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Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )


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7 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

The media have been very good at exposing the Conservatives of late. Just ask matt Hancock, Allegra posh bird and anyone who was at a Downing St xmas party last year. 

 

I doubt they'll expose the NHS being sold off, it's not actually happening 

 

I know someone who works for the NHS in Manchester and she would challenge that. 

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21 minutes ago, Jonkel Hoon said:

The media have been very good at exposing the Conservatives of late. Just ask matt Hancock, Allegra posh bird and anyone who was at a Downing St xmas party last year. 

 

I doubt they'll expose the NHS being sold off, it's not actually happening 

Believe what you want.

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26 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Why are you quoting figures from Friday 24th?

My error . I just assumed it was updated every day . Ofcourse when it is updated tomorrow there may be rises which the doom mongers will gleefully highlight it ! 

16 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

But what is the hospitalisation data (not aiming that at you specifically by the way).  We are obsessed by case data when increasingly it is simply irrelevant.  We need accompanying hospitalisation, ICU and death data, they are all that matter.  

They love to highlight the massive infections figures as it looks more Alarming but isn’t so if you look more in depth at the other stats . The ones that actually matter . 

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Had great Xmas day . We all went to restaurant for it . Brilliant  day and evening . Woke up yesterday with sore throat actually . Thought the worse or the best really ( mild variant and all ) so took a LfT test yesterday . Was negative . Took Some strepsils  yesterday and today . All gone . 

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Footballfirst
4 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

My error . I just assumed it was updated every day . Ofcourse when it is updated tomorrow there may be rises which the doom mongers will gleefully highlight it ! 

I don't think we are expecting to get Scotland's complete figures until Wednesday.

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5 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I don't think we are expecting to get Scotland's complete figures until Wednesday.

It’ll no doubt be a media frenzy if they are off the scale . Hopefully not 👍

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Had what I thought was a good Christmas day with my kids and family, took lft tests before we went to my parents and everyone negative. My cousin tested again on boxing day and is now positive, now wondering how me and my household should play the full situation as we are currently all negative through LF tests at the moment, thus virus can do one, it's playing games with me just as I was enjoying abit more freedom again and becoming abit more comfortable 

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Everyone down to England for Hogmanay. You might even get to see a game too. 
 

Covid restrictions will not be tightened in England before the New Year, Boris Johnson has decided after reviewing the latest data on the spread of the omicron variant.

It means there will be no limits on the number of people who can gather for New Year’s Eve parties - an issue around which there had been a lack of clarity in the last week.

Sajid Javid, the Health Secretary, is expected to announce the position in comments to TV reporters to be aired later today. It means that Parliament will not be recalled this week.

Yet uncertainty remains about whether new rules could come into effect at the start of January, with government sources stressing the data is being carefully monitored day-by-day. 

Downing Street is also continuing to encourage people to be cautious, stressing that the pandemic still poses a threat and people should take lateral flow tests before attending gatherings.

The decision not to bring in new restrictions before January was taken after Mr Johnson gathered to go through the latest omicron data with government scientists on Monday.

Edited by Boy Daniel
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Nucky Thompson

It's just been confirmed by Sajid Javid that there will be no more Covid rules in England before New Year.

The New Year celebrations can continue 

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Footballfirst
7 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

It’ll no doubt be a media frenzy if they are off the scale . Hopefully not 👍

I'm sure that the media, like you and I, would actually love numbers to come plummeting down and allow us to return to pre covid days. 

 

I suspect that the numbers that have come out today reflect the results of tests taken prior to Christmas Day, i.e. before any legal restrictions were brought into effect.

 

Just from my own observations there certainly seems a ramping up of infections across the board, e.g. no of games called off, or even JKB posters reporting family issues.  If that is reflected across most industries then it will impact many more businesses and services than those being directly impacted by restrictions such as nightclubs.

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Nucky Thompson

It's the isolation rules that are going to cripple work places.

 

NFL players who test positive, but are double jabbed and asymptomatic, are cleared to play.

Covid seems to be ripping through teams, but it's not having much of an effect on the league

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2 hours ago, Horatio Caine said:

My heart sinks every time that woman offers her tuppence worth.  I have never heard a word of optimism or positivity come out of her mouth.

 

My glad I'm not the only one to think this about her as well. 👍

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Brighton Jambo
18 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I'm sure that the media, like you and I, would actually love numbers to come plummeting down and allow us to return to pre covid days. 

 

I suspect that the numbers that have come out today reflect the results of tests taken prior to Christmas Day, i.e. before any legal restrictions were brought into effect.

