Come on Ann get Cathro sacked ( merged )

[Peebo]

That's laughable stuff. But then some people thought Neilson was going to get us relegated as well.

Why is it laughable? Our form under Cathro is relegation standard.

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Why is it laughable? Our form under Cathro is relegation standard.

Wouldn't we be 12th from his games in charge of us?

[Peebo]

Wouldn't we be 12th from his games in charge of us?

Eh?

[kingantti1874]

That's laughable stuff. But then some people thought Neilson was going to get us relegated as well.

Why is it Laughable? It's based on a relatively long term trend..

 

I think you need to stop bringing Neilson into it.. You'd be lucky if 5% of fans didn't support him and that was because we kept being dominated by hibs..

[kingantti1874]

Wouldn't we be 12th from his games in charge of us?

Yep. Dead last

[socrates82]

Why is it laughable? Our form under Cathro is relegation standard.

 

Form doesn't carry over between two different seasons (I don't remember that being the case for Neilson anyhow - the moment things dipped after January 2016 the Championship and good start to the season were forgotten!) and we haven't even played a league game yet. 

[kingantti1874]

Eh?

Former the day he walked in the door.. Our points return was the lowest in the SPL 12TH

[Rudi5kaceldream1ng]

7 months and 3 relatively different squads all underachieving. The people accepting the last 7 months can do one. Go support East Stirling if you think that level of performance is good enough.

 

Probably the same folk slavering over a European game which we actually lost 5-0. Absolute hibs cuck behaviour.

[kingantti1874]

Form doesn't carry over between two different seasons (I don't remember that being the case for Neilson anyhow - the moment things dipped after January 2016 the Championship and good start to the season were forgotten!) and we haven't even played a league game yet.

Former doesn't carry over? Of course either doesm

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Former the day he walked in the door.. Our points return was the lowest in the SPL 12TH

Thank you.

[Peebo]

Form doesn't carry over between two different seasons (I don't remember that being the case for Neilson anyhow - the moment things dipped after January 2016 the Championship and good start to the season were forgotten!) and we haven't even played a league game yet.

We've just lost to Peterhead. Yes, Peterhead. There is nothing to suggest our piss poor form won't continue.

[Peebo]

Former the day he walked in the door.. Our points return was the lowest in the SPL 12TH

I get that. I was puzzled by the direction of that question at me.

[socrates82]

Why is it Laughable? It's based on a relatively long term trend..

 

I think you need to stop bringing Neilson into it.. You'd be lucky if 5% of fans didn't support him and that was because we kept being dominated by hibs..

 

Seriously I couldn't care less about last season. I do wipe the slate clean every new season for players and managers because it's amazing how things can change. And so far we've played 3 and won 2 and are still in every competition we've entered. So I'm fine with that at the same time as considering the Peterhead result an embarrassment for a team with our quality in it.

[Lucille's Thirsty]

I get that. I was puzzled by the direction of that question at me.

It's because you responded to Socrates82,

 

You said our form is relegation standard?

 

Can you not read or something?

[socrates82]

Former the day he walked in the door.. Our points return was the lowest in the SPL 12TH

 

Neilson had a 60% win rate and it wasn't enough for a surprising number of Hearts fans. The fact is some of our support won't be happy until Levein is gone and we return to the same manager in charge of everything situation as before. We should back Cathro. He's not going to get sacked after a bad league cup result. He will be sacked after 10 or so games like Peterhead or last season though. So which is better - trying to back the team to help win those games or throw the towel in and just moan and moan after every defeat? Levein is not going anywhere, some folk just need to deal with that and follow the team. I disliked Wallace Mercer for being a Tory and his whole "football as a business" approach and couldn't stand Romanov (despite kind of admiring his ambition) but I still backed the club.

[Notts1874]

Here's the question chaps.

 

Who goes. Cathro or Levein? Both isn't an option for this hypothetical question.

 

My answer is Levein.

[Peebo]

It's because you responded to Socrates82,

 

You said our form is relegation standard?

