Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[redjambo]

Today's per-board case figures (per-100,000):

 

Lanarkshire 44, Greater Glasgow 31, Ayrshire & Arran 15, Lothian 13, Tayside 12

 

All the rest: less than 10.

[coconut doug]

30 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

I don't know what shit show you've been watching, but NS politicised the virus from day 1, attacking the lack of funding, the stay alert message which she couldn't understand apparently, and continues to make it a Nationalist issue (see today's arguments about cross border  lighthouse labs). They have politicised it because they wanted to make it an independence cause, which to some extent seems to be backfiring on them now. 

 

As for at the beginning, the SG had their own pandemic plan, their own Emergency plan and in both those plans it stated clearly that the resources were there should a pandemic occur. They clearly weren't. While Westminster lacked plans and visions too, there is nobody more responsible for the current situation in Scotland than the Scottish Govt. themselves.

 

I think all opposition parties would attack the lack of funding generally. Here Nicola says she "hugely welcomes" the furlough scheme. In fact she likes it so much she wants it extended. https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/extend-the-scottish-furlough-scheme-18412470

 

Nothing political in the "stay alert" message either. The FM is completely correct to criticise something that had been widely condemned by all opposition parties and many scientists. The same message that a Tory minister could not explain on the Marr show.Why would the FM want Scotland to be encumbered by the incoherent nonsense that was emanating from Westminster? Far better to have your own protocols and remind the public every day as to what the were.

 

I do not know what is happening with lighthouse labs but i do know from personal experience that some of the UK run testing capacity has already been withdrawn in Scotland because it was not operating properly. Having now just looked at what happened it seems to me the politicising has come from Westminster. Even the BBC and that is my only source says the FM is "playing it down" and does not want "a war of words". She staed that the backlog was due to tests being rerouted out of Glasgow and it seems that is indeed the case. Imo it is not unreasonable for the FM to be asked why the numbers appeared to fall and give an explanation. This has happened several times before and the UKgov does not deny that it happened here. What's the problem? how is it politicking? How on earth could you make this an "independence cause"? How could this be backfiring on Indy? More importantly has the FM said anything that isn't true?

 

I wonder what resources you are referring to that were not available to the Scottish government. Are you not aware that the death rate in England appears to be 40% higher than Scotland? That's politicking, something the FM has assiduously avoided throughout the pandemic. 

 

 

[graygo]

53 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said:

Hitting some European countries really badly now apparently with transmission rates rising and more cases by the day.

 

We now have Wales in lockdown, some areas in the UK under stricter restrictions with more to follow.  At what point do the UK government stop travel into our island from Europe so as to start to reduce the possible transmission of Covid from external sources?

 

Or do we just keep taking restrictive measures with our own population and keep the trap doors open?  Should the UK government not be looking to act quickly here?

 

How many infected folk do you think are flooding into our tiny island on a daily basis, all of whom presumably are asymptomatic?

 

There will be more 'cases' coming out of Tesco every day.

 

[graygo]

52 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

 

 

I found it and i read it and wholly unsurprisingly it does not support your ludicrous statistics and the inferences you make from them.

  https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0036933020962891

 

Nobody could possibly think that "Back in March/April 50% of over 65s that caught the virus, were infected in hospital." All you are doing is trying to characterise our hospitals, our country and our response to the pandemic in the worst possible way.

 

The current death rate for the virus does not as you say have  "a death rate of less than 0.5%". In the UK about 0.65% of the population have already died. That figure can only go one way. Around 7% of those who have tested positive have died. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

We also know that many are having illness that doesn't kill them but does seriously debilitate them. This site also shows that the proportion of younger people dying is increasing. https://www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/

 

It seems to me the government modelers have this about right. 

 

Your 7% figure is as you correctly say people who have died after having a positive test. What it doesn't say is that they all died because of the virus. Taking off the false positives (or whatever term you want to use for dead viral traces) and comorbidities will leave you with a number which can only go one way from 7.

[coconut doug]

46 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Fair enough, Doug, thanks for taking the time to explain your views. I can't say I agree with many of your points, and indeed, find that you come across as being blinkered to any of the SNP/NS's faults. I'm a former member of the SNP and voted Yes last time around, so do have some sympathies, but it would take a lot for me to consider the misguided and systematic dismantling of the hospitality industry - and likely more to come - as well as the care home fiasco and the general fearmongering promoted by those in charge as being a success.

