Maroon Sailor Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This. It is debatable whether it is even relevant to this GE. What a load of tosh GE or a referendum the thought process of the SNP is the same. One thing on their agenda and everyone knows it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowmans_Boot Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 It is an issue according to the First Minister : http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/27/nicola-sturgeon-admits-will-use-snp-votes-general-election-press/ & Alex Salmond: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/04/26/alex-salmond-admits-snp-would-use-overwhelming-election-win/ Shock, horror: the SNP wants an independent Scotland. That fact does not, in any way at all, make it the most important issue today, nor anywhere near it. Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP talk about many issues. The Tories and SL refuse to talk about anything other than independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Young people, please, get off your arses and vote today. Less than 40% of under 24s bothering last time was a disgrace. You're assuming they got off their arses in the first place to register to vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Cannot vote labour as that would mean personal financial disaster. Struggle to vote SNP , but they be the only option to keep labour out, but still with a tax hike cannot bring myself to vote Tory and thus continue the never ending pay freeze nobody else even worth considering not going to vote Don't whine about things then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 My goodness, you are an angry little chap. You're quite hard to understand. Just a ball of rage. Go and have a tug, get some cans in and watch the results on the telly tonight. Give yourself a holiday. deflecting from answering = seeyoujimmyhatter. go sit on your hands and give your keyboard and us a rest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_bolton Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Shock, horror: the SNP wants an independent Scotland. That fact does not, in any way at all, make it the most important issue today, nor anywhere near it. Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP talk about many issues. The Tories and SL refuse to talk about anything other than independence. Every piece of literature from the unionist parties I've seen this week through the door has mentioned independence as either the first or second point. Yet the media constantly give air time to their bizarre assertions that it's the SNP who are obsessed with the subject. It's a blatant denial of reality. Of course the SNP are for independence, but in this campaign it's the unionists who have never stopped talking about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 The unionist parties have done a great stitch-up job in convincing so many hard-of-thinking Scots that the prospect of a second referendum is even close to being the biggest political issue facing Scots. Sad so many seem to have fallen for it. Hang on a minute it was Sturgeon who made it the biggest issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_bolton Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 deflecting from answering = seeyoujimmyhatter. go sit on your hands and give your keyboard and us a rest No offence, but you don't seem like somebody worth having any kind of discussion with. You're just angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doogz Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This. It is debatable whether it is even relevant to this GE. Shock, horror: the SNP wants an independent Scotland. That fact does not, in any way at all, make it the most important issue today, nor anywhere near it. Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP talk about many issues. The Tories and SL refuse to talk about anything other than independence. Okay, so it's not debatable that independence is relevant to this General Election then - thanks for clarifying ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_bolton Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Hang on a minute it was Sturgeon who made it the biggest issue. Look at the literature from the parties, listen to the soundbites from the politicians. It's very hard to objectively come to the view that the SNP have been the main party mentioning independence in this campaign. The unionist parties have gone for the approach of repeating that the SNP talk about nothing else until it became accepted as the truth. The truth is that it's the Scottish unionist parties who have constantly dragged the topic up. It's like when you're at school and a story spreads quickly about someone in the school. Everyone repets it and repeats it until it is accepted and becomes part of the accepted narrative of life. Like 'Hearts are a big physical team'. This is what the unionist parties have done. It's hard for the SNP to counter as it comes from all sides and from the media. Perception is king. Yet when Davidson or Dugdale open their mouths, it's very unusual for them not to mention independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 No offence, but you don't seem like somebody worth having any kind of discussion with. You're just angry. it was a one answer question and you only had to choose A,B or C, there was never gonna be a discussion as you've shown you don't do answers, no surprise there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowmans_Boot Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Okay, so it's not debatable that independence is relevant to this General Election then - thanks for clarifying ! My posts are not contradictory. The SNP are for independence but hardly mention it as there are more important and relevant issues at present. The unionist parties have tried to dumb down this GE by trying to make independence the only issue for Scotland. Some people are able to see past that, others just swallow it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Look at the literature from the parties, listen to the soundbites from the politicians. It's very hard to objectively come to the view that the SNP have been the main party mentioning independence in this campaign. The unionist parties have gone for the approach of repeating that the SNP talk about nothing else until it became accepted as the truth. The truth is that it's the Scottish unionist parties who have constantly dragged the topic up. It's like when you're at school and a story spreads quickly about someone in the school. Everyone repets it and repeats it until it is accepted and becomes part of