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Sturgeon shelves plan for quick second Scottish independence referendum


Gorgiewave

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Lololololol, MSM at its finest.

 

http://wingsoverscotland.com/and-twirling-always-twirling/

 

 

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So how do you propose to turn Scotland into a strong economy, producing fiscal supluses year on year so that we can continue to fund the NHS, our Education and Infrastructure at current levels?  Scotland could survive alone, I'm sure, but I cannot see huge spending cuts and/or large tax increases not being necessary.  If the latter happens at present, there would probably be a massive brain and talent drain.  Oil, sadly is finished as a cash cow. Shale Oil & Gas in America has seen to that.

 

On the plus side, Food and Agriculture and Tourism are strong, so too Banking in Edinburgh but what else can we rely on to strengthen our economy?  We do 75% of our trade with the rest of the UK where there are no currency or trade barriers.  Southern Ireland, independent for nearly 100 years still does a huge chunk of its trade with the UK and they are very concerned about us leaving.

 

I'm genuinely interested to know what parts of  our economy people think we could develop and make competitive as an independent nation, because ass things stand, accroding to GERS, we currently have a bigger fiscal deficit than Greece!

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Space Mackerel

I'm sure you'll keep us all right. Why don't you cut and paste all your comments from the other brexit / independence threads and you won't have to waste your time retyping them.

[emoji2][emoji2] From yesterday:

 

Lord Ashcroft poll

Voting intentions if General Election held tomorrow:

 

SNP - 54%

Tory - 21%

Labour - 15%

Lib Dems - 5%

Greens - 2%

UKIP - 3%

 

 

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Space Mackerel

So how do you propose to turn Scotland into a strong economy, producing fiscal supluses year on year so that we can continue to fund the NHS, our Education and Infrastructure at current levels? Scotland could survive alone, I'm sure, but I cannot see huge spending cuts and/or large tax increases not being necessary. If the latter happens at present, there would probably be a massive brain and talent drain. Oil, sadly is finished as a cash cow. Shale Oil & Gas in America has seen to that.

 

On the plus side, Food and Agriculture and Tourism are strong, so too Banking in Edinburgh but what else can we rely on to strengthen our economy? We do 75% of our trade with the rest of the UK where there are no currency or trade barriers. Southern Ireland, independent for nearly 100 years still does a huge chunk of its trade with the UK and they are very concerned about us leaving.

 

I'm genuinely interested to know what parts of our economy people think we could develop and make competitive as an independent nation, because ass things stand, accroding to GERS, we currently have a bigger fiscal deficit than Greece!

Swindon Jambo, Houston Jambo? Nobody on here live in Scotland?

 

 

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[emoji2][emoji2] From yesterday:

 

Lord Ashcroft poll

Voting intentions if General Election held tomorrow:

 

SNP - 54%

Tory - 21%

Labour - 15%

Lib Dems - 5%

Greens - 2%

UKIP - 3%

 

 

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I believe that to be accurate but not everyone who votes SNP wants independence and not everyone who wants independence votes SNP.

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[emoji2][emoji2] From yesterday:

 

Lord Ashcroft poll

Voting intentions if General Election held tomorrow:

 

SNP - 54%

Tory - 21%

Labour - 15%

Lib Dems - 5%

Greens - 2%

UKIP - 3%

 

 

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I didn't mean you should do them individually. Just do one big jumbo one and it'll help me get off to sleep easier.
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Space Mackerel

I believe that to be accurate but not everyone who votes SNP wants independence and not everyone who wants independence votes SNP.

[emoji2] Going up! And up and up and up...

 

 

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kingantti1874

Swindon Jambo, Houston Jambo? Nobody on here live in Scotland?

 

 

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Why not break the habit of a lifetime and answer the question.. all rhetoric, no answers.

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[emoji2] Going up! And up and up and up...

 

 

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Wish the economy was going the same way.

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kingantti1874

[emoji2] Going up! And up and up and up...

 

 

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What's going up and up and up? The defecit?

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kingantti1874

The current defecit will have to be cut sharpish - this will see an end to the blatant SNP policing of buying the votes of the stupid.

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Thunderstruck

[emoji2][emoji2] From yesterday:

 

Lord Ashcroft poll

Voting intentions if General Election held tomorrow:

 

SNP - 54%

Tory - 21%

Labour - 15%

Lib Dems - 5%

Greens - 2%

UKIP - 3%

 

 

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Here's another Ashcroft Poll which, in light of what we are told by SNP, might appear counter-intuitive at the very least.

