The 2015 General Election Megathread

[Pans Jambo]

Nah - you are wrong because you suggested that I was angry because I thought the SNP would wipe the floor with my mob. I dont think that is the case - I think my mob will increase their vote. So, yes, you were and remain wrong. 

 

Your last sentence is nonsense on many levels. I think you should consult a dictionary as you are using words that you don't understand the meaning of. 

Now now Maggie, no need to resort to that sort of nonsense. I'm not Eton educated old boy.

 

I cant see how they will increase their vote? who will they take votes off other than the LibDems? Wont be SNP or Greens. I still don't see how I am wrong about an event that hasn't even taken place yet.

[Socrates]

Going from 17 to 18 or 19% is hardly a major achievement, especially if the SNP go from 20 to 40-something. I think it could still be categorised as wiping the floor.

[TheMaganator]

Now now Maggie, no need to resort to that sort of nonsense. I'm not Eton educated old boy.

 

I cant see how they will increase their vote? who will they take votes off other than the LibDems? Wont be SNP or Greens. I still don't see how I am wrong about an event that hasn't even taken place yet.

fair enough - I just don't like being called a nationalist when I am not one. 

 

They'll take floating voters imo. I think the prospect of Miliband in power will put people off him and all signs indicate that the Libs are going to take a pounding. They wont take any SNP votes but maybe some soft greens. 

 

A wee ?10 wager (donation to HYDC) on the tories getting more votes in Scotland than they did last time?

[Socrates]

Maybe we should run a wee election prediction competition.

[Pans Jambo]

fair enough - I just don't like being called a nationalist when I am not one. 

 

They'll take floating voters imo. I think the prospect of Miliband in power will put people off him and all signs indicate that the Libs are going to take a pounding. They wont take any SNP votes but maybe some soft greens. 

 

A wee ?10 wager (donation to HYDC) on the tories getting more votes in Scotland than they did last time?

Not against it.

They may in fact increase their vote slightly but not their seats that you cannot argue against.

You are probably right that they may increase their vote at the expense of the Lib Dems but I cant see someone who usually votes Labour voting Conservative (even though you couldn't get a bank card between them these days IMO).

But seeing as the bet is for a good cause I will accept.

A Tenner it is.

Edited February 19, 2015 by Pans Jambo

[TheMaganator]

Not against it.

They may in fact increase their vote slightly but not their seats that you cannot argue against.

You are probably right that they may increase their vote at the expense of the Lib Dems but I cant see someone who usually votes Labour voting Conservative (even though you couldn't get a bank card between them these days IMO).

But seeing as the bet is for a good cause I will accept.

A Tenner it is.

good stuff!

[Gorgiewave]

Anything that harms the SNP, even lies, is fine by me. The moronic, panting, messianic public deserve it.

[Boris]

Interesting to hear Murphy saying he wants working class people to have middle class kids.

 

What's wrong with being working class, Jim?  Aren't you supposed to represent them?

 

What an arse.

[doctor jambo]

JIm Murphy is a fudd, lets be honest,

but the SNP are frankly dangerous now

They think they are Scotland now, and the dissenters are somehow not Scottish- which is odd given their recent pumping in the referendum

I would really like them crushed

I suspect also that the referendum has opened the eyes of many and may have rekindled the Conservative vote- a few shocks may be in store

[doctor jambo]

Interesting to hear Murphy saying he wants working class people to have middle class kids.

 

What's wrong with being working class, Jim?  Aren't you supposed to represent them?

 

What an arse.

Working class now means lumpen proletariat

What used to be working class is now lower ,middle class- you know the thing- foreign holidays, home ownership etc etc

But Scotland has this idea it is "working class" and sees middle class as embarrassing somehow

As a librarian Boris, like it or not, you are most certainly middle class.

[Gorgiewave]

Boris, it's not that it's shameful, it just limits you more than being middle class.

