Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[Unknown user]

2 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Serious question;  have you thought about adult education classes? It's never too late.

 

I did wonder how you got past remedial, good effort 👍

[WorldChampions1902]

22 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The fact that the SNP are running the country into the ground should surely make you question the wisdom of Scexit. You don't suddenly magic up a capable political class. The same incompetents will be there , fighting like ferrets in a sack. In addition to Sturgeon,  Salmond, Harvie, Greer and Constance you can add the chilling prospect of Colin Fox, half-wit Sheridan and that Canadian bint from the Greens.  What a feckin shit show🤣🤣

 

It seems the “shit show” you allege is all down to the SNP is very much one created by the Tory Junta - literally.

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

12 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

It seems the “shit show” you allege is all down to the SNP is very much one created by the Tory Junta - literally.

 

 

Blaming Thatcher?  Ahahahaha. Priceless🤣🤣🤣. Bitter and twisted doesn't even scratch the surface. 

I'll bet the silly mare wasn't even born when Lady T was in power.🤣🤣

Tell you one thing...there is more bile, sewage and sh**e on Twatter than you'll find in any river.

[Roxy Hearts]

22 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

It seems the “shit show” you allege is all down to the SNP is very much one created by the Tory Junta - literally.

 

Sums her up! Dreadful human being.

[The Mighty Thor]

4 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Blaming Thatcher?  Ahahahaha. Priceless🤣🤣🤣. Bitter and twisted doesn't even scratch the surface. 

I'll bet the silly mare wasn't even born when Lady T was in power.🤣🤣

Tell you one thing...there is more bile, sewage and sh**e on Twatter than you'll find in any river.

That's factual.

Thatcher's governments sold off everything they possibly could in the race to privatisation. 

It's why our infrastructure is so shit nowadays as it requires maintenance and that costs money which means less return for the shareholders.

It's not rocket science. It's just facts. 

[WorldChampions1902]

5 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Blaming Thatcher?  Ahahahaha. Priceless🤣🤣🤣. Bitter and twisted doesn't even scratch the surface. 

I'll bet the silly mare wasn't even born when Lady T was in power.🤣🤣

Tell you one thing...there is more bile, sewage and sh**e on Twatter than you'll find in any river.

True to form, you ignore hard facts. Better to go on a rant to divert from the uncomfortable truths. At least you’re consistent.

[Enzo Chiefo]

Just now, WorldChampions1902 said:

True to form, you ignore hard facts. Better to go on a rant to divert from the uncomfortable truths. At least you’re consistent.

Hard facts? On Twitter?🤣🤣

Stay off it..that's my advice.

[Roxy Hearts]

11 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Hard facts? On Twitter?🤣🤣

Stay off it..that's my advice.

Stay off the the bevy!

[Enzo Chiefo]

10 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

That's factual.

Thatcher's governments sold off everything they possibly could in the race to privatisation. 

It's why our infrastructure is so shit nowadays as it requires maintenance and that costs money which means less return for the shareholders.

It's not rocket science. It's just facts. 

Utter nonsense. Yes, she privatised the water and sewage systems after decades of underinvestment, including a certain Labour govt that had to go cap in hand to the IMF.

Do you not remember the polluted beaches, poor water quality and high leakage rates prior to the sell off?  All improved greatly. 

Like most nationalised industries back in the 70s and early 80s, it was inefficient and second rate.

[Victorian]

6 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Serious question;  have you thought about adult education classes? It's never too late.

 

The guy this insult was aimed at is a teacher.

[Enzo Chiefo]

4 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

The guy this insult was aimed at is a teacher.

Which is a sad indictment,  given his infantile posting style and intolerance of other opinions.  If he dishes it out, he gets it back. Maybe a lesson for him.

[Victorian]

Just now, Enzo Chiefo said:

Which is a sad indictment,  given his infantile posting style and intolerance of other opinions.  If he dishes it out, he gets it back. Maybe a lesson for him.

 

A few items there can be attributed to you tbh.  I think we can all be guilty of that at times.  I just thought you might like to know.  I've found the chap to be a pleasant,  well adjusted,  personable guy in real life.  Just to make you aware of the mismatch while you and your unjustifiable ego are tearing around the board.

[WorldChampions1902]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Hard facts? On Twitter?🤣🤣

Stay off it..that's my advice.

