Levein’s time is up...

[Rudy T]

I can’t be the only one who is bored with these endless threads arguing the same points over and over. It’s clear as day we are falling short in the league, we see changes to the team every single game even if the same players are available, we have a ridiculous amount of players especially midfielders, our talented youth players are missing out and not getting regular game time. The football is awful to watch at times and we rely on Naismith far too much. So that’s what we all know.

 

Heres the reality check we’re in the semi final of the cup and hanging on to the top six, so Ann Budge isn’t removing Craig Levein from the mangers job anytime soon. If we progress in the cup then can we just accept CL will lead out the team for that game. 

 

The time for change is the end of the season. Give a new management team the transfer window to fill the obvious gaps in the team but also someone with a track record of playing and improving young players.

 

I want CL to walk away gracefully he’s given a lot to the club over the years so I’d much prefer he steps down returns to running the academy and general football structure and stays out of first team affairs. He’s a board member and having a guy like that on the board is no bad thing.

[Governor Tarkin]

25 minutes ago, Rudy T said:

 

I want CL to walk away gracefully he’s given a lot to the club over the years so I’d much prefer he steps down returns to running the academy and general football structure and stays out of first team affairs. He’s a board member and having a guy like that on the board is no bad thing.

 

Agreed.

[Bull's-eye]

It's clear as day he isn't going anywhere, that's the reality.

 

A fine thing as well. 

 

Start of the seasons targets 1. European Football. 2. Hampden appearances.

 

9 other clubs in the SPFL extremely jealous of target number 2. 

 

Like I said, he's going nowhere soon so I'm going to enjoy it. 

 

 

[William H. Bonney]

2 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

It's clear as day he isn't going anywhere, that's the reality.

 

A fine thing as well. 

 

Start of the seasons targets 1. European Football. 2. Hampden appearances.

 

9 other clubs in the SPFL extremely jealous of target number 2. 

 

Like I said, he's going nowhere soon so I'm going to enjoy it. 

 

 

 

And what exactly are you enjoying? 

It can't be the football. 

[Deviskan]

If our current manager was someone with no previous affiliation to our club (never mind being a club legend)...then the reaction to the way we're playing and results would be way, way worse.

 

They would be hounded out the club...that in itself is telling (with some posters being blinded with maroon legend specs).

 

Essentially, because it's Craig he's getting an easier ride than some of our previous managers would have.

Edited March 19, 2019 by Deviskan

[JackLadd]

9 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

 

Like I said, he's going nowhere soon so I'm going to enjoy it. 

 

 

 

 

[thewiseone]

2 hours ago, David McCaig said:

The obvious change to make on Saturday was Uche for Mulraney.

 

I feel desperately sorry for Vanecek as Levein seems to be on a mission to strip him of any dignity, confidence and respect.

 

Good point re Vanecek however not sure if he will actually realise what he is doing.

 

Craig Levein can still be a success at Hearts and we can still lift the cup playing in a manner of free flowing attacking football I certainly wish to see, there is however  an if to this and that if is- if he has the will and desire to understand, learn and then adapt his philosophy. His present ways are ineffectual despite this though he has some remarkable qualities and strengths which have been hugely necessary in  taking  the club out of admin to its present place.

Learning how  what he says, does and acts currently influences his players would be a great starting point. Then adopt new approaches to positively influence them and  help to unearth their confidence, which may I add is not done by scraping 0 V 1 away wins at low positioned clubs. His current inability to do this is all there to see, this is not a criticism of him  more a opportunity for him to learn and develop himself, to do this he will need to admit to himself he has these gaps in his make up- admitting to these personal vulnerabilities can be difficult! He can change his perspective anytime and his team will be influenced immediately in a positive way , as boss of the organisation it is down to Anne Budge to seek out and provide the necessary training for him, rather than being in awe of him time to be a boss! 

[Rocky jamboa]

12 hours ago, Cruyff Turn said:

Why? Of course he is, he’s the DoF. If we The other people on the board run the business, marketing etc... None of them have a football background. 

