******The Official EUROPEAN ( merged ) Thread******

[IveSeenTheLight]

Thanks that's the kind of info I was after.

 

Has the co-efficient system changed in the last 10 years or so? I'm sure once upon a time the points came from actual results....so a win and a loss and going out was better than two losses....I might be talking rubbish however.

 

Yes it has changed.

Not only for the rounds but also the association factor

 

Here's the latest

 

 

UEFA Europa League points system 

First qualifying round elimination ? 0.25 points 

Second qualifying round elimination ? 0.5 points

Third qualifying round elimination ? 1 point 

Play-off elimination ? 1.5 points 

Group stage win ? 2 points 

Group stage draw ? 1 point

Since 2009/10, clubs have been guaranteed a minimum of two points if they reach the group stage and are awarded an additional point if they get to the quarter-finals, semi-finals or final.

*Penalty shoot-outs do not affect the calculation system.

[Jeff]

This really does look in the bag

[IveSeenTheLight]

If we are seeded in round 1/2 win all four games and then say go out in round 3 after a win and a loss would there be any chance We'd be seeded in round 3 the following year or will it take several years of us winning games combined with other Scottish teams doing well to improve the co-efficient?

 

If you go out in the 3rd round, you'll drop around 0.5 coefficient points.

[Daveandal]

Thanks to Statto and I've seen the light. Feel up to speed now.

 

So we really need to make the group stages to help us in future years....anything else is at best treading water.

[Gorgie_Rules]

Thanks to Statto and I've seen the light. Feel up to speed now.

 

So we really need to make the group stages to help us in future years....anything else is at best treading water.

 

Yep. Or Celtic to start putting in performances in Europe which reflect the size of club they are, and the likes of St Johnstone etc not losing to Armenian pub teams

[Statto]

If Celtic, Aberdeen, Hearts and Rangers/Hibs all make next season's Europa League group stage and win 2 games each, our coefficient for the following season would be 15.260, which was enough to have been seeded in this season's Europa League play off round and on the borderline for entering pot 3 in the group stage.

 

Our coefficient for the previous 4 seasons is 4.460. We would earn 6.000 points for making the groups and winning 2 games. Scotland would earn 24.000 points if all 4 clubs achieved this, we'd receive 20% of 24.000 on top of our 6.000 (4.800 = 10.800) to add to our 4.460 = 15.260.

[IveSeenTheLight]

If Celtic, Aberdeen, Hearts and Rangers/Hibs all make next season's Europa League group stage and win 2 games each, our coefficient for the following season would be 15.260, which was enough to have been seeded in this season's Europa League play off round and on the borderline for entering pot 3 in the group stage.

 

Our coefficient for the previous 4 seasons is 4.460. We would earn 6.000 points for making the groups and winning 2 games. Scotland would earn 24.000 points if all 4 clubs achieved this, we'd receive 20% of 24.000 on top of our 6.000 (4.800 = 10.800) to add to our 4.460 = 15.260.

 

 

Very true, but it would be very hard for all 4 teams to reach the group stage.

 

Right now, you guys will be seeded for the 2nd round (not the third) and we are unlikely to be seeded in the 2nd round.

Same with Sevco / Hibs, they'll be the lowest seeds of us three

 

Therefore, the chances of us getting through the 2nd, 3rd and play-off rounds all against higher seeded teams is a stretch too far.

 

Realistically, if we all progressed to the 3rd round (Celtic to drop into the play/offs or group stage), then we may have a chance to be seeded in the 3rd round. From then we should realistically be looking to reach 3rd at least and then push on to the Play-off round.

 

Sad and realistic it may be, but you'd have got better odds on Leceister winning the premiership this season, than all 4 of us reaching the group stages.

[Statto]

 

Today's games - Wednesday 11th May

 

Slovenia

15:00 - Maribor v Rudar

15:00 - Celje v Olimija

We need Maribor to win the league. They're currently level on points with Olimija but have the worse head-to-head record. There will be 2 games left after today.

 

 

Maribor lost 3-2 and Olimija won 3-1. Olimpija 3 clear at the top with 2 to play.

