Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[The Mighty Thor]

26 minutes ago, Barack said:

Lube up, folks...

I'd have thought they would review the impact of the last two sets of restrictions before making statements like that. Especially if we're following the science.

 

 

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, jonesy said:

 

Neither would I. However, I don't think these are either temporary nor all that useful. On the contrary, I've seen plenty damage caused as a result of government actions.

 

Fair enough. They're certainly not turning out as temporary as we would have liked them to be. And there is certainly a case to be made for backward tracing of cases and far more focussed localised restrictions.

[luckydug]

2 hours ago, weehammy said:

Is that you Jason? That acronym stinks of ripe cheese.

Couldn’t you have come up with something better like.....ARSE?

Is there really any need for that ? 

[The Real Maroonblood]

9 minutes ago, jonesy said:

I wonder if she's going to bring in a drinks limit for individuals.

 

 

6 pints a day.

I could live with that.

[westbow]

4 minutes ago, jonesy said:

merde?

[Heartsmad1874]

21 minutes ago, Jambo 4 Ever said:

Is this really a surprise to anyone?

Pubs weren't normal when they reopened after lockdown numero uno so its not really a surprise nah.

 

Hospitality venues spent thousands on getting Covid secure yet still got shafted so i doubt they expect normality to resume.

[TheOak88]

3 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

I'd have thought they would review the impact of the last two sets of restrictions before making statements like that. Especially if we're following the science.

 

 

 

I think the whole following the science thing when out the window a month or two ago. We now seem to just be winging it from week to week. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Just now, The Real Maroonblood said:

6 pints a day.

I could live with that.

 

It was 3 drinks per day, so the rumour went, strangely that same rumour has re-surfaced in recent months.

[redjambo]

Just now, TheOak88 said:

 

I think the whole following the science thing when out the window a month or two ago. We now seem to just be winging it from week to week. 

 

This might surprise you, but I generally agree with this. I think we have lost focus, and have done so ever since the SG didn't nip Greater Glasgow in the bud when it could, and then followed that up by allowing the opening up of student accommodation. Both of these led to the situation we're in now where we're just chucking solutions at the problem and hoping that one of them will stick.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

5 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Fair enough. They're certainly not turning out as temporary as we would have liked them to be. And there is certainly a case to be made for backward tracing of cases and far more focussed localised restrictions.

 

I think most people knew, deep down that temporary didn't actually mean temporary though.

[The Real Maroonblood]

7 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

It was 3 drinks per day, so the rumour went, strangely that same rumour has re-surfaced in recent months.

If its 3 drinks a day I'll drink through a straw to make it last longer.

Edited October 15, 2020 by The Real Maroonblood

[GBJambo]

7 minutes ago, Heartsmad1874 said:

Pubs weren't normal when they reopened after lockdown numero uno so its not really a surprise nah.

 

Hospitality venues spent thousands on getting Covid secure yet still got shafted so i doubt they expect normality to resume.

So did pubs. They have spent thousands to be covid secure and are safer than most shops 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Just now, The Real Maroonblood said:

If its 3 drinks a day I'll drink through a straw to make it las longer.

 

As long as it's not a plastic straw, they're banned.

[redjambo]

1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

If its 3 drinks a day I'll drink through a straw to make it las longer.

 

Shree drinks a day? No problem.

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Just now, redjambo said:

 

Shree drinks a day? No problem.

 

 

Oh, when did you meet Mrs JJ. 

[The Mighty Thor]

8 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

 

I think the whole following the science thing when out the window a month or two ago. We now seem to just be winging it from week to week. 

There's certainly no time allowed for measures to take effect. It gives an impression of a lack of control. 

It'll end in a 'full lockdown' which will be full in name only and round and round we'll go.

[The Real Maroonblood]

3 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

As long as it's not a plastic straw, they're banned.

😆

[redjambo]

2 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Oh, when did you meet Mrs JJ. 

