New Stand: Ongoing work (updated)

[Lambo85]

That's in your opinion. Your facts are your own and do not relate to the project. Thankfully we have professional, fully qualified Experianced people in charge of the whole project.

 

Dannie Boy your making a fool of yourself because I am actually involved with the project.

 

The programme for this was always border line unachieveable as others who are involved with the project on here have pointed out previously.

All the contractors have been working their butts off to get it finished on time. Had there been no problems or glitches what so ever then yes maybe it could have been finished. Maybe. However as with most construction projects, there have been problems which have caused delays.

 

I am glad Anne Budge did commend the contractors in her statement as it is through no fault of theirs that it is delayed.

Edited August 4, 2017 by Lambo85

[Bowmans_Boot]

Let's be abundantly clear what has caused this delay.

1 shipping of the seats (already made) from China. That's out with the control of anyone here.

Some steel from South Korea . Once again out with our control.

Other aspects of the construction continue are per normal.

There will be no impact on the cost other what Ann Has already announced.

We were already short to start with. I really dont get why noone seems to care about it. Perhaps I come across as overly critical but that is purely through concern for our club. I dont think the club planned the finances and just relied upon FOH.

[Bowmans_Boot]

You also think You're Jamie Walkers best mate.

I have never met Jamie and have never claimed to be ITK/mates. I simply stuck up for our best player. Quite what this has to do with this thread is beyond me.

[Don Dan]

Dannie Boy your making a fool of yourself because I am actually involved with the project.

 

The programme for this was always border line unachieveable as others who are involved with the project on here have pointed out previously.

All the contractors have been working their butts off to get it finished on time. Had there been no problems or glitches what so ever then yes maybe it could have been finished. However as with most construction projects, there have been problems which have caused delays.

 

I am glad Anne Budge did commend the contractors in her statement as it is through no fault of theirs that it is delayed.

Well this fool spoke to Ann last night I asked her directly about budgets and time lines and what she told me differs greatly from your version.

Yes there were problems but these were overcome by the hard work and overtime put in but the contractors. If it was not for the seats and the steel delays which are out of our control the project would have been brought in as per the schedule.

 

So I'm nobody's fool and certainly not yours.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Morgaro Gomis]

We were already short to start with. I really dont get why noone seems to care about it. Perhaps I come across as overly critical but that is purely through concern for our club. I dont think the club planned the finances and just relied upon FOH.

I don't think it's that people don't care, it's obviously extremely pertinent to the future of our club. As such; you, and anyone else, are perfectly entitled to be worried or have queries regarding the funding shortage.

 

I think what people are more frustrated at is that you are continually posting the same thing, which is your right, on this thread and asking people for answers which they do not have.

 

Additionally, the questions you have posed have been done so in an extremely critical manner in regards the club, and more so, Ann Budge. People obviously don't take kindly to that.

 

The questions you ask are very valid, however, and I, too, would like to hear about the shortage would be made up. I doubt you'll get an answer on this thread though, so whilst it is your prerogative to do as you please - it may be best to fire an email to the club with them rather than continually post the concerns here.

 

If you happened to get an answer, I, and many others I'm sure, would appreciate to be told. Just a thought though and I'm by no means meaning to tell you what to do.

[Bad Religion]

I have never met Jamie and have never claimed to be ITK/mates. I simply stuck up for our best player. Quite what this has to do with this thread is beyond me.

 

Its relevant as what 'you think' is fantasy. 

[Thomaso]

Just to put this into context, a good friend of mine is a Director with a major Main Contractor in Scotland - he is also a big Hearts fan.

 

He was obviously interested in the project and priced up the plans and programmed it.  He told me if a Main Contractor built the new stand development you were looking at a price around ?18m with a 12 month programme. This of course would not meet the Club's requirement in terms of budget and programme.

