Players we should be looking at in the summer

[johnking123]

A Scottish/British spine of a team. Preferably no less than eight.

That's what I would want. Can all be in there 30's. But players for the youngsters to look up to and learn from.

[dumpson]

I've heard a wee rumour Jack may be willing to sign another contract with Aberdeen.

Maybe suggests there's not a lot of offers coming in from his agent.

Wouldn't be surprised if there was an announcement in the week running up to the cup final to give us that double act with Jack / Tansey.

It may even release Shinnie to LB, although I do like his energy in midfield

 

Alll in, quote a good and reasonable list of players youve identified there in your post.

 

Best post I've read in here if I'm honest

 

Heard last night that Jack to Sevco is a done deal !

[Alan_R]

All I can say is thank goodness the people in charge at our club appear to have their heads screwed on.

 

?7k a week??

 

?354k a year??

 

For kicking a ball about in our backwater league, a league where one team will dominate for the next 5/10 years at least.

 

It was paying players too much that got us into the mess we found ourselves in 4 years ago, it would be batsh!t mental to go down the same road again. IF (?) the current wage cap is ?3k per week then, quite simply, it's not going to go up to ?7k any time soon IMO. If that wage cap prevents us signing the like of Berra and McGinn then fine - I'd much rather have a club to support than go through what we had to go through in 2013 again.

No one is suggesting that. What people are suggesting is quality over quantity. An overall budget for squad (which I'm sure there is anyway)

 

I think the idea others are proposing is a handful of quality higher earners supplemented by youth. Rather than tens of neverbeens don't feck all for ?3k

 

This isn't exactly my opinion but the other side of the arguement seemed to have went right over your head

[Musemic]

No one is suggesting that. What people are suggesting is quality over quantity. An overall budget for squad (which I'm sure there is anyway)

 

I think the idea others are proposing is a handful of quality higher earners supplemented by youth. Rather than tens of neverbeens don't feck all for ?3k

 

This isn't exactly my opinion but the other side of the arguement seemed to have went right over your head

 

What a lot of people seem to be forgetting is that football is a TEAM game. If the stories are to be believed, Oshaniwa is one of our highest earners and he's not even quoted for our first team. Every other member of the first team squad will be thinking "he's getting ?3k per week (a guess) so why am I not?". Can't be good for TEAM morale.

Say, for example, we do get Berra and Whittaker in this summer and pay them each, say, ?7k per week (they would both be coming from clubs where their salary will be higher than that at the moment I'd guess). As soon as we pay ONE player ?7k a week that figure becomes the benchmark for any future negotiations with agents, be it for players already with us extending their contract or new players coming in. Before long we're doing a Sevco and living beyond our means. If we are to believe that there is a salary cap of ?3k per week at the moment it's there because we can't afford any more than that. In future that salary cap will, no doubt, rise but it will be some time before we're shelling out ?7k per week to players IMO.

It's not as if we can gamble like sides in the lower leagues in England who can chase the dream of getting into the EPL with the vast sums of money that can be earned there for both club and player - finishing somewhere between 2-6 in the SPL, with an occasional cup win (fingers crossed) is as high as we're ever going to get and, unless some Saudi Arabian prince takes a fancy to us, that's not going to change any time soon. 

[Luscious Laryea]

I can claim to be ITK about this...

 

Our future strategy will be to have match day squads typically comprised of 33% academy players, 33% foreign signings and 33% experienced Scottish/other British isles players.

 

This would suggest to me we will see a number of our overseas players leave and at least a couple of experienced (thinking of Berra in particular) heads coming in.

[JamboAl]

I can claim to be ITK about this...

 

Our future strategy will be to have match day squads typically comprised of 33% academy players, 33% foreign signings and 33% experienced Scottish/other British isles players.

 

This would suggest to me we will see a number of our overseas players leave and at least a couple of experienced (thinking of Berra in particular) heads coming in.

Firstly I would say we should be trying to obtain the best possible players within our budget and not be put off because we made temporary signings of foreigners who seem to have little appetite for a scrap when necessary.

That said I have no great quibble with the above ratio provided it's operated flexibly.

[OTT]

What a lot of people seem to be forgetting is that football is a TEAM game. If the stories are to be believed, Oshaniwa is one of our highest earners and he's not even quoted for our first team. Every other member of the first team squad will be thinking "he's getting ?3k per week (a guess) so why am I not?". Can't be good for TEAM morale.