One of the points made is that Ann won't get rid of craig as she knows nothing about the football side. It puts us in an awkward position if we are so reliant on one person for running the football operations side of things that no matter how bad a job he does, we can't get rid of him as no one else would know what to do! 

 

The DOF and manger should be (and usually is) a separate person. I would be happy for Craig to oversee the football side but surely even he can see a new manager/coach (or whatever you want to call it) is needed to take us forward. 

 

It doesnt make sense for him to hold all these different roles as he's only accountable to himself! 

[Rocky jamboa]

3 hours ago, David McCaig said:

The obvious change to make on Saturday was Uche for Mulraney.

 

I feel desperately sorry for Vanecek as Levein seems to be on a mission to strip him of any dignity, confidence and respect.

 

Or put uche or keena on with him for more support 

[DarthVodka]

I think Craig has now mellowed out too much for the job, especially after the health scare (and who can blame him)

 

Under his previous leadership stint he would have kicked the sh1te out of all 11 players at halftime at Hamilton (see previous incidents like punching dressing room doors and breaking bones in his hand)

[Bull's-eye]

22 minutes ago, Dino Velvet said:

 

And what exactly are you enjoying? 

It can't be the football. 

 

I love watching Hearts. 

Can't think of anything else I'd rather spend my spare time doing tbh.

 

Seriously bored all ready with the thought of International Football. 

Obviously it'll be scintillating stuff being Scotland's finest on show. It just doesn't float my boat like watching Hearts though.

 

 

[Boab]

19 minutes ago, Deviskan said:

If our current manager was someone with no previous affiliation to our club (never mind being a club legend)...then the reaction to the way we're playing and results would be way, way worse.

 

They would be hounded out the club...that in itself is telling (with some posters being blinded with maroon legend specs).

 

Essentially, because it's Craig he's getting an easier ride than some of our previous managers would have.

 

This time seven years ago we were going into a Scottish Cup QF Replay against St Mirren and we were sitting in 6th place in the League.

I don’t remember Paolo Sergio being hounded out at that point. 

He had no previous affiliation to the club.

Was the football better ?

Yes, probably but what do points make ?

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

But he's a ginger 

??

[Jambof3tornado]

5 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

I love watching Hearts. 

Can't think of anything else I'd rather spend my spare time doing tbh.

 

Seriously bored all ready with the thought of International Football. 

Obviously it'll be scintillating stuff being Scotland's finest on show. It just doesn't float my boat like watching Hearts though.

 

 

You cant possibly be loving watching Hearts of late. The product on the park has been hopeless at times??

[OmiyaHearts]

2 minutes ago, Boab said:

 

This time seven years ago we were going into a Scottish Cup QF Replay against St Mirren and we were sitting in 6th place in the League.

I don’t remember Paolo Sergio being hounded out at that point. 

He had no previous affiliation to the club.

Was the football better ?

Yes, probably but what do points make ?

Completely different circumstances and a ridiculous comparison.

[Boab]

Just now, OmiyaHearts said:

Completely different circumstances and a ridiculous comparison.

 Why ?

Sergio had won nothing at that point.

Nothing !

[Captain Canada]

Our record since October in the league is truly awful. We missed our targets last season and reaching two semi-finals shouldn't be viewed by anyone as a measure of success. I want to see us win trophies, not be satisfied getting to the last four. 

 

We've got a good core of players signed up for next season, but I can only see more of the same pedestrian, mediocre football and results if the manager and tactics don't change. 

 

I would be shocked if anything happened this season with Levein, but if we lose against ICT and finish 6th then I don't know what excuse he can have for not meeting expectations. Injuries have been brutal, but we have enough players at our disposal where we should be able to cope. 

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, Rudy T said:

I can’t be the only one who is bored with these endless threads arguing the same points over and over. It’s clear as day we are falling short in the league, we see changes to the team every single game even if the same players are available, we have a ridiculous amount of players especially midfielders, our talented youth players are missing out and not getting regular game time. The football is awful to watch at times and we rely on Naismith far too much. So that’s what we all know.