 

From day one the Club did not want to go down the Main Contractor route as they were subjected to disputes and claims on the building of the other stands, and they appointed a very able Project Manager to co-ordinate the subcontractors carrying out the work.  Because many of the subcontract Companies are 'Hearts minded' they are building the new stand at a very competitive price, and have done all possible to achieve what was always a huge ask in terms of the Aberdeen game.

 

With regards to accusations of 'bad planning' I think some are totally oblivious of the planning that had to take place to mitigate the logistical difficulties of commencing the build when the old stand was still in operation, erection of a huge truss, the complex demolition of the out buildings and old stand, the very tight space to operate on site, and having to bring in essential material from Korea because they were the sole manufacturers. Another problem has been the regular 'summer' downpours that flood the site and floor plates of the building.

 

With the greatest respect it is a minor miracle that this new stand complex building is being built to the current price and programme that has now developed.

Edited August 4, 2017 by Thomaso

[Bowmans_Boot]

I don't think it's that people don't care, it's obviously extremely pertinent to the future of our club. As such; you, and anyone else, are perfectly entitled to be worried or have queries regarding the funding shortage.

 

I think what people are more frustrated at is that you are continually posting the same thing, which is your right, on this thread and asking people for answers which they do not have.

 

Additionally, the questions you have posed have been done so in an extremely critical manner in regards the club, and more so, Ann Budge. People obviously don't take kindly to that.

 

The questions you ask are very valid, however, and I, too, would like to hear about the shortage would be made up. I doubt you'll get an answer on this thread though, so whilst it is your prerogative to do as you please - it may be best to fire an email to the club with them rather than continually post the concerns here.

 

If you happened to get an answer, I, and many others I'm sure, would appreciate to be told. Just a thought though and I'm by no means meaning to tell you what to do.

Fair enough response, to be honest. I just get frustrated when it appears noone cares and we are trusting blind faith: we have been down that road before.

[Don Dan]

We were already short to start with. I really dont get why noone seems to care about it. Perhaps I come across as overly critical but that is purely through concern for our club. I dont think the club planned the finances and just relied upon FOH.

There was enough money available to open a functional Stand the fans will be able to take their seats buy a coffee and snack and go to the bog. Some areas like the ground floor would be finished in due course but would no impact on a match day. Funds for the project are still being raised as we speak and it's not solely down to FoH.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[highlandjambo3]

We are getting a new stand........... am chuffed.........SIMPLE

[Mars plastic]

You also think You're Jamie Walkers best mate.

You bring very little, if anything at all, to the conversation.

[Mikey1874]

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lucille's Thirsty]

Christ B_B you're still at it.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Anyone working in project based work will understand, those who don't wouldn't because they have never experienced it. I for one, happy that a relatively early announcement has been made, slightly disappointed it is not on time, but these things barely ever run exactly to plan, because of the many many imponderables that projects throw up, contingency or not

[Homme]

Just to put this into context, a good friend of mine is a Director with a major Main Contractor in Scotland - he is also a big Hearts fan.

 

He was obviously interested in the project and priced up the plans and programmed it. He told me if a Main Contractor built the new stand development you were looking at a price around ?18m with a 12 month programme. This of course would not meet the Club's requirement in terms of budget and programme.

 

From day one the Club did not want to go down the Main Contractor route as they were subjected to disputes and claims on the building of the other stands, and they appointed a very able Project Manager to co-ordinate the subcontractors carrying out the work. Because many of the subcontract Companies are 'Hearts minded' they are building the new stand at a very competitive price, and have done all possible to achieve what was always a huge ask in terms of the Aberdeen game.

 

With regards to accusations of 'bad planning' I think some are totally oblivious of the planning that had to take place to mitigate the logistical difficulties of commencing the build when the old stand was still in operation, erection of a huge truss, the complex demolition of the out buildings and old stand, the very tight space to operate on site, and having to bring in essential material from Korea because they were the sole manufacturers. Another problem has been the regular 'summer' downpours that flood the site and floor plates of the building.

