More Tory lies

[Pans Jambo]

43 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Nothing to see there  

It wouldn’t matter what lies are exposed, a majority of scots still don’t actuall believe it. Completely servile. 

I was down England at the weekend and politics came up a couple of times. It’s fair to say the perception of us being a massively subsidised nation is strong with them. In short we’d be ****ed without them firing money up our arse. It never feels like a union when you speak to English people about it, it’s like your pishy little small minded nation needs to pipe down. 

BBC watchers and Daily Mail reading ignorance is at play here.

 

Equally, I have spent quite a lot of time with English 'Northerners' and they often say they wish they could re-draw the Scottish border just north of Birmingham.

 

BTW, none of the tories on here will even mention the missing oil £Billions. Its Westminster that's the parasite. You wont read that in the Mirror.

[Boris]

46 minutes ago, jambo lodge said:

Why is it that the Tories in Scotland are detested by much of the population but not so in England. It cant be anything to do with class as working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories. My conclusion from reading the many posts on here, from Nats in particular, is that it has to do with race. Tories seem to equate to everything that is English and therefore toxic to Nats. The anti English sentiment is often related to Tories on this thread.

 

Maybe Scots have long memories?  The heartless de-industrialisation of Scotland, the Poll Tax a year early, the campaign for devolution...

 

It could also be that as an ideology, Toryism is reviled up here.  Just because "working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories" doesn't mean that Scottish areas would do the same.  If anything, that statement ignores the different political culture that has evolved in Scotland post-1979, arguably accelerated post 97.

 

To then conclude that despising the Tories is actually an act of racism beggars belief.  A similar percentage of Scots back a party that is the antithesis of the Tory party, yet they support the Union.  Are they racists too?  Politics isn't binary.

[ri Alban]

56 minutes ago, jambo lodge said:

Why is it that the Tories in Scotland are detested by much of the population but not so in England. It cant be anything to do with class as working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories. My conclusion from reading the many posts on here, from Nats in particular, is that it has to do with race. Tories seem to equate to everything that is English and therefore toxic to Nats. The anti English sentiment is often related to Tories on this thread.

What about an opinion on the above post from pans? 

No! I didn't think so. 

[Phil Dunphy]

28 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What about an opinion on the above post from pans? 

No! I didn't think so. 

 

Racists often tell you they’re not racist. 

 

[Thunderstruck]

2 hours ago, Pans Jambo said:

So lets see what the lizard party lovers say about this one then:

 

 

Not this again!

 

“Anger”? Now?

 

This is was discussed in 2014 - by “Wings” and others - even the Twitfeed you quote has a link to a mention in the Sunday Post in 2013. 

 

This relates to Regional Trade Statistics so it is not clear why “Revenues” is mentioned. Even the explanatory notes are clear on “value of trade”. 

 

Why wasn’t there a huge outcry in 2017 when the methodology changed?

 

A short but informative read - 

 

https://fraserofallander.org/scottish-economy/hmrc-regional-trade-statistics-goods/

 

 

 

[John Findlay]

1 hour ago, jambo lodge said:

Why is it that the Tories in Scotland are detested by much of the population but not so in England. It cant be anything to do with class as working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories. My conclusion from reading the many posts on here, from Nats in particular, is that it has to do with race. Tories seem to equate to everything that is English and therefore toxic to Nats. The anti English sentiment is often related to Tories on this thread.

I lived in England for twenty six years. Served in HM forces for eleven years. Married my first wife in 1983 who just happened to be English. My two oldest children now aged 32 and 27 respectively are English born and bred. They both live there and always have. Yet at any national election I vote SNP and have done so since 1983. Never registered for the constituency I lived in in England and voted by post for Edinburgh North and Leith. Ron the Macentre Brown being my MP for years.

Conservatives won the three seats I lived in in England. East Hampshire, Fareham and  Havant. Never hated the English in my puff and never will. However have always believed Scotland has always got the shit end of the stick from Westminster governments since 1707 regardless of who have been the ruling party. Personally more galley with Labour than the Conservatives. A party born in Scotland but who have shit on us Scots as much as the Tories imho. Many will disagree with me and that is their perogative. I would fight for England tomorrow if it was attacked unjustly. I would still vote SNP at the next election.

