The rise and fall of The SNP.

[Savage Vince]

14 minutes ago, Ked said:

Also I'd say without flaws is very risky.

The legislation seemed rushed and consultation was largely ignored.

 

Definitely could have engaged with families more. The scare stories all over the media didn't help at all, of course. 

 

There was absolutely a need to bring agencies together and work more collaboratively though although after over a decade of austerity many of these agencies no longer ****ing exist. 

[Ked]

7 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

In fact I'm so loyal to a party that I'm advocating a 2 party strategy

 

 

Dont think I'll bother discussing this with you.

Sorry .

Bit juvenile for me.

[Ked]

8 minutes ago, Savage Vince said:

 

Definitely could have engaged with families more. The scare stories all over the media didn't help at all, of course. 

 

There was absolutely a need to bring agencies together and work more collaboratively though although after over a decade of austerity many of these agencies no longer ****ing exist. 

Austerity has definitely had an adverse impact on the vulnerable.

I think the Scottish government under Sturgeon started of well.

But like any party with poor opposition they go unchecked.

 

[Unknown user]

5 minutes ago, Ked said:

Dont think I'll bother discussing this with you.

Sorry .

Bit juvenile for me.

 

You gave me a wee critique which was way off, I've voted for and against the SNP and now advocate a 2 party strategy to achieve independence and break the deadlock.

What is there to discuss?

[Unknown user]

Just now, jonesy said:

Michael Smith's necessary transition to centre-back, I'd imagine.

I'm a bit juvenile for that right enough jonesy

[Unknown user]

Just now, jonesy said:

Shame on you for being juvenile.  

Shame on you for growing up!

[Savage Vince]

8 minutes ago, jonesy said:

You're bloody right. A policy designed by people who have no access to 'normal life' to involve themselves in the 'normal lives' of others and simultaneously weaken the strength of the family and dilute parental responsibility even further than has already been done by a victim/blame-culture society.

 

A disaster of a plan rightly called out by a variety of voices and quietly scraped into the bin by the SNP hierarchy. 

 

However, they will, dragging those massive chips along on those awfy narrow shoulders they all have, seek to resurrect any elements of it they can. Not to improve the lives of others, but merely because they don't like being proven wrong. The whole modern SNP is one big victim support group for something that never even happened.

 

I'll let you get back to your Daily Express. 😊

[Savage Vince]

10 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Michael Smith's necessary transition to centre-back, I'd imagine.

 

Should be Kingsley. 

[Savage Vince]

Just now, jonesy said:

Typical SNP voter spiel. Bet you wouldn't even tell Kingsley's parents if you did move him to CB.

 

I wouldn't call myself an SNP voter. 

[Ked]

16 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

You gave me a wee critique which was way off, I've voted for and against the SNP and now advocate a 2 party strategy to achieve independence and break the deadlock.

What is there to discuss?

You may have voted you say alternately but your posts on here immediately defend the Scottish government usually with whataboutery.

Pulling faces to signify duh I think is not really for me.

My critique of you is that what I read of your responses is usually an attack and not debate.

I also note your posts referencing my comments to others.

Not really for me like I said but that could just be the way I am .

No hard feelings I hope .

 

 

[Ked]

7 minutes ago, jonesy said:

How dare you! I'm as immature at 38 as I was when I was 18. 

I'm a bit older than you lads maybe I missed the meaning.

🙂

[Savage Vince]

5 minutes ago, jonesy said:

And I wouldn't call myself a Daily Express reader. 😜 

 

😁

[Unknown user]

11 minutes ago, Ked said:

You may have voted you say alternately but your posts on here immediately defend the Scottish government usually with whataboutery.

Pulling faces to signify duh I think is not really for me.

My critique of you is that what I read of your responses is usually an attack and not debate.

I also note your posts referencing my comments to others.

Not really for me like I said but that could just be the way I am .

No hard feelings I hope .

 

 

I rarely defend the Scottish government, perhaps you need to re-evaluate. I don't really care about the rest, if I wanted your approval I'd ask for it.

[Ked]

1 minute ago, Smithee said:

I rarely defend the Scottish government, perhaps you need to re-evaluate. I don't really care about the rest, if I wanted your approval I'd ask for it.

You dont need my approval and I didnt say you did.

