Russia Invades Ukraine

[Sharpie]

In 1935 I was born into a world heading for a disastrous war with Germany invading Poland. By the age of four I was watching Stukas dive bombing cities, people with bundles and pushing prams with their life gatherings in them,  pictures of ruined cities and lots of dead. Eighty three years later here I am watching an army again invade another Country, this time however I am the winner, I am not entering this world I am looking at the exit. It seems every thing repeats itself, more modern weapons, threat of nuclear weapons, China sitting by instead of Japan, but what remains the same are families mourning their young men and women who served, devastation of whole towns, concentration camps for those who disagree with the government, but the old maxim the more things change the more they stay the same, and there is not a better example than the activities of today.

 

On a wee side note I will be interested to watch the Canucks v Calgary ice hockey tonight and see if there is any reaction to the Russian players. Large Ukrainean population  in Vancouver. I personally have quite a few such friends and former workmates.

[King prawn]

What use is an abandoned Nuclear power plant ? Just because it’s close to Kiev I assume ? 

[Gizmo]

7 minutes ago, Boy Daniel said:

Alex salmondski has suspended broadcasting on RT 

* RT should be suspended immediately. All known propaganda feeds on social media that will be hopefully well known to the intelligence agencies, blocked. Use cyber attacks to shut the bot farms down at source if required.  
* All Russian assets frozen.
* All UK ambassadors in Russia repatriated immediately.
* All Russian ambassadors given a total dressing down and ejected from the UK in handcuffs, persona non grata - once our people are safe. Round them up and put them in a holding jail meantime.
* Every asset of Russia/Putin/his supporters should be frozen. 
* Harden Ukraine's cyber-defences. 
* Short-term increase OPEC production and shut down the Gas pipeline, as much as that won't help the climate, neither will war. 

We need to strangle this ******* as much as possible and be as ruthlessly hard-nosed whilst doing it, it's the only language he will take seriously. Sanctions hopefully will increase the pressure on him domestically. How stable is his popularity/control domestically - could their be another coup like the one that lead to the break-up of the Soviet Union?

Not sure what we can do about the GOP and the far-right siding with Putin because a) they ain't patriots b) anything to kick the dems/Biden. Doubt Putin suck-up's like Carlson on Fox News can be shut down, sadly. Thank **** Trump isn't still in charge!  

[Victorian]

He's been granted the full support from opposition parties.  It's now up to him to make good on the promises to target all dirty Russian finance.  If he's half-arsed about it through incompetence or because of personal or Tory Party interests then he'll need to face the consequences of abusing the contract of trust he's been given.  

 

He can't expect trust and support and willfully abuse the spirit in which it has been given.

[Lord Montpelier]

I don't tend to wish ill will on anyone. But in this instance I really hope the SAS / Navy Seals / Mossad guys are going to go in against putin and those doing his bidding

[King prawn]

2 minutes ago, Victorian said:

He's been granted the full support from opposition parties.  It's now up to him to make good on the promises to target all dirty Russian finance.  If he's half-arsed about it through incompetence or because of personal or Tory Party interests then he'll need to face the consequences of abusing the contract of trust he's been given.  

 

He can't expect trust and support and willfully abuse the spirit in which it has been given.

This is Boris Johnson we’re talking about

[south morocco]

2 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

I don't tend to wish ill will on anyone. But in this instance I really hope the SAS / Navy Seals / Mossad guys are going to go in against putin and those doing his bidding

Agreed. 

[The Mighty Thor]

The lack of action on SWIFT is a big error. 

 

Cut them off today and he'll come back to the table as Russia would go back to the 60s economically.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, King prawn said:

This is Boris Johnson we’re talking about

He's brilliant now.

[Lord Montpelier]

1 minute ago, The Mighty Thor said:

The lack of action on SWIFT is a big error. 

 

Cut them off today and he'll come back to the table as Russia would go back to the 60s economically.

Correct.  Hopefully this is under permanent review and happens shortly  

[151]

3 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

And so we have it

 

 

 

****ing horrific. As a father of 2 boys I genuinely cannot begin to imagine what he feels.

 

For me even the feeling of thinking there was something so great I couldn't protect them from it is harrowing.

 

I left the forces in 2018 but if we have to go we go. 