 

With the greatest respect it is a minor miracle that this new stand complex building is being built to the current price and programme that has now developed.

Great post Thomaso and with the greatest respect to some posters on here, they just do not get it.

[dallan]

Im not involved in this project but like to think I have a bit of understanding on what's going on.

 

A complex ?12M constuction project in the middle of a housing sceme in the timeframe we were looking at was always a stretch in my opinion, and I'm sure Ann and the team involved new that.  Were they right to go for it, absolutely yes, were they hoping for some luck and no delays in material deliveries, absolutely yes, have they got contingency plans in place, absolutely yes....Let's try and keep the big picture in mind...

 

It will be finished and it will be magnificent and we will all be incredibly proud.

 

Keep the faith fellow jambos... 

[August Landmesser]

The planning of the funding was horrendous. Just how short are we now?

?0

 

Sent from my FP2 using Tapatalk

[Lambo85]

There was enough money available to open a functional Stand the fans will be able to take their seats buy a coffee and snack and go to the bog. Some areas like the ground floor would be finished in due course but would no impact on a match day. Funds for the project are still being raised as we speak and it's not solely down to FoH.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I was just about to reply to you saying the same thing.

If it were not for the delays in the seats then there was a chance that the stand could have been operational for the Aberdeen match but the project as a whole would be far from complete.

Thats the point I was trying to make. There was no way that the entire project was going to be complete by September.

There is no home match to be played at Tynecastle until Novemeber now which means the stand will be far more operational and complete than it ever would have been for the Aberdeen match (even if there had been no glitches of problems).

[Mikey1874]

I was just about to reply to you saying the same thing.

If it were not for the delays in the seats then there was a chance that the stand could have been operational for the Aberdeen match but the project as a whole would be far from complete.

Thats the point I was trying to make. There was no way that the entire project was going to be complete by September.

There is no home match to be played at Tynecastle until Novemeber now which means the stand will be far more operational and complete than it ever would have been for the Aberdeen match (even if there had been no glitches of problems).

Ann said that last night

[sairyinthat]

Just to put this into context, a good friend of mine is a Director with a major Main Contractor in Scotland - he is also a big Hearts fan.

 

He was obviously interested in the project and priced up the plans and programmed it.  He told me if a Main Contractor built the new stand development you were looking at a price around ?18m with a 12 month programme. This of course would not meet the Club's requirement in terms of budget and programme.

 

From day one the Club did not want to go down the Main Contractor route as they were subjected to disputes and claims on the building of the other stands, and they appointed a very able Project Manager to co-ordinate the subcontractors carrying out the work.  Because many of the subcontract Companies are 'Hearts minded' they are building the new stand at a very competitive price, and have done all possible to achieve what was always a huge ask in terms of the Aberdeen game.

 

With regards to accusations of 'bad planning' I think some are totally oblivious of the planning that had to take place to mitigate the logistical difficulties of commencing the build when the old stand was still in operation, erection of a huge truss, the complex demolition of the out buildings and old stand, the very tight space to operate on site, and having to bring in essential material from Korea because they were the sole manufacturers. Another problem has been the regular 'summer' downpours that flood the site and floor plates of the building.

 

With the greatest respect it is a minor miracle that this new stand complex building is being built to the current price and programme that has now developed.

Is the completion date for the stadium now likely to be earlier than planned as other works will be started earlier than was planned and will there be a catch up of sorts on the time lost.

[Thomaso]

Fair enough response, to be honest. I just get frustrated when it appears noone cares and we are trusting blind faith: we have been down that road before.

 

 

We have been down that route before with the Pieman and Romanov - I am not trusting "blind faith" - I am trusting Ann budge!

[Don Dan]

I was just about to reply to you saying the same thing.

If it were not for the delays in the seats then there was a chance that the stand could have been operational for the Aberdeen match but the project as a whole would be far from complete.