 

Heres the reality check we’re in the semi final of the cup and hanging on to the top six, so Ann Budge isn’t removing Craig Levein from the mangers job anytime soon. If we progress in the cup then can we just accept CL will lead out the team for that game. 

 

The time for change is the end of the season. Give a new management team the transfer window to fill the obvious gaps in the team but also someone with a track record of playing and improving young players.

 

I want CL to walk away gracefully he’s given a lot to the club over the years so I’d much prefer he steps down returns to running the academy and general football structure and stays out of first team affairs. He’s a board member and having a guy like that on the board is no bad thing.

The problem with that is he hired someone to run the academy, he’s not needed there. So what does that leave? Recruitment, do you want him in charge of that considering the deals he’s signed off on these last 5 years? No decent manager will put up with him as their DoF, as he said he can’t help interfering which is why he wants Daly to take over. Keep him on the board as an advisor on football matters but a new DoF needs to come in alongside his choice of manager/head coach.

[Pasquale for King]

27 minutes ago, thewiseone said:

Good point re Vanecek however not sure if he will actually realise what he is doing.

 

Craig Levein can still be a success at Hearts and we can still lift the cup playing in a manner of free flowing attacking football I certainly wish to see, there is however  an if to this and that if is- if he has the will and desire to understand, learn and then adapt his philosophy. His present ways are ineffectual despite this though he has some remarkable qualities and strengths which have been hugely necessary in  taking  the club out of admin to its present place.

Learning how  what he says, does and acts currently influences his players would be a great starting point. Then adopt new approaches to positively influence them and  help to unearth their confidence, which may I add is not done by scraping 0 V 1 away wins at low positioned clubs. His current inability to do this is all there to see, this is not a criticism of him  more a opportunity for him to learn and develop himself, to do this he will need to admit to himself he has these gaps in his make up- admitting to these personal vulnerabilities can be difficult! He can change his perspective anytime and his team will be influenced immediately in a positive way , as boss of the organisation it is down to Anne Budge to seek out and provide the necessary training for him, rather than being in awe of him time to be a boss! 

He’s not shown any evidence that he would do any of this I’m afraid, especially between now and the end of the season.

[OmiyaHearts]

7 minutes ago, Boab said:

 Why ?

Sergio had won nothing at that point.

Nothing !

His players weren't getting paid. 

[Jambof3tornado]

1 hour ago, BelgeJambo said:

If Levein goes then McPhee and Daly also go.

they are standing there every week trying to work out the tactics, so why would keeping them change anything.

Andy Kirk would be worth keeping imo

 

i like Lee Johnson at Bristol City but I don’t think we could tempt him from that job.

LJ is the kind of guy I'd like to see come in, not him specifically but a young guy with desire who has managed a few hundred games.

 

Plenty options in my opinion.

[sac]

Just finding it really difficult to see much evidence of the five year plan on the playing side of things from the academy to the first team progressing. Can anyone itk, tell us if any of our academy players are ready to be included in next seasons squad?

[Allowayjambo1874]

4 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said:

His players weren't getting paid. 

They weren’t even his players, he brought one player in during the winter transfer window, Craig Beattie.

 

ludicrous to compare Paulo Sérgio’s situation to Craig Levein’s

[Bull's-eye]

15 minutes ago, Jambof3tornado said:

You cant possibly be loving watching Hearts of late. The product on the park has been hopeless at times??

 

Seen worse, seen better. 

 

I remember when there was a real possible we would not have a club to support anymore.

Every time I'm feeling a little disgruntled I put my thoughts back to those days and how properly Shit they were and I soon realise things aren't as bad as they seem.

 

I also firmly believe that had Mrs Budge not stepped forward then that privilege we all have now would be a distant memory and if she believes in Craig Levein then that's fine by me. 

She has more credit in my mind than any of the loonies on here. 

[BigAlim]

3 minutes ago, Allowayjambo1874 said:

They weren’t even his players, he brought one player in during the winter transfer window, Craig Beattie.

