The rise and fall of The SNP.

[jack D and coke]

18 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Lemme get this straight - yoons are happy to repeat the mantra of "national debt" (and Scotland's share therof) - on the basis Westminster has spent all that dosh on Scotland's behalf but when it comes to getting back what Scotland paid Westminster for , that is not going to happen ?

Aye ?

 

 

 

 

We leave and we’re to take hundreds of billions of debt but we’re also to accept getting plums for what we’ve paid in…

Seems fair  
 

[NANOJAMBO]

9 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

We leave and we’re to take hundreds of billions of debt but we’re also to accept getting plums for what we’ve paid in…

Seems fair  
 

Thanks for the clarity.😄

Just one of the benefits of the union, obv. 

[Don Dan]

Food for thought. I’d be interested to hear peoples thoughts on how they think this scenario would work or not as the case may be.

 

https://apple.news/AgPyzjxIOQGyTuTqUuXNGDQ

The challenges posed by the English border if an independent Scotland joins the EU should not be downplayed, academics have said.

A paper by the UK in a Changing Europe think tank says some of the cross-border arrangements envisaged in the 2014 referendum would not be possible due to Brexit, as a new land border between the EU and the rest of the UK would be created.

The authors, Professor Nicola McEwen of the University of Edinburgh and Professor Katy Hayward of Queen’s University Belfast, said any future prospectus for independence must confront the challenges of Brexit to ensure an informed debate.

While Scotland would likely remain in the common travel area, they said a deal similar to the Northern Ireland protocol would be unlikely.

The report says the main trunk roads between England and Scotland would need some form of border control and inspection facilities. While Scottish goods would be opened up to the EU single market, trade with the continent would not be entirely “frictionless” due to goods having to travel through England.

During an online panel discussion McEwen said people living in Scotland’s southern communities would need reassurance and support on the implications of the new border.

She said: “I think there is downplaying on the part of the SNP about the significance of the border challenge. In some ways it’s not a problem of their making, it’s not a problem that they wanted — because they’d much rather the rest of the UK at the time of independence was also within the EU or in the single market. But nonetheless it is a problem that would have to be faced.”

Brexit shows the importance of preparing for these challenges, she said, pointing to events in Northern Ireland, where Paul Givan, the first minister, has resigned over the disputed protocol.

Last week it was revealed that 11 civil servants had started work on a new prospectus for independence.

 

[Japan Jambo]

13 minutes ago, Boy Daniel said:

Food for thought. I’d be interested to hear peoples thoughts on how they think this scenario would work or not as the case may be.

 

https://apple.news/AgPyzjxIOQGyTuTqUuXNGDQ

The challenges posed by the English border if an independent Scotland joins the EU should not be downplayed, academics have said.

A paper by the UK in a Changing Europe think tank says some of the cross-border arrangements envisaged in the 2014 referendum would not be possible due to Brexit, as a new land border between the EU and the rest of the UK would be created.

The authors, Professor Nicola McEwen of the University of Edinburgh and Professor Katy Hayward of Queen’s University Belfast, said any future prospectus for independence must confront the challenges of Brexit to ensure an informed debate.

While Scotland would likely remain in the common travel area, they said a deal similar to the Northern Ireland protocol would be unlikely.

The report says the main trunk roads between England and Scotland would need some form of border control and inspection facilities. While Scottish goods would be opened up to the EU single market, trade with the continent would not be entirely “frictionless” due to goods having to travel through England.

During an online panel discussion McEwen said people living in Scotland’s southern communities would need reassurance and support on the implications of the new border.

She said: “I think there is downplaying on the part of the SNP about the significance of the border challenge. In some ways it’s not a problem of their making, it’s not a problem that they wanted — because they’d much rather the rest of the UK at the time of independence was also within the EU or in the single market. But nonetheless it is a problem that would have to be faced.”

Brexit shows the importance of preparing for these challenges, she said, pointing to events in Northern Ireland, where Paul Givan, the first minister, has resigned over the disputed protocol.

Last week it was revealed that 11 civil servants had started work on a new prospectus for independence.

 

 

Has the SNP published anything yet that indicates what independence might look like and how issues like this might be resolved? I'm sure that 'if there is a will there is a way' but one would like to hope that things have been considered a little more deeply than Brexit was.

[JudyJudyJudy]

35 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

😉😂

I do love a Scotland England😃I’m golfing in the morning so getting into town probably not happening but defo out for it. 

