Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Des Lynam]

2 hours ago, Adam_the_legend said:

Interesting read

 

 

Prof Lockdown's 'apocalyptic' omicron claims undermine faith in vaccines and have fuelled unnecessary shutdowns

Professor Neil Ferguson's team forecast thousands of deaths a day from the latest variant but new evidence suggests it may be far milder

Ambrose Evans-Pritchard23 December 2021 • 7:33am

 

 

The Covid modellers at Imperial College have begun to back down. About time too. Over the past few weeks, they have made extreme claims about the omicron variant that cannot be fully justified by fundamental science, let alone by clinical observation.

Academic etiquette restrains direct criticism, but immunologists say privately that Professor Neil Ferguson and his team breached a cardinal rule by inferring rates of hospitalisation, severe disease, and death from waning antibodies, and by extrapolating from infections that break through the first line of vaccine defence. 

The rest are entitled to question whether they can legitimately do this. And we may certainly question whether they should be putting out terrifying claims of up to 5,000 deaths a day based on antibody counts.

“It is bad science and I think they’re being irresponsible. They have a duty to reflect the true risks but this is just headline grabbing,” said Dr Clive Dix, former chairman of the UK Vaccine Task Force.

Needless to say, these headlines have spread as fast as omicron itself. Britain is the Covid laboratory of the developed world, and what Imperial says right now has global resonance. Its dire warnings are contributing to some European countries imposing full or partial Christmas lockdowns.

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Governments are so alarmed by the possibility that healthcare systems might collapse under pressure that they have neglected the opposite risk - and much more probable outcome - that omicron will largely bounce off a population where almost everybody has cell immunity from vaccines or past infection, and in the case of Britain where most vulnerable people have been triple jabbed for good measure.   

“To talk of 5,000 deaths a day is a very high number. It is risky to push apocalyptic scenarios that are highly unlikely to happen,” said Professor Francois Balloux, director of the UCL Genetics Institute.

“What I am more worried about is a loss of trust in governments and public institutions for crying wolf. The mood is changing everywhere."

Prof Balloux, who used to work with the Imperial team, said he understood why they had focused on neutralising antibodies: they are easy to measure and tell you how well the front-line fighters are doing against infection. But this has led to great confusion.

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The second line of defence, what really matters for serious illness, comes from B and T cell memory - either from jabs or prior illness. This carries on long after antibodies are no longer circulating in the blood. Cell memory is much harder to measure but is known to last much longer. 

“Cellular memory is still there for omicron and remains intact,” Balloux said.

The first studies from around the world have begun validating the potency of cell memory against omicron, more or less as theoretical science would predict. 

A team at the University of Cape Town found that double-jabbed patients still had 70pc of the CD4 T cell response against the new variant, and full CD8 protection, despite the mutations.

“T cells are holding out against omicron, and the data is very consistent across vaccines,” they told the US magazine Science. “From everything we know about T cells, this is what they do - control a virus once you’ve been infected. So this is their time to shine.”

You would not know this from the series of claims in the past few weeks by Prof Ferguson and his team that omicron “largely evades immunity”, even if they are technically within their rights to use this construction. 

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Imperial might struggle to substantiate their initial warning that a 4.5 fold reduction in neutralising antibodies will lead to a “drop in vaccine efficacy against severe disease (hospitalisation)”. 

They certainly cannot quantify hospital figures or project extreme death rates without taking into account the full effects of cell memory, which they fail to do. 

Their assertion that vaccine efficacy for double-jabbers ranges from zero to 20pc was misleading. Nor can they legitimately assert that there is “no evidence of omicron having lower severity than Delta” since their sample was vanishingly small, the timeline was too short, and they did not know the denominator of actual omicron infections since so many asymptomatic cases passed undetected. The clinical pattern worldwide suggests otherwise. That is "evidence".

Their hospitalisation assumptions have already been undermined by better data from Danish hospitals. The emerging ratios are a small fraction of the Imperial claims. 