 

Just from my own observations there certainly seems a ramping up of infections across the board, e.g. no of games called off, or even JKB posters reporting family issues.  If that is reflected across most industries then it will impact many more businesses and services than those being directly impacted by restrictions such as nightclubs.

It’s the restrictions that are crippling business not the illness itself.

 

My wife and I both have/had Covid this past week.  We both would be fine to have worked every day.  If we were in a job where WFM wasn’t an option under SG rules we would have to sit and home for ten days despite feeling fine and almost certainly testing negative for the last few days.  
 

The draconian restrictions are the biggest problem.  We need to change our thinking on how this is managed. 

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Sounds to me like England is going to just let it rip and go for a herd immunity strategy.

Could be argued that living with the virus, you'd have to do something like this sooner or later, is it the right time though.....guess we'll find out soon enough.

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highlandjambo3
1 hour ago, NANOJAMBO said:

A nation not paralysed with fear is being told not to be paralysed with fear.

Rinse & repeat. It'sOK to disagree but talk of being "paralysed" is ridiculous. 

 

I never cease to be amazed by posts like this where there is a total denial of the reality this variant is having on the NHS. The published numbers from 10 days ago in terms of NHS staff affected in London are totally ignored because Omicron is nothing like as serious and hardly anyone goes to hospital or dies. So, nothing to worry about ? Even though there's reports of staff who're completely jabbed but who are off sick having had both variants and last week  1 in 7 doctors in London were off sick with it. 

No, nothing to worry about, the people off sick aren’t dying at home are they? They are being guided by the rules for being positive which is self isolation.  There is not a total denial of the effect this variant is having on the NHS because their staff (who are not dying) are not at work to tend to patients (who are also not dying), it’s well documented that the NHS are struggling with this because of the current rules.  The NHS are short staffed, as they have been for a very long time, bodies are not piling up.

 

Lets take it back a bit to this “tidal” wave that was about to flatten us.  Is was mutes at the outset that this variant may not be as serious as initially thought but, wheeling in all the “prophet of doom” experts has gotten the government and us to shit ourselves again.  Now it’s looking like it’s all a wet flannel…..now no one in the government has the balls to stand up and say we may have over reacted but, did what we thought was best at the time.  If the government did a U turn things would likely settle down but they won’t simply because the politicians would all be sniping at each other again.

 

COVID can GTF

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40 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It's just been confirmed by Sajid Javid that there will be no more Covid rules in England before New Year.

The New Year celebrations can continue 

Sensible governance unless ours . Brave leadership really as the mass media and the doom laden number crunchers were predicting Armageddon . Meanwhile in Scotland business ruined yet again , Xmas and New Years plans in tatters . Events and sporting events cancelled for weeks . What a hideous scared way to govern 

13 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said:

No, nothing to worry about, the people off sick aren’t dying at home are they? They are being guided by the rules for being positive which is self isolation.  There is not a total denial of the effect this variant is having on the NHS because their staff (who are not dying) are not at work to tend to patients (who are also not dying), it’s well documented that the NHS are struggling with this because of the current rules.  The NHS are short staffed, as they have been for a very long time, bodies are not piling up.

 

Lets take it back a bit to this “tidal” wave that was about to flatten us.  Is was mutes at the outset that this variant may not be as serious as initially thought but, wheeling in all the “prophet of doom” experts has gotten the government and us to shit ourselves again.  Now it’s looking like it’s all a wet flannel…..now no one in the government has the balls to stand up and say we may have over reacted but, did what we thought was best at the time.  If the government did a U turn things would likely settle down but they won’t simply because the politicians would all be sniping at each other again.

 

COVID can GTF

Yes nearly 3/4 weeks since all the talk of tidal waves , tusnami  etc . Still waiting . Clearly was ruse to people boosted . 

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Footballfirst
20 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

It’s the restrictions that are crippling business not the illness itself.

 

My wife and I both have/had Covid this past week.  We both would be fine to have worked every day.  If we were in a job where WFM wasn’t an option under SG rules we would have to sit and home for ten days despite feeling fine and almost certainly testing negative for the last few days.  
 

The draconian restrictions are the biggest problem.  We need to change our thinking on how this is managed. 

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

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1 minute ago, Footballfirst said:

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

 

The downside is that people will stop registering with track and trace at venues to avoid being pinged and getting 10 days solitary confinement at Sturgeon's pleasure.

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Adam_the_legend
1 minute ago, Footballfirst said:

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

They are draconian. Glad more people are starting to question the justification for these “rules”. The media are even starting to ask important questions about the collateral damage from the restrictions and the pandemic long with/of debate. Feels like the turning point back to normality. 

