The Rangers soap opera goes on and on.

[Imeantasong]

That's a bloody good question!

It is.

 

So how thorough is their own investigation going to be?

 

With all these allegations and suspicions, I wonder if the police have considered getting more involved.

 

Maybe not until they've had time to destroy as much hard evidence as possible.

[Rick Grimes]

Who knows what will happen after LIQUIDATION.

 

Any number of permutations are possible. I don't think any of them will be light punishments.

 

Liquidation is a racing certainty. Whether or not the SPL have the cojones to not just vote NewCo straight back in is an entirely different thing.

 

Sadly.

[wavydavy]

I haven't seen this posted anywhere on here, may have been mentioned in one of the Rangers mega threads, I reckon it needs a wee thread of it's own.

 

Rangers wanting to cut players wages instead of getting rid of some of them. These players shouldn't even be at the club, they have been getting paid with money Rangers don't have and were also bought with money they don't have. Surely this can't work long term, can it?

 

I really hope this turns round and bites them on the arse

 

 

My link

 

 

You have not been looking very hard then.

[Tiberius Stinkfinger]

I'm a bit confused by this.

 

We have a case going on involving HMRC about players wages being paid abroad as a way to reduce tax ?

 

We are now being told that players may have more than one contract ?

 

Surely HMRC where made aware of these "other contracts" during what was obviously a serious investigation. If not, then it will throw the "big tax" case into total chaos.

 

If the Revenue knew about these "other contracts" then why has this not been made public or why has the league not been informed until now.

 

If the Revenue where not unaware of these "other contracts" I suggest a group of people are in some serious doodoo, because that is nailed on Tax evasion.

 

The plot thickens..

[Lovecraft]

It is.

 

So how thorough is their own investigation going to be?

 

With all these allegations and suspicions, I wonder if the police have considered getting more involved.

Maybe not until they've had time to destroy as much hard evidence as possible.

 

 

I don't think the contracts thing is illegal in British/Scottish law, just illegal in the SPL/SFA.

 

Even if there are signs of people covering it up, I doubt the police could be involved.

[hughesie27]

What is the big thing with these double contracts?

Was this all brought to light by their ex director? Isn't he in line to be punished too? Wouldn't he have known about it and therefore it is highly likely that they will be found guilty?

 

I can't help but think that they will get a "time served" punishment of stripping their titles if they are found guilty.

[jamboinglasgow]

Aye lads, I wasn't exactly being serious...

 

Although I do think that we should only be allowed to celebrate our glorious title win of '92 in the fashion that we would have at the time. I was eight, so I'd probably be allowed full sugar cola, some sweets and to play my Sega Master System past bedtime.

 

As I was only 5 in '92 I will celebrate by pretending to be a fireman and running around the garden making siren noises.

[Hagar the Horrible]

That's a bloody good question!

 

 

Perhaps question should be asked of CO and GS both high up in the SFA and both at Rangers

 

Bringing down the GFA would be my wet dream

[Erik]

The consequences for this are massive if it pans out this way.

 

This could have been the difference between top 6 / bottom 6. The difference between relegation and survival. Difference between European football and not.

 

Basically the last 14 years off Scottish football could be about be become null and void with a lot of clubs potentially cheated out of one thing or another.

 

Regarding cup wins - how would that work exactly? Given that rangers will have eliminated folk at various different stages, who do you award the cups to? Just awarding it to the beaten finalist doesn't compensate whoever rangers beat in the 3rd, 4th quarter or semi final rounds does it....

 

Could get very messy.

[Imeantasong]

Liquidation is a racing certainty. Whether or not the SPL have the cojones to not just vote NewCo straight back in is an entirely different thing.

 

Sadly.

If (and that is if) they are found guilty of breaching these rules too, a lot of club chairmen may have a lot of explaining to do to their supports if they are too lenient.

 

Let's hope fans everywhere are going to petition their clubs should these be proven. Maybe we'll just write about it on fans' forums though.

 

All these potential scandals are looking extremely bad for a lot of people.

[Rick Grimes]

I'm a bit confused by this.