[Boris]

Working class now means lumpen proletariat

What used to be working class is now lower ,middle class- you know the thing- foreign holidays, home ownership etc etc

But Scotland has this idea it is "working class" and sees middle class as embarrassing somehow

As a librarian Boris, like it or not, you are most certainly middle class.

 

I fully endorse Marx & Engels view of social stratification and agree regards the growth in the lumpen proletariat.  But I would take your spin and say that the lower middle class as you perceive are in fact the proletariat.  As Marx & Engels predicted.

 

Boris, it's not that it's shameful, it just limits you more than being middle class.

 

But Murphy implies that it is indeed something to be ashamed of.

[TheMaganator]

Interesting to hear Murphy saying he wants working class people to have middle class kids.

 

What's wrong with being working class, Jim?  Aren't you supposed to represent them?

 

What an arse.

 

Class politics does my head in. Both labour and the SNP are guilty of it. Us and them.

 

It puts one group against another and can only ever be divisive. 

[Pans Jambo]

For me, the whole politics thing is completely rotten regardless of what colour you lean towards. It needs a massive overhaul.

 

Big business runs this country NOT politicians as they allow themselves to be lobbied and bend to their will. Most money wins. That's not why we elected these people!

 

The government then changes tax rules so their rich mates can keep hold of even more money whilst hammering the lowest earners with 20% VAT & a minuscule minimum wage.

 

London is now the best place in the entire planet to live if you are a Billionaire! That's just not right!

 

To top it all off, these same corporations have their dirty fingers in international media organisations and drip feed us crap on TV & in the newspapers like "the economy is booming", average earnings have increased by X%", ISIS are coming to a town near you", Dole scroungers, pregnant teenagers and the Eastern European immigrants are the reason we are in such a bad state (after telling us the economy is booming)". That's the REAL project fear. 

 

Is it right that corporations that make hundreds and billions of pounds of profit allow their top earners to take home millions but still pay their staff the minimum wage?

 

The banks (who dropped the ball & put us in this position) are STILL paying out MASSIVE bonuses to their staff but we have to pay for their mistakes with stagnant wages and austerity.

 

Until this changes it really wont matter who get's in to be honest. Sure there will be some policies that will help/hinder the population (first ?10K tax free/bedroom tax are examples) but we are only getting the scraps whilst the politicians, the billionaires, corporations and their pals dine out on our hard graft.

 

Really, What's in it for us? Oh aye, work until your 73.

 

Where is the real effort to raise pay, create jobs, invest in our schools & hospitals, re-distribute wealth, cut VAT, make the corporations pay REAL tax by closing loopholes, investment in infrastructure and de-centralise power to a local level so people can have a REAL say in their communities?

 

House prices are far too high because there's not enough of them being built and the land that they are getting built on is far FAR too expensive. Something needs done about the greedy land owners most of whom are in a position of privilege and members of the lobby groups or the unelected house of lords!

 

Wont happen in my lifetime.

 

I would also like to put an end to the madness of send Scottish produce round the planet (like Lamb) to New Zealand etc. only for Scotland to import New Zealand lamb! Crazy! Why do we need potatoes from the channel Islands again???

 

The world has gone mad!

Edited February 19, 2015 by Pans Jambo

[doctor jambo]

Class politics does my head in. Both labour and the SNP are guilty of it. Us and them.

 

It puts one group against another and can only ever be divisive. 

Scotland does this- don't blame the party

For some unknown reason Scotland is gripped by a desire to be working class- even when its not

People wish to be regarded as that when they are patently middle class

To be middle class is derided and something to be embarrassed about

To be CONSERVATIVE is evil and anti-scots

We , generally, put people down for success and celebrate the fall of the successful

A prime example is that the SNP want the ability to raise benefits in Scotland

That would create a cross border benefits differential that could mean an influx of benefit claimants to Scotland from England.

