Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Gards]

8 minutes ago, heartstastic said:

Scientists or 'the science'...which one is it? seeing as there's hundreds of scientists and medical professionals challenging the offical narative.

 

You can choose to stay ignorant all you want of you can look at both sides of the story and come to your own conclusions.

The scientists that all the countries I mentioned above all seem to agree on?  It's the scientists who don't get chosen to advise for countries/governments who seem to have an alternate opinion.  You'd think all these countries would have the best scientists that country has to be given them advice....seems weird doesn't it.  Or could just be a huge big conspiracy and they're all colluding together on this.

[heartstastic]

2 minutes ago, Gards said:

The scientists that all the countries I mentioned above all seem to agree on?  It's the scientists who don't get chosen to advise for countries/governments who seem to have an alternate opinion.  You'd think all these countries would have the best scientists that country has to be given them advice....seems weird doesn't it.  Or could just be a huge big conspiracy and they're all colluding together on this.

I put a video up and your doing your best to avoid it..you do you. But as for the bit in bold....the uk's whole response was based on prof Neil Ferguson spectaculary wrong modeling...that best science that countries are listening too?...or the CDC in the US...200000 covid deaths...later revised down to under 10000 real covid fatalities...that best in class scientfic advice your alluding too? When the best scientists as you put it are getting it that wrong i'll maybe take other voices onboard before making my mind up.

[SectionFJambo]

Put up a video at 50 mins long of some looney conspiracy theorist who takes forever to get to the point then wonder why folk don't watch it.

What are that's guys credentials?

[Gards]

3 minutes ago, heartstastic said:

I put a video up and your doing your best to avoid it..you do you. But as for the bit in bold....the uk's whole response was based on prof Neil Ferguson spectaculary wrong modeling...that best science that countries are listening too?...or the CDC in the US...200000 covid deaths...later revised down to under 10000 real covid fatalities...that best in class scientfic advice your alluding too? When the best scientists as you put it are getting it that wrong i'll maybe take other voices onboard before making my mind up.

The scientists who have been recommeding lockdown over 8 weeks ago which the UK government ignored and now we're seeing the escalation.  The scientists who recommended the path for NZ and AU (VIC) which the governments followed and have been successful in?  Those ones?

[heartstastic]

2 minutes ago, Gards said:

The scientists who have been recommeding lockdown over 8 weeks ago which the UK government ignored and now we're seeing the escalation.  The scientists who recommended the path for NZ and AU (VIC) which the governments followed and have been successful in?  Those ones?

No we are seeing more pcr testing of which the creator of the test Kary Mullis explicitly said was not to be used for infectious disease identification...more false positive testing = more false postive cases which are used to justify lockdown.

 

https://www.bitchute.com/video/wOSeTz57xrCF/

 

See before covid came along had you ever heard the term asymptomatic in regards to illness? I can only talk from personal experience but anytime i've been ill my own body was the first to let me know something was up. But now we have millions of people being tested and getting a positive result but they feel absolutely fine...yes a disease so deadly you have to have a test to be told you have it...crock of shit imo and no more deadly than seasonal flu yet the world is tatters because of it and the real damaging effect of lockdown are starting to be felt everywhere and will be the real 2nd wave of illness.

[BudgeUp]

10 minutes ago, heartstastic said:

See before covid came along had you ever heard the term asymptomatic in regards to illness?

Yes.

[1971fozzy]

All the arguments for and against mean nothing.  If the NHS gets overrun then it’s game over for everyone who needs to use it. That’s what it’s all about. 

[DETTY29]

10 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

All the arguments for and against mean nothing.  If the NHS gets overrun then it’s game over for everyone who needs to use it. That’s what it’s all about. 

This is what I don't get about folk not getting.......

 

 

[heartstastic]

13 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

All the arguments for and against mean nothing.  If the NHS gets overrun then it’s game over for everyone who needs to use it. That’s what it’s all about. 

What about the millions across the world that have more serious conditons than covid that are being denied treatment of there ailments? If that's what it's all about then it's not about protecting health.

[1971fozzy]

4 minutes ago, heartstastic said:

What about the millions across the world that have more serious conditons than covid that are being denied treatment of there ailments? If that's what it's all about then it's not about protecting health.

unfortunately it’s not about those in other countries in the world at the moment. It’s about this country and those who live here who may need to use the NHS. 
 