 

We have a case going on involving HMRC about players wages being paid abroad as a way to reduce tax ?

 

We are now being told that players may have more than one contract ?

 

Surely HMRC where made aware of these "other contracts" during what was obviously a serious investigation. If not, then it will throw the "big tax" case into total chaos.

 

If the Revenue knew about these "other contracts" then why has this not been made public or why has the league not been informed until now.

 

If the Revenue where not unaware of these "other contracts" I suggest a group of people are in some serious doodoo, because that is nailed on Tax evasion.

 

The plot thickens..

 

I think the second contract basically guarantees the EBT portion of the money & HMRC are already in possession of copies of such hidden contracts. The very fact they made the money in the EBTs contractually guaranteed is the nub of the problem as its against the law if how EBTs are to be used.

 

As for the SFA/SPL investigating these hidden contracts, till now they've only been interested in the unpaid tax side of the entire circus and I get the impression they would have been very happy if nobody chose to focus on the actual issue of secret contracts. And as has been stated on this thread recently, it opens a massive can of worms over the due diligence done by the SFA/SPL when registering the non-hidden portion of the contracts.

[djg001]

Will leave it to the RTC blog to uncover multiple contracts and remuneration.

 

If it is the case though that the SFA were complicit, surely it would need dissolved... Move the new headquarters to Edinburgh!!! Lol

[Cesni]

Just wondering...why should there even be a vote to parachute a newco into the SPL? shouldn't it be that Rangers cease to exist and no relegation happens with one promoted? Any newco surely should go through the usual channels. I don't see why there should even be the privalege of a vote?

[Imeantasong]

The consequences for this are massive if it pans out this way.

 

This could have been the difference between top 6 / bottom 6. The difference between relegation and survival. Difference between European football and not.

 

Basically the last 14 years off Scottish football could be about be become null and void with a lot of clubs potentially cheated out of one thing or another.

 

Regarding cup wins - how would that work exactly? Given that rangers will have eliminated folk at various different stages, who do you award the cups to? Just awarding it to the beaten finalist doesn't compensate whoever rangers beat in the 3rd, 4th quarter or semi final rounds does it....

 

Could get very messy.

Very true.

 

That's what makes me think they'd either just make them void, or at most award to the runner-ups for ease.

 

Still, nothing proven yet.

[Rick Grimes]

As I was only 5 in '92 I will celebrate by pretending to be a fireman and running around the garden making siren noises.

 

I was 16. I'll celebrate by trying, and most likely failing, to get my hole.

 

How times have changed.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[1874robbo]

Would we lose our final win in 98?

[Guest GhostHunter]

I wonder if these EBT's are created to offset the tax the players are supposed to be paying through their normal contracts...in effect giving them a tax free salary and making rangers extremely attractive to players to come and play for.

 

I always wondered how they managed to sign players like Gazza, Laudrup, Mols, Flo etc - now the penny is starting to drop.

 

Whilst the SFA/SPL have there many faults, Doncaster has actually played a blinder here - pre Administration, documents could be, ahem, misplaced, but now, with court appointed Administrators and a very public statement of intent - documents will quickly be handed over, and may in fact be part of whats been handed over to the Police.

 

Plus, the SPL would not kick off a high level investigation without mitigating evidence that there has been some wrongdoing already - we'll probably find that they already have initial documents - and remember - they only need to find one player since 1998 who has been given a secondary contract for payments, and their goose is cooked.

 

If proof exists - then Rangers FC will die, and any new company will be hard pushed to be granted a licence - the spotlight on them is going to be huge.

[jambovambo]

As I was only 5 in '92 I will celebrate by pretending to be a fireman and running around the garden making siren noises.

Top idea

 

Being the age I am, I'd celebrate with a nice cup of Horlicks and an early night.

[Guest GhostHunter]

PS - if the SPL find that the SFA were complicit in this, then they cant investigate the governing body, so I reckon we'll see an investigation coming from UEFA pretty shortly.

[Imeantasong]

Just wondering...why should there even be a vote to parachute a newco into the SPL? shouldn't it be that Rangers cease to exist and no relegation happens with one promoted? Any newco surely should go through the usual channels. I don't see why there should even be the privalege of a vote?

