Russia Invades Ukraine

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, Cade said:

My demands, by Vladimir Putin (age 69)

 

Ukraine isn't allowed to have any armed forces
Ukraine isn't allowed to make any defence pacts (NATO)

Ukraine isn't allowed to make any political pacts (EU)

Ukraine must live in constant fear of Russian invasion forever

Oh, and same goes for Finland.

 

........And he expects anybody to accept this??? 

Ukraine's demand to Vladimir Putin.

 

 

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, jonesy said:

They went from Craig Ferguson to him on that show. That's like selling Gordon and replacing them him with Kurskis. 

CF and his Sidekick Skeleton were hilarious at times.

[ri Alban]

3 hours ago, SwindonJambo said:

Good analogy. It's like a traffic jam of tanks filllng all lanes of that very road. Utter counts. They'll pay for this.

Nearly a week in and  the roads are all still intact. Russia just driving straight to Kyiv. Mental.

[The Mighty Thor]

7 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:

Neil Oliver today making excuses for Putin and saying he ignores most of the mainstream media because he doesn’t trust it. I suspect he has an account (or two) on here.

 

7 hours ago, Captain Slog said:

That man used to inspire me with some of his history programmes.  Then i read some of his books, which seemed to be more about him than history.  Now, i just can't accept anything he says.  The hair says it all - narcissist.

 

7 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

He actually said this on GammonTV in relation to Ukraine - and he's supposed to be a historian. He's shameless. 

 

I'm old enough to remember when Neil Oliver was a man who spoke truth to power in the eyes of a good half dozen critical thinkers on here. 

 

True story. 

 

Personally, I think he's a ****ing welt. 

[milky_26]

6 hours ago, neilnunb said:

 

 

Worse

 

 

If Ukraine had some bombers they could launch it could be a slaughter. I wonder if Putin is thinking the same, lose all those troops in a slaughter and then accuse Ukraine of being the aggressor/one committing war crimes?

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

You have to hope that some of the generals commanding the invasion see it as immoral and abhorrent what they have been tasked to do. There has to be war crime repercussions awaiting them down the line otherwise.

[Victorian]

Who's in a position and willing to defy Putin and try to oust him?  Anybody who's anybody will be being watched closely.  People watching people watching people.  Who really expects that a man like Putin hasn't secured his own arse from a plot after all the time he's been in power?  

[Herbert.]

7 hours ago, SwindonJambo said:

40 miles now ☹️

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60542877

 

It's a pity the Ukrainians don't have better air firepower because they could do some damage.

 

 

America should send them a few A10s

[il Duce McTarkin]

24 minutes ago, Barack said:

You'd think...but then again,maybe not...

 

 

 

 

 

Thank **** people got out that car. Soiled breeks no doubt. This is absolute madness.

If the Ukranians don't throw in the towel Kiev could be another Grozny.

[1971fozzy]

A 40 mile convoy. That’s awful. Do Ukraine not have any weapons or Air Force that can take that out ?  If not then this looks as though it’s going go one way. 

[Better call Saul]

10 minutes ago, Herbert said:

 

 

America should send them a few A10s

A convy 40 miles long I think maybe a few hundred A10s 

Poor buggers 😞

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

If the Ukrainian government is removed then the sanctions on Russian are PERMANENT.

[Armageddon]

7 hours ago, SwindonJambo said:

40 miles now ☹️

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60542877

 

It's a pity the Ukrainians don't have better air firepower because they could do some damage.

 

Jeez, is there a breakdown at Harthill?  Can't they all just work from home?!

 

The drone footage I saw of the missile launchers being destroyed did make me wonder, it had no audio as I suspect you'd hear American English accents.

[Dazo]

7 minutes ago, All roads lead to Gorgie said:

If the Ukrainian government is removed then the sanctions on Russian are PERMANENT.

If the Ukrainian government is removed the sanctions will need to be escalated to such an extent I’m not sure how the world recovers. It would almost certainly lead to the financial collapse of Russia. 

[Dazo]

7 hours ago, SwindonJambo said:

40 miles now ☹️

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-europe-60542877

 

It's a pity the Ukrainians don't have better air firepower because they could do some damage.

Now would be a good time to borrow some more of those Turkish drones.  

