Latest SNP embarassment

[aussieh]

All those Scots who died fighting for this lot to roll over and surrender.

Embarrassment.

[jack D and coke]

It's not a coincidence that ned central (Glasgow and Dundee) were two of the few areas that voted yes.

That is a huge generalisation. Some of the biggest neds I know are Hun no voters. I also came across ned Yes supporters but I'm sensible enough to realise the brain cripples were on both sides.

It's like the cringeworthy cybernat chat, there was equal amounts of abuse dished out from both Yes and No.

[grumpyjambo]

So the SNP want to protect the Sunday pay rates for workers forced to work in large stores on a Sunday.

My understanding (happy to be corrected BTW) is that if the vote to change the Sunday trading laws in England are passed then Sunday will just be another "standard" trading day like a Tuesday or a Wednesday.

Scottish MP's protecting Scottish workers rights? Is that it?

Whatever next?

Aye, that is embarrassing right enough!

[Sheriff Fatman]

It's like the cringeworthy cybernat chat, there was equal amounts of abuse dished out from both Yes and No.

 

And there still is as shown by this thread and the 2015 Election one that has been high jacked by those that think political discussion means throwing juvenile insults at each other

[pablo]

And there still is as shown by this thread and the 2015 Election one that has been high jacked by those that think political discussion means throwing juvenile insults at each other

Welcome to Scotland 2014/15/16......ad nauseam

[Trapper John McIntyre]

And there still is as shown by this thread and the 2015 Election one that has been high jacked by those that think political discussion means throwing juvenile insults at each other

Just like Holyrood isn't it?

 

Welcome to the new Scotland. 

[Auld Reekin']

Just like Holyrood isn't it?

 

Welcome to the new Scotland. 

 

Or, indeed, Westminster - and you're welcome to it.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

Or, indeed, Westminster - and you're welcome to it.

 

I am, thanks.

[Auld Reekin']

I am, thanks.

 

You're welcome...

 

This could go on a while (and get a bit boring, not to mention juvenile) so instead: are you seriously trying to say that the level of debate at "The Mother of Parliaments" is really any more edifying and dignified than at Holyrood? If so, you've clearly been watching a whole different set of debates and parliamentary / Prime Minister / First Minister questions than I have over the years...

[Phil Dunphy]

All those Scots who died fighting for this lot to roll over and surrender.

Embarrassment.

 

Died fighting what, exactly?

[reaths17]

All those Scots who died fighting for this lot to roll over and surrender.

Embarrassment.

what shit are you trotting oot now, the sons/daughters, grand children, great grand children cousins, uncles/aunties etc of scots who died protecting their nearest and dearest voted "NO" that's "NO" I repeat "NO"

 

its your kind that are responsible for a "NO" vote, and that void of substance plan from the SNP for independence. nobody in their right mind is gonna vote alongside people with no other reason than their dislike for the English.

if you can come up with a coherent reason of your own, feel free to put it up, otherwise just use another of those substanceless carps that you post on everything.

[Gorgiewave]

I had never really noticed reaths17 before but now I really like him/her.

[Boab]

what shit are you trotting oot now, the sons/daughters, grand children, great grand children cousins, uncles/aunties etc of scots who died protecting their nearest and dearest voted "NO" that's "NO" I repeat "NO"

 

its your kind that are responsible for a "NO" vote, and that void of substance plan from the SNP for independence. nobody in their right mind is gonna vote alongside people with no other reason than their dislike for the English.

if you can come up with a coherent reason of your own, feel free to put it up, otherwise just use another of those substanceless carps that you post on everything.

 

I don't think we should be using the deaths of our military to assume their vote on a referendum.

 

A bit insensitive and a huge generalisation.

 

I appreciate you are responding to a post I also disagree with but let's not go down this road.......far too important for an SNP thread.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

All those Scots who died fighting for this lot to roll over and surrender.

Embarrassment.

 

The SNP were backing the Nazis, no?

[reaths17]

I don't think we should be using the deaths of our military to assume their vote on a referendum.

