Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[ri Alban]

12 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Who are “ careless “ ? 

Drivers 

 

Sorry. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

8 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Drivers 

 

Sorry. 

Ok 

[vegas-voss]

1 hour ago, Taffin said:

 

To be fair, 5 tiers is a better approach than the UK governments. A lot of areas dont even need to really be in Tier 1, yet there is no scope for that. Also some Tier 3 have gyms open and others don't as an example of local variation. It's not quite as simple as Boris likes to make out.

 

That said it's another example of the Scottish Government bringing much the same approach and measures with a few tweaks that the UK government they're only too happy to criticise, brought in weeks before them

I posted last night in England you can go to the pub with as much as 30 of you if it's for business.Thats baffling so 6 of the same office can't go for a social drink but 30 of you can if you say it's for business in the tier 2 setting.

[vegas-voss]

18 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

5 tiers, that'll simplify things. I remember when stay alert was too complicated for the FM.

The three tiers is going down well in England right enough.

[vegas-voss]

48 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Our hospitality sector will remain shut as long as the west coast one does to deter pint tourists.

 

 

👍

 

 

It's still the the first wave, Seymour, it never went away.

Exactly this wave is just media talk.

[Shanks said no]

1 hour ago, Lord BJ said:

Tier 3 announcement expected today for Yorkshire.

An announcement on whether South Yorkshire will face the toughest Covid rules is expected on Wednesday morning, the communities secretary has said.

[Whatever]

2 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

An announcement on whether South Yorkshire will face the toughest Covid rules is expected on Wednesday morning, the communities secretary has said.

Already announced according to a Reuters notification I just received.

[Shanks said no]

2 minutes ago, Whatever said:

Already announced according to a Reuters notification I just received.

BBC probably lagging behind.

 

Next up for the clampdown are West Yorkshire, the North East, Teesside and Nottinghamshire.

[Whatever]

1 minute ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

BBC probably lagging behind.

 

Next up for the clampdown are West Yorkshire, the North East, Teesside and Nottinghamshire.

Already announced from the local mayor upon reading the article. £41 million support package agreed.

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

Listening to Talk Radio just now and Ian Duncan Smith discussing treatments stating that anti viral drugs are effective and should be sent to GP surgeries as apparently they can help prevent a patient getting worse and ending up in hospital . He said this needs ramped . And before anyone slates me yes I can’t stand the man but I agree with what he says here 

[Shanks said no]

@redjambo as our numbers man, what will the Dumfries outbreak do to their figures given the NHS area covers a population of 148k ?

 

 

[vegas-voss]

3 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Listening to Talk Radio just now and Ian Duncan Smith discussing treatments stating that anti viral drugs are effective and should be sent to GP surgeries as apparently they can help prevent a patient getting worse and ending up in hospital . He said this needs ramped . And before anyone slates me yes I can’t stand the man but I agree with what he says here 

What ones are they ?

 

I seen that WHO said that Remdesivir has very little impact on Covid 19

[The Internet]

Seeing chat that a breath test has been developed that can detect covid in under a minute. Obviously sounds like one of those things that seems like the answer to all our problems and then nothing ever happens, but apparently there has been variations of it used in Netherlands for the last week as a prescreening before proper tests. Worth keeping an eye on but early days. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

9 minutes ago, vegas-voss said:

What ones are they ?

 

I seen that WHO said that Remdesivir has very little impact on Covid 19

He didn’t say what they were but did mention a couple drugs which do help 

[ri Alban]

Seems to me that non BCG generation are doing quite well against covid. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by ri Alban

[vegas-voss]

6 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

He didn’t say what they were but did mention a couple drugs which do help 

Anything that can help people is good in my book.Im surprised it has taking so long for trials of the BCG Jag seeing as they have been using it in India since March.

Edited October 21, 2020 by vegas-voss

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 minute ago, vegas-voss said:

Anything that can help people is good in my book.Im surprised it has taking do long for trials of the BCG Jag seeing as they have been using it in India since March.