[hughesie27]

6 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

I've learned from difficult experiences never to take any visual evidence at face value.  And whether or not a video or picture has been edited, staged or manipulated, it still gets made and disseminated for a reason and in a context, and looking at the reasons and contexts is important when there's a war going on.

 

I'm not sure what feed you are referring to when you say "fairly neutral and at best pro-Ukraine".  I saw three Twitter posts containing the clip on this thread.  Two were by pro-Russian Telegram "publishers", and the third was by someone partly responsible for the Russian annexation of Crimea, for the downing of a civilian aircraft with the loss of 300 lives, and for leading a military force designed to cause political instability in Ukraine.  None of those sources are neutral or pro-Ukraine.

 

My push back has almost nothing to do with the video.  It is because all of those people - and many more like them who amplify and disseminate such material - are running a hypernationalist extreme right-wing disinformation playbook.  In doing so, they rely to a considerable degree on the material being of a "clickbait" nature, so that the material is more likely to be spread widely by people in their target zones in the English-speaking world.  The stuff is amusing and entertaining, so we pass it on - and it all adds up and helps the overall propaganda effort, in much the same way that the "useful idiots" and the "useful innocents" helped and collaborated with the Soviets in the Cold War era.

 

What is being said is important.  Who is saying it, editing it, manipulating it and giving it a political context is also important.

I appreciate the need for caution when looking at anything coming from either side of the War. Yesterday I had to gently inform someone that the post they had shared of a before and after of Kyiv contained an after photo of Kyiv that was from 2014 after protest and riots.

In this instance though I just don't see what the Russians would get out of it from sharing. It shows an enemy civilian attacking a broken down tank of theirs. If anything I'd suspect that would bring encouragement to the Ukranians.

 

With regards to the 3rd account I posted, there's no guarentee that the name attached is actually who owns the account. But they have a large following so it could well be. Regardless though they have been posting images and videos of Russain soldiers being over run and Russian equipment being seized. Again not something I've seen from any other pro Russian sources.

 

 

 

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

5 minutes ago, Dazo said:

If the Ukrainian government is removed the sanctions will need to be escalated to such an extent I’m not sure how the world recovers. It would almost certainly lead to the financial collapse of Russia. 

The west will just have to improve production of goods and energy at an increased rate. The banks will suffer a lot but an end to the dirty Russian money going through the system will be a good thing in the long term. Russia needs to be brought to its knees to spark a proper democratic revolution.

[Boab]

8 hours ago, hughesie27 said:

I've no idea who originally posted the video or who those people are. I just searched twitter to find it as you cannot easily post videos from the Telegram group I originally seen it in.

Think its lretty fair to say that this is likely a Ukranian trying to petrol bomb a Russian tank and doing a poor job of it though. 

Regardless of the veracity of the video, throwing petrol bombs at a tank will always have a pretty low success rate.

[hughesie27]

6 minutes ago, Boab said:

Regardless of the veracity of the video, throwing petrol bombs at a tank will always have a pretty low success rate.

Evidently! The tractor would have been a much better target.

[Unknown user]

45 minutes ago, Boab said:

Regardless of the veracity of the video, throwing petrol bombs at a tank will always have a pretty low success rate.

 

Depends how you look at it, I doubt many expect to take out a tank with one, but they are causing harassment, stress, worry and will undoubtedly be making russian soldiers nervous.

[Japan Jambo]

1 hour ago, Herbert said:

 

 

America should send them a few A10s

 

Turkish drones work well...

[Cade]

51 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

Turkish drones work well...

 

Turks already sold them a bunch of those.

[Cruyff]

The Eu are sending 70 fighter jets and drones, hopefully in time to destroy that convoy.

[Irufushi]

4 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

The Eu are sending 70 fighter jets and drones, hopefully in time to destroy that convoy.

fingers crossed if not it’s going to be a bloodbath in Kyiv. 

[Mikey1874]

Still doesn't look good with increased Russian bombing which remains their deadliest and most effective tactic. This from a US Senator.

 

 

Edited March 1, 2022 by Mikey1874

[jack D and coke]

9 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

The Eu are sending 70 fighter jets and drones, hopefully in time to destroy that convoy.

