Naismith/McAvoy/Forrest confirmed as management team - contracted to 2025 (title updated)

[DETTY29]

42 minutes ago, jtkb said:

Also only a few weeks for pre season would expect first team coach involved in prep for this. And agreed if it is the old ' The best candidate  was in the building all along ' That would be a joke. If we do pop a decent experienced coach then may be worth taking 2 months I supose

So names mentioned...ofc rumoured rubbish or just put out there on here.

 

Knutson.....now an Ajax candidate.

 

Wilder a candidate for many Championship and 'big' League 1 teams that struggle to learn lessons and despite similar t/o to Hearts, their football playing budget outweighs ours by a long way.

 

Alex Neil (who I think will be Savage's preference) didn't get sacked by Stoke and paid off as many has hoped and instead of him being compensated by Stoke by now, would mean us compensating Stoke and paying Neil more than we anticipated.

 

Cifuentes who some folk thought 'oh aye, interesting' has a poor start to season after losing his 5 top players now don't want him, with even calls of 'another Neilson clone'

 

In 2017, I cant remember who the 4 rumoured candidates were but I'm sure the preferred one was Dougie Freedman followed by final interviews going Owen Coyle, Billy Davies (who I saw going to his interview) and an other.

 

Freedman ended up as Sporting Director at Premiership club Ctrystal where he has a near career long relationshipship.

 

Davies and Coyle would've been hounded by the first poor result.

 

Just sometimes you can do all the due diligence in the world and end up with an internal candidate as times catches up on you.

 

We could of course put someone really crap in just now and await the managerial sacking merry go round to await who you wanted all along.

 

As a PS I do wonder if someone with Lauder, Gala, Berwick,Falkirk (promotions and relegation) on their CV would be accepted on here nowadays for the job.

Edited June 5, 2023 by DETTY29

[Hampden Demolition]

While they have had a poor start this year, Cifuentes has a 54% win rate at Hammarby which isn’t bad going considering they aren’t one of the bigger clubs in the league. Also wants to play attractive football. Also got them to a cup final and into Europe.

[Sertse]

 

 

 

[Pasquale for King]

2 minutes ago, Sertse said:

 

 

 

Just beat me to it 👍🏽😆

[Pasquale for King]

3 minutes ago, Hampden Demolition said:

While they have had a poor start this year, Cifuentes has a 54% win rate at Hammarby which isn’t bad going considering they aren’t one of the bigger clubs in the league. Also wants to play attractive football. Also got them to a cup final and into Europe.

Was there not some information from their version of JKB saying that was a lot of nonsense and sounds eerily similar to RNs style of play?

[Unknown user]

I want Naismith, but a lot of that is that we either use him or lose him.

 

He has a better chance of being a really good manager than most, and I'd rather he got the chance with us than against us. If his skills don't translate to results, so be it, but that's the risk you take with any manager.

[jamboinglasgow]

11 minutes ago, Sertse said:

 

 

 

 

Having read it and another article about it in the Sun, I would caution people to take this to mean Naismith has got it. It more makes sense that with a decision expected this week that he sticks around, especially as he is a front runner. The Sun talks about how he will join up with the Scotland squad if he doesn't get it.

[Hampden Demolition]

10 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Was there not some information from their version of JKB saying that was a lot of nonsense and sounds eerily similar to RNs style of play?

I’m not going to pretend i have watched much of them because I haven’t. Looking at their stats, they average around 56% possession and just over 2 goals per game.

[Newton51]

Sounds like there is a split between the board. I was convinced Naismith  Would have been confirmed right after the last game but seems they are unsure. If we came 3rd would have been done by now. 

[sac]

12 minutes ago, jamboinglasgow said:

 

Having read it and another article about it in the Sun, I would caution people to take this to mean Naismith has got it. It more makes sense that with a decision expected this week that he sticks around, especially as he is a front runner. The Sun talks about how he will join up with the Scotland squad if he doesn't get it.

Does sound like it. Club would also know that this would be in the media, unless SN has made an assumption about getting the job and jumped the gun.

 

[chrystaf]

41 minutes ago, Smithee said:

I want Naismith, but a lot of that is that we either use him or lose him.

 

He has a better chance of being a really good manager than most, and I'd rather he got the chance with us than against us. If his skills don't translate to results, so be it, but that's the risk you take with any manager.

Says  it all.