 

Thanks. it's good to try to put things in context and find that there is at least a little appreciation of the attempt. Most of what they have done is a relative success against a bumbling UKgov. I think NS has handled the pandemic well but i also think it likely she will have to resign soon. I think it telling that the opposition are not calling for her resignation, there is nobody to take her place in any party with UK prospects even worse.

[coconut doug]

3 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Your 7% figure is as you correctly say people who have died after having a positive test. What it doesn't say is that they all died because of the virus. Taking off the false positives (or whatever term you want to use for dead viral traces) and comorbidities will leave you with a number which can only go one way from 7.

 

Totally agree.

[Enzo Chiefo]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

 

 

 

I found it and i read it and wholly unsurprisingly it does not support your ludicrous statistics and the inferences you make from them.

  https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0036933020962891

 

Nobody could possibly think that "Back in March/April 50% of over 65s that caught the virus, were infected in hospital." All you are doing is trying to characterise our hospitals, our country and our response to the pandemic in the worst possible way.

 

The current death rate for the virus does not as you say have  "a death rate of less than 0.5%". In the UK about 0.65% of the population have already died. That figure can only go one way. Around 7% of those who have tested positive have died. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

We also know that many are having illness that doesn't kill them but does seriously debilitate them. This site also shows that the proportion of younger people dying is increasing. https://www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/

 

It seems to me the government modelers have this about right.

You've seriously been trawling for 2 days looking for the nosocomial figures that I provided on Sat. I quote "46% of older patients tested positive after 14 days in hospital....felt likely to represent nosocomial infection". Not quite sure what was so surprising about that?? The majority of deaths have occurred in care homes and a large number in hospital anong patients who caught the virus there.  That is where is it spreads and where resources should be targetted. Closing hospitality is a nonsense and Sturgeon will find herself under huge pressure if common sense decisions about this sector are not taken later this week. Other countries are looking at k number now, using backward tracing, concentrating on where clusters occur and who are the super spreaders. It is now thought that 80% of positive cases do not infect anyone else, but we are still stuck behind the curve, fretting about r numbers and nonsensical lock downs

[graygo]

10 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I'm a bit confused, do each of those actions not make the number go in a different direction?

 

No.

[joondalupjambo]

27 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

How many infected folk do you think are flooding into our tiny island on a daily basis, all of whom presumably are asymptomatic?

 

There will be more 'cases' coming out of Tesco every day.

 

Is that the point or is it not just simply about reducing the risk and what actions Governments should be taking to keep it's people safe?  My point was if we take all the necessary measures internally, including limiting travel or stopping travel here between areas does it make sense to keep our borders open?  If we are trying to get the infection rates as low as possible or even eradicate is closing other borders not something that has to be done? That after all is a weak point in any plan I would have tbought if we have saving lives as a priority.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2020 by joondalupjambo

[coconut doug]

45 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I am still a member of the SNP and I don't consider the SG handling of the virus crisis to be a success at all. They were completely unprepared to protect vulnerable people in care homes or in hospitals and mistakes made there cost a huge amount of lives. Testing was not introduced as quickly as it could have been, therefor infections were spreading in hospitals and care homes due to staff not knowing they were spreading. They have been slow to engage with many businesses that could have resumed sooner safely, see fans at sports etc. Exams fiasco.

 

However I don't feel that political gain for the cause of independence is the reason for the failings, nor do I blame them for the dismantling of the hospitality trade. The decisions made here have mirrored those across Europe and the West, every Government is culpable as even now you see hospitality being the target of new measures right across Europe. I don't understand why now, during this lockdown, jobs and businesses are not being protected the same as they were in March? and that does require additional funding from central UK Gov.

 

I also don't subscribe to the fear mongering theory, I do accept others will disagree. Does that mean I'm brainwashed?

 

I'm not, never have been and never will be a member of the SNP. I do think however that the SG has done a good job on the pandemic. I think the care home inquiry findings will either confirm or destroy that opinion though. I'm not aware of any major problems in hospitals so that could change things too.

  Imo our strategy was changed because we did not have the necessary  testing capacity and again i am not sure what the effect of this has been. Germany for instance had limited testing capacity but still suppressed the virus. 

 I can see that a lack of responsiveness caused problems but i would say that the SGs attempts at a clear strategy were undermined by those who thought that Scotland should not under any circumstances deviate from what was happening in England. A view that looks even more stupid now than it did then. 