 

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Footballfirst
7 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Yes nearly 3/4 weeks since all the talk of tidal waves , tusnami  etc . Still waiting . Clearly was ruse to people boosted . 

What is it you are waiting for James?  Case rates multiplying 4 fold over the 3 weeks, with further increases expected, seems to fit the description of a tidal wave of cases.

 

3 or 4 weeks ago we didn't know how those case numbers will affect the NHS or other businesses.  I'd argue that we still don't know the full impact.  I hope that the restrictions eventually prove to be overkill, but I'm sure that you would be one of those criticising the SG if they had adopted a laissez faire approach and the impact had been severe (hospitalisations, football games cancelled, businesses closed, buses/trains not running because of multiple infections etc. etc.) 

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Brighton Jambo
8 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

I agree with your depiction at the beginning when caution was sensible.  Now with so much more known and hospital data understood I would depict them as draconian especially given the impact they are having on business and essential services.

 

for what it worth I also think the English rules are far too strict for this strain of the virus.  We need to get back to allowing people to work if they test negative and are double vaccinated and reduce the self isolation significantly for those who are asymptomatic.  

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Footballfirst
1 minute ago, Brighton Jambo said:

I agree with your depiction at the beginning when caution was sensible.  Now with so much more known and hospital data understood I would depict them as draconian especially given the impact they are having on business and essential services.

 

for what it worth I also think the English rules are far too strict for this strain of the virus.  We need to get back to allowing people to work if they test negative and are double vaccinated and reduce the self isolation significantly for those who are asymptomatic.  

News update - Hospitalisations in England are now 8,474, up 27% over a week.

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16 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

Vaccine passports ? Various other rules from today ? 

6 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

What is it you are waiting for James?  Case rates multiplying 4 fold over the 3 weeks, with further increases expected, seems to fit the description of a tidal wave of cases.

 

3 or 4 weeks ago we didn't know how those case numbers will affect the NHS or other businesses.  I'd argue that we still don't know the full impact.  I hope that the restrictions eventually prove to be overkill, but I'm sure that you would be one of those criticising the SG if they had adopted a laissez faire approach and the impact had been severe (hospitalisations, football games cancelled, businesses closed, buses/trains not running because of multiple infections etc. etc.) 

I’ll wait until it “ overwhelms “ the NHS as was predicted and yes I’ve just saw your breaking post about an increase in hospital admissions by 27% in England . Are they “ overwhelmed “ due to this ? 

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I think Boris is treating the English like adults and giving them the choice to do what's necessary to lighten the risk.

 

It's easily avoided if you really want to avoid it.

 

 

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Footballfirst
5 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

Vaccine passports ? Various other rules from today ? 

I’ll wait until it “ overwhelms “ the NHS as was predicted and yes I’ve just saw your breaking post about an increase in hospital admissions by 27% in England . Are they “ overwhelmed “ due to this ? 

The "rules" I was responding to BJ about were those on "self isolation".  

 

I don't think NHS England will be "overwhelmed" as yet, but watch the direction of travel.  I'm sure Boris will have  a number in mind which, if exceeded, will trigger the introduction of further restrictions/guidelines.  It may actually be a collection of numbers, e.g. 10,000, 12,000  hopitalisations, 150k daily cases, 200 deaths or whatever.

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The Mighty Thor
2 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Weird how Scotland/Wales are broadly in step with major European countries but because it's out of step with London we get these accusations. It's almost as if London has got it right and everyone else in the UK and Europe is wrong. 

The families of the 170,000 odd who have died would probably conclude London hasn't got it right.

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2 hours ago, Savage Vince said:

 

I know someone who works for the NHS in Manchester and she would challenge that. 

I know a consultant who works for the NHS in Bolton. They are adamant it is not being sold off. They all cannot be correct.

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20 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

I think Boris is treating the English like adults and giving them the choice to do what's necessary to lighten the risk.

 

It's easily avoided if you really want to avoid it.

 

 

Chief mammy and the snp policies are underpinned by Infantilisation / creating dependency so it’s no surprise about their covid approach . 

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Dusk_Till_Dawn

Bozza keeping new year alive

 

Sturgeon draining the fun from life, which seems to be her only talent (apart from forgetting inconvenient things)

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1 hour ago, highlandjambo3 said:

No, nothing to worry about, the people off sick aren’t dying at home are they? They are being guided by the rules for being positive which is self isolation.  There is not a total denial of the effect this variant is having on the NHS because their staff (who are not dying) are not at work to tend to patients (who are also not dying), it’s well documented that the NHS are struggling with this because of the current rules.  The NHS are short staffed, as they have been for a very long time, bodies are not piling up.