They deem this more important than, say, cutting tax and thus encouraging influx of working people

It's the Scots way

[TheMaganator]

Scotland does this- don't blame the party

For some unknown reason Scotland is gripped by a desire to be working class- even when its not

People wish to be regarded as that when they are patently middle class

To be middle class is derided and something to be embarrassed about

To be CONSERVATIVE is evil and anti-scots

We , generally, put people down for success and celebrate the fall of the successful

A prime example is that the SNP want the ability to raise benefits in Scotland

That would create a cross border benefits differential that could mean an influx of benefit claimants to Scotland from England.

They deem this more important than, say, cutting tax and thus encouraging influx of working people

It's the Scots way

I certainly agree with these! People in Scotland seem to loathe the successful. They see the wealthy as a group to be hammered - they rarely acknowledge the hard work that people do to achieve success. 

[Pans Jambo]

I certainly agree with these! People in Scotland seem to loathe the successful. They see the wealthy as a group to be hammered - they rarely acknowledge the hard work that people do to achieve success. 

Yip!

 

Only a moron would dislike a group of people just because they are wealthy. I have no problem with wealthy people at all. As long as they pay their fair share to society and they are not wealthy on the backs of paying minimum wages, tax dodging or some other immoral reason!

 

Fair play to the wealthy who look after the not so wealthy. That's good & proper.

[Gizmo]

Yeah - the NHS stuff was bad and they should have checked it.

 

Wee you equally as angry when the SNP knowingly lied repeatedly about having taken legal advice during the referendum on our EU position?

 

I'll grant you that this is purely whataboutery. But let's not get too carried away on your high horse.

I already qualified my post by stating that all parties are at it, at times. For Labour, however, it is the only thing they know - spin and distortion.

 

I am not uncritical of the SNP, far from it but I see them as a safe government and a means to an end. My political compass lies almost exactly in the same place as the green party, as it happens.

 

And I wasn't upset. There is no way on this earth Scottish Labour will win back my vote in their current state. Their actions actually reinforce everything I already know about them.

 

And about "nationalist" governments. A left-wing, civic nationalism is a very different beast to the right-wing "nationalism" and anti-EU rhetoric that is espoused by UKIP and the Tories. That type of xenophobia, in the 21st Century after decades of immigration and emigration, is embarrassing.

 

 

 

 

[TheMaganator]

I already qualified my post by stating that all parties are at it, at times. For Labour, however, it is the only thing they know - spin and distortion.

 

I am not uncritical of the SNP, far from it but I see them as a safe government and a means to an end. My political compass lies almost exactly in the same place as the green party, as it happens.

 

And I wasn't upset. There is no way on this earth Scottish Labour will win back my vote in their current state. Their actions actually reinforce everything I already know about them.

 

And about "nationalist" governments. A left-wing, civic nationalism is a very different beast to the right-wing "nationalism" and anti-EU rhetoric that is espoused by UKIP and the Tories. That type of xenophobia, in the 21st Century after decades of immigration and emigration, is embarrassing.

 

 

Yeah, fair enough. I was being a bit pissy this morning. 

 

I take your point re UKIP but I do not think it is fair to categorise the Tories as being anti-EU. Sure, there may be some loonies in the party who are against it (and thankfully those nitwits are slowly leaving an joining UKIP).

 

Whatever your views on the EU are, it is right that we are having a debate on the issue. 

[doctor jambo]

Yip!

 

Only a moron would dislike a group of people just because they are wealthy. I have no problem with wealthy people at all. As long as they pay their fair share to society and they are not wealthy on the backs of paying minimum wages, tax dodging or some other immoral reason!

 

Fair play to the wealthy who look after the not so wealthy. That's good & proper.

However the hoo-ha has played right into the hands of HMRC,

The very rich SHOULD pay their fair share- and as a % of their income it is exactly the same- no more and no less.

The amount they are avoiding is immaterial.

If you follow the trajectory of the discussions you will see cantering over the hill a crack down on "cash in hand" for jobs, and indeed cash payments for services.

As these payments cost the revenue fortunes per year in evaded tax

The fact is these are small quantities is not important-

Expect tips, and service providers and sole traders to get severely pumped pretty soon

BUt then again - the public are DEMANDING this crackdown on people not paying what they are supposed to- are they not?

