***Official Heart of Midlothian v Dundee United Match Thread***

[ramrod]

14 minutes ago, Sooks said:

A lot of hyperbole about Kingsley in my opinion . He just needs a run of games in one position and he will be back to his excellent old self . McKay is just a typical winger who will have games where nothing comes off for him and then suddenly just pull out a tremendous move like the one where he last 

 Edit

Edited February 4, 2023 by ramrod

[Bazzas right boot]

18 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

Hopefully Kingsley and McKay are no where near the team. 

 

Hope Bazza plays, cracking player. 

 

 

[EIEIO]

13 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Snodgrass played and very few people were calling for Devlin to be dropped. They certainly didn’t represent the whole of kickback imo.

 

Nice graphic though. The lack of dig in midfield was a huge problem. 

Was Devlin not injured as a result of the Livi game where he was subbed? Midfield was lightweight graph shows it but was obvious to anyone in attendance after 5 minutes. Robbie made a complete arse of his team selection hopefully this will not be repeated today.

[Bazzas right boot]

15 minutes ago, Sooks said:

A lot of hyperbole about Kingsley in my opinion . He just needs a run of games in one position and he will be back to his excellent old self . McKay is just a typical winger who will have games where nothing comes off for him and then suddenly just pull out a tremendous move like the one where he last scored

 

Yip, he scored 2 cracking goals just weeks ago.

 

Folk are mental imo, Absolute bonkers.

[GinRummy]

Just now, EIEIO said:

Was Devlin not injured as a result of the Livi game where he was subbed? Midfield was lightweight graph shows it but was obvious to anyone in attendance after 5 minutes. Robbie made a complete arse of his team selection hopefully this will not be repeated today.

Think Devlin was injured aye. Agree. It was a mess. I’ve settled down a bit from Wednesday when I was pissed right off but hope lessons have been learned. 

[wavydavy]

4 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Hope Bazza plays, cracking player. 

 

 

 

McKay is one of those type of players that can be so frustrating to watch as there are times when he just looks as if he isn't interested.

 

The next thing he goes on a mazy run and lays on a goal and he is a hero again.

 

He is certainly what may be described as a bit of a  luxury player in that although he tracks back to an extent he doesn't llok as if his heart is really in that side of the game.

 

But his attacking skills probably outway his lack of effort in helping the team defend so that is why Robbie starts him most of the time I would imagine.

[Badonde]

3-0 Hearts.  
shankland X2 and ginnelly 

[No Idle Talk]

29 minutes ago, Sooks said:

A lot of hyperbole about Kingsley in my opinion . He just needs a run of games in one position and he will be back to his excellent old self . 

 

Well said. I would begin that run of games today. 

[Bazzas right boot]

7 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

McKay is one of those type of players that can be so frustrating to watch as there are times when he just looks as if he isn't interested.

 

The next thing he goes on a mazy run and lays on a goal and he is a hero again.

 

He is certainly what may be described as a bit of a  luxury player in that although he tracks back to an extent he doesn't llok as if his heart is really in that side of the game.

 

But his attacking skills probably outway his lack of effort in helping the team defend so that is why Robbie starts him most of the time I would imagine.

 

Disagree, reference work rate. He works hard, just as hard as anyone. 

 

Just because he doesn't go in for 50/50's with 6ft 3 journey men centre half's it doesn't make him lazy like many folk seem to think.

Just makes him clever. 

The middle aged Scottish football fan really can be  hilarious  sometimes, there is an absolute slaver of a man, about 55-60 who screams at Mckay for trying " poofy wee flicks " and not getting stuck in.

Absolute melt.

 

I would probably drop him in certain away games or v the OF and use him as a sub, but the guy is quality at our level and not someone we could easily replace. 

 

Despite the jkb brains trust comments, He's also been decent recently with 2 cracking goals to his name. 

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by Bazzas right boot

[No Idle Talk]

For me, today is not a 'just get the three points and move on' day. I actually want to see a good performance from the team. They owe us one because the last two matches have been absolute crap to watch. 

Edited February 4, 2023 by No Idle Talk

[Bazzas right boot]

13 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Think Devlin was injured aye. Agree. It was a mess. I’ve settled down a bit from Wednesday when I was pissed right off but hope lessons have been learned. 

 

Agree, hopefully  the we play too many defenders, play more attackers,  and the "just have a go crowd" have realised it's not as easy as that.

A far more pragmatic approach is required,  defensive some would say.

 

 

.....