[Auldbenches]

2 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

Reading on another forum about people saying lockdowns a joke.

they don’t realise it’s all about the NHS.  Hospitals would be full by December then what happens ? Decisions on who dies first by not being able to admit. Heart attack ? Stroke ? Emergencies? Or covid patients ? Who do they choose who lives ? A 79 year old or a 30 year old ?

really don’t see what folk don’t understand. It’s all about saving lives and those outside covid

Everybody seemed to accept the first lockdown because of the impact on the nhs.  That never comes into it now, even though that's the same concern.  Is it not also the long term damage it can do as much as dying from it? 

[Governor Tarkin]

3 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Furlough should be available to any country or region that needs it. Not when one and only one is on't trouble. It scandalous. 

 

Spot on, Ausseh.

[Cade]

January: WTO declares Covid-19 a "Public Health Emergency of International Concern"
UK Government does nothing. No borders are closed, no PPE is ordered, no emergency measures are put in place.
February: Worldwide cases continue to increase at an exponential rate.
UK government does nothing.
March: 1,000 UK citizens are dying every day.

UK government finally caves in and orders a nation-wide lockdown.

However, it is not police nor enforced and fines are laughable. 

So everybody takes the piss.

The final piss take was when the Prime Minister's top lad went on a wee trip with his family.

He then held a press conference in which he explained he had only driven all those mile "to test his eyesight".
He escapes any kind of punishment.
Public confidence in the lockdown falls apart.
Conservative party internal politics then also rears its ugly head and after 100 days of half-ersed, barely recognised "lockdown", the Prime Minister and Chancellor decide to slowly come out of lockdown.
Or course, the Great British Public immediately go apeshit and try to get back to normal right away.
Government does nothing.
September: infection rates and hospital admissions are rising faster than they were in March.
Government does nothing.
October: Government creates an impossible to keep track of, confusing and contradictory set of local lockdown rules in several areas of the nation, but with so many exceptions and caveats that they may as well not have feckin bothered.
November: Back into full national lockdown. Weeks too late and yet again not policed or enforced in any way.

Brace yourselves everybody, this is going to be a brutal winter.

 

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, weehammy said:

‘We’ve controlled this...’

It's a what if statement. So take your UJ glasses off for once and think about folk outside London. The North having to fight for funds yet when the city of London gets in trouble, oh look furlough is extended in a flash. It's shite hammy. 

 

Hopefully the SG will use this month to put a knee on the virus' neck. Close Lanarkshire(Example) completely and use furlough to keep the people sane and out of financial trouble while they sit at home for a couple of weeks. UC doesn't cut it, either full pay or Basic income. 

 

 

Anyway, Boris has dropped the ball completely here and his own Party will skin him alive now. 

 

 

Fwiw, I'd take Scotland into lockdown to help England out, especially the North and close all airports and ports to non essentials. No one is going anywhere til 2021 would be my mantra. 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 1, 2020 by ri Alban

[steve123]

https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/what-you-can-and-cant-do-under-rules

 

Australia seem to be getting some sense of control or Sydney at least (had to check after seeing Halloween pictures on fb of bjg groups) 

[spirt of 98]

10 hours ago, steve123 said:

Na you either follow a UK approach or you don't, you can't keep going for the most stringent that is available.

 

Nicola shut alot of things down in Scotland to stop us going the same way as England she can't now say we are going that way anyway and seem credible !!

I would say she can as folk aren’t following the rules. I know people who’ve gone to England this weekend for a bevy and folk who nipped I’ve to Fife. 

[GinRummy]

10 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Why? Listen folks we've controlled this but if we get in trouble in December the money won't be available for us as it is only when England is in the shite. 

It’s controlled us more like. 

[ri Alban]

Just now, GinRummy said:

It’s controlled us more like. 

I've explained what I meant above Ginso. 👍

[GinRummy]

Just now, ri Alban said:

I've explained what I meant above Ginso. 👍

I have been known to jump the gun a bit 😀

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, GinRummy said:

I have been known to jump the gun a bit 😀

And I should explain my point of view better. 👍

[GinRummy]

6 hours ago, Cade said:

January: WTO declares Covid-19 a "Public Health Emergency of International Concern"
UK Government does nothing. No borders are closed, no PPE is ordered, no emergency measures are put in place.
February: Worldwide cases continue to increase at an exponential rate.
UK government does nothing.
March: 1,000 UK citizens are dying every day.

UK government finally caves in and orders a nation-wide lockdown.

However, it is not police nor enforced and fines are laughable. 

So everybody takes the piss.

The final piss take was when the Prime Minister's top lad went on a wee trip with his family.