It’s a good Scotland team (even if a good few non Scot’s in there these days) but it’s coming to the end of its peak I think.
Got to get something soon it’s been too long. 

👌

[Taffin]

How does a state pension work?

 

I always thought you were paying for other people's pensions (those receiving it now) and we're reliant on those future earners paying for yours. Wouldn't that mean that the benefit of paying to the UK treasury will already have been spent?

[coconut doug]

46 minutes ago, Taffin said:

How does a state pension work?

 

I always thought you were paying for other people's pensions (those receiving it now) and we're reliant on those future earners paying for yours. Wouldn't that mean that the benefit of paying to the UK treasury will already have been spent?

 

I think you know very well we have a contributions based system and that the money we pay goes to the UKgov. Clearly they have an obligation to pay contributors irrespective of nationality. You can contact the gov to see your contributions status.

 

 

 

On the other hand i don't think Scotland has any obligation to pay for UK debt if we are no longer in the UK.

 

 

[Taffin]

8 minutes ago, coconut doug said:

 

I think you know very well we have a contributions based system and that the money we pay goes to the UKgov. Clearly they have an obligation to pay contributors irrespective of nationality. You can contact the gov to see your contributions status.

 

 

 

On the other hand i don't think Scotland has any obligation to pay for UK debt if we are no longer in the UK.

 

 

 

I don't know that very well, hence the question. It's not something I've ever given much consideration to but I've definitely heard people talk about how I'm effectively paying for their pension and a future generation will pay for mine.

 

Thus my thinking was my contributions are already being spent and therefore once people stop paying into it there is no backlog to be paid out, it's already gone.

 

Thanks for making me aware that isn't how it works.

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

3 hours ago, Boy Daniel said:

Food for thought. I’d be interested to hear peoples thoughts on how they think this scenario would work or not as the case may be.

 

https://apple.news/AgPyzjxIOQGyTuTqUuXNGDQ

The challenges posed by the English border if an independent Scotland joins the EU should not be downplayed, academics have said.

A paper by the UK in a Changing Europe think tank says some of the cross-border arrangements envisaged in the 2014 referendum would not be possible due to Brexit, as a new land border between the EU and the rest of the UK would be created.

The authors, Professor Nicola McEwen of the University of Edinburgh and Professor Katy Hayward of Queen’s University Belfast, said any future prospectus for independence must confront the challenges of Brexit to ensure an informed debate.

While Scotland would likely remain in the common travel area, they said a deal similar to the Northern Ireland protocol would be unlikely.

The report says the main trunk roads between England and Scotland would need some form of border control and inspection facilities. While Scottish goods would be opened up to the EU single market, trade with the continent would not be entirely “frictionless” due to goods having to travel through England.

During an online panel discussion McEwen said people living in Scotland’s southern communities would need reassurance and support on the implications of the new border.

She said: “I think there is downplaying on the part of the SNP about the significance of the border challenge. In some ways it’s not a problem of their making, it’s not a problem that they wanted — because they’d much rather the rest of the UK at the time of independence was also within the EU or in the single market. But nonetheless it is a problem that would have to be faced.”

Brexit shows the importance of preparing for these challenges, she said, pointing to events in Northern Ireland, where Paul Givan, the first minister, has resigned over the disputed protocol.

Last week it was revealed that 11 civil servants had started work on a new prospectus for independence.

 

A couple of thoughts :

Scotland needs to think about it's long term economic aims (assuming EU membership) as Ireland did - and wean itself from dependency on England, as Ireland did.

 

Scottish goods having to travel through England ? No, no, no, thanks. This needs to be avoided as much as possible. 

Scotland will need direct ferry routes to Europe to avoid the disaster that is Dover (this will remain a mess until/unless England rejoins the EU) - as Ireland recognised, by abandoning the land bridge approach to Europe . Irish trucks now almost totally avoid England due to customers delays at Holyhead & Dover via a multitude of new ferry links built since 2016. Scotland can't afford to be a hostage to English goodwill - see Priti  Patel and her "using food as a weapon against Ireland" suggestion. 

 

Borders with England were always unavoidable , it could never be totally avoided but English brexit shouldn't be a barrier to Scottish freedom. If anything, it will likley continue to make the case for indpependence as the economic costs begin to hit domestic consumption via lack of choice/inflationary costs. 

 

If the current 20km queues at Dover aren't a problem for brexiters then I'm sure Scotland can cope with a delay at Gretna.  

