Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[Alex Kintner]

3 minutes ago, Ked said:

Glad to be there.

 

Is that it ?

You slagged Enzo of about Scottish Water no comeback on that?

You slagged Enzo of about the expressed will of Scottish people what the fek does that mean?

Come on Alex express yourself instead of just your silly inane shit.

 

Expand and express your Scottishness.

 

Or is that just as I said a load of old fekin shite.

Nah mate, you’ve exposed your true colours now too and your entrenched, self/loathing views aren’t worth the time or effort. In my job (which isn’t teaching any more) I see the very worst but also the very best of society. I work with so many intelligent, selfless professionals who strive to make Scotland a better place today and for future generations. Your characterisation of this amazing country and its people couldn’t be more wrong. Regardless of their political or idealogical beliefs, I pity anyone who genuinely thinks about their own country and countrymen the way you and Enzo do. I’ll leave you to your neuroses. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

In the interests of impartiality 

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Just popped back to see whether anyone had answered my question about the NHS. 

Apparently we have now learned that you can have 4 year "privatisation" packages that aren't really "privatisation"

 

it's not a "privatisation" package - it's a contract awarded by  the Scottish gov to operate/provide services for a fixed term ie the Scottish govt has asked for the best bid for provision of services in a competitive tendering process. Maybe you can confirm/deny and provide a source ? 

 

so, just to confirm, for the benefit of the intellectually challenged: privatisation occurs when a business or a service is operated by private companies i.e when there is no state monopoly

 

Incorrect : privatisation occurs when the public owned entity is passed into private ownership or the govt transfers it into private hands - neither has happened in Scotland and you've been told this by several posters and I have provided you with definitions of privatisation that support this (and not you). 

 

.  There is no "ownership" of service provision; it's a service so opening up a service to one, or more, companies is, you guessed it, PRIVATISATION.

 

There absolutely is in Scotland because the Scottish govt , through Scottish Water, awards said contracts for a fixed period. They have not transferred anything into private hands. 

 

Are we all agreed that,

No

 

back to the NHS question,

we're not getting "back" to the "NHS question" because it was never under discussion. You introduced in a desperate attempt to get away from the beating you were taking on Scottish water. Which followed on from the beating you were taking on your nonsense claims about privatisation of water generally. 

 

opening up health service provision to US health providers , to offer competition, is privatisation? Or not?

Johnson said  NHS privatisation by the US is not part of any US trade deal (which he failed to sign anyway so is totally irrelevant) . You've been told this already.

 

Anyone??

It looks like you're on your own. 

 

Edited November 2, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[NANOJAMBO]

36 minutes ago, Ked said:

I challenge anyone to define their expressed will of being Scottish.

 

I know what I would like politically as someone born in Scorland.

I can tell you it isnt the bitter chipped shoulder anti English shit you all post on here.

Or the skin crawl dinnae want to hear opposite views.

 

I dont think Scotland can truly realise its potential in the union.

But that's not down to the failure of Westminster.

 

But I cringe at the arguments for independence on here.

What's your argument for independence ? 

[NANOJAMBO]

50 minutes ago, Ked said:

Scottish people?

Take yer heid oot the glue bag. OK

 

Scottish people are mostly made up of Rangers and Celtic fans and arseholes.

Not OK

 

Just like any other peoples .

That's plain wrong. 

 

Expressed will?

The expressed will if it's even relevant It's very relevant 

 

given its once every so often as a tick in a box. That's how people vote and "express their will" 

 

Or a March through Artur Seat dressed like a haggis waving flags like American arseholes.

Relevance ? 

 

The expressed will of people is getting oot their beds and respecting their neighbours while working hard and not being nationalistic fuds or union jack fuds(As is increasingly the case in Scotland)

It isn't. 

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

1 hour ago, Ked said:

Put it down to what you want.

Answer my points.

 

Is Scottish Water managing sewage and fresh water or is it sub contracting to private companies.

Scottish water retains ownership of the provision of services : they have chosen to sub contract that out to a presumably better/better value  service provider. The provision of these services remain in the domain of Scottish water. 

 

 

 

Yes

 

Or 

No  See above

 

1 hour ago, Ked said:

 

Looks like Enzos made a pure jeremy out of the lot ay yeez

 

[NANOJAMBO]

1 hour ago, Ked said:

They opened up a lot more than that.

The only part of non household us the tie in.

All other works are privatised.

Like what ?

Sources  please ? 

[NANOJAMBO]

1 hour ago, Ked said:

So anyone care to argue that there is no sub contracting by Scottish Water to private companies?