[Carter]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

I want Naismith, but a lot of that is that we either use him or lose him.

 

He has a better chance of being a really good manager than most, and I'd rather he got the chance with us than against us. If his skills don't translate to results, so be it, but that's the risk you take with any manager.

I agree with this. The difficult part was getting Naismith in the building in the first place. Clearly the most complex transfer to conclude of the Budge era. You then see how he interacts and conducts himself day to day. Clearly well enough to entrust him with the last 7 games if a season that had gone alarmingly sideways. 

 

I hope someone at the club isn't trying to be too clever right now. 

[Jodami]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

I want Naismith, but a lot of that is that we either use him or lose him.

 

He has a better chance of being a really good manager than most, and I'd rather he got the chance with us than against us. If his skills don't translate to results, so be it, but that's the risk you take with any manager.

Not having a go at all but intrigued by this view that Naismith has a better chance of being a really good manager than most. Where is the evidence of this? Coaches who have become successful tend not to be decent players (Guardiola excepted!) and they also take the time to fully learn their trade at lower levels before progressing up the ladder. 

I may have missed something but I don't recall Naismith being a particularly supportive team mate either, his MO in many games with us was blaming others for what at times were often his own failings. 

I see the attraction in appointing him as assistant to an experienced coach to help him learn but if he chose to leave if he didn't get the job then fair enough. His contract has ran out and I doubt whether we would be paying the kind of money he was on to anyone other than a manager in any case.

Edited June 5, 2023 by Jodami

[David McCaig]

1 minute ago, Jodami said:

Not having a go at all but intrigued by this view that Naismith has a better chance of being a really good manager than most. Where is the evidence of this? Coaches who have become successful tend not to be decent players (Guardiola excepted!) and they also take the time fully learn their trade at lower levels before progressing up the ladder. 

I may have missed something but I don't recall Naismith being a particularly supportive team mate either, his MO in many games with us was blaming other for what at times were often his own failings. 

I see the attraction in appointing him as assistant to an experienced coach to help him learn but if he chose to leave if he didn't get the job then fair enough. His contract has ran out and I doubt whether we would be paying the kind of money he was on to anyone other than a manager in any case.

In my view Naismith the player was someone who wasn't blessed with a great physique, wasn't particularly quick and wasn't blessed with amazing natural talent.

 

However, through sheer hard work, dedication and a fantastic football brain where more often than not he took the right option by making quick simple decisions, he succeeded in playing in the best league in the world.

 

So for me he understands the mindset needed to make an average player into a very good player.  This allies well with the fact that he is a natural leader of men and a very intelligent and articulate guy who can communicate his ideas to those playing for him.

[Kyle Lafferty HoMSC]

2 hours ago, DETTY29 said:

As a PS I do wonder if someone with Lauder, Gala, Berwick,Falkirk (promotions and relegation) on their CV would be accepted on here nowadays for the job.

That's a very good point.

FWIW I'm local to JJ and he is in my work quite often - spoke to him last week and he thought that it was almost certainly going to be Naismith.

Also added that there wouldn't be enough games in the season for the suspension he'd get if Lee Johnson had punched him like he did Naismith

[Jodami]

13 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

In my view Naismith the player was someone who wasn't blessed with a great physique, wasn't particularly quick and wasn't blessed with amazing natural talent.

 

However, through sheer hard work, dedication and a fantastic football brain where more often than not he took the right option by making quick simple decisions, he succeeded in playing in the best league in the world.

 

So for me he understands the mindset needed to make an average player into a very good player.  This allies well with the fact that he is a natural leader of men and a very intelligent and articulate guy who can communicate his ideas to those playing for him.

Not disputing much of that other than he definitely did have natural technical talent as a young player. 

None of that changes the fact that he has very limited experience as a coach though and that's the big issue.

[David McCaig]

2 minutes ago, Jodami said:

Not disputing much of that other than he definitely did have natural technical talent as a young player. 

None of that changes the fact that he has very limited experience as a coach though and that's the big issue.

These things are very much relative.  Compared to us punters in the stand, Naismith has a gift from god in terms of natural talent, as a professional player though I don't think his natural talent was any different to the vast bulk of our current squad, it was attitude, hard-work and decision making that made him a Scotland hall of famer.  In theory all of these things should be coachable.

[merseyjambo]

I love all this pony about what we can pay a manager. 
 

