and most of the rest seem like nice, privileged young chaps. Latifi annoys me because he's a terrible driver (comparatively) and he wrecks other people's races too often. I used to really like Danny Ric, but I've gone off him a lot for some reason that I can't really put my finger on. Generally they all seem pretty nice blokes as you say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 Sundays race is 6am I see. Get a stream here. http://www.hesgoal.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milky_26 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 15 minutes ago, Taffin said: 😂😂 I'll give you that!! Latifi annoys me because he's a terrible driver (comparatively) and he wrecks other people's races too often. I used to really like Danny Ric, but I've gone off him a lot for some reason that I can't really put my finger on. Generally they all seem pretty nice blokes as you say. For me I don't like the pay drivers as you end up blocking spots for potentially better drivers which would increase the spectacle of formula 1. George Russell seems to have developed the Toto Wolf arrogance when you hear some of his radio messages complaint about things like cars driving slowly. He needs to remember he got lucky and Norris probably would have been the better option for the Mercedes no 2 position Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 8 minutes ago, milky_26 said: For me I don't like the pay drivers as you end up blocking spots for potentially better drivers which would increase the spectacle of formula 1. George Russell seems to have developed the Toto Wolf arrogance when you hear some of his radio messages complaint about things like cars driving slowly. He needs to remember he got lucky and Norris probably would have been the better option for the Mercedes no 2 position Russell would be their choice over Norris as he’s more of a scientific type of driver who give the engineers good feedback. However he’s very quickly turned into a prick since his move to Mercedes’. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 7, 2022 Share Posted October 7, 2022 9 minutes ago, milky_26 said: For me I don't like the pay drivers as you end up blocking spots for potentially better drivers which would increase the spectacle of formula 1. George Russell seems to have developed the Toto Wolf arrogance when you hear some of his radio messages complaint about things like cars driving slowly. He needs to remember he got lucky and Norris probably would have been the better option for the Mercedes no 2 position It's 15 out of 20 are in it because of their wealth background. A lot of them are still good drivers though. In most walks of life the people at the top are from privileged backgrounds though F1 financing has created this situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milky_26 Posted October 8, 2022 Share Posted October 8, 2022 gasly to alpine and nyck de vries takes gaslys seat at alpha tauri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 8, 2022 Share Posted October 8, 2022 4 hours ago, milky_26 said: gasly to alpine and nyck de vries takes gaslys seat at alpha tauri Alpine where cracking Fabrizio Romano broke the news 😂😂😂 Quali was great. My manager wasnt happy I watched it while I was working. I did ask him if I could come to work an hour earlier to leave an hour early to watch it. Alarm set for 5.50am in the morning for race. Let's bring the title home super max ❤️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 Verstappen takes the title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DETTY29 Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 35 minutes ago, Sooperstar said: Verstappen takes the title. Ok it's early but in the space of an hour the headlines went from 'Verstappen can't win title to today' to 'Verstappen confirmed as world champion' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossaldinho Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 12 minutes ago, DETTY29 said: Ok it's early but in the space of an hour the headlines went from 'Verstappen can't win title to today' to 'Verstappen confirmed as world champion' They never understood the rules regarding the points that were awarded because of the red flag. They assumed it would be restricted points but that's only if the race can't restart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 I'll no watch the highlights, then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 6 hours ago, rossaldinho said: They never understood the rules regarding the points that were awarded because of the red flag. They assumed it would be restricted points but that's only if the race can't restart. Was it not because of Leclerq’s demotion? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milky_26 Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 6 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Was it not because of Leclerq’s demotion? i think they missed the half or 3/4 points depending on how much of the race distance was completed out when they changed the rules in the event of last seasons belgium GP. add the le clerc penalty most people were confused Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo_jim2001 Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 9 hours ago, Sooperstar said: Verstappen takes the title. Looking forward to going to the bookies tomorrow 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 Max verstappen you are the world champion the world champion ❤️❤️❤️ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossaldinho Posted October 9, 2022 Share Posted October 9, 2022 4 hours ago, hmfc_liam06 said: Was it not because of Leclerq’s demotion? It was a mixture of that and the new ruling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Redbull minor breach of financial rules. Rumours are they went over the cost and wasn't spent on the car. Aston Martin procedural breach too led to believe they didn't overspend but filed in the forms wrong. Could be a point deductions for red bull in constructors. Max losing 2 world titles and a huge fine or race ban. Depending how much over they went. I'd say a fine and maybe deducted constructor points from last season and this season. Be gutted If they took titles from max. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Ferrari are funny. They cheated for several years and it took nearly 3 years to find them out. They are the ones calling for severe sanctions now. I don't know the technicalities of the Budget cap but Red Bull sound confident they haven't deliberately cheated. I think they can be trusted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Just now, Mikey1874 said: Ferrari are funny. They cheated for several years and it took nearly 3 years to find them out. They are the ones calling for severe sanctions now. I don't know the technicalities of the Budget cap but Red Bull sound confident they haven't deliberately cheated. I think they can be trusted. Even Hamilton aswell sure he was part of the famous spygate team when at McLaren. He didn't lose his points that year but think McLaren lost constructor points Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 5 minutes ago, Seaside Dave said: Redbull minor breach of financial rules. Rumours are they went over the cost and wasn't spent on the car. Aston Martin procedural breach too led to believe they didn't overspend but filed in the forms wrong. Could be a point deductions for red bull in constructors. Max losing 2 world titles and a huge fine or race ban. Depending how much over they went. I'd say a fine and maybe deducted constructor points from last season and this season. Be gutted If they took titles from max. Minor under 5 per cent won't bring anything serious. Maybe actually end up with reforms of the Budget cap. So we can definitely say congratulations to Red Bull and Max Verstappen. They are the ones to catch now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arse 'Friends' Dyslexic? Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 6 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: Minor under 5 per cent won't bring anything serious. Maybe actually end up with reforms of the Budget cap. So we can definitely say congratulations to Red Bull and Max Verstappen. They are the ones to catch now. I disagree. If the overspend is into the millions then I would expect them to be hit with a significant penalty to deter any future breaches - reduced budget for 2023 or reduced R&D time (windtunnel/CFD). It is significant that only one team was found to have overspent though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malinga the Swinga Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Reaction of the UK pundits is, as expected, utterly pathetic. Penalise Red Bull, unfair on Lewis, poor old Mercedes amongst the comments with Martin Brundle amongst the worst. Get over it, Lewis Hamilton didn't win world championships last year cause car wasn't good enough and fast enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 8 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said: Reaction of the UK pundits is, as expected, utterly pathetic. Penalise Red Bull, unfair on Lewis, poor old Mercedes amongst the comments with Martin Brundle amongst the worst. Get over it, Lewis Hamilton didn't win world championships last year cause car wasn't good enough and fast enough. Tbh the thing was his car was faster than red bull lol fresh tyres on a one lap got Lewis beat and I loved it. Max had title won weeks before it but sure got 0 points some races becusse of likes of Silverstone where Hamilton gained even know he took max out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 It's not just Mercedes that is upset. Ferrari team principal Mattia Binotto said on Sunday that even a so-called 'minor' breach was a significant offence, and detailed the value of an overspend to a team's competitiveness. Binotto said: "If there is a breach, the penalty has to be significant. Our car has been developed respecting the budget cap and we know how much even a minor breach would have implied in performance. "$5m is about half a second, $1-2m is 0.1-0.2secs, which can be the difference between second on the grid to pole. "It is about 2021. And also over the following seasons. I am expecting full transparency and clarity on the discussions they have had." The last point is an important one, in that an overspend on development in one year means that the benefit is carried through to the next. Personally, I would like to see their cap reduced for the next two seasons reduced by whatever amount the cap was exceeded last year (it is too late for a meaningful sanction this year). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. #stillwecry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaside Dave Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 Ferrari have a cheek 😂 no matter what redbull punishment is here. The Ferrari strategy all season has been ran by School children messing about. They are a shambles of a team Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Cockade Posted October 10, 2022 Share Posted October 10, 2022 F1 is a complete shambles Safety cars galore, crazy rule changes , winning on technicalities etc etc Luckily I’m old enough to have watched Jim Clark, Jackie Stewart, Jochen Rindt, Graham Hill et al when it was proper racing Last few years have been pathetic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossaldinho Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 Ferrari have got a brass neck to be complaining after the shit they got away with a wee while back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterion Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 On 10/10/2022 at 20:04, Footballfirst said: The last point is an important one, in that an overspend on development in one year means that the benefit is carried through to the next. Personally, I would like to see their cap reduced for the next two seasons reduced by whatever amount the cap was exceeded last year (it is too late for a meaningful sanction this year). That would be interesting to see play out. Wonder if Alpha Tauri would get additional funding/redirect of RBR sponsors to boost that team if the main team was restricted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Just reading that the F1 salary cap overspend is about allocating time spent by staff who do other jobs at Red Bull. One senior member of staff not included at all. But general view is it will blow over. FIA don't have enough staff to properly review and assess the salary cap it seems. Will post article I read when I can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 On 10/10/2022 at 23:36, The White Cockade said: F1 is a complete shambles Safety cars galore, crazy rule changes , winning on technicalities etc etc Luckily I’m old enough to have watched Jim Clark, Jackie Stewart, Jochen Rindt, Graham Hill et al when it was proper racing Last few years have been pathetic Aw, did wee lewis get beat again. Boo hoo. It wasn't confusing. If the race is stopped and then you finish the race, you get full points, if the race can't continue it's not full points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Cockade Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 6 hours ago, ri Alban said: Aw, did wee lewis get beat again. Boo hoo. It wasn't confusing. If the race is stopped and then you finish the race, you get full points, if the race can't continue it's not full points. Eh? Have hardly watched Hamilton race at all Not a fan Just saying the racing now doesn’t compare to the 60’s 70’s and 80’s Capiche? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 39 minutes ago, The White Cockade said: Eh? Have hardly watched Hamilton race at all Not a fan Just saying the racing now doesn’t compare to the 60’s 70’s and 80’s Capiche? I'd love to have seen Jim Clark racing, the old videos of those times are great. I still really like it though, but I agree this year there has been an awful lot of wet weather red flags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted October 15, 2022 Share Posted October 15, 2022 22 hours ago, Mikey1874 said: Just reading that the F1 salary cap overspend is about allocating time spent by staff who do other jobs at Red Bull. One senior member of staff not included at all. But general view is it will blow over. FIA don't have enough staff to properly review and assess the salary cap it seems. Will post article I read when I can. https://thejudge13.com/2022/10/13/red-bull-crafty-salary-trick-to-avoid-budget-overspend/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milky_26 Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 red bull founder and owner Dietrich Mateschitz has died aged 78 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo_jim2001 Posted October 22, 2022 Share Posted October 22, 2022 1 minute ago, milky_26 said: red bull founder and owner Dietrich Mateschitz has died aged 78 He's got his wiiings😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 20 hours ago, milky_26 said: red bull founder and owner Dietrich Mateschitz has died aged 78 And by Christ the pre-race tribute was an absolute disaster of broadcasting. And just when it couldn’t get any worse some bursd is absolutely mauling the US anthem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughesie27 Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 1 minute ago, Tazio said: And by Christ the pre-race tribute was an absolute disaster of broadcasting. And just when it couldn’t get any worse some bursd is absolutely mauling the US anthem. Has anyone ever not mauled that anthem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milky_26 Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 problem with hamiltons brakes on the way to the grid, they are currently replacing the brakes, something that normally takes 30 mins but they are trying it in 15 mins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted October 23, 2022 Share Posted October 23, 2022 Mercedes are so reckless. Constantly ruin other people's races. What's the odds we'll hear that Sainz 'turned in on me'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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