 

[mrmarkus1981]

6 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

If its 3 drinks a day I'll drink through a straw to make it last longer.

 

3 x 5 pint pitchers, winner

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

Shree drinks a day? No problem.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Oh, when did you meet Mrs JJ. 

Was thinking about Mrs TRM as well.

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 minute ago, The Mighty Thor said:

There's certainly no time allowed for measures to take effect. It gives an impression of a lack of control. 

It'll end in a 'full lockdown' which will be full in name only and round and round we'll go.

 

It gives an impression of panic and knee-jerk reactions, if you ask me.

And I agree, a full national lockdown by whatever name it's called in coming down the line in the next 2 to 4 weeks.

[Cairneyhill Jambo]

3 hours ago, the general said:

 

Anyone know what pubs they have in Scotland?

 

Sweet Chestnut at Fife Leisure Park, Dunfermline is one.

[The Real Maroonblood]

Just now, mrmarkus1981 said:

 

3 x 5 pint pitchers, winner

Good shout.

[JWL]

8 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

If its 3 drinks a day I'll drink through a straw to make it las longer.

 

Can we save them up until 31 October and have a massive piss up when we pump Hibs in the semi?

[redjambo]

I know that the numbers have already been posted, but as I'm getting into the habit of posting the figures as they appear on the SG website:

 

Scottish numbers: 15 October 2020

Summary

• 1,351 new cases of COVID-19 reported; this is 17.6%* of newly tested individuals [-78]
• 13 new reported death(s) of people who have tested positive [-2]
• 51 people were in intensive care yesterday with recently confirmed COVID-19 [+2]
• 601 people were in hospital yesterday with recently confirmed COVID-19 [+31]
• 18,085 new tests for COVID-19 that reported results

[westbow]

1 minute ago, Brian Dundas said:

I've seen this phrase mentioned a few times, but it can't be true, most shops are large or are very controlled in numbers entering them, you move around and don't stay in close contact with anyone for longer than a few seconds and are wearing a mask.

 

I don't see how pubs can be safer than shops.

 

(I am not advocating the current closure of pubs to resolve this crisis by posting this)

Apples and pears to be honest.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, JWL said:

 

Can we save them up until 31 October and have a massive piss up when we pump Hibs in the semi?

That would be great as we could do with a lift. 

[Victorian]

In the frenzy to gurn at Sturgeon,  did nobody notice that she made no reference to the hospitality closure period being extended?    

 

[GBJambo]

5 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I've seen this phrase mentioned a few times, but it can't be true, most shops are large or are very controlled in numbers entering them, you move around and don't stay in close contact with anyone for longer than a few seconds and are wearing a mask.

 

I don't see how pubs can be safer than shops.

 

(I am not advocating the current closure of pubs to resolve this crisis by posting this)

Because there is a lot of touch points in shops . Touching food items, products etc. Where pubs are table service 

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, Victorian said:

In the frenzy to gurn at Sturgeon,  did nobody notice that she made no reference to the hospitality closure period being extended?    

 

Yes. You're correct. 

 

[redjambo]

Today's per-NHS board breakdown (per-100,000):

 

Lanarkshire 57, Greater Glasgow 38, Ayrshire & Arran 30, Dumfries & Galloway 19, Lothian 18, Tayside 18, Forth Valley 17, Borders 10.

 

All the rest: below 10.

 

So, Lanarkshire continues to be the hotspot of the moment.

[jack D and coke]

28 minutes ago, Barack said:

I thought you were a big SNP voter? Getting political Münchausen Syndrome are we? 

❌

 you’re falling into the trap that voting Yes=Slavish SNP....voted SNP once mate, ain’t a fan - I did like Salmond at one time but he started to wind me up and NS is seriously ripping my jimmys nowadays. 
Ive voted for them all at different points, even the tories😱

[JWL]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

Today's per-NHS board breakdown (per-100,000):

 

Lanarkshire 57, Greater Glasgow 38, Ayrshire & Arran 30, Dumfries & Galloway 19, Lothian 18, Tayside 18, Forth Valley 17, Borders 10.