We are not going to pay a manager 10k a week. That’s more than our highest paid players are on. We start doing that and players are going to start wanting 10k a week and it takes us back to wages being greater than turnover and back where we were during the Vlad era.

 

SPL clubs like ourselves, Hibs and Aberdeen are shopping in Greggs for a manager, the rest are shopping in the Pound Bakery.

 

Average Championship managers in England are on 15-20k per week. Top end is double that plus but wages are higher as well. 
 

The Average salary in League 1 in England is 200k per annum.

 

A manager with a proven track record at that level is likely to want more than we can afford or want to pay because it will break the salary structure in place at the clubso we go back to someone out of work like a Danny Cowley type, a Stephen Robinson type who knows the Scottish game,  a foreign coach who may be a Ronny Delia but may also turn out to be a Paul le Guen or Allesandro Allessio or a rookie like Naismith.

[merseyjambo]

10 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

These things are very much relative.  Compared to us punters in the stand, Naismith has a gift from god in terms of natural talent, as a professional player though I don't think his natural talent was any different to the vast bulk of our current squad, it was attitude, hard-work and decision making that made him a Scotland hall of famer.  In theory all of these things should be coachable.

Think that a bit of a disservice as Naismith was a very highly regarded and talented youngster. Yes he worked hard but he’s played in the EPL for two clubs, regularly at one who under Moyes were regularly in top half of table 

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, Hampden Demolition said:

I’m not going to pretend i have watched much of them because I haven’t. Looking at their stats, they average around 56% possession and just over 2 goals per game.

We probably averaged about the same under Neilson, I think you get a better judge of a manager from the fans, stats can hide many faults. 

[Pasquale for King]

29 minutes ago, merseyjambo said:

I love all this pony about what we can pay a manager. 
 

We are not going to pay a manager 10k a week. That’s more than our highest paid players are on. We start doing that and players are going to start wanting 10k a week and it takes us back to wages being greater than turnover and back where we were during the Vlad era.

 

SPL clubs like ourselves, Hibs and Aberdeen are shopping in Greggs for a manager, the rest are shopping in the Pound Bakery.

 

Average Championship managers in England are on 15-20k per week. Top end is double that plus but wages are higher as well. 
 

The Average salary in League 1 in England is 200k per annum.

 

A manager with a proven track record at that level is likely to want more than we can afford or want to pay because it will break the salary structure in place at the clubso we go back to someone out of work like a Danny Cowley type, a Stephen Robinson type who knows the Scottish game,  a foreign coach who may be a Ronny Delia but may also turn out to be a Paul le Guen or Allesandro Allessio or a rookie like Naismith.

The vast majority of clubs pay their manager more than the highest paid player, hard to get respect off someone who earns more than you do. 
We should be able to pay 3-400k to someone who is worth it, by having 1 or 2 youngsters replace a GMS/Stewart in the squad. 
 

[jambopilms]

Just give it to Naismith, what's the worst that can happen?

 

 

[Fxxx the SPFL]

1 hour ago, Jodami said:

Not having a go at all but intrigued by this view that Naismith has a better chance of being a really good manager than most. Where is the evidence of this? Coaches who have become successful tend not to be decent players (Guardiola excepted!) and they also take the time to fully learn their trade at lower levels before progressing up the ladder. 

I may have missed something but I don't recall Naismith being a particularly supportive team mate either, his MO in many games with us was blaming others for what at times were often his own failings. 

I see the attraction in appointing him as assistant to an experienced coach to help him learn but if he chose to leave if he didn't get the job then fair enough. His contract has ran out and I doubt whether we would be paying the kind of money he was on to anyone other than a manager in any case.

I think he was always trying to get team mates to try harder i think he was more frustrated at times i certainly don't recall him blaming others unlike a certain Mr Stewart

[DETTY29]

4 minutes ago, jambopilms said:

Just give it to Naismith, what's the worst that can happen?

 

 

JKB triple meltdown.

[Pasquale for King]

16 minutes ago, jambopilms said:

Just give it to Naismith, what's the worst that can happen?

 

 

He gets the sack and Budge brings Levein or Neilson comes back 🤦🏽?

[Pasquale for King]

14 minutes ago, **** the SPFL said:

I think he was always trying to get team mates to try harder i think he was more frustrated at times i certainly don't recall him blaming others unlike a certain Mr Stewart

Definitely, I think he played with at least 11 of the squad.
He was always asking for better from his teammates not blaming them for his own inadequacies like Stewart. 