 

Where you been ?

 

The point is - it IS being subcontracted and not privatised.

Enzo must be fuming.   but also

[NANOJAMBO]

2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

A trade deal with the US , following Brexit,was, apparently , judging by all the screeching and squawking at the time, going to lead to UK health care provision being opened to competition from US providers. Privatisation we were told.

For the FOURTH time ; Johnson said NHS privatisation would not be part of any US trade deal. 

 

 

So, again, anyone?

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

Could some of you **** off and discuss water, pee, crap and your fears/hopes of independence on another thread?  **** sake. 

 

Any sign of the EU caving now that some coked-up headbangers set a bus on fire in Newtownards?

 

Edited November 2, 2021 by Ulysses

[NANOJAMBO]

14 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

Could some of you **** off and discuss water, pee, crap and your fears/hopes of independence on another thread?  **** sake. 

 

Any sign of the EU caving now that some coked-up headbangers set a bus on fire in Newtownards?

 

Sorry , bud.

It's a downward spiral with him. I've been hoping the mods would step in but 🤷‍♂️

 

PS Good to hear France calling out Frost on the NIP. Good times ahead. 

 

Sorry to hear about the bus. Was it French ? 

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Sorry to hear about the bus. Was it French ? 

 

Regrettably, no. 

[NANOJAMBO]

1 minute ago, Ulysses said:

 

Regrettably, no. 

That's good to know because things are escalating here.

Liz Truss has told the French to back down or  else ..... so far "or else" seems to be giving the French exactly what they want ie the licences the UK has been sitting on for months. 

[Ulysses]

4 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Regrettably, no. 

 

In case the m0dzoR5 intervene, I don't of course condone the burning of French buses.

 

 

1 minute ago, NANOJAMBO said:

That's good to know because things are escalating here.

Liz Truss has told the French to back down or  else ..... so far "or else" seems to be giving the French exactly what they want ie the licences the UK has been sitting on for months. 

 

France will back down, and so will Britain.  It's a complicated and completely trivial issue being used by Macron to sound tough without actually having to be tough.

 

Meanwhile, the latest thoughts from Simon Jenkins in the Grauniad about how the UK is isolating and weakening itself as a result of its leaving - not leaving the EU, but leaving the Single Market. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/nov/01/fish-france-johnson-broken-britain-european-single-market

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

3 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

In case the m0dzoR5 intervene, I don't of course condone the burning of French buses.

 

 

 

France will back down, and so will Britain.  It's a complicated and completely trivial issue being used by Macron to sound tough without actually having to be tough.

 

Meanwhile, the latest thoughts from Simon Jenkins in the Grauniad about how the UK is isolating and weakening itself as a result of its leaving - not leaving the EU, but leaving the Single Market. 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/nov/01/fish-france-johnson-broken-britain-european-single-market

 

 

Will read over breakfast. Bonne nuit ! 

[Ulysses]

Just now, NANOJAMBO said:

Will read over breakfast. Bonne nuit ! 

 

À bientôt!

[ri Alban]

5 hours ago, Ked said:

Says the soul who wants a square g with England by jumping in with the french to better in with a Scottish fisherman.

 

Not privatised I grant you but nationalised.

 

Aw, poor Zlat.

 

 

And feck Team GB, it'll be dead soon.

[ri Alban]

Always thought shite didnae burn.

[ri Alban]

Now I know why Scotland spends so much money on ruks economy. 

 

Shitebags!

 

Edited November 2, 2021 by ri Alban

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:

Nah mate, you’ve exposed your true colours now too and your entrenched, self/loathing views aren’t worth the time or effort. In my job (which isn’t teaching any more) I see the very worst but also the very best of society. I work with so many intelligent, selfless professionals who strive to make Scotland a better place today and for future generations. Your characterisation of this amazing country and its people couldn’t be more wrong. Regardless of their political or idealogical beliefs, I pity anyone who genuinely thinks about their own country and countrymen the way you and Enzo do. I’ll leave you to your neuroses. 

Zlatanable has most definitely exposed himself. 

 

[ri Alban]

5 hours ago, Ked said:

Says the soul who wants a square g with England by jumping in with the french to better in with a Scottish fisherman.

 

Not privatised I grant you but nationalised.

 

[ri Alban]

For the offended, jumping in and offending folk, I'm pretty sure Enzo PLC.  can handle himself and a wee piss take.