Plenty of fact cross-checking available here. https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/water
Not that you will bother as inconvenient facts get in the way of your agenda.

[Enzo Chiefo]

1 minute ago, Victorian said:

 

A few items there can be attributed to you tbh.  I think we can all be guilty of that at times.  I just thought you might like to know.  I've found the chap to be a pleasant,  well adjusted,  personable guy in real life.  Just to make you aware of the mismatch while you and your unjustifiable ego are tearing around the board.

I'm sure he is but I was responding to him in a reciprocal manner. I would have expected better from a teacher tbh.

You know nothing about me, so I'm happy to confirm, following your inference, that there is no mismatch. 👍

[Enzo Chiefo]

2 minutes ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

Plenty of fact cross-checking available here. https://weownit.org.uk/public-ownership/water
Not that you will bother as inconvenient facts get in the way of your agenda.

I've already explained how privatisation benefited the water quality,  the standard of our beaches and the drop in leakage.

[Victorian]

1 minute ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I'm sure he is but I was responding to him in a reciprocal manner. I would have expected better from a teacher tbh.

You know nothing about me, so I'm happy to confirm, following your inference, that there is no mismatch. 👍

 

Righto.

[Gizmo]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Blaming Thatcher?  Ahahahaha. Priceless🤣🤣🤣. Bitter and twisted doesn't even scratch the surface. 

I'll bet the silly mare wasn't even born when Lady T was in power.🤣🤣

Tell you one thing...there is more bile, sewage and sh**e on Twatter than you'll find in any river.

[NANOJAMBO]

18 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I've already explained how privatisation benefited the water quality,  the standard of our beaches and the drop in leakage.

It can't have been suuccessful because Tory MPs have been telling the public this week it would cost £600 billion to fix the problems that currently require raw sewage to be pumped into the waterways and seas of the UK.  And they wouldn't lie about something like that. 

[Beni]

Privatisation raised water quality.  

 

I hate to drag this thread back on topic, but it seems to have come full circle anyway, and it wouldn't do any harm for some posters with fertile imaginations to educate themselves on the history of water standards legislation. 

 

https://ec.europa.eu/environment/archives/guide/part2d.htm

[NANOJAMBO]

6 minutes ago, Beni said:

Privatisation raised water quality.  

 

I hate to drag this thread back on topic, but it seems to have come full circle anyway, and it wouldn't do any harm for some posters with fertile imaginations to educate themselves on the history of water standards legislation. 

 

https://ec.europa.eu/environment/archives/guide/part2d.htm

You think Enzo will read it ? 

[Enzo Chiefo]

3 minutes ago, Beni said:

Privatisation raised water quality.  

 

I hate to drag this thread back on topic, but it seems to have come full circle anyway, and it wouldn't do any harm for some posters with fertile imaginations to educate themselves on the history of water standards legislation. 

 

https://ec.europa.eu/environment/archives/guide/part2d.htm

I suggest you do a bit of research and look back to the reasons why water was privatised, the required investment that was delivered by the private companies and the subsequent improvement in polluted beaches, water quality and leakage rates. 

Blaming Thaaaatccher is a peculiarly Scottish disease that, as we saw last week with the car crash performance of Susan Aitken at WM, invites well deserved ridicule.

[Konrad von Carstein]

4 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

You think Enzo will read it ? 

Clearly not

 

[NANOJAMBO]

5 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

I suggest you do a bit of research and look back to the reasons why water was privatised,  it was sold off so Thatcher could get some cash, same as gas & BT. it wasn't done for altruistic or environmental reasons. 🙄

 

the required investment that was delivered by the private companies so what , that's what business do. Meanwhile  in real terms cost of water in England is 40% higher 

 

and the subsequent improvement in polluted beaches, water quality and leakage rates. EU directives , the water companies weren't environmental Jihadis. 

Blaming Thaaaatccher is a peculiarly Scottish disease that, as we saw last week with the car crash performance of Susan Aitken at WM, invites well deserved ridicule.

 

[Cade]

Coming back day after day and having all your DailyMail/Express fever dreams punctured by cold hard facts and logic yet still coming back for more.

 

Masochistic in the extreme.

[NANOJAMBO]

21 minutes ago, Beni said:

Privatisation raised water quality.  

 

I hate to drag this thread back on topic, but it seems to have come full circle anyway, and it wouldn't do any harm for some posters with fertile imaginations to educate themselves on the history of water standards legislation. 