 

Maribor would need to win their remaining 2 and Olimpija lose or draw their last 2.

[Euan]

 

Today's games - Wednesday 11th May

 

 

England

20:00 - Liverpool v Chelsea

We need Liverpool to finish top-6 (or top-7 if Man United win the Cup). A win puts them 1 ahead in 7th with 1 game to go.

 

Edit: 1-1, this one is looking pretty unlikely with Southampton at home for the last game.

 

 

Austria

19:30 - Sturm Graz v Mattersburg

19:30 - Wolfsberger v Admira

We need Admira to finish 4th ahead of Sturm Graz, they're behind on goal difference (8) with 2 games to go.

 

Edit: Great result, Admira win while Sturm Graz draw. Admira have 2nd placed Rapid Wien at home which could be a tough fixture, though Rapid have nothing to play for.

 

 

Denmark

17:00 - SonderjyskE v Viborg

19:00 - Hobro v Midtjylland

We need SonderjyskE to finish 2nd-4th. They're 2nd, 7 clear of 5th, 6 clear of Midtjylland, 4 games to play after today.

 

Edit: Both sides won. Why does it matter if Midjylland win? It's probably more of a worry that  SonderjyskE finish top than 5th now

 

 

Greece

17:15 - Panionios v Panathinaikos

19:30 - POAK v AEK

We need Panionios to finish 4th in the play off. AEK and Panathinaikos start with a 2 point advantage, based on their regular season performance. This is the 1st games of the play off.

 

Edit: PAOK win, Panionios lose. They are currently in 4th position as required.

 

Poland

19:30 - Lechia Gdansk v Legia Warsaw

19:30 - Ruch Chorzow v Piast Gliwice

We need Legia Warsaw to win the league, they're 3 ahead with 2 to play. Teams are ranked on points, then points from the regular season. Since Legia had more points than Piast in the regular season, if Legia equal or better Piast's result, this would confirm a seeding place.     

 

Edit: Poor result as Legia lose and Piast win comfortably. Hopefully they can hold on though.

 

 

Serbia

18:00 - Partizan v Javor Ivanjica (Cup Final)

We need Partizan to lose the Cup Final and finish outside the top-3 (Currently 2nd) or Vojvodina (4th) to finish outside the top-3 if Javor Ivanjica win the Cup, or outside the top-4 if Partizan win the Cup.

 

Edit: Partizan win the cup.

 

 

Slovenia

15:00 - Maribor v Rudar

15:00 - Celje v Olimija

We need Maribor to win the league. They're currently level on points with Olimija but have the worse head-to-head record. There will be 2 games left after today.

 

Edit: Statto has already covered this one, but this is done for. 

 

[Statto]

Thanks for the summary Euan, appreciated.

 

 

Today's games - Thursday 12th May

 

 

Denmark

17:00 - Randers v Brondby

19:00 - Aalborg v Copenhagen

We need SonderjyskE to finish 2nd-4th. They're 4 behind Copenhagen (1st) with 4 games to play after today. Brondby are 5th, 10 behind.

 

 

Tomorrow's games - Friday 13th May

 

 

Albania

18:00 - Skenderbeu Korce v Partizani Tirana

We need Skenderbeu to win the league, they're 5 clear of Partizani with 2 games to go. A win or draw confirms a seeding place.     

 

 

Slovakia

19:30 - Podbrezova v Spartak Trnava

19:30 - Trencin v Zilina

We need Trnava to finish outside the top-4, they're 4th, 3 points ahead of Zilina with 2 games to go. Zilina must finish with more points as Trnava have the better head-to-head record.

[jambojnr]

How many possible leagues with viable scenarios are still left for the 3 that are still needed?

[Gorgie_Rules]

Statto, have you any idea how the pools of teams are made up before the draw? I think they announce them the night before the draw and is around 8 teams in each? Is there any logic behind it?

 

Cheers for the updates so far, top work

[Jambo in Yorkshire]

This is what you need.