Personally, I was gonnae sit back and watch, but some ghost had go and bring me back in.  👍 

Now I'm gonnae have me some fun. On all the threads.

Edited November 2, 2021 by ri Alban

[Alex Kintner]

4 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

That's good to know because things are escalating here.

Liz Truss has told the French to back down or  else ..... so far "or else" seems to be giving the French exactly what they want ie the licences the UK has been sitting on for months. 

Truss to the rescue 

[Enzo Chiefo]

7 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

 

Where you been ?

 

The point is - it IS being subcontracted and not privatised.

Enzo must be fuming.   but also

I've already PROVED to you that  there are various definitions of privatisation. Read the academic link I sent.

Privatisation is NOT just about the sale of national assets, it's about outsourcing,  subcontracting,  any form of service provision by private companies is Privatisation. 

 

I'm not sure how you and your wee gang haven't been removed from this thread yet tbh. 

 

[Cade]

UK newspapers: "MACRON BACKS DOWN IN THE FACE OF BORIS' AGGRESSION!!! HOORAH!!!"

 

Actual facts: Jersey is handing out fishing licences to French boats like sweeties, so the French are easing the pressure off, having achieved their goal.

 

 

[Konrad von Carstein]

13 minutes ago, Cade said:

UK newspapers: "MACRON BACKS DOWN IN THE FACE OF BORIS' AGGRESSION!!! HOORAH!!!"

 

Actual facts: Jersey is handing out fishing licences to French boats like sweeties, so the French are easing the pressure off, having achieved their goal.

 

 

 

 

[Alex Kintner]

20 minutes ago, Cade said:

UK newspapers: "MACRON BACKS DOWN IN THE FACE OF BORIS' AGGRESSION!!! HOORAH!!!"

 

Actual facts: Jersey is handing out fishing licences to French boats like sweeties, so the French are easing the pressure off, having achieved their goal.

 

 

Thank goodness for the vitality and aggression of our fearless leader

 

[Beni]

An interesting take on why the withdrawal deal means "taking back control" is just a slogan.

 

https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2021/11/01/the-iron-cage-revisited-how-brexit-constrains-the-uk/

[The Real Maroonblood]

51 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

Thank goodness for the vitality and aggression of our fearless leader

 

[WorldChampions1902]

11 hours ago, Ked said:

You would do well to realise that statement.

Saying as you post inane pictures of pumpkins to make a point.

Good to see you are back on the Brexit bus. Pro-Brexit Liz Truss has stuck her oar in on the fishing dispute. Yes, this Liz Truss.

 

[WorldChampions1902]

Brexit is going swimmingly.

 

[WorldChampions1902]

1 hour ago, Alex Kintner said:

Thank goodness for the vitality and aggression of our fearless leader

 

 

[WorldChampions1902]

1 hour ago, Beni said:

An interesting take on why the withdrawal deal means "taking back control" is just a slogan.

 

https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/europpblog/2021/11/01/the-iron-cage-revisited-how-brexit-constrains-the-uk/

Brilliant article that sadly won’t be read by a certain cohort. Third paragraph in and the damning realities start to bite……….

”………the UK is forced to abide by standards and norms set in Brussels for the free movement of goods (and even services); if new trade agreements conflict with those standards, the EU can unilaterally suspend its free trade on those goods and services. Given the relative size of the EU as the UK’s main trading partner, accounting for almost 50% of UK exports, the EU’s shadow therefore hovers over all trade talks”. 
 

But we took back control.

[Gizmo]

3 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I've already PROVED to you that  there are various definitions of privatisation. Read the academic link I sent.

Privatisation is NOT just about the sale of national assets, it's about outsourcing,  subcontracting,  any form of service provision by private companies is Privatisation. 

 

I'm not sure how you and your wee gang haven't been removed from this thread yet tbh. 

 

 

Are you Mike Graham? 

[Alex Kintner]

1 hour ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

Brilliant article that sadly won’t be read by a certain cohort. Third paragraph in and the damning realities start to bite……….

”………the UK is forced to abide by standards and norms set in Brussels for the free movement of goods (and even services); if new trade agreements conflict with those standards, the EU can unilaterally suspend its free trade on those goods and services. Given the relative size of the EU as the UK’s main trading partner, accounting for almost 50% of UK exports, the EU’s shadow therefore hovers over all trade talks”. 
 

But we took back control.

Brexshit 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

5 hours ago, Alex Kintner said:

Truss to the rescue 

In Truss we trust !!!!