 

Oh, and Bob can select players in the correct positions and the players have regained from their colour blindness which will allow them to pass to someone they know. 

 

 

[A_A wehatethehibs]

Just now, No Idle Talk said:

For me, today is not a 'just get the three points and move on' day. I actually want to see a good performance from the team. They owe us one because the last two matches have absolute crap to watch. 

Personally disagree with this. We need 3 points any which way today against relegation dog fighters. The game is going to be a scrap against a team who’d be delighted with a point.

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, No Idle Talk said:

For me, today is not a 'just get the three points and move on' day. I actually want to see a good performance from the team. They owe us one because the last two matches have been absolute crap to watch. 

 

They owe us nothing. 

It's football,  a competitive sport, not the theatre. 

 

"They owe us"...

 

The entitlement of some is fantastic. 

 

 

 

[OTT]

10 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

McKay is one of those type of players that can be so frustrating to watch as there are times when he just looks as if he isn't interested.

 

The next thing he goes on a mazy run and lays on a goal and he is a hero again.

 

He is certainly what may be described as a bit of a  luxury player in that although he tracks back to an extent he doesn't llok as if his heart is really in that side of the game.

 

But his attacking skills probably outway his lack of effort in helping the team defend so that is why Robbie starts him most of the time I would imagine.

 

I just don't think he does big games. Which is fine for the moment, but I think Robbie needs to recognise that in him that he lacks that in his game. I genuinely die in side when I see his name on the team sheet when we're playing the OF. I don't see the point in starting him because we've never had a good performance from him in one of these games, and I doubt we ever will. He's a great wee player against 9 teams in this league, its just the big two where there is issues.

 

Against Utd, I'd like to see Kuol and Gino as our wide players with Shanks through the middle (or Gino and Shanks rotating as they have been). 

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Personally disagree with this. We need 3 points any which way today against relegation dog fighters. The game is going to be a scrap against a team who’d be delighted with a point.

 

Yip, I disagreed with  it as its entitled nonsense. 

 

 

[johnking123]

Need a good performance today. Been picking up wins , but performances have been a bit crap. Need a response after Wednesday.  

[Fozzyonthefence]

8 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

 

Well said. I would begin that run of games today. 

Not for me, he should bide his time on the bench, doesn’t deserve a start.  If he did play though, who would you drop for him - Cochrane or Rowles?  That’s why he shouldn’t be starting, along with his own poor form.  He’ll get his chance again and if he’ll need to play well to keep his place. Although I look at McKay and wonder how he gets his game every week!

Edited February 4, 2023 by Fozzyonthefence

[wavydavy]

3 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Disagree, reference work rate. He works hard, just as hard as anyone. 

 

Just because he doesn't go in for 50/50's with 6ft 3 journey men centre half's it doesn't make him lazy like many folk seem to think.

Just makes him clever. 

The middle aged Scottish football fan really can be  hilarious  sometimes, there is an absolute slaver of a man, about 55-60 who screams at Mckay for trying " poofy wee flicks " and not getting stuck in.

Absolute melt.

 

I would probably drop him in certain away games or v the OF and use him as a sub, but the guy is quality at our level and not someone we could easily replace. 

 

Despite the jkb brains trust comments, He's also been decent recently with 2 cracking goals to his name. 

 

 

I disagree with your summary and think that he gives the opposition far too much room and doesn't close down wide players quickly enough.

 

It could be of course that he is doing what Robbie wants him to do in which case I would disagree with hsi tactics.

 

Who said anything about not going in for 50/50's with 6ft 3 jorneymen cebntre halfs? I certainly didn't.

 

I was trying to justify why he plays and not otherwise. Did you read my lasy sentence.

[wavydavy]

2 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

I just don't think he does big games. Which is fine for the moment, but I think Robbie needs to recognise that in him that he lacks that in his game. I genuinely die in side when I see his name on the team sheet when we're playing the OF. I don't see the point in starting him because we've never had a good performance from him in one of these games, and I doubt we ever will. He's a great wee player against 9 teams in this league, its just the big two where there is issues.

 

Against Utd, I'd like to see Kuol and Gino as our wide players with Shanks through the middle (or Gino and Shanks rotating as they have been). 

 

 

👍

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, OTT said:

 

I just don't think he does big games. Which is fine for the moment, but I think Robbie needs to recognise that in him that he lacks that in his game. I genuinely die in side when I see his name on the team sheet when we're playing the OF. I don't see the point in starting him because we've never had a good performance from him in one of these games, and I doubt we ever will. He's a great wee player against 9 teams in this league, its just the big two where there is issues.