 

In the qualifying rounds the teams are divided into groups with the same number of seeded and unseeded teams. A few hours before the draw a computer system is used to prepare the groups such that teams of the same association are not in the same group and and that all groups are about equal strength (in terms of ranking). Then all clubs in each group are ordered randomly and identified by a number. For these draws there are only two bowls with numbered balls, one with the seeded numbers and one with the unseeded numbers. The draw determines the pairs in the groups: e.g. (7 vs 4) which means that the 7th team of each group plays against the 4th club of each group.

 

For the draw of the 1st round the 102 teams are divided into 9 groups of 10 teams and 1 group of 12 teams. For the groups with 10 teams the pairs (9 vs 4), (2 vs 6), (7 vs 5), (10 vs 3), and (8 vs 1) were drawn, and for the group with 12 teams the pairs (8 vs 1), (10 vs 5), (6 vs 7), (11 vs 3), (4 vs 12), and (9 vs 2) were drawn.

 

The 2nd paragraph refers to the first round draw last year.

[Statto]

How many possible leagues with viable scenarios are still left for the 3 that are still needed?

 

There's still 16 that can potentially go our way.

 

Albania is almost there.

 

Denmark should go for us but there's still a chance that it goes against us.

 

The rest of the leagues, we need some turnarounds.

 

There are 5 Cup finals to be played. We'd only need 1 or 2 of these to go in our favour.

[Daveandal]

So its not certain but looking ok....

[Jeff]

Surely Bulgaria is a sure thing

[Statto]

Surely Bulgaria is a sure thing

 

Yes, it's already won. That was one of the ones that brought us down from 5 to 3.     

[Statto]

Copenhagen won 2-0 tonight. 7 clear of SonderjyskE at the top with 4 games to go. Brondby won so are 7 points behind SonderjyskE in 5th.

[Jambomuzz]

what are the chances that hearts assuming we make it through the first qualifying round wouls draw a bulgarian team in the second round?

im away there.for my holiday that coincides with the second leg, and if luck were on my side then i would have an oppwrtunity to make the game.

[8skacel8]

what are the chances that hearts assuming we make it through the first qualifying round wouls draw a bulgarian team in the second round?

im away there.for my holiday that coincides with the second leg, and if luck were on my side then i would have an oppwrtunity to make the game.

 

If we are seeded then the second leg would be at home.

[Statto]

If we are seeded then the second leg would be at home.

 

It can change if, for example two teams from the same city are drawn in the same round and are both seeded/unseeded, they don't usually arrange the games for the same day when the teams are in close proximity to each other. It's extremely rare for Europa League games to not be played on a Thursday. They'd usually switch one of the fixtures so the seeded team may play at home in the first leg.

 

As for drawing a Bulgarian team, all Bulgarian clubs that will qualify for the Europa League will enter the 1st and 2nd qualifying round, all are ranked below Hearts so all will probably be unseeded in the 2nd qualifying round.

[CavySlaveJambo]

I am still hoping on Malta Hibs/Birkirkara and which of Sliema and Balzan win the cup.

[RENE]

Albania :  Skenderbeau 0-0 at half time. 

[Jambomuzz]

It can change if, for example two teams from the same city are drawn in the same round and are both seeded/unseeded, they don't usually arrange the games for the same day when the teams are in close proximity to each other. It's extremely rare for Europa League games to not be played on a Thursday. They'd usually switch one of the fixtures so the seeded team may play at home in the first leg.

 

As for drawing a Bulgarian team, all Bulgarian clubs that will qualify for the Europa League will enter the 1st and 2nd qualifying round, all are ranked below Hearts so all will probably be unseeded in the 2nd qualifying round.

so the chances are if we are seeded then the home leg would be the second leg. therefor i would miss out. and if we are unseeded then we cannot draw them anyway! thats unfortunate.

[Statto]

Albanian result, Skenderbeu lose 1-0.

 

They now only have a 2 point lead going into the final game of the season. If Partizani win, Skenderbeu MUST win as Partizani have the better head-to-head record.

 

 

It's looking like we have lost Slovakia. Trnava (who we need to lose) are getting beat 2-0, however Zilina (who we need to win) are getting beat 5-2! There is a 3 point difference but Trnava have the better head-to-head record. Zilina Hibsed it.