He then held a press conference in which he explained he had only driven all those mile "to test his eyesight".
He escapes any kind of punishment.
Public confidence in the lockdown falls apart.
Conservative party internal politics then also rears its ugly head and after 100 days of half-ersed, barely recognised "lockdown", the Prime Minister and Chancellor decide to slowly come out of lockdown.
Or course, the Great British Public immediately go apeshit and try to get back to normal right away.
Government does nothing.
September: infection rates and hospital admissions are rising faster than they were in March.
Government does nothing.
October: Government creates an impossible to keep track of, confusing and contradictory set of local lockdown rules in several areas of the nation, but with so many exceptions and caveats that they may as well not have feckin bothered.
November: Back into full national lockdown. Weeks too late and yet again not policed or enforced in any way.

Brace yourselves everybody, this is going to be a brutal winter.

 

Very good post. Chuck in something about only London being important enough to lockdown countries and you’re there. 

[steve123]

17 minutes ago, spirt of 98 said:

I would say she can as folk aren’t following the rules. I know people who’ve gone to England this weekend for a bevy and folk who nipped I’ve to Fife. 

Yea, but I don't think these type of folk are ever going to follow rules in full lockdown they will all just be at house parties etc.

 

I may have had a shandy or 2 last night and been a bit strong on my opinion, I do believe though that it would be damaging to announce a new route map to great fanfair then go straight into lockdown when numbers are going in right direction.

Edited November 1, 2020 by steve123

[Dazo]

11 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Furlough should be available to any country or region that needs it. Not when one and only one is on't trouble. It scandalous. 

It is available to everyone, it’s been extended so anyone already using the scheme can continue to do so. 
 

Nicola is doing such a great job I doubt we’ll need it though. 

[Victorian]

10 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

All the arguments for and against mean nothing.  If the NHS gets overrun then it’s game over for everyone who needs to use it. That’s what it’s all about. 

 

They're never going to get it.  All these people mumbling on about high survival rates.  These people are surviving right now because our fantastic frontline staff have the opportunity to treat them all.  If things don't take a turn for the better then not everybody will receive the treatment they need.  

 

It's a simple concept.  Too many people presenting at hospital all at once.  They can't be added to a waiting list.  But it's being ignored,  or denied.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

They've totally Hibsed it in England.

 

If Sturgeon were to now bin her own new system and just lump in with them for the cash, she'd be Hibsing it, too.

 

The lot of them should resign and allow for a national coalition government to be created with the speaker of the house hand picking the cabinet, none of whom may stand again for elected office in order to ensure they remain focused on the job at hand rather than ratings and long term ambition. Plan and deliver a clear six month strategy and implement it. 

 

Labour supports and will vote for the lockdown.  Starmer said this morning that he would work with the government on a national interest ticket.  There is a degree of cooperation already.  

 

The real dysfunction exists behind the political masters.  It's the culture of how this government operates.  The outsourcing of power to Cummings and the shady,  non-tendered awarding of key contracts and the appointment of people like Dido Harding to positions well beyond her sphere of expertise.  There's an awful lot of vested,  mutually beneficial and highly dubious interests existing within that lot.  There are plenty of people within that who will oppose to their last breath any notion of a national unity government that threatens the status quo.

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

16 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

 

The real dysfunction exists behind the political masters.  It's the culture of how this government operates.  The outsourcing of power to Cummings and the shady,  non-tendered awarding of key contracts and the appointment of people like Dido Harding to positions well beyond her sphere of expertise.  There's an awful lot of vested,  mutually beneficial and highly dubious interests existing within that lot.  There are plenty of people within that who will oppose to their last breath any notion of a national unity government that threatens the status quo.

 

agree with most of this - would probably apply it to a wider group than just this government

 

given this makes acceptance of “the science” not so straight-forward as some of the more simplistic thinkers would suggest

 

 

[The Internet]

 

[Seymour M Hersh]

13 hours ago, heartstastic said:

I put a video up and your doing your best to avoid it..you do you. But as for the bit in bold....the uk's whole response was based on prof Neil Ferguson spectaculary wrong modeling...that best science that countries are listening too?...or the CDC in the US...200000 covid deaths...later revised down to under 10000 real covid fatalities...that best in class scientfic advice your alluding too? When the best scientists as you put it are getting it that wrong i'll maybe take other voices onboard before making my mind up.

 

That's not even science it's mathematical algorithms. Put in disaster movie data and guess what you'll get disaster movie predictions. Job's a good un! 