[Hasselhoff]

 

3 hours ago, Pans Jambo said:

So lets see what the lizard party lovers say about this one then:

 

 

@FactCheckScot is a joke - look at their tweets, nationalist rubbish. 

 

Nothing to do with facts. 

 

 

[AlimOzturk]

[Pans Jambo]

55 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

Racists often tell you they’re not racist. 

 

They do. Are you suggesting I may be racist because of my dislike of the tories?

[Pans Jambo]

53 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

Not this again!

 

“Anger”? Now?

 

This is was discussed in 2014 - by “Wings” and others - even the Twitfeed you quote has a link to a mention in the Sunday Post in 2013. 

 

This relates to Regional Trade Statistics so it is not clear why “Revenues” is mentioned. Even the explanatory notes are clear on “value of trade”. 

 

Why wasn’t there a huge outcry in 2017 when the methodology changed?

 

A short but informative read - 

 

https://fraserofallander.org/scottish-economy/hmrc-regional-trade-statistics-goods/

 

 

 

Smoke & fire though. Who knows what other shenanigans Westminster get up to. Would certainly explain the small tax take versus similar small oil producing nations.

Scotland pumps more oil than Dubai. Seems to be a bit of a differential in wealth status between the 2 countries. Good job Westminster doesn't run Dubai eh?

Edited July 2, 2018 by Pans Jambo

[Thunderstruck]

10 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Smoke & fire though. Who knows what other shenanigans Westminster get up to. Would certainly explain the small tax take versus similar small oil producing nations.

Scotland pumps more oil than Dubai. Seems to be a bit of a differential in wealth status between the 2 countries. Good job Westminster doesn't run Dubai eh?

 

If there was any fire to produce smoke, we would know about it - I’m fairly certain that the Growth Commission would have unearthed it. 

 

The problem here (and quite common for Wings, etc) is conflating two entirely different sets of information compiled for entirely different purposes. 

 

RTS measures the value of goods imported/exported and is entirely unrelated to the amount of tax paid or, indeed, where that tax is paid. 

 

It wouldn’t be difficult to pump more oil than Dubai. It only produces around 70k barrels per day (compared with 1.6m barrels per day for U.K. N Sea). Dubai is wealthy for other reasons. 

 

That aside, the extraction of oil in the Middle East costs a fraction of that in the N Sea. Tax revenue is based on the net income after costs and will be offset by allowances for such as capital expenditure. 

[Governor Tarkin]

1 hour ago, John Findlay said:

Never hated the English in my puff and never will. However have always believed Scotland has always got the shit end of the stick from Westminster governments since 1707 regardless of who have been the ruling party. Personally more galley with Labour than the Conservatives. A party born in Scotland but who have shit on us Scots as much as the Tories imho. Many will disagree with me and that is their perogative. I would fight for England tomorrow if it was attacked unjustly. I would still vote SNP at the next election.

 

Good post. Especially this part.

[Pans Jambo]

Yip. More smoke...

https://informscotland.com/tory-dark-money-scandal-bbc-scotland-speechless/

 

[Phil Dunphy]

1 hour ago, Pans Jambo said:

They do. Are you suggesting I may be racist because of my dislike of the tories?

 

I never suggested anything of the sort. I merely said your reply was along the same lines as someone denying they’re a racist. 

[Pans Jambo]

11 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

I never suggested anything of the sort. I merely said your reply was along the same lines as someone denying they’re a racist. 

U huh. 

[jambo lodge]

3 hours ago, Boris said:

 

Maybe Scots have long memories?  The heartless de-industrialisation of Scotland, the Poll Tax a year early, the campaign for devolution...

 

It could also be that as an ideology, Toryism is reviled up here.  Just because "working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories" doesn't mean that Scottish areas would do the same.  If anything, that statement ignores the different political culture that has evolved in Scotland post-1979, arguably accelerated post 97.

 

To then conclude that despising the Tories is actually an act of racism beggars belief.  A similar percentage of Scots back a party that is the antithesis of the Tory party, yet they support the Union.  Are they racists too?  Politics isn't binary.

