Sean Clare.

[Beast Boy]

59 minutes ago, Hercules said:

Is there something holding him back physically ? FWIW I also think the booing is out of order. He’s shite but he’s our shite. 

 

If I was to make a guess, he’s probably shit scared of making a mistake and then having over ten thousand people abuse him. People can call that weak or lacking heart if they like, but at the end of the day he’s a fairly young bloke in a new city, struggling to kick on.

[Spoleto]

I just hope that if he is playing tomorrow night the genuine fans get right behind the whole team and give them their full backing.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

3 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

If I was to make a guess, he’s probably shit scared of making a mistake and then having over ten thousand people abuse him. People can call that weak or lacking heart if they like, but at the end of the day he’s a fairly young bloke in a new city, struggling to kick on.

You would have to blame the manager here. It's been obvious he has been needing a place on the bench for weeks, for his own good as well as the team. Against Motherwell we had Damour and Meshino on the bench so would have been the perfect opportunity. Hopefully that will happen now and he can maybe come on and impact a game to get his confidence back. He really needs to show more desire though.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

1 minute ago, Spoleto said:

I just hope that if he is playing tomorrow night the genuine fans get right behind the whole team and give them their full backing.

😂😂 

[merseyjambo]

I actually think that given the chance of playing in the right position with players around him that suit his style of play, he’d be a great player for us. 

 

He’s not a wide player and it doesn’t suit his game playing there. It’s no wonder he looks frustrated but I understand why people get annoyed with him. 

 

What is his correct position. Personally I think he would suit playing off the striker in the number 10 role. He is very good at picking out the short passes in and around the box. What he needs is a striker with movement in front of him and 2 wingers that can be brought into play. 

 

What we have doesn’t suit him and I feel sorry for him as he’s the scapegoat 

[Spoleto]

1 minute ago, merseyjambo said:

I actually think that given the chance of playing in the right position with players around him that suit his style of play, he’d be a great player for us. 

 

He’s not a wide player and it doesn’t suit his game playing there. It’s no wonder he looks frustrated but I understand why people get annoyed with him. 

 

What is his correct position. Personally I think he would suit playing off the striker in the number 10 role. He is very good at picking out the short passes in and around the box. What he needs is a striker with movement in front of him and 2 wingers that can be brought into play. 

 

What we have doesn’t suit him and I feel sorry for him as he’s the scapegoat 

 

Exactly this. 

 

Meshino on the left, Clare centre and Morrison right with Uche up front.

 

You can't blame a player for being played out of position because of the ridiculous number of injuries we''ve had over the last year.

[1971fozzy]

What gets me is that there is an element of our support who always seems always seems to want / need and have to have a scapegoat.

Prince / Djoum / Isma / Walker / even Calum Paterson got it 😂 , could go on. 

Booing does absolutely nothing but make the players confidence worse and certainly doesn’t help team morale.

 

 

[AlphonseCapone]

29 minutes ago, Spoleto said:

 

Really?

 

To quote your own words "Some of the harshest, and not always fair, things I've said about Clare are in response to what I see are his uber defenders."

 

So you admit to making ridiculous and false statements which are unjust. 

 

Thanks for confirming what we already knew.

 

If you interpret that sentence to mean ridiculous and false then that's simply a failure of your English comprehension. To add to your lack of football comprehension.

[Homme]

I like him but i think he needs taken out of the firing line at the minute.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

31 minutes ago, merseyjambo said:

I actually think that given the chance of playing in the right position with players around him that suit his style of play, he’d be a great player for us. 

 

He’s not a wide player and it doesn’t suit his game playing there. It’s no wonder he looks frustrated but I understand why people get annoyed with him. 

 

What is his correct position. Personally I think he would suit playing off the striker in the number 10 role. He is very good at picking out the short passes in and around the box. What he needs is a striker with movement in front of him and 2 wingers that can be brought into play. 

 

What we have doesn’t suit him and I feel sorry for him as he’s the scapegoat 

Meshino or Naismith will be the No 10 role so he may have to be happy on the bench then

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

17 hours ago, Spoleto said:

 

46 games actually. In which he's scored 7. 

 

Compared to Mulraneys 1 in 40.

Ideally, I would be looking for a better winger than Mulraney as well.

[Pasquale for King]

Clare has to play as a number 10 or not at all, he has been shuttled all over the place as a few others have and we wonder why their not producing performances. We paid money for him so he has been played constantly to justify that. He need a break from starting and should start on the bench on Wednesday.

[Spoleto]

14 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Ideally, I would be looking for a better winger than Mulraney as well.

 

What we'd give for a John Colquhoun eh?