 

 

 

 

[coconut doug]

4 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I don't know that very well, hence the question. It's not something I've ever given much consideration to but I've definitely heard people talk about how I'm effectively paying for their pension and a future generation will pay for mine.

 

Thus my thinking was my contributions are already being spent and therefore once people stop paying into it there is no backlog to be paid out, it's already gone.

 

Thanks for making me aware that isn't how it works.

 

 

 

Well i suppose the propaganda hit the correct demographic then. If you pay, you have an entitlement based on your contributions. You should be sent an update every so often as to what your entitlement is.

 

Surprisingly the former pensions minister Libdem,Steve Webb to whom this quote is attributed,didn't seem to know this either. Next thing you know the Libdems will be telling us NS is manipulating Covid statistics and that there was no difference in the outcomes for Scotland and England as a result of the differing levels of restriction over the last few weeks.

 

There are several reasons why Scotland is better placed to provide better pensions for its people the biggest being that we currently subsidise RUK with our working life contributions and shorter penshionable life.

[NANOJAMBO]

25 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Thus my thinking was my contributions are already being spent and therefore once people stop paying into it there is no backlog to be paid out, it's already gone.

 

Thanks for making me aware that isn't how it works.

 

 

 

Are you seriously saying you don't know how the UK state retirement pension works ? 

[Taffin]

1 minute ago, coconut doug said:

 

Well i suppose the propaganda hit the correct demographic then. If you pay, you have an entitlement based on your contributions. You should be sent an update every so often as to what your entitlement is.

 

Surprisingly the former pensions minister Libdem,Steve Webb to whom this quote is attributed,didn't seem to know this either. Next thing you know the Libdems will be telling us NS is manipulating Covid statistics and that there was no difference in the outcomes for Scotland and England as a result of the differing levels of restriction over the last few weeks.

 

There are several reasons why Scotland is better placed to provide better pensions for its people the biggest being that we currently subsidise RUK with our working life contributions and shorter penshionable life.

 

 

What propaganda?!? 

 

I've never read anything about it in my life 😂😂

 

I asked a question based on my understanding that there is not pension pot I pay into just waiting to be paid back at a future point in time.

 

You've said that's incorrect, so that's great. I've also never had an update as to what my entitlement is, now I know I'm supposed to get one I'll ask for it too 👍

[manaliveits105]

3 hours ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

Has the SNP published anything yet that indicates what independence might look like and how issues like this might be resolved? I'm sure that 'if there is a will there is a way' but one would like to hope that things have been considered a little more deeply than Brexit was.

NAW they still dont have a feckin clue so cant publish anything which is ok as they arent in a hurry for another referendumb any time soon  

 

[Taffin]

3 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

 

Are you seriously saying you don't know how the UK state retirement pension works ? 

 

No, I'm saying I thought I did and it's just been corrected. Why would I be that interested in how it works?

 

I thought (hypothetically) if younger generations all stopped working and paying then I'd have no state pension. I didn't know it was my contributions that were going to be paid back to me.

Edited February 4, 2022 by Taffin

[coconut doug]

8 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

 

What propaganda?!? 

 

I've never read anything about it in my life 😂😂

 

I asked a question based on my understanding that there is not pension pot I pay into just waiting to be paid back at a future point in time.

 

You've said that's incorrect, so that's great. I've also never had an update as to what my entitlement is, now I know I'm supposed to get one I'll ask for it too 👍

 

The propaganda that Scotland and the Scots are once again looking for something for nothing from the hard working English taxpayer. A story which is obvious nonsense and over a year old but recycled by various forms of the ministry of truth (our Free Press) to remind us all that we are too wee, too poor and too stupid.

 

[Roxy Hearts]

17 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

 

What propaganda?!? 

 

I've never read anything about it in my life 😂😂

 

I asked a question based on my understanding that there is not pension pot I pay into just waiting to be paid back at a future point in time.

 

You've said that's incorrect, so that's great. I've also never had an update as to what my entitlement is, now I know I'm supposed to get one I'll ask for it too 👍

You can check your pension status on line. I did it a while back. Govuk Web.

[Taffin]

5 minutes ago, Roxy Hearts said:

You can check your pension status on line. I did it a while back. Govuk Web.

 

Cheers. I'll get on top of it.

 

I genuinely just assumed you got whatever you got in line with a standard amount for the state pension.

 

I'm all over my private one like a rash in comparison!