 

Lets take it back a bit to this “tidal” wave that was about to flatten us.  Is was mutes at the outset that this variant may not be as serious as initially thought but, wheeling in all the “prophet of doom” experts has gotten the government and us to shit ourselves again.  Now it’s looking like it’s all a wet flannel…..now no one in the government has the balls to stand up and say we may have over reacted but, did what we thought was best at the time.  If the government did a U turn things would likely settle down but they won’t simply because the politicians would all be sniping at each other again.

 

COVID can GTF

 

The nick of this. 😃

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manaliveits105
16 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

Bozza keeping new year alive

 

Sturgeon draining the fun from life, which seems to be her only talent (apart from forgetting inconvenient things)

Guy getting arrested for the sign up for sturgeons party night lark 

says it all about those funsters 

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49 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

I think Boris is treating the English like adults and giving them the choice to do what's necessary to lighten the risk.

 

It's easily avoided if you really want to avoid it.

 

 

:facepalm:

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1 hour ago, highlandjambo3 said:

No, nothing to worry about, the people off sick aren’t dying at home are they? They are being guided by the rules for being positive which is self isolation.  There is not a total denial of the effect this variant is having on the NHS because their staff (who are not dying) are not at work to tend to patients (who are also not dying), it’s well documented that the NHS are struggling with this because of the current rules.  The NHS are short staffed, as they have been for a very long time, bodies are not piling up.

 

Lets take it back a bit to this “tidal” wave that was about to flatten us.  Is was mutes at the outset that this variant may not be as serious as initially thought but, wheeling in all the “prophet of doom” experts has gotten the government and us to shit ourselves again.  Now it’s looking like it’s all a wet flannel…..now no one in the government has the balls to stand up and say we may have over reacted but, did what we thought was best at the time.  If the government did a U turn things would likely settle down but they won’t simply because the politicians would all be sniping at each other again.

 

COVID can GTF

The state of this. 

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Brighton Jambo
1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

News update - Hospitalisations in England are now 8,474, up 27% over a week.

And yet the peak last January in England was over 34,000 so in really good shape and absolutely no need for restrictions as it’s stands despite cases being highest ever for a couple of weeks.  Also ICU numbers are lowest for more than two months.  

 

Also we know that a percentage of those are in hospital with Covid not from it so that reduces the risks even further. We also know that Omicron related hospital stays are significantly less.  
 

 

 

 

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Nucky Thompson
31 minutes ago, Savage Vince said:

 

The nick of this. 😃

 

10 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The state of this. 

Multiple accounts. Weakened offender will be along in a minute

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6 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

And yet the peak last January in England was over 34,000 so in really good shape and absolutely no need for restrictions as it’s stands despite cases being highest ever for a couple of weeks.  Also ICU numbers are lowest for more than two months.  

 

Also we know that a percentage of those are in hospital with Covid not from it so that reduces the risks even further. We also know that Omicron related hospital stays are significantly less.  
 

 

 

 

I feel much more relaxed now about Covid. 

Now that the medical experts of JKB have reassured me. 

Anyone would think they knew what they were talking about. 

Nothing to worry about😏

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Nucky Thompson
1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

The only difference between the UK and SG "rules" is that the self isolation period in England is 7 days as opposed to 10. 

 

I had hoped that the SG would reduce the isolation period or allow a specified number of days with negative tests to enable people to exit isolation.

 

Are the measures "draconian" as you describe them or a rational, although unwelcome, response to slow the spread of the virus?   

In Scotland you have to isolate for 10 days if a family member tests positive regardless of anything.

In England if a family member tests positive, you need a negative PCR test and daily LFT's to avoid isolation 

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Footballfirst
15 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

Also we know that a percentage of those are in hospital with Covid not from it so that reduces the risks even further. We also know that Omicron related hospital stays are significantly less.  

From the Beeb:

 

Latest figures also showed there were 8,474 people with Covid currently in hospital in England - the highest since March, but well below last winter's peak of more than 34,000. Not all the patients in hospital will be being treated for Covid - about three in 10, according to latest data, have Covid but are in hospital for something else.

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1 minute ago, Footballfirst said:

From the Beeb:

 

Latest figures also showed there were 8,474 people with Covid currently in hospital in England - the highest since March, but well below last winter's peak of more than 34,000. Not all the patients in hospital will be being treated for Covid - about three in 10, according to latest data, have Covid but are in hospital for something else.