[Boris]

Scotland does this- don't blame the party

For some unknown reason Scotland is gripped by a desire to be working class- even when its not

People wish to be regarded as that when they are patently middle class

To be middle class is derided and something to be embarrassed about

To be CONSERVATIVE is evil and anti-scots

We , generally, put people down for success and celebrate the fall of the successful

A prime example is that the SNP want the ability to raise benefits in Scotland

That would create a cross border benefits differential that could mean an influx of benefit claimants to Scotland from England.

They deem this more important than, say, cutting tax and thus encouraging influx of working people

It's the Scots way

 

I suspect it is because the majority of Scots are from working class backgrounds.  Now, as Sillars alluded to in the referendum campaign, many are now what could be described as "middle class" (me, if I am honest, I suppose) but I don't get the derision or embarrassment that you speak of.

 

Scotland used to vote Conservative, majority before the "orange card" ceased to stop working, but it is not Conservatism per se that Scots are against, imo, but merely its current incarnation. 

 

On the referendum thread there were many comments about Scotland being naturally conservative (with a small c) and I agree, but it is this conservatism, or perhaps culture, that rails against Thatcherism (for want of a word).  So, your example about raising benefits - this fits that Scottish conservatism i.e. the desire to help and protect the community, something that Thatcherism patently does not do.

 

I agree to an extent that we don't necessarily celebrate success as well as we should, but then how often do you hear McGlashan types reel off the Scots influence globally?  I'd also say that the putting down and celebrating failure is not just a Scots trait but, I'd say, a cultural response to the selfish nature of our society post 1979.

[RosscoC]

@blairmcdougall: People will be pretty angry if a combination of other parties try to prevent the leading party from forming a government. #VoteSNPgetTories

 

Then from his boss in 2010.....

 

Speaking at a post-election press conference in Glasgow he said as the sitting PM, Mr Brown had the "constitutional and moral right" to try to form a government.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/scotland/8668114.stm

Edited February 19, 2015 by RosscoC

[Pans Jambo]

However the hoo-ha has played right into the hands of HMRC,

The very rich SHOULD pay their fair share- and as a % of their income it is exactly the same- no more and no less.

The amount they are avoiding is immaterial.

If you follow the trajectory of the discussions you will see cantering over the hill a crack down on "cash in hand" for jobs, and indeed cash payments for services.

As these payments cost the revenue fortunes per year in evaded tax

The fact is these are small quantities is not important-

Expect tips, and service providers and sole traders to get severely pumped pretty soon

BUt then again - the public are DEMANDING this crackdown on people not paying what they are supposed to- are they not?

Missed my point DJ

 

The rich are "squirreling" vast amounts of cash away by using tax loopholes. Not Illegal I will grant you but very immoral. a % share is not enough, the 50% rate should be brought back as what we are talking about here is ? left over after the tax man takes his share. not much left if you earn less than the average salary but plenty left if you earn well over ?100K P/A. 

You are right about folk getting hammered though, they will. The attention should first of all go on the Billionaire corporations and multi-millionaires using loopholes but as usual, we will be fed the line that we are cheating the system and they will crack down hard. Low hanging fruit and a diversion to keep the rich staying rich.

 

So what if a guy get ?40 cash for fitting a washing machine & not declaring. It isnt going to pay for a hospital wing but Amazon on the other hand....

[Socrates]

@blairmcdougall: People will be pretty angry if a combination of other parties try to prevent the leading party from forming a government. #VoteSNPgetTories

 

Then from his boss in 2010.....

 

Speaking at a post-election press conference in Glasgow he said as the sitting PM, Mr Brown had the "constitutional and moral right" to try to form a government.

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/scotland/8668114.stm

 

The Labour stuff about the Tories being able to form a Government on the basis that they're the largest single party is unusually desperate. You'd have thought they might remember that the first UK Labour Government was formed despite the fact that Labour were not the largest party. Unless, of course, they're just making up random shite in a desperate effort to get votes.