 

**** cowering away from these bullying *******s.

[Lord Montpelier]

2 minutes ago, 151 said:

 

****ing horrific. As a father of 2 boys I genuinely cannot begin to imagine what he feels.

 

For me even the feeling of thinking there was something so great I couldn't protect them from it is harrowing.

 

I left the forces in 2018 but if we have to go we go. 

 

**** cowering away from these bullying *******s.

Well said 151

[Des Lynam]

2 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Donetsk and Lugansk

 

(guy in photo is pro Russian 'leader' there) 

 

The red line area next to Russia is area already controlled by separatists. 

 

 

 

That's Juan Guaido the Venezuelan opposition guy. 

[south morocco]

1 minute ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Correct.  Hopefully this is under permanent review and happens shortly  

Read today the way it was set up means  it’s a complex procedure to unravel quickly and needs everyone to agree. This is maybe the hold up. 

[ri Alban]

5 minutes ago, 151 said:

 

****ing horrific. As a father of 2 boys I genuinely cannot begin to imagine what he feels.

 

For me even the feeling of thinking there was something so great I couldn't protect them from it is harrowing.

 

I left the forces in 2018 but if we have to go we go. 

 

**** cowering away from these bullying *******s.

Well said.

[Lord Montpelier]

1 minute ago, south morocco said:

Read today the way it was set up means  it’s a complex procedure to unravel quickly and needs everyone to agree. This is maybe the hold up. 

Indeed it is. And with any sanction has effects on all sides . But - needs done in my view. 

[ri Alban]

Have Ukraine anything that can hit the Kremlin?

[Footballfirst]

13 minutes ago, King prawn said:

What use is an abandoned Nuclear power plant ? Just because it’s close to Kiev I assume ? 

It can be weaponised by blowing it up, or setting fire to it, thus spreading radioactive material beyond the current exclusion zone (1,000 sq. miles).

 

The best estimate for the immediate surrounding area to become habitable is over 300 years, although some organisations suggest that it will take multiple thousands of years. 

[milky_26]

Just now, Footballfirst said:

It can be weaponised by blowing it up, or setting fire to it, thus spreading radioactive material beyond the current exclusion zone (1,000 sq. miles).

 

The best estimate for the immediate surrounding area to become habitable is over 300 years, although some organisations suggest that it will take multiple thousands of years. 

there will be accessable spent nuclear fuel as there were reactors still generating power there until 2000. it is currently in the decommissioning phase

[Jambo-Jimbo]

14 minutes ago, King prawn said:

What use is an abandoned Nuclear power plant ? Just because it’s close to Kiev I assume ? 

 

They were saying on the TV that not only is the road from Chernobyl to Kiev one of the best roads in Ukraine, the closer you get to Kiev from that direction the better the ground is for tanks to spread out in the countryside as the ground is firm.  That's why Chernobyl is a prize, it opens the way up for mass tank usage.

[Des Lynam]

53 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Of course we are assuming overwhelming Russian superiority. Let's see. 

 

 

 

I hope this is true. Putin should be wary as Russian history shows how its leaders can be dealt with. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

Corbyn acting like total nonce once again, as are his pals

[Lord Montpelier]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

Corbyn acting like total nonce once again, as are his pals

What's he saying (or not saying) now ?

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

Corbyn acting like total nonce once again, as are his pals

Is he imitating Johnson and his cronies?

[joondalupjambo]

4 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

It can be weaponised by blowing it up, or setting fire to it, thus spreading radioactive material beyond the current exclusion zone (1,000 sq. miles.)

Wind blows in all directions so that would be a big mistake as it would spread nuclear dust into Russia and Belarus so hopefully more to do with access route to Kiev being more accessible.

[Cade]

Was Ukraine's former President who was pro-Russia against the will of his people a bad thing? YES

Was the West getting openly involved in the 2014 revolution that toppled him a bad thing? YES

Was the annexation of Crimea a bad thing? YES

Has the international community totally failed to bring the 8 year civil war in the south east of Ukraine to a proper peaceful conclusion? YES

Have Ukrainian forces broken the ceasefire since the Minsk agreement was signed? YES

Have Russian forces broken the ceasefire since the Minsk agreement was signed? YES

 

Is there any excuse for an invasion? NO

[Tennant's 6's]

15 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

 

That's Juan Guaido the Venezuelan opposition guy. 