Im ok with people who have opposite political views but can discuss matters in a rational way. What I have noticed on here are the snide comments about little Englanders, English nationalists etc. Also some of the extreme banners pictured at Snat rallies such as " Tory scum out" lead me to beleive that there is a growing racism attached to the seperatist movement.

[Pans Jambo]

53 minutes ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

I never suggested anything of the sort. I merely said your reply was along the same lines as someone denying they’re a racist. 

 

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, Phil Dunphy said:

 

Racists often tell you they’re not racist. 

 

Are the Tories a race, now? 

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, jambo lodge said:

Im ok with people who have opposite political views but can discuss matters in a rational way. What I have noticed on here are the snide comments about little Englanders, English nationalists etc. Also some of the extreme banners pictured at Snat rallies such as " Tory scum out" lead me to beleive that there is a growing racism attached to the seperatist movement.

That set of bampots fae the 70s. What about the EDL, BNP, Ukip, do we judge all brexit voters on this lot. 

[ri Alban]

3 hours ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

If there was any fire to produce smoke, we would know about it - I’m fairly certain that the Growth Commission would have unearthed it. 

 

The problem here (and quite common for Wings, etc) is conflating two entirely different sets of information compiled for entirely different purposes. 

 

RTS measures the value of goods imported/exported and is entirely unrelated to the amount of tax paid or, indeed, where that tax is paid. 

 

It wouldn’t be difficult to pump more oil than Dubai. It only produces around 70k barrels per day (compared with 1.6m barrels per day for U.K. N Sea). Dubai is wealthy for other reasons. 

 

That aside, the extraction of oil in the Middle East costs a fraction of that in the N Sea. Tax revenue is based on the net income after costs and will be offset by allowances for such as capital expenditure. 

Here Thundy, tell us all again how everybody and their dug would leave Scotland if it becomes independent, but Airbus etc... are at it when they say they're leaving because of brexit. Go on gies a laugh. 

[Pans Jambo]

See the Lizard Malevolent party are having a barney....

https://news.sky.com/story/brexit-jacob-rees-mogg-faces-backlash-after-warning-to-theresa-may-11423576?dcmp=snt-sf-twitter

 

[Thunderstruck]

1 hour ago, ri Alban said:

Here Thundy, tell us all again how everybody and their dug would leave Scotland if it becomes independent, but Airbus etc... are at it when they say they're leaving because of brexit. Go on gies a laugh. 

 

Nothing to say on the topic of “fireless smoke”?

 

Your off-topic question was discussed on a different thread but to save you having to look - see below for my response re Airbus and for independence read “Scottish” for “British”. 

 

There is real risk of business leaving should either event happen and I’m sure you can differentiate risk and absolute certainty. Brexit carries risk but independence would bring clear and obvious losses which, if you had been paying any sort of attention, you would recognise. 

 

[Boris]

3 hours ago, jambo lodge said:

Im ok with people who have opposite political views but can discuss matters in a rational way. What I have noticed on here are the snide comments about little Englanders, English nationalists etc. Also some of the extreme banners pictured at Snat rallies such as " Tory scum out" lead me to beleive that there is a growing racism attached to the seperatist movement.

 

Ok, so you've qualified your earlier statement by saying some nats are racist, as opposed to people who are anti Tory. Fair enough.

 

i think little englander isn't a phrase unique to Scottish nationalists and describes that section, especially in the Tory party, who see England as Britain and vice versa. In that sense it's fair comment, IMO. It's not anti English, far from it.

 

There was a recent article, in the spectator I think, that was actually quite generous to the SNP and its brand of nationalism. I'll try and find it for you.

 

Apologies, it was the New Statesman. https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2018/06/global-far-right-rises-snp-offering-inclusive-nationalism

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

Nothing to say on the topic of “fireless smoke”?

 

Your off-topic question was discussed on a different thread but to save you having to look - see below for my response re Airbus and for independence read “Scottish” for “British”. 

 

There is real risk of business leaving should either event happen and I’m sure you can differentiate risk and absolute certainty. Brexit carries risk but independence would bring clear and obvious losses which, if you had been paying any sort of attention, you would recognise. 

 

Yawn. 

 

Can I ask you? Have you ever heard of Astroturfing? 