  Totally agree re hospitality 

[graygo]

3 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said:

Is that the point or is it not just simply about reducing the risk and what actions Governments should be taking to keep it's people safe?  My point was if we take all the necessary measures internally, including limiting travel or stopping travel here between areas does it make sense to keep our borders open?  If we are trying to get the infection rates as low as possible or even eradicate is closing other borders not something that has to be done? That after all is a weak point in any plan I would have tbought if we have saving lives as a priority.

 

All those things you say we should do internally are not happening, until they are then stopping international travel, especially from countries with less infections per head of population than us just doesn't make sense to me. It doesn't make much sense to the World Health Organisation either.

[Enzo Chiefo]

1 hour ago, Nucky Thompson said:

You're wasting your time with him.

He won't hear a bad word against 'Nicola' and the SG.

He's one of the brainwashed who thinks that Scotland has done a lot better than England dealing with the pandemic, although the 2 countries are much the same per 100,000 people. 

Can we not just lockdown Sturgeon in Bute House? Certainly these ridiculous daily briefings have to stop. Same old script every single day with her rolling eyes every time a member of the press pack strays from the party line.  She will certainly be at a loose end when all this ends, although I suspect she'll be back to whinging about Brexit. Never mentions that more Scots voted for Brexit than voted SNP at the last election though 😉

[graygo]

3 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

If you take out the positive test results for those with non virulent traces of the virus that would make the number of deaths % go up as the +ve tests go down.

 

If you take out the comorbidities then the number of deaths would go down and so would the % of those who died compared to +ve test.

 

What if those with the non virulent traces of the virus are among the dead?  Let's say 5 of them for arguments sake. You then have 95 positive cases and 2 dead. That gives a figure of around 2%.  ie. It will go down.

[redjambo]

9 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Can we not just lockdown Sturgeon in Bute House? Certainly these ridiculous daily briefings have to stop. Same old script every single day with her rolling eyes every time a member of the press pack strays from the party line.  She will certainly be at a loose end when all this ends, although I suspect she'll be back to whinging about Brexit. Never mentions that more Scots voted for Brexit than voted SNP at the last election though 😉

 

In the Brexit referendum, 1,018,322 Leave votes were cast in Scotland (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/politics/eu_referendum/results).

 

In the 2019 UK General Election, 1,242,380 votes were cast for the SNP (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019_United_Kingdom_general_election_in_Scotland).

Edited October 19, 2020 by redjambo

[Weakened Offender]

2 hours ago, SE16 3LN said:

I don't know what shit show you've been watching, but NS politicised the virus from day 1, attacking the lack of funding, the stay alert message which she couldn't understand apparently, and continues to make it a Nationalist issue (see today's arguments about cross border  lighthouse labs). They have politicised it because they wanted to make it an independence cause, which to some extent seems to be backfiring on them now. 

 

As for at the beginning, the SG had their own pandemic plan, their own Emergency plan and in both those plans it stated clearly that the resources were there should a pandemic occur. They clearly weren't. While Westminster lacked plans and visions too, there is nobody more responsible for the current situation in Scotland than the Scottish Govt. themselves.

 

You're posting record on this thread is absolutely chronic. 

[joondalupjambo]

I have to be honest travel has been my biggest bug bear in all of this.  Folk moving around when I suspect in many cases is not needed.  I totally get how hard it is to stop and totally get the economic arguements but for me it is the one area all politicians are in fear of making the big decisions, Wales at least tickling the trout.  I guess we will see in the coming weeks if travel including international travel becomes an issue again.  I just fear it will.

[luckydug]

3 hours ago, coconut doug said:

 

Taking responsibility for the management of the pandemic and being seen to do so is not "a political move". That is her job and every day she points out that she does not want to politicise the situation despite being asked incessantly why she is doing things differently to England. She always points out to them that the devolved governments and Westminster must do what they think is best for the areas they are responsible for and she is doing the same. She frequently tells them that now is not the time for political or constitutional questions but it often makes no difference as she is frequently asked for her opinion on what is happening elsewhere and why are we not doing the same because we are after all one United Kingdom. It is the dullards in the Press and the haters on here who are politicising her briefings.

 

   Nicola and the SNP did not use Brexit to further the Indy cause and they are not using the pandemic either. The fact that she is still "churning them out" shows that the situation is changing and that there is a need for further exposition. Of course people are fatigued that's why you have to keep explaining things to them. 

 

  There is a very good argument that UK policies failed at the beginning and that was to do with indecision rather than public engagement. It is much more difficult to claim that now in Scotland's case where our relative position with regard to the pandemic has improved significantly.