More like CIA/IMF stooge. 

Thankfully for the Venezuelan people that coup got nowhere.

[Captain Slog]

Heard from someone close in Fort Riley KS, that the US is moving sizeable amounts of troops to Alaska.  Are they worried about China or Russia? - either way, it's scary times.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

6 minutes ago, south morocco said:

Read today the way it was set up means  it’s a complex procedure to unravel quickly and needs everyone to agree. This is maybe the hold up. 

 

They were saying on Sky News earlier that one of the sticking points was France & Italy, seemingly French & Italian banks are heavily exposed to Russian debt and would probably lose a hell of a lot of money if Russia was kicked out of SWIFT.  The UK/US and other EU members have been trying to get the French & Italians onside, they will do so, eventually.

[JimmyCant]

15 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

It can be weaponised by blowing it up, or setting fire to it, thus spreading radioactive material beyond the current exclusion zone (1,000 sq. miles).

 

The best estimate for the immediate surrounding area to become habitable is over 300 years, although some organisations suggest that it will take multiple thousands of years. 

Why would they bother ‘weaponising’ a redundant reactor in god knows what state of stability, when they have 1200 shiney new nuclear warheads already targeted and primed which could take out every major city in The region in about 4 minutes.

 

God knows why the media have attached such importance to it. Just fear broadcasting. 

Edited February 24, 2022 by JimmyCant

[Tennant's 6's]

4 minutes ago, Cade said:

Was Ukraine's former President who was pro-Russia against the will of his people a bad thing? YES

Was the West getting openly involved in the 2014 revolution that toppled him a bad thing? YES

Was the annexation of Crimea a bad thing? YES

Has the international community totally failed to bring the 8 year civil war in the south east of Ukraine to a proper peaceful conclusion? YES

Have Ukrainian forces broken the ceasefire since the Minsk agreement was signed? YES

Have Russian forces broken the ceasefire since the Minsk agreement was signed? YES

 

Is there any excuse for an invasion? NO

Well said.

This could all have been avoided. The 2014 Maidan coup, neo nazi fascists militias, the US needing another war after 20 yrs of destroying the middle east, Putin acting the alpha male.

 

As always, the people suffer, never the 'elites'.

 Real  shame. 

[ri Alban]

3 minutes ago, Tennant's 6's said:

More like CIA/IMF stooge. 

Thankfully for the Venezuelan people that coup got nowhere.

 

[FWJ]

I wonder if Ukraine will target the Crimea Bridge over the Kerch Strait.  It looks like the only link between the peninsula and Russia proper.

[Tennant's 6's]

3 minutes ago, Captain Slog said:

Heard from someone close in Fort Riley KS, that the US is moving sizeable amounts of troops to Alaska.  Are they worried about China or Russia? - either way, it's scary times.

Worried about them? They've been agitating for this.  Causing tensions by arming Ukraine & Taiwan.

Big money to be made fir Goldman Sachs, Lochheed Martin, Raytheon,  Exxon Mobil etc..

 

Bloody depressingly predictable now that the 'war on terror' has died down..

[Des Lynam]

1 minute ago, Tennant's 6's said:

As always, the people suffer, never the 'elites'.

 Real  shame. 

 

This. 

 

[Jambo_jim2001]

6 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Why would they bother ‘weaponising’ a redundant reactor is god knows what state of stability, when they have 1200 shiney new nuclear warheads already targeted and primed which could take out every major city in The region in about 4 minutes.

 

God knows why the media have attached such importance to it. Just fear broadcasting. 

Dirty bomb,been a fear for decades now

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, Tennant's 6's said:

Worried about them? They've been agitating for this.  Causing tensions by arming Ukraine & Taiwan.

Big money to be made fir Goldman Sachs, Lochheed Martin, Raytheon,  Exxon Mobil etc..

 

Bloody depressingly predictable now that the 'war on terror' has died down..

[Tennant's 6's]

Just now, Jambo_jim2001 said:

Dirty bomb,been a fear for decades now

Doesn't bare thinking about.

Would the 'mutual destruction ' philosophy of nuclear war not prevent such a heinous thing though?..

