Sturgeon shelves plan for quick second Scottish independence referendum

[Maroon Sailor]

I had a bit of a wobble in the shower after writing my previous post. It occurred to me that aussieh may in fact be a character whose creator is having a chuckle at us all.

Always wondered why kangaroo boy didn't call himself Scottieh

[Old Hearts]

But for how much longer? My guess is 10 years max [emoji41]

10 years!? Hope there's some oil left in 10 years.

 

I have faith that the Scottish people are not all stupid.

[Space Mackerel]

10 years!? Hope there's some oil left in 10 years.

 

I have faith that the Scottish people are not all stupid.

There's plenty oil, loads. Shame you base your outlook on one commodity, most Scottish people don't.

 

You should take a wee drive about Scotland, see for yourself the diverse and natural resources we have. We are practically self sufficient as a nation.

 

Anyway, you're Old and set in your ways, you can't teach an old dug new tricks.

[151]

Democracy my arse

[aussieh]

Always wondered why kangaroo boy didn't call himself Scottieh

Aussie H=aussieh

Hope that helps, Mr Sailor

[Hasselhoff]

Sturgeon is deflecting when asked about Scotland's awful financial situation by blaming the Tories for Brexit. Shame the rest of the UK isn't struggling as bad as Scotland is which disproves her Brexit effect accusation. Our state of affairs was almost as bad last year too, long before Brexit became a serious issue.

 

An Independence Party will sadly never let the notion of independence go until it happens (which it won't). This will continue to cause uncertainty to businesses and people. Only when Scotland wakes up and sends SNP into the periphery where they belong will we recover as a country.

[Space Mackerel]

Sturgeon is deflecting when asked about Scotland's awful financial situation by blaming the Tories for Brexit. Shame the rest of the UK isn't struggling as bad as Scotland is which disproves her Brexit effect accusation. Our state of affairs was almost as bad last year too, long before Brexit became a serious issue.

 

An Independence Party will sadly never let the notion of independence go until it happens (which it won't). This will continue to cause uncertainty to businesses and people. Only when Scotland wakes up and sends SNP into the periphery where they belong will we recover as a country.

You really are a brainless oaf

 

https://www.facebook...54455107253670/

[Gorgiewave]

Sturgeon is deflecting when asked about Scotland's awful financial situation by blaming the Tories for Brexit. Shame the rest of the UK isn't struggling as bad as Scotland is which disproves her Brexit effect accusation. Our state of affairs was almost as bad last year too, long before Brexit became a serious issue.

 

An Independence Party will sadly never let the notion of independence go until it happens (which it won't). This will continue to cause uncertainty to businesses and people. Only when Scotland wakes up and sends SNP into the periphery where they belong will we recover as a country.

 

How long do you predict that will take?

[Hasselhoff]

You really are a brainless oaf

 

https://www.facebook...54455107253670/

It was your Facebook post that i was responding to. Brexit uncertainty is not the cause of Scotland performing worse than the rest of the UK. What else could it be??

 

I'm not the person sharing completely made-up memes from the web as if they are fact then having the stupidity to criticise MSM for spreading lies.

[Hasselhoff]

How long do you predict that will take?

People I know who voted yes already getting sick of the sound of sturgeon. Voted the most arrogant leader in the UK recently, her only direction is down. The best opportunity for Indy has passed. It won't happen now, all she can do is prolong Scotland's poor performance by continuing to go on about it

[Space Mackerel]

It was your Facebook post that i was responding to. Brexit uncertainty is not the cause of Scotland performing worse than the rest of the UK. What else could it be??

 

I'm not the person sharing completely made-up memes from the web as if they are fact then having the stupidity to criticise MSM for spreading lies.

Chow down on this.

 

Gordon MacIntyre-Kemp: No matter the deal May strikes, Sturgeon will benefit

SEPTEMBER 9TH, 2016 - 12:12 AM GORDON MACINTYRE-KEMP

WHEN Theresa May became Prime Minister she really did inherit a poisoned chalice, but it?s hard to feel sorry for her as her own lack-lustre EU Remain campaign contribution (designed to leave the door open for a run at Number 10 if Cameron failed) was very much part of the poisonous cocktail.

 

Had she been a Brexit hardliner and already enacted Article 50, as if it were some sort of trophy England had won, her premiership would be in trouble already. So, she is attempting to kick Article 50 into the long grass hoping not to have to enact it until January. Gordon Brown had a similar beginning to his time as PM: A bounce in the polls, a new PM representing a change distracting the people from the nation?s problems, and then he decided not to call the snap general election Douglas Alexander was advising, ending his honeymoon period and defining his time in office. We won?t truly know the measure of May until we start to see how the Brexit negotiations are going, but she is in a no-win situation.