 

Can you not read or something?

I can read. I questioned why the prediction we would finish 11th was laughable.

 

I didn't make any predictions myself, yet you seemed to be questioning what I had predicted.

[Voice of reason]

Innovative appointments like Cathro/McPhee need time. I think it would be so wrong to give up on this without a fair bit of patience. Alex Ferguson would have lasted 6 months at Man United with some of the short-term thinking on view here. I'd rather give a young intelligent coach time than appoint a thick dinosaur like Neil Lennon even if that means the dinosaur winning the early battles. I hope Ann is brave and keeps the faith until at least Christmas. I think she will and I really hope it pays off long term. It's a risk but then so is switching manager every 6 months.

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

Here's the question chaps.

Who goes. Cathro or Levein? Both isn't an option for this hypothetical question.

My answer is Levein.

Cathro

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Neilson had a 60% win rate and it wasn't enough for a surprising number of Hearts fans. The fact is some of our support won't be happy until Levein is gone and we return to the same manager in charge of everything situation as before. We should back Cathro. He's not going to get sacked after a bad league cup result.

Neilson was a dead man walking we he mentioned the word "money spinner" after a championship Hibs pegged us back twice.

 

A PHM would be raging inside but like the club he was more interested in the money we were about to receive than the fact that he was just embarrassed by the vermin on our own patch.

[Cruyff Turn]

p

 

Fair post.. I think people have bitten because of who we lost to and the fact there was a lot of last season in the performancd.. Was an absolute shocker

It was but it was over the top, folk who have said nothing all summer coming out the woodwork to demand his head on a spike after one game. Calling for Leveins head after signing the likes of Berra and Lafferty & huge progress with the Academy, some even criticising Ann Budge, absolutely ridiculous stuff.

 

We've already beaten better teams than Peterhead so far. Dunfermline will certainly be our toughest test yet and then it doesn't get much more difficult than Celtic at Parkhead. I think those games will tell us all a lot more than a day off on Tuesday.

[Lucille's Thirsty]

I can read. I questioned why the prediction we would finish 11th was laughable.

 

I didn't make any predictions myself, yet you seemed to be questioning what I had predicted.

I was on your side Cathro's form as our manager had it been in one season would have seen us finished dead last.

[redm]

Craig's a Hearts man he must start to realise this,he's starting to become a pariah in this club that is just not willing to admit he's made a mistake.

I think a small vocal minority who don't like Levein would quite like him to become a pariah but for the majority, he's nowhere near it. I totally blame interweb echo chambers for perceptions like this. Forums especially, I suppose... [emoji51]

[Marooned in Sec Z]

Seriously I couldn't care less about last season. I do wipe the slate clean every new season for players and managers because it's amazing how things can change. And so far we've played 3 and won 2 and are still in every competition we've entered. So I'm fine with that at the same time as considering the Peterhead result an embarrassment for a team with our quality in it.

 

Why should we just forget about the shite we had to endure last season? It shouldn't just be magically forgotten as if it didn't happen. Yes we have won 3 out of 2 games, but can you honestly say we looked any different from the style we played last season? Struggled against Elgin, nothing great against East Fife and then beat from Peterhead. FFS look at those teams your using as a point to justify forgetting everything that has gone on before. Struggle again on Saturday and any confidence we had going into the new season has gone!

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

Here's the question chaps.

 

Who goes. Cathro or Levein? Both isn't an option for this hypothetical question.

 

My answer is Levein.

[Peebo]

Innovative appointments like Cathro/McPhee need time. I think it would be so wrong to give up on this without a fair bit of patience. Alex Ferguson would have lasted 6 months at Man United with some of the short-term thinking on view here. I'd rather give a young intelligent coach time than appoint a thick dinosaur like Neil Lennon even if that means the dinosaur winning the early battles. I hope Ann is brave and keeps the faith until at least Christmas. I think she will and I really hope it pays off long term. It's a risk but then so is switching manager every 6 months.

I've often seen language like "innovative" used to describe Cathro's. In what way do you think it was innovative? Genuine question...