 

Do we know the mix of vaccinated/unvaccinated in hospital and ICUs?

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Nucky Thompson
1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

News update - Hospitalisations in England are now 8,474, up 27% over a week.

What are the numbers in ICU this morning?

The last update on the 22nd was 842, down from 888 a week earlier 

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Footballfirst
4 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

In Scotland you have to isolate for 10 days if a family member tests positive regardless of anything.

In England if a family member tests positive, you need a negative PCR test and daily LFT's to avoid isolation 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance/stay-at-home-guidance-for-households-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection

 

According to the current guidance, it's still 10 days in England, but can be reduced to 7 days with negative tests on days 6 and 7. See the document above for the full explanation of what's required (last updated 24/12).

 

What has changed

The self-isolation advice for people with coronavirus (COVID-19) has changed. It is now possible to end self-isolation after 7 days, following 2 negative LFD tests taken 24 hours apart. The first LFD test should not be taken before the sixth day.

  

 

 

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Footballfirst
6 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

What are the numbers in ICU this morning?

The last update on the 22nd was 842, down from 888 a week earlier 

I don't think they have been published as yet. I have posted in the last few days that ICU use is still drifting down, but with the last week's rise in hospitalisations I would expect it to bottom out and start increasing slowly. 

 

Based on what we have heard from recent studies, I don't think ICU numbers will become unmanageable in this wave.

Edited by Footballfirst
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Nucky Thompson
1 minute ago, Footballfirst said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-stay-at-home-guidance/stay-at-home-guidance-for-households-with-possible-coronavirus-covid-19-infection

 

According to the current guidance, it's still 10 days in England, but can be reduced to 7 days with negative tests on days 6 and 7. See the document above for the full explanation of what's required (last updated 24/12).

 

What has changed

The self-isolation advice for people with coronavirus (COVID-19) has changed. It is now possible to end self-isolation after 7 days, following 2 negative LFD tests taken 24 hours apart. The first LFD test should not be taken before the sixth day.

  

 

 

That's for confirmed infection not close contact 

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Footballfirst
1 minute ago, Nucky Thompson said:

That's for confirmed infection not close contact 

I think it also covers household contacts, otherwise it's 10 days.

 

From the same publication:

Household contacts who are required to self-isolate

If you live in the same household as someone with COVID-19, and you are aged over 18 years and 6 months and not fully vaccinated, you are legally required to self-isolate. This does not apply if you have taken part in or are currently part of an approved COVID-19 vaccine trial or you are not able to get vaccinated for medical reasons. Do not go to work, school, or public areas and do not use public transport or taxis.

Your isolation period includes the day the first person in your household’s symptoms started (or the day their test was taken if they did not have symptoms) and the next 10 full days. This means that if, for example, your 10 day isolation period starts on the 15th of the month, your isolation period ends at 23:59 hrs on the 25th and you can return to your normal routine.

You may be entitled to a payment of £500 from your local authority under the Test and Trace Support Payment scheme. If you are the parent or guardian of a child who has been told to self-isolate, you may also be entitled to this payment.

Failure to comply with self-isolation may result in a fine, starting from £1,000. Parents or guardians are legally responsible for ensuring that anyone under 18 self-isolates if they test positive for COVID-19 and are contacted by NHS Test and Trace and told to self-isolate.

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7 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

I think it also covers household contacts, otherwise it's 10 days.

 

From the same publication:

Household contacts who are required to self-isolate

If you live in the same household as someone with COVID-19, and you are aged over 18 years and 6 months and not fully vaccinated, you are legally required to self-isolate. This does not apply if you have taken part in or are currently part of an approved COVID-19 vaccine trial or you are not able to get vaccinated for medical reasons. Do not go to work, school, or public areas and do not use public transport or taxis.

Your isolation period includes the day the first person in your household’s symptoms started (or the day their test was taken if they did not have symptoms) and the next 10 full days. This means that if, for example, your 10 day isolation period starts on the 15th of the month, your isolation period ends at 23:59 hrs on the 25th and you can return to your normal routine.

You may be entitled to a payment of £500 from your local authority under the Test and Trace Support Payment scheme. If you are the parent or guardian of a child who has been told to self-isolate, you may also be entitled to this payment.

Failure to comply with self-isolation may result in a fine, starting from £1,000. Parents or guardians are legally responsible for ensuring that anyone under 18 self-isolates if they test positive for COVID-19 and are contacted by NHS Test and Trace and told to self-isolate.

 

 

If you're vaccinated you don't have to do anything 👍

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  • davemclaren changed the title to Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

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