 

All the signs point to May looking to secure a deal that can be defined as a Brexit, but maintains the closest possible links to the EU and as free as possible access to the European single market. Let?s be clear about this: There is no way the UK can have border controls and total access to the single market. Other non-EU countries have access to the single market (Norway, Iceland, Switzerland, even North Korea) but access is not uniform and not as advantageous to trade as membership is and the more access you have, the more sovereignty (over EU regulations and borders) you have to give away.

 

With this comes more money you have to pay in trade levies, up until the point where you may as well pay a membership fee. So, May?s only option is to try to negotiate a fudge that will please everyone, when actually it will only disappoint everyone and even anger the anti-EU hardliners in her party and Ukip. She might, however, be able to persuade England she did the best under the circumstances and that will give her a chance of maintaining party unity, but the honeymoon will very definitely be over.

 

She probably won?t be able to convince Scotland that she did the best deal though. Not only did we vote to stay, Scotland does far better than most out of EU membership overall through our exports and the sheer volume of EU grants. We pull down 17.4 per cent of all grants to the UK with 8.4 per cent of the UK population. Any restriction on access to the single market for Scottish exporters and a failure to replace the EU grants will mean a bad outcome for Scotland and Nicola Sturgeon, and her Scottish Government team knows it. That is why she has been stressing the need for access to the single market and moving the argument to one that all businesses and most Scots can agree on. She can then focus the inevitable disappointment with the post Brexit trade deal in a way that will lead people to considering independence, something many are not yet willing to do as they believe that access to the single market can be maintained.

 

Much of the unionist press have stated that her offer to work with those in Westminster who want to maintain access to the single market is her backing off the independence cause. That is a flawed analysis, as she is clearly just preparing the battlefield to her liking, as shown by the announcement that draft legislation to allow for a second independence referendum will be published within 10 months.

 

May is now starting to face pressure from multiple fronts. The restless natives in Scotland will be on her radar, but the EU is putting diplomatic and public pressure on the UK to move forward on Article 50 as soon as possible. Donald Tusk has pointed out that the ball is the UK?s court, but it?s now time to pass it back, and to sweeten the pill he has been suggesting that ?the EU wants to agree the closest possible relations with the UK?. That means the EU wants open borders, massive trade levies and free access to the UK market, however, the best possible deal when defined by David Davis and his like means closed borders and no fees of any sort. Like I say, everyone is going to be disappointed, and to keep that fact under wraps for as long as possible May won?t detail what she thinks will happen, justifying it as not showing her hand too soon. The trouble is, her hand is empty.

 

The importance of the emerging single market dynamic to the debate cannot be overstated. It helps define the huge difference between leaving a political union and leaving a trading union. If you leave a political union you lose clout in what remains of the political union (understandable and acceptable to most) but get more say over your own affairs. If you leave a trading union you lose trade and your economy suffers. This is the difference between leaving the EU (a trading union) and leaving the UK (a political union).

 

In both cases, if you manage to maintain access to the existing single market your economy will not suffer. As Nicola Sturgeon has figured out, if the UK leaves the EU but maintains a free trade deal, then Scotland can leave the UK, maintain its membership of the EU and by virtue of that maintain its free trade deal with the UK, thus proving independence would not hurt trade with the rest of the UK.

 

This is where the fudged deal becomes even more important. May needs some form of immigration control or she is in trouble and she can?t get that without some sort of trade penalty, most likely the loss of financial passporting. That could mean 50,000 well-paid jobs leaving the city of London, and if Scotland were an independent member of the EU then many, if not most, of those jobs could come here, forming part of the enlarging independence dividend. Independence supporters have to campaign as if a referendum has been called and help get support for Yes to 55 per cent before the new referendum bill is published next year. Then things will get interesting.

[Hasselhoff]

I stopped reading as soon as I read Gordon McIntyre Kemp. One of the guys at Business for Scotland who are one of the biggest sham outfits of the whole Indy experience.

[Maroon Sailor]

Your brain must be squeaky clean by now space fish

 

It's been washed that many times

[Space Mackerel]

I stopped reading as soon as I read Gordon McIntyre Kemp. One of the guys at Business for Scotland who are one of the biggest sham outfits of the whole Indy experience.

Oh well, your loss.

[Old Hearts]

There's plenty oil, loads. Shame you base your outlook on one commodity, most Scottish people don't.

 

You should take a wee drive about Scotland, see for yourself the diverse and natural resources we have. We are practically self sufficient as a nation.

 

Anyway, you're Old and set in your ways, you can't teach an old dug new tricks.

You should tell wee Jimmy Krankie and the Natwits that then....before they write another White Paper fable financially-based purely on oil at a price of $113 a barrel.

[Space Mackerel]

Your brain must be squeaky clean by now space fish

 

It's been washed that many times

 

I'm guessing you're an ex pat as well [emoji106]

[Space Mackerel]

You should tell wee Jimmy Krankie and the Natwits that then....before they write another White Paper fable financially-based purely on oil at a price of $113 a barrel.