[Spoleto]

24 minutes ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

If you interpret that sentence to mean ridiculous and false then that's simply a failure of your English comprehension. To add to your lack of football comprehension.

 

My English comprehension is just fine thank you. Yours seems a little iffy, as does your judgement. 

 

You're entitled to your opinion, I'm just happy that you've admitted to it being tainted with bias.

[4marsbars]

46 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

What gets me is that there is an element of our support who always seems always seems to want / need and have to have a scapegoat.

Prince / Djoum / Isma / Walker / even Calum Paterson got it 😂 , could go on. 

Booing does absolutely nothing but make the players confidence worse and certainly doesn’t help team morale.

 

 

 

Exactly.

 

As far as Clare is concerned, what I have seen of the best of him is a player who can ghost past two or three defenders with a few touches, and who is capable of passing / striking / placing the ball very accurately, for example, his (too rare) goals, and penalties (mostly). At his worst, he seems to fade out of the game. As others have noted, he's been moved around to cover other positions, and that has not worked. He's best as an inside forward who arguably needs to work on his defending.

 

It makes me very angry that people simply make things up here just for mischief, for example, in this thread that he didn't celebrate our goals when he plainly did (whilst  no doubt hurting inside about having been taken off).

 

Did we improve on Sunday because it was Clare who was taken off, or because Levein changed the formation?

 

If I was a prospective Hearts signing and I was given the grand tour, Riccarton, Tynecastle, Edinburgh and its delights, I'd be impressed. If by chance I came across Kickback, I'd think, do I really want to play in front of (some of) these people? 

 

 

Edited September 24, 2019 by 4marsbars

[Jenks]

Dont agree with the booing of our own players but Clare is an absolute waste of a Jersey.

[Clerry Jambo]

1 hour ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

If I was to make a guess, he’s probably shit scared of making a mistake and then having over ten thousand people abuse him. People can call that weak or lacking heart if they like, but at the end of the day he’s a fairly young bloke in a new city, struggling to kick on.

Mothy, he's a pro fitba player ffs!!

[jambocub]

3 hours ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

Nailed it. Folk are wondering what might be holding him back mentally? Maybe it’s the fact he arrived injured, was played all over the shop, and gets constant abuse from the stands and online 🤔

 

Get him playing whatever future position  we see him playing in the reserves and from bench .. 

 

Would hope our injured players that are returning soon get a bit game time in reserves as well to ease them back in

[jack D and coke]

1 hour ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

If I was to make a guess, he’s probably shit scared of making a mistake and then having over ten thousand people abuse him. People can call that weak or lacking heart if they like, but at the end of the day he’s a fairly young bloke in a new city, struggling to kick on.

He doesn’t strike me as a shy individual though. I’m not saying he’s ballsy and cocky but he’s not a shy boy. 
I don’t expect him to dominate every single week but it’s been even against lower league opposition he’s barely stood out. 
I’ve played football I know it just doesn’t come off for you some weeks and there’s no real reason why but then fly into some tackles, get booked for putting someone up in the air, get the fans onside, just look like you care. 
We just want to see a little guts sometimes and other things can be forgiven. 
Ive been a harsh critic but I’d love him to ram my words down my throat. 

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

1 hour ago, Spoleto said:

I just hope that if he is playing tomorrow night the genuine fans get right behind the whole team and give them their full backing.

 

Big waft of vermin off this

[Spoleto]

5 minutes ago, Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine said:

 

Big waft of vermin off this

 

Ah, I smell a "real" fan.

[AlphonseCapone]

44 minutes ago, Spoleto said:

 

My English comprehension is just fine thank you. Yours seems a little iffy, as does your judgement. 

 

You're entitled to your opinion, I'm just happy that you've admitted to it being tainted with bias.

 

Of course, I'm human. You're obviously special though and show no bias.

[Spoleto]

1 minute ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

Of course, I'm human. You're obviously special though and show no bias.

 

Well I certainly don't make things up just so I can generate dislike and abuse of a player for a team that I support.

 

If that makes me special so be it.

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

 

2 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

What gets me is that there is an element of our support who always seems always seems to want / need and have to have a scapegoat.

Prince / Djoum / Isma / Walker / even Calum Paterson got it 😂 , could go on. 

Booing does absolutely nothing but make the players confidence worse and certainly doesn’t help team morale.

 

 

 

I'd only ever boo a lack of effort. Sean Clare is guilty of that far too many times.

[gorgieheart]

1 hour ago, Jenks said:

Dont agree with the booing of our own players but Clare is an absolute waste of a Jersey.

 

Dont agree..but !

 

The boy has been played in more positions than a swedish p*rn star !  ..he needs to know his role and grow into it, not pushed all over the park !