 

 

Bad, bad day.

 

Prematurely I'll say 3/15 required.

[Statto]

^^^I missed taking out Partizan winning the Serbian Cup, 3/14 required.

 

Today's games - Saturday 14th May

 

 

Denmark

17:00 - Midtjylland v SonderjyskE

We need SonderjyskE to finish 2nd-4th. They're currently 2nd, 7 behind 1st and 7 ahead of 5th with 4 games to play. A win or a draw is okay.

 

 

Israel

17:00 - Bnei Sakhnin v Hapoel Ra'anana

17:45 - Maccabi Haifa v Hapoel Be'er Sheva

17:45 - Beitar Jerusalem v Maccabi Tel Aviv

We need Maccabi Tel Aviv to win the league, they're 5 behind Hapoel Be'er Sheva with 2 games to play, they do have the better goal difference if they finish level. We also need Maccabi Haifa to finish outside the top-4 and lose the Cup Final (May 23rd). They're currently 4th, 3 points ahead of Bnei Sakhnin with the same goal difference.

If Be'er Sheva win or Maccabi Tel Aviv don't win, we lose 1 of our 14. Although, if Be'er Sheva and Bnei Sakhnin win, it moves Maccabi Haifa out of the top-4 going into the last game of the season.

 

 

Serbia

18:00 - Vojvodina v Borac Cacak

We need Vojvodina to finish outside the top-4. They're 1 point ahead of 5th with 2 games left. They had more points than Radnicki Nis (5th) in the regular season so must finish with less points to finish below them.

 

 

Slovenia

15:55 - Rudar v Olimija

15:55 - Krka v Maribor

We need Maribor to win the league, they're 3 behind with 2 to play but have a worse head-to-head record so must finish with more points. If Maribor don't better Olimija's result today, we lose Slovenia.

 

 

We can't confirm any today but can lose 2.

[Michael_Jackson]

.

[Statto]

10 minutes to go. Maribor winning, Olimpija drawing!

 

Hold!!!

[Statto]

90+4 winner for Olimpija.

 

3/13 required.

[Sandy Clark]

Statto, thank you so much for all the updates. It's been very much appreciated and has gotten me into checking scores in leagues I knew nothing about.

[Statto]

 

^^^I missed taking out Partizan winning the Serbian Cup, 3/14 required.

 

Today's games - Saturday 14th May

 

 

Denmark

FT - Midtjylland 3-2 SonderjyskE

We need SonderjyskE to finish 2nd-4th. They're currently 2nd, 7 behind 1st and 7 ahead of 5th with 4 games to play. A win or a draw is okay.

 

-Not great, potentially only 4 ahead of 5th after this weekend with 3 games to play, could have been more comfortable.

 

Israel

FT - Bnei Sakhnin 1-1 Hapoel Ra'anana

FT - Maccabi Haifa 2-1 Hapoel Be'er Sheva

FT - Beitar Jerusalem 0-2 Maccabi Tel Aviv

We need Maccabi Tel Aviv to win the league, they're 5 behind Hapoel Be'er Sheva with 2 games to play, they do have the better goal difference if they finish level. We also need Maccabi Haifa to finish outside the top-4 and lose the Cup Final (May 23rd). They're currently 4th, 3 points ahead of Bnei Sakhnin with the same goal difference.

If Be'er Sheva win or Maccabi Tel Aviv don't win, we lose 1 of our 14. Although, if Be'er Sheva and Bnei Sakhnin win, it moves Maccabi Haifa out of the top-4 going into the last game of the season.

 

-The title will be decided on the last day of the season, from 5 behind with 2 to go to 2 behind is a good result. We've lost the 2nd possible seeding place from Israel, although considering we needed a Cup result from that one as well, it's not so bad.

 

Serbia

FT - Vojvodina 2-0 Borac Cacak

We need Vojvodina to finish outside the top-4. They're 1 point ahead of 5th with 2 games left. They had more points than Radnicki Nis (5th) in the regular season so must finish with less points to finish below them.

 

-4 ahead, Radnicki Nis must win their last 2 and Vojvodina drop points in their last game.