[jambo1185]

The Labour stuff about the Tories being able to form a Government on the basis that they're the largest single party is unusually desperate. You'd have thought they might remember that the first UK Labour Government was formed despite the fact that Labour were not the largest party. Unless, of course, they're just making up random shite in a desperate effort to get votes.

 

I suspect your last sentence is bang on the cash.

[doctor jambo]

Missed my point DJ

 

The rich are "squirreling" vast amounts of cash away by using tax loopholes. Not Illegal I will grant you but very immoral. a % share is not enough, the 50% rate should be brought back as what we are talking about here is ? left over after the tax man takes his share. not much left if you earn less than the average salary but plenty left if you earn well over ?100K P/A. 

You are right about folk getting hammered though, they will. The attention should first of all go on the Billionaire corporations and multi-millionaires using loopholes but as usual, we will be fed the line that we are cheating the system and they will crack down hard. Low hanging fruit and a diversion to keep the rich staying rich.

 

So what if a guy get ?40 cash for fitting a washing machine & not declaring. It isnt going to pay for a hospital wing but Amazon on the other hand....

Wrong- we are supposed to be all equal in the eyes of the law- that is what people demand- yes?

Therefore HMRC should be after everyone at the same time with the same force.

The amount is not the important thing

Using tax avoidance is legal

NOt declaring income for C.I.H is illegal tax evasion and is actually worse

You cannot demand the law is enforced on some people then , because you do the same or worse, but with lower profit margins , you should somehow be exempt.

 

And the accumulative effect of tax revenue for all the cash jobs/tips must be, frankly, astronomical.

And it is equally unfair on those who do not or cannot accept cash

And it would be very easy to legislate against and thus increase tax revenue from illegal tax evaders- joiners, plumbers, hairdressers etc

Be careful what you wish for

[Pans Jambo]

Wrong- we are supposed to be all equal in the eyes of the law- that is what people demand- yes?

Therefore HMRC should be after everyone at the same time with the same force.

The amount is not the important thing

Using tax avoidance is legal

NOt declaring income for C.I.H is illegal tax evasion and is actually worse

You cannot demand the law is enforced on some people then , because you do the same or worse, but with lower profit margins , you should somehow be exempt.

 

And the accumulative effect of tax revenue for all the cash jobs/tips must be, frankly, astronomical.

And it is equally unfair on those who do not or cannot accept cash

And it would be very easy to legislate against and thus increase tax revenue from illegal tax evaders- joiners, plumbers, hairdressers etc

Be careful what you wish for

Like I say, low hanging fruit. the common man cant evade his taxes so they are easy to nail first when IMO, the first thing needing looked at is the millionaires and corporations who are lobbying governments to allow tax loopholes so they can become even richer at our expense.

 

We will never agree if you think the cash in hand guy is "actually worse" than the corporation who evade ?Billions. 

 

As my post a lot further up states, the whole system stinks and is designed to keep the masses under the boot heel whilst the people at the top become even richer.

A progressive tax system that is fair, fit a proper needs to be looked into. Doesn't matter who we vote in though because they all have their noses at the trough.

 

The only way society can move forward is if it is fair for all, not just the super rich.

[doctor jambo]

Like I say, low hanging fruit. the common man cant evade his taxes so they are easy to nail first when IMO, the first thing needing looked at is the millionaires and corporations who are lobbying governments to allow tax loopholes so they can become even richer at our expense.

 

We will never agree if you think the cash in hand guy is "actually worse" than the corporation who evade ?Billions. 

 

As my post a lot further up states, the whole system stinks and is designed to keep the masses under the boot heel whilst the people at the top become even richer.

A progressive tax system that is fair, fit a proper needs to be looked into. Doesn't matter who we vote in though because they all have their noses at the trough.

 

The only way society can move forward is if it is fair for all, not just the super rich.

The corporates are Avoiding- legal whether you agree or not

The cash in hand is evading- illegal

[TheMaganator]

Like I say, low hanging fruit. the common man cant evade his taxes so they are easy to nail first when IMO, the first thing needing looked at is the millionaires and corporations who are lobbying governments to allow tax loopholes so they can become even richer at our expense.