 

A bit insensitive and a huge generalisation.

 

I appreciate you are responding to a post I also disagree with but let's not go down this road.......far too important for an SNP thread.

if you have a problem with the use of the fallen, could you please quote the post responsible and deride the moronic poster there

[XB52]

can't believe people still reply to Aussieh, the guy comes over as totally deranged. I have always hoped he was a unionist plant to make Independence supporters look bad but, whether he is, or just a total raving loony nat, he is not worth engaging with. You couldn't get a more committed SNP/Independence supporter than me but Aussieh makes me cringe every time I see one of his posts quoted. Ignore is made for him 

[coconut doug]

can't believe people still reply to Aussieh, the guy comes over as totally deranged. I have always hoped he was a unionist plant to make Independence supporters look bad but, whether he is, or just a total raving loony nat, he is not worth engaging with. You couldn't get a more committed SNP/Independence supporter than me but Aussieh makes me cringe every time I see one of his posts quoted. Ignore is made for him 

Surprised you don't see the irony in Aussie's post. Very effective IMO as he got the sites most nihilistic poster to almost care and nearly blow a fuse .  Aussie is very good at revealing the inherent weaknesses in Unionists logic as can be seen in many of the replies to his posts. Most of them don't see it but i'm surprised you missed it.

[GBJambo]

Surprised you don't see the irony in Aussie's post. Very effective IMO as he got the sites most nihilistic poster to almost care and nearly blow a fuse . Aussie is very good at revealing the inherent weaknesses in Unionists logic as can be seen in many of the replies to his posts. Most of them don't see it but i'm surprised you missed it.

Hiya Aussie

[Boab]

what shit are you trotting oot now, the sons/daughters, grand children, great grand children cousins, uncles/aunties etc of scots who died protecting their nearest and dearest voted "NO" that's "NO" I repeat "NO"

 

its your kind that are responsible for a "NO" vote, and that void of substance plan from the SNP for independence. nobody in their right mind is gonna vote alongside people with no other reason than their dislike for the English.

if you can come up with a coherent reason of your own, feel free to put it up, otherwise just use another of those substanceless carps that you post on everything.

I don't agree with what aussie said but I also think the bit in bold is a generalisation that has made me think the two posts are similar in their false generalisations.

 

if you have a problem with the use of the fallen, could you please quote the post responsible and deride the moronic poster there

[Trapper John McIntyre]

The SNP were backing the Nazis, no?

 

Shhh...You're not supposed to mention that.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

You're welcome...

 

This could go on a while (and get a bit boring, not to mention juvenile) so instead: are you seriously trying to say that the level of debate at "The Mother of Parliaments" is really any more edifying and dignified than at Holyrood? If so, you've clearly been watching a whole different set of debates and parliamentary / Prime Minister / First Minister questions than I have over the years...

 

Just that I'd rather have the reasonably competent bickering clowns of Westminster running matters than the plainly incompetent bickering nodding dogs/imbeciles of Holyrood.

 

You've got a short memory. Remember Eck bullying and shouting down anyone who dared to question him when he was Governor-general?

 

Or is that another inconvenient truth?

[Trapper John McIntyre]

Surprised you don't see the irony in Aussie's post. Very effective IMO as he got the sites most nihilistic poster to almost care and nearly blow a fuse .  Aussie is very good at revealing the inherent weaknesses in Unionists logic as can be seen in many of the replies to his posts. Most of them don't see it but i'm surprised you missed it.

 

What a load of total bullshit. 

 

Some pearls from Aussie: 'Traitors, Stockholm syndrome, rebuild Hadrians Wall in order to line them up and shoot them, Scots died for you, England's poodles, only Scots voted Yes, we were robbed, ad nauseum ad infinitum'

 

One day Scotland will waken up and think, feck me, did I really swallow all that SNP shite?

[HaymarketJambo]

What a load of total bullshit. 

 

Some pearls from Aussie: 'Traitors, Stockholm syndrome, rebuild Hadrians Wall in order to line them up and shoot them, Scots died for you, England's poodles, only Scots voted Yes, we were robbed, ad nauseum ad infinitum'

 

One day Scotland will waken up and think, feck me, did I really swallow all that SNP shite?