Dont expect commonsense and reason to be welcomed on here mate. 

Get the tin hat on. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 hours ago, Brian Dundas said:

The decisions made here have mirrored those across Europe and the West,

So ? That doesn't mean to say they made the right decisions just because other countries did the same bar Sweden. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 hours ago, jonesy said:

Fair enough, Doug, thanks for taking the time to explain your views. I can't say I agree with many of your points, and indeed, find that you come across as being blinkered to any of the SNP/NS's faults. I'm a former member of the SNP and voted Yes last time around, so do have some sympathies, but it would take a lot for me to consider the misguided and systematic dismantling of the hospitality industry - and likely more to come - as well as the care home fiasco and the general fearmongering promoted by those in charge as being a success.

Similar to me regarding voting next year. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

1 hour ago, coconut doug said:

I think NS has handled the pandemic well but i also think it likely she will have to resign soon.

How bizarre ! 

[Robbofan99]

3 hours ago, Barack said:

Same thing, ain't it? Unless Harvie's getting binned?

 

 

Its their environmental policies i support.. The other parties are a waste of space. 

[ri Alban]

2021 will be the last vote we will ever have to cast for the SNP. Pandemic or no pandemic. 

[Robbofan99]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Can we not just lockdown Sturgeon in Bute House? Certainly these ridiculous daily briefings have to stop. Same old script every single day with her rolling eyes every time a member of the press pack strays from the party line.  She will certainly be at a loose end when all this ends, although I suspect she'll be back to whinging about Brexit. Never mentions that more Scots voted for Brexit than voted SNP at the last election though 😉

This is a major issue i have with these briefings.  Why does she have to front it all the time?  Its a rhetorical question but typical for the SNP with their cult mentality. Her incessant use of the pronoun " I" also re enforces the cult and suggests she is making all the decisions in her cabinet.  Its would be  very alarming  if there was an Independent Scotland with her at the helm. However her ego mania may be her downfall .  In the last Indy ref was the economy was their Achilles heel and thats going to be even worse if and when we have another vote. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot..

[Robbofan99]

1 hour ago, weehammy said:

She doesn’t have to do or say anything political. She is milking a fantastic opportunity to achieve and maintain a very high profile with her daily epistles. The rest of her Party/Government have been close to invisible - including her own HEALTH minister.

Imagine the howls in here if Boris, rather than his hapless sidekicks, was hogging the limelight.

Yes its a one woman show 

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, Robbofan99 said:

Yes its a one woman show 

[Ray Gin]

[Robbofan99]

20 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

2021 will be the last vote we will ever have to cast for the SNP. Pandemic or no pandemic. 

In your dreams. Just wait until the full force of the media again ramps it up in any future Indy campaign.  Their main area will again be the economy.  They will argue that we have had to go hand in cap to Westminster to literally saves lives and there would be no way an Independent Scotland would be able to financially manage a pandemic without Westminster supporting us.  Plus the economy will be f%%%%%% anyway so bang goes any hopes of an Independent Scotland. 

[Seymour M Hersh]

6 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

The Welsh announce their fire break. Stay at home order and everything to shut bar essential shops/facilities.

 

 

 

They're as bad as Krankie. Fire****ingbreak. Jesus wept. 

[GinRummy]

38 minutes ago, Robbofan99 said:

Its their environmental policies i support.. The other parties are a waste of space. 

All parties in this country are shit imo. 

[Victorian]

Hysterical stuff.   

[Robbofan99]

On 07/09/2020 at 13:51, Victorian said:

It's going to take a while before the effects of the sharp rise in cases will become apparent.    There's little effect on deaths and ICU admissions right now but the knock-on effects of higher incidence could well be more older people becoming infected from coming into contact with people carrying virus.    I don't expect to see deaths rising much for another 4-6 weeks but more virus circulating is highly unlikely to remain ineffective forever.

 

If your current comfort blanket is a much smaller percentage of seriously affected cases right now then you're barking up the wrong comfort blanket I'm afraid.

well done Mystic Meg...however deaths  haven't risen that much .  Maybe revisit again in the next  4 - 6 weeks ?  

[Robbofan99]

5 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

All parties in this country are shit imo. 

Agreed. 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Robbofan99 said:

well done Mystic Meg...however deaths  haven't risen that much .  Maybe revisit again in the next  4 - 6 weeks ?  