That’s full on war though isn’t it? That’s WW3 if we all start destroying that convoy? That’s shooting fish in a barrel…that will not end well for anyone. 

Sheeeeeit😟

[Don Dan]

 

https://apple.news/Aj6oQxEyIS06UP1pPF04RwA

 

World news

Five reasons 'puffy-faced' Putin could be seriously ill

In the wake of his decision to invade Ukraine speculation is mounting about Mr Putin's health

It is all circumstantial but there is growing evidence that Vladimir Putin could be suffering from a serious illness.

At least five factors point to suspicions that his horrendous decision to invade Ukraine could be underpinned not by his mental state, the effects of Covid isolation, or hubris, but by a physical condition that spurred him to gamble on a quick win.

1. Putin's appearance

The Russian president has appeared notably more bloated around the face and neck recently.

That has led to suggestions he may be undergoing treatment with steroids.

Side effects of steroids include increased risk of infection, like coughs and colds, and "mood and behavioural changes."

"Sometimes, when taken in higher doses, steroids can cause confusion or changes in thinking," according to Macmillan Cancer Support. "This can include having strange or frightening thoughts."

In November 2020 Mr Putin suffered an extended coughing fit during a televised meeting with his finance minister. The footage was later edited and the Kremlin said he was "absolutely fine".

According to Fiona Hill, the British former senior White House expert on Russia, Mr Putin is "not looking so great" at the moment.

Ms Hill, who has met Mr Putin more than once, said: "He’s been rather puffy-faced. We know that he has complained about having back issues. Even if it’s not something worse than that, it could be that he’s taking high doses of steroids, or there may be something else.

"There seems to be an urgency for this [invasion] that may be also driven by personal factors."

2. The Long Tables

People with weakened immune systems are at higher risk of contracting severe cases of coronavirus, and other infections.

That would include those taking immune-suppressing drugs.

There has been much speculation about why Mr Putin has engaged in such extreme social distancing.

Emmanuel Macron was forced to sit at the other end of a 13ft table.

During a televised meeting Mr Putin's own foreign minister Sergei Lavrov was also seated at the other end of an absurdly long table.

And at a meeting where he humiliated his spy chief Mr Putin's top security officials all had to sit at the other side of a giant marble chamber.

Covid cases have soared in Russia recently, but the extraordinary efforts to keep Mr Putin in a "bubble" go back many months.

Many of those entering his presence have been forced to quarantine in hotels for two weeks beforehand, including business leaders, politicians and staff.

There have also been reports of a tunnel leading to his office in which visitors are sprayed with disinfectant.

Meanwhile, Joe Biden, who is a decade older, has been huddling around a relatively small table in the Situation Room elbow-to-elbow with his advisers.

Mr Putin, 69, says he has taken the Sputnik vaccine, but it was not filmed.

His extreme measures to avoid the virus would make sense if he had an underlying condition.

But bizarrely, he did shake hands with - and sit right next to - an unvaccinated Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro a few weeks ago.

3. The Intelligence

Marco Rubio, the Republican senator, set a hare running at the weekend when he suggested "something is off" with Mr Putin.

Mr Rubio is no random internet conspiracy theorist, he is the senior Republican on the Senate Intelligence Committee.

As such, he sees classified intelligence, which he can't talk about.

However, he is at liberty to drop hints. And he has.

Mr Rubio said: "I wish I could share more, but for now, I can say it’s pretty obvious to many that something is off with Putin.

"He has always been a killer, but his problem now is different and significant."

Mr Rubio later expanded that Mr Putin "appears to have some neuro/physiological health issues."

He did not give details on what was informing his opinion.

There are growing suggestions that if the US does have intelligence that Mr Putin is sick, they should release it.

A former White House national security official told the Telegraph the US should "make it personal" and release anything it had on Mr Putin.

The French may also have suspicions. The assessment of a French official, following Mr Macron's marathon meeting with Mr Putin before the invasion, hinted at something.

The official was quoted as saying that Mr Putin was "not the same" as when Mr Macron met him two years earlier. He was more rigid and ideological and had, in some respects, "gone haywire".

There has also still been no firm answer as to why Mr Putin disappeared from public view for 10 days in 2015. Speculation about a health scare was dismissed at the time.