 

https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/poll-suggests-scots-back-keeping-trident/?utm_source=FB&utm_medium=FacebookPage&utm_campaign=social

 

So, do we put implicit faith in all polls or only those that massage our prejudices/preferences?

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[emoji2] Going up! And up and up and up...

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Serious question, you seem to have all the answers, explain to us how the SNP having a 54% projected vote in a GE but the poll last week has Independence at <44%, why are they not skooshing the separation vote?

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kingantti1874

Serious question, you seem to have all the answers, explain to us how the SNP having a 54% projected vote in a GE but the poll last week has Independence at <44%, why are they not skooshing the separation vote?

He can't.. the SNP either

 

1. Believe, given the defecit and the unavoidable austerity and tax hikes mean this is not in the countries best interest or

2. Believe They would get smashed at the polls..

 

That's why they've shat it Let's face it, the truth is it's both...

 

I want the referendum - lets go.. ..

 

it'll be 70:30 when the turkeys realise what they are being asked to vote for, put an end to this nonsense for a generation..

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Serious question, you seem to have all the answers, explain to us how the SNP having a 54% projected vote in a GE but the poll last week has Independence at <44%, why are they not skooshing the separation vote?

The answer is simple and confirms why Indy is sunk.

 

Many people think Scotland is best represented by Westminister so are happy for SNP to fulfil that role. That's the opposite of Indy. In fact if the polling for a GE would be 100% SNP that would be a disaster for Indy.

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Captain Sausage

Swindon Jambo, Houston Jambo? Nobody on here live in Scotland?

 

 

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Live in Aberdeen boss.

 

And despite the amount of posts you've added to this thread, I've yet to see anything in there which discusses the points I raised.

 

Rather than copy and paste someone else's pish, why not actively engage in a proper debate. Take apart my argument. Discuss it.

 

I'm sure we'd both learn that way, but as it is, all I see is you blustering and having digs at people, with zero retort to any argument.

 

It's absolutely symptomatic of the Yes vote. Nicola says it'll be okay, so it'll be okay. any argument to the contrary is heresy and beneath a yes voter to respond to.

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Seymour M Hersh

The real work being not sitting on an Internet forum all day but losing my business access to the EU market.

 

You've not a clue, not a single clue how things work.

 

floods of tears in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1!!

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The current defecit will have to be cut sharpish - this will see an end to the blatant SNP policing of buying the votes of the stupid.

 

It will have to be cut anyway, whether in or out of the UK.  UK National debt is now ?1.6trn - a staggering figure. Growing by ?70bn a year, with Scotland contributing ?15bn.  Going back to my earlier question, dodged by Space Mackerel, I'm genuinely interested to hear from anyone with a decent knowledge of Economics, what can be done to lift the Economy, in or out of the UK.  Don't forget that the much lauded EU Infrastructure Fund will have to be cut drastically as with the UK leaving, the EU loses its 2nd biggest Economy and Contributor, although once our future relationship with the EU has been negotiated, I suspect it will still involve paying them money as Non Members Norway and Switzerland both do.

 

An Independent Scotland would have to set up its own currency initially at least and with no Credit History, Financial Institutions will not be keen on lending it money and will hike up interest rates accordingly.  Some bits of our economy are strong and fair play to them, but at present it's not enough to support the whole country with oil dead as a dodo.

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She and the rest of those thin-lipped gonks had their chance and they blew it.

 

So, as the chant goes, she can stick her independence up her arse.

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I'm still intrigued by this plan for the SNP to conduct the National Survey into why people voted No. What the **** are expecting to find out? And even if they did, what would they actually do to attract No voters?

 

No voters don't put stickers on their cars or attend rallies. They won't partake in a Nationalist survey. The silent majority.

 

I'll save them the trouble. No voters probably identified with Britain in some way, from next to nothing to full on Rule Britannia and weren't looking for a messy divorce. Then the SNP published the white paper.

 

Invoice on the way to Castle Krankie

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Captain Sausage

Feel the seethe from the loony Yoonys

 

 

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You're either a pathetic troll or an idiot. Either way, contribute to the discussion or GTF.

 

Yet again you fail to put forward any counter arguments and resort to more inane guff.

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Space Mackerel

You're either a pathetic troll or an idiot. Either way, contribute to the discussion or GTF.

 

Yet again you fail to put forward any counter arguments and resort to more inane guff.

Inane guff that the GERS figures are.