 

We will never agree if you think the cash in hand guy is "actually worse" than the corporation who evade ?Billions. 

 

As my post a lot further up states, the whole system stinks and is designed to keep the masses under the boot heel whilst the people at the top become even richer.

A progressive tax system that is fair, fit a proper needs to be looked into. Doesn't matter who we vote in though because they all have their noses at the trough.

 

The only way society can move forward is if it is fair for all, not just the super rich.

The thing is though, the man on the street avoids tax too. If you put money into an isa you get allowances. If you receive money from share dividends you get a more favourable tax rate than you would do if it was income from other streams. 

 

Buy booze in duty free? That's avoiding paying tax. 

 

The government makes the tax law. Working within that law is fair game. Working outside that law is not fair game. 

 

Tax avoidance isn't wrong. It is paying exactly as much as the government wants you to pay. No more. No less. 

 

I worked in an accountancy firm for a year. From the sole trader to the larger company - they all come to their accountant to see what they have to pay in tax and if there are schemes available to make their tax burden less, people are well within their legal and moral right to use them. 

[Boris]

The thing is though, the man on the street avoids tax too. If you put money into an isa you get allowances. If you receive money from share dividends you get a more favourable tax rate than you would do if it was income from other streams. 

 

Buy booze in duty free? That's avoiding paying tax. 

 

The government makes the tax law. Working within that law is fair game. Working outside that law is not fair game. 

 

Tax avoidance isn't wrong. It is paying exactly as much as the government wants you to pay. No more. No less. 

 

I worked in an accountancy firm for a year. From the sole trader to the larger company - they all come to their accountant to see what they have to pay in tax and if there are schemes available to make their tax burden less, people are well within their legal and moral right to use them. 

 

Legal right yes.  Moral?  Open to debate.

 

IMO, the entire tax system needs rebooted and needs to be transparent. 

[Pans Jambo]

Legal right yes.  Moral?  Open to debate.

 

IMO, the entire tax system needs rebooted and needs to be transparent. 

Some sense.

[doctor jambo]

Legal right yes.  Moral?  Open to debate.

 

IMO, the entire tax system needs rebooted and needs to be transparent. 

In favour of a flat tax rate , say 33% inc NI

I think it fair that the tax man can decide how to spend a third of your earnings, while I get to decide how to spend the rest

[Pans Jambo]

The corporates are Avoiding- legal whether you agree or not

The cash in hand is evading- illegal

Right Wrong or Indifferent, the tax system is greatly geared up for the rich. 20% VAT means nothing if you earn big but it means a lot if you are on ?16K a year. That needs sorted.

Last estimate was around ?20Billions per annum in lost revenue to tax avoidance (which is currently legal). 

 

TWENTY BILLION POUNDS. And society just lets that go???

 

But hey, lets cut the unemployment benefit if they dont start losing weight!!!

[doctor jambo]

Right Wrong or Indifferent, the tax system is greatly geared up for the rich. 20% VAT means nothing if you earn big but it means a lot if you are on ?16K a year. That needs sorted.

Last estimate was around ?20Billions per annum in lost revenue to tax avoidance (which is currently legal). 

 

TWENTY BILLION POUNDS. And society just lets that go???

 

But hey, lets cut the unemployment benefit if they dont start losing weight!!!

20 % VAT makes no difference if you are rich or poor- it goes on top of your bill- it is not a personal taxation.

 

And the cut benefits for the obese kind of makes sense

If you are not contributing to the NHS via taxes ( ie unemployed) the least you should be doing is minimising your cost to the NHS- lose weight, stop drinking/smoking/drugs etc- no?

Otherwise you are taking from a system needlessly when you are not putting into it- double costing

[Pans Jambo]

20 % VAT makes no difference if you are rich or poor- it goes on top of your bill- it is not a personal taxation.