[WorldChampions1902]

I have now added Morrisons supermarket chain to my list of boycotted companies (Wetherspoons was the first). Take a look at the labelling on their chickens! What a country we have become. “Seasoned with Non-EU salt and pepper”. WTAF. 

 

 

[Alex Kintner]

1 minute ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

I have now added Morrisons supermarket chain to my list of boycotted companies (Wetherspoons was the first). Take a look at the labelling on their chickens! What a country we have become. “Seasoned with Non-EU salt and pepper”. WTAF. 

 

 

Saw this last night. What a bizarre thing to put. Did they genuinely think customers weren’t buying chickens due to concerns about the source of the seasoning 😂

[NANOJAMBO]

5 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I've already PROVED to you that  there are various definitions of privatisation. Read the academic link I sent.

Privatisation is NOT just about the sale of national assets, it's about outsourcing,  subcontracting,  any form of service provision by private companies is Privatisation. 

 

I'm not sure how you and your wee gang haven't been removed from this thread yet tbh. 

 

For the last time, and let's not forget why we got to this apparently trivial point.

 

You started off by saying water was privatised because government (aka the state ) didn't have the money to fix the problems and denied it was done to finance tax cuts. 

 

So here we go , in 1989 Thatcher privatised water (in England, but NOT Scotland ) but as has been pointed out to you , she also sold off,  inter alia , BT, Britsh Gas to raise funds for much needed tax cuts.  Argue all you like, that is a proven fact.

And as also pointed out to you by me & others, It also fitted her "small government" agenda and had nothing to do with  "the state " having "no money", as you put it. The state having "no money" argument  is completely false as I'll demonstrate below. 

 

Your point is proven fallacious because in Scotland, water continued to be in publc hands for SIXTEEN years after Thatcher privatised it in England. As I have shown  you (but which you labelled "conspiracy theories") , Scottish water is 100% owned by the Scot gov and Scottish water is financed through its own revenues and "long term government loans". So, for SIXTEEN years after privatisation in England, Scotland financed its water services with government loans - which you claim Thatcher couldn't afford to do for England. 

 

SIXTEEN years after the 1989 privatisation in England , Scotland allowed private sector competition  in the water "market" in a very limited and specific way and for a 4 year period only- I am assuming they won this business through a tender process*. If so, that is not privatisation. (for which I've given you two definitions - and awarding a short term contract on commercial grounds doesn't meet that criteria.   *Maybe you can confirm - I've asked you before but you never answered. 

 

So in short, you're nitpicking over "privatisation" because that's all you have left after  your nonsense about Thatcher was shown to be wrong and  your nonsense about Thatcher not having the money to pay for the works required is wrong (cos either Westminster gov or Scot gov was still financing it in Scotland 16 years after privatisation in England). 

 

And now I'm putting your insulting , time wasting arse on ignore. 

Edited November 2, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[Japan Jambo]

36 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

I have now added Morrisons supermarket chain to my list of boycotted companies (Wetherspoons was the first). Take a look at the labelling on their chickens! What a country we have become. “Seasoned with Non-EU salt and pepper”. WTAF. 

 

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/nov/02/morrisons-apologises-for-non-eu-salt-and-pepper-chicken-label

 

What an embarrassment, struggled to believe it wasn't a meme! 

[WorldChampions1902]

19 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

For the last time, and let's not forget why we got to this apparently trivial point.

 

You started off by saying water was privatised because government (aka the state ) didn't have the money to fix the problems and denied it was done to finance tax cuts. 

 

So here we go , in 1989 Thatcher privatised water (in England, but NOT Scotland ) but as has been pointed out to you , she also sold off,  inter alia , BT, Britsh Gas to raise funds for much needed tax cuts.  Argue all you like, that is a proven fact.

And as also pointed out to you by me & others, It also fitted her "small government" agenda and had nothing to do with  "the state " having "no money", as you put it. The state having "no money" argument  is completely false as I'll demonstrate below. 

 

Your point is proven fallacious because in Scotland, water continued to be in publc hands for SIXTEEN years after Thatcher privatised it in England. As I have shown  you (but which you labelled "conspiracy theories") , Scottish water is 100% owned by the Scot gov and Scottish water is financed through its own revenues and "long term government loans". So, for SIXTEEN years after privatisation in England, Scotland financed its water services with government loans - which you claim Thatcher couldn't afford to do for England. 

 

SIXTEEN years after the 1989 privatisation in England , Scotland allowed private sector competition  in the water "market" in a very limited and specific way and for a 4 year period only- I am assuming they won this business through a tender process*. If so, that is not privatisation. (for which I've given you two definitions - and awarding a short term contract on commercial grounds doesn't meet that criteria.   *Maybe you can confirm - I've asked you before but you never answered. 