 

Ok then.

 

 

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Feel the seethe from the loony Yoonys

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There is no seethe here - just balanced, reasoned and civilised debate. Still waiting for those plans to boost the economy and close the ?15bn public sector spending gap.

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What a terrible argument. Properly moronic.

 

The blind who are voting for independence appear not to give a shit about the rest of us, who will have to cover a significant (whether that is ?9,10,15,20bn a year) deficit just to keep things where they are.

 

What planet do these people live on. Scotland has been a net contributor and a net receiver of UK finds at different times over the last few hundred years. At the moment, we are significantly funded by the rest of the U.K.

 

People arguing that the economy isn't the only thing to consider would be right, if the black hole wasn't so farcically large. ?15bn works out at ?4500pa (and that's on the assumption that everyone between 16-65 was contributing).

 

If me and my wife had to stump up ?10-15k a year in additional tax, we'd be headed down south tomorrow. I'm sure that applies to nearly everybody.

 

The fact that such a large proportion of our society would vote for this absolutely baffles me. It's not like 'things are bad now, might as well vote for change and see what happens' kind of scenario. It's blatantly obvious that independence would be catastrophic for Scotland in the current climate.

This guy gets it. Well said.

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Space Mackerel

There is no seethe here - just balanced, reasoned and civilised debate. Still waiting for those plans to boost the economy and close the ?15bn public sector spending gap.

 

?15 billion lololololol

 

807310e69a90265e57ee490767395828.jpg

 

 

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Inane guff that the GERS figures are.

Ok then.

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In what way is Public Spending exceeding Tax revenues inane guff?

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Space Mackerel

In what way is Public Spending exceeding Tax revenues inane guff?

See above and stop being blinded by MSM pish.

 

 

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Captain Sausage

The ?12.5bn goes on EU membership, national projects and DEBT SERVICING. How can you just wipe it away and pretend we wouldn't deal with that in an independent Scotland?

 

Do you genuinely take no time to understand what you post?

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Space Mackerel

The ?12.5bn goes on EU membership, national projects and DEBT SERVICING. How can you just wipe it away and pretend we wouldn't deal with that in an independent Scotland?

 

Do you genuinely take no time to understand what you post?

53adcc6e1d97482353ec1d9b4e0aea03.jpg

 

 

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See above and stop being blinded by MSM pish.

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So you don't think Scotland would incur any of those costs included in the ?12.5bn allocated charge? No service charges on debt, EU Membership for free and we'd have no trade deficit. No costs attributable to Scotland's FCO?

 

I actually genuinely appreciate the answer you've come back with this time. The truth as always, is somewhere in between. That ?15bn figure does seem to be overblown, but the ?2.5bn is based on some absolutely ridiculous and unrealistic assumptions. Where did it come from, as a matter of interest ?

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Space Mackerel

So you don't think Scotland would incur any of those costs included in the ?12.5bn allocated charge? No service charges on debt, EU Membership for free and we'd have no trade deficit. No costs attributable to Scotland's FCO?

 

I actually genuinely appreciate the answer you've come back with this time. The truth as always, is somewhere in between. That ?15bn figure does seem to be overblown, but the ?2.5bn is based on some absolutely ridiculous and unrealistic assumptions. Where did it come from, as a matter of interest ?

Why don't you do a bit of searching and find out why the GERS figures were brought into bearing.

 

Starter for 10. Ian Lang.

 

 

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Captain Sausage

Why don't you do a bit of searching and find out why the GERS figures were brought into bearing.

 

Starter for 10. Ian Lang.

 

 

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So do you believe Scotland will have no debt repayment, FCO share or EU membership fees if it becomes independent?

 

Yes or no please.

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Space Mackerel

So do you believe Scotland will have no debt repayment, FCO share or EU membership fees if it becomes independent?

 

Yes or no please.

I'm watching the tennis, guid Scoattish laddie on court the now, doing things that Timmy Henman never managed. Keeping the Union Flag flying high [emoji2]

 

 

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Captain Sausage

I'm watching the tennis, guid Scoattish laddie on court the now, doing things that Timmy Henman never managed. Keeping the Union Flag flying high [emoji2]

 

 

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:rofl:

 

I'll take that as a no then.

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Swindon Jambo, Houston Jambo? Nobody on here live in Scotland?

 

 

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Houston's just down the road from Bridge of Weir the last time I looked.

 

:beatnik2:

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Space Mackerel

:rofl:

 

I'll take that as a no then.