 

https://ec.europa.eu/environment/archives/guide/part2d.htm

Enzo won't  accept EU directives driving up standards, he thinks the new water companies were run by enviromental zealots who did it of their own free will. 

[Enzo Chiefo]

3 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

 

Are you 5 years old?

The poster that blamed Thaaatcher for the sewage problems 32 years later is WRONG. That was my point and it's now proven. 

Why we are now getting links about EU directives is not clear. Nobody is disputing that there have been EU directives. 

But the improvements and investment were undertaken and accomplished by the private companies, after decades of under investment. That's why they were privatised; to provide the service and investment that the State couldn't. Free from union interference and inefficient,  state bureaucracy, standards were raised and 3 times as many UK beaches were deemed "green flag" compared with pre-privitisation.

Again, the advice is : stay off Twitter, it's a cesspit of misinformation. 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

2 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Are you 5 years old?

The poster that blamed Thaaatcher for the sewage problems 32 years later is WRONG. That was my point and it's now proven. 

Why we are now getting links about EU directives is not clear. Nobody is disputing that there have been EU directives. 

But the improvements and investment were undertaken and accomplished by the private companies, after decades of under investment. That's why they were privatised; to provide the service and investment that the State couldn't. Free from union interference and inefficient,  state bureaucracy, standards were raised and 3 times as many UK beaches were deemed "green flag" compared with pre-privitisation.

Again, the advice is : stay off Twitter, it's a cesspit of misinformation. 

 

You're the last person on here to be handing out advice.   

 

In short, privatised water companies have fleeced the consumer (I make no comment on Scotland) - prices up 40% in real terms , nearly £60 billion paid out in dividends, multi million piund salaries for CEOs , utility companies now sunstantially foreign owned ...... ("union interference" , or the lack of now, has worked wonders, eh ?). 

 

As for Scotland , how did they manage to get their water sorted without putting it into private ownership ? 

[Enzo Chiefo]

3 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

You're the last person on here to be handing out advice.   

 

In short, privatised water companies have fleeced the consumer (I make no comment on Scotland) - prices up 40% in real terms , nearly £60 billion paid out in dividends, multi million piund salaries for CEOs , utility companies now sunstantially foreign owned ...... ("union interference" , or the lack of now, has worked wonders, eh ?). 

 

As for Scotland , how did they manage to get their water sorted without putting it into private ownership ? 

In short, you're talking garbage. Not for the first time.

Just take my advice; stay off Twitter 👍

[NANOJAMBO]

14 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Are you 5 years old?

The poster that blamed Thaaatcher for the sewage problems 32 years later is WRONG. That was my point and it's now proven. 

Why we are now getting links about EU directives is not clear. Nobody is disputing that there have been EU directives. 

But the improvements and investment were undertaken and accomplished by the private companies, after decades of under investment. That's why they were privatised; to provide the service and investment that the State couldn't. Free from union interference and inefficient,  state bureaucracy, standards were raised and 3 times as many UK beaches were deemed "green flag" compared with pre-privitisation.

Again, the advice is : stay off Twitter, it's a cesspit of misinformation. 

 

You need to think about that.

You're saying "the state" has less money than a tin pot water company.  It's not that Thatcher couldn't afford to, she didn't want to.  This was all about "small government" - and selling off the family jewels to rasie money for tax cuts. 

[NANOJAMBO]

6 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

In short, you're talking garbage. Not for the first time.

Just take my advice; stay off Twitter 👍

Mate , you're good at insulting peole but quite poor at debating your own posts or supporting them with evidence (or contradicting others  with any contra source). You resort to insults when your idiotic ranting gets demolished - which it does frequently. 

 

 Just take my advice; stay off this thread 👍

Edited October 31, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[Beni]

24 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Why we are now getting links about EU directives is not clear.

 

I think it's pretty clear tbh, but just in case it wasn't, it was to show that your pretence that water privatisation was the driver for improvements in water quality is nothing more than a figment of your imagination. 

Glad we've got that sorted out. 👍

[Enzo Chiefo]

2 minutes ago, Beni said:

 

I think it's pretty clear tbh, but just in case it wasn't, it was to show that your pretence that water privatisation was the driver for improvements in water quality is nothing more than a figment of your imagination. 