“B and T cell protection is holding up well but they did not have an immunology group working with them. They are just modellers who plug in what they are told on vaccine efficacy (ie antibody counts) and come with this data,” said Dix. 

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He wrote a robust critique of some of the claims, as did Professor James Naismith from Oxford University, though in gentler language. 

There is an interesting twist to this. The AstraZeneca adenovirus vaccine scores well on cell memory and may ultimately protect better than messenger RNA jabs such as Pfizer-BioNTech, now that we are relying more on this second line of defence. He believes the UK should have stuck with AstraZeneca for mix-and-match boosters.

Dix said the political class in the UK - and more broadly in Europe - does not understand the difference between front-line antibodies and lasting cell memory, and is therefore succumbing to unnecessary alarmism. 

He assumes that Professor Chris Whitty and his close colleagues do understand but went along with Imperial’s claims as a tool of public policy, hoping to cajole more people into getting booster jabs. Anthony Fauci in the US is apparently thinking along the same lines. But it is a double-edged strategy. It risks a loss of faith in vaccines altogether.

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Dix said it is inexplicable that the NHS is not publishing daily data giving the exact percentage of those in hospital with omicron by vaccine status, comorbidities, and whether they were admitted for Covid or for another reason. They should publish the numbers needing oxygen, and those going onto critical care, as other countries do. 

“It is not that difficult to put together the data. It would make a huge difference to public confidence,” he said.

The global picture emerging from lab studies is not only that cell memory works like a charm, but that omicron may be inherently less dangerous than delta. 

Research by the Cambridge virologist Ravi Gupta found that the omicron spike protein cleaves far less efficiently than earlier variants, and replicates most in the upper respiratory tract rather than in the lungs where it does most damage. 

“I think the evidence is mounting that the virus potentially causes less progression to severe disease,” he said.

It confirms earlier work from Hong Kong University and is extremely encouraging. “If you have to pick between bronchitis and pneumonia, I can tell you, take bronchitis any day,” said Balloux.

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Balloux said the sketchy clinical evidence from South Africa, Denmark, Australia, and London is that the case fatality rate of omicron for populations with broad immunity is 25 to 30 times lower than the earlier pre-vaccinated waves. 

There is a 90pc drop in hospitalisation rates, and a further two-thirds drop in death rates after admission. This takes it down to the levels of seasonal flu.

He said data from Australia is the most “elegant” yet, showing two simultaneous outbreaks of Covid in a well-vaccinated population, one delta, the other omicron. The hospitalisation rate of omicron is roughly half. 

In London, omicron has already blown through the residual pockets of vaccine refuseniks but has not led to comparable parabolic mayhem amongst the rest of the well-jabbed population. 

“It has already peaked in Gauteng (South Africa) and in all likelihood it will peak in London very soon. I am now quite confident that omicron won’t be as bad as they say,” said Balloux.

Global markets are sniffing this out and are learning to ignore the political noise. The equity rout earlier this week has already given way to a pre-Christmas relief rally. Airline and other "reopening" stocks are soaring again.  

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The high probability is that omicron will disappoint the alarmists and frustrate those of a hairshirt Puritan character who almost seem to want lockdowns as a form of self-flagellation. 

The rest of us can get on with our lives and leave the antibody modellers to build castles in the air.

 

When Swine flu (H1N1) was starting to appear in 2009 my old man was called to a meeting where the scientists were predicting through computer modelling that the deaths would be in the region of hundreds of thousands if not worse. They were calling for the type of restrictions that we've seen in the last 18 months. They weren't taken seriously and thankfully the doomsday predictions didn't come to pass. 

[1874robbo]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Not necessarily.  Put your trust in the ongoing process of scientific learning.  More and more is gradually being learned by science as they go along.  We're getting closer to science providing advances in vaccine production that will directly address the issue of new variants.  As the Telegraph article touched on,  eventually there will be more faith and trust placed on the more elusive elements of the immune system.  Cellular memory.  

