Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Taffin]

7 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

If the vaccines prevent you from catching covid in the first place for up to 95% of people, then you can't pass on what you can't catch, except if your in that small 5% or so, or you haven't had the vaccine, so the more people who have the vaccine the more protection for the whole population would surely follow, wouldn't it?

 

That's kind of what I'm saying, if they can prove that, great. Currently (and correct me if I'm wrong), they've only proven that it prevents you getting seriously ill with Covid rather than preventing you catching Sars-Cov2

[Victorian]

The people doing the vaccinations are pretty much the first to get the vaccine.  I have no issue with that at all but it's a bit curious.  These people wont have their protection for about a month (a week after 2nd jab) so presumably they'll be vaccinating others before they acquire their own immunity.  Seems a bit odd and purpose defeating.

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, AlimOzturk said:

WTF are you talking about?

 

The old and vulnerable are at a high risk of dying if they contracted Covid 19. Healthy people aren’t so stop talking shite. 
 

 

The fact that you think healthy people aren’t in danger of dying from Covid 19 shows a level of ignorance not only widespread in this thread but also the general public. Is it any wonder the virus keeps spreading. I could share a thousand links showing this but whats the point with a lost cause like yourself. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 minutes ago, Victorian said:

The people doing the vaccinations are pretty much the first to get the vaccine.  I have no issue with that at all but it's a bit curious.  These people wont have their protection for about a month (a week after 2nd jab) so presumably they'll be vaccinating others before they acquire their own immunity.  Seems a bit odd and purpose defeating.

Do the NHS workers who administer the flu jab get it first too, if so it’s just procedure. They will be using PPE when giving out the vaccine whether they’ve had it or not. 

[redjambo]

6 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

That's kind of what I'm saying, if they can prove that, great. Currently (and correct me if I'm wrong), they've only proven that it prevents you getting seriously ill with Covid rather than preventing you catching Sars-Cov2

 

That's the way all vaccines work though, as far as I am aware. They don't prevent the virus from entering you, they just make your body far more capable of fighting it if it does. And I would imagine that it does that at a stage that is well before the virus takes over your body enough to be infectious through your bodily emissions.

 

However, even if you're vaccinated, if someone with Covid spreads the virus to you by e.g. shaking your hand and you shake hands with someone else straight afterwards, to give one scenario, then you'll no doubt be able to transmit the virus on your hand to someone else. No amount of vaccines will prevent onward transmission like that.

[frankblack]

Having seen today's briefing my guess is Tier 4 goes to 3 and Edinburgh stays on 3 until the new year.

[redjambo]

8 minutes ago, Victorian said:

The people doing the vaccinations are pretty much the first to get the vaccine.  I have no issue with that at all but it's a bit curious.  These people wont have their protection for about a month (a week after 2nd jab) so presumably they'll be vaccinating others before they acquire their own immunity.  Seems a bit odd and purpose defeating.

 

Can we afford to delay a month though before immunising everyone else? Those administering the vaccines will be presumably following tight protocols that will minimise viral transmission to/from those being vaccinated. However, that transmission risk gets reduced markedly if the vaccine givers are themselves vaccinated. So, better to start the vaccine process with them first. Makes sense.

[Konrad von Carstein]

39 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

She loathes to give out good news , her face tripping her today when giving out stats 

Hyperbolic bull shite, wtf has happened to you recently?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

28 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

That's kind of what I'm saying, if they can prove that, great. Currently (and correct me if I'm wrong), they've only proven that it prevents you getting seriously ill with Covid rather than preventing you catching Sars-Cov2

 

Yeh, I think you are right.

[gjcc]

49 minutes ago, jonesy said:

It means I get pished only around people I care about. 

 

(not saying you look like Petrie!)

[graygo]

47 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

She loathes to give out good news , her face tripping her today when giving out stats 

 

You're losing the plot mate.

[frankblack]

13 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Can we afford to delay a month though before immunising everyone else? Those administering the vaccines will be presumably following tight protocols that will minimise viral transmission to/from those being vaccinated. However, that transmission risk gets reduced markedly if the vaccine givers are themselves vaccinated. So, better to start the vaccine process with them first. Makes sense.

 

I'd imagine the vaccination programme is limited by the supply and the fact that Pfizer is the only licensed vaccine they have.  Remember that each patient needs two injections within a short time period (2 weeks?).