[Weakened Offender]

14 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Even, over the age of 90, the majority of people survive Covid. Nearly every single death is among those with underlying conditions  - 98% or so. Pretty much like all viruses, including flu, it affects the most vulnerable.  For 99.5% of people,  the human immune system is the cure.

 

You're commitment to spouting this nonsense is truly marvellous. 

[And he’s not praying!]

There’s a noticeable absence from certain posters in light of BoJo’s announcement.

 

I can only imagine the reaction should Nicola Sturgeon need to do similar. 

[Weakened Offender]

2 minutes ago, And he’s not praying! said:

There’s a noticeable absence from certain posters in light of BoJo’s announcement.

 

I can only imagine the reaction should Nicola Sturgeon need to do similar. 

 

Incredible isn't it? 

[Bongo 1874]

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/fresh-hope-scots-health-chiefs-22938369.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAQ&usg=AOvVaw2Hpuz9f9yQa-2b-7wKAuQa&ampcf=1

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.thenational.scot/news/18838123.covid-scotland-nhs-chiefs-planning-vaccine-roll-out-six-weeks/&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAX&usg=AOvVaw3kmdCszwnUn3QjyeVnSapy

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/leaked-emails-reveal-nhs-lothian-19201701.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAe&usg=AOvVaw2ixgXk2zIpI6k1hS5qyF-Y

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

15 minutes ago, And he’s not praying! said:

There’s a noticeable absence from certain posters in light of BoJo’s announcement.

 

I can only imagine the reaction should Nicola Sturgeon need to do similar. 

Spot on.

[kila]

Let’s post snippets/quotes from links instead of pasting just them.

 

[Bongo 1874]

3 minutes ago, kila said:

Let’s post snippets/quotes from links instead of pasting just them.

 

Sorry mate 👍. 

[coconut doug]

28 minutes ago, And he’s not praying! said:

There’s a noticeable absence from certain posters in light of BoJo’s announcement.

 

I can only imagine the reaction should Nicola Sturgeon need to do similar. 

 

Did NS not point out the possible need for this in Scotland and was she not told Scotland would not get a furlough reintroduction?

 

Now it seems o.k. for England to use UK money for their England only furlough and it seems they are able to do it without consultation or even informing the devolved governments.

 

Surely in such a scenario our recovery will take longer. We are likely to suffer more hospitalisations and deaths as a result. It's almost as if the Tories don't care about us.

[Enzo Chiefo]

34 minutes ago, Weakened Offender said:

 

You're commitment to spouting this nonsense is truly marvellous. 

In the absence of you being able to contradict any of the FACTS that I outlined in my post, I have filed your post under " Utter Garbage ", where most of your previous posts reside. 

 

[And he’s not praying!]

4 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Did NS not point out the possible need for this in Scotland and was she not told Scotland would not get a furlough reintroduction?

 

Now it seems o.k. for England to use UK money for their England only furlough and it seems they are able to do it without consultation or even informing the devolved governments.

 

Surely in such a scenario our recovery will take longer. We are likely to suffer more hospitalisations and deaths as a result. It's almost as if the Tories don't care about us.

Upon watching one of the Sunday morning news channels it was pointed out that during a recent cobra meeting, the devolved government’s had all pleaded for an extension to the furlough scheme and were told in no uncertain terms, No.

 

 

[coconut doug]

1 minute ago, And he’s not praying! said:

Upon watching one of the Sunday morning news channels it was pointed out that during a recent cobra meeting, the devolved government’s had all pleaded for an extension to the furlough scheme and were told in no uncertain terms, No.

 

 

 

They only found out about England's lockdown via the Press. I expect somebody will be along in a minute to explain to us why we have been treated this way.

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

In the absence of you being able to contradict any of the FACTS that I outlined in my post, I have filed your post under " Utter Garbage ", where most of your previous posts reside. 

 

 

Your post was nonsense.

 

Thousands of people are being successfully treated in hospital.  Many of them would not survive without vital treatment.  They're not "curing" themselves with their own immune systems.  The only credible continuation of the successful treatment of people is to ensure they receive treatment at all.  The trajectory of the epidemic indicates that,  without urgent measures,  people would begin to be denied treatment from around the start of December.  Why?  Because the space and personnel in hospitals would be beyond all routine and contingency capacity.  Every space in a corridor filled.

 

The human immune system is not the cure.  Specific treatment is not a cure.  But it is necessary to prevent deaths.

 

You're wrong.  Spouting ill conceived nonsense.  Short sighted and ignorant.

[The Internet]

Feels like we're a week to 10 days away from BoRiS himself using the phrase 'digital Christmas'. 