 

And the cut benefits for the obese kind of makes sense

If you are not contributing to the NHS via taxes ( ie unemployed) the least you should be doing is minimising your cost to the NHS- lose weight, stop drinking/smoking/drugs etc- no?

Otherwise you are taking from a system needlessly when you are not putting into it- double costing

Really, so if you earn ?16K a year and you buy an item for ?200 + VAT you pay ?40 tax. ?40 is a lot of money to someone who is on a small salary whereas for the person on ?120K a year buying the same thing ?40 is piss all.

You are looking at the percentages and not the money value. Its money that pays your bills and puts food in your belly not percentages.

It IS a personal taxation, very personal for many.

I have a few extra pounds in weight but I haven't been been to the docs for years, I'm also not unemployed so its a moot point but you catch my drift I'm sure.

It's how society is looking at itself these days. Look up to the super wealthy and allow them Carte-Blanche to treat us like morons and then we treat the poor and vulnerable like we were back in medieval times. Perhaps we should call the minimum wage "working poor" serfs!

Society is on its erchie!

[TheMaganator]

Really, so if you earn ?16K a year and you buy an item for ?200 + VAT you pay ?40 tax. ?40 is a lot of money to someone who is on a small salary whereas for the person on ?120K a year buying the same thing ?40 is piss all.

You are looking at the percentages and not the money value. Its money that pays your bills and puts food in your belly not percentages.

It IS a personal taxation, very personal for many.

I have a few extra pounds in weight but I haven't been been to the docs for years, I'm also not unemployed so its a moot point but you catch my drift I'm sure.

It's how society is looking at itself these days. Look up to the super wealthy and allow them Carte-Blanche to treat us like morons and then we treat the poor and vulnerable like we were back in medieval times. Perhaps we should call the minimum wage "working poor" serfs!

Society is on its erchie!

How would you deal with the VAT issue that you describe?

 

I cannot see anyway to have a variable rate - unless we're going to issue VAT exemption cards for those earning below a certain level. Though those on the lowest incomes pay proportionately less tax than those on the highest - the threshold is over ?10k now, is it not? Before you start paying tax?

 

I just don't get your grievance about looking up to the super-wealthy and giving them carte-blanche. Who is being treated like a moron and why?

 

I think we do pretty well as a society tbh. People like to moan about Britain but I would rather be on a low income here than in the majority of the other countries out there. 

[Pans Jambo]

How would you deal with the VAT issue that you describe?

 

I cannot see anyway to have a variable rate - unless we're going to issue VAT exemption cards for those earning below a certain level. Though those on the lowest incomes pay proportionately less tax than those on the highest - the threshold is over ?10k now, is it not? Before you start paying tax?

 

I just don't get your grievance about looking up to the super-wealthy and giving them carte-blanche. Who is being treated like a moron and why?

 

I think we do pretty well as a society tbh. People like to moan about Britain but I would rather be on a low income here than in the majority of the other countries out there. 

Do away with it completely and raise the income tax bands for higher earners.

[TheMaganator]

Do away with it completely and raise the income tax bands for higher earners.

The rise in tax for the high earners would need to be at 100% and probably cover the middle earners to. Think how much dosh VAT brings in - 20% of so many things that are purchased, on paying for goods and services etc. I just do not think doing away with it is at all realistic. 

 

If we did this nobody would hang around long enough to pay the increased rates. 

 

But I don't think VAT is the problem in the UK. There's none to pay on food or children's clothes for example (though it is pretty harsh that it is charged on women's sanitary products, and jonnies for that matter).

[Gershwin]

When do we find out the lists of the people/parties you can vote for in your constituency?

 

Hoping for some decent candidates in Surrey, but not holding out much hope

[doctor jambo]

Do away with it completely and raise the income tax bands for higher earners.

I like VAT though- it goes on the price of things BEFORE I buy them- I already know if I can afford something- because of the price on it.

Frankly I pretty much forget that VAT exists- I just look at the whole price.