 

Slovenia

FT - Rudar 0-1 Olimija

FT - Krka 1-3 Maribor

We need Maribor to win the league, they're 3 behind with 2 to play but have a worse head-to-head record so must finish with more points. If Maribor don't better Olimija's result today, we lose Slovenia.

 

-As posted earlier, a 94th minute winner to take the title.

 

 

We can't confirm any today but can lose 2.

 

 

We lost 2 today.

 

3/12 required.

 

Squeaky bum time.

[Fxxx the SPFL]

We lost 2 today.

 

3/12 required.

 

Squeaky bum time.

are any of the twelve a stick on or are they all hanging by a bawhair

[Statto]

are any of the twelve a stick on or are they all hanging by a bawhair

 

The safest one looks Denmark, our team will be between 4 and 7 points clear of 5th place, depending on results tomorrow, with 3 games left.

 

The Albanian and Polish leagues will go to the last game of the season with our teams ahead. Both have had chances in their last couple of games to win their leagues.

 

The Greek play offs have only just begun, our team are bottom, where we need them, still with 5 games to go.

 

There is also 5 Cup finals which gives us another 5 chances.

 

None of them really certainties just now. I've said the safest looking one is Denmark but the fixtures for the chasing teams tomorrow look quite easy, they should win. games against the 10th and 11th placed teams who have nothing left to play for. It could realistically be 4 points between 4 teams with 3 games left.

[hughesie27]

are any of the twelve a stick on or are they all hanging by a bawhair

Quite a few cup finals in that 12.

[Fxxx the SPFL]

The safest one looks Denmark, our team will be between 4 and 7 points clear of 5th place, depending on results tomorrow, with 3 games left.

 

The Albanian and Polish leagues will go to the last game of the season with our teams ahead. Both have had chances in their last couple of games to win their leagues.

 

The Greek play offs have only just begun, our team are bottom, where we need them, still with 5 games to go.

 

There is also 5 Cup finals which gives us another 5 chances.

 

None of them really certainties just now. I've said the safest looking one is Denmark but the fixtures for the chasing teams tomorrow look quite easy, they should win. games against the 10th and 11th placed teams who have nothing left to play for. It could realistically be 4 points between 4 teams with 3 games left.

cheers Statto that's made it a bit clearer hopefully looking OK

[Statto]

Today's matches - Sunday 15th May

 

 

England

15:00 - Southampton v Crystal Palace

15:00 - West Brom v Liverpool

15:00 - Stoke v West Ham

We need Liverpool to finish top-6 (or top-7 if Man United win the Cup). They're 8th, 1 point behind Southampton (7th) and 3 points behind West Ham (6th). If Southampton draw or lose, Liverpool go above them with a win, if West Ham lose and Liverpool win (either by more than one goal) then Liverpool go above West Ham, if West Ham lose by one and Liverpool win by one, they're level on goal difference, we need Liverpool to score 3 more than West Ham or if the results are; for example - Stoke 1-0 West Ham and West Brom 1-2 Liverpool, there will be a Play off between West Ham and Liverpool to decide the European place, unless Southampton lose, then both West Ham and Liverpool qualify with no need for a Play off. Additionally, if Liverpool don't finish in a European place, Sevilla can beat them in the Europa League Final for a seeding place. One of these to confirm...     

 

 

Austria

16:30 - Austria Vienna v Sturm Graz

16:30 - Admira v Rapid Vienna

We need Admira to finish 4th and lose the Cup final. They're currently 4th, 2 ahead of Sturm Graz but with a worse goal difference. This is the last league game.

 

 

Poland

17:00 - Legia Warsaw v Pogon Szczecin

17:00 - Piast Gliwice v Zaglebie Lubin

We need Legia Warsaw to win the league, they need to equal or better Piast Gliwice's result to confirm a seeding place.     

 

 

Serbia

18:00 - Radnicki Nis v Partizan

We need Vojvodina (3rd) to finish outside the top-4, Radnicki Nis (5th) are 4 behind with 1 game left after today. They had less points in the regular season so must finish with more points to finish above Vojvodina. They must win today or we lose Serbia.

