Scary stuff

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

Webmaster, can you confirm if this persons user id has been banned or at least suspended pending the court case?

[tedp6873]

Tom, I'm not sure what you've read into my post (or if I've phrased it badly) but I was answering Shaun Lawson's hypothetical question.

 

In case there's any ambiguity, I think he's a horrific sex beast who should be locked away and children should be protected from predators like him.

 

 

Yeah i know just re read your thread m8 and i would tottally agree with you he should be locked away... i do know he has been put on the Sex offenders reg as he should be.....

[Walter Payton]

lol i suppose being in oz you never heard about big jock

 

I don't live in Oz anymore.

I have a Season Ticket in Section N, and have definitely heard "about Big Jock".

I don't make assumptions about Celtic fans because of what happened at Celtic Boys Club.

If somebody made assumptions about me or Hearts because of what this guy has done, I would make another assumption just as fast that they were an imbecile and their opinion wasn't worth worrying about.

[Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC]

Does anyone else think this guys PMs to and from members of the board should be investigated?

 

For all we know he could be grooming another wee lassie.

[shaun.lawson]

I would be equally disgusted by her actions. Generally speaking 14 year old girls are more mature than 14 year old boys, and while a 14 year old boy's peers might backslap and congratulate him, I think there's a lot more to sex than just the physical act (for males and females) and for both genders the law being set at age 16 for consent isn't a judgement of physical readiness but more emotional maturity.

 

Any adult that puts their own sexual satisfaction (and lets face it, he wasn't really looking for companionship) ahead of wanting to protect a child's right to grow up and mature at an appropriate rate deserves to be locked up.

 

I agree with all of this - especially the part about sex involving much more than just something physical. Indeed, it's actually the reason why I've often wondered whether the age of consent is too low: are people really emotionally ready for sex come their 16th birthday?

 

I ask because of something that happened to me many years ago. Our family had a French au pair: nothing special to look at, but still the subject of fantasies for a 13-year-old boy! Her bedroom was on one side of the hall landing, mine was on the other; and there were also two upstairs toilets: one next to her room, the other along the corridor from mine. Late one night, I needed the toilet, and thoughtlessly, went to the loo naked. Just after I'd shut the toilet door, I heard the other one close too - and the split second I emerged, so did she: and she was also naked.

 

A moment of cringeworthy embarrassment for us both, you'd think? Except that I froze - and she, no doubt getting off on the fact I had a crush on her, started beckoning me towards her. I took one step forward: then panicked, and bolted back to my room.

 

But the thing is, whenever I've thought about it since, I've never considered her to be a 'beast' or anything like that. I think her behaviour was stupid - reckless, even, and extremely confusing to a 13 year-old lad like I was - but hardly abusive. Who knows: had I actually followed her directions, she might well have just laughed and sent me packing - but she certainly seemed serious. And the bizarre thing is, though her behaviour was obviously unacceptable according to society's norms, had something actually happened, I'd probably have been considered the school hero: which is wrong, but that's why I posed the question above.

[boabyarsebiscuit]

Does anyone else think this guys PMs to and from members of the board should be investigated?

 

For all we know he could be grooming another wee lassie.

I recently got an email from Admin of another board I go on listing a series of accounts that they'd closed. Top of the list, WAJ. Perhaps that forum had already been contacted by the Police?

[Sooperstar]

Webmaster, can you confirm if this persons user id has been banned or at least suspended pending the court case?

 

I'm sure he'll have been banned straight away.

 

As for pending the court case - the court case is over, he admitted his beast status immediately and all that is left is for him to be sentenced.

[shaun.lawson]

Any chance of a quick edit to what you wrote above, BAB? Bearing in mind what the mods have told us and all that...?

[boabyarsebiscuit]

Any chance of a quick edit to what you wrote above, BAB? Bearing in mind what the mods have told us and all that...?

 

Unpossible.

[Rawrrrrrrr]

He has stopped posting on the sites- at least using his old ID

 

Most likely because it got out, their were allegations flying around at the time which were removed

 

He probably just moved onto another name, I certainly would suggest the mods should be permanently banning any IP he has access too but then id imagine any sentence will bar him from doing similar things again

[coppercrutch]

I agree with all of this - especially the part about sex involving much more than just something physical. Indeed, it's actually the reason why I've often wondered whether the age of consent is too low: are people really emotionally ready for sex come their 16th birthday?