[doctor jambo]

The rise in tax for the high earners would need to be at 100% and probably cover the middle earners to. Think how much dosh VAT brings in - 20% of so many things that are purchased, on paying for goods and services etc. I just do not think doing away with it is at all realistic. 

 

If we did this nobody would hang around long enough to pay the increased rates. 

 

But I don't think VAT is the problem in the UK. There's none to pay on food or children's clothes for example (though it is pretty harsh that it is charged on women's sanitary products, and jonnies for that matter).

Condoms are free through the NHS eg the "c-card"

And sanitary products are an enviro disaster

[Pans Jambo]

The rise in tax for the high earners would need to be at 100% and probably cover the middle earners to. Think how much dosh VAT brings in - 20% of so many things that are purchased, on paying for goods and services etc. I just do not think doing away with it is at all realistic.

 

If we did this nobody would hang around long enough to pay the increased rates.

 

But I don't think VAT is the problem in the UK. There's none to pay on food or children's clothes for example (though it is pretty harsh that it is charged on women's sanitary products, and jonnies for that matter).

Its just the type if radical move thats needed. To be realistic, I would cut it in half to 10%. That would get the economy moving and I think ?20billion clawed back from the tax dodgers would more than cover it & then some.

[IMac]

Its just the type if radical move thats needed. To be realistic, I would cut it in half to 10%. That would get the economy moving and I think ?20billion clawed back from the tax dodgers would more than cover it & then some.

currently raises in the region of ?120 billion....

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

currently raises in the region of ?120 billion....

You and your facts! Socialist pipe dreams are being created here!

[aussieh]

JIm Murphy is a fudd, lets be honest,

but the SNP are frankly dangerous now

They think they are Scotland now, and the dissenters are somehow not Scottish- which is odd given their recent pumping in the referendum

I would really like them crushed

I suspect also that the referendum has opened the eyes of many and may have rekindled the Conservative vote- a few shocks may be in store

They are, the other parties are Britain, where's the mop?

[JamboX2]

They are, the other parties are Britain, where's the mop?

What a load of crap.

 

What we are doing is saying the SNP and all they stand for is Scottish. Scotland is not a homogeneous one party state. What of the Greens, SSP and the like?

 

I think the SNP have made a rod for their backs in all this. Call Labour Red Tories all they want but they will only work with them. So you oppose something so much you obliterate it in your patch only to walk hands together through the lobby together.

 

What will all those anti-Labour members make of that? I'll join to stop and take revenge on Labour. Landslide. Great. Indepen... Oh we're backing Miliband for PM!?!?!

Edited February 19, 2015 by JamboX2

[RosscoC]

What a load of crap.

 

What we are doing is saying the SNP and all they stand for is Scottish. Scotland is not a homogeneous one party state. What of the Greens, SSP and the like?

 

I think the SNP have made a rod for their backs in all this. Call Labour Red Tories all they want but they will only work with them. So you oppose something so much you obliterate it in your patch only to walk hands together through the lobby together.

 

What will all those anti-Labour members make of that? I'll join to stop and take revenge on Labour. Landslide. Great. Indepen... Oh we're backing Miliband for PM!?!?!

Have you considered people are voting SNP with a longer-term aim rather than who is PM for the next 5 years?

[aussieh]

Truth hurt, face it Scottish Labour are dead. 40+ seats come May, Eck DPM, will play Ed like a violin, how good.

[Psychedelicropcircle]

Have you considered people are voting SNP with a longer-term aim rather than who is PM for the next 5 years?

Lanour showed through the indyref smiths commision and have only offering more devolution for votes, if they get the votes they'll dilute all the promises keeping the power centralised to WM. With a number of snp MPs to deal with they'll have to deliver.

[Gorgiewave]

Truth hurt, face it Scottish Labour are dead. 40+ seats come May, Eck DPM, will play Ed like a violin, how good.

 

You lot are going to cause a Conservative government.

 

I hope you get squarely blamed for it, too.

 

The most dishonest, opportunist, unnecessary, destructive political "movement" in Scotland's modern history.