 

The hope is that other vaccines the UK government bought into get licensed as the supply of Pfizer runs out.

[Harry Potter]

53 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

I've never had a card for the flu jab, and I'm unaware of anyone I know having a card as well.

My wife did get a slip to pass on to her GP to update their records, no card.

[frankblack]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

I think he did early doors when he was rubbing down his beans (oo-er!), but strikes me as one of the saner posters now 😛 

 

Haven't got time to listen/watch the Sturge Report, but did she rule out any current T3s going up?

 

I switched on late but that didn't seem to be on the cards.  The general tone of being cautious leading up to Christmas makes me feel Edinburgh is about to get shafted again.

[frankblack]

Just now, Harry Potter said:

My wife did get a slip to pass on to her GP to update their records, no card.

 

I got my records updated from the chemist via their computer, but the chemist at East Craigs is pretty much a supply store for the GP a couple of hundred yards down the road.

[frankblack]

In other news Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds gig for the Hydro rescheduled to next year has been cancelled.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 minutes ago, Harry Potter said:

My wife did get a slip to pass on to her GP to update their records, no card.

 

I've always (as almost everybody here does) had mine done at my GP's so the records are updated there & then.

[graygo]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

I think he did early doors when he was rubbing down his beans (oo-er!), but strikes me as one of the saner posters now 😛 

 

Haven't got time to listen/watch the Sturge Report, but did she rule out any current T3s going up?

 

His mental state has mirrored the graph showing covid cases, started off normal then went way off the scale before dropping to something approaching normality then started rising again to get to where it is today. Hopefully he can drop back down to pre-covid levels soon.

 

 

She never ruled anything out, apart from confirming tier 4 areas will come out of tier 4 she said nothing. It will be decided and announced tomorrow as has always been the plan.

 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

10 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I think he did early doors when he was rubbing down his beans (oo-er!), but strikes me as one of the saner posters now 😛 

 

Haven't got time to listen/watch the Sturge Report, but did she rule out any current T3s going up?

Thanks Jonesy 👍 perfect summary I’m far from losing the plot . Just more enlightened now plus my recent experience with my “ urgent “ referral to the NHS was personal evidence that the NHS is not up to speed with non covid health issues , despite the lies sorry “ information”  from the SG 

[redjambo]

9 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I think he did early doors when he was rubbing down his beans (oo-er!), but strikes me as one of the saner posters now 😛 

 

Haven't got time to listen/watch the Sturge Report, but did she rule out any current T3s going up?

 

I have to admit that I too anti-bacterially wiped my shopping for the first wee while. James, however, was the one who had the bollocks to admit it. Given the paucity of data and information related to the transmission of the virus in the early days (which still exists to a certain extent), it wasn't that odd a thing to do at all, imo. Peace of mind for a few minutes rubbing. He took some flak for it though, or at least a good measure of healthy ribbing.

[redjambo]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Ooh - harsh! I'd say he has shown remarkable progress, and is now effectively in a Tier 0 state  

 

I wouldn't be surprised if some kind of 'Tier 3+' was announced for certain, high-case areas. While it would represent a pragmatic approach, I do think it would show up the Tier system as NFFP. However, que sera sera.

 

The reduction in the case rates in the Tier 4's has been solid and significant. Scotland has also consistently had a lower case rate than the rest of the UK for a good while now. NFFP my arse. It's just tough finding the best balance.

[redjambo]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

No worries, J. However, having me - the most selfish, arrogant, ignorant and wantonly dangerous poster on here, according to some - describe you as one of the saner ones might actually be the worst compliment anyone has ever received   

 

Agreed.

[graygo]

2 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Ooh - harsh! I'd say he has shown remarkable progress, and is now effectively in a Tier 0 state  

 

I wouldn't be surprised if some kind of 'Tier 3+' was announced for certain, high-case areas. While it would represent a pragmatic approach, I do think it would show up the Tier system as NFFP. However, que sera sera.

 

Not harsh at all. Anybody who honestly believes a countries leader desperately wants to announce bad news and actually looks visibly upset when they have good news to report has lost the plot imo.

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

A forum full of ****ing tin washers and murderers. 

 

Who's been murdering tins?! That would indeed be beyond the pale.