 

I ask because of something that happened to me many years ago. Our family had a French au pair: nothing special to look at, but still the subject of fantasies for a 13-year-old boy! Her bedroom was on one side of the hall landing, mine was on the other; and there were also two upstairs toilets: one next to her room, the other along the corridor from mine. Late one night, I needed the toilet, and thoughtlessly, went to the loo naked. Just after I'd shut the toilet door, I heard the other one close too - and the split second I emerged, so did she: and she was also naked.

 

A moment of cringeworthy embarrassment for us both, you'd think? Except that I froze - and she, no doubt getting off on the fact I had a crush on her, started beckoning me towards her. I took one step forward: then panicked, and bolted back to my room.

 

But the thing is, whenever I've thought about it since, I've never considered her to be a 'beast' or anything like that. I think her behaviour was stupid - reckless, even, and extremely confusing to a 13 year-old lad like I was - but hardly abusive. Who knows: had I actually followed her directions, she might well have just laughed and sent me packing - but she certainly seemed serious. And the bizarre thing is, though her behaviour was obviously unacceptable according to society's norms, had something actually happened, I'd probably have been considered the school hero: which is wrong, but that's why I posed the question above.

 

That sounds like a cracking porno !! You should have done it. The ending would have been much better.

 

And in response to your previous hypothetical question:

 

If a 20 year old bird had wanted me to meet up for sex when I was 14 ?

 

I would have jumped at the chance !!! Does that make me a beast too.

[Taffin]

Yeh that was a bloody awful statement from me.

 

Not going to make any excuses, and and I sincerely apologise to all.

 

I will make no further posts on this thread and possibly this site.

[shaun.lawson]

That sounds like a cracking porno !! You should have done it. The ending would have been much better.

 

And in response to your previous hypothetical question:

 

If a 20 year old bird had wanted me to meet up for sex when I was 14 ?

 

I would have jumped at the chance !!! Does that make me a beast too.

 

Many a time I've thought about it and regretted what I did (or rather, didn't do): many a time! And I can't blame you for responding to my hypothetical question like that either: it's human nature, and sums up the fine lines and grey areas which sometimes (though only sometimes) apply with issues such as this.

[Walter Payton]

I recently got an email from Admin of another board I go on listing a series of accounts that they'd closed. Top of the list, WAJ. Perhaps that forum had already been contacted by the Police?

 

Think the other board deleted accounts because the owners of those accounts were uncontactable by e-mail rather than any reason related to this.

[Walter Payton]

Many a time I've thought about it and regretted what I did (or rather, didn't do): many a time! And I can't blame you for responding to my hypothetical question like that either: it's human nature, and sums up the fine lines and grey areas which sometimes (though only sometimes) apply with issues such as this.

 

There's no doubt most 14 year olds would jump at the chance of a French au Pair (unless she was as overweight as the "man" in question!)! I don't think that creates any grey areas though- if she hadn't been willing, it would have been a case of rape, and not just statutory rape.

 

The law's spot on in regards to this IMO (I know you're not arguing with this!)- He took advantage of somebody who couldn't possibly be in full possesion of all the facts (no sex ed classes are a substitute for wisdom gained through the aging process) and there should be no possible defence of "she wanted it too".

 

The responsibility lay entirely with him and he should answer for it.

[Pants Shaton]

I'd be grateful if the mods could let us know the username. I recently watched a channel 4 documentary which showed how 'paedoes' can make computer keyboards secrete a gas which makes you more suggestible. I'd hate to think I've been targeted, even though I'm a 29 year old man.

[coppercrutch]

Yeh that was a bloody awful statement from me.

 

Not going to make any excuses, and and I sincerely apologise to all.

 

I will make no further posts on this thread and possibly this site.

 

Don't be an idiot !! Yes it was rather crude but I have to say I did snigger a little. But I am a sick man.

 

Did I tell you about the 58 year old bird in the toilets of the Ardmillan Hotel............

 

Actually that sort of makes me the opposite of the the current Gorgie sex pest......I was raped by a granny

[Guest gorgie kev]

Sheesh - everyone knows to go to the cemetery up Ardmillan.

 

No,its up beside Jemimas pantry when ya pull a skank in Robbos

[Guest gorgie kev]

Don't be an idiot !! Yes it was rather crude but I have to say I did snigger a little. But I am a sick man.