 

Yeah, Scotland woke up after 70 odd years or so and found out Scottish Labour and their pays masters in London and give them the order of the big boot thankfully.

[jambos are go!]

Try watching the interview Nicola Sturgeon had with Andrew Neil in the Sunday Politics which should still be on Catch up/ BBC iPlayer. Because of the fall in the oil price the Scottish Budget is currently being susidised to the extent of ?15 billion a year by the Uk Treasury. Scotland has a budget deficit of 10% -  the highest in western Europe. It is set to get worse next year. When asked  if she would finance that deficit by cuts or tax rises she continually dodged the question and basically said it would be alright on the night. That's not good enough IMO. She also dodged questions on Currency and EC membership implications of the huge deficit. 

 

To me the funding of the deficit is proof positive that we are Better Together sharing risks. Within the EC we would be subject to Greek like sanctions. Within the UK we are protected and enjoying ongoing growth unparalled in the EC..

[JamboX2]

Yeah, Scotland woke up after 70 odd years or so and found out Scottish Labour and their pays masters in London and give them the order of the big boot thankfully.

So in 50 years will we wake up to the SNP?

 

The SNP are defending the "inept" (to use their terms) Lab-Lib governments achievements. They've barely done a radical thing in power, and still propose little of anything radical for Scotland's future.

 

The SNP are now the masters of managerial politics.

 

If the people want that fair enough. Frankly though, its not an alternative of much note or radical alternative to the Tories or Labour.

[Auld Reekin']

Just that I'd rather have the reasonably competent bickering clowns of Westminster running matters than the plainly incompetent bickering nodding dogs/imbeciles of Holyrood.

 

You've got a short memory. Remember Eck bullying and shouting down anyone who dared to question him when he was Governor-general?

 

Or is that another inconvenient truth?

 

You don't say?!?!?!?     

 

Nothing wrong with my memory, other than perhaps not recalling having had any similar conversation with you on here in the past*, and so being somewhat at a loss to know what you're on about with your attempted "another inconvenient truth" jibe. "another" in addition to what? All of the other "inconvenient truths" you somehow imagine you've honoured me with in the past? Or maybe you're confusing me with someone else. Or are just confused.

 

As to your statement about "Eck bullying and shouting down...", perhaps he simply became exasperated with the poor quality of debate and questioning by the ranks of "nodding dogs/imbeciles..." arrayed against him. Either way, do me a favour and set your traps elsewhere.

 

(*And if I did, it was clearly not interesting or enlightening enough to be memorable.)

[Trapper John McIntyre]

Yeah, Scotland woke up after 70 odd years or so and found out Scottish Labour and their pays masters in London and give them the order of the big boot thankfully.

 

Yeah, woke up with the Welfare State, NHS, the Minimum Wage, amongst others.

 

Still waiting for one single tangible benefit that the SNP in its entire history has given the Scottish people.

 

Meanwhile those awful people in Westminster are carrying Scotland to the tune of billions of English taxpayers pounds 'cos Nicky's onshore miracle has yet to materialise.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

You don't say?!?!?!?     

 

Nothing wrong with my memory, other than perhaps not recalling having had any similar conversation with you on here in the past*, and so being somewhat at a loss to know what you're on about with your attempted "another inconvenient truth" jibe. "another" in addition to what? All of the other "inconvenient truths" you somehow imagine you've honoured me with in the past? Or maybe you're confusing me with someone else. Or are just confused.

 

As to your statement about "Eck bullying and shouting down...", perhaps he simply became exasperated with the poor quality of debate and questioning by the ranks of "nodding dogs/imbeciles..." arrayed against him. Either way, do me a favour and set your traps elsewhere.

 

(*And if I did, it was clearly not interesting or enlightening enough to be memorable.)

 

Oh dear, you're taking this rather personal aren't you?

[HaymarketJambo]

Yeah, woke up with the Welfare State, NHS, the Minimum Wage, amongst others.