 

Don't depress yourself with fatalism about variants.  The boffins are alive to it.

I really hope you’re correct on this one 👍

[Roxy Hearts]

1 hour ago, JamesM48 said:

Oh dear ! Thank god I avoid this place ! I prefer more spit and sawdust places 😂😎

 

 

https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/news/edinburgh-news/covid-scotland-popular-edinburgh-bar-22557857?fbclid=IwAR1cpXNL_SoBpMo2qq0RJlRJ3od2m6vAZnzzsittG-cYQ8Y-UN8IE9BdVvI

🤣. Laughing at your comment not the poor staff! 

[InternationalJambo]

Wasn’t it ‘wait a few weeks and see’ when we originally heard about this variant from various posters on here when shown the SA data regarding hospitalisations and cases? Now it’s wait a few weeks more to wait and see… Hmm….
 

I will wager the outcome shall be exactly that of what has been shown to us from SA experts weeks ago. Then these same posters will twist it to say they knew all along. Majority of folk reading in on here have seen through the facade for months and will continue to do so 😁.

[InternationalJambo]

But aye let’s shut down businesses and destroy peoples livelihoods.. cause caution ya’know. Couldn’t mark their neck with a blowtorch. 

[Gizmo]

3 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

The whole premise of the article is nonsense - no one in their right mind wants any kind of lockdown but the Torygraph insists on turning it into some kind of point scoring exercise. 

It's so childish and demeaning. 

Nothing new in a long run of articles froom the Torygraph decrying "experts". Was amusing this evening, mind you, when cuntbag Toby Young tried the same gaslighting crap as the Torygraph and called the scientific experts "Cassandras". 

See, now, when your Daddy gets you in to University despite being too thick to qualify under your own merits, this is what happens. What an embarassing melt that boy is. Absolutely thick as pigshit.  


 

1 hour ago, 1874robbo said:

Yeh we will until the next variant comes along that the devolved nations collectively shit their pants over.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-59733716 Better add the WHO to your list of bodies shitting their pants. 

[NANOJAMBO]

58 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

Nothing new in a long run of articles froom the Torygraph decrying "experts". Was amusing this evening, mind you, when cuntbag Toby Young tried the same gaslighting crap as the Torygraph and called the scientific experts "Cassandras". 

See, now, when your Daddy gets you in to University despite being too thick to qualify under your own merits, this is what happens. What an embarassing melt that boy is. Absolutely thick as pigshit.  


 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-59733716 Better add the WHO to your list of bodies shitting their pants. 

Toby Young - wrong on brexit, wrong on the pandemic but the right wing loons lap it up. 

 

The "Cassandra" thing was hilarious. Right up there when Ree- Smogg quoted Iago in his defence at being cleared over the loan issue this week. 

But enough of this, let's get back to slagging off the SNP. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

2 hours ago, Roxy Hearts said:

🤣. Laughing at your comment not the poor staff! 

OH mate im very reeking now. So ill be mindful what i say. Ive had a good night actually. Much better than i expected. Bloody fabulous actually.  But its bed time now as Im er reeko.  Hope your grand kid is improving, God bless. 

[NANOJAMBO]

3 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

I don't think the "Puritans" in the article want lockdowns necessarily (Ferguson would just ignore it anyway, the hypocrite) but there are extremists amongst them who want a zero Covid policy, even now and masks to be worn in perpetuity. The joy for them is that they don't have to obtain consent from the polity, they just have to scream about collapsing health systems.

"Extremists" - who are these people ? Names ?  By what empiric measure are these people "extremists" ? 

"Zero Covid policy"  - LOL, in the UK, with Johnson asleep at the wheel ? 

"Masks to be worn in perpetuity" - really ?  You really believe that ? 

"The joy for them " Who is "them" ? 