 

All the rest: below 10.

 

So, Lanarkshire continues to be the hotspot of the moment.

 

What are the relative figures for say the Tier 3 regions in England in comparison?

[redjambo]

Just now, JWL said:

 

What are the relative figures for say the Tier 3 regions in England in comparison?

 

The UK data doesn't get updated on the website until 6pm, but have a look at the Local Data tab on https://www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/

 

The table you want to look at is "New Local Authority Cases" and the more relevant column for making comparisons is probably the "Per 100k pop" to the right of "Past 7 Days".

[luckydug]

9 minutes ago, Victorian said:

In the frenzy to gurn at Sturgeon,  did nobody notice that she made no reference to the hospitality closure period being extended?    

 

For some that is what this thread is about. 

[westbow]

1 minute ago, GBJambo said:

Because there is a lot of touch points in shops . Touching food items, products etc. Where pubs are table service 

Fairly minuscule risk in these touch points though. I read the other day that too much emphasis was put on the catching of Covid by touch and not enough on airborne transmission earlier in the year. Properly maintained hospitality with social distancing between groups shouldn't be a problem though.

[TheOak88]

20 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

This might surprise you, but I generally agree with this. I think we have lost focus, and have done so ever since the SG didn't nip Greater Glasgow in the bud when it could, and then followed that up by allowing the opening up of student accommodation. Both of these led to the situation we're in now where we're just chucking solutions at the problem and hoping that one of them will stick.

 

Focus was lost a while back I think. When we came out of Lockdown NS seemed to want to pursue a CV elimination strategy (probably after seeing the 5 minutes of world fame the New Zealand PM got back around that time for a similar strategy). 

 

Predictably the elimination strategy fell flat on its face, and now she seems to have absolutely no idea where to go with this.

 

Terrified of the public reaction / consequences both economic and social of implementing full scale lockdown again, and on the other hand terrified to relax restrictions as we need to keep the Scottish death count down in order to appear more compassionate than the Tories. 

 

I honestly think she looks a bit shell shocked now. With no real strategy on how to move forward over the upcoming months, it feels like every week she is just tinkering around the edges of the restrictions in order to make it look like we are doing something rather than nothing. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

4 minutes ago, luckydug said:

For some that is what this thread is about. 

This.

That'll be the simpletons.

[westbow]

3 minutes ago, luckydug said:

For some that is what this thread is about. 

Correct, on both sides tho.

[redjambo]

Just now, westbow said:

Fairly minuscule risk in these touch points though. I read the other day that too much emphasis was put on the catching of Covid by touch and not enough on airborne transmission earlier in the year. Properly maintained hospitality with social distancing between groups shouldn't be a problem though.

 

But then there was the very recent Australian study that showed that Covid can survive for up to 28 days on surfaces.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/10/11/australian-study-finds-coronavirus-can-remain-infectious-28/

 

In the end, I think the only way to make a reasonable comparison between shops and hospitality venues would be to determine which ends up actually causing the most viral transmissions per visit, and to do that we would need proper backwards contact tracing which we don't have. So, I think it will have to remain disputed. Just better perhaps that both continue to do their best to minimise the risks.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 minute ago, Brian Dundas said:

As long as they keep Football and Schools going I can cope. Sorry if you need the pub, not my priority though.

 

Nor mine, I think the last time I was in a pub not having a meal or at a wake, was when I worked in one, and that was several years ago.

Pubs are not places I frequent all that often, certainly not to just go and have a few pints, although I did visit a few in Dublin a few years ago, if that counts.

 

My interest in pubs and the pub trade is that I have several friends who still work in the trade and whose jobs are now on the line.

[graygo]

22 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

I've seen this phrase mentioned a few times, but it can't be true, most shops are large or are very controlled in numbers entering them, you move around and don't stay in close contact with anyone for longer than a few seconds and are wearing a mask.