Say, for example, we do get Berra and Whittaker in this summer and pay them each, say, ?7k per week (they would both be coming from clubs where their salary will be higher than that at the moment I'd guess). As soon as we pay ONE player ?7k a week that figure becomes the benchmark for any future negotiations with agents, be it for players already with us extending their contract or new players coming in. Before long we're doing a Sevco and living beyond our means. If we are to believe that there is a salary cap of ?3k per week at the moment it's there because we can't afford any more than that. In future that salary cap will, no doubt, rise but it will be some time before we're shelling out ?7k per week to players IMO.

It's not as if we can gamble like sides in the lower leagues in England who can chase the dream of getting into the EPL with the vast sums of money that can be earned there for both club and player - finishing somewhere between 2-6 in the SPL, with an occasional cup win (fingers crossed) is as high as we're ever going to get and, unless some Saudi Arabian prince takes a fancy to us, that's not going to change any time soon. 

 

You're right, football is a team game and you can't have the ludicrous situation where 1 player is on (using current example) ?7k p/w and the rest are on ?3k p/w. Obviously if that gets out then it creates problems in the dressing room. I also think you're right about it becoming a future benchmark. However (I'm totally getting splinters with my fence sitting here ) as with most things the best scenario falls somewhere in the middle. For a club with a turnover of less than ?10m it probably is too much to be forking out that kind of cash (?7k p/w), although I do think the club have a responsibility to put the most competitive team on the park as possible and it seems to me that we've deliberately been signing players on the cheaper end of the scale. 

 

I think the best situation we could manage is to try and hit the salary between championship and league 1 (there is a huge jump) 

 

 

(Source)

 

 http://www.themag.co.uk/2016/02/how-wages-have-changed-year-by-year-1984-2015-for-players-in-all-4-divisions-unbelievable-premier-league-newcastle-united/

 

http://forums.scottishfootballforums.co.uk/topic/24553-spl-average-1st-team-wages/ (I blocked the DR so can't access the relevant link, SPFL  figures are:

 

Celtic: ?717,860

Rangers: ?316,888

Aberdeen: ?134,670

Hearts: ?86,890

Dundee: ?61,837

Inverness: ?53,345

Motherwell: ?49,335

Kilmarnock: ?48,950

Ross County: ?47,515

St Johnstone: ?47,206

Partick Thistle: ?42,671

Hamilton: ?42,606 

 

 

 

 

We're currently on an average of circa ?85k so around ?20k above an average League 1 side. Aberdeen are spending an average of around ?135k so I think the first step is closing the gap and getting our average up to a more competitive level (Obviously this is with the assumption that player quality increases too). Can Aberdeen realistically afford to increase their salaries in proportion to however much we do (If we do?).

[Jammy T]

A Scottish/British spine of a team. Preferably no less than eight.

You mean like:

 

Hamilton

 

Souttar

Paterson

 

Cowie

 

Watt

Sammon

 

??

 

Let's not pretend that last summer we didn't get in British players with SPL experience.

 

We just need better players

 

For every Hartley there is an MDV

Every Cameron a Rudi

Every Paterson a Takis

 

Equally for every Tziolis there is a Wyness

 

There is no "British" holy grail here.

[Elias Henry Furst]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

[Tynecastlesmychurch]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

Top end premireship club? And one from Poland? Hmmmmm colour me intrigued!.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

I really don't mind where they come from as long as

 

They have ability

They are motivated and have a purpose to their career

They are well organised

They are bonded with a common goal

 

With these simple things, you will have a successful team, passport really is not an issue

[rudi must stay]

I really don't mind where they come from as long as

 

They have ability

They are motivated and have a purpose to their career

They are well organised

They are bonded with a common goal

 

With these simple things, you will have a successful team, passport really is not an issue

And : they want to win things. Purpose is great, but wanting to win things in a Hearts shirt is even better. We have motivated guy but not many winners who it means everything to play in a Hearts shirt

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

And : they want to win things. Purpose is great, but wanting to win things in a Hearts shirt is even better. We have motivated guy but not many winners who it means everything to play in a Hearts shirt

Sorry that was the purpose I had in mind! I forget sometimes people can't read my mind

[rudi must stay]

Sorry that was the purpose I had in mind! I forget sometimes people can't read my mind

Great post then. Just thought you meant purpose as in 'get a move to England' that's been our stumbling block since moving up to the Premier League

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Great post then. Just thought you meant purpose as in 'get a move to England' that's been our stumbling block since moving up to the Premier League

No, I should have said that too eh

 

Then again, I don't have a real issue with that, the only way they are going to get to England is if they are any good. Must be a bit of a reality check for some of those who have had that stated intention.