 

 

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

2 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

 

When Swine flu (H1N1) was starting to appear in 2009 my old man was called to a meeting where the scientists were predicting through computer modelling that the deaths would be in the region of hundreds of thousands if not worse. They were calling for the type of restrictions that we've seen in the last 18 months. They weren't taken seriously and thankfully the doomsday predictions didn't come to pass. 

Backed up by what ?

What yer da says ? 

And his qualifications in epidemiology are ? 

[NANOJAMBO]

5 hours ago, Adam_the_legend said:

But a bit silly considering the different demographics, vax rate…etc 🙃

100% correct. UK has far more in common with South Africa than any European country.

Good shout.

Edited December 24, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[Des Lynam]

8 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Backed up by what ?

What yer da says ? 

And his qualifications in epidemiology are ? 

You wanting the minutes from the meeting?

 

Retired Dentist and Public health advisor to the Government. 

 

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

34 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

"Extremists" - who are these people ? Names ?  By what empiric measure are these people "extremists" ? 

"Zero Covid policy"  - LOL, in the UK, with Johnson asleep at the wheel ? 

"Masks to be worn in perpetuity" - really ?  You really believe that ? 

"The joy for them " Who is "them" ? 

 

 

 

 

If you want a couple of examples, look up Susan Michie and Raina McIntyre. Both epidemiologists who have said masks should remain post pandemic, Covid Zero policies should be followed and founders of Independent SAGE in the UK and OzSAGE here. Extremists, IMO who can justify that extremism via their expertise, knowing they would never be accountable to the great unwashed.

Edited December 24, 2021 by Geoff Kilpatrick

[NANOJAMBO]

12 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

If you want a couple of examples, look up Susan Michie and Raina McIntyre. Both epidemiologists who have said masks should remain post pandemic, Covid Zero policies should be followed and founders of Independent SAGE in the UK and OzSAGE here. Extremists, IMO who can justify that extremism via their expertise, knowing they would never be accountable to the great unwashed.

You think they're wrong ? On what basis ? 

 

Who are these extremists ? 

 

By what measure are they extreme ?  Your opinion ? 

Who is accountable to the "great unwashed" ? What does that mean ? 

Edited December 24, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[NANOJAMBO]

26 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

You wanting the minutes from the meeting?

 

Retired Dentist and Public health advisor to the Government. 

 

 

No.

Just answers to my questions. 

To be clear - your dad isn't an epidemiologist ? 

Edited December 24, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[Ulysses]

8 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

SIMILUR POPULAYSHUN!!!

 

Whurs ra data??? 😂

 

Did me own research, so I did. 

[Ulysses]

8 hours ago, **** the SPFL said:

Cheers FF I was actually referring to Ireland I’m sure from memory there was no spike in deaths. There was also the Liverpool v Athletico Madrid game me and the wife were in Manchester and there were a few Athletico fans in our Hotel I’m sure Madrid was reporting high numbers at that point

 

Actually, there was a spike in deaths in Ireland.  That doesn't implicate Cheltenham as a "super-spreader" event, but April 2020 was our first wave of big numbers of hospitalisations and deaths.  Also, at the risk of being pedantic, Irish punters don't make up anything like 80% of the Cheltenham attendance.  It varies from year to year, but media sources here put it at typically about a third.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

3 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

You think they're wrong ? On what basis ? 

 

Who are these extremists ? 

 

By what measure are they extreme ?  Your opinion ? 

Who is accountable to the "great unwashed" ? What does that mean ? 

Yes. No need for face nappies to be MANDATED. That's the point as they've stated they want.

[manaliveits105]

4 hours ago, Des Lynam said:

You wanting the minutes from the meeting?

 

Retired Dentist and Public health advisor to the Government. 

 

 

No match for our resident know it all experts though ay 

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, manaliveits105 said:

No match for our resident know it all experts though ay 

Or your new mates of the Green Brigade it would appear?

[Roxy Hearts]

6 hours ago, JamesM48 said:

OH mate im very reeking now. So ill be mindful what i say. Ive had a good night actually. Much better than i expected. Bloody fabulous actually.  But its bed time now as Im er reeko.  Hope your grand kid is improving, God bless. 