[Roxy Hearts]

Just now, Taffin said:

 

Cheers. I'll get on top of it.

 

I genuinely just assumed you got whatever you got in line with a standard amount for the state pension.

 

I'm all over my private one like a rash in comparison!

I think there's differences in pay out. I've a couple of work pensions but not great. 

[davemclaren]

26 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

No, I'm saying I thought I did and it's just been corrected. Why would I be that interested in how it works?

 

I thought (hypothetically) if younger generations all stopped working and paying then I'd have no state pension. I didn't know it was my contributions that were going to be paid back to me.

The state pension isn’t a funded scheme. The state pensions paid out this year come from the general taxation pot. Your entitlement depends on the number of years of NI contributions you make. 

[Lord Montpelier]

25 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

The state pension isn’t a funded scheme. The state pensions paid out this year come from the general taxation pot. Your entitlement depends on the number of years of NI contributions you make. 

Yep, 30 years hard slog I believe to get the NI contributions for full state pension

[davemclaren]

5 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Yep, 30 years hard slog I believe to get the NI contributions for full state pension

Indeed. One year to go for me before I can start to collect something from them. 

[SwindonJambo]

18 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Yep, 30 years hard slog I believe to get the NI contributions for full state pension

It's now 35 actually for the post 2016 state pension.

[Taffin]

1 hour ago, Roxy Hearts said:

I think there's differences in pay out. I've a couple of work pensions but not great. 

 

1 hour ago, davemclaren said:

The state pension isn’t a funded scheme. The state pensions paid out this year come from the general taxation pot. Your entitlement depends on the number of years of NI contributions you make. 

 

36 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Yep, 30 years hard slog I believe to get the NI contributions for full state pension

 

30 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Indeed. One year to go for me before I can start to collect something from them. 

 

Thanks 👍👍

 

And enjoy it when it comes Dave!

[davemclaren]

18 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

 

 

 

Thanks 👍👍

 

And enjoy it when it comes Dave!

It comes quicker than you think! 😄

[John Findlay]

1 hour ago, davemclaren said:

The state pension isn’t a funded scheme. The state pensions paid out this year come from the general taxation pot. Your entitlement depends on the number of years of NI contributions you make. 

Correct, which you can find out on the government pension website. All you need is your NI number.

[Taffin]

5 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I doubt there will be a state pension when you retire tbh. The aging population is a major tax drain and that was one of the reason the pension changed a few year ago.
 

It’s basically to wean us off the expectation of a state pension and move it into the individuals responsibility. 

 

The above relates to UK. 
 

 

 

 

That's sort of what I thought was the situation but the comments so far suggests I'm entitled to it as I've paid in already via NI.

 

Either way, better for me to wise up about it so I do notice if they take it away, and I'm glad I've been prioritising my private pot too...as painful as it is to see it disappear each month.

[132goals1958]

22 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

 

I’m not 100% sure but think your entitled to nowt tbh. NI is a system, as your rightly state is just paid out it not like your private pension. 
 

If you died tomorrow your nearest and dearest don’t get your contribution back, you just paid  into a system. 
 

Your entitled to a pay out only when meet certain conditions, which are ever changing. Age, number of years paid etc. I’m assuming people forecasts are passed on the % of years work as a couple other posters suggested. 
 

I think your relatively young late 20’s/early 30’s, you should invest when your young to benefit from long term trends and take advantages of compound principals. The maths isn't particularly complicated, it’s not that difficult to have yourself at least a million NPV, with a long term investment strategy for relatively small contributions. 
 

As painful as it is, one of the most important things you can do when young. Thankfully your a smart lad and seem to have in hand. 
 

I personally think the state pension is a bit of out dated system as it was developed in different times. Political suicide to try and **** with it though due to the grey vote 
 

 

 

Basically the government benefit from those who die just before or after retirement.

[Roxy Hearts]

31 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

 

I’m not 100% sure but think your entitled to nowt tbh. NI is a system, as your rightly state is just paid out it not like your private pension. 
 

If you died tomorrow your nearest and dearest don’t get your contribution back, you just paid  into a system. 
 

Your entitled to a pay out only when meet certain conditions, which are ever changing. Age, number of years paid etc. I’m assuming people forecasts are passed on the % of years work as a couple other posters suggested. 
 