 

Still waiting for one single tangible benefit that the SNP in its entire history has given the Scottish people.

 

Meanwhile those awful people in Westminster are carrying Scotland to the tune of billions of English taxpayers pounds 'cos Nicky's onshore miracle has yet to materialise.

 

You forgot mention about the UK going nearly bust and all the strikes we had in the 1970's under the Labour Government or under New Labour, what was the saying "Things can only get better" well that went well didn't it, Blair and Brown.

 

And if SNP are that bad as you say why are people voting them?

 

Labour are in a fight for 2nd place with their "Better to together" Pals the Conservatives for Holyrood, how the mighty fall.      

[HaymarketJambo]

So in 50 years will we wake up to the SNP?

 

The SNP are defending the "inept" (to use their terms) Lab-Lib governments achievements. They've barely done a radical thing in power, and still propose little of anything radical for Scotland's future.

 

The SNP are now the masters of managerial politics.

 

If the people want that fair enough. Frankly though, its not an alternative of much note or radical alternative to the Tories or Labour.

 

JamboX2, you have a chance to vote out the nasty SNP in May. 

[Trapper John McIntyre]

You forgot mention about the UK going nearly bust and all the strikes we had in the 1970's under the Labour Government or under New Labour, what was the saying "Things can only get better" well that went well didn't it, Blair and Brown.

 

And if SNP are that bad as you say why are people voting them?

 

Labour are in a fight for 2nd place with their "Better to together" Pals the Conservatives for Holyrood, how the mighty fall.      

 

...and throughout that period described, the Scottish people continued to vote Labour while in 1979 the SNP Bravehearts (how many MP's back then???) played an instrumental role in ushering in the Thatcher government.

 

It's dangerous stuff, playing the history card if you support the Tartan Tories.

 

Though I'm pretty confidant all you Labour turncoats will eventually see through the Nats and return to the fold.

 

I mean, that's what Scots do best. We're just so contrary, aren't we?

[JamboX2]

JamboX2, you have a chance to vote out the nasty SNP in May.

Right, don't belittle the point. The SNP aren't "nasty" nor is my point to make that the case. My point to you is policy wise they are in no way different from their predecessors. No more vibrant, democratic, open, transparent, left wing or radical than the executives that preceded them. Not at all.

 

Yet they and their supporters claim them to be so.

 

I won't be voting for them. For 9 years we've been promised the earth and sold a pup.

 

But we live in a democracy and folk like me, the minority who don't support the government, will live with that decision. Regardless of their majority or their poll ratings it won't change my view of the SNP and its performance and conduct so far. They're playing the same bullshit these old Labour types used to, take the people for granted.

 

Over the past few years I've become a believer in democracy working best when it's crowded by a sea of minority voices and a forcing of the need to work together.

 

Shall be voting Labour or Green, probably both fwiw.

[HaymarketJambo]

...and throughout that period described, the Scottish people continued to vote Labour while in 1979 the SNP Bravehearts (how many MP's back then???) played an instrumental role in ushering in the Thatcher government.

 

It's dangerous stuff, playing the history card if you support the Tartan Tories.

 

Though I'm pretty confidant all you Labour turncoats will eventually see through the Nats and return to the fold.

 

I mean, that's what Scots do best. We're just so contrary, aren't we?

No

I think you find that it was Labour that was to blame for Thatcher, strikes all the time, we couldn't bury our dead under the Labour Government, and lets not forget nearly going bust under Labour in the late 70s that was when Labour are at their best, thankfully we had Scottish Oil to bail us out at that time. 

 

The Blair Government was more Tory than the Tories.  

 

The real Tartan Tories are Labour that's why you nearly lost all your seats bar one in Scotland last May's General Election.  

[HaymarketJambo]

Right, don't belittle the point. The SNP aren't "nasty" nor is my point to make that the case. My point to you is policy wise they are in no way different from their predecessors. No more vibrant, democratic, open, transparent, left wing or radical than the executives that preceded them. Not at all.

 

Yet they and their supporters claim them to be so.