 

Did I tell you about the 58 year old bird in the toilets of the Ardmillan Hotel............

 

Actually that sort of makes me the opposite of the the current Gorgie sex pest......I was raped by a granny

 

Yeah and we have seen the video as well-You did NOT put in a good performance:wavey:

[coppercrutch]

Yeah and we have seen the video as well-You did NOT put in a good performance:wavey:

 

I didn't video that one. I was too shocked with the granny in question !!

[bilstonjambo]

Do you think that WEE man from AIRDRIE who's a JAMBO will be taking up his usual seat in section T behind the home dugout on saturday?

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

I didn't video that one. I was too shocked with the granny in question !!

 

You didnt but i did!

[Tazio]

Do you think that WEE man from AIRDRIE who's a JAMBO will be taking up his usual seat in section T behind the home dugout on saturday?

 

He's a brave boy if he does. Though I imagine the club will be instigating a lifetime ban from Tynecastle in consultation with the police.

[Rawrrrrrrr]

Do you think that WEE man from AIRDRIE who's a JAMBO will be taking up his usual seat in section T behind the home dugout on saturday?

 

 

Dont be silly

 

Maybe the 2 usual seats:rolleyes:

 

Or maybe he will go in N1 again

 

Although Id suspect he will be in hiding awaiting safety in segregation

[I P Knightley]

I'd be grateful if the mods could let us know the username. I recently watched a channel 4 documentary which showed how 'paedoes' can make computer keyboards secrete a gas which makes you more suggestible. I'd hate to think I've been targeted, even though I'm a 29 year old man.

 

A quick search of the Members List shows a vacancy in the usernames for a Jambo hailing from North Lanarkshire. All the better if he or she's not particularly big and wants to be identified by his or her smallness.

 

Yes folks, "TitchyHertzboyfaeCoatbridge" still hasn't been taken.

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

Webmaster, can you confirm if this persons user id has been banned or at least suspended pending the court case?

 

any word on this webmaster (or other mod etc)?

[Spellczech]

The outpourings of disgust remind me of the Rix debates. The norms of society tell us that these guys are wrong and have committed a crime but in both cases the girls would have been post-pubescent so I?m not sure about the "disgusting" tag as applied by many. Personally I?ll save that kind of attitude for the real beast who gets turned on by pre-pubescents. What I will say is that someone who cannot see mental immaturity in a 14 year old must be pretty damned immature himself. Someone who seduces women, or girls on the net must be both lonely and lacking in the social skills that most of us take forgranted...Is he a danger to society? Well our country?s society says he is, somewhere like the Netherlands might not. The circumstances of this case as reported make me think that this person ought to be punished as he forced the issue of physical intimacy (if you can call a tryst in the bogs at Tynie and on Gorgie Road "intimacy") and he ought not to have done so.

 

Is this case worse than Rix? Well the age difference says no, but the details and general grubbiness of his actions probably says yes...I can also accept that some people enjoy public sex even in places as unsalubrious as public toilets, so perhaps my sniffing at that is just that I prefer slightly cleaner places than receptacles of pee and pooh for getting jiggy...

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, so don?t think I am criticising those who feel disgust at the guy?s actions. My own are more a sense of pity, that someone could be so obviously sad, and that PERHAPS a girl has been hurt by what happened. My own opinion is that this guy needs taught a lesson about what is acceptable and that laws are there for a reason and should be adhered to. Whether being stuck in prison with a bunch of like-minded individuals will provide that lesson? Well I have my doubts...

[Guest czechmate]

Yeh that was a bloody awful statement from me.

 

Not going to make any excuses, and and I sincerely apologise to all.

 

I will make no further posts on this thread and possibly this site.

 

Your breaking my heart fella!

[Rab]

I'm not saying what he done was right, far from it. It was wrong, stupid and my opinion of the guy is that he is a very sad individual.

I was just pointing out the difference in cultures and the fact that if it happened elsewhere, nothing would have seemed 'wrong' about it.

The Jambo from Airdrie is undoubtedly in the wrong here, and should be punished accordingly. However, I don't think he should be made out to some sort of a paedophile.

 

I also never used the word "good" once.

 

Are you serious?

 

A 13 year old girl?

 

And you think that the only thing that makes it wrong is that it happened in Scotland?