 

 A Spell on the side lines wont do him any harm, CL can reintroduce him slowly, build his confidence up and see what happens..

 

some are always looking for a target unfortunately !

[DG_HMFC]

Sean Clare will find himself warming the bench when Walker, Naismith, Washington and Haring are back fully fit.

[RS86]

2 hours ago, merseyjambo said:

I actually think that given the chance of playing in the right position with players around him that suit his style of play, he’d be a great player for us. 

 

He’s not a wide player and it doesn’t suit his game playing there. It’s no wonder he looks frustrated but I understand why people get annoyed with him. 

 

 

100%. I've mentioned it on here in the past, he's shoe-horned in at right mid exactly the same way Cowie used to be and it's not his position so he is ineffective and then comes in for criticism

[Spoleto]

I think it is clear that the majority of fans know and appreciate the qualities that Clare can bring to the team. Given time and support I have no doubts he will be an important player for us. 

 

The minority of boo boys however will continue to vent their fevered wrath. They are the "real" fans after all.

[ramrod]

3 hours ago, merseyjambo said:

I actually think that given the chance of playing in the right position with players around him that suit his style of play, he’d be a great player for us. 

 

He’s not a wide player and it doesn’t suit his game playing there. It’s no wonder he looks frustrated but I understand why people get annoyed with him. 

 

What is his correct position. Personally I think he would suit playing off the striker in the number 10 role. He is very good at picking out the short passes in and around the box. What he needs is a striker with movement in front of him and 2 wingers that can be brought into play. 

 

What we have doesn’t suit him and I feel sorry for him as he’s the scapegoat 

The voice of reason  in amongst some utter shite . 

[stevie1874]

2 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Ideally, I would be looking for a better winger than Mulraney as well.

Mulraney is frustrating as when he receives the ball he tends to slow the game down. With his pace we should be playing balls down the channels or over the full backs for him to run in to, Boyle at Hibs is utilised in that way to good affect.  He actually had a couple of good runs late on when he got the ball  cut in and ran at the centre of the Hibs defence which seemed to cause panic. He also needs to cut out the floated crosses all the time and fire balls across the goal or look up und cut the ball back. 

[Rods]

If Clare is dropped who will the boo boys move onto next? 

 

I mean god forbid they actually get behind the players and the team so they will need someone to pick on.

 

Any takers?

 

 

[Ron Burgundy]

3 hours ago, Clerry Jambo said:

Mothy, he's a pro fitba player ffs!!

Correct, maybe he'd be better off settling down in a familiar city and getting a job as a postie if a football lifestyle isn't for him.

[Glamorgan Jambo]

A part of the problem was how hugely hyped his arrival was when essentially no one had heard of him.

 

The boy has skill and attributes but needs taken out of the front line for his own good.

 

He's become a target for boo boys and moaners. At the Stenhousemuir game I attended I was delighted when one of our fans told the moaner who was constantly on his back to lay off. These guys need to have a word because whatever their motivations they come over as hyper critical and bigoted.

[TheOak88]

7 hours ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

Nailed it. Folk are wondering what might be holding him back mentally? Maybe it’s the fact he arrived injured, was played all over the shop, and gets constant abuse from the stands and online 🤔

 

Who has said he is being held back mentally? Are there any quotes from him about lacking confidence etc? 

 

Would be an interesting point as I haven’t read anything to that effect. 

[David McCaig]

3 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Ideally, I would be looking for a better winger than Mulraney as well.

Neither Mulraney or Morrision are world beaters, but what a difference having two wide players staying wide makes to our balance and shape.

 

A great example was Morrison over-hitting a cross, but we retained posession because Mulraney was wide on the left.

 

 

[Beast Boy]

5 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

Who has said he is being held back mentally? Are there any quotes from him about lacking confidence etc? 

 

Would be an interesting point as I haven’t read anything to that effect. 

 

Few posts further up, or on the previous page. Can't be hooped looking for you.

[TheOak88]

1 hour ago, Spoleto said:

I think it is clear that the majority of fans know and appreciate the qualities that Clare can bring to the team. Given time and support I have no doubts he will be an important player for us. 

 

The minority of boo boys however will continue to vent their fevered wrath. They are the "real" fans after all.

Given time? 

 

He has been here a year and has 40+ games under his belt. 

[TheOak88]

1 minute ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

Few posts further up, or on the previous page. Can't be hooped looking for you.

Cool, I will have a look.

[jack D and coke]

1 hour ago, Spoleto said:

I think it is clear that the majority of fans know and appreciate the qualities that Clare can bring to the team. Given time and support I have no doubts he will be an important player for us. 