 

I won't be voting for them. For 9 years we've been promised the earth and sold a pup.

 

But we live in a democracy and folk like me, the minority who don't support the government, will live with that decision. Regardless of their majority or their poll ratings it won't change my view of the SNP and its performance and conduct so far. They're playing the same bullshit these old Labour types used to, take the people for granted.

 

Over the past few years I've become a believer in democracy working best when it's crowded by a sea of minority voices and a forcing of the need to work together.

 

Shall be voting Labour or Green, probably both fwiw.

 

But plenty of people will be voting SNP, I'll be giving SNP both my votes.

[JamboX2]

But plenty of people will be voting SNP, I'll be giving SNP both my votes.

Again, what's your point?

 

Plenty of folk voted UKIP last year, I wouldn't vote for them.

[HaymarketJambo]

Again, what's your point?

 

Plenty of folk voted UKIP last year, I wouldn't vote for them.

 

You bang on how bad the SNP are all the time, fine you are going vote for either Labour or Green, lets see if they do any better than the SNP in Government  if they get elected to Government in May? 

[JamboX2]

You bang on how bad the SNP are all the time, fine you are going vote for either Labour or Green, lets see if they do any better than the SNP in Government if they get elected to Government in May?

The SNP have been a thoroughly competent government. Not bad but not great.

 

It's hard to deny their pretty tame approach. Nor their lackluster approach to applying radical rhetoric into policy.

 

We both know there'll be one winner. Let's see if a new and fairer Scotland is born from it or another 5 years of managerial politics centred on applying cuts and cutting corporate taxes they control.

 

My issue is with their majority the SNP could've changed local taxation, brought in radical land reform and passed legislation that transformed Scotland. Instead Scotland isn't much different from the country they inherited in 2007. It really isn't.

[jambos are go!]

But plenty of people will be voting SNP, I'll be giving SNP both my votes.

But plenty of people will be voting SNP, I'll be giving SNP both my votes.

And that tactic is undermining the voting system at Holyrood. It was supposed to allow voters a chance to express support for a a couple of differing parties or candidates. At the last Holyrood election despite being an an arch unionist I gave Margo Macdonald my list vote as an independent and wise voice. Not so for the Nats who only care about one issue and not good governance at Holyrood.

 

It will be Labour for both my votes this time and support for a change to the voting system.

[aussieh]

...and throughout that period described, the Scottish people continued to vote Labour while in 1979 the SNP Bravehearts (how many MP's back then???) played an instrumental role in ushering in the Thatcher government.

 

It's dangerous stuff, playing the history card if you support the Tartan Tories.

 

Though I'm pretty confidant all you Labour turncoats will eventually see through the Nats and return to the fold.

 

I mean, that's what Scots do best. We're just so contrary, aren't we?

I'm sure you missed something out, that's right labour reneged on devo.

[aussieh]

what shit are you trotting oot now, the sons/daughters, grand children, great grand children cousins, uncles/aunties etc of Brits who died protecting their nearest and dearest voted "NO" that's "NO" I repeat "NO"

 

its your kind that are responsible for a "NO" vote, and that void of substance plan from the SNP for independence. nobody in their right mind is gonna vote alongside people with no other reason than their dislike for the English.

if you can come up with a coherent reason of your own, feel free to put it up, otherwise just use another of those substanceless carps that you post on everything.

Scots voted Yes.

No Scot would ever vote against Scotland.

British, would.

[aussieh]

Yeah, woke up with the Welfare State, NHS, the Minimum Wage, amongst others.

 

Still waiting for one single tangible benefit that the SNP in its entire history has given the Scottish people.

 

Meanwhile those awful people in Westminster are carrying Scotland to the tune of billions of English taxpayers pounds 'cos Nicky's onshore miracle has yet to materialise.

That's still to come.

And who's fault is it this so called WM payout is happening. That's right No thankers,(rhyming slang)we dont want anything from the UK.

[aussieh]

The SNP were backing the Nazis, no?

No, it'll be a Republic after Indy.