 

And that he's not a pedophile?

 

Really?

 

Genuine question, and I'd really like an answer to this:

 

How old are you?

[Rab]

 

Genuine question, and I'd really like an answer to this:

 

How old are you?

 

Never mind, I saw you posted it later in the thread.

 

It's what I expected to be honest.

 

Try having a 13 year old daughter/sister (when ur much older) and see if you're so interested in 'debate' if the same happens to her.

[boabyarsebiscuit]

I've seen mod activity on this thread on the rights and wrongs of naming the sexual offender in question. I've seen nothing in response to requests from members to clarify whether this convicted sexual predator is currently free to groom under age females on this forum or not. Is he or isn't he?

[djf]

As far as i'm aware pedophiles are attracted to pre-pubescent children.

 

So pervert yes, pedophile no.

[Makween]

The outpourings of disgust remind me of the Rix debates. The norms of society tell us that these guys are wrong and have committed a crime but in both cases the girls would have been post-pubescent so I?m not sure about the "disgusting" tag as applied by many. Personally I?ll save that kind of attitude for the real beast who gets turned on by pre-pubescents. What I will say is that someone who cannot see mental immaturity in a 14 year old must be pretty damned immature himself. Someone who seduces women, or girls on the net must be both lonely and lacking in the social skills that most of us take forgranted...Is he a danger to society? Well our country?s society says he is, somewhere like the Netherlands might not. The circumstances of this case as reported make me think that this person ought to be punished as he forced the issue of physical intimacy (if you can call a tryst in the bogs at Tynie and on Gorgie Road "intimacy") and he ought not to have done so.

 

Is this case worse than Rix? Well the age difference says no, but the details and general grubbiness of his actions probably says yes...I can also accept that some people enjoy public sex even in places as unsalubrious as public toilets, so perhaps my sniffing at that is just that I prefer slightly cleaner places than receptacles of pee and pooh for getting jiggy...

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, so don?t think I am criticising those who feel disgust at the guy?s actions. My own are more a sense of pity, that someone could be so obviously sad, and that PERHAPS a girl has been hurt by what happened. My own opinion is that this guy needs taught a lesson about what is acceptable and that laws are there for a reason and should be adhered to. Whether being stuck in prison with a bunch of like-minded individuals will provide that lesson? Well I have my doubts...

 

Totally disagree. Thirteen year olds are very much still children, regardless of whether or not they've got hair on their *****. At 20, it's not like he was only a couple of years older - if he was even, say, 16, I'd agree with you.

[Walter Payton]

As far as i'm aware pedophiles are attracted to pre-pubescent children.

 

So pervert yes, pedophile no.

 

I think paedo just means child, so that would apply in this case.

[Toggie88]

Are you serious?

 

A 13 year old girl?

 

And you think that the only thing that makes it wrong is that it happened in Scotland?

 

And that he's not a pedophile?

 

Really?

 

Genuine question, and I'd really like an answer to this:

 

How old are you?

 

I don't think you've understood my point. I said it was wrong but I was also contrasting what is deemed as wrong here, is not elsewhere. I intended for debate to be on that subject (ages of consent), not this case in question - which has quite obviously upset a lot people, including myself.

I don't believe this can be defined as peadophilia, well at least it won't be considered that in a court of law - I could be wrong however.

 

I apologies if I have cause any offence, none was intended.

[doctor jambo]

I don't think you've understood my point. I said it was wrong but I was also contrasting what is deemed as wrong here, is not elsewhere. I intended for debate to be on that subject (ages of consent), not this case in question - which has quite obviously upset a lot people, including myself.

I don't believe this can be defined as peadophilia, well at least it won't be considered that in a court of law - I could be wrong however.

 

I apologies if I have cause any offence, none was intended.

 

You need to think in broader terms Toggie

Just because something is legal in one country does not make something even vaguely comparable to ours

Laws reflect the common shared values of a society

For instance would you be happy if the girl in question was stoned to death because of what happened to her- thats what would happen in, say, the Sudan, or perhaps thrashed with canes as they would do in Saudi?

the guy, whether you accept it or not is a grooming, predatory paedophile. End of story

[Cesnauskis+10]

The thread is being allowed to run...

 

Please DO NOT make any references to the member allegedly in question, as this contravenes board rules.