4. Russian academic claims Putin has Parkinson's disease and cancer

In November 2020 Professor Valery Solovei, a former historian at the Moscow State Institute of International Relations, was quoted as suggesting Mr Putin may have Parkinson's disease and cancer.

He also suggested that Mr Putin may be poised to quit in 2021 due to fears for his health.

At the time Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said it was “absolute nonsense” and “everything is fine with the president.”

Asked if Mr Putin was planning to step down in the near future, Mr Peskov said: “No”.

Prof Solovei resigned from the institute, where he was head of the public relations department, in 2019, saying "political pressure" was responsible for his departure.

He was later detained at an opposition protest in Moscow.

5. Putin's accelerated timeline

In his mission to restore what he considers lost Russian land, Mr Putin had previously taken a long view.

In 2008 he invaded Georgia in support of the self-proclaimed republics of South Ossetia and Abkhazia.

Six years later, he annexed Crimea.

Under changes to the Russian constitution made in early 2021, he could remain president until 2036.

That would give him plenty of time for incremental land grabs, what the West might see as "minor incursions" punishable only with a slap on the wrist.

For those reasons many Putin watchers expected him to adopt "salami tactics," taking Ukraine "slice by slice" over a period of time.

They have been left puzzled as to why he would take such a gamble on capturing the whole of Ukraine, a country of 44 million people, in one go with a force military experts say was not enough.

It only increases the suspicion that, perhaps, his health meant he was running out of time.

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

This will end with Putin in prison. 

[Herbert.]

Germany are flying fighters over Poland. We all know how that turned out last time. 

 

[I P Knightley]

13 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The Bicester reference : savage.

Afraid that that one's over my head - anyone care to explain? Ta.

[maroonlegions]

They shut down a Kremlin backed site within thirty minutes of their announcement

 

 

 

 

LADBIBLE.COM

Hacking Group Anonymous Declares 'Cyber War' Against Russian Government

 

Edited March 1, 2022 by maroonlegions

[The Real Maroonblood]

29 minutes ago, Herbert said:

Germany are flying fighters over Poland. We all know how that turned out last time. 

 

Drama queen alert.

[Boab]

33 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

That’s full on war though isn’t it? That’s WW3 if we all start destroying that convoy? That’s shooting fish in a barrel…that will not end well for anyone. 

Sheeeeeit😟

Not Western EU countries and not Western jets. That would, more or less, be a declaration of war.

They are being supplied with jets the Ukrainians already use. Mig 29, SU 25 and the like, from Bulgaria, Slovakia.

 

Either way, it will escalate an already desperate situation.

This is a worrying development. Not run for the hills yet, but worrying.

[Nobreath]

15 minutes ago, maroonlegions said:

They shut down a Kremlin backed site within thirty minutes of their announcement

 

 

 

 

LADBIBLE.COM

Hacking Group Anonymous Declares 'Cyber War' Against Russian Government

 

 

I wonder if this is just an independent group of hackers or some government agency pretending to be, to distance themselves from it. 

Edited March 1, 2022 by Nobreath

[Debut 4]

Just catching up. Saw the Boris press conference in Poland. Really impassioned plea from a person questioning him why the UK and others aren’t just weighing in?  

Obviously emotions are high but **** being put on the spot like that.  

 

[Victorian]

Don't think there's much doubt now that the intensity of destruction is being increased.  Kharkiv is being indiscriminately pounded.  Signs that cities are being targeted for seige action as well.  It seems only inevitable that utilities and supplies will cease.  Millions of people subjected to seige torture from the dark ages.  

[jack D and coke]

7 minutes ago, Boab said:

Not Western EU countries and not Western jets. That would, more or less, be a declaration of war.

They are being supplied with jets the Ukrainians already use. Mig 29, SU 25 and the like, from Bulgaria, Slovakia.

 

Either way, it will escalate an already desperate situation.

This is a worrying development. Not run for the hills yet, but worrying.