[Boris]

And that tactic is undermining the voting system at Holyrood. It was supposed to allow voters a chance to express support for a a couple of differing parties or candidates. At the last Holyrood election despite being an an arch unionist I gave Margo Macdonald my list vote as an independent and wise voice. Not so for the Nats who only care about one issue and not good governance at Holyrood.

 

It will be Labour for both my votes this time and support for a change to the voting system.

What would be your preferred voting system?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

If aussie lived in America he'd be voting for Trump!

[HaymarketJambo]

The SNP have been a thoroughly competent government. Not bad but not great.

 

It's hard to deny their pretty tame approach. Nor their lackluster approach to applying radical rhetoric into policy.

 

We both know there'll be one winner. Let's see if a new and fairer Scotland is born from it or another 5 years of managerial politics centred on applying cuts and cutting corporate taxes they control.

 

My issue is with their majority the SNP could've changed local taxation, brought in radical land reform and passed legislation that transformed Scotland. Instead Scotland isn't much different from the country they inherited in 2007. It really isn't.

 

I agree, but it was the SNP that got all these new powers, not Labour,  not Conservative, not Green, not LibDem  it's because we voted SNP in huge numbers and we stood up to the Conservative Government and the SNP got this great deal for Scotland, all thanks to the SNP standing firm and standing up for Scotland.

 

If elected in May, lets see what the SNP do these new powers for the next 5 year's, but it's about time the SNP start governing otherwise they will loose my vote and others.

[Thunderstruck]

I agree, but it was the SNP that got all these new powers, not Labour, not Conservative, not Green, not LibDem it's because we voted SNP in huge numbers and we stood up to the Conservative Government and the SNP got this great deal for Scotland, all thanks to the SNP standing firm and standing up for Scotland.

 

If elected in May, lets see what the SNP do these new powers for the next 5 year's, but it's about time the SNP start governing otherwise they will loose my vote and others.

 

They don't even want the powers as with power comes responsibility for financing their own expenditure which already has a ?15bm deficit (?2,900 for every man, woman and child in Scotland).

 

There isn't a shred of evidence that the SNP will or even know how to use these powers to the benefit of everyone in Scotland. The floundering of Sturgeon in the face of easily foreseeable questions from Andrew Neil illustrated serious and worrying shortcomings.

[HaymarketJambo]

They don't even want the powers as with power comes responsibility for financing their own expenditure which already has a ?15bm deficit (?2,900 for every man, woman and child in Scotland).

 

There isn't a shred of evidence that the SNP will or even know how to use these powers to the benefit of everyone in Scotland. The floundering of Sturgeon in the face of easily foreseeable questions from Andrew Neil illustrated serious and worrying shortcomings.

 

What a party would do any better?

 

I have you seen the mess that Wales are in under Labour, Wales might even get a Tory Administration in May's Election there? 

[Thunderstruck]

What a party would do any better?

 

I have you seen the mess that Wales are in under Labour, Wales might even get a Tory Administration in May's Election there?

I doubt they could do worse.

 

A half-savvy Scottish Elctorate would elect a minority government - that was the original plan and it did work. Unfortunately, tribalism now seems to be back with a vengeance.

[reaths17]

Scots voted Yes.

No Scot would ever vote against Scotland.

British, would.

haha, you couldn't even find a smart assed comment, the epitomy of why the separatists failed, the followers of the SNP by their nature made it easy to reject their substanceless proposal

[reaths17]

The SNP have been a thoroughly competent government. Not bad but not great.

 

It's hard to deny their pretty tame approach. Nor their lackluster approach to applying radical rhetoric into policy.

 

We both know there'll be one winner. Let's see if a new and fairer Scotland is born from it or another 5 years of managerial politics centred on applying cuts and cutting corporate taxes they control.

 

My issue is with their majority the SNP could've changed local taxation, brought in radical land reform and passed legislation that transformed Scotland. Instead Scotland isn't much different from the country they inherited in 2007. It really isn't.

really, crucifying services and raising our debt beyond any previously know levels. being the best shit in the pan isn't competence.