[The Internet]

Lol what am I thinking, he's just done a little announcement last night. Will be at least 2 or 3 weeks before we see or hear from him again. 

[Weakened Offender]

16 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

In the absence of you being able to contradict any of the FACTS that I outlined in my post, I have filed your post under " Utter Garbage ", where most of your previous posts reside. 

 

 

Your brass-necked garbage on this thread is poison, pal. File that too. 😊

[Enzo Chiefo]

6 minutes ago, Weakened Offender said:

 

Your brass-necked garbage on this thread is poison, pal. File that too. 😊

The hysterical virus fear on this thread is poison PAL. Facts trump hysteria though. Frothing at the mouth is a symptom of being unable to challenge the facts that I laid out in my post. Bye.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

26 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

They only found out about England's lockdown via the Press. I expect somebody will be along in a minute to explain to us why we have been treated this way.

 

That's been the normal throughout most of this, the complete lack of communication from WM to the devolved nations, yet at the very start they were all in unison, now however....................

Edited November 1, 2020 by Jambo-Jimbo

[Enzo Chiefo]

22 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Your post was nonsense.

 

Thousands of people are being successfully treated in hospital.  Many of them would not survive without vital treatment.  They're not "curing" themselves with their own immune systems.  The only credible continuation of the successful treatment of people is to ensure they receive treatment at all.  The trajectory of the epidemic indicates that,  without urgent measures,  people would begin to be denied treatment from around the start of December.  Why?  Because the space and personnel in hospitals would be beyond all routine and contingency capacity.  Every space in a corridor filled.

 

The human immune system is not the cure.  Specific treatment is not a cure.  But it is necessary to prevent deaths.

 

You're wrong.  Spouting ill conceived nonsense.  Short sighted and ignorant.

I wasn't talking about people in hospital. The asymptomatic people - who are not actually cases, despite being recorded as such - have beaten the virus with their immune system,  if indeed they even had the virus. The vast majority of "positive" results therefore cure themselves as do those with mild symptoms. A small minority, most of whom are either in hospital anyway or have underlying conditions , require hospital treatment.  Stop spreading fear snd hysteria through ignorance of the facts.

[The Internet]

Borderline witch doctor chat that. 

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, Dazo said:

It is available to everyone, it’s been extended so anyone already using the scheme can continue to do so. 
 

Nicola is doing such a great job I doubt we’ll need it though. 

That's not the point I was making Daza. Furlough should have been extended to Scotland(Example) in November, even if England wasn't in lockdown. Not because London is starting to be hit bad. £1.8b allocated to transport London in a heartbeat, yet the North of England had to fight for their funding. 

[manaliveits105]

1 hour ago, Bongo 1874 said:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/fresh-hope-scots-health-chiefs-22938369.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAQ&usg=AOvVaw2Hpuz9f9yQa-2b-7wKAuQa&ampcf=1

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.thenational.scot/news/18838123.covid-scotland-nhs-chiefs-planning-vaccine-roll-out-six-weeks/&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAX&usg=AOvVaw3kmdCszwnUn3QjyeVnSapy

 

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/leaked-emails-reveal-nhs-lothian-19201701.amp&ved=2ahUKEwjFw4XJqOHsAhVuQUEAHR2PCoEQ0PADegQICxAe&usg=AOvVaw2ixgXk2zIpI6k1hS5qyF-Y

 

Sounds promising 

(but will get ignored or poo pooed by our resident doom mongers)

[Victorian]

11 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I wasn't talking about people in hospital. The asymptomatic people - who are not actually cases, despite being recorded as such - have beaten the virus with their immune system,  if indeed they even had the virus. The vast majority of "positive" results therefore cure themselves as do those with mild symptoms. A small minority, most of whom are either in hospital anyway or have underlying conditions , require hospital treatment.  Stop spreading fear snd hysteria through ignorance of the facts.

 

More nonsense and squirming.  Pontificate about non-hospitalised cases all you want but the matter at hand is the scale of hospitalisation.  That is the specific crisis that necessitates urgent action in the way of a lockdown.  

 

Hiding under a comfort blanket of a so-called minority requiring hospital treatmemt does not enable the scale of treatment to take place.  The minority is able to receive vital treatment right now.  But the minority number in a few weeks time will begin to be a larger number than can be treated.  You must be a special type of ignorant to continue to miss this basic principle.

 

You've got some brass neck to dismiss these facts as hysteria or spreading fear.  What you call facts are an absolute shambles of ignorance,  complacency and ill conceived opinion.

Edited November 1, 2020 by Victorian