Thats the point I was trying to make. There was no way that the entire project was going to be complete by September.

There is no home match to be played at Tynecastle until Novemeber now which means the stand will be far more operational and complete than it ever would have been for the Aberdeen match (even if there had been no glitches of problems).

That's exactly what Ann said and she also said "There are positives in these delays."

Ive spoken to Ann a good few times now since she took charge and she is one amazing operator. Eric said something (can't remember what) last night and she quick to correct him. She is also a very very hard worker and she is definitely in charge. I think Levein is well aware of that now as well if he ever thought that she wasn't.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dannie Boy

[Bad Religion]

You bring very little, if anything at all, to the conversation.

 

Its a tad rich coming from you mp.

[FarmerTweedy]

The planning of the funding was horrendous. Just how short are we now?

It wasn't, unless the delay is actually because we've run out of money and can't afford to complete it until we find a way to get our hands on some more!

[Thomaso]

That's exactly what Ann said and she also said "There are positives in these delays."

Ive spoken to Ann a good few times now since she took charge and she is one amazing operator. Eric said something (can't remember what) last night and she quick to correct him. She is also a very very hard worker and she is definitely in charge. I think Levein is well aware of that now as well if he ever thought that she wasn't.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

 

 

Underneath that always coiffured hair is 'as sharp as a tack' brain that does not suffer fools gladly!    There is nobody better to lead our Club.

[Bowmans_Boot]

It wasn't, unless the delay is actually because we've run out of money and can't afford to complete it until we find a way to get our hands on some more!

We planned to build a new stand without the funding in place. If that happened under any other owner we would all be slating them.

[Mars plastic]

Underneath that always coiffured hair is 'as sharp as a tack' brain that does not suffer fools gladly!    There is nobody better to lead our Club.

*looking for a regular invitation to the directors suite type post

[kila]

We planned to build a new stand without the funding in place. If that happened under any other owner we would all be slating them.

 

The alternative was:

 

- Keep throwing ?250k a year on maintenance for the old stand

- Lose the ability to ever build a big new main stand because the council will have built the new nursery on their land

 

I'm sure you've been told the facts many times and this'll no doubt go in one eye and out the other...

[Thomaso]

*looking for a regular invitation to the directors suite type post

 

 sussed!

[Cut The Crap]

That's exactly what Ann said and she also said "There are positives in these delays."

Ive spoken to Ann a good few times now since she took charge and she is one amazing operator. Eric said something (can't remember what) last night and she quick to correct him. She is also a very very hard worker and she is definitely in charge. I think Levein is well aware of that now as well if he ever thought that she wasn't.

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

It's reassuring that you are reassured. Dr B might do well to communicate through channels that will reach a higher proportion of the fanbase so that we are all reassured. From the outside it currently looks a wee bit like this project is getting away from us.

 

Just want to clarify your comment about steel from Korea being delayed. Is that correct? I though it was the seating decks that were coming from there? 

[Cut The Crap]

Thanks, I'll pass that down the line to the guys on site.

 

It's up to you, Thomaso. Personally i think they could probably do without any more distractions and should focus on the task in hand. 

[Gizmo]

Just to put this into context, a good friend of mine is a Director with a major Main Contractor in Scotland - he is also a big Hearts fan.

 

He was obviously interested in the project and priced up the plans and programmed it.  He told me if a Main Contractor built the new stand development you were looking at a price around ?18m with a 12 month programme. This of course would not meet the Club's requirement in terms of budget and programme.

 

From day one the Club did not want to go down the Main Contractor route as they were subjected to disputes and claims on the building of the other stands, and they appointed a very able Project Manager to co-ordinate the subcontractors carrying out the work.  Because many of the subcontract Companies are 'Hearts minded' they are building the new stand at a very competitive price, and have done all possible to achieve what was always a huge ask in terms of the Aberdeen game.