Because Rupert Murdoch's Sky might just not be too bothered about the integrity of the Scottish game, as long as they get their chosen product on our screens, with their determined cast list.

[Hagar the Horrible]

If they were to take the cup wins away from Rangers since 1998 then Queen of the South, Dundee, Aberdeen and Falkirk will have won it and Not Hibs

[Lovecraft]

I wonder if these EBT's are created to offset the tax the players are supposed to be paying through their normal contracts...in effect giving them a tax free salary and making rangers extremely attractive to players to come and play for.

 

I always wondered how they managed to sign players like Gazza, Laudrup, Mols, Flo etc - now the penny is starting to drop.

 

Whilst the SFA/SPL have there many faults, Doncaster has actually played a blinder here - pre Administration, documents could be, ahem, misplaced, but now, with court appointed Administrators and a very public statement of intent - documents will quickly be handed over, and may in fact be part of whats been handed over to the Police.

 

Plus, the SPL would not kick off a high level investigation without mitigating evidence that there has been some wrongdoing already - we'll probably find that they already have initial documents - and remember - they only need to find one player since 1998 who has been given a secondary contract for payments, and their goose is cooked.

 

If proof exists - then Rangers FC will die, and any new company will be hard pushed to be granted a licence - the spotlight on them is going to be huge.

 

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6901085.stm

[Imeantasong]

Would we lose our final win in 98?

For beating the cheats?

 

Nah, they may award us a double cup.

[1874robbo]

Aye man. That would make tonnes of sense.

 

 

 

 

It was only a question pal.

What teams did a cheating rangers put out in previous rounds?

If we are talking of injustices surely those teams have a case also.

[Imeantasong]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6901085.stm

I can't remember the full extent of the extensive journalistic investigation following this.

Edited March 5, 2012 by Imeantasong

[Socrates]

Would we lose our final win in 98?

No. Because we haven't systematically cheated for many years.

[Erik]

Aye man. That would make tonnes of sense.

 

That's the thing though, how far do you take it? Whilst we beat them fair and square in 98, what about the teams try disposed on en route to Parkhead? I'd imagine they might have something to say on the matter, no?

 

Like i said, the cup situation could get massively messy

[The People's Chimp]

Who knows what will happen after LIQUIDATION.

 

Gazza turns up with a fishing rod, rotisserie chicken and a few cans?

[Lovecraft]

I can't rememeber the full extent of the extensive journalistic investigation following this.

 

 

I'm guessing this is where the whole tax case stemmed from, getting hold of documents and emails.

[269miles]

They might not have to if this punter is correct.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk...g_live_ran.html

 

 

Matt Slater need to spend some quality time reading the RTC website and then he might have some idea of the reality of the situation facing Rangers.

[The Mighty Thor]

So Rangers are getting investigated by both the SFA and the SPL, SFA say that if found guilty of players having two contracts they will be chucked out of the SFA (and I presume all leagues in that case.) SPL could void all titles in their period if found guilty (and I imagine more if the SFA dont punish them first.)

 

So what we have here is a possible double whammy for Rangers. Either they face annhilation from the taxman winning the big tax case or they face being chucked out of Scottish football disgraced by the football authorities, or even better both. I cant see why anyone would now want to buy Rangers in their present state with more axes above Rangers.

 

 

I'd heard yesterday from an impeccable source that the meetings this week were nothing to do with voting a Newco anywhere instead it was trying to ascertain what to do with the Oldco once the full extent of the double-contract caper became apparent.

 

Suffice to say certain club chairmen who would have voted Newco straight in are now shitting bricks at the prospect of the revelations coming out scuppering their golden egg for next season.

 

The extent of the double-contract at Ibroke is apprently 'staggering' and that's from a Finance Director.

 

:greggy:

[Cesni]

Because Rupert Murdoch's Sky might just not be too bothered about the integrity of the Scottish game, as long as they get their chosen product on our screens, with their determined cast list.