 

ludicrous to compare Paulo Sérgio’s situation to Craig Levein’s

Was it not about March when beattie came in? Paulo had very little to work with in his time at the club but he got the best form out of some very ordinary players 

(he also had Rudi to bail us out though) 

[Enzo Chiefo]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

Seen worse, seen better. 

 

I remember when there was a real possible we would not have a club to support anymore.

Every time I'm feeling a little disgruntled I put my thoughts back to those days and how properly Shit they were and I soon realise things aren't as bad as they seem.

 

I also firmly believe that had Mrs Budge not stepped forward then that privilege we all have now would be a distant memory and if she believes in Craig Levein then that's fine by me. 

She has more credit in my mind than any of the loonies on here. 

"Loonies on here"? Were you not the poster who started the "disrespect thread"? Or is it only your hero Levein that deserves respect?

[OmiyaHearts]

6 minutes ago, Allowayjambo1874 said:

They weren’t even his players, he brought one player in during the winter transfer window, Craig Beattie.

 

ludicrous to compare Paulo Sérgio’s situation to Craig Levein’s

I know. I was going to do a point at a time, gradually showing the comparison to be a total joke!

 

 

 

 

[Allowayjambo1874]

2 minutes ago, BigAlim said:

Was it not about March when beattie came in? Paulo had very little to work with in his time at the club but he got the best form out of some very ordinary players 

(he also had Rudi to bail us out though) 

According to wiki (I know) it was 23rd Feb

[kila]

3 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Seen worse, seen better. 

 

I remember when there was a real possible we would not have a club to support anymore.

Every time I'm feeling a little disgruntled I put my thoughts back to those days and how properly Shit they were and I soon realise things aren't as bad as they seem.

 

I also firmly believe that had Mrs Budge not stepped forward then that privilege we all have now would be a distant memory and if she believes in Craig Levein then that's fine by me. 

She has more credit in my mind than any of the loonies on here. 

 

And when you run out of toilet roll you no doubt chuckle to yourself and think ‘well it was even worse back in the day!’

 

 

[Jambof3tornado]

3 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Seen worse, seen better. 

 

I remember when there was a real possible we would not have a club to support anymore.

Every time I'm feeling a little disgruntled I put my thoughts back to those days and how properly Shit they were and I soon realise things aren't as bad as they seem.

 

I also firmly believe that had Mrs Budge not stepped forward then that privilege we all have now would be a distant memory and if she believes in Craig Levein then that's fine by me. 

She has more credit in my mind than any of the loonies on here. 

But do you think another manager within our budget could do better with our squad? Are we underachieving?

[Jingle Bells]

11 minutes ago, BigAlim said:

Was it not about March when beattie came in? Paulo had very little to work with in his time at the club but he got the best form out of some very ordinary players 

(he also had Rudi to bail us out though) 

Aye agree, thought he and his coaching staff improved some pretty unpromising material immensely, which took time as a consequence.

[Rocky jamboa]

10 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

Seen worse, seen better. 

 

I remember when there was a real possible we would not have a club to support anymore.

Every time I'm feeling a little disgruntled I put my thoughts back to those days and how properly Shit they were and I soon realise things aren't as bad as they seem.

 

I also firmly believe that had Mrs Budge not stepped forward then that privilege we all have now would be a distant memory and if she believes in Craig Levein then that's fine by me. 

She has more credit in my mind than any of the loonies on here. 

How long do we play the "not have a club to support anymore" card? That was 5 years ago now. I can't see what effect that has on the current way we're playing and results. 

[Bull's-eye]

12 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

"Loonies on here"? Were you not the poster who started the "disrespect thread"? Or is it only your hero Levein that deserves respect?

 

Read the opening post on the thread you reference, it's pretty clear what I meant, if you're still struggling ask somebody to explain it to you.

[Boab]

12 minutes ago, BigAlim said:

Was it not about March when beattie came in? Paulo had very little to work with in his time at the club but he got the best form out of some very ordinary players 

(he also had Rudi to bail us out though) 

 

9 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said:

I know. I was going to do a point at a time, gradually showing the comparison to be a total joke!

 

 

 

 

 

Shite !

Very ordinary players ?