 

Against Utd, I'd like to see Kuol and Gino as our wide players with Shanks through the middle (or Gino and Shanks rotating as they have been). 

 

 

Tbf, recently there isn't a player that's played well v OF, he's not the only one. 

 

I agree with the point tho.

 

I'd go 451 v the of, sit deep and play a low block and containing game using Gino as my outlet with support from guys like Shankland and Hump.

I would try and sit a little deep but not too deep, that us the hard part.

 

I'd bring on guys ike Mckay maybe later on.

 

Certain folk would explode at that tho.

 

 

 

[Pasquale for King]

Lots of decisions to make because we have such a good squad of players now, even with a few injuries. Good to see Hill was taken off and not injured as one fantasist stated. Should be interesting. 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

I disagree with your summary and think that he gives the opposition far too much room and doesn't close down wide players quickly enough.

 

It could be of course that he is doing what Robbie wants him to do in which case I would disagree with hsi tactics.

 

Who said anything about not going in for 50/50's with 6ft 3 jorneymen cebntre halfs? I certainly didn't.

 

I was trying to justify why he plays and not otherwise. Did you read my lasy sentence.

 

I think he closes down and chases back more than enough.

Just as much as guys like Gino for example,  probably more.

 

 

Going in for  challenges was more in reference to the arse next to me.

 

 

[TheBigO]

Zander

 

Toby

Kingsley

 

Oda

Kuol

Shankland

Snoddy

Barrie

 

Gino

Barrie

Boyce

 

253, playing Barrie twice and giving Boyce 85 mins to ease him back

 

Id bring Kio on at halftime for one of the Barries (the upfront one) and have Grant dive in the halftime rondo and pick up a booking.

 

8-0 Hearts. Robbie slated for not playing Beni.

[Fozzyonthefence]

2 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

I just don't think he does big games. Which is fine for the moment, but I think Robbie needs to recognise that in him that he lacks that in his game. I genuinely die in side when I see his name on the team sheet when we're playing the OF. I don't see the point in starting him because we've never had a good performance from him in one of these games, and I doubt we ever will. He's a great wee player against 9 teams in this league, its just the big two where there is issues.

 

Against Utd, I'd like to see Kuol and Gino as our wide players with Shanks through the middle (or Gino and Shanks rotating as they have been). 

I agree about McKay.  He really should be due a couple of games on the bench as his form doesn’t justify being an almost ever present.  However, today is one of the games you fancy he might actually turn up.  I wouldn’t be starting him against Celtic, Rangers or probably even Hibs though, they’re not his type of games and he effectively leaves us a man short.

 

Would be good to see Kuol get a start in his natural position.  Maybe rest Gino and a start for Humphrys if he’s fit. 

[Pasquale for King]

9 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

For me, today is not a 'just get the three points and move on' day. I actually want to see a good performance from the team. They owe us one because the last two matches have been absolute crap to watch. 

Definitely, performances have dropped off so dominating the game and scoring a few against the worst team in the league isn't too much to ask.

[No Idle Talk]

7 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

They owe us nothing. 

It's football,  a competitive sport, not the theatre. 

 

"They owe us"...

 

The entitlement of some is fantastic. 

 

 

 

 

If you don't think the team have let the fans down in the last two games then that's your opinion and you're 'entitled' to it. 

 

Pretty sure there are loads of Jambos out there who won't agree with you however. 

[SuperPippo]

Clark 

 

Sibbick

Rowles 

Kingsley 

 

Atkinson

Kio

Snodgrass

Grant

Cochrane

 

Shankland

Gino/Kuol

 

 

[Fozzyonthefence]

3 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

 

If you don't think the team have let the fans down in the last two games then that's your opinion and you're 'entitled' to it. 

 

Pretty sure there are loads of Jambos out there who won't agree with you however. 

I never agree with that clown!

 

The “owing” the fans is something you often hear from players or managers though, nothing unusual. 

Edited February 4, 2023 by Fozzyonthefence

[Sooks]

I do not think McKay tries any less in big games , I just think it is a simple matter of the moves he attempts being against better players so they do not come off as regularly . I think we as fans have a tendency to over think these things and I definitely do not think he hides either 

[jimbojambo]

Wednesday is gone. Robbie got the balance of the team wrong and will learn from it. Hopefully a fast start and early goal to get everyone on board for a vital win. C'mon the Hearts 

[OTT]

1 minute ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

 

Tbf, recently there isn't a player that's played well v OF, he's not the only one. 