Good man James. Glad you enjoyed your night. My wee granddaughter is fine at the moment 👍

[Captain Sausage]

Had my booster yesterday. Had no reaction to the first two Pfizer jabs, but feeling pretty shit today. 
 

Shit sleep, sore arm, headache. Hopefully clears up later today. I guess it’s a sign that it’s doing it’s job…

[The Mighty Thor]

5 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

Did me own research, so I did. 

[Roxy Hearts]

It's rising based on people I've spoken to. My wife has staff of work due Covid, guys I work with have it. When does this end.....

[Lord Montpelier]

9 minutes ago, Roxy Hearts said:

It's rising based on people I've spoken to. My wife has staff of work due Covid, guys I work with have it. When does this end.....

It will end once we accept that we can't control nature 

 

Omicron could well be a blessing in disguise, in combination with vaccines building out herd immunity . Speaking personally, its my view we will all get Covid at some point unless we hide away, now might be a good time to get it.  

 

For any serious cases that slip through, drugs like paxlovid will start to pick up, and obviously hospital therapeutics seem to work pretty well now. Despite all that , people will sadly die because of covid - and much in the same way as flu we need our leaders to define the boundaries of acceptability and stick to that.

 

All that said, light at the end of the tunnel . 

[pablo]

1 hour ago, Lord BJ said:

Get jabed for Jesus Christ. **** off Boris.

 

Had enough of politicians this year, there Christmas messages are even more nauseas than their usual pish. 
 

 

 

I feel a wee bit sorry for the politicians this time.

 

At a UK level, they'll carry the can for Covid, should anything goes wrong while not imposing tougher restrictions.

 

But as is looking more and more likely, there has been an overreaction, and who will take responsibility for that? SAGE, Whitty, the BBC? 

 

6000 deaths a day, Tsunamis etc. 

 

After all there, were consequences for The Boy Who Cried Wolf.

[pablo]

1 hour ago, Lord BJ said:

Get jabed for Jesus Christ. **** off Boris.

 

Had enough of politicians this year, there Christmas messages are even more nauseas than their usual pish. 
 

 

 

I feel a wee bit sorry for the politicians this time.

 

At a UK level, they'll carry the can for Covid, should anything goes wrong while not imposing tougher restrictions.

 

But as is looking more and more likely, there has been an overreaction, and who will take responsibility for that? SAGE, Whitty, the BBC? 

 

6000 deaths a day, Tsunamis etc. 

 

After all there, were consequences for The Boy Who Cried Wolf.

[Boab]

1 hour ago, Captain Sausage said:

Had my booster yesterday. Had no reaction to the first two Pfizer jabs, but feeling pretty shit today. 
 

Shit sleep, sore arm, headache. Hopefully clears up later today. I guess it’s a sign that it’s doing it’s job…

It is.

Had one day of that then back to normal.

Feeling shit means good antibodies....so I've been told !

👍

[Bindy Badgy]

1 hour ago, Captain Sausage said:

Had my booster yesterday. Had no reaction to the first two Pfizer jabs, but feeling pretty shit today. 
 

Shit sleep, sore arm, headache. Hopefully clears up later today. I guess it’s a sign that it’s doing it’s job…

 

The second Pfizer jab put me on my arse for a couple of days. You should be fine in a day or two. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

27 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

I feel a wee bit sorry for the politicians this time.

 

At a UK level, they'll carry the can for Covid, should anything goes wrong while not imposing tougher restrictions.

 

But as is looking more and more likely, there has been an overreaction, and who will take responsibility for that? SAGE, Whitty, the BBC? 

 

6000 deaths a day, Tsunamis etc. 

 

After all there, were consequences for The Boy Who Cried Wolf.

 

Going forward this is one of my concerns, that the public won't take any of them seriously after this.

[Boab]

2 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Going forward this is one of my concerns, that the public won't take any of them seriously after this.