[JudyJudyJudy]

6 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

Not harsh at all. Anybody who honestly believes a countries leader desperately wants to announce bad news and actually looks visibly upset when they have good news to report has lost the plot imo.

I take it back !!! Her face is always tripping her regardless of good or bad news . She must know that it takes. Lot of effort and muscles to crack a smile 😃 

[JudyJudyJudy]

11 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

I have to admit that I too anti-bacterially wiped my shopping for the first wee while. James, however, was the one who had the bollocks to admit it. Given the paucity of data and information related to the transmission of the virus in the early days (which still exists to a certain extent), it wasn't that odd a thing to do at all, imo. Peace of mind for a few minutes rubbing. He took some flak for it though, or at least a good measure of healthy ribbing.

Oh yes I got pelters for that but least it gave the other message washers the courage to “ come out “ too 😂😂😂 there were a couple others . Yes that period was a high level stress time for me and everyone else . But we got through it and things are certainly looking much better now 👍👍

[JudyJudyJudy]

14 minutes ago, jonesy said:

No worries, J. However, having me - the most selfish, arrogant, ignorant and wantonly dangerous poster on here, according to some - describe you as one of the saner ones might actually be the worst compliment anyone has ever received   

Yes we have been singled out several times ! I f do take it as a compliment 👍👍👍

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, JamesM48 said:

I take it back !!! Her face is always tripping her regardless of good or bad news . She must know that it takes. Lot of effort and muscles to crack a smile 😃 

 

Regardless of politics, I can't think that it has been an easy task trying to negotiate a country through a pandemic over such a prolonged period of time. She must have been and still be stressed to the max. She deserves a break, imo, on whether she smiles or not at press conferences. I personally couldn't smile while folk are still dying, getting ill and suffering financially and psychologically due to the pandemic and the restrictions.

[redjambo]

Scottish numbers: 7 December 2020

Summary

• 677 new cases of COVID-19 reported [+34]
• 1 new reported death(s) of people who have tested positive [-4]
• 59 people were in intensive care yesterday with recently confirmed COVID-19 [-3]
• 974 people were in hospital yesterday with recently confirmed COVID-19 [+23]
• 11,521 new tests for COVID-19 that reported results – 6.7% of these were positive [-3.269; +1.5%]

[Pasquale for King]

6 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Regardless of politics, I can't think that it has been an easy task trying to negotiate a country through a pandemic over such a prolonged period of time. She must have been and still be stressed to the max. She deserves a break, imo, on whether she smiles or not at press conferences. I personally couldn't smile while folk are still dying, getting ill and suffering financially and psychologically due to the pandemic and the restrictions.

She would be getting pelters for not taking it seriously if she smiled all the time. I know I love it when people say “smile” but it happens to women far more often. 
 

[redjambo]

3 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I'd agree re the balance issue. But the people I speak to daily - most of whom are well-educated but working in hospitality on zero hour contracts as they establish themselves in the country - are starting to get desperate, work, money, and mental health-wise. 

 

I know. I completely appreciate that. It's a complete fecker. But we still have to beat this pandemic, and letting it run riot wasn't an option. Whichever way it was going to be played out, folk were going to lose out. I still think that we'll find out at the end that the countries who went in quicker and harder, employed backwards tracing, and then tried to keep their countries as much "closed system" as possible, will be the ones who managed to control the virus effectively enough in order to minimise the knock-on damage to the general public, but I'm sure that will all come out in the wash.

[redjambo]

Today's per-board, per-100,000 case stats:

 

Scotland 12 [=].

 

Forth Valley 17 [+5], Lanarkshire 16 [-3], Ayrshire 15 [-4], Greater Glasgow 15 [-1], Fife 14 [-2], Lothian 13 [+6], Grampian 11 [+3].

 

All others: less than 10.

[JudyJudyJudy]

11 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I'd agree re the balance issue. But the people I speak to daily - most of whom are well-educated but working in hospitality on zero hour contracts as they establish themselves in the country - are starting to get desperate, work, money, and mental health-wise. 