And from what I've read you immediately use whataboutery in defence of them.

I'm not arguing with you over petty nonsense.

And my initial feeling of your juvenile response is reinforced by this one.

Calm down .

I only want to post my views and questions not boost my ego.

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Ked said:

You dont need my approval and I didnt say you did.

And from what I've read you immediately use whataboutery in defence of them.

I'm not arguing with you over petty nonsense.

And my initial feeling of your juvenile response is reinforced by this one.

Calm down .

I only want to post my views and questions not boost my ego.

 

I'm absolutely calm, would you care to go back on topic or do you want to obsess over me for a bit longer?

[Ked]

Just now, Smithee said:

 

I'm absolutely calm, would you care to go back on topic or do you want to obsess over me for a bit longer?

Obsess over you?

I apologise.

 

[Ron Burgundy]

Saw something about a new SNP referendum advisor getting a swedge of £180K a year.

Nice little earner and good use of taxpayers money if true.

[pablo]

The Tennant Hardship Fund, or rather the SNP management of it is being savaged from all angles. 

 

Only a fifth of applicants who applied received an interest free loan to be be used to cover up to 9 months of rent arrears.

 

As usual, talked up big time and they've yet again failed to deliver. The SNP don't care about helping our people who need it the most.

 

And typically, this only became known after a FOI request. 

[Mysterion]

59 minutes ago, pablo said:

The Tennant Hardship Fund, or rather the SNP management of it is being savaged from all angles. 

 

Only a fifth of applicants who applied received an interest free loan to be be used to cover up to 9 months of rent arrears.

 

As usual, talked up big time and they've yet again failed to deliver. The SNP don't care about helping our people who need it the most.

 

And typically, this only became known after a FOI request. 

 

How much money was given out ? 

How many people applied/received a loan ? 

 

Is there a criteria for the loan ? Guessing they aren't going to hand out free money easily ?

 

Would like to know more if you have detail ? 👍

[pablo]

1 hour ago, Mysterion said:

 

How much money was given out ? 

How many people applied/received a loan ? 

 

Is there a criteria for the loan ? Guessing they aren't going to hand out free money easily ?

 

Would like to know more if you have detail ? 👍

 

Approximately, half a million from the 10m pot, and 200 loans granted from a 1000 applicants. Open to tenants in both private and council letts. There's a few articles in the Scottish press this morning with more detail.

[JudyJudyJudy]

20 hours ago, jonesy said:

 

I think my turning points were a) a mate having an emotional breakdown because 'Yes' lost. His reasons were more about the idea of winning at something than Scottish independence, from what I could tell, and b) seeing a tartan/saltire bedecked arsehole on a train through to Edinburgh from Glasgow for some march, his clearly confused wife and bairn in tow, telling anyone he could get near in the carriage about how terribly Scotland has been treated and how great the country has always been. I'm sure a few floating voters might have been turned towards 'no' that particular train ride.

 

Interestingly, another mate, who was very much against independence due to the likely financial catastrophe that would occur, is now inching towards it because of Brexit. I think another vote wouldn't necessarily play out the way any of us foresee it; a lot has happened since 2014 for everyone.

My turning point was the handlng of the Corona virus and the real

lack of any decent economic argument for independence really . Emotionally I’m a yes but I’m the cold hard world it’s a no 

[Mysterion]

18 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

Approximately, half a million from the 10m pot, and 200 loans granted from a 1000 applicants. Open to tenants in both private and council letts. There's a few articles in the Scottish press this morning with more detail.

 

Will go have a further look as wonder what the criteria is.

Just seems a bit low to reject 800 requests unless they are potentially fraudulent/ineligible or (worst case) the decision making used an overly strict process.

 

Just scaling up the numbers it's arguable the government "over provisioned" the funding rather than the negative slant implied. Just need to find out how strict the decision making process was to establish why only 20% of applicants were able to gain a loan. 

 

 

 

 

[Ray Gin]

5 hours ago, Ron Burgundy said:

Saw something about a new SNP referendum advisor getting a swedge of £180K a year.

Nice little earner and good use of taxpayers money if true.

 

Peanuts compared to the billions pissed away on Brexit.

 

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Peanuts compared to the billions pissed away on Brexit.