Yeah it’s not the road to Basra. We’re not dealing with some tinpot country like Iraq where we played a video game at a disheveled outfit that could barely fire back. I hope there some cool heads in there somewhere or just a brave Russian general who decides to end that *****. 
I know at some point we have to say no more but it’s giving me the fear this nonsense. 
I didn’t think he’d invade. I didn’t think he’d keep going…

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

Just now, Debut 4 said:

Just catching up. Saw the Boris press conference in Poland. Really impassioned plea from a person questioning him why the UK and others aren’t just weighing in?  

Obviously emotions are high but **** being put on the spot like that.  

 

Did they ask about the Russian donations?

[Lord Montpelier]

9 minutes ago, Nobreath said:

 

I wonder if this is just an independent group of hackers or some government agency pretending to be, to distance themselves from it. 

Suspect independent but no western government is going to stop their mischief at this point. Good on them

[Boab]

9 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Yeah it’s not the road to Basra. We’re not dealing with some tinpot country like Iraq where we played a video game at a disheveled outfit that could barely fire back. I hope there some cool heads in there somewhere or just a brave Russian general who decides to end that *****. 
I know at some point we have to say no more but it’s giving me the fear this nonsense. 
I didn’t think he’d invade. I didn’t think he’d keep going…

 

I did think he would go in. There is nothing, as yet, that I didn't think they would do.

Unless something happens to escalate this conflict beyond Ukraine, I think it will be within there.

Terrible as it is.

[jack D and coke]

8 minutes ago, Boab said:

I did think he would go in. There is nothing, as yet, that I didn't think they would do.

Unless something happens to escalate this conflict beyond Ukraine, I think it will be within there.

Terrible as it is.

Hope you’re right man. 

[maroonlegions]

30 minutes ago, Nobreath said:

 

I wonder if this is just an independent group of hackers or some government agency pretending to be, to distance themselves from it. 

Nope. 

 

They are notorious and well orginised. 

[maroonlegions]

"Governments run by oil barons, deposits running low.. so let's start a war.."

Total Invasion...

 

 

[1971fozzy]

1 hour ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

This will end with Putin in prison. 

Id think the coward would take a pill or something rather than that

[highlandjambo3]

2 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

Depends how you look at it, I doubt many expect to take out a tank with one, but they are causing harassment, stress, worry and will undoubtedly be making russian soldiers nervous.

It’s not a complete dud but it would have very limited effect and, you’d be extremely lucky to get a fuel container inside the vehicle.  Thing is armoured crews don’t like to “batten down” for long periods, you get a lack of local awareness and a bit paranoid about who’s sneaking up on you…..no matter how modern the vehicle is, observation when battened down is similar to having a pair of binoculars jammed into your face so crews tend to be peeking out quite often and that’s Huge risk for them……….would take some sort of balls to get close enough but, tanks/armoured vehicles really were not designed for urban warfare………large containers of fuel (glass sweet jars) dropped at hight to saturate a vehicle followed by a couple of smaller lite up ones would do the trick 👍….. still take a brave soul to do this thought and the vehicle would need to be quite close to some high buildings……a risk I’m sure crews are aware of.

[Hesh]

3 hours ago, Boab said:

Regardless of the veracity of the video, throwing petrol bombs at a tank will always have a pretty low success rate.

Petrol bombs are rarely intended to destroy/damage the target. It's gets them to button up which significantly effects their fighting ability 

[Homme]

The person translating for Zelenksy on Sky News is breaking down. You can just feel the sadness.

 

The lady who spoke at the EU Parliament just before Zelensky came on was absolutely fantastic. A speech for the ages.

[Vlad Magic]

Just now, Homme said:

The person translating for Zelenksy on Sky News is breaking down. You can just feel the sadness.

 

The lady who spoke at the EU Parliament just before Zelensky came on was absolutely fantastic. A speech for the ages.

Im in bits listening to him.

 

Thats the most upsetting and powerful thing I’ve seen on TV in a long time.

[Homme]

1 minute ago, Vlad Magic said:

Im in bits listening to him.

 

Thats the most upsetting and powerful thing I’ve seen on TV in a long time.

 

It was unbelievable.

[Cruyff]

1 hour ago, jack D and coke said:

That’s full on war though isn’t it? That’s WW3 if we all start destroying that convoy? That’s shooting fish in a barrel…that will not end well for anyone. 

Sheeeeeit😟

Already is mate. This is probably just the start.