Yes it’s really biting them now as even with level 2 restrictions some bars will

still not be able to open as they don’t sell food . Pubs like “ Dickens “ which made a great effort with shields , track and trace etc can kiss the rest of the year goodbye and probably fold 😪

[CavySlaveJambo]

1 hour ago, Taffin said:

 

That's kind of what I'm saying, if they can prove that, great. Currently (and correct me if I'm wrong), they've only proven that it prevents you getting seriously ill with Covid rather than preventing you catching Sars-Cov2

If they sort the trial results out, it actually looks like the Oxford Vaccine does prevent illness in most cases.  They actually tested for SARS-CoV-2 during the trials, 

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Regardless of politics, I can't think that it has been an easy task trying to negotiate a country through a pandemic over such a prolonged period of time. She must have been and still be stressed to the max. She deserves a break, imo, on whether she smiles or not at press conferences. I personally couldn't smile while folk are still dying, getting ill and suffering financially and psychologically due to the pandemic and the restrictions.

It’s not so much the smiling or lack of it ( which wound be inappropriate) it’s the lack of delivering positive news with optimism , she flounders on . Yes I know there hasn’t been a lot but she can at least rejoice at times . Can’t stand BJ but his optimism does shine through at times . 

[frankblack]

12 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I wonder if Edinburgh is going to suffer for the other Tier 2 areas that have shot up recently. Also with the schools closing they expect that to push numbers up and the five day bubble for Christmas. 
 

Edinburgh does seem to have had a raw deal, but the west have had tougher restrictions for longer. 

 

As I said above, Sturgeon repeatedly mentioned about taking the cautious approach at today's briefing and balancing the concessions announced at Christmas.

 

Suggests to me Edinburgh isn't going to move tiers.

[OmiyaHearts]

1 hour ago, Brian Dundas said:

I made a switch in my 30s from pubs to house over time. Probably mostly because I moved from West End of Glasgow and didn’t have great pubs near me. 

Dumbarton road is just an amazing stretch of road, if you enjoy a pint in the pub. I lived at the bottom of Crow Road for a year and had a blast in all the Dumbarton Road / Byers Road pubs.

 

Anyway back on topic - Sturgeon is a nazi etc etc

[Nucky Thompson]

It will be an absolute disgrace is Edinburgh doesn't move down to 2.

Should have been moved a couple of weeks ago

[OmiyaHearts]

6 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It will be an absolute disgrace is Edinburgh doesn't move down to 2.

Should have been moved a couple of weeks ago

If it does got to Tier 2, I'll be on the first train through from Glasgow. Canny mind the last time I had a pint in the pub.

 

Plus, I'm on holiday the week of 14th, a week long session on the cards!

[JudyJudyJudy]

14 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It will be an absolute disgrace is Edinburgh doesn't move down to 2.

Should have been moved a couple of weeks ago

It certainly will be Nucky 

[redjambo]

Latest per-council 7-day infection rates:

 

		7-day per-100,000 cases
Council Area	Tier	Today	Yesterday		Start of T4’s				5 Dec	4 Dec	3 Dec	2 Dec	1 Dec
Clackmannanshire	3	227	194	+33	165	+62			217	208	200	192	155
Argyll and Bute	2	166	176	-10	31	+135			173	182	79	77	77
Glasgow City	4	159	162	-3	235	-76			156	155	153	160	155
North Lanarkshire	4	156	152	+4	235	-79			153	159	159	170	176
Renfrewshire	4	155	152	+3	260	-105			158	162	179	206	194
North Ayrshire	3	144	139	+5	124	+20			136	137	131	140	128
South Lanarkshire	4	138	128	+10	233	-95			136	146	159	172	174
East Renfrewshire	4	137	154	-17	195	-58			150	156	164	169	155
East Ayrshire	4	132	123	+9	152	-20			121	114	118	118	115
West Lothian	4	116	116	0	193	-77			110	114	130	132	127
Fife	3	111	105	+6	116	-5			101	103	103	107	99
Dundee City	3	110	104	+6	102	+8			101	96	98	92	92
East Dunbartonshire	4	105	110	-5	161	-56			101	100	113	121	117
South Ayrshire	4	100	103	-3	153	-53			101	103	100	114	125
Midlothian	3	94	82	+12	101	-7			86	83	88	86	65
Perth and Kinross	3	94	89	+5	116	-22			100	100	102	97	93
Aberdeenshire	2	88	92	-4	64	+24			90	91	92	87	93
Stirling	4	83	70	+13	210	-127			84	94	99	124	123
Aberdeen City	2	80	66	+14	51	+29			73	64	65	71	90
Falkirk	3	79	76	+3	85	-6			68	62	57	59	58
Edinburgh City	3	77	70	+7	84	-7			72	67	63	68	69
East Lothian	2	76	71	+5	48	+28			66	63	56	49	48
West Dunbartonshire	4	76	70	+6	142	-66			87	89	85	94	89
Angus	3	62	67	-5	88	-26			64	66	66	62	62
Inverclyde	3	59	67	-8	99	-40			57	55	64	90	87
Scottish Borders	2	40	37	+3	74	-34			35	35	34	33	33
Dumfries & Galloway	2	26	23	+3	34	-8			21	20	21	21	21
Moray	1	16	14	+2	25	-9			11	11	14	11	9
Na h-Eileanan Siar	1	15	15	0	0	+15			15	15	22	22	22
Highland	1	10	18	-8	19	-9			17	20	18	18	19
Orkney Islands	1	4	4	0	4	0			4	4	4	9	9
Shetland Islands	1	4	4	0	13	-9			4	4	4	9	17
Scotland		105	99	+6	135	-30			101	101	101	106	105