 

I don't see how pubs can be safer than shops.

 

(I am not advocating the current closure of pubs to resolve this crisis by posting this)

 

A shop will have a far bigger number of patrons in a day than a pub will so the chances of an infected person being on the premises is greater in a shop.

 

Will that do are do you want to discuss the other measures that pubs have to undergo?

[kila]

4 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

Rather optimistic view . Still no vaccine fir the HIV virus and that’s been around since the late 1970s ! However I have read that recovery rates in ICU are now at 80% which is a massive increase in the last few months 

 

Not sure your HIV comparison is a worth example given the reliable treatment. From the NHS website - "while there's no cure for HIV, there are very effective treatments that enable most people with the virus to live a long and healthy life."

 

Even if a vaccine isn't the immediate solution to CV19, treatments will be. We don't have to stop people getting sick with CV19 if treatments mean the most vulnerable who have symptoms have to use an inhaler for a week and take it easy.

 

 

[graygo]

21 minutes ago, Brian Dundas said:

Agreed, but it was an argument used by so many to keep pubs open that it has become fact, when like you I don't see the comparison at all

 

And yet you compared them. 🥴

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Nor mine, I think the last time I was in a pub not having a meal or at a wake, was when I worked in one, and that was several years ago.

Pubs are not places I frequent all that often, certainly not to just go and have a few pints, although I did visit a few in Dublin a few years ago, if that counts.

 

My interest in pubs and the pub trade is that I have several friends who still work in the trade and whose jobs are now on the line.

Pubs are one of my pleasures however everyone has their own.

Having said that I see the work and expense my local has put in and I'm sure they'll survive but at what cost.

Credit to the owners who looked after their staff financially during lockdown. 

[Taffin]

Just now, graygo said:

 

A shop will have a far bigger number of patrons in a day than a pub will so the chances of an infected person being on the premises is greater in a shop.

 

Will that do are do you want to discuss the other measures that pubs have to undergo?

 

Pubs also had to implement table service (I think in Scotland too?) which means there's a break between patrons that can be taken to sanitise the table area that the last group were at. Similar to the break between sessions at my gym so it can 'reset' so to speak.

 

Shops are just a steady stream of people wandering about rummaging for good dates etc.

 

It's not really worry comparing them though tbh. Everyone has different priorities of things they'd prefer to see closed before other things, none are more valid than others really and the governments will just do whatever they fancy and target those they think will push back the least.

[graygo]

24 minutes ago, Victorian said:

In the frenzy to gurn at Sturgeon,  did nobody notice that she made no reference to the hospitality closure period being extended?    

 

 

Tomorrow is the date for reviewing the restrictions.

[GBJambo]

5 minutes ago, graygo said:

 

A shop will have a far bigger number of patrons in a day than a pub will so the chances of an infected person being on the premises is greater in a shop.

 

Will that do are do you want to discuss the other measures that pubs have to undergo?

Yep and pubs have to abide by track and trace and get all clientele’s details. 
Shops do not 

[Taffin]

3 minutes ago, kila said:

 

Not sure your HIV comparison is a worth example given the reliable treatment. From the NHS website - "while there's no cure for HIV, there are very effective treatments that enable most people with the virus to live a long and healthy life."

 

Even if a vaccine isn't the immediate solution to CV19, treatments will be. We don't have to stop people getting sick with CV19 if treatments mean the most vulnerable who have symptoms have to use an inhaler for a week and take it easy.

 

 

 

Is that not true of CV19 though? We've improved treatment from earlier in the year quite significantly that enable most people with CV19 to live a long and healthy life.

 

I don't really see the benefit to comparing the two but the statement above does seem pretty true for CV19.

[Heartsmad1874]

2 minutes ago, GBJambo said:

Yep and pubs have to abide by track and trace and get all clientele’s details. 
Shops do not 

Can you imagine track and trace in big supermarkets