 

Death rate nationally has doubled over the last 12 days.  Deaths and hospital admissions are rising.  The better thing is that the growth seems different this time.  Not yet accelerating off on a steep,  expontential curve.  

 

Still,  what was suggested (and ridiculed) a while back is now happening.  You were at the front of the queue with the ridicule and it's quite remarkable you've got the brass neck to revisit that subject.  Shameless.

[ri Alban]

33 minutes ago, Robbofan99 said:

In your dreams. Just wait until the full force of the media again ramps it up in any future Indy campaign.  Their main area will again be the economy.  They will argue that we have had to go hand in cap to Westminster to literally saves lives and there would be no way an Independent Scotland would be able to financially manage a pandemic without Westminster supporting us.  Plus the economy will be f%%%%%% anyway so bang goes any hopes of an Independent Scotland. 

  Unionists are funny. 

 

If Scotland could borrow and shut her borders, we'd nail this virus. But we can't and the SG are pissing pretty well with coak that they've goat. 

 

SNP voter. 

[Robbofan99]

8 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Death rate nationally has doubled over the last 12 days.  Deaths and hospital admissions are rising.  The better thing is that the growth seems different this time.  Not yet accelerating off on a steep,  expontential curve.  

 

Still,  what was suggested (and ridiculed) a while back is now happening.  You were at the front of the queue with the ridicule and it's quite remarkable you've got the brass neck to revisit that subject.  Shameless.

Nah...like i said deaths are certainly not on the scale of your prediction..infections yes..me shameless ? Never. 

[Weakened Offender]

14 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Death rate nationally has doubled over the last 12 days.  Deaths and hospital admissions are rising.  The better thing is that the growth seems different this time.  Not yet accelerating off on a steep,  expontential curve.  

 

Still,  what was suggested (and ridiculed) a while back is now happening.  You were at the front of the queue with the ridicule and it's quite remarkable you've got the brass neck to revisit that subject.  Shameless.

 

Well said. 

 

There's about 5/6 on this thread who, if they had anything about them at all, would have slithered off to post drivel on some other thread by now . Utter cretins. 

Edited October 19, 2020 by Weakened Offender

[Victorian]

7 minutes ago, Robbofan99 said:

Nah...like i said deaths are certainly not on the scale of your prediction..infections yes..me shameless ? Never. 

 

Hopefully fewer and fewer people pay any heed to your drivel.   

[GinRummy]

23 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Death rate nationally has doubled over the last 12 days.  Deaths and hospital admissions are rising.  The better thing is that the growth seems different this time.  Not yet accelerating off on a steep,  expontential curve.  

 

Still,  what was suggested (and ridiculed) a while back is now happening.  You were at the front of the queue with the ridicule and it's quite remarkable you've got the brass neck to revisit that subject.  Shameless.

Could it be that the virus itself has changed. Lots of chat about it weakening but also chat about young folk getting it so that kept death rate down. 

[SectionFJambo]

lIt's clear the west particularly in the Glasgow/Lanarkshire area are making Scotland a lot worse. Hopefully this is recognised in the phasing however I suspect due to the geography you have no choice but to deal with the central belt as a whole to prevent thick weegies jumping on a train.

[Victorian]

4 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

Ireland considering going into a full lockdown for 6 weeks. 

 

 

 

Not surprised to see these lockdowns coming.  Scientists suggesting full blooded measures are more effective than targeted,  localised variations.  Even economists have said that full lockdowns are better in terms of longer term economic prospects.   It's coming to the whole of the UK.  

[JudyJudyJudy]

8 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

Ireland considering going into a full lockdown for 6 weeks. 

 

 

Yes they have went bat shit crazy over there..

[SectionFJambo]

For me Sturgeon cocked up by not doing the lockdown to coincide with schools closing. We should have had 2 mini lockdowns now and then again at Xmas if still required.

 

You just need to go outside to see that the current measures aren't working. Hospitality closures have taken it on to the next step a bit but you can see people have lost the social distancing messages.

[GinRummy]

Just now, JamesM48 said:

Yes they have went bat shit crazy over there..

It’s the only thing proven to work other than effective track and trace, which the Uk seems to be making an absolute arse of. All these half measures, closing pubs etc are just bollocks. Either open everything or close everything. 

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, GinRummy said:

Could it be that the virus itself has changed. Lots of chat about it weakening but also chat about young folk getting it so that kept death rate down. 