Natwits [emoji85]

 

Where do you get your ditties from?

[coconut doug]

People I know who voted yes already getting sick of the sound of sturgeon. Voted the most arrogant leader in the UK recently, her only direction is down. The best opportunity for Indy has passed. It won't happen now, all she can do is prolong Scotland's poor performance by continuing to go on about it

Virtually every aspect of our country has improved since we have had an SNP govt.

 

Its the Tories who keep on about Indy.

 

Polls show SNP support up again.

 

Most Scots don't want to be isolated from Europe and as Brexit reality hits home more people will begin to think that our interests are best served in the EU and best looked after by a competent govt that has Scottish interests at heart. Clinging to the negatives in the universally acknowledged inaccurate Gers figures seems to be the only thing unionists have now. Like right wingers everywhere they are only interested in money but what will it be worth if it continues to collapse at the rate it has since the EU referendum? Economic one club golfers are not convincing anybody the polls show it..

[coconut doug]

I stopped reading as soon as I read Gordon McIntyre Kemp. One of the guys at Business for Scotland who are one of the biggest sham outfits of the whole Indy experience.

All you guys stop reading as soon as someone challenges your anglocentric views. That's when you tell us we are blinkered or launch into insults, or both.

[Maroon Sailor]

I'm guessing you're an ex pat as well [emoji106]

Feck off - I've probably had more grief with the English than you'll ever have. They are good at dishing it out but not good at taking it back.

[Space Mackerel]

Superb, good to see the Record change sides. They ken.

 

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/eus-chief-brexit-negotiator-agrees-8796253

[Space Mackerel]

Feck off - I've probably had more grief with the English than you'll ever have. They are good at dishing it out but not good at taking it back.

That's a shame, I've loads of English mates.

I'm not anti-English, just more pro Scottish.

 

And 1 of my my English mates up here has changed from a No to a Yes since Brexit. Go figure.

[Space Mackerel]

All you guys stop reading as soon as someone challenges your anglocentric views. That's when you tell us we are blinkered or launch into insults, or both.

It's a wee shame that they can't see the big political picture.

[Maroon Sailor]

That's a shame, I've loads of English mates.

I'm not anti-English, just more pro Scottish.

And 1 of my my English mates up here has changed from a No to a Yes since Brexit. Go figure.

Ever worked with lots of English people during the World Cup and Euros ?

[Space Mackerel]

Ever worked with lots of English people during the World Cup and Euros ?

Are you an English hooligan likes? [emoji23]

[Maroon Sailor]

Are you an English hooligan likes? [emoji23]

That's not work that's a hobby for them

[Space Mackerel]

That's not work that's a hobby for them

That BritNat nationalism though, lovely, smashing up foreign pubs and singing 10 German Bombers.

[Old Hearts]

Superb, good to see the Record change sides. They ken.

 

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/eus-chief-brexit-negotiator-agrees-8796253

The Daily Record. Brilliant ha ha ha

[Space Mackerel]

The Daily Record. Brilliant ha ha ha

Guid pro Independence paper now [emoji106]

[Hasselhoff]

All you guys stop reading as soon as someone challenges your anglocentric views. That's when you tell us we are blinkered or launch into insults, or both.

Gordon has history in writing a load of crap hence why I don't trust a word that comes out of his mouth.

 

https://whytepaper.wordpress.com/2016/03/09/the-oil-crash-is-good-for-the-overall-economy-and-gordon-macintyre-kemps-deficit-deception/

[Space Mackerel]

Gordon has history in writing a load of crap hence why I don't trust a word that comes out of his mouth.

 

https://whytepaper.wordpress.com/2016/03/09/the-oil-crash-is-good-for-the-overall-economy-and-gordon-macintyre-kemps-deficit-deception/

I stopped reading at whyte paper as I'm an ignorant uneducated blind nationalist [emoji23]

[Thunderstruck]

Virtually every aspect of our country has improved since we have had an SNP govt.

 

Its the Tories who keep on about Indy.

 

 

I know it is wrong to mock the afflicted but I thought Bob Mortimer on WILTY was the comic highlight of the day and then I read this.

 

We've never had it so good than under the SNP!!! I'm sure the nurses forced to sleep in their cars at the flagship QEUH are grateful.

 

And somebody has mentioned Independence more than your Dear Leader who can barely complete a sentence without making mention.

[Gorgiewave]

Your brain must be squeaky clean by now space fish

 

It's been washed that many times

 

But it's still ram-jam-packed with bullshit.

[Hasselhoff]

Virtually every aspect of our country has improved since we have had an SNP govt.

 

Its the Tories who keep on about Indy.

 

Polls show SNP support up again.