[socrates82]

Neilson was a dead man walking we he mentioned the word "money spinner" after a championship Hibs pegged us back twice.

 

A PHM would be raging inside but like the club he was more interested in the money we were about to receive than the fact that he was just embarrassed by the vermin on our own patch.

 

Christ, that's just weird. Everyone knows Neilson wasn't exactly good with his words. He whispered his way through every press conference! Was he not just putting a positive spin on things? That was my take. I barely remember that interview other than folk going on about it. 

[Notts1874]

Didn't get your answer there caller. It's dead simple. Cathro or Levein?

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Christ, that's just weird. Everyone knows Neilson wasn't exactly good with his words. He whispered his way through every press conference! Was he not just putting a positive spin on things? That was my take. I barely remember that interview other than folk going on about it.

It's weird I know I like Neilson,thought he was a fine young manager but people wanted him gone for that performance and the subsequent replay at ER where we gave up without a fight.

[Hendricks]

The seeding is Europe teams plus best 4 group winners so we will not be seeded in next round so could get Livingston or Ayr

That is true but should we get through we could now get Celtic, Rangers or Aberdeen too which wouldn't have been the case had we managed to beat 3 pub teams and Dunfermline! We now face the possibility of a far more difficult last 16. Just another consequence of our sloppy and careless performance and lack of preparation for the new season.

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

What's your defence of Cathro?

 

Well if you forget about everything else including his inability it be a leader of anyone he's only lost to Peterhead and struggled at Elgin.

 

Heads well and truly in the sand. ****ing batshit.

[kingantti1874]

Didn't get your answer there caller. It's dead simple. Cathro or Levein?

Cathro.. Without doubt.. Because levein is at least adding value to the youth development structure..

[socrates82]

Why should we just forget about the shite we had to endure last season? It shouldn't just be magically forgotten as if it didn't happen. Yes we have won 3 out of 2 games, but can you honestly say we looked any different from the style we played last season? Struggled against Elgin, nothing great against East Fife and then beat from Peterhead. FFS look at those teams your using as a point to justify forgetting everything that has gone on before. Struggle again on Saturday and any confidence we had going into the new season has gone!

 

Our best season in the top league was 85/86. Take a look at the first few games of that season if you're not old enough to have seen them. Literally no-one though we would be anywhere near challenging for the title! And that was with a relatively inexperienced manager too. Amazing how things can change in football. That's why I backed Neilson to turn things around. he did much better than Doddie in his first couple of seasons as a manager. I back Cathro but have less confidence in him as he really hasn't;t shown he is capable of being a head coach (although we are told be people who have worked with him that he is a very good coach).

 

I'm willing to give him time this season but my opinion right now is he has the look of a very reliable and useful No. 2, like a Steve Clark or Eric Black type, rather than a leader of a team. He doesn't;t look comfortable in the No. 1 position to me, unlike someone like Neilson who took to it very quickly and seemed to have more confidence. I think that does rub off on players, which could be the problem with Cathro just now - he doesn't inspire confidence in fans or players. He is still learning so let's see..

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Didn't get your answer there caller. It's dead simple. Cathro or Levein?

I think you know the answer to you're own question there chief.

 

Levein should be the one pushing Cathro out the door.

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

Didn't get your answer there caller. It's dead simple. Cathro or Levein?

Well obviously I would prefer our worst manager in history to leave.

 

You were joking right?

[Notts1874]

Cathro.. Without doubt.. Because levein is at least adding value to the youth development structure..

I'm only playing devils advocate.....but that would put Levein in charge of the next head coach appointment.

[kingantti1874]

It was but it was over the top, folk who have said nothing all summer coming out the woodwork to demand his head on a spike after one game. Calling for Leveins head after signing the likes of Berra and Lafferty & huge progress with the Academy, some even criticising Ann Budge, absolutely ridiculous stuff.