[CollyWolly]

Statto. Can you explain why the English results matter to us ? I'd have thought all the teams involved in that scenario would be seeded way above us anyway ?

[Statto]

Statto. Can you explain why the English results matter to us ? I'd have thought all the teams involved in that scenario would be seeded way above us anyway ?

 

The Champions League and Europa League winners from this season will enter next season's Champions League. If they have qualified for the Europa League in their domestic seasons, their place is vacated and the EL access list is changed. The change would include the Cypriot Cup winners entering QR3 instead of QR2. All 3 Cypriot teams entering the EL are ranked above us, if 1 of them enters a round later, it means there is 1 less team ranked above us in the 2nd round.

 

Liverpool's opponents in the Europa League Final, Sevilla have already qualified for the Europa League in La Liga, so if Liverpool also qualify, it doesn't matter who wins the Final, if they don't, Sevilla can still win for us.

[davemclaren]

The Champions League and Europa League winners from this season will enter next season's Champions League. If they have qualified for the Europa League in their domestic seasons, their place is vacated and the EL access list is changed. The change would include the Cypriot Cup winners entering QR3 instead of QR2. All 3 Cypriot teams entering the EL are ranked above us, if 1 of them enters a round later, it means there is 1 less team ranked above us in the 2nd round.

 

Liverpool's opponents in the Europa League Final, Sevilla have already qualified for the Europa League in La Liga, so if Liverpool also qualify, it doesn't matter who wins the Final, if they don't, Sevilla can still win for us.

Cypriot teams above us. Shows how far we have fallen. Of course they tend to be funded by Russian millionaires...

[August Landmesser]

How does Ukraine winning the Eurovision affect us? Shocker tbh...

 

Sent from my LG-H340n using Tapatalk

[CollyWolly]

How does Ukraine winning the Eurovision affect us? Shocker tbh...

Sent from my LG-H340n using Tapatalk

My missus has decided to 'Vote Leave' based on that result !!! CWazeeeee old burd.

[CollyWolly]

The Champions League and Europa League winners from this season will enter next season's Champions League. If they have qualified for the Europa League in their domestic seasons, their place is vacated and the EL access list is changed. The change would include the Cypriot Cup winners entering QR3 instead of QR2. All 3 Cypriot teams entering the EL are ranked above us, if 1 of them enters a round later, it means there is 1 less team ranked above us in the 2nd round.

 

Liverpool's opponents in the Europa League Final, Sevilla have already qualified for the Europa League in La Liga, so if Liverpool also qualify, it doesn't matter who wins the Final, if they don't, Sevilla can still win for us.

Cheers. Great work BTW.

[peter_hmfc]

How does Ukraine winning the Eurovision affect us? Shocker tbh...

 

Sent from my LG-H340n using Tapatalk

 

1 seeding place confirmed :sunny: .

[PeterintheRain]

Yes it has changed.

Not only for the rounds but also the association factor

 

Here's the latest

 

   It changed from being a co-efficient to being not a co-efficient.  It is now a system rigged absolutely in favour of 4 leagues and will prevent any diddy team from ever being able to challenge them. 

 

    Will people stop talking about the co-efficient. It doesn't exist anymore.

[Statto]

Liverpool finish outside the top-7, we now need Sevilla to win the Europa League for a seeding place.

 

In Austria, after 30 minutes, Admira are losing, we could be losing Austria...

[West Jambo]

Admira now two down with 25 left but Sturm Graz still 0-0 away to Austria Vienna and Sturm now down to ten men. Stays like this and we keep Austria in the mix.

 

Also, Legia winning and Piast losing - very much going our way at HT in Poland

[RENE]

Admira now two down with 25 left but Sturm Graz still 0-0 away to Austria Vienna and Sturm now down to ten men. Stays like this and we keep Austria in the mix.

 

Also, Legia winning and Piast losing - very much going our way at HT in Poland

 

Austria Vienna also missed a penalty!!!!

[West Jambo]

1-0 Austria Vienna with 5 mins to go

[RENE]

Damn you just beat me.....

[RENE]

Austria Vienna two up