Take it anyway you want.

I'm just assuming you work in the oil industry and completely uneducated about how the modern world works.

 

 

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Captain Sausage

Take it anyway you want.

I'm just assuming you work in the oil industry and completely uneducated about how the modern world works.

 

 

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I guess that says more about you than me.

 

You've failed to answer any of my points. You've called me uneducated (I'm a chartered engineer btw...) and yet you've offered nothing to this debate.

 

You've not exactly furthered the independence argument this evening.

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Space Mackerel

I guess that says more about you than me.

 

You've failed to answer any of my points. You've called me uneducated (I'm a chartered engineer btw...) and yet you've offered nothing to this debate.

 

You've not exactly furthered the independence argument this evening.

I couldn't care less if I've furthered the independence cause.

I'm just pointing out the facts that there's enough dingles on here who read far too much MSM content and don't look further afield. Brain washed by Sky, the BBC and the red tops.

 

Mrs May reading out racist Twitter trolls at PMQs today?

 

http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-reads-tweet-racist-twitter-troll-attack-jeremy-corbyn-pmqs/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I couldn't care less if I've furthered the independence cause.

I'm just pointing out the facts that there's enough dingles on here who read far too much MSM content and don't look further afield. Brain washed by Sky, the BBC and the red tops.

Mrs May reading out racist Twitter trolls at PMQs today? http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-reads-tweet-racist-twitter-troll-attack-jeremy-corbyn-pmqs/

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That article you posted claiming to show Scotland's true budget deficit to be ?2.5bn has been your only material argument so far. I don't doubt you for a second that there is a degree of propoganda in the MSM but the assumptions and reasoning as to Scotland not having any share of the ?12.5 bn allocated are absolutely ludicrously daft. No interest charges? Give me strength! For the 2nd time where did that article come from? It reads like propoganda from the other side.

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Space Mackerel

That article you posted claiming to show Scotland's true budget deficit to be ?2.5bn has been your only material argument so far. I don't doubt you for a second that there is a degree of propoganda in the MSM but the assumptions and reasoning as to Scotland not having any share of the ?12.5 bn allocated are absolutely ludicrously daft. No interest charges? Give me strength! For the 2nd time where did that article come from? It reads like propoganda from the other side.

You tell everyone on here what it should be then.

While you're there, post the figures for Wales and NI thanks.

 

 

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Captain Sausage

I couldn't care less if I've furthered the independence cause.

I'm just pointing out the facts that there's enough dingles on here who read far too much MSM content and don't look further afield. Brain washed by Sky, the BBC and the red tops.

 

Mrs May reading out racist Twitter trolls at PMQs today?

 

http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-reads-tweet-racist-twitter-troll-attack-jeremy-corbyn-pmqs/

 

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I'd be interested in finding out when exactly you posted any facts?

 

You posted one picture with numbers in it, which was somewhere between incredibly naive and a bag of lies.

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Space Mackerel

 

I couldn't care less if I've furthered the independence cause.

I'm just pointing out the facts that there's enough dingles on here who read far too much MSM content and don't look further afield. Brain washed by Sky, the BBC and the red tops.

 

Mrs May reading out racist Twitter trolls at PMQs today?

 

http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-reads-tweet-racist-twitter-troll-attack-jeremy-corbyn-pmqs/

 

I'd be interested in finding out when exactly you posted any facts?

 

You posted one picture with numbers in it, which was skmewhere between incredibly naive and a bag of lies.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Not much of a engineer when you can't quote properly on a forum [emoji53]

 

 

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I couldn't care less if I've furthered the independence cause.

I'm just pointing out the facts that there's enough dingles on here who read far too much MSM content and don't look further afield. Brain washed by Sky, the BBC and the red tops.

 

Mrs May reading out racist Twitter trolls at PMQs today?

 

http://evolvepolitics.com/theresa-may-reads-tweet-racist-twitter-troll-attack-jeremy-corbyn-pmqs/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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What's the secret of how you are so superior and knowledgeable? Is it higher than average omega-3?
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Space Mackerel

What's the secret of how you are so superior and knowledgeable? Is it higher than average omega-3?

I just read different shit. You should try it.

 

 

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?15 billion lololololol

 

807310e69a90265e57ee490767395828.jpg

 

 

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You do realise that if independent and in the European Union those costs for foreign affairs, international development and for things like defence and things which are UK wide costs at the moment.

 

Meaning the deficit would be a lot higher than ?2.5billion.

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