 

So in short, you're nitpicking over "privatisation" because that's all you have left after  your nonsense about Thatcher was shown to be wrong and  your nonsense about Thatcher not having the money to pay for the works required is wrong (cos either Westminster gov or Scot gov was still financing it in Scotland 16 years after privatisation in England). 

 

And now I'm putting your insulting , time wasting arse on ignore. 

Tory double-speak on privatisation is legend……

 

[NANOJAMBO]

4 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/nov/02/morrisons-apologises-for-non-eu-salt-and-pepper-chicken-label

 

What an embarrassment, struggled to believe it wasn't a meme! 

But there's no such thing as "culture wars" though . 🙄

 

 

[WorldChampions1902]

4 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/nov/02/morrisons-apologises-for-non-eu-salt-and-pepper-chicken-label

 

What an embarrassment, struggled to believe it wasn't a meme! 

It has become a supermarket trend and is indicative of the mindset of a number of our fellow citizens. Utterly cringeworthy.

[Japan Jambo]

9 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

It has become a supermarket trend and is indicative of the mindset of a number of our fellow citizens. Utterly cringeworthy.

 

[NANOJAMBO]

More good news from brexitopia -

 

@JP_Biz

·

3m

Stormont’s Agriculture Minister has heavily criticised the UK’s trade deal with New Zealand. Edwin Poots said the deal is a ‘very serious threat’ to NI farmers. It will mean that all tariffs will ultimately be removed from New Zealand’s exports of lamb, beef & butter to the UK.

[Gizmo]

20 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

Tory double-speak on privatisation is legend……

 

Mendacious beyond parody. 

 

[WorldChampions1902]

Just now, NANOJAMBO said:

More good news from brexitopia -

 

@JP_Biz

·

3m

Stormont’s Agriculture Minister has heavily criticised the UK’s trade deal with New Zealand. Edwin Poots said the deal is a ‘very serious threat’ to NI farmers. It will mean that all tariffs will ultimately be removed from New Zealand’s exports of lamb, beef & butter to the UK.

No s**t Sherlock! Every single day, the penny is starting to drop with the hard of thinking. Tick-Tock.

[Alex Kintner]

1 hour ago, NANOJAMBO said:

For the last time, and let's not forget why we got to this apparently trivial point.

 

You started off by saying water was privatised because government (aka the state ) didn't have the money to fix the problems and denied it was done to finance tax cuts. 

 

So here we go , in 1989 Thatcher privatised water (in England, but NOT Scotland ) but as has been pointed out to you , she also sold off,  inter alia , BT, Britsh Gas to raise funds for much needed tax cuts.  Argue all you like, that is a proven fact.

And as also pointed out to you by me & others, It also fitted her "small government" agenda and had nothing to do with  "the state " having "no money", as you put it. The state having "no money" argument  is completely false as I'll demonstrate below. 

 

Your point is proven fallacious because in Scotland, water continued to be in publc hands for SIXTEEN years after Thatcher privatised it in England. As I have shown  you (but which you labelled "conspiracy theories") , Scottish water is 100% owned by the Scot gov and Scottish water is financed through its own revenues and "long term government loans". So, for SIXTEEN years after privatisation in England, Scotland financed its water services with government loans - which you claim Thatcher couldn't afford to do for England. 

 

SIXTEEN years after the 1989 privatisation in England , Scotland allowed private sector competition  in the water "market" in a very limited and specific way and for a 4 year period only- I am assuming they won this business through a tender process*. If so, that is not privatisation. (for which I've given you two definitions - and awarding a short term contract on commercial grounds doesn't meet that criteria.   *Maybe you can confirm - I've asked you before but you never answered. 

 

So in short, you're nitpicking over "privatisation" because that's all you have left after  your nonsense about Thatcher was shown to be wrong and  your nonsense about Thatcher not having the money to pay for the works required is wrong (cos either Westminster gov or Scot gov was still financing it in Scotland 16 years after privatisation in England). 

 

And now I'm putting your insulting , time wasting arse on ignore. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

6 minutes ago, Alex Kintner said:

[JudyJudyJudy]

Unsure why people are trying to Score points About Brexit .? It’s rather a mooted argument . Everyone knew it was gonna to be an epic disaster of gigantic proportions and it’s now evident that it is . So it’s not exactly point scoring as such . More of “ I Told you so “