 

I agree with the point tho.

 

I'd go 451 v the of, sit deep and play a low block and containing game using Gino as my outlet with support from guys like Shankland and Hump.

I would try and sit a little deep but not too deep, that us the hard part.

 

I'd bring on guys ike Mckay maybe later on.

 

Certain folk would explode at that tho.

 

 

 

 

Exactly what I'd like to see us do too. I'm still sore from that game, because I genuinely believe we could have taken something from the game if the initial set up hadn't been so poor. We've seen it so many times from teams like Livi, Killie etc. the best way to compete with the OF is to just totally stop them playing football. Choke the midfield, be hard to break down and make it a horrible game for them. I think trying to play football against a team that plays football better than you is just naïve. A bit like Ange in Europe with Celtic, they've not had good results because he tries to play football against Real Madrid, the same principles apply here. Having Gino as our outball to counter attack them,  I think would have been very effective. 

 

Anyway, with McKay, tbh its not even a criticism of him. If he did it in big games, he'd not be here. I just would like Robbie to acknowledge that he struggles with the big occasions, perhaps a sub role might suit him better in these fixtures. 

 

Those folk that would explode will look for any reason to explode. Whilst I felt that Robbie deserved criticism for how he set up against Rangers, seeing the handful of folk that is the Robbie out brigade try and latch onto the frustration was laughable. 

[TheBigO]

1 minute ago, Sooks said:

I do not think McKay tries any less in big games , I just think it is a simple matter of the moves he attempts being against better players so they do not come off as regularly . I think we as fans have a tendency to over think these things and I definitely do not think he hides either 

Agreed. Too much focus on the guy. So nuch moaning about him around me on Wednesday, got to the stage where folk seemed pissed off when he did something well. You can only say "aye, about time though" once, surely!!!?

 

He works hard, thats never in doubt for me.

 

I think we need him on the ball more and need to find him pockets. Sorry to beat the drum but 433/4231 just jumps out at me.

 

Dont underestimate how important Cam is for Barrie. Getting Baz on the ball in a turnover is the key. We didnt have ANY turnovers on Wed!!!

[Ricardo Quaresma]

                 Clark

         Hill Sibbick Rowles 

Smith Kio/Devlin Kingsley Cochrane

              Snodgrass

        Shankland Ginelly

 

Too defensive? Change it later

[davemclaren]

20 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Personally disagree with this. We need 3 points any which way today against relegation dog fighters. The game is going to be a scrap against a team who’d be delighted with a point.

Indeed. 

[No Idle Talk]

22 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Personally disagree with this. We need 3 points any which way today against relegation dog fighters. The game is going to be a scrap against a team who’d be delighted with a point.

 

I'm not sure that's true. Look back at our recent history against Dundee Utd. There haven't been many 'scraps' in there. There have been loads of goals and some really enjoyable games of football. They're a team we clearly know how to do some damage against so let's go and do some more today. 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, No Idle Talk said:

 

I'm not sure that's true. Look back at our recent history against Dundee Utd. There haven't been many 'scraps' in there. There have been loads of goals and some really enjoyable games of football. They're a team we clearly know how to do some damage against so let's go and do some more today. 

They are bottom of the table though. They have already shown against us they are good at mixing it. 

[Rods]

same team that started v Hibs and Aberdeen at home except Atkinson or Forrest in for Smith due to injury.

[spacerjoe]

56 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Yip, he scored 2 cracking goals just weeks ago.

 

Folk are mental imo, Absolute bonkers.

There is definitely a bit of an unconscious bias built up against to McKay that he doesn't perform against big teams.

 

This was kind of his own making in a way from being so good last season and there being this expectation that he would always deliver something special. We looked to him to make the difference in big games. So when he then doesn't deliver it is more noticed than others.

 

We now go into games with people framing his performances from the perspective of 'he can't do it' and so look for mistakes rather than anything else.

 

It's interesting to see from the Rangers game that almost all players poor performances were down to tactics or being played out of position, except for McKay who was, to quote the most common word used on the match thread, 'pathetic'.

 

He's no more a CM than Kuol.

 

He missed a good chance (not an open goal as many seemed to describe it) and had some wayward passes, but no more than anyone else.

 

Against Celtic in the 3-4 game, he was a great creative outlet cutting in from the left. He linked with Snodgrass and Devlin brilliantly. It seemed to go unnoticed though as people were only looking for errors...