 

Webmaster

 

Are we allowed to post threads titled something like "FAO Webmaster"?

[I P Knightley]

Is this case worse than Rix? Well the age difference says no, but the details and general grubbiness of his actions probably says yes...

QUOTE]

 

I don't know that the cases should be compared looking for an answer to the question which is wrong-er.

 

I have heard that Rix could have put up a much stouter defence (or mitigating circumstances) for his actions which would have put him in a much more forgiveable light. However, he recognised the one fact (that he had sex with someone under 16 - a fact he may not have known) and to put forward the mitigating factors would not have reversed that and would, in all likelihood have caused distress to the girl in question. Therefore he pled guilty, without embellishment, to the charge of having sex with a minor.

 

The guy in this story has admitted to what we know as 'grooming' in the full knowledge that the lassie is very under age. I don't know him nor do any of his posts on JKB stick out in my mind (and he's gone from the members' list - I assume due to moderator/webmaster intervention) but I'm picking up from what others say that he's maybe not the full shilling. I'm no lefty tree-hugging sappy liberal by any means but I suspect that this guy needs a little more help and education rather than a damn good kicking.

 

Two very, very different cases.

 

My reason for introducing the Rix angle to the debate earlier was to counter the (valid) question raised about whether it was maybe ok for a 20-year-old to do this to a 14-year-old. The point was that the JKB community seemed all too happy to jump on the "Rix = paedo" without question of whether there may have been more to the story. It seemed to me inconsistent. That's all.

[coppercrutch]

You need to think in broader terms Toggie

Just because something is legal in one country does not make something even vaguely comparable to ours

Laws reflect the common shared values of a society

For instance would you be happy if the girl in question was stoned to death because of what happened to her- thats what would happen in, say, the Sudan, or perhaps thrashed with canes as they would do in Saudi?

the guy, whether you accept it or not is a grooming, predatory paedophile. End of story

 

Come on Doc, you are totally screwing this debate.

 

The countries in question where this particular act would have been deemed legal are Spain and Japan. Countries with similar* attitudes to life and women.

 

To compare what happens in Saudi Arabia to what happens in Spain is quite honestly nonsense. IMO.

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Spain ? Reasonable,

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Saudi ? Unreasonable. Different Worlds - never mind different countries.

 

Anyway I agree with DJF. IMO the guy in question is a pervert, not a peadophile. Not quite sure how putting him in prison is going to help anyone. If I have read correctly the female in question even wants to get back with him.

 

 

 

* Vague of course but no 2 countries are the same.

[doctor jambo]

Come on Doc, you are totally screwing this debate.

 

The countries in question where this particular act would have been deemed legal are Spain and Japan. Countries with similar* attitudes to life and women.

 

To compare what happens in Saudi Arabia to what happens in Spain is quite honestly nonsense. IMO.

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Spain ? Reasonable,

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Saudi ? Unreasonable. Different Worlds - never mind different countries.

 

Anyway I agree with DJF. IMO the guy in question is a pervert, not a peadophile. Not quite sure how putting him in prison is going to help anyone. If I have read correctly the female in question even wants to get back with him.

 

 

 

* Vague of course but no 2 countries are the same.

 

 

Japan and the UK are not comparable, especially wiht regards to sexual tastes. NOt by any stretch of any imagination

Feet binding, fetishism, school girls pants by mail order, never mind the fake train carriages you can pay to stand in and feel up the "other passangers"

 

So that leaves Spain as a comparison, and I'm pretty sure that even there no-one would be happy with a 20 year old man texting pics of his boaber to a 13/14 year old and indulging in public indecency with her, after a careful grooming

Had he met her in a pub, the pair of them been steemin, not known her age and taken her home for a one night stand, there MAY be mitigation

What he did was groom her for a period of time (psychological rape) before commiting his crime

These kind of behaviours are recurrent, and he will be high risk of doing it again

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

I've seen mod activity on this thread on the rights and wrongs of naming the sexual offender in question. I've seen nothing in response to requests from members to clarify whether this convicted sexual predator is currently free to groom under age females on this forum or not. Is he or isn't he?

 

 

Dissapointed in the mods here, quick enough to jump on us if we name someone that has not posted yet not confiming if "predator" is still free to use these boards.

 

I can still recall getting emails reminding me to watch my posts as its a family board. Wont be a family board for long if parents find out people like him are still free to post.