 

We've already beaten better teams than Peterhead so far. Dunfermline will certainly be our toughest test yet and then it doesn't get much more difficult than Celtic at Parkhead. I think those games will tell us all a lot more than a day off on Tuesday.

People are demanding his head on a spike due to his record.. It's that simple.. There is no such thing as a clean slate, Cathro does not have one.. He has nowhere near the kudos required to withstand a defeat by Peterhead without taking a pasting

[Notts1874]

Well obviously I would prefer our worst manager in history to leave.

 

You were joking right?

Or the man who appointed him? I can see both sides.

[Lucille's Thirsty]

I'm only playing devils advocate.....but that would put Levein in charge of the next head coach appointment.

Surely he wouldn't have the balls to put Daly in charge?

 

Would he ?

[socrates82]

Or the man who appointed him? I can see both sides.

 

He also appointed Neilson though who was a success, so is that 1 good and 1 bad purely on results so far? Not exactly sackable, given what a lottery hiring a new manager can be.

 

Anyhow, Levein's job entails much more than that. If he does anywhere near the job he did with D Utd's youth set-up we should be doing everything we can to keep him. Signs so far are promising.

[kingantti1874]

I'm only playing devils advocate.....but that would put Levein in charge of the next head coach appointment.

Hes got a 50% success rate.. One more try

[socrates82]

I'm only playing devils advocate.....but that would put Levein in charge of the next head coach appointment.

 

With Budge's sign-off, so not totally in charge. Like many fans, she thought the Cathro appointment looked like a good idea. If he fails to show up well in the league, she may change her mind on that and press on Levein the need for a more experienced man.

[Notts1874]

Surely he wouldn't have the balls to put Daly in charge?

 

Would he ?

Probably not.....hopefully.

[socrates82]

People are demanding his head on a spike due to his record.. It's that simple.. There is no such thing as a clean slate, Cathro does not have one.. He has nowhere near the kudos required to withstand a defeat by Peterhead without taking a pasting

 

Which would accomplish what exactly?

[Notts1874]

Good points being made so far. Just looking to get a slightly more rounded debate.

 

Sometimes that means putting a binary choice down.

[kingantti1874]

Which would accomplish what exactly?

In any walk of life you do a poor job and you get criticised.. It's a fact of life.. He should resign.

[socrates82]

In any walk of life you do a poor job and you get criticised.. It's a fact of life.. He should resign.

 

Resign after a defeat against Celtic? We won't have many managers if that's the expectations. You clearly really just want him to resign now. Expecting a win against Celtic is just silly but with Cathro the few times we've been good we've been very good, so who knows.

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

Or the man who appointed him? I can see both sides.

I thought he was worth a shot at the time tbh. I said I would give Cathro until this season before I would judge unless he was seriously bad. Turns out he was worse than I ever imagined.

 

I'm interested to see how our youth development goes and I did think Neilson was a great appointment.

 

If the choice was both then I may agree with you. His decision to let Cathro stay in the job was just the same as a another bad appointment to me.

 

His stubbornness to stick with someone so hopelessly out of their depth has made me question if his character is right for the position he holds within our club.

[Shanks]

We all wanted it to work. When cathro was getting a pasting from the Scottish dinosaurs we all rallied around him and were desperate for him to succeed. There has been no improvement,nothing has changed. Why should we allow him to ruin two seasons instead of just one?

 

Also lets not forget Levein. The whole idea of his role is that we have continuity when we change managers, well that has been a complete and utter disaster. The January transfer window was a total joke and goes against everything that we are supposed to be building for.

 

We are into year 4 now and we are going backwards.

[kingantti1874]

We all wanted it to work. When cathro was getting a pasting from the Scottish dinosaurs we all rallied around him and were desperate for him to succeed. There has been no improvement,nothing has changed. Why should we allow him to ruin two seasons instead of just one?

 

Also lets not forget Levein. The whole idea of his role is that we have continuity when we change managers, well that has been a complete and utter disaster. The January transfer window was a total joke and goes against everything that we are supposed to be building for.

 

We are into year 4 now and we are going backwards.

This