[rudi must stay]

No, I should have said that too eh

 

Then again, I don't have a real issue with that, the only way they are going to get to England is if they are any good. Must be a bit of a reality check for some of those who have had that stated intention.

I have a big issue with it. It's the reason some in the team pull out of challenges and pass the buck on the ball. In their heads they'll be in England soon anyway, I hope we ditch that transfer strategy

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

I have a big issue with it. It's the reason some in the team pull out of challenges and pass the buck on the ball. In their heads they'll be in England soon anyway, I hope we ditch that transfer strategy

Tbh I think that is the change being touted. It only works if the players are good enough

[Captain Bubblebeard]

You're right, football is a team game and you can't have the ludicrous situation where 1 player is on (using current example) ?7k p/w and the rest are on ?3k p/w. Obviously if that gets out then it creates problems in the dressing room. I also think you're right about it becoming a future benchmark. However (I'm totally getting splinters with my fence sitting here ) as with most things the best scenario falls somewhere in the middle. For a club with a turnover of less than ?10m it probably is too much to be forking out that kind of cash (?7k p/w), although I do think the club have a responsibility to put the most competitive team on the park as possible and it seems to me that we've deliberately been signing players on the cheaper end of the scale.

 

I think the best situation we could manage is to try and hit the salary between championship and league 1 (there is a huge jump)

 

 

(Source)

 

http://www.themag.co.uk/2016/02/how-wages-have-changed-year-by-year-1984-2015-for-players-in-all-4-divisions-unbelievable-premier-league-newcastle-united/

 

http://forums.scottishfootballforums.co.uk/topic/24553-spl-average-1st-team-wages/ (I blocked the DR so can't access the relevant link, SPFL figures are:

 

Celtic: ?717,860

Rangers: ?316,888

Aberdeen: ?134,670

Hearts: ?86,890

Dundee: ?61,837

Inverness: ?53,345

Motherwell: ?49,335

Kilmarnock: ?48,950

Ross County: ?47,515

St Johnstone: ?47,206

Partick Thistle: ?42,671

Hamilton: ?42,606

 

 

 

 

We're currently on an average of circa ?85k so around ?20k above an average League 1 side. Aberdeen are spending an average of around ?135k so I think the first step is closing the gap and getting our average up to a more competitive level (Obviously this is with the assumption that player quality increases too). Can Aberdeen realistically afford to increase their salaries in proportion to however much we do (If we do?).

Which team(s) cam up from League 1 that caused such a drop this year? Or were there other factors?

 

Edit - should have said two years ago - just seen the dates that the data is based upon.

[OTT]

Which team(s) cam up from League 1 that caused such a drop this year? Or were there other factors?

 

Edit - should have said two years ago - just seen the dates that the data is based upon.

 

Yeah fair question but I'm not totally sure I can answer it,

 

The changes in the 13-14 championship season were:

DOWNPREM: Norwich City, Fulham & Cardiff City

UP: Leicester City, Burnley & Queens Park Rangers

DOWN: Doncaster Rovers, Barnsley & Yeovil Town

UP1: Wolverhampton Wanderers,Brentford & Rotherham United

 

I'm apprehensive to go deep into finances etc, but the gist I got from http://www.onefootballforum.co.uk/index.php?threads/championship-finances.7593/ highlights QPR having one of the worst wages to turnover ratios 0.58 so I suppose you could draw from that they were overspending massively. Burnley had a ratio of 0.82 so again over spending. 

 

Perhaps this is the reason? I only wanted to try and highlight where we are right now as far as wages go (i.e somewhere between the championship and league 1).

 

If someone else can hazard a better guess that would be appreciated

[jamboinglasgow]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

Sorry to be pedantic but when you say a premiership club presume you mean an English premier league team not a scottish premiership team.