 

Most Scots don't want to be isolated from Europe and as Brexit reality hits home more people will begin to think that our interests are best served in the EU and best looked after by a competent govt that has Scottish interests at heart. Clinging to the negatives in the universally acknowledged inaccurate Gers figures seems to be the only thing unionists have now. Like right wingers everywhere they are only interested in money but what will it be worth if it continues to collapse at the rate it has since the EU referendum? Economic one club golfers are not convincing anybody the polls show it..

So the SNP didn't just hold a special event all about rekindling the independence fire? The Tories would have no need to mention Indy if it wasn't at the forefront of everything the SNP do.

 

Polls show support for Indy declining gradually.

 

A vote for remain was not a vote for independence. Two wrongs don't make a right. If Brexit had involved a new currency for us all, it wouldn't have happened. Indy requires too much change for what is essentially a flag waving exercise caused by an inferiority complex

 

Do you really think repeatedly trying to get over the 50% winning line for Indy is going to leave a country which is united and ready to make Indy Scotland work? If Scotland is to go Indy, you'd want the vast majority all up for the idea so that as many people are motivated as possible to make a go of it. SNP and co just want to fool the ignorant, take advantage of the vulnerable and coax their way to a victory no matter what the cost to our country long term.

[Space Mackerel]

But it's still ram-jam-packed with bullshit.

Another gem from our resident Spanish expert [emoji23]

[Space Mackerel]

So the SNP didn't just hold a special event all about rekindling the independence fire? The Tories would have no need to mention Indy if it wasn't at the forefront of everything the SNP do.

 

Polls show support for Indy declining gradually.

 

A vote for remain was not a vote for independence. Two wrongs don't make a right. If Brexit had involved a new currency for us all, it wouldn't have happened. Indy requires too much change for what is essentially a flag waving exercise caused by an inferiority complex

 

Do you really think repeatedly trying to get over the 50% winning line for Indy is going to leave a country which is united and ready to make Indy Scotland work? If Scotland is to go Indy, you'd want the vast majority all up for the idea so that as many people are motivated as possible to make a go of it. SNP and co just want to fool the ignorant, take advantage of the vulnerable and coax their way to a victory no matter what the cost to our country long term.

It must be absolute craziness to want 5 million highly educated people determine policies that affect their lives. [emoji23]

[Gorgiewave]

People I know who voted yes already getting sick of the sound of sturgeon. Voted the most arrogant leader in the UK recently, her only direction is down. The best opportunity for Indy has passed. It won't happen now, all she can do is prolong Scotland's poor performance by continuing to go on about it

 

I will allow myself a wee dram when she finally goes.

 

I hope you're right.

[Gorgiewave]

It must be absolute craziness to want 5 million highly educated people determine policies that affect their lives. [emoji23]

How many highly educated Scotch persons have you met?

[Old Hearts]

It must be absolute craziness to want 5 million highly educated people determine policies that affect their lives. [emoji23]

Come on, be fair, let's take you and aussieh out the equation.

 

Round it down to 4,999,998

[Space Mackerel]

How many highly educated Scotch persons have you met?

Plenty

[Space Mackerel]

Come on, be fair, let's take you and aussieh out the equation.

 

Round it down to 4,999,998

[Gorgiewave]

By "Mackerel", do you mean "Cadet"?

[Old Hearts]

 

Come on, be fair, let's take you and aussieh out the equation.

 

Round it down to 4,999,998

You are distracting me from watching Team GB winning gold after gold in Paralympics .... Hearing our national anthem so many times. Fantastic.

[SwindonJambo]

It must be absolute craziness to want 5 million highly educated people determine policies that affect their lives. [emoji23]

I think it might be somewhat fanciful to suggest that they're ALL highly educated. And likewise any society anywhere in the World.

[Space Mackerel]

You are distracting me from watching Team GB winning gold after gold in Paralympics .... Hearing our national anthem so many times. Fantastic.

you could've made the mental squad

[Space Mackerel]

I think it might be somewhat fanciful to suggest that they're ALL highly educated. And likewise any society anywhere in the World.

We are so backward here right enough.

[Arnold Rothstein]

 

Come on, be fair, let's take you and aussieh out the equation.

 

Round it down to 4,999,998

European Union? Don't think so.

[Mister T]

 

Come on, be fair, let's take you and aussieh out the equation.

 

Round it down to 4,999,998

Kinrick o'scotland? WTF is that?

[Old Hearts]

you could've made the mental squad

'the mental squad'

 

Dear Lord. I'm actually embarrassed for you.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

The problem was that RBS didn't do the due diligence. Lawyers to blame apparently. Salmond thought he was supporting Scottish business and jobs what's wrong with that? Do you think he should have known ABN amro was a basket case when those trying to take it over didn't know?

RBS's real "basket case" was Countrywide in the USA.