Yes that’s true . I also think the tier system is probably a good idea which may work it’s basically localised lockdowns 

[DETTY29]

2 hours ago, Dazo said:

It isn’t just business that dies with lockdown. Lockdown isn’t a solution it’s a panic tactic to save Christmas. People are dying regardless including during lockdown so we need guidelines and soft restrictions that allow all businesses to be open. Shut down the businesses that are clearly and repeatedly breaking the guidelines. 

UK doesn't have the resources to do anything properly.

 

Or not the right priorities.

 

4-5th largest economy, (now 7th) in more recent times built on me, me, me, blame someone else strategy, and not having a pot to piss in.

 

And with this current government, we know they will siphone off not just the cream, but all the milk, the jar, the cups, the saucers, the dishwasher, the fairly liquid pod and the cat for their own benefit ahead of public interest.

[Dazo]

8 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

UK doesn't have the resources to do anything properly.

 

Or not the right priorities.

 

4-5th largest economy, (now 7th) in more recent times built on me, me, me, blame someone else strategy, and not having a pot to piss in.

 

And with this current government, we know they will siphone off not just the cream, but all the milk, the jar, the cups, the saucers, the dishwasher, the fairly liquid pod and the cat for their own benefit ahead of public interest.

We are paying businesses to close. That money could be better spent imo so there is money there to do things. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by Dazo

[Jambo-Jimbo]

24 minutes ago, Mauricio Pinilla said:

Seeing chat that a breath test has been developed that can detect covid in under a minute. Obviously sounds like one of those things that seems like the answer to all our problems and then nothing ever happens, but apparently there has been variations of it used in Netherlands for the last week as a prescreening before proper tests. Worth keeping an eye on but early days. 

 

Seen a report on Sky News (I think) last week about that, sure it was from the Netherlands as well, so probably the same thing that your seeing chat about now.

[Enzo Chiefo]

31 minutes ago, Dazo said:

We are paying businesses to close. That money could be better spent imo so there is money there to do things. 

Open up businesses, allow hospitality to operate safely and get the economy moving again. Without income tax, corporation tax, VAT etc, there will be no money to fund anything. Where the hell do these lefties that want to give a permanent big warm hug to the "vulnerable" and the NHS, think the money comes from??  Ensure adequate safety measures are in place in hospitals and care homes, where the majority of deaths did come and are coming from and start getting life back to normal. We can still follow the basic safety measures but continual lockdowns are doing far more damage than the pandemic thay they say they are "saving us" from.

 

[ri Alban]

8 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Open up businesses, allow hospitality to operate safely and get the economy moving again. Without income tax, corporation tax, VAT etc, there will be no money to fund anything. Where the hell do these lefties that want to give a permanent big warm hug to the "vulnerable" and the NHS, think the money comes from??  Ensure adequate safety measures are in place in hospitals and care homes, where the majority of deaths did come and are coming from and start getting life back to normal. We can still follow the basic safety measures but continual lockdowns are doing far more damage than the pandemic thay they say they are "saving us" from.

 

Yeah, , those lefties saved you and your fellow right wingers who bankrupted the world back in 2008.

But you're right, the Labour government should have left everyone to go bust, lose their house and whatever goes with it. 

Wait, we bailed them out and also allowed their mates to cash in on the debt. 🤔

Edited October 21, 2020 by ri Alban

[graygo]

2 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Our hospitality sector will remain shut as long as the west coast one does to deter pint tourists.

 

 

👍

 

 

It's still the the first wave, Seymour, it never went away.

 

Does it have to go away completely to be classed as a second wave when it comes back? The sea doesn't go away yet we have multiple waves.

 

The answer is "no" by the way, we are slap bang in the middle of a second wave right now despite what you say. Google it - "is the UK having a second wave"

[Enzo Chiefo]

Just now, Brian Dundas said:

That sounds great, but if everything is 'open' then the virus is circulating so how do you keep it out of care homes and hospitals?

It only circulates if basic precautions are not taken.  There is no inevitability about it. It is now believed that it spreads in clusters, with more and more research suggesting that most infected people don't pass it on to anyone. Care homes and other institutional settings are where they need to ensure PPE, testing etc is adequate. 

[Weakened Offender]

7 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

That sounds great, but if everything is 'open' then the virus is circulating so how do you keep it out of care homes and hospitals?