the accepted narrative of life. Like 'Hearts are a big physical team'. This is what the unionist parties have done. It's hard for the SNP to counter as it comes from all sides and from the media. Perception is king. Yet when Davidson or Dugdale open their mouths, it's very unusual for them not to mention independence. oh good, they havn't talked about independence, pray tell us what else the fish spoke about, you must know. your trying to persuade us that your lot are worth voting for so enlighten us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Look at the literature from the parties, listen to the soundbites from the politicians. It's very hard to objectively come to the view that the SNP have been the main party mentioning independence in this campaign. The unionist parties have gone for the approach of repeating that the SNP talk about nothing else until it became accepted as the truth. The truth is that it's the Scottish unionist parties who have constantly dragged the topic up. It's like when you're at school and a story spreads quickly about someone in the school. Everyone repets it and repeats it until it is accepted and becomes part of the accepted narrative of life. Like 'Hearts are a big physical team'. This is what the unionist parties have done. It's hard for the SNP to counter as it comes from all sides and from the media. Perception is king. Yet when Davidson or Dugdale open their mouths, it's very unusual for them not to mention independence. Utter drivel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 My posts are not contradictory. The SNP are for independence but hardly mention it as there are more important and relevant issues at present. The unionist parties have tried to dumb down this GE by trying to make independence the only issue for Scotland. Some people are able to see past that, others just swallow it all. it was sturgeon, right at the start that said it was about independence. instead of bleating about the other parties, lets hear why we should vote for your lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Independence was the biggest issues in Sturgeon's head right up until the point where May called a general election. The Sturgeon shat it and realised that banging on about Indy Ref might cost her votes. She's as much of an opportunist as anyone else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 To paraphrase an old election headline... Because of all these Tory voting referendum hystericals, someone turn the ****ing lights off in Scotland before you leave. Depressing and nonsensical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Tory economic genius in action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 SNP have the power to raise or lower income tax....... And after a 10 year pay freeze, the thought of Corbyn bamming me right up with a tax hike on everything over 80k would be a right kick in the moos. My shoulders don't feel as broad as they used to............................................. 80K is some wage and I can understand why someone on that would vote Tory. For everyone on an average wage....a big fat no ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Potter Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Independence was the biggest issues in Sturgeon's head right up until the point where May called a general election. The Sturgeon shat it and realised that banging on about Indy Ref might cost her votes. She's as much of an opportunist as anyone else. Also past her sell by date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwindonJambo Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Tory economic genius in action. Impressive big splashy chart but that's one single quarter so a ridiculous comparison. Do you have the figures over a longer period, say 5-10 years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 I hope everyone get what they wish for! Except Spacey. A Tory majority would seal the Indy 2 ref. Be careful what you wish for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gizmo Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 SNP have the power to raise or lower income tax....... And after a 10 year pay freeze, the thought of Corbyn bamming me right up with a tax hike on everything over 80k would be a right kick in the moos. My shoulders don't feel as broad as they used to............................................. My heart bleeds for you. No, wait, actually it bleeds for those being sanctioned and penalised for being poor, kids going to school hungry, cut to the core public services, pensioners with already miserly pensions compared to most of Europe being hammered, dementia taxes, the NHS doctors and nurses struggling in the face of pay freezes and systematic, stealth privatisation... Still, all that has done it's job and really paid off that national debt paid for tax concessions for corporations and the rich. But she's "strong and stable" and the fact she can't debate hasn't remotely worried me that she can't cope with 27 tough negotiators at all. And, well, she's bringing back all the stuff the toffs and imperialists love, class division, grammar schools, ripping animals to shreds for kicks, homophobia, censorship, ripping up the ECHR, selling arms to the known biggest exporters and funders of terrorism... But, hey, we are far more secure now thanks to her 7 years as Home Secretary and stint as PM. Telling the Police Chief to shut his hole when he pointed out the security ramifications of shedding thousands of Police jobs hasn't come back to bite people, at all. I've not hated all tory governments, some have been relatively stable and progressive even if I didn't vote for them. This ukip aping right-wing monstrosity is an absolute hateful shambles, on any metric you choose to measure them. No doubt her vote, thanks in part to the non tax dom billionaire owned papers, and the bbc championing the party that will keep the license fee secure, and the fact that the tory vote is usually under-represented in polls, will be far better than it ever deserves to be. So those of you who vote to protect a few extra quid in your pocket, don't pretend to utter any sympathies as food bank use rises and pensioners turn blue in the depths of winter because they can't afford to heat their homes. That's on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Impressive big splashy chart but that's one single quarter so a ridiculous comparison. Do you have the figures over a longer period, say 5-10 years? SNP figures for their 10 years of governance 0% of doing anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This sums up the hard of thinking Yoon