 

With regards to accusations of 'bad planning' I think some are totally oblivious of the planning that had to take place to mitigate the logistical difficulties of commencing the build when the old stand was still in operation, erection of a huge truss, the complex demolition of the out buildings and old stand, the very tight space to operate on site, and having to bring in essential material from Korea because they were the sole manufacturers. Another problem has been the regular 'summer' downpours that flood the site and floor plates of the building.

 

With the greatest respect it is a minor miracle that this new stand complex building is being built to the current price and programme that has now developed.

To be able to substantially reduce the cost from that 18 million quid estimate and avoiding having to play an entire season at Murrayfield (presumably) is a ****ing miracle. 

 

Exceptional job this, clearly everyone is going the extra mile to deliver. As such, it would be a rather churlish display of ingratitude to complain about a delay. 

[Thomaso]

We planned to build a new stand without the funding in place. If that happened under any other owner we would all be slating them.

 

 

Funding WAS in place.  ?9m of funding out of the estimated cost of ?12m was in place.

 

If the Club had waited until they had all ?12m in place then we would miss the boat to build the stand due to the nursery situation.

 

So rather than missing the opportunity FOR EVER, Ann Budge made a commercial judgement that the extra funds would be in place and pressed the 'GO' button.

 

So you tell me - was she wrong????

[Thomaso]

It's reassuring that you are reassured. Dr B might do well to communicate through channels that will reach a higher proportion of the fanbase so that we are all reassured. From the outside it currently looks a wee bit like this project is getting away from us.

 

Just want to clarify your comment about steel from Korea being delayed. Is that correct? I though it was the seating decks that were coming from there? 

 

 

It was the seating decks

[Thomaso]

It's up to you, Thomaso. Personally i think they could probably do without any more distractions and should focus on the task in hand. 

 

 

You're right - negative comments and petty gripes do nothing to help their productivity.....

[FarmerTweedy]

We planned to build a new stand without the funding in place. If that happened under any other owner we would all be slating them.

We had very good reasons for doing so, which have been covered numerous times on this and other threads.

[Cut The Crap]

It was the seating decks

 

Cheers. So the dates we heard yesterday (7 and 15 August, I think) are the current ones? Or are we subject to further delay?

[Bowmans_Boot]

Funding WAS in place. ?9m of funding out of the estimated cost of ?12m was in place.

 

If the Club had waited until they had all ?12m in place then we would miss the boat to build the stand due to the nursery situation.

 

So rather than missing the opportunity FOR EVER, Ann Budge made a commercial judgement that the extra funds would be in place and pressed the 'GO' button.

 

So you tell me - was she wrong????

Not all of the funding was (or is) in place. That, for me, is poor planning. They presumed that FOH would cover any shortfall, which isnt entirely fair or honest. I dont appreciate being taken for granted and, as a FOH contributor from the start, I have been here.

[Mikey1874]

Hopefully be able to watch the ships come in now

[hughesie27]

When we pump the Hobos 4-1 on December 27th in front of 20,500 under the floodlights it'll all be worth it.

20500?

[Thomaso]

Not all of the funding was (or is) in place. That, for me, is poor planning. They presumed that FOH would cover any shortfall, which isnt entirely fair or honest. I dont appreciate being taken for granted and, as a FOH contributor from the start, I have been here.

 

 

I'll ask you again - Should Ann Budge have waited until all the ?12m funding was in place, and missed the opportunity FOR EVER of building a new main stand at Tynecastle??

[Jambo92]

Not all of the funding was (or is) in place. That, for me, is poor planning. They presumed that FOH would cover any shortfall, which isnt entirely fair or honest. I dont appreciate being taken for granted and, as a FOH contributor from the start, I have been here.

 

Do you pay for everything on the day upfront in your life?

 

Ideal world we would have had the capital to pay for it all, but we had the option either building the stand with the shortfall or moving away from Tynecastle.  I know which option I prefer. 