[graygo]

9 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said:

If it does got to Tier 2, I'll be on the first train through from Glasgow. Canny mind the last time I had a pint in the pub.

 

Plus, I'm on holiday the week of 14th, a week long session on the cards!

 

It's the fear of the weegie masses doing this that is making them shite it from moving Edinburgh into tier 2.

[steve123]

No way they can move the others down to tier 3 and keep Edinburgh there, if they do then their Tier system is fecked and loses all credibility

[Fxxx the SPFL]

3 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

A question ? So can “ outside “

 be defined as pubs which have an out side area with a roof covering it ? Like the Murrayfid sports bar ? 

yep i was in the Ship in Melrose on Friday they have an outside seated area that's covered but open at one side and you can bevvy until 9.30then drink up and out by ten.

[redjambo]

16 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It will be an absolute disgrace is Edinburgh doesn't move down to 2.

Should have been moved a couple of weeks ago

 

Two weeks ago, Edinburgh was rated as High as regards test positivity and Medium as regards infection rate. Last week, the infection rate (Medium) was the only indicator above Low, but no changes were made anywhere due to the recent data hole.

 

"Because we deserve it" doesn't cut the mustard. There's a chance that Edinburgh will be moved down to tier 2 tomorrow, imo, but the data has to support it.

[Nucky Thompson]

2 minutes ago, steve123 said:

No way they can move the others down to tier 3 and keep Edinburgh there, if they do then their Tier system is fecked and loses all credibility

It's never had any credibility to start with

[Fxxx the SPFL]

27 minutes ago, Nucky Thompson said:

It will be an absolute disgrace is Edinburgh doesn't move down to 2.

Should have been moved a couple of weeks ago

less positive cases than east lothian on saturday

[redjambo]

6 minutes ago, jonesy said:

Probably, although there is an aspect of cultural expectations/traditions in there that make it realistic or not to impose certain levels of restrictions.

 

Still, I think we'd both agree that it's not a black or white situation in regards to restrictions being +ve/-ve, although I'd go further and suggest that we'll never really know which countries have 'won' or 'lost' the 'fight' given the huge number of variables involved. With the vaccine imminent, we can only hope that both excess deaths and economic damage are minimised in the future. Both have been too high thus far.

 

 

Yup, the cultural expectations and traditions in Australia and New Zealand can be a bit strange at times. I mean, they drink Fosters and all that...!

 

Agree with the bit in bold - hopefully brighter days ahead.

 

[Nucky Thompson]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

 

Two weeks ago, Edinburgh was rated as High as regards test positivity and Medium as regards infection rate. Last week, the infection rate (Medium) was the only indicator above Low, but no changes were made anywhere due to the recent data hole.

 

"Because we deserve it" doesn't cut the mustard. There's a chance that Edinburgh will be moved down to tier 2 tomorrow, imo, but the data has to support it.

The outbreak at HWU had something to do with the test positivity being falsely high.

According to the link that was posted last night, the SG have been advised that Edinburgh meets all the criteria for moving down.

 

[redjambo]

Just now, Nucky Thompson said:

The outbreak at HWU had something to do with the test positivity being falsely high.

According to the link that was posted last night, the SG have been advised that Edinburgh meets all the criteria for moving down.

 

I didn't see that link. Cheers, Nucky. Good to learn that.