I never took that rice pudding in a suit seriously well before any pandemic.

[pablo]

3 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Going forward this is one of my concerns, that the public won't take any of them seriously after this.

 

Yes, I've already heard friends and colleagues question getting a fourth shot if it's "pointless". These are reasonable people who have played everything by the book up to now, and when it comes down to it, I'm sure they will do again. But still.......

[milky_26]

1 hour ago, Captain Sausage said:

Had my booster yesterday. Had no reaction to the first two Pfizer jabs, but feeling pretty shit today. 
 

Shit sleep, sore arm, headache. Hopefully clears up later today. I guess it’s a sign that it’s doing it’s job…

i didnt have the headache but had the sore arm and difficulty sleeping for a few days after it but fine now

[Bindy Badgy]

2 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

Yes, I've already heard friends and colleagues question getting a fourth shot if it's "pointless". These are reasonable people who have played everything by the book up to now, and when it comes down to it, I'm sure they will do again. But still.......

 

The point to make to these people is that it's normal to get boosters for various disease every so often and we get flu shots every year. Yes, it's increased for COVID but, that's too be expected for a new disease.

 

I completely understand people being skeptical of the idiots that are running the country. However, we should be listening to the scientists that have designed the vaccines.

[westbow]

2 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

Had my booster yesterday. Had no reaction to the first two Pfizer jabs, but feeling pretty shit today. 
 

Shit sleep, sore arm, headache. Hopefully clears up later today. I guess it’s a sign that it’s doing it’s job…

I know it’s anecdotal but everyone I know was the same. For about 48 hours any little breeze had me shaking like a shitting dug. Made my nighttime piss interesting.

[Nookie Bear]

11 minutes ago, Bindy Badgy said:

 

The point to make to these people is that it's normal to get boosters for various disease every so often and we get flu shots every year. Yes, it's increased for COVID but, that's too be expected for a new disease.

 

I completely understand people being skeptical of the idiots that are running the country. However, we should be listening to the scientists that have designed the vaccines.

But it would be like getting a flu jab…and then being potentially locked inside your house for 10 days if your partner catches it. 
 

I will get a 4th if necessary but my tolerance of lockdowns is waning big time. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

9 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

Yes, I've already heard friends and colleagues question getting a fourth shot if it's "pointless". These are reasonable people who have played everything by the book up to now, and when it comes down to it, I'm sure they will do again. But still.......

 

This virus is new and is still rapidly evolving, which means we have to evolve as well in how we treat it and if that now means 4 or 5 or 6 or 10 boosters then so be it, it'll take what it'll take to get on top of it.  It just seems to me that people don't have any patience anymore.

 

If your friends or colleagues developed cancer would they give up after one or two courses of treatment if the cancer was still there or would they continue and have multiple rounds of treatment and do whatever it took to defeat it.

[Dagger Is Back]

15 hours ago, **** the SPFL said:

Cheers FF I was actually referring to Ireland I’m sure from memory there was no spike in deaths. There was also the Liverpool v Athletico Madrid game me and the wife were in Manchester and there were a few Athletico fans in our Hotel I’m sure Madrid was reporting high numbers at that point

Football fans were banned from attending games in Madrid at the time due to COVID.

 

Beyond belief that they couldn’t attend a game in their own city but could travel thousands of miles and be in contact with thousands of folks, to watch a game here.

 

An utter shitshow of incompetence 

 

 

[Bull's-eye]

This thread cheers me up everytime I have a browse.

 

Keep up the good slaver ladies & gents.

 

Epic stuff 😃😃😃😃😃😃

[westbow]

56 minutes ago, pablo said:

 

I feel a wee bit sorry for the politicians this time.

 

At a UK level, they'll carry the can for Covid, should anything goes wrong while not imposing tougher restrictions.

 

But as is looking more and more likely, there has been an overreaction, and who will take responsibility for that? SAGE, Whitty, the BBC? 