 

There's zero scientific basis to the weakening theory.  Treatments are better understood.  Age profile was younger but is slowly moving back towards older end.  Might even be that many fewer people are experiencing a higher viral load at infection,  possibly due to behavioral changes and fewer settings where higher viral load is present at infection.   

 

I'm hoping the slower growth of numbers might indicate an effect from the small amount of population immunity we have.  If immunity is persisting well then perhaps the virus is being naturally suppressed by having fewer possible infection chains to make.

[GinRummy]

Just now, Victorian said:

 

There's zero scientific basis to the weakening theory.  Treatments are better understood.  Age profile was younger but is slowly moving back towards older end.  Might even be that many fewer people are experiencing a higher viral load at infection,  possibly due to behavioral changes and fewer settings where higher viral load is present at infection.   

 

I'm hoping the slower growth of numbers might indicate an effect from the small amount of population immunity we have.  If immunity is persisting well then perhaps the virus is being naturally suppressed by having fewer possible infection chains to make.

Thanks for reply. Bit behind with my reading on all this. Gets a bit depressing after a while. 

[manaliveits105]

On One Show there development in cancer treatment where they introduce a virus ( common tummy bug virus used in example) to cancer which not only attacks the cancer but puts a target on it for our own immune systems to attack the cancer - a double whammy - very encouraging

well done scientists 

[Enzo Chiefo]

55 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Death rate nationally has doubled over the last 12 days.  Deaths and hospital admissions are rising.  The better thing is that the growth seems different this time.  Not yet accelerating off on a steep,  expontential curve.  

 

Still,  what was suggested (and ridiculed) a while back is now happening.  You were at the front of the queue with the ridicule and it's quite remarkable you've got the brass neck to revisit that subject.  Shameless.

Again we are obsessing about Covid deaths ahead of the many other illnesses, like cancer,  where people of all ages have had treatment stopped , or have missed a check up or a diagnosis. Many people have died as a direct result of their treatment being stopped.  Bowel cancer screening was put on hold for 7 months. How many people will die needlessly because of catastrophic decisions like that?? People that have suffered because of the effective closure of many GP surgeries??Covid is a virus that the majority of people suffer no symptoms from and has a survival rate of 99.5%. The average age of those who die is higher than the life expectancy age ffs. It's time to protect those in care homes, hospitals etc, where the majority of vulnerable people died in Spring, and allow the rest of us to go about our business, following the basic distancing rules, masks etc. Get the economy moving again before it's too late. Ministers and scientists are covering their erses ahead of the public inquiry and probably think they wont be blamed for non Covid deaths.  But turning the NHS into a National Covid Service has been the height of negligence and they don't appear to have learned anything. Lockdowns would be ignored by the majority of people imo. I will follow the basic measures but will not adhere to any stay at home message that limits how many times you can leave your house. 

[Nucky Thompson]

In my line of work I deal with a lot of elderly people. 

Back in March, like most people they were terrified and would only talk to you from behind their window.

Now, most of them aren't scared of the virus, they are more scared of what restrictions are going to be put on their lives

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Again we are obsessing about Covid deaths ahead of the many other illnesses, like cancer,  where people of all ages have had treatment stopped , or have missed a check up or a diagnosis. Many people have died as a direct result of their treatment being stopped.  Bowel cancer screening was put on hold for 7 months. How many people will die needlessly because of catastrophic decisions like that?? People that have suffered because of the effective closure of many GP surgeries??Covid is a virus that the majority of people suffer no symptoms from and has a survival rate of 99.5%. The average age of those who die is higher than the life expectancy age ffs. It's time to protect those in care homes, hospitals etc, where the majority of vulnerable people died in Spring, and allow the rest of us to go about our business, following the basic distancing rules, masks etc. Get the economy moving again before it's too late. Ministers and scientists are covering their erses ahead of the public inquiry and probably think they wont be blamed for non Covid deaths.  But turning the NHS into a National Covid Service has been the height of negligence and they don't appear to have learned anything. Lockdowns would be ignored by the majority of people imo. I will follow the basic measures but will not adhere to any stay at home message that limits how many times you can leave your house. 

 

Want the NHS to be able to deal with non-covid work?   Best not overload the hospitals with covid then.   Very simple.

 

Your argument is an ill conceived cliche.   

[SectionFJambo]

Back in March it was unknown and people only saw the news etc.

Now 7 months on they have seen it first hand or I suspect rather have not and are a lot less placid re it's impacts.

 

I'd hazard a guess most people know no one who has died of it and very few people who have had it.