 

Oh and for the ones playing dumb about the power grab, this bill effectively takes control of all powers. All the SNP wanted was an opt out of certain trade deals that infringed on products that are banned like GM crops or dodgy chicken fae America. Now it can overrule anytime it they not normally can. 

As for making reporters apply for Freedom of information just like you and I. What's the problem? 

[ri Alban]

Anybody who thinks the BBC isn't biased and want to watch who exactly were the violent side. Watch London's calling. 

Edited July 2, 2018 by ri Alban

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, jambo lodge said:

Why is it that the Tories in Scotland are detested by much of the population but not so in England. It cant be anything to do with class as working class areas in England regularly vote in Tories. My conclusion from reading the many posts on here, from Nats in particular, is that it has to do with race. Tories seem to equate to everything that is English and therefore toxic to Nats. The anti English sentiment is often related to Tories on this thread.

Listen Lodgie, this is true about both sides. Tell me why there's never any unionist rallies(apart from the July sponsored walks) and if there was do you think they'd be as peaceful as the yes movement rallies?. 

[Thunderstruck]

10 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Yawn. 

 

Can I ask you? Have you ever heard of Astroturfing? 

 

Oh and for the ones playing dumb about the power grab, this bill effectively takes control of all powers. All the SNP wanted was an opt out of certain trade deals that infringed on products that are banned like GM crops or dodgy chicken fae America. Now it can overrule anytime it they not normally can. 

As for making reporters apply for Freedom of information just like you and I. What's the problem? 

 

This is like a Two Ronnies sketch except it isn’t answering the last but one question but questions from the last but one week. 

 

Just goes to show that there is such a thing as too much sun. 

[ri Alban]

5 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

This is like a Two Ronnies sketch except it isn’t answering the last but one question but questions from the last but one week. 

 

Just goes to show that there is such a thing as too much sun. 

I've been in the jkb jail. So answer the questions. Or are just gonna bounce from thread to thread deflecting onto #snpbad whenever yer rulers are exposed. 

[Seymour M Hersh]

6 hours ago, John Findlay said:

I lived in England for twenty six years. Served in HM forces for eleven years. Married my first wife in 1983 who just happened to be English. My two oldest children now aged 32 and 27 respectively are English born and bred. They both live there and always have. Yet at any national election I vote SNP and have done so since 1983. Never registered for the constituency I lived in in England and voted by post for Edinburgh North and Leith. Ron the Macentre Brown being my MP for years.

Conservatives won the three seats I lived in in England. East Hampshire, Fareham and  Havant. Never hated the English in my puff and never will. However have always believed Scotland has always got the shit end of the stick from Westminster governments since 1707 regardless of who have been the ruling party. Personally more galley with Labour than the Conservatives. A party born in Scotland but who have shit on us Scots as much as the Tories imho. Many will disagree with me and that is their perogative. I would fight for England tomorrow if it was attacked unjustly. I would still vote SNP at the next election.

 

C'mon John a bit of honesty goes a long way on here. You genuinely thought the SNP badge you wore back then stood for sex not politics. 

[maroonlegions]

 

 

[ri Alban]

16 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

This is like a Two Ronnies sketch except it isn’t answering the last but one question but questions from the last but one week. 

 

Just goes to show that there is such a thing as too much sun. 

An other thing fae last week. Scottish growth 0.2%,the UK 0.1% and they have total control. 

[maroonlegions]

May had to find that Billion pound to bribe the DUP to cling onto power right enough.

 

 

Benefit claimants have been underpaid by £1.7 BILLION this year

MIRROR.CO.UK

 

 

[Phil Dunphy]

3 hours ago, Pans Jambo said:

 

 

Yes. You are very oppressed

[Thunderstruck]

12 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

I've been in the jkb jail. So answer the questions. Or are just gonna bounce from thread to thread deflecting onto #snpbad whenever yer rulers are exposed. 

 

Ironic post of the month contender and were are only at day 2. 

[robroy1874]

11 minutes ago, maroonlegions said:

 

 

Doesn't surprise me !!

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, Thunderstruck said:

 

Ironic post of the month contender and were are only at day 2. 

Still no answers. And I'm still waiting on the comparison graph for Scottish imports from England. You can do a graph for brexit and indy combined. 70% of English sales gone. But unlike you I think Scotland and England will do just fine. 