 

6000 deaths a day, Tsunamis etc. 

 

After all there, were consequences for The Boy Who Cried Wolf.

See what you mean but I never feel sorry for politicians. Their whole raison d’etre is to be in power and to govern. They wanted to be in charge and tell everyone what to do. It isn’t all preaching to the converted, tub thumping and wallowing in  applause. They wanted the job, **** them.

[JudyJudyJudy]

15 hours ago, Adam_the_legend said:

The high probability is that omicron will disappoint the alarmists and frustrate those of a hairshirt Puritan character who almost seem to want lockdowns as a form of self-flagellation. 

The rest of us can get on with our lives and leave the antibody modellers to build castles in the air

perfect summary of this thread actually

[Maroon Sailor]

52 minutes ago, Boab said:

It is.

Had one day of that then back to normal.

Feeling shit means good antibodies....so I've been told !

👍

 

Feck - I didn't feel like shit after any of my jags 

[Victorian]

Nicola Sturgeon MSP & First Minister of Scotland.  Christmas message.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nicola-sturgeon-douglas-ross-scots-national-health-service-scottish-government-b1981767.html

 

 

[Fxxx the SPFL]

11 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

 

Feck - I didn't feel like shit after any of my jags 

Neither did I but had Covid in September after a trip to London all I had was a tickly cough nothing else so hopefully have plenty antibodies had every jab offered so far 

[JudyJudyJudy]

17 hours ago, Pele_Is_God said:

Anyone else been waiting 2 days or longer for a PCR Result? Went to Oxgangs Walk-In on Tuesday….

i had that test in August got it on a Tuesday and never heard back at all. Called them Saturday and after a lot of palaver got my result via phone. 

14 hours ago, Dazo said:

Shoe, boot or cap. 

or heel  

14 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

The same doom mongers on this thread infest the brexit thread with doom and gloom - they are at it 24/7 

it must be a hoot at theirs over the festive season 

I sometimes get confused which thread im on actually due to that  

14 hours ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

Two-thirds of new Covid hospital patients in England only tested positive after being admitted for a different illness, official data shows amid mounting evidence Omicron is milder.

Interesting but not surprising. 

14 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

Don’t really see much wrong with that article…

 

The salient point is that people are losing faith with the modellers (particularly Ferguson and his team) as a result of consistent raising of alarm and continued failure to accurately predict what is going to happen. 
 

I think the doomsday predictions of opening up in summer were the final nail in the coffin for many people and an abject failure this time, given the consequences we’re currently seeing, will see a majority of people tell them to **** it off. 

Yep they can bolt. 

13 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Chris Whitty is an equal to any specialist on his field. I'll wager he's not. I'll wager there a quite a few absolute scientific specialists that no way more than him, but who have either no desire to do the speaking and meeting part of job, or would speak in a technical language no-one would be able to understand.

FFS, I never said he was stupid, just he works in team and will have to listen to others as he can't possibly understand every single thing to expert level himself.

You're the ultimate pious know it all on this thread. You say you have ideas but want to keep them to yourself, then when another poster puts something down, you come out with 'i think the same'.

Had to look up gaslighting as had no idea what it meant. Rancid gaslighting! You slate other posters opinions continually but when someone disagrees with you, it's unfair, it's bullying or some other dressed up pretence.

Several posters have called you out for it, but to make things easier, don't bother replying and we'll do each other the courtesy of politely ignoring each other.

Goodnight, good luck and let's leave it there.

 

Whitty looks like one of those kids from that crap horror film " children of the corn".. im in that daft kind of mood the day

13 hours ago, Robbies right hand man said:

I think we need to line with it. Otherwise we’d kill elderly, vulnerable and the poor.

You mean the same people who normally die anyway? 

11 hours ago, InternationalJambo said:

Wasn’t it ‘wait a few weeks and see’ when we originally heard about this variant from various posters on here when shown the SA data regarding hospitalisations and cases? Now it’s wait a few weeks more to wait and see… Hmm….
 