I think your relatively young late 20’s/early 30’s, you should invest when your young to benefit from long term trends and take advantages of compound principals. The maths isn't particularly complicated, it’s not that difficult to have yourself at least a million NPV, with a long term investment strategy for relatively small contributions. 
 

As painful as it is, one of the most important things you can do when young. Thankfully your a smart lad and seem to have in hand. 
 

I personally think the state pension is a bit of out dated system as it was developed in different times. Political suicide to try and **** with it though due to the grey vote 
 

 

How can other countries manage it and pay higher amounts? The UK is well passed its sell by date and time to get out.

[Taffin]

42 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

 

I’m not 100% sure but think your entitled to nowt tbh. NI is a system, as your rightly state is just paid out it not like your private pension. 
 

If you died tomorrow your nearest and dearest don’t get your contribution back, you just paid  into a system. 
 

Your entitled to a pay out only when meet certain conditions, which are ever changing. Age, number of years paid etc. I’m assuming people forecasts are passed on the % of years work as a couple other posters suggested. 
 

I think your relatively young late 20’s/early 30’s, you should invest when your young to benefit from long term trends and take advantages of compound principals. The maths isn't particularly complicated, it’s not that difficult to have yourself at least a million NPV, with a long term investment strategy for relatively small contributions. 
 

As painful as it is, one of the most important things you can do when young. Thankfully your a smart lad and seem to have in hand. 
 

I personally think the state pension is a bit of out dated system as it was developed in different times. Political suicide to try and **** with it though due to the grey vote 
 

 

 

I had a wonderful modern studies teacher and one of his pieces of advice was to start paying into a pension as soon as possible and prioritise it over other things and I've always just remembered that and tried to stick to it.

 

I've made the thread go very pension heavy, apologies people that's me asking loosely linked questions. 👍

[NANOJAMBO]

31 minutes ago, Roxy Hearts said:

How can other countries manage it and pay higher amounts? The UK is well passed its sell by date and time to get out.

Higher taxes. 

[manaliveits105]

Nicola Sturgeon claims UK taxpayers would fund Scots' pensions after independence

[jack D and coke]

[NANOJAMBO]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10474977/Sturgeon-says-British-taxpayers-continue-foot-bill-Scottish-pensions-independence.html

 

 

Sturgeon told the Scottish Parliament: 'When Scotland votes for independence, as was the case in 2014, the distribution of existing UK liabilities and assets, including those related to pensions, will be subject to negotiation.

'But the key point is for those in receipt of pensions, and it is what the minister for pensions in the UK Government at the time, Steve Webb, confirmed: that people with accumulated rights would continue to receive the current levels of state pension.'

But Mr Webb clarified his remarks just days later, saying: 'I would think the Scottish people would expect their Government to take on full responsibility for paying pensions. Similarly people in the rest of the UK would not expect to guarantee or underwrite the pensions of those living in what would then [be] a separate country.'

 

 

A spokesman for Miss Sturgeon said: 'Pensions will be delivered in an independent Scotland by the Government of an independent Scotland but there will be historic contributions made into the UK pot that are owed from that UK side.'

 

 

 

Pressed on why the First Minister referenced Mr Webb's comments when they were clarified one week later, he said: 'He is on record saying what he said.'

Last week, Sturgeon was accused of overseeing an 'obscene waste of public money' after it emerged a team of 11 Holyrood civil servants are working on her new blueprint for Scottish independence.  

****************************

 

 

Nothing dificult in this.

Westminster continues to pay for those pensions it already pays out (and for which recipients paid their taxes to London and not Edinburgh) 

All Scots not of pensionable age get a DWP statement from London telling them what their pension entitlement is at the point of indy (based on their taxes paid to London) - Scotgov assumes responsibility post indy. 

 

All part of the post indy settlement  discussions(when Scotland gets to talk about rent due on  England's nuclear deterrent and it's share of England's national debt). 

[Roxy Hearts]

2 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Higher taxes. 

It's all relative. Close loopholes and pay people a decent wage.

[Roxy Hearts]

1 hour ago, manaliveits105 said:

Nicola Sturgeon claims UK taxpayers would fund Scots' pensions after independence

I'm a UK taxpayer and paid my contributions so I expect my pension to be paid. Don't you?

[manaliveits105]

Not by another country naw - the murrell sofa should cover things though ay 

[luckydug]

27 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Not by another country naw - the murrell sofa should cover things though ay 

Are you trying to say Scottish people should not be entitled to a pension after paying NI for all those years before independence ? 

In other words UK government gets to keep all our money. 