[John Findlay]

20 minutes ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

C'mon John a bit of honesty goes a long way on here. You genuinely thought the SNP badge you wore back then stood for sex not politics. 

Trust me I got far more politics than sex.

[Victorian]

So indications have been that the latest (if not final) direction of travel of the government is to be towards a softer type of Brexit.    Lo and behold,   JRM and the rest of the dangerous,  maniacal,  hard line zealots don't like it one bit and the threats of rebellion and regime change are issued.     Cue a flurry of counter statements from supposedly more moderate party members,    doubtless worried sick that this sudden and entirely expected bun fight might lead to total meltdown and many a Tory parasite losing their seat at the next election.     

 

What a ****ing shame.     But who can be blamed?     Only themselves.     This is what the Tory party have allowed to exist and fester.    Not below the suface but in plain sight.      The sort of unholy,  dysfunctional situation that necessitates keeping utter cretins like Boris Johnson in the cabinet,  whilst overtly briefing counter to official government policy.      Whatever that happens to be on any given day.

 

Shambles.

[Pans Jambo]

7 minutes ago, Victorian said:

So indications have been that the latest (if not final) direction of travel of the government is to be towards a softer type of Brexit.    Lo and behold,   JRM and the rest of the dangerous,  maniacal,  hard line zealots don't like it one bit and the threats of rebellion and regime change are issued.     Cue a flurry of counter statements from supposedly more moderate party members,    doubtless worried sick that this sudden and entirely expected bun fight might lead to total meltdown and many a Tory parasite losing their seat at the next election.     

 

What a ****ing shame.     But who can be blamed?     Only themselves.     This is what the Tory party have allowed to exist and fester.    Not below the suface but in plain sight.      The sort of unholy,  dysfunctional situation that necessitates keeping utter cretins like Boris Johnson in the cabinet,  whilst overtly briefing counter to official government policy.      Whatever that happens to be on any given day.

 

Shambles.

Well said. 

[Pans Jambo]

So, IMAGINE if this was the SNP...

They would be screaming for scalps, investigations & parlimentary equiries etc. Front page of the Mirror, Mail, Sun, Record, Scotsman & lead on BBC Good morning Scotland Radio then a whole ‘Call Kaye’ programme followed by big John at lunchtime getting the boot in. Then the lead story on BBC Reporting Scotland with in-depth analysis then all over the evening news & the STV network. Tweets galore from that horror show Ruth and that guy who runs Scottish Labour whos name I can never remember but then nobody else can either. 

 

SILENCE!

 

Edited July 2, 2018 by Pans Jambo

[Pans Jambo]

Remind you of anyone?

 

[AuldReekie444]

2 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Remind you of anyone?

 

 

Yes, The SNP

[Victorian]

Mooth will just laugh very, very loudly,    raise an eyebrow and make a remark about it being all about someone else's obsession with independence.

 

That seems to be the sum total of her day job which,  to her credit,   she performs on a daily basis.

[Seymour M Hersh]

56 minutes ago, John Findlay said:

Trust me I got far more politics than sex.

 

Your bad then John! 

[Pans Jambo]

4 minutes ago, AuldReekie444 said:

 

Yes, The SNP

 

[ri Alban]

4 minutes ago, AuldReekie444 said:

 

Yes, The SNP

Yer arse and parsley! 

[AuldReekie444]

3 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

 

 

3 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Yer arse and parsley! 

 

Thanks Pans, thats a good description of the SNP. 

 

Edited July 2, 2018 by AuldReekie444

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, AuldReekie444 said:

 

 

Thanks Pans, thats a good description of the SNP. 

 

In one word describe the Tories. I'll go first. Starts with a c ends with an s, 5 letters. 

[Pans Jambo]

1 minute ago, AuldReekie444 said:

 

 

Thanks Pans, thats a good description of the SNP. 

 

A million miles away from the SNP. Beautifully describes exactly what the lizard parties motivation is all about. Exactly. 

 

 

Exactly. 

[AuldReekie444]

Just now, Pans Jambo said:

A million miles away from the SNP. Beautifully describes exactly what the lizard parties motivation is all about. Exactly. 

 

 

Exactly. 

 Lizard parties? Are you...do you...