[merseyjambo]

58 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

The vast majority of clubs pay their manager more than the highest paid player, hard to get respect off someone who earns more than you do. 
We should be able to pay 3-400k to someone who is worth it, by having 1 or 2 youngsters replace a GMS/Stewart in the squad. 
 

 

The link would suggest that most clubs pay less than they do to players.

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrkNL3KAH5kSiAzX8AM34lQ;_ylu=Y29sbwNpcjIEcG9zAzQEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Ny/RV=2/RE=1686008139/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.manchesterworld.uk%2fsport%2ffootball%2fmanchester-city%2fpep-guardiolas-man-city-salary-compared-to-liverpool-man-utd-managers-as-new-deal-signed-gallery-3928634/RK=2/RS=q9fkjBpP7kNtFjV5nNoQhdrB9cU-

[Don Dan]

Cifuentes not happening imo 

 

https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/marti-cifuentes-hearts-warning-hammarby-27056058?utm_source=football_scotland_newsletter&utm_campaign=hearts_live_newsletter2&utm_medium=email

[Pasquale for King]

38 minutes ago, merseyjambo said:

 

The link would suggest that most clubs pay less than they do to players.

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrkNL3KAH5kSiAzX8AM34lQ;_ylu=Y29sbwNpcjIEcG9zAzQEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Ny/RV=2/RE=1686008139/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.manchesterworld.uk%2fsport%2ffootball%2fmanchester-city%2fpep-guardiolas-man-city-salary-compared-to-liverpool-man-utd-managers-as-new-deal-signed-gallery-3928634/RK=2/RS=q9fkjBpP7kNtFjV5nNoQhdrB9cU-

No it doesn’t, theres no comparison to players wages. 
Ferguson received a wage raise every time they signed a player that was on the same as him, Pep is on £20m a year and they aren’t paying anyone more than £400k a week. 
You cant have the people you tell what to do earning more than the boss, that just doesn’t work in any business. 

[Pasquale for King]

39 minutes ago, Imaman said:

Cifuentes not happening imo 

 

https://www.footballscotland.co.uk/spfl/scottish-premiership/marti-cifuentes-hearts-warning-hammarby-27056058?utm_source=football_scotland_newsletter&utm_campaign=hearts_live_newsletter2&utm_medium=email

If thats to be believed Budge and McKinlay interviewed him, some folk think she wasn’t going to be involved. 

[Taffin]

47 minutes ago, merseyjambo said:

 

The link would suggest that most clubs pay less than they do to players.

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=AwrkNL3KAH5kSiAzX8AM34lQ;_ylu=Y29sbwNpcjIEcG9zAzQEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Ny/RV=2/RE=1686008139/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.manchesterworld.uk%2fsport%2ffootball%2fmanchester-city%2fpep-guardiolas-man-city-salary-compared-to-liverpool-man-utd-managers-as-new-deal-signed-gallery-3928634/RK=2/RS=q9fkjBpP7kNtFjV5nNoQhdrB9cU-

 

Based on a sample of 20 from a league where there are some of the highest paid players in the world?

 

Not sure that can really be used for 'most clubs'?

[thejoff]

I can’t see any other outcome than Naismith getting it. The results he picked up in top 6, he deserves the chance to start the season. I’m not convinced he will be still in a job come Christmas but he deserves the chance to lead them out next season and I wish him all the best 

[tartofmidlothian]

19 hours ago, Daktari said:

https://livingstonfc.co.uk/christophe-berra-departs/

 

Could do a job? 

 

Could be a good assistant manager to Naisy?

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

1 minute ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

Could be a good assistant manager to Naisy?

Maybe naw

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

Could be a good assistant manager to Naisy?

They went seriously downhill after he replaced Bartley, disastrous spell defensively for them. 

[gar jambo]

9 hours ago, counting sheep said:

🤞 🤞

Rubbish they are going through the proper channels to see also who has applied for the job! so interview a happen simple 

[merseyjambo]

3 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

Based on a sample of 20 from a league where there are some of the highest paid players in the world?

 

Not sure that can really be used for 'most clubs'?