 

Well you obviously don't. 

[redjambo]

1 hour ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

@redjambo as our numbers man, what will the Dumfries outbreak do to their figures given the NHS area covers a population of 148k ?

 

 

Oh noes, don't be giving me unwanted responsibilities as a "numbers man"!

 

I assume you're talking about this morning's news about Charnwood Lodge Care Home? D&G have had elevated case numbers over the last 2-3 weeks, e.g. 15, 29, 29, 10, 7, 12, 16 over the last week, so it may not make much difference, particularly outwith the short term if the outbreak is confined to the care home (and whoever brought it in) without it spreading further in the community. When making decisions affecting whole NHS areas, the SG will probably be concentrating on the spread of infection in an area's population as a whole rather than localised "contained" outbreaks.

 

It concerns me that we're still getting outbreaks in care homes. I thought we would have learned our lesson and had strict protocols in place by now.

[Victorian]

1 hour ago, JamesM48 said:

Listening to Talk Radio just now and Ian Duncan Smith discussing treatments stating that anti viral drugs are effective and should be sent to GP surgeries as apparently they can help prevent a patient getting worse and ending up in hospital . He said this needs ramped . And before anyone slates me yes I can’t stand the man but I agree with what he says here 

 

He's got history of talking total bollocks to support a pre-determined agenda.  Nothing he says can be taken at face value.  He's probably latched on to some positive info re anti-virals and is touting them as some kind of universal panacea.  He can go and **** himself.

[coconut doug]

13 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

What's that got to do with there being no PPE available for them to purchase for their highly trained but underpaid staff? Scotland was well prepared right enough. 

 

I agree though, the lassies should've told their employers to **** of and left the corpses rotting where they lay. If that's what it is that you're implying.

 

 

Hiya, Weakened.

Hiya pal.

 

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

20 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Yeah, , those lefties saved you and your fellow right wingers who bankrupted the world back in 2008.

But you're right, the Labour government should have left everyone to go bust, lose their house and whatever goes with it. 

Wait, we bailed them out and also allowed their mates to cash in on the debt. 🤔

[Shanks said no]

4 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Oh noes, don't be giving me unwanted responsibilities as a "numbers man"!

 

I assume you're talking about this morning's news about Charnwood Lodge Care Home? D&G have had elevated case numbers over the last 2-3 weeks, e.g. 15, 29, 29, 10, 7, 12, 16 over the last week, so it may not make much difference, particularly outwith the short term if the outbreak is confined to the care home (and whoever brought it in) without it spreading further in the community. When making decisions affecting whole NHS areas, the SG will probably be concentrating on the spread of infection in an area's population as a whole rather than localised "contained" outbreaks.

 

It concerns me that we're still getting outbreaks in care homes. I thought we would have learned our lesson and had strict protocols in place by now.

Cheers Red, the carehome appears to have a capacity of 68 residents, so assuming it has already spread through a number of them and associated staff, we might see a slight spike in the daily figures for that area. 

[Victorian]

This 'open it aw up man' stuff again.   It might sound very easy when it tends to support a wider opinion but in practice it's not.  It's been totally discounted by most scientific / medical voices.   The problem is scale.  It's not even about deaths,  it's about the unmanageable scale of hospital treatment.  We could get to a hypothetical point where virtually nobody dies but only because they get treated in hospital.  The hospitals have a finite number of people they can deal with.  There's a finite number of frontline staff to treat people.   Even now with suppression the hospitals are much busier.  Open up too much and the sheer scale can only become unmanageable.  

 

That's the main reason we are in strict suppression.  Not deaths.  Not long covid.  It's simply about regulating the scale of demand along a timeline.

[JudyJudyJudy]

12 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

He's got history of talking total bollocks to support a pre-determined agenda.  Nothing he says can be taken at face value.  He's probably latched on to some positive info re anti-virals and is touting them as some kind of universal panacea.  He can go and **** himself.

Lol well I did say I wasn’t a fan of his in my posting ! He wasn’t called “ Dr death “ for nothing 😂

[kingantti1874]

Approaching the point in Belgium where doctors will decide who gets treatment and who dies without the help they need.  Lombardy all over again.
 