[Walter Payton]

Dissapointed in the mods here, quick enough to jump on us if we name someone that has not posted yet not confiming if "predator" is still free to use these boards.

 

I can still recall getting emails reminding me to watch my posts as its a family board. Wont be a family board for long if parents find out people like him are still free to post.

 

Had a quick look at the members list (available at the top of the page). His account has been deleted, and I'd assume he'll be banned from frequenting any messageboards (or even from using the internet) by subsequent court orders.

[dodethejambo]

Come on Doc, you are totally screwing this debate.

 

The countries in question where this particular act would have been deemed legal are Spain and Japan. Countries with similar* attitudes to life and women.

 

To compare what happens in Saudi Arabia to what happens in Spain is quite honestly nonsense. IMO.

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Spain ? Reasonable,

 

Comparing attitudes between the UK and Saudi ? Unreasonable. Different Worlds - never mind different countries.

 

Anyway I agree with DJF. IMO the guy in question is a pervert, not a peadophile. Not quite sure how putting him in prison is going to help anyone. If I have read correctly the female in question even wants to get back with him.

 

 

 

* Vague of course but no 2 countries are the same.

 

 

It may stop him from 'Grooming' another child or having sex with a child while he's locked-up.

[Guest S.U.S.S.]

Had a quick look at the members list (available at the top of the page). His account has been deleted, and I'd assume he'll be banned from frequenting any messageboards (or even from using the internet) by subsequent court orders.

 

Thanks for the info, still feel the admin team let us down here.

[Dr. Bapswent]

Let he who is not without sin....

 

tsk tsk tsk

[coppercrutch]

Japan and the UK are not comparable, especially wiht regards to sexual tastes. NOt by any stretch of any imagination

Feet binding, fetishism, school girls pants by mail order, never mind the fake train carriages you can pay to stand in and feel up the "other passangers"

 

So that leaves Spain as a comparison, and I'm pretty sure that even there no-one would be happy with a 20 year old man texting pics of his boaber to a 13/14 year old and indulging in public indecency with her, after a careful grooming

Had he met her in a pub, the pair of them been steemin, not known her age and taken her home for a one night stand, there MAY be mitigation

What he did was groom her for a period of time (psychological rape) before commiting his crime

These kind of behaviours are recurrent, and he will be high risk of doing it again

 

 

Not arguing with most of what you say Doc.

 

But you must admit that comparing our views on Women in the UK to those in Saudi is a bit much....

[coppercrutch]

It may stop him from 'Grooming' another child or having sex with a child while he's locked-up.

 

Well that is your opinion. Whilst 14 is a very young age to be doing these sort of things I personally would class what happened here as very very different to someone abusing an 8 year old.

 

We all agree that what he did was wrong. But the fact that the female in question had no problems with it and is actually wanting to get back with him after his release SHOULD mean people can see this for what it is.

 

IMO (From the facts I have heard) this was not a case of a person 'grooming a child'. Some may argue that for a 20 year old man to act in this way he could be classed as quite 'childlike' himself.

 

But we all have different opinions.

[Dr. Bapswent]

It may stop him from 'Grooming' another child or having sex with a child while he's locked-up.

 

Where is the evidence that he was grooming anyone...and not that she was fully compliant about the whole thing?

[tedp6873]

As CC mentioned above it has been reported that the young girl will wait on him, now not sure if thats a good thing or bad.

[Makween]

Where is the evidence that he was grooming anyone...and not that she was fully compliant about the whole thing?

 

Whether she was compliant or not is irrelevant - it's still grooming. Even if she was totally infatuated with him (which I doubt, he was a fat ugly ****), he's still taking advantage of her immaturity to get her to meet him from the internet, so it was still grooming.

 

People are going on about "pervert, not paedophile" here, but that's a purely pedantic point which is really of no relevance. She was, by all accounts, 13 years old when he started grooming her - at 13, you're still very much a child, physically and mentally.

 

I remember one of the points several people made during the Rix debates was that a lot of girls under 16 look substantially older. This is true to an extent, but at 13? I doubt it. Either way, even when they have looked older, I've never met a girl that age who wasn't still a child in terms of behaviour.

 

The guy's a beast. Whether or not, in terms of semantics, he'd be classed as a paedophile as opposed to a pervert is irrelevant.