Paolo done a decent job at Hearts but if you look back to the post I was originally replying to, you’ll see the point I was making. 

Forget opinions, we were sitting 6th in the table with far, far better players than we have now.

Don’t look further than March 2012 because that’s not the point I was making.

 

[Bridge of Djoum]

3 hours ago, David McCaig said:

The obvious change to make on Saturday was Uche for Mulraney.

 

I feel desperately sorry for Vanecek as Levein seems to be on a mission to strip him of any dignity, confidence and respect.

 

Yeah, that’s what CL wants.

 

FFS. Will folk ever tire of making up this shit?

[Bull's-eye]

12 minutes ago, Jambof3tornado said:

But do you think another manager within our budget could do better with our squad? Are we underachieving?

 

As I don't know the budget and neither do you, the question is moot.

 

Could a different manager get better results, probably could, but paying someone £5-10m a year is probably not within our budget. 

 

 

[Bull's-eye]

7 minutes ago, Paulp74 said:

How long do we play the "not have a club to support anymore" card? That was 5 years ago now. I can't see what effect that has on the current way we're playing and results. 

 

Probably for the rest of my days tbh. 

 

Life's experiences should be learned from and thanks to the current holders of office that scenario will never happen again. 

[Morgan]

4 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

Yeah, that’s what CL wants.

 

FFS. Will folk ever tire of making up this shit?

I agree with you.

 

Could it not just simply be that Mr Vanecek is just “not awfy good’?

 

It’s not a new phenomenon.

[Boab]

Just now, Artful Dodger said:

 

Probably for the rest of my days tbh. 

 

Life's experiences should be learned from and thanks to the current holders of office that scenario will never happen again. 

 Correct. We can never forget those days.

We rallied round and saved our club.

Well said, mate.

[JamboGraham]

5 hours ago, Haken said:

I wonder is Levein will voluntarily stand down at the end of the season.  He can't be deaf to all that's going on, and on top of that he's already had one health scare.

 

Without being flippant he won't hear "all that's going on" if he doesn't frequent social media...

 

The Hearts support booing a poor result, performance or even a half isn't a new thing...the team got booed after 90 minutes and 120 minutes at Hampden in 2006, a few minutes later the team were lifting the Scottish Cup.

 

Yes there are moans and groans in the stand but there is none of the collective fury that generates chants of 'Manager X Out', etc. No collective chants towards the directors box, no supporters waiting outside the players entrance to challenge players and club officials. It might be coming but it isn't here yet...

 

Saturday was right up there in terms of apathetic displays and there were plenty of individual shouts but the only collective was about a dozen teenagers singing that the club was in the wrong hands.

 

Compare this to the Dunfermline league cup tie last season when it was clear that the supporters had lost patience with the manager and wanted change.

 

Change might be desired but it is not being expressed in a way that anyone not following social media would sit up and take notice of.

 

 

[Cruyff Turn]

2 hours ago, mitch41 said:

What would of put many potential managers from applying for the Hearts job after Cathro was 

sacked was the insistence that McPhee had to be Asst. Manager and that Daly, Fox ect had 

to be kept on. Now all these guys are Leveins men and this puts a new manager in an 

awkward position from day one. This whole thing of having a part-time DOF and a part-time 

Manager just hasn't worked. Short time fixing out Cathro/Levein's mess needed to be done 

but this mess we're in just now is down to bad planning. We have still got to deal with Levein 

wanting Jon Daly to take over when he leaves because remember after Cathro Levein wanted 

Daly to get the job and when he didn't that's when Levein, who had always said he wasn't 

interested, and had blocked all the other applicants got the managers job.

And how much would it cost for us to sack the entire coaching staff everytime we’re not happy with how things are going? 

 

A small fortune. 

 

One of our current coaches might be a good manager, it’s only been done with Neilson and he did well. 

 

1 hour ago, Paulp74 said:

One of the points made is that Ann won't get rid of craig as she knows nothing about the football side. It puts us in an awkward position if we are so reliant on one person for running the football operations side of things that no matter how bad a job he does, we can't get rid of him as no one else would know what to do! 