 

[Shanks said no]

11 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

The Dumfries care home appears to be a charity enterprise.

 

Charnwood Lodge is proud to be part of Community Integrated Care, one of Britain’s largest social care charities, which was voted Charity of the Year 2019 at Charity Times Awards. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Oh noes, don't be giving me unwanted responsibilities as a "numbers man"!

 

I assume you're talking about this morning's news about Charnwood Lodge Care Home? D&G have had elevated case numbers over the last 2-3 weeks, e.g. 15, 29, 29, 10, 7, 12, 16 over the last week, so it may not make much difference, particularly outwith the short term if the outbreak is confined to the care home (and whoever brought it in) without it spreading further in the community. When making decisions affecting whole NHS areas, the SG will probably be concentrating on the spread of infection in an area's population as a whole rather than localised "contained" outbreaks.

 

It concerns me that we're still getting outbreaks in care homes. I thought we would have learned our lesson and had strict protocols in place by now.

My friends husband only gets tested twice per week at the nursing hone he works in. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

 

[SE16 3LN]

2 hours ago, vegas-voss said:

The three tiers is going down well in England right enough.

Exactly

[Governor Tarkin]

19 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

 

None of this should be news to anyone, doug, and I agree that it's disgusting, but my point stands.

Covid positive patients were sent back from the hospitals to their care homes where staff spread the virus between their charges due to a lack of PPE. This is from the horses mouth.

We can't pick and choose govenrment successes and government failures to suit our own narratives.

 

Edited October 21, 2020 by Governor Tarkin

[kingantti1874]

44 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Open up businesses, allow hospitality to operate safely and get the economy moving again. Without income tax, corporation tax, VAT etc, there will be no money to fund anything. Where the hell do these lefties that want to give a permanent big warm hug to the "vulnerable" and the NHS, think the money comes from??  Ensure adequate safety measures are in place in hospitals and care homes, where the majority of deaths did come and are coming from and start getting life back to normal. We can still follow the basic safety measures but continual lockdowns are doing far more damage than the pandemic thay they say they are "saving us" from.

 

sorry, just this is just ill informed nonsense fuelled by internet conspiracy theories which are actually pushed to people likely to buy into it. Shows a real fundamental lack of understanding of what is going on, and a in all honesty a bizarre lack of judgement.
 

At the very simplest level why would governments across the globe, who hold wildly different politics, and advised by a wide array of people who are brightest minds in the field of expertise all arrive at the same conclusion in terms of the risk and the best ways to mitigate that risk? Do you genuinely believe you are right and they are wrong? I mean seriously? 

Edited October 21, 2020 by kingantti1874

[The Mighty Thor]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

This 'open it aw up man' stuff again.   It might sound very easy when it tends to support a wider opinion but in practice it's not.  It's been totally discounted by most scientific / medical voices.   The problem is scale.  It's not even about deaths,  it's about the unmanageable scale of hospital treatment.  We could get to a hypothetical point where virtually nobody dies but only because they get treated in hospital.  The hospitals have a finite number of people they can deal with.  There's a finite number of frontline staff to treat people.   Even now with suppression the hospitals are much busier.  Open up too much and the sheer scale can only become unmanageable.  

 

That's the main reason we are in strict suppression.  Not deaths.  Not long covid.  It's simply about regulating the scale of demand along a timeline.

Do you think we'll see some data on how the current suppression measures are performing, particularly as we've shut down the two areas where the issue apparently was?

[Dazo]

3 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

sorry, just this is just ill informed nonsense fuelled by internet conspiracy theories. Shows a real fundamental lack of understanding of what is going on , and a in all honesty a bizarre lack of judgement.
 

At the very simplest level why would governments across the globe, who hold wildly different politics, and advised by a wide array of people who are brightest minds in the field of expertise all arrive at the same conclusion in terms of the risk and the best ways to mitigate that risk? 

If all these governments are unified how come we are repeatedly told ours is doing it wrong ? Does that mean everyone is doing it wrong ? 

[graygo]

22 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

 

The distribution and responsibilities for PPE in both NHS and private care homes was taken over by the SG. The normal routes to purchase for private care homes were shut off to them.