 

Edited February 4, 2022 by luckydug

[Unknown user]

25 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Not by another country naw - the murrell sofa should cover things though ay 

 

You keep swinging champ, you're a trooper!

[periodictabledancer]

36 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Not by another country naw - the murrell sofa should cover things though ay 

Did you ride a bike once without a crash helmet and get brain damage 

[The Real Maroonblood]

11 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

Did you ride a bike once without a crash helmet and get brain damage 

[Hmfc1965]

1 hour ago, luckydug said:

Are you trying to say Scottish people should not be entitled to a pension after paying NI for all those years before independence ? 

In other words UK government gets to keep all our money. 

 

NI is a tax. As has been mentioned we all pay NI but the rules as to when we become entitled to a state pension keep changing. 

Sturgeon is right that it's something to be looked at in the event of independence. 

[Roxy Hearts]

7 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

Not by another country naw - the murrell sofa should cover things though ay 

Were there any schools where you lived! 

[Guest]

7 hours ago, luckydug said:

Are you trying to say Scottish people should not be entitled to a pension after paying NI for all those years before independence ? 

In other words UK government gets to keep all our money. 

 

Is it not the case that the money has been spent already (barring something like a 2 month buffer)? Its the taxpayers of the day that fund the state pensions of the day. Presumably that set up will continue in the future, whether that be a UK or IScot future.

[pablo]

8 hours ago, luckydug said:

Are you trying to say Scottish people should not be entitled to a pension after paying NI for all those years before independence ? 

In other words UK government gets to keep all our money. 

 

 

That's exactly what will happen.  Why would the taxpayers of the UK fund the pensions of a newly Independent Scotland while Scottish taxpayers put nothing into the UK pot? 

 

Is Scotland too poor, too wee, too stupid to fund it's own welfare state?😉

 

 

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

If Scotland became an independent country then England, Wales & Northern Ireland become independent to Scotland I doubt you would be able to cherry pick although I presume it would all be debated for years through court's in a deal or no deal pavlova palaver all over again 

Pensions why bother we're all doomed 

[Lord Montpelier]

Would I trust Sturgeon and Kate Forbes to look after my pension rights in the event of independence, those great shapers of economic policy.

 

Let me think. No. 

[Boab]

6 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Would I trust Sturgeon and Kate Forbes to look after my pension rights in the event of independence, those great shapers of economic policy.

 

Let me think. No. 

I would trust Sunak as far as I could throw him, which, I concede, would be quite far, the little shit ! 
 

[Roxy Hearts]

1 hour ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Would I trust Sturgeon and Kate Forbes to look after my pension rights in the event of independence, those great shapers of economic policy.

 

Let me think. No. 

There would be a Scottish General Election at some stage and you could vote them out. Vote in someone more aligned with your politics. That's part of the reason why we need independence. 

[Roxy Hearts]

2 hours ago, pablo said:

 

That's exactly what will happen.  Why would the taxpayers of the UK fund the pensions of a newly Independent Scotland while Scottish taxpayers put nothing into the UK pot? 

 

Is Scotland too poor, too wee, too stupid to fund it's own welfare state?😉

 

 

Existing monies would be paid then the Scottish taxpayers would fund their pensions as they do now but Westminster have it. Do you think everything will just cut off?  

 

Negotiations and transfers on several issues would be done and of course once all the propaganda and nonsense is over realpolitik would happen. 

[NANOJAMBO]

40 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

 

However, it doesn’t work that way and why anyone would voluntary take on a debt it doesn’t need to do is beyond me🤷🏻‍♂️Not taking a debt wouldn’t stop Scotland borrowing money on the markets. 

 

Pensions are a liability from governments perspective. The state pension is a welfare system, it’s not a pension scheme. 

 

Its not a complicated issue at all, come day 1 Scotland funds itself incl pensions, which would be done via tax income and borrowing like most countries including the UK. Until that day the UK funds it with Scotland paying in. 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

The desperation for an argument from some posters😂 

 

 

 

 

How do you know how it "works" ?  

Did you actually think about what you were writing and apply some critical thinking ? 

Scots will have paid their taxes for decades and are entitled to a pension , it's that simple - this will have to be negotiated in the event of indy. 

It is a truly bizarre "argument" from the yoons that on the one hand Scotland will be saddled with a  share of the debt accumulated by London but will not be paid pensions by London which they have paid their taxes for. Obligations work both ways.