Probably a better example. League 1 averaged managers salary is 200k per year

 

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=Awr.jsvdOn5ksdw1UZ0M34lQ;_ylu=Y29sbwNpcjIEcG9zAzUEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Ny/RV=2/RE=1686023005/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fsalarysport.com%2ffootball%2fsky-bet-league-one%2fhighest-paid%2f/RK=2/RS=b.qV06zWAgjsvEKYWGsxbY6ICeo-

 

 

[Carter]

3 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

If thats to be believed Budge and McKinlay interviewed him, some folk think she wasn’t going to be involved. 

Money person is always involved. 

[OldGorgie]

And the big news from Hearts is that the summer menu has arrived, meanwhile eight Hearts women players are leaving. As for new managerial announcements absolutely nothing. Clearly the club has its priorities correct.

[soonbe110]

4 hours ago, thejoff said:

I can’t see any other outcome than Naismith getting it. The results he picked up in top 6, he deserves the chance to start the season. I’m not convinced he will be still in a job come Christmas but he deserves the chance to lead them out next season and I wish him all the best 

If you are not convinced he will still be in the job by Xmas why give him the job in the first place? Madness. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

4 hours ago, tartofmidlothian said:

 

Could be a good assistant manager to Naisy?

Acted like a bellend when Stendel turned up, and also cost us in the cup final.

 

It’s a hard naw from me

[Sherbet]

1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

They went seriously downhill after he replaced Bartley, disastrous spell defensively for them. 

Don't think berra was a direct replacement for Bartley. 

[ScandinavianJambo]

10 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Was there not some information from their version of JKB saying that was a lot of nonsense and sounds eerily similar to RNs style of play?

Feedback from Hammarby supporter is that he does not change his style of play, independent of opposition.

Add to that lack of understanding of Scottish football. Their supporters held up banners about him playing tippi tapi football and they where not being positive about it. Can't see that going down a storm on here..

[SomethingAboutObua]

https://www.svenskafans.com/fotboll/bajen/avga-alla-658401

 

Personally not sure on Naismith, but here's a Hammarby fan article on Cifuentes. Seems very similar to the complaints fans had about Neilson. Playing players out of position, not playing youth players, slow passing between defenders then lumping the ball up when plan a doesnt work etc. Was intrigued by Cifeuntes but not if he's another passing for the sake of passing  coach. 

[Agentjambo]

4 minutes ago, SomethingAboutObua said:

https://www.svenskafans.com/fotboll/bajen/avga-alla-658401

 

Personally not sure on Naismith, but here's a Hammarby fan article on Cifuentes. Seems very similar to the complaints fans had about Neilson. Playing players out of position, not playing youth players, slow passing between defenders then lumping the ball up when plan a doesnt work etc. Was intrigued by Cifeuntes but not if he's another passing for the sake of passing  coach. 

Bet they weren’t complaining when they finished 3rd and qualified for Europe,it’s very easy to get on a managers back when things aren’t going well but these are the same fans worshiping him last season….fickle.

[Pasquale for King]

32 minutes ago, ScandinavianJambo said:

Feedback from Hammarby supporter is that he does not change his style of play, independent of opposition.

Add to that lack of understanding of Scottish football. Their supporters held up banners about him playing tippi tapi football and they where not being positive about it. Can't see that going down a storm on here..

Sounded all a bit familiar didn’t it 🤦🏽. 

[Pasquale for King]

17 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

Bet they weren’t complaining when they finished 3rd and qualified for Europe,it’s very easy to get on a managers back when things aren’t going well but these are the same fans worshiping him last season….fickle.

I was last season about Neilson so you never know 🤷🏾‍♂️?

[Pasquale for King]

24 minutes ago, SomethingAboutObua said:

https://www.svenskafans.com/fotboll/bajen/avga-alla-658401

 

Personally not sure on Naismith, but here's a Hammarby fan article on Cifuentes. Seems very similar to the complaints fans had about Neilson. Playing players out of position, not playing youth players, slow passing between defenders then lumping the ball up when plan a doesnt work etc. Was intrigued by Cifeuntes but not if he's another passing for the sake of passing  coach. 

Ffs, Budge and McKinlay actually interviewed this guy 🤦🏽. Slightly worrying tbh. 

[Agentjambo]

1 minute ago, Pasquale for King said:

I was last season about Neilson so you never know 🤷🏾‍♂️?

We can’t go about comparing every manager to Neilson…although a lot probably will.

[Pasquale for King]

Just now, Agentjambo said:

We can’t go about comparing every manager to Neilson…although a lot probably will.

No but when Its relevant, as the evidence provided by others shows, its fair enough.