[Bad Religion]

I'll ask you again - Should Ann Budge have waited until all the ?12m funding was in place, and missed the opportunity FOR EVER of building a new main stand at Tynecastle??

 

Don't hold your breath.

[Section Q]

The alternative was:

 

- Keep throwing ?250k a year on maintenance for the old stand

- Lose the ability to ever build a big new main stand because the council will have built the new nursery on their land

 

I'm sure you've been told the facts many times and this'll no doubt go in one eye and out the other...

?250k on maintenance on the old stand....! Yer dreaming mate...!

[ejbh]

They presumed that FOH would cover any shortfall, which isnt entirely fair or honest. I dont appreciate being taken for granted and, as a FOH contributor from the start, I have been here.

No, there is not a presumption or expectation that FoH would or will cover any more of the cost beyond the ?3m agreed. There is a legal agreement in place for that amount only. Any change to that would require another vote of FoH membership. There had been nothing from official sources about FoH paying any more than that.

 

If on the first vote it had been a no, the club would have had to borrow money commercially and gone into debt. This way we will most likely come out of the process with the stand already paid for, and debt free (apart from the repayment to Ann budge). Funding wise, if that is the outcome, that is brilliant planning. Most other clubs would have to borrow many millions to build something like this.

[Hagar the Horrible]

Honestly some people rip my tights?  Three years ago we were in Admin, now we are well underway replacing the old stand, that was unfit, and soon it will be fully replaced by a state of the art main stand we ARE proud of!  Yes its gone over budget, but by a fully expected amount, thats not cripling, most of the money has been rasied, and in only a few short years, the stand will have paid for itself.  It was abitious to expect it to be ready for the Aberdeen game? we could have planned a move away for the whole season, but we didnt.  People are working hard to get this done in such a tight window, and well done to all!  

 

Once the stand is fully paid, then the additional revenue will be pumped into the squad, NO mortgage no cripling debt, And the best if not the biggest stadium in Scotland.

 

Hopefully more semi finals will be played as well as Junior cup finals

[Bowmans_Boot]

I'll ask you again - Should Ann Budge have waited until all the ?12m funding was in place, and missed the opportunity FOR EVER of building a new main stand at Tynecastle??

I like honesty. I dont believe the club were honest when planning or announcing the new stand funding.

[Hagar the Horrible]

?250k on maintenance on the old stand....! Yer dreaming mate...!

No it was about that getting safety certificates and a lot of work to stop it falling down.  Every year

[Thomaso]

No, there is not a presumption or expectation that FoH would or will cover any more of the cost beyond the ?3m agreed. There is a legal agreement in place for that amount only. Any change to that would require another vote of FoH membership. There had been nothing from official sources about FoH paying any more than that.

 

If on the first vote it had been a no, the club would have had to borrow money commercially and gone into debt. This way we will most likely come out of the process with the stand already paid for, and debt free (apart from the repayment to Ann budge). Funding wise, if that is the outcome, that is brilliant planning. Most other clubs would have to borrow many millions to build something like this.

 

 

Spot on.

 

When Ann made the announcement that we were going ahead with the desperately required new stand she justifiably had a "presumption and expectation" that the team would be in line for 4th place money, qualify for Europe prize money, and progress in the LC - the appointment of Cathro put paid to that!!

[Taffin]

Funding WAS in place. ?9m of funding out of the estimated cost of ?12m was in place.

 

If the Club had waited until they had all ?12m in place then we would miss the boat to build the stand due to the nursery situation.

 

So rather than missing the opportunity FOR EVER, Ann Budge made a commercial judgement that the extra funds would be in place and pressed the 'GO' button.

 

So you tell me - was she wrong????

Simply, we don't know yet.

 

Once the stand is finished and the cost a are covered we'll know she made the right choice.

 

Until then we won't know and if it doesn't happen then we know she made the wrong choice.