 

The DOF and manger should be (and usually is) a separate person. I would be happy for Craig to oversee the football side but surely even he can see a new manager/coach (or whatever you want to call it) is needed to take us forward. 

 

It doesnt make sense for him to hold all these different roles as he's only accountable to himself! 

I suppose it depends on whether you believe CL has the clubs best interests at heart or not. I’ve no reason to doubt he does and will step down when he thinks he can’t turn the situation around. 

 

I agree though, the DoF should be separate from the manager but as I said to Mitch, I think it’s down to money. 

[Haken]

11 minutes ago, JamboGraham said:

 

Without being flippant he won't hear "all that's going on" if he doesn't frequent social media...

 

The Hearts support booing a poor result, performance or even a half isn't a new thing...the team got booed after 90 minutes and 120 minutes at Hampden in 2006, a few minutes later the team were lifting the Scottish Cup.

 

Yes there are moans and groans in the stand but there is none of the collective fury that generates chants of 'Manager X Out', etc. No collective chants towards the directors box, no supporters waiting outside the players entrance to challenge players and club officials. It might be coming but it isn't here yet...

 

Saturday was right up there in terms of apathetic displays and there were plenty of individual shouts but the only collective was about a dozen teenagers singing that the club was in the wrong hands.

 

Compare this to the Dunfermline league cup tie last season when it was clear that the supporters had lost patience with the manager and wanted change.

 

Change might be desired but it is not being expressed in a way that anyone not following social media would sit up and take notice of.

 

 

Fair enough points.  But I'd be surprised if Levein isn't aware of the social media coverage through third parties. Unless, of course, he's issued a strict instruction that he doens't want to be told of anything that's being said on such platforms.

[Jamhammer]

35 minutes ago, Jambof3tornado said:

But do you think another manager within our budget could do better with our squad? Are we underachieving?

I’m beginning to think there are too many chiefs and not enough indians. I think we have a core of decent players but there is no consistency of selection (TBF injuries haven’t helped) and we’re a real Jekyll and Hyde team. More Hyde recently. There are times the players seem to lack spirit and fight, especially against the so called “lesser” teams. That’s not acceptable.

Something is not right. I dunno if the rumours about CL moving back upstairs due to his health is having an impact or what but, at times we look lost.

[Jambof3tornado]

26 minutes ago, Artful Dodger said:

 

As I don't know the budget and neither do you, the question is moot.

 

Could a different manager get better results, probably could, but paying someone £5-10m a year is probably not within our budget. 

 

 

We dont need 5 to 10 million to get better out of our current group of players.

[NANOJAMBO]

21 minutes ago, Cruyff Turn said:

And how much would it cost for us to sack the entire coaching staff everytime we’re not happy with how things are going? 

 

A small fortune. 

 

One of our current coaches might be a good manager, it’s only been done with Neilson and he did well. 

 

I suppose it depends on whether you believe CL has the clubs best interests at heart or not. I’ve no reason to doubt he does and will step down when he thinks he can’t turn the situation around. 

 

I agree though, the DoF should be separate from the manager but as I said to Mitch, I think it’s down to money. 

FFS, he's been there for nearly two full seasons as manager,  he says he doesn't know what to do to fix it.  This isn't an overnight sensation. 

[Cruyff Turn]

Just now, NANOJAMBO said:

FFS, he's been there for nearly two full seasons as manager,  he says he doesn't know what to do to fix it.  This isn't an overnight sensation. 

That’s not what he said at all. 

[NANOJAMBO]

Just now, Cruyff Turn said:

That’s not what he said at all. 

What did he say ?

[Boab]

8 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

What did he say ?

 You tell us.

You’re the one claiming he said something he didn’t.

[NANOJAMBO]

Just now, Boab said:

 You tell us.

You’re the one claiming he said something he didn’t.

You're the one claiming I'm wrong , so crack on and prove  it. 

[NANOJAMBO]

10 minutes ago, Cruyff Turn said:

That’s not what he said at all. 

"After the last couple of games I was hopeful we were back on track but we were lacking today in focus and aggression and I don’t know why."