 

The minority of boo boys however will continue to vent their fevered wrath. They are the "real" fans after all.

See if you get picked to play against Aberdeen Sean get angry mate. Show some stones. 
It’s either that or you’re dead in the water bud. 

[GinRummy]

3 hours ago, Spoleto said:

 

Ah, I smell a "real" fan.

 

Were you not just banging on about genuine fans? What’s the best genuine fans or real fans?

[Beast Boy]

8 hours ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

Nah I disagree mate. I'm not saying that is not an issue now but Sean Clare was poor long before it became such a big thing to say so.

 

When he arrived it was with this fanfare, he'd knocked back English premier league teams and Levein made a big deal out of his capture so the expectations were set particularly high, by the player himself and the club. Now the problem with that is you're giving yourself a much higher platform to fall from if it doesn't work out.

 

I remember when he was first playing there was a buzz about seeing him, and folk shouting only half jokingly, "just give the ball to Clare". It's not dissimilar to the buzz around Meshino arriving. Even after the first few games folk were still behind him because most folk understood about the injury and easing back in. But look where we are now, he's not really improved a lot. I do think he has improved a little but nowhere near what we expected or need.

 

If he'd been dropped when necessary then this would have removed some of the heat but he's got this perception of being undroppable. That's poor man management. His other problem is that he is one of these people that tends to look slow or lazy in their movement. There are quite a few players like that, but it doesn't always mean they are slow or lazy but with Clare there is a definite lack of fight, he's weak in the tackle. So when folk see him move the way he does (not his fault) then go in weak to a tackle (his fault) it combines into an overall feeling of he's not trying and doesn't care.

 

The other thing, on here, is that his critics and his supporters are both very strong in their views and he's became very polarising so the debates tend to get more extreme. I'm guilty of it. Some of the harshest, and not always fair, things I've said about Clare are in response to what I see are his uber defenders.

 

I don't think he's a bad guy, I think he wants to do well, I think he lacks confidence and it's nothing personal but in my opinion, from watching and playing football over many years, he lacks some of the key ingredients to make it as a top footballer. I don't think he's good enough for our level but maybe Scottish Championship level.

 

Btw, I'd absolutely love him to prove me wrong. And I'll hold my hands up if he does. I'll go insofar as saying to you, if one of us remembers, though I'm not sure on how to measure it, but if he turns his career around with us I'll donate £50 go big hearts.

 

I get what you’re saying, and I wish he would kick on. A lot of what you’ve said there is heavily influenced by what was said about him before he signed and what people expected though. I feel that’s a bit harsh. I think a lot of people have held that against him, a bit unfairly.

 

Edited September 24, 2019 by Icon of Symmetry

[jr ewing]

Don't even think of playing him tomorrow Craig.

[Spoleto]

First name on the team sheet Craig.

 

Mashino on the left, Clare central, Morrison on the right.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

4 hours ago, TheOak88 said:

Given time? 

 

He has been here a year and has 40+ games under his belt. 

 

There have been worst players who have made a worst contribution over the last season or so then Clare.

 

18/19 - 35 games, 6 goals, 3 assists. I think he hit woodwork about 3 times as well. Was one of the few players who provided a bit of attacking threat when the injuries hit last season.

 

19/20 - 11 games, 1 goal, 3 assists. Again, he's made a contribution while not playing especially well.

 

Wouldn't it be better to judge him when he's played in a more settled position in a more settled team with better, more experienced pros around him, not to mention playing in a team on better form playing with more confidence?

 

That said, he should be dropped for a bit when Walker, Naismith, Meshino, Whelan, Damour and Haring are all available unless he comes into some form. I think he'll be competing for a place with Damour and Irving in the middle, or as attacking mid when all or maybe two of Walker, Meshino and Naismith are out.

 

I like how he goes for a run with the ball now and then, he can provide a goal threat, he's quite a clean tackler and his decision making and composure to me seems to be improving.

 

Not all our players can be world beaters. Think of Ian Jardine in the 80s who was mostly a sub in a similar role but did get extended starts when we had injuries. 70 games, 11 goals. He was no world beater and no-one expected him to be but could make a contribution and fill in. Clare came in with a big reputation but it was stressed it was all potential so why are folk expecting the finished article?

 

Edited September 24, 2019 by ToqueJambo

[DH1986]

33 minutes ago, Spoleto said:

First name on the team sheet Craig.

 

Mashino on the left, Clare central, Morrison on the right.

 

The goalie will be the first name on the team sheet.

 

Yer man Sean Clare will be warming the bench at best.

[TheOak88]

33 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

There have been worst players who have made a worst contribution over the last season or so then Clare.