voters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boab Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 My heart bleeds for you. No, wait, actually it bleeds for those being sanctioned and penalised for being poor, kids going to school hungry, cut to the core public services, pensioners with already miserly pensions compared to most of Europe being hammered, dementia taxes, the NHS doctors and nurses struggling in the face of pay freezes and systematic, stealth privatisation... Still, all that has done it's job and really paid off that national debt paid for tax concessions for corporations and the rich. But she's "strong and stable" and the fact she can't debate hasn't remotely worried me that she can't cope with 27 tough negotiators at all. And, well, she's bringing back all the stuff the toffs and imperialists love, class division, grammar schools, ripping animals to shreds for kicks, homophobia, censorship, ripping up the ECHR, selling arms to the known biggest exporters and funders of terrorism... But, hey, we are far more secure now thanks to her 7 years as Home Secretary and stint as PM. Telling the Police Chief to shut his hole when he pointed out the security ramifications of shedding thousands of Police jobs hasn't come back to bite people, at all. I've not hated all tory governments, some have been relatively stable and progressive even if I didn't vote for them. This ukip aping right-wing monstrosity is an absolute hateful shambles, on any metric you choose to measure them. No doubt her vote, thanks in part to the non tax dom billionaire owned papers, and the bbc championing the party that will keep the license fee secure, and the fact that the tory vote is usually under-represented in polls, will be far better than it ever deserves to be. So those of you who vote to protect a few extra quid in your pocket, don't pretend to utter any sympathies as food bank use rises and pensioners turn blue in the depths of winter because they can't afford to heat their homes. That's on you. I would hope the above would be a popular view of things. It probably is and here's hoping everyone who thinks this way gets out to vote today. Well said, Sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reaths17 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This sums up the hard of thinking Yoon voters. and here's the cut'n'paste chief, with no thoughts of his own, hence the copying of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Impressive big splashy chart but that's one single quarter so a ridiculous comparison. Do you have the figures over a longer period, say 5-10 years? Eurozone been ahead of the UK since the Tories came into power in 2010. Austerity is a lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hasselhoff Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This sums up the hard of thinking Yoon voters. Give Brexit a chance to see what happens. One thing is for sure at the moment, independence will provide a lot more austerity for Scotland than a Tory government will. If it turns out to be a disaster as Sturgeon is hoping, then we will have another vote and go indy. The rush of some nats to have another indy ref is putting off those who aren't fully committed. I know of several people who are in that camp. They want to see how Brexit goes first rather than be railroaded into indy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Glad it's almost over tbh. I will be staying up and watching the results come in though, took the day off tomorrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hasselhoff Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Eurozone been ahead of the UK since the Tories came into power in 2010. Austerity is a lie. 2009 - 2012 UK = +6.70 Euro area = + 6.14 UK has grown at a faster rate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Cannot vote labour as that would mean personal financial disaster. Struggle to vote SNP , but they be the only option to keep labour out, but still with a tax hike cannot bring myself to vote Tory and thus continue the never ending pay freeze nobody else even worth considering not going to vote Then stop ****ing moaning. Lots of people made lots of sacrifices in order that you get the opportunity to vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 This sums up the hard of thinking Yoon voters. Yep. Obsessed with stopping a referendum they all insist they would win anyway. So why oppose it? Why shy away from it? Why deny everyone a choice? Voting in a Tory to Westminster in a deranged notion that it stops the above... which it doesn't anyway. WE DINNY WANT A REFERENDUM (but we would win yin). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Give Brexit a chance to see what happens. One thing is for sure at the moment, independence will provide a lot more austerity for Scotland than a Tory government will. If it turns out to be a disaster as Sturgeon is hoping, then we will have another vote and go indy. The rush of some nats to have another indy ref is putting off those who aren't fully committed. I know of several people who are in that camp. They want to see how Brexit goes first rather than be railroaded into indy. But the call for a second indy ref was to hold it when the brexit ngotiation outcome became obvious. NOt tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowmans_Boot Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Yep. Obsessed with stopping a referendum they all insist they would win anyway. So why oppose it? Why shy away from it? Why deny everyone a choice? Voting in a Tory to Westminster in a deranged notion that it stops the above... which it doesn't anyway. WE DINNY WANT A REFERENDUM (but we would win yin). I think everyone knows it would take a big swing for Yes to win a referendum at present and I dont believe the unionist parties are scared of it. I do believe, however, that it is the only negative they see for the SNP and the only way they can successfully attack them. Unionists on here keep on about how poor the SNP have been in power, if that was the case then why not use these arguments to attack them? The simple answer is that the SNP have actually done very, very well in power and using peoples fear of/reluctance to another referendum is all the unionists have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Yep. Obsessed with stopping a referendum they all insist they would win anyway. So why oppose it? Why shy away from it? Why deny everyone a choice? Voting in a Tory to Westminster in a deranged notion that it stops the above... which it doesn't anyway. WE DINNY WANT A REFERENDUM (but we would win yin). 