Glad we've got that sorted out. 👍

No, privatisation delivered the improvements. Why tf you think we needed EU directives to improve standards is unclear. Beaches were polluted, leakage was high and water quality was poor. Private investment was needed as the State could not fund the necessary improvements.

Glad we've cleared that up.

[Enzo Chiefo]

14 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Mate , you're good at insulting peole but quite poor at debating your own posts or supporting them with evidence (or contradicting others  with any contra source). You resort to insults when your idiotic ranting gets demolished - which it does frequently. 

 

 Just take my advice; stay off this thread 👍

Mate, you're another one who doesn't think twice about making disparaging comments yet starts playing the victim card when he gets a bit back.

If you were "insulted", best find another thread.👍

[NANOJAMBO]

11 minutes ago, Beni said:

 

I think it's pretty clear tbh, but just in case it wasn't, it was to show that your pretence that water privatisation was the driver for improvements in water quality is nothing more than a figment of your imagination. 

Glad we've got that sorted out. 👍

👍

[Enzo Chiefo]

19 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

You need to think about that.

You're saying "the state" has less money than a tin pot water company.  It's not that Thatcher couldn't afford to, she didn't want to.  This was all about "small government" - and selling off the family jewels to rasie money for tax cuts. 

A "tin pot company" which, you complained , paid 60bn in dividends? Which is it?

And, no, the state could not justify throwing billions at an inefficient industry; privatisation was needed to invest and improve.  That's what happened. 

[NANOJAMBO]

4 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

No, privatisation delivered the improvements. semantics : they did what they were legally obliged to do

 

Why tf you think we needed EU directives to improve standards is unclear. Only to you 

 

Beaches were polluted, leakage was high and water quality was poor. Hence all the EU directives AFTER water was privatised in 1989

Private investment was needed as the State could not fund the necessary improvements.

Glad we've cleared that up. It could - it is patent nonsense to say "the state" had lesser financial resources than a tin pot water company - but it didn't because Thatcher wanted the sell off to raise money for tax cuts and as part of her "small government" agenda. 

 

 

 

[NANOJAMBO]

13 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

A "tin pot company" which, you complained , paid 60bn in dividends? Which is it? Read my post , again, properly. 

And, no, the state could not justify throwing billions at an inefficient industry; Improving water standards isn't throwing money at  anything 

privatisation was needed to invest and improve. it wasn't , it was a political choice

 

That's what happened. That's not what happened.

You've got all the answers , you tell me. 

 

Can you get back to me on how Scotland managed to deliver clean water in line with EU directives  without privatisation ? 

Edited October 31, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[Enzo Chiefo]

5 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

 

 

 

The State doesn't have money. It comes from taxpayers. 

If you're happy with your taxes being hiked to prop up inefficient, state run industries, frequently held to ransom by unions, that's your choice.

[Beni]

10 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

No, privatisation delivered the improvements. Why tf you think we needed EU directives to improve standards is unclear. Beaches were polluted, leakage was high and water quality was poor. Private investment was needed as the State could not fund the necessary improvements.

Glad we've cleared that up.

 

Doubling down on your nonsense might make you feel better, but reality doesn't care about your feelings.

 

[NANOJAMBO]

12 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The State doesn't have money. It comes from taxpayers. 

If you're happy with your taxes being hiked to prop up inefficient, state run industries, frequently held to ransom by unions, that's your choice.

Can you get back to me on how Scotland managed to deliver clean water in line with EU directives  without privatisation ? 

[NANOJAMBO]

20 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

The State doesn't have money.

It comes from taxpayers. so it DOES have money then 🙄

If you're happy with your taxes being hiked to prop up inefficient, state run industries, frequently held to ransom by unions, that's your choice. bullshit deflection. 

Can you get back to me on how Scotland managed to deliver clean water in line with EU directives  without privatisation ? 

Edited November 1, 2021 by NANOJAMBO

[NANOJAMBO]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Mate, you're another one who doesn't think twice about making disparaging comments yet starts playing the victim card when he gets a bit back.

If you were "insulted", best find another thread.👍

Can you get back to me on how Scotland managed to deliver clean water in line with EU directives  without privatisation ? 

[The Mighty Thor]

9 hours ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Utter nonsense. Yes, she privatised the water and sewage systems after decades of underinvestment, including a certain Labour govt that had to go cap in hand to the IMF.

Do you not remember the polluted beaches, poor water quality and high leakage rates prior to the sell off?  All improved greatly. 