[Dazo]

13 minutes ago, Victorian said:

This 'open it aw up man' stuff again.   It might sound very easy when it tends to support a wider opinion but in practice it's not.  It's been totally discounted by most scientific / medical voices.   The problem is scale.  It's not even about deaths,  it's about the unmanageable scale of hospital treatment.  We could get to a hypothetical point where virtually nobody dies but only because they get treated in hospital.  The hospitals have a finite number of people they can deal with.  There's a finite number of frontline staff to treat people.   Even now with suppression the hospitals are much busier.  Open up too much and the sheer scale can only become unmanageable.  

 

That's the main reason we are in strict suppression.  Not deaths.  Not long covid.  It's simply about regulating the scale of demand along a timeline.

 

Who has said genuinely open it all up without any sort of control or guidelines ? Probably no one ever. 

[graygo]

9 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

 

 

He's not spot on, not about the PPE situation in care homes anyway.

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, Dazo said:

If all these governments are unified how come we are repeatedly told ours is doing it wrong ? Does that mean everyone is doing it wrong ? 

There is a difference between the guidance and how that guidance has been implemented. We aren’t doing great, the data is pretty clear.
 

“letting life go on as normal” and trying to secure the vulnerable is simply not possible.  
 

As for who has got it right.. NZ, Australia, SK.. not many others.  Although I will say we would have fared much better we had behaved better as individuals.. the amount of people not following guidance 🤦‍♂️ Also being the ones to moan their faces off when the consequences of that become clear..

 

 

 

Edited October 21, 2020 by kingantti1874

[Shanks said no]

13 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

My friends husband only gets tested twice per week at the nursing hone he works in. 

well that’s twice as much as nurses in NHS Lothian were getting tested in a community hospital,  caring for the elderly,  around 2 months ago, before the nurse I know went on maternity leave. 

Edited October 21, 2020 by The Frenchman Returns

[graygo]

5 minutes ago, Dazo said:

 

Who has said genuinely open it all up without any sort of control or guidelines ? Probably no one ever. 

 

There was one tbf.

[JudyJudyJudy]

30 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

Pandemics happen, those in care homes are more susceptible to pandemics. Care home owners in the private sector should know this and expect shortages when pandemics occur. They need contingency plans. Instead they cut corners on training, pay very poor wages to their staff to maximise their profits which they pay in tax havens to avoid paying tax here. There is substantial evidence that much infection in private care homes was brought in by agency staff and others who travelled long distances and visited many homes because they couldn't recruit and retain local staff..

 

  They have the audacity to constantly complain about not being provided with PPE despite the company who had the home in Skye where many residents died, making hundreds of millions of pounds in profit but paying nothing in tax. Despite this they were provided with ppe. PPE that had to be diverted from the NHS us putting additional strain on the NHS. The better homes would have been prepared. Profit is everything for some though and looking after patients and staff is clearly an afterthought.

 

 

Exactly my feelings about those private homes , they should have had PPE long before any pandemic anyway as many residents have dementia and sadly need full personal care which should be carried out using PPE 

[Governor Tarkin]

41 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Does it have to go away completely to be classed as a second wave when it comes back? The sea doesn't go away yet we have multiple waves.

 

The answer is "no" by the way, we are slap bang in the middle of a second wave right now despite what you say. Google it - "is the UK having a second wave"

 

If I ask Google "is the Earth flat" I'll have some **** telling me it is, grago, so I'll keep my own counsel.

Would we be in a 'second wave' if we hadn't artificially supressed the first one?

The terminology isn't an accident, and is frankly patronising to all of us.

👍

 

 

[redjambo]

25 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

As I said above I don't see how you can keep it out if the staff live in the real world, even if you get them not to use public transport to get to and from work, they would need to use it in their own lives, go to shops, socialise, have kids at school. If it is circulating in the community it will eventually get into care settings.

 

I'd love someone to tell me I'm wrong about this and explain how we can keep it out of care homes etc

 

They could try to keep each care home as isolated a system as possible by employing live-in carers for the actual hands-on work with the clients. The live-in carers would probably have to be tested a couple of times in isolation, within a special area of the care home, before being cleared for their however-many-days-it-is shift. Just an idea.