[Jambo_jim2001]

Dirty bomb is basically a bomb being used to spread copious amounts of radioactive material around a major city, regardless of where in the world it's set off👍👍

[Jambo_jim2001]

Just now, Jambo_jim2001 said:

Dirty bomb is basically a bomb being used to spread copious amounts of radioactive material around a major city, regardless of what city it's set off👍👍

 

[Jeff]

2 minutes ago, Jambo_jim2001 said:

Dirty bomb is basically a bomb being used to spread copious amounts of radioactive material around a major city, regardless of where in the world it's set off👍👍

 

That would be the same as them firing at NATO troops on the border.

 

Guessing they've captured it to avoid terrorist groups getting to it + to use the path to Kiev

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Just now, Jambo_jim2001 said:

Dirty bomb,been a fear for decades now

 

Just drop a glass vial filled with a nerve agent from a high building, such as a church spire......got yourself a dirty bomb.

The Russians have plenty of spent nuclear waste from power stations and decommissioned subs, I don't think they are interested in an old power station, Chernobyl is the best route to Kiev, that's why the Russians wanted it.

[Gizmo]

4 minutes ago, Tennant's 6's said:

Doesn't bare thinking about.

Would the 'mutual destruction ' philosophy of nuclear war not prevent such a heinous thing though?..

Who do you retaliate to? You can assume Russia, another rogue state or very well organised terror group but even then, a fire everything doctrine just sees it come straight back. 

Only silver lining here is that I don't think there are enough hypersonic nuclear missile availble to any nuclear power yet, to tip us from MAD to a first-strike mentality.

[Jambo_jim2001]

13 minutes ago, Steak said:

 

That would be the same as them firing at NATO troops on the border.

 

Guessing they've captured it to avoid terrorist groups getting to it + to use the path to Kiev

More than likely Russia is aware of the potential Ukrainian military or such like, getting spent material,making a bomb and setting it off in a major russian city.if that did happen then the rest of Ukraine would be invaded ,,not just ,rightly or wrongly the Donetsk region, remember Ukraine has been shelling and such like the Donetsk area for a fair few years,and of course they have been fighting back..still shit though 

[manaliveits105]

32 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Why would they bother ‘weaponising’ a redundant reactor in god knows what state of stability, when they have 1200 shiney new nuclear warheads already targeted and primed which could take out every major city in The region in about 4 minutes.

 

God knows why the media have attached such importance to it. Just fear broadcasting. 

A little false flag explosion ? - let’s hope not 

I’ve been to Chernobyl and there were a lot of old Ruski missile silos along the way which our local told us used to point at European cities. 

 

 

[Jambo_jim2001]

22 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

Just drop a glass vial filled with a nerve agent from a high building, such as a church spire......got yourself a dirty bomb.

 

You'd shit yourself if you realised the stuff that not only is stockpiled by various governments and what so little can do,but the stuff that got dumped at sea just off our west coast as well as other parts of the world😳😳

[Tennant's 6's]

3 minutes ago, Jambo_jim2001 said:

More than likely Russia is aware of the potential Ukrainian military or such like, getting spent material,making a bomb and setting it off in a major russian city.if that did happen then the rest of Ukraine would be invaded ,,not just ,rightly or wrongly the Donetsk region, remember Ukraine has been shelling and such like the Donetsk area for a fair few years,and of course they have been fighting back..still shit though 

That's a scary thought. 

You've got to imagine, or hope, that talks are going on behind the scenes to put a stop to this through diplomatic means rather than further bloodshed & destruction.

'Leaders' trying to look supposedly strong & tough doesn't help anyone. 

[Jambo_jim2001]

6 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

A little false flag explosion ? - let’s hope not 

I’ve been to Chernobyl and there were a lot of old Ruski missile silos along the way which our local told us used to point at European cities. 

 

 

It's the unknown and mobile ones that are the ultimate scary ones,plus the submarines,as sting sung" I hope the Russians love their children too"

[Francis Albert]

Big demonstration outside Downing Street by Ukrainian nationals living in London. To continue until the Russian invasion ends apparently. Would have thought the Russian embassy was a more obvious target.

[joondalupjambo]

Interesting watching the pictures on TV from within Russia where anti war protesters were being huckled and ruffed up by the police.  Reminded me of the same pictures coming out of America in the late 60's / early 70's onto our TV screens where American police were doing the same to the anti war protesters back then.  Both wars are/were avoidable so go figure.