 

Certainly an interesting mix. Though the Polish one is left field. I will be interesting to see what will come off it.

[WheatfieldWarrior]

You mean like:

 

Hamilton

 

Souttar

Paterson

 

Cowie

 

Watt

Sammon

 

??

 

Let's not pretend that last summer we didn't get in British players with SPL experience.

 

We just need better players

 

For every Hartley there is an MDV

Every Cameron a Rudi

Every Paterson a Takis

 

Equally for every Tziolis there is a Wyness

 

There is no "British" holy grail here.

 

I think that we will need to look at the balance of uk vs foreign nationals in any case - post brexit it may not be possible to recruit so many from Europe with out an international record if work permits are needed. 

 

This may also push up the values of home grown players so it may be wise to rebalance as a risk management exercise.  Conversely we may also get a stack through the door of players that want to move to Britain now incase it's harder later.

[Musemic]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

I suggested we should try this in an earlier post. I wouldn't want to see any more than a couple of players at any one time but when you consider that Celtic have loaned the likes of Denayer and Roberts (when both were only 19 y-o) over the past few seasons then surely it's something we should at least consider. I appreciate we've tried that this season with Choulay, who looks a decent prospect, but maybe we've not seen the best of him because of the current malaise affecting the team in general. 

[269miles]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

Given the money that has been wasted over the last two seasons I wouldn't be surprised. It's hard to see where we are going to get the money from otherwise to sign players. 

 

I hope you are wrong , in the nicest possible way. 

[Just joe]

1 year rolling contracts for all signings...... play for the badge or f.... off .

[Jambo On Fire]

I, personally, feel that a player's wage should have multiple layers to the structure. Players should have a basic wage, win bonuses, appearance bonuses, goal bonuses etc but, crucially, another layer which sees them rewarded for their standing within the team, relative to the players around them.

 

This could be decided by the likes of fans/players Player of the Year rankings.

 

That way, you get away from some players being on inflated basic wages which can cause discontent with other players on significantly less and really pushes the players to perform as well as making the effort to endear themselves to the supporters.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Gav M]

I'm led to believe we could be looking at bringing in a few younger players on loan. Representatives of a top end Premiership club and a top Polish club are due to meet club management in Edinburgh at the end of the week.

anybody see the FA youth cup final between man city and Chelsea last night? at 16 some of those boys look bigger, better and stronger than most of our team. there's definitely players to be had down this route.

[Jambof3tornado]

1 year rolling contracts for all signings...... play for the badge or f.... off .

No chance of making sow type money moves then.

[Homme]

Could we tempt Maddison from Coventry? Not sure what his situation is but he did well for the Dons this season.

[BelgeJambo]

Could we tempt Maddison from Coventry? Not sure what his situation is but he did well for the Dons this season.

I think he is attached to Norwich City, not Coventry

[Cruyff Turn]

Certainly need a number of new players in during the summer. Imo it can't be waves of has beens from foreign leagues who don't give a shite, who cannot cope with the pace,the conditions or the physicality involved in winning a game in Scotland. We need to start building a team in the same template as Aberdeen, but better.

 

Wes Fotheringham if Rangers don't want him, gid keeper.

 

Liam Lindsey, Niall Keown, Christophe Berra would always be a welcome addition.

 

RB and LB don't know who.

 

Mallan at St Midden, Ryan Jack, Mark O'Hara, Luke Berry from Cambridge Utd are CM I'd be looking at.

 

Niall McGinnis and any other rapid, skillful, goalscoring wingers

 

Strikers, need at least 2 maybe 3 Liam Boyce, Christian Doidge random, scores goals though, Moult

[Homme]

I think he is attached to Norwich City, not Coventry

You're right. Silly me.

[Jammy T]

I think that we will need to look at the balance of uk vs foreign nationals in any case - post brexit it may not be possible to recruit so many from Europe with out an international record if work permits are needed.

 

This may also push up the values of home grown players so it may be wise to rebalance as a risk management exercise. Conversely we may also get a stack through the door of players that want to move to Britain now incase it's harder later.

Nope

 

We just need to get the best players we can.

 

Doesn't matter a **** where they come from.

[PTBCAL]

Ipswich taking up 1 year extension on Berra.

 

Disappointing as I was led to believe there was a real good chance he was coming back.