 

 

Plus, a referendum advisor seems fairly wise if planning a referendum

[Ron Burgundy]

25 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

Peanuts compared to the billions pissed away on Brexit.

 

 So basically the SNP can piss money away cos of Brexit. 

[Ron Burgundy]

24 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Plus, a referendum advisor seems fairly wise if planning a referendum

I'm sure that a referendum advisor could be found for a salary that isn't greater than that of the Prime Minister of the UK.

 

I wonder how much they will pay an for an advisor on 4 year old gender swapping ?

 

Seems wise if they are planning that sort of nonsense.

 

I cannot begin to explain how much I hate both the Snatzis and the Tolies.

 

Both horrible sneaky disgusting parties.

[Unknown user]

32 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

I'm sure that a referendum advisor could be found for a salary that isn't greater than that of the Prime Minister of the UK.

 

I wonder how much they will pay an for an advisor on 4 year old gender swapping ?

 

Seems wise if they are planning that sort of nonsense.

 

I cannot begin to explain how much I hate both the Snatzis and the Tolies.

 

Both horrible sneaky disgusting parties.

What's the normal going rate?

[JackLadd]

Can't believe the Snp want emergency covid powers to be permanent and have snuck it in during recess. They can decide on prisoner early release, school and public building closures, courts and councils operating on zoom dial... The Taliban could take notes from this shower.

[pablo]

30 minutes ago, Ron Burgundy said:

I'm sure that a referendum advisor could be found for a salary that isn't greater than that of the Prime Minister of the UK.

 

I wonder how much they will pay an for an advisor on 4 year old gender swapping ?

 

Seems wise if they are planning that sort of nonsense.

 

I cannot begin to explain how much I hate both the Snatzis and the Tolies.

 

Both horrible sneaky disgusting parties.

 

Hold on, the British taxpayer is paying for an advisor to the Scottish Government to look into splitting up the UK? 

 

On a matter reserved to Westminster, that they can’t influence. Brilliant. 

 

 

 

 

[Ray Gin]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

And the amount the UK government invested in vaccine research.

 

Well, if you get to play Name that Whataboutery then I do, too 😜 

 

Let's also not forget the billions pissed away on dodgy contracts during the pandemic then. 

[jack D and coke]

1 hour ago, pablo said:

 

Hold on, the British taxpayer is paying for an advisor to the Scottish Government to look into splitting up the UK? 

 

On a matter reserved to Westminster, that they can’t influence. Brilliant. 

 

 

 

 

You think they don’t influence the indy conversation up here? Brilliant  

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, pablo said:

 

Hold on, the British taxpayer is paying for an advisor to the Scottish Government to look into splitting up the UK? 

 

On a matter reserved to Westminster, that they can’t influence. Brilliant. 

 

 

 

 

Gove illegally syphoned off Covid funding to run polling on that very subject recently. 

 

[Guest]

I see the old fall back argument of "whit aboot" has made a triumphant return

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

I see the old fall back argument of "whit aboot" has made a triumphant return

 

Just because it's inconvenient doesn't mean it's invalid. Comparing things to Westminster is very much part of the point, which is of course why unionists hate it so much.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Just because it's inconvenient doesn't mean it's invalid. Comparing things to Westminster is very much part of the point, which is of course why unionists hate it so much.

Its largely a lazy deflection.

 

In the last few posts in reply to money being spent on an adviser to the SG, the replies have been  

 

• the billions pissed away on dodgy contracts during the pandemic
• Gove illegally syphoned off Covid funding
• Peanuts compared to the billions pissed away on Brexit.

 

None of those address the original point. 

 

  

Edited August 17, 2021 by Jonkel Hoon

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

Its largely a lazy deflection.

 

In the last few posts in reply to money being spent on an adviser to the SG, the replies have been  

 

• the billions pissed away on dodgy contracts during the pandemic
• Gove illegally syphoned off Covid funding
• Peanuts compared to the billions pissed away on Brexit.

 

None of those address the original point. 

 

  

 

They're still fair points.

 

No one's under any obligation to please you. Whether you like it or not, what Westminster does is completely valid in the independence debate.

[Konrad von Carstein]

6 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

They're still fair points.