 

I can understand the TV deal argument though I'm sure I heard we wouldn't lose that much with the top heavy distribution of tv rights. Develop youth, create a stronger national team in the process and in turn create a more competitive league. I still don't think sky/espn would pull out completely and a rangers of some sort would be back in 3-5 years. If our league is seriously dependant on one team cheating there way to victory after victory then it's sad days for us all

[Imeantasong]

I'd heard yesterday from an impeccable source that the meetings this week were nothing to do with voting a Newco anywhere instead it was trying to ascertain what to do with the Oldco once the full extent of the double-contract caper became apparent.

 

Suffice to say certain club chairmen who would have voted Newco straight in are now shitting bricks at the prospect of the revelations coming out scuppering their golden egg for next season.

 

The extent of the double-contract at Ibroke is apprently 'staggering' and that's from a Finance Director.

 

:greggy:

Like I said in a earlier post, looking like it's gonna be difficult for quite a few people.

[Imeantasong]

I can understand the TV deal argument though I'm sure I heard we wouldn't lose that much with the top heavy distribution of tv rights. Develop youth, create a stronger national team in the process and in turn create a more competitive league. I still don't think sky/espn would pull out completely and a rangers of some sort would be back in 3-5 years. If our league is seriously dependant on one team cheating there way to victory after victory then it's sad days for us all

Sure, agreed.

 

I was only replying to your "why" question.

[Lovecraft]

Like I said in a earlier post, looking like it's gonna be difficult for quite a few people.

 

 

Yep, now the world is looking in, there are gonna be a lot of people sweating their little blue balls off, and the rest are gonna have to look like they are doing something about it, including all the shitty so called journalists in Scotland; which is why we have suddenly seen a huge swing in the reporting recently.

 

Superb.

Edited March 5, 2012 by Lovecraft

[jamboinglasgow]

Because Rupert Murdoch's Sky might just not be too bothered about the integrity of the Scottish game, as long as they get their chosen product on our screens, with their determined cast list.

 

On a sidenote, I was thinking last night that there are similarities between the Sun/News of the World scandal and the Rangers crisis. Both big institiutions in Scotland/Britain, both despised by people but are still got a large following, both after an inital incident (adminstration for Rangers, phone hacking trials) are exposing a rotten core and practices. Everyday something worse is coming out in the press. Both rapidly losing credibility, and both have to grasp with the ultimate fact that to solve this problem they may have to be shut down.

[269miles]

I'm a bit confused by this.

 

We have a case going on involving HMRC about players wages being paid abroad as a way to reduce tax ?

 

We are now being told that players may have more than one contract ?

 

Surely HMRC where made aware of these "other contracts" during what was obviously a serious investigation. If not, then it will throw the "big tax" case into total chaos.

 

If the Revenue knew about these "other contracts" then why has this not been made public or why has the league not been informed until now.

Anything uncovered in the BTC (or any tax investigation) is strictly confidential and cannot be disclosed to anyone else. I'm not sure if this applies in the event of criminal wrongdoing but HMRC wouldn't be giving a toss about RFC breaching the SFA articles of association. There's no obligation on HMRC to disclose this , assuming they knew. In fact , it's the reverse. However , IF RFC didn't disclose this to the HMRC then presumably they could be open to a criminal prosecution.

I'd like to know what the SPL/SFA have got their hands on that brought about the investigation. As above , it can't be (it certainly shouldn't be) emanating from HMRCs investigation.

 

If the Revenue where not unaware of these "other contracts" I suggest a group of people are in some serious doodoo, because that is nailed on Tax evasion.

 

The plot thickens..

 

 

This whole case is beginning to make the JFK assassination look like a walk in the park.

[Imeantasong]

Yep, now the world is looking in, there are gonna be a lot of people sweating their little blue balls off, and the rest are gonna have to look like they are doing something about it, including all the shitty so called journalists in Scotland; which is why we have suddenly seen a huge swing in the reporting recently.

 

Superb.

It is superb isn't it.

 

Getting beyond points where reporters and club owners can justify ignoring it.

 

Even thick as sheit pundits will have to come round, if they can be battered into submission.

[Wee Frah]

I was 16. I'll celebrate by trying, and most likely failing, to get my hole.

 

How times have changed.