[Morgaro Gomis]

Ipswich taking up 1 year extension on Berra.

 

Disappointing as I was led to believe there was a real good chance he was coming back.

Disappointing if true.

 

Is it not the case though, that it's up to him if he wants to stay? I thought they had an option but he had to agree to it.

[deejtee]

Ipswich taking up 1 year extension on Berra.

 

Disappointing as I was led to believe there was a real good chance he was coming back.

Perhaps looking for a fee and if so unlikely to be from us. Happy to see him back but far from being the only central defender around.

[aceand1]

Certainly need a number of new players in during the summer. Imo it can't be waves of has beens from foreign leagues who don't give a shite, who cannot cope with the pace,the conditions or the physicality involved in winning a game in Scotland. We need to start building a team in the same template as Aberdeen, but better.

 

Wes Fotheringham if Rangers don't want him, gid keeper.

 

Liam Lindsey, Niall Keown, Christophe Berra would always be a welcome addition.

 

RB and LB don't know who.

 

Mallan at St Midden, Ryan Jack, Mark O'Hara, Luke Berry from Cambridge Utd are CM I'd be looking at.

 

Niall McGinnis and any other rapid, skillful, goalscoring wingers

 

Strikers, need at least 2 maybe 3 Liam Boyce, Christian Doidge random, scores goals though, Moult

Luke Berry is good on my FM save...not sure about his real life performances

 

Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk

[aceand1]

Luke Berry is good on my FM save...not sure about his real life performances

 

Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk

Don't really follow English football other than the EPL

 

Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk

[Cruyff Turn]

Luke Berry is good on my FM save...not sure about his real life performances

 

Sent from my SM-J500FN using Tapatalk

The boys an absolute goalmachine from midfield, very similar player to Paul Hartley. He'd be a great signing for us.

 

[Spencer]

Ipswich taking up 1 year extension on Berra.

 

Disappointing as I was led to believe there was a real good chance he was coming back.

This is probably for the best.

 

Rarely effective turning the clock back. Robbo and Rudi notable exceptions

[soonbe110]

Disappointing if true.

Is it not the case though, that it's up to him if he wants to stay? I thought they had an option but he had to agree to it.

Correct. McCarthy says they have still to talk to him. He thinks he wants to come back to Hearts based in previous discussions with him. Probably Ipswich just trying to get a nominal fee out of us. They are skint.

[Musemic]

Ipswich taking up 1 year extension on Berra.

 

Disappointing as I w

as led to believe there was a real good chance he was coming back.

 

Where have you seen this? Nothing on ITFC site

[IveSeenTheLight]

Heard last night that Jack to Sevco is a done deal !

Lol, let's see then.

Very much doubt it

[PTBCAL]

Where have you seen this? Nothing on ITFC site

Sky ticker tape yesterday

[We_are_the_Hearts]

This is probably for the best.

 

Rarely effective turning the clock back. Robbo and Rudi notable exceptions

JC and McPherson?

[jamle1874]

Billy McKay?

[jbee647]

First name we should sign up is Jamie Walker

If he doesn't sign a new deal by the beginning of next season we should actively look to sell him, come next January he can sign a pre contract with anyone and would be shafted yet again

This should be a matter of priority

[OTT]

First name we should sign up is Jamie Walker

If he doesn't sign a new deal by the beginning of next season we should actively look to sell him, come next January he can sign a pre contract with anyone and would be shafted yet again

This should be a matter of priority

I'd say summer. **** going through Paterson mk 2

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jbee647]

I'd say summer. **** going through Paterson mk 2

 

 

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Sooner the better, would love him to stay, but his maximum sale value is now, it starts depreciating very shortly

[Samuel Camazzola]

Ryan Edwards at Partick has always impressed me. I think he's the type of player who'd improve the squad and is the profile of player we should be looking at.

 

Hopefully he has a bad game tomorrow though!

[Spencer]

Ryan Edwards at Partick has always impressed me. I think he's the type of player who'd improve the squad and is the profile of player we should be looking at.

 

Hopefully he has a bad game tomorrow though!

Edwards does look decent.

 

Doolan and Lawless at Partick have always looked decent as do Crawford and Devlin at Hamilton along with Boyce at County and Moult at Motherwell

 

Draper is effective at SPL level also.