 

18/19 - 35 games, 6 goals, 3 assists. I think he hit woodwork about 3 times as well. Was one of the few players who provided a bit of attacking threat when the injuries hit last season.

 

19/20 - 11 games, 1 goal, 3 assists. Again, he's made a contribution while not playing especially well.

 

Wouldn't it be better to judge him when he's played in a more settled position in a more settled team with better, more experienced pros around him, not to mention playing in a team on better form playing with more confidence?

 

That said, he should be dropped for a bit when Walker, Naismith, Meshino, Whelan, Damour and Haring are all available unless he comes into some form. I think he'll be competing for a place with Damour and Irving in the middle, or as attacking mid when all or maybe two of Walker, Meshino and Naismith are out.

 

I like how he goes for a run with the ball now and then, he can provide a goal threat, he's quite a clean tackler and his decision making and composure to me seems to be improving.

 

Not all our players can be world beaters. Think of Ian Jardine in the 80s who was mostly a sub in a similar role but did get extended starts when we had injuries. 70 games, 11 goals. He was no world beater and no-one expected him to be but could make a contribution and fill in. Clare came in with a big reputation but it was stressed it was all potential so why are folk expecting the finished article?

 

Nah mate, Clare doesn’t get special treatment. He will be judged the same as any other player at the club would. 

 

Your suggesting that we can’t judge Clare until he has 1) Played in a settled position 2) Played in a settled team 3) Played in a winning team. 

 

1) If he was a particularly good player he would have made a position his own. Despite the masses of injuries we have faced and 40+ appearances for us he still has not been able to prove much ability in any position. 

 

2) He will never play in a settled team as Levein likes to bring around about 15 new faces each season. 

 

3) You cannot just judge players when we are winning. When things are going well, everyone wants the ball and is enjoying themselves. Players also have to be judged when the chips are down. 

 

Finally, where is the evidence his decision making and composure are improving. Think you need to re-watch the Motherwell game where he missed a sitter and sold the jerseys for 2 of Motherwell’s goals. 

 

Just to clarify, I defended this guy for months last season and said we should keep him in the team. 

 

Its difficult to justify his current status as an automatic starter in the team given his contribution.

Edited September 24, 2019 by TheOak88

[Guest ToqueJambo]

7 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

Nah mate, Clare doesn’t get special treatment. He will be judged the same as any other player at the club would. 

 

Your suggesting that we can’t judge Clare until he has 1) Played in a settled position 2) Played in a settled team 3) Played in a winning team. 

 

1) If he was a particularly good player he would have made a position his own. Despite the masses of injuries we have faced and 40+ appearances for us he still has not been able to prove much ability in any position. 

 

2) He will never play in a settled team as Levein likes to bring around about 15 new faces each season. 

 

3) You cannot just judge players when we are winning. When things are going well, everyone wants the ball and is enjoying themselves. Players also have to be judged when the chips are down. 

 

Finally, where is the evidence his decision making and composure are improving. Think you need to re-watch the Motherwell game where he missed a sitter and sold the jerseys for 2 of Motherwell’s goals. 

 

Just to clarify, I defended this guy for months last season and said we should keep him in the team. 

 

Its difficult to justify his current status as an automatic starter in the team given his contribution.

 

The bits in bold don't take into account what an inexperienced player he is, or do they? They are big asks for younger, inexperienced players. I would agree with you if we were talking more of the finished article - Damour or Whelan for example. Truly exceptional youngsters like Calum Paterson or Hickey come in and settle in no matter how we're doing, but they tend to be the exception. Craig Halkett is young and has done it with us from his first game but he did come with a lot more experience.

 

I agree he needs dropped but I don't think we should write him off yet. And the booing was a disgrace but sadly predictable these days.

Edited September 24, 2019 by ToqueJambo

[kingantti1874]

48 minutes ago, Spoleto said:

First name on the team sheet Craig.

 

Mashino on the left, Clare central, Morrison on the right.

You are Sean Clare aren’t you 😂 

[pettigrewsstylist]

6 hours ago, Spoleto said:

I think it is clear that the majority of fans know and appreciate the qualities that Clare can bring to the team. Given time and support I have no doubts he will be an important player for us. 

 

The minority of boo boys however will continue to vent their fevered wrath. They are the "real" fans after all.

Utter drivel. 

[kingantti1874]

9 minutes ago, pettigrewsstylist said:

Utter drivel. 

 
funny isn’t it.. you could coukd his moments of quality across 50+ fixtures in one hand.. far outweighs by slackness, weakness, lack of positional awareness.. general nothingness.. hearts version of stevie mallan without a strike