Edited February 4, 2023 by spacerjoe

[Dick Dastardly]

1 hour ago, RS86 said:

Wonder what odds you'd get for that 😅

Evens, it's a stick on 😁😁

[Kev1998]

40 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

For me, today is not a 'just get the three points and move on' day. I actually want to see a good performance from the team. They owe us one because the last two matches have been absolute crap to watch. 

Spot on.3 points with a bit class.weve got out of jail more than twice in the past 10 games.time to get back on track

[Famous 1874]

Is Devlin back?

[Bazzas right boot]

18 minutes ago, spacerjoe said:

There is definitely a bit of an unconscious bias built up against to McKay that he doesn't perform against big teams.

 

This was kind of his own making in a way from being so good last season and there being this expectation that he would always deliver something special. We looked to him to make the difference in big games. So when he then doesn't deliver it is more noticed than others.

 

We now go into games with people framing his performances from the perspective of 'he can't do it' and so look for mistakes rather than anything else.

 

It's interesting to see from the Rangers game that almost all players poor performances were down to tactics or being played out of position, except for McKay who was, to quote the most common word used on the match thread, 'pathetic'.

 

He's no more a CM than Kuol.

 

He missed a good chance (not an open goal as many seemed to describe it) and had some wayward passes, but no more than anyone else.

 

Against Celtic in the 3-4 game, he was a great creative outlet cutting in from the left. He linked with Snodgrass and Devlin brilliantly. It seemed to go unnoticed though as people were only looking for errors...

 

 

Yeah.

 

These types are clueless tho.

 

Usually overweight, middle aged men that are angry with life.

Usually red in face and foaming.

Edited February 4, 2023 by Bazzas right boot

[Sertse]

Really hoping we go for speed today and actually play people in their proper positions. Kuol and Ginnelly on wings should be absolutely ripping their defence apart, extremely formidable.

[Bazzas right boot]

45 minutes ago, No Idle Talk said:

 

If you don't think the team have let the fans down in the last two games then that's your opinion and you're 'entitled' to it. 

 

Pretty sure there are loads of Jambos out there who won't agree with you however. 

 

They let themselves down in that game.

 

Hopefully 3 points and a good performance, but "owe", imo folk are way to precious.

 

Edited February 4, 2023 by Bazzas right boot

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Sertse said:

Really hoping we go for speed today and actually play people in their proper positions. Kuol and Ginnelly on wings should be absolutely ripping their defence apart, extremely formidable.

 

Kuol looks very lightweight. 

 

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Personally disagree with this. We need 3 points any which way today against relegation dog fighters. The game is going to be a scrap against a team who’d be delighted with a point.

👍likely to be a very physical game. 

[Pasquale for King]

24 minutes ago, spacerjoe said:

There is definitely a bit of an unconscious bias built up against to McKay that he doesn't perform against big teams.

 

This was kind of his own making in a way from being so good last season and there being this expectation that he would always deliver something special. We looked to him to make the difference in big games. So when he then doesn't deliver it is more noticed than others.

 

We now go into games with people framing his performances from the perspective of 'he can't do it' and so look for mistakes rather than anything else.

 

It's interesting to see from the Rangers game that almost all players poor performances were down to tactics or being played out of position, except for McKay who was, to quote the most common word used on the match thread, 'pathetic'.

 

He's no more a CM than Kuol.

 

He missed a good chance (not an open goal as many seemed to describe it) and had some wayward passes, but no more than anyone else.

 

Against Celtic in the 3-4 game, he was a great creative outlet cutting in from the left. He linked with Snodgrass and Devlin brilliantly. It seemed to go unnoticed though as people were only looking for errors...

Good post, you have to wonder why hes been played as an 8 a few times recently?

[King prawn]

I was his biggest critic not long ago but Ginnelly has to start for me. We've chucked Oda in too soon and it seems daft considering the form he was on (did Ginnelly get the illness that was going around?)

 

If we can't have Devlin and Snodgrass in the middle it has to be a 3 of Snodgrass, Kio and Grant.

[Gizmo]

33 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

They are bottom of the table though. They have already shown against us they are good at mixing it. 

I really hope we haven’t forgotten just how ‘robustly’ that mob mix it. 

[soonbe110]

30 minutes ago, Rods said:

same team that started v Hibs and Aberdeen at home except Atkinson or Forrest in for Smith due to injury.

Is Smith def out?