3 main Yoon politicians going about and actively campaigning that democracy and voting is a bad thing to have. Beggars belief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmfc_liam06 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Done. Mon the Tories!! Notoindyref2!! The irony being that voting for Labour is probably more beneficial to staying in the Union. A Tory win will absolutely speed up Sturgeon's Indyref2 push! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 I think everyone knows it would take a big swing for Yes to win a referendum at present and I dont believe the unionist parties are scared of it. I do believe, however, that it is the only negative they see for the SNP and the only way they can successfully attack them. Unionists on here keep on about how poor the SNP have been in power, if that was the case then why not use these arguments to attack them? The simple answer is that the SNP have actually done very, very well in power and using peoples fear of/reluctance to another referendum is all the unionists have. Correct. Yet still people are buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hasselhoff Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 But the call for a second indy ref was to hold it when the brexit ngotiation outcome became obvious. NOt tomorrow. Brexit will be tough in the early years and only when that settles down can a fair decision be made, hence the "Now is not the time" line. How on earth can negotiations be done including Scotland in the UK if right at the end of the negotiations, Scotland leave the UK. Brexit needs to be finished and lived with for a few years at least. Only then should independence come back on the table. The uncertainty to business is why Scotland's economy is tanking. Nationalists ask "if you're so confident people will vote no, then let us have it". My reply would be "If you're so confident support for indy will keep rising, then SNP will still be the majority in 5 years time and can legitimately call a referendum then" The only reason SNP would want to rush a decision on indy is that they are worried they are just flavour of the month and their poor governing will soon begin to be noticed by more and more people. Fools rush in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Dan Posted June 8, 2017 Author Share Posted June 8, 2017 Tell you what, lets see all the politicians and I mean all ditch their big wages packets and work for the minimum living wage. Add in all the mouth pieces like J.K. Rowling and the likes and lets see these cash fat idealists hand over the vast swathes cash they have to say the NHS. Never happen though. I'm alright Jack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam Tarts 1874 Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Full marks to the SNP boy who has been outside James Gillespie's since early this morning (and is still there now) with only a baseball cap to protect him from the rain. Alternatively, maybe only SNP supporters are stupid enough to ignore the weather forecast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Brexit will be tough in the early years and only when that settles down can a fair decision be made, hence the "Now is not the time" line. How on earth can negotiations be done including Scotland in the UK if right at the end of the negotiations, Scotland leave the UK. Brexit needs to be finished and lived with for a few years at least. Only then should independence come back on the table. The uncertainty to business is why Scotland's economy is tanking. Nationalists ask "if you're so confident people will vote no, then let us have it". My reply would be "If you're so confident support for indy will keep rising, then SNP will still be the majority in 5 years time and can legitimately call a referendum then" The only reason SNP would want to rush a decision on indy is that they are worried they are just flavour of the month and their poor governing will soon begin to be noticed by more and more people. Fools rush in Scotland doesn't even have a voice at the forthcoming Brexit talks, that's how much these Torys treat us with contempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hasselhoff Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Scotland doesn't even have a voice at the forthcoming Brexit talks, that's how much these Torys treat us with contempt. We only have one sole voice in the government in David Mundell. The SNP MPs are only down there to further their separatist cause. After tomorrow, we will have more Tory MPs and therefore more of a voice for Scotland in a positive way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irufushi Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 That's my Tory vote done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 We only have one sole voice in the government in David Mundell. The SNP MPs are only down there to further their separatist cause. After tomorrow, we will have more Tory MPs and therefore more of a voice for Scotland in a positive way He's on a shoogly peg, the SNP candidate down there is a young vibrant local lass and pretty fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 I started off in this thread saying I'd be voting conservative as I felt they'd be best for me and my family. Over the course of the past month I've completely switched and went for labour. I'm in Edinburgh south and I hope Murray keeps his seat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OmiyaHearts Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 I don't have a clue what I'm voting for. I've not paid attention to any debates or social media so I don't really know any parties manifesto. I'll probably go and vote SNP. I'm unsure if a guess vote is worse than not voting at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hasselhoff Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 He's on a shoogly peg, the SNP candidate down there is a young vibrant local lass and pretty fit. Next you'll be asking what the naughtiest thing she has done is with an expectant grin on your face Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 Next you'll be asking what the naughtiest thing she has done is with an expectant grin on your face I'll pish myself silly if Fluffy and Murray are given the boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted June 8, 2017 Share Posted June 8, 2017 I don't have a clue what I'm voting for. I've not paid attention to any debates or social media so I don't really know any parties manifesto. I'll probably go and vote SNP. I'm unsure if a guess vote is worse than not voting at all? Pay attention to what Brian is telling you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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