Like most nationalised industries back in the 70s and early 80s, it was inefficient and second rate.

And the power companies and the communications networks and anything of any value. All sold off. For buttons. 

I'm old enough to remember polluted beaches and rivers. It was only last week after all.

 

Oh and by the way your privatisation theory on water holds no water. Scottish water, publicly owned, invests more and has better water quality than any private, foreign owned water company in the UK.

Why would that be do you think?

 

Them damn pesky facts again eh?

[Enzo Chiefo]

6 hours ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Can you get back to me on how Scotland managed to deliver clean water in line with EU directives  without privatisation ? 

That's up to Scotland.  One of many powers that it has.

My purpose was to refute the false claim made on Twitter - where else - about Thatcher.

I've done that.  Privatisation back then was necessary and delivered marked improvements in water cleanliness, leakage rates and beach pollution. 

 

[Enzo Chiefo]

8 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

And the power companies and the communications networks and anything of any value. All sold off. For buttons. 

I'm old enough to remember polluted beaches and rivers. It was only last week after all.

 

Oh and by the way your privatisation theory on water holds no water. Scottish water, publicly owned, invests more and has better water quality than any private, foreign owned water company in the UK.

Why would that be do you think?

 

Them damn pesky facts again eh?

Not the issue we were talking about but, you are partially correct. There are, however, parts of the Scottish provision which are private.

Having previously run my own business,  I know that business customers choose from a range of private providers and are charged, based on water consumption.

 

In addition,  water treatment plants were built with private money - PFI - and in 2015 the SNP led Scot Gov awarded a contract to Anglian Water to provide water management services to all of Scotland's public sector buildings,  including hospitals. 

Private sector involvement has of course, enabled greater investment.

Ironically,  they blamed EU competition rules for awarding the contract. 

Who'd have thought it?😀

[ri Alban]

Aw naw, Scotland is running out of water anaw, noo .

[The Mighty Thor]

1 hour ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Not the issue we were talking about but, you are partially correct. There are, however, parts of the Scottish provision which are private.

Having previously run my own business,  I know that business customers choose from a range of private providers and are charged, based on water consumption.

 

In addition,  water treatment plants were built with private money - PFI - and in 2015 the SNP led Scot Gov awarded a contract to Anglian Water to provide water management services to all of Scotland's public sector buildings,  including hospitals. 

Private sector involvement has of course, enabled greater investment.

Ironically,  they blamed EU competition rules for awarding the contract. 

Who'd have thought it?😀

A lot of whataboutery. The bottom line is the one UK water board that was not privatised is the one that has consistently invested the most in its infrastructure, has the best water quality and manages the largest bodies of fresh water in the UK. 

 

So your argument about privatisation is bollocks, as anyone with cognitive function can see. 

 

As for your 'that's up to Scoooaaaatland' defence when presented with the facts, it's all a bit like when Paulo Sergio said to the vermin, if you want to keep losing, keep losing before we rammed 5 past them.  

[Enzo Chiefo]

6 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

A lot of whataboutery. The bottom line is the one UK water board that was not privatised is the one that has consistently invested the most in its infrastructure, has the best water quality and manages the largest bodies of fresh water in the UK. 

 

So your argument about privatisation is bollocks, as anyone with cognitive function can see. 

 

As for your 'that's up to Scoooaaaatland' defence when presented with the facts, it's all a bit like when Paulo Sergio said to the vermin, if you want to keep losing, keep losing before we rammed 5 past them.  

Correcting your claim is not "whataboutery", it's a presentation of facts.

Scottish water provision is partially privatised ,allowing greater investment, contrary to your claim.

I've proved my point so we're going no further with this. Bye for now

[Unknown user]

Jesus wept

[The Mighty Thor]

6 minutes ago, Enzo Chiefo said:

Correcting your claim is not "whataboutery", it's a presentation of facts.

Scottish water provision is partially privatised ,allowing greater investment, contrary to your claim.

I've proved my point so we're going no further with this. Bye for now

mate you're frantically combing goolge to find an argument which backs up your spurious claims that the only way to have a functioning water supply was with private money. Scottish water blows that clean out the water so to speak. 

 

Furthermore Thatcher and her ministers sold off anything of value and we've all paid the price ever since. Power, communications, transportation. All of the national infrastructure that a modern country needs, all in private hands, none of it being invested in.