 

 

Id be the same, and doing the same, with added drinking MD 20/20 in a bus shelter.

[leginten]

I'd heard yesterday from an impeccable source that the meetings this week were nothing to do with voting a Newco anywhere instead it was trying to ascertain what to do with the Oldco once the full extent of the double-contract caper became apparent.

 

Suffice to say certain club chairmen who would have voted Newco straight in are now shitting bricks at the prospect of the revelations coming out scuppering their golden egg for next season.

 

The extent of the double-contract at Ibroke is apprently 'staggering' and that's from a Finance Director.

 

:greggy:

 

As someone who wants the book thrown at Rangers in every conceivable way and for them to suffer right and fitting consequences of their cheating and illegalities, I have to say that my main worry now is the craven, short-sighted "can't do without Rangers" mentality it seems many club chairmen will be adopting if and when it comes to a vote. They're a bloody Trojan Horse.

[Imeantasong]

As someone who wants the book thrown at Rangers in every conceivable way and for them to suffer right and fitting consequences of their cheating and illegalities, I have to say that my main worry now is the craven, short-sighted "can't do without Rangers" mentality it seems many club chairmen will be adopting if and when it comes to a vote. They're a bloody Trojan Horse.

Fan power?

 

We can all just vent off on forums, or petition our clubs when the full extent is known and judged.

[Cesni]

Sure, agreed.

 

I was only replying to your "why" question.

 

Of course and thanks. The 'smug' face was unintentional and was meant to be a sad face!? Can tell I don't post a lot

[Walter Bishop]

If your looking for a laugh, sit back relax and have a look at this site, 100% Comedy gold .... http://forum.rangersmedia.co.uk/index.php?showforum=1

 

 

They are more deluded than the tramps from Leith.

[leginten]

Fan power?

 

We can all just vent off on forums, or petition our clubs when the full extent is known and judged.

 

Fan power is a problem in Scotland, isn't it? As in: we have none. Even a club like ours has no unified supporters' club body, and as for taking joint action with fans of other clubs...

 

High time supporters of all clubs got together and made their feelings known.

 

Someone suggested mass non-renewal of STs across all SPL clubs if Rangers come out of this smelling of roses, but it could only work if it was a mass movement, in other words if it was clear that it was a move aimed at making the entire SPL unworkable rather than just hurting your own club.

[Imeantasong]

Of course and thanks. The 'smug' face was unintentional and was meant to be a sad face!? Can tell I don't post a lot

Just hope we don't end up with eggs on our face.

 

But the chances of a total whitewash are appearing slimmer every day

[PsychocAndy]

In 92 I would have got guttered on about ?30, now I dont drink I think with the increase prices of alcohol, it would take me about ?25 to get guttered when we are given the league.

[weaz1981]

If your looking for a laugh, sit back relax and have a look at this site, 100% Comedy gold .... http://forum.rangersmedia.co.uk/index.php?showforum=1

 

 

They are more deluded than the tramps from Leith.

 

Not pretending I like the tims but I love how they are all calling Celtic 'tainted'. What a bunch of idiots - Rangers are now, or at least will be the most tainted team in UK history.

[The Mighty Thor]

As someone who wants the book thrown at Rangers in every conceivable way and for them to suffer right and fitting consequences of their cheating and illegalities, I have to say that my main worry now is the craven, short-sighted "can't do without Rangers" mentality it seems many club chairmen will be adopting if and when it comes to a vote. They're a bloody Trojan Horse.

 

From the conversation i had yesterday, club chairmen are going to have a hell of a job returning der Hun back into the SFL let alone the SPL.

 

I know for a fact that certain 'sympathetic clubs' are now, for the first time, seriously examining the possibility of a SPL without Rangers and how they can balance the books without the 3,000 knuckledraggers twice a season. Apparently this eventuality had not hitherto crossed their minds.

 

This pleases me no end.

[Prince Buaben]

Would we lose our final win in 98?

 

Why ?

[Feeno]

I would have been ten back in 92 and as a resident of East Lothian would have been celebrating with 6 cans of cheap omega cider and a couple mild Hamlets!