 

No one's under any obligation to please you. Whether you like it or not, what Westminster does is completely valid in the independence debate.

Very much agree with this point of view, well said.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

They're still fair points.

 

No one's under any obligation to please you. Whether you like it or not, what Westminster does is completely valid in the independence debate.

 

5 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

They're still fair points.

 

No one's under any obligation to please you. Whether you like it or not, what Westminster does is completely valid in the independence debate.

"Pissed away" "dodgy" "syphoned off".   Its just a continuation of the football scarf politics perpetrated by the SNP.  To be fair that has increased support to its current level. 

 

I just think its very unimaginative and not very enlightened, when the go to reply is "whit aboot".

 

I'm of the opinion that the SNP cause would be helped by taking a more grown up and respectful approach

 

 

[Konrad von Carstein]

2 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

 

"Pissed away" "dodgy" "syphoned off".   Its just a continuation of the football scarf politics perpetrated by the SNP.  To be fair that has increased support to its current level. 

 

I just think its very unimaginative and not very enlightened, when the go to reply is "whit aboot".

 

I'm of the opinion that the SNP cause would be helped by taking a more grown up and respectful approach

 

 

That last sentence is laughable given how the Scottish Conservative and Unionist party and its leader have been behaving.

SNP and its cause is doing just fine and with Alba hopefully getting its act together it'll be like taking Candy from a baby at the next election,  unless of course we are indy by then

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Konrad von Carstein said:

That last sentence is laughable given how the Scottish Conservative and Unionist party and its leader have been behaving.

Whit aboot

[Unknown user]

6 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

 

"Pissed away" "dodgy" "syphoned off".   Its just a continuation of the football scarf politics perpetrated by the SNP.  To be fair that has increased support to its current level. 

 

I just think its very unimaginative and not very enlightened, when the go to reply is "whit aboot".

 

I'm of the opinion that the SNP cause would be helped by taking a more grown up and respectful approach

 

 

 

 

I'm sure no one in the independence movement cares if you find it unimaginative or unenlightened, no one's trying to convince you.

 

Please don't pretend you're concerned about what would further the SNP's cause, or that you're actually complaining about a more grown up and respectful approach when you jumped in with "whit aboot"

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

Whit aboot

 

Q.E.D.

[Konrad von Carstein]

3 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

Whit aboot

Your point, not that you'll have one...

[Guest]

4 minutes ago, Konrad von Carstein said:

Your point, not that you'll have one...

Point is, it's more whitabootery

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

 

I'm sure no one in the independence movement cares if you find it unimaginative or unenlightened, no one's trying to convince you.

 

Please don't pretend you're concerned about what would further the SNP's cause, or that you're actually complaining about a more grown up and respectful approach when you jumped in with "whit aboot"

The Indy movement should be trying to convince people like me. More voters would help the cause

[manaliveits105]

2 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

The Indy movement should be trying to convince people like me. More voters would help the cause

They can’t after 10 years they still don’t have the answers 

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

The Indy movement should be trying to convince people like me. More voters would help the cause

 

They shouldn't waste their time or effort trying to convince those who won't listen, the middle ground is the key and you're certainly not in there.

[Enzo Chiefo]

24 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

They shouldn't waste their time or effort trying to convince those who won't listen, the middle ground is the key and you're certainly not in there.

The middle ground have mortgages, pensions and common sense. I can't see the SNP getting much change out of them, to be honest.

[Pasquale for King]

8 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The middle ground have mortgages, pensions and common sense. I can't see the SNP getting much change out of them, to be honest.

Hahahahaha the U.K. has one of the worst pensions in the developed world, don’t think that’s something you want to highlight. 

Edited August 17, 2021 by Pasquale for King

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

 

"Pissed away" "dodgy" "syphoned off".   Its just a continuation of the football scarf politics perpetrated by the SNP.  To be fair that has increased support to its current level. 

 

I just think its very unimaginative and not very enlightened, when the go to reply is "whit aboot".

 

I'm of the opinion that the SNP cause would be helped by taking a more grown up and respectful approach

 

 

My point was a direct answer to another poster bumping about the 'British taxpayer' paying for a Scottish Government appointee when the UK government ILLEGALLY used British taxpayer money set aside for Covid to conduct polling into the support for Independence.

 

Very relevant.