I will wager the outcome shall be exactly that of what has been shown to us from SA experts weeks ago. Then these same posters will twist it to say they knew all along. Majority of folk reading in on here have seen through the facade for months and will continue to do so 😁.

Yesh as i said weeks ago i bet it comes to nowt much. We have been strung along yet again. Its been a ruse to blackmail / encourage vaccine uptake and scare people shitless . Whilst vaccine uptake has risen people are seeing through it all and thoroughly peed aff 

9 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

If you want a couple of examples, look up Susan Michie and Raina McIntyre. Both epidemiologists who have said masks should remain post pandemic, Covid Zero policies should be followed and founders of Independent SAGE in the UK and OzSAGE here. Extremists, IMO who can justify that extremism via their expertise, knowing they would never be accountable to the great unwashed.

That Michie is a left wing Commie. A red under the bed . An NHS bed at that.  

3 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

Get jabed for Jesus Christ. **** off Boris.

 

Had enough of politicians this year, there Christmas messages are even more nauseas than their usual pish. 
 

 

I  think Jesus, if he existed would have had some stern words for Mr Johnson about his  multiple sins.  I think Jesus would have been a pro choice and might not even have taken the vaccine 

2 hours ago, Roxy Hearts said:

Good man James. Glad you enjoyed your night. My wee granddaughter is fine at the moment 👍

Thats great. Yes it was a good night. Few cocktails in one pub then couple more pubs. Suffering today but itll pass. Good news about your wee yin. 

1 hour ago, Boab said:

It is.

Had one day of that then back to normal.

Feeling shit means good antibodies....so I've been told !

👍

Yes i only had a slightly sore arm so not good news really.

58 minutes ago, Bindy Badgy said:

 

The point to make to these people is that it's normal to get boosters for various disease every so often and we get flu shots every year. Yes, it's increased for COVID but, that's too be expected for a new disease.

 

I completely understand people being skeptical of the idiots that are running the country. However, we should be listening to the scientists that have designed the vaccines.

I think some people are just thinking that its probably better just getting covid really. 

[escobri]

27 minutes ago, Victorian said:

Nicola Sturgeon MSP & First Minister of Scotland.  Christmas message.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nicola-sturgeon-douglas-ross-scots-national-health-service-scottish-government-b1981767.html

 

 

QR code on chimney for Santa?

[JudyJudyJudy]

27 minutes ago, Victorian said:

Nicola Sturgeon MSP & First Minister of Scotland.  Christmas message.

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nicola-sturgeon-douglas-ross-scots-national-health-service-scottish-government-b1981767.html

 

 

God . The ego has landed. Her narcissm knows no bounds. Heres my message to her 

 

 

[felix]

47 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

This virus is new and is still rapidly evolving, which means we have to evolve as well in how we treat it and if that now means 4 or 5 or 6 or 10 boosters then so be it, it'll take what it'll take to get on top of it.  It just seems to me that people don't have any patience anymore.

 

If your friends or colleagues developed cancer would they give up after one or two courses of treatment if the cancer was still there or would they continue and have multiple rounds of treatment and do whatever it took to defeat it.

 

Think you'd continue with cancer treatment for obvious reasons JJ.

 

The more I hear people like Edwina Curry pleading with me to get boosted and now Boris  comparing boosters with the meaning of Christianity  - the more inclined I am to think ; feck it. I'll take my chances 

[ri Alban]

3 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

Get jabed for Jesus Christ. **** off Boris.

 

Had enough of politicians this year, there Christmas messages are even more nauseas than their usual pish. 
 

 

When did tis become a thing, LBJ. Political Party leaders giving Christmas speeches. The Queen speech is bad enough without these ***** giving it large. I could maybe tolerate a prime minister address , but The labour/opposition leader,

[Dennis Denuto]

1 minute ago, escobri said:

QR code on chimney for Santa?

So you think Covid is fake but Santa is real?

 

🤪😜😉