All Home games to be streamed for ST Holders

[been here before]

17 minutes ago, wattie exploited said:

I really don.t think the club do  give a shit about this matter as am sure they will release a statement at some point hopefully 

 

I genuinelly think theyre waiting until the first streamed league game to see if any ST holders looking for a refund, parity or whatever watch it then we'll see a statement along the lines of those ST holders will have 'used' their ST so arent entitled to anything.

[SectionFJambo]

The clubs behaviour on this stinks. They clearly don't feel they have to respond to the fans who have raised queries. It does seem as if they are just waiting to see if they go away whilst letting the clock tick down on potential bank refunds etc.

 

 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

30 minutes ago, SectionFJambo said:

The clubs behaviour on this stinks. They clearly don't feel they have to respond to the fans who have raised queries. It does seem as if they are just waiting to see if they go away whilst letting the clock tick down on potential bank refunds etc.

 

 

The lack of responses is out of order. Another thing FOH should be pressing the club on, but won’t.

[Jodami]

I'm not really understanding what is going on with this. Surely there can only be 2 real options here. Either the club has only received a small amount of complaints and requests for refunds and they can accommodate those with refunds or they have an unsustainably large amount of complaints and need to explain themselves over what was a misleading communication. Either way they need to do something as burying your head in the sand and treating current and future customers with apparent disdain is extremely bad business. Communications to the club have been met with a senior decision makers are still discussing the matter response. This does not reflect well on them at all. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

6 minutes ago, Jodami said:

I'm not really understanding what is going on with this. Surely there can only be 2 real options here. Either the club has only received a small amount of complaints and requests for refunds and they can accommodate those with refunds or they have an unsustainably large amount of complaints and need to explain themselves over what was a misleading communication. Either way they need to do something as burying your head in the sand and treating current and future customers with apparent disdain is extremely bad business. Communications to the club have been met with a senior decision makers are still discussing the matter response. This does not reflect well on them at all. 

 

It would be interesting to know how many people have complained and not got any response at all. No new threads seem to have been started on it though, which is what typically happens when someone is really pissed off with the club. A large amount would likely mean a complete change of strategy, which would take time if we have budgeted for the money and then have to give a lot of it back. A small number means the club will likely respond individually and try to figures something out on a case by case basis.

 

 

[Jodami]

13 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It would be interesting to know how many people have complained and not got any response at all. No new threads seem to have been started on it though, which is what typically happens when someone is really pissed off with the club. A large amount would likely mean a complete change of strategy, which would take time if we have budgeted for the money and then have to give a lot of it back. A small number means the club will likely respond individually and try to figures something out on a case by case basis.

 

 

I think that our fanbase are extremely understanding and patient with the club, often affording them the doubt when many wouldn't. I rather suspect its a sizeable amount which would constitute an unsustainably large refund and that is what is delaying any decision and communication. However, the club cannot present a principled stand on an array of topics and treat their core supporters so shabbily. Making difficult decisions is the reason people are appointed leadership roles, the disrespectful silence needs addressed now. 

Edited October 9, 2020 by Jodami

[Guest ToqueJambo]

20 minutes ago, Jodami said:

I think that our fanbase are extremely understanding and patient with the club, often affording them the doubt when many wouldn't. I rather suspect its a sizeable amount which would constitute an unsustainably large refund and that is what is delaying any decision and communication. However, the club cannot present a principled stand on an array of topics and treat their core supporters so shabbily. Making difficult decisions is the reason people are appointed leadership roles, the disrespectful silence needs addressed now. 

 

What would sizeable be? I agree but there's no evidence of ongoing widespread discontent leading to requests for refunds.

[Jodami]

17 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

What would sizeable be? I agree but there's no evidence of ongoing widespread discontent leading to requests for refunds.

I'm really not sure what constitutes sizeable as far as the club are concerned, I suspect it will be amount of cash rather than fans. I think the lack of discontent is down to people wanting to give the club every chance and other than here I don't know where discontent would be visible. 

[maroonsgotop]

Have to say the silence from the Club on this matter is shocking when it would appear many fans feel they have been misled

[HighTimes]

2 hours ago, been here before said:

 

I genuinelly think theyre waiting until the first streamed league game to see if any ST holders looking for a refund, parity or whatever watch it then we'll see a statement along the lines of those ST holders will have 'used' their ST so arent entitled to anything.

Aye, this is what I've always assumed.No other reason it's taken a month and still no word from the Board about this.

[maroonsgotop]

so STH's lost 4 or 5 games last season and got no refund and STH's this season look as though they may only 14 streamed league games. Pretty garbage value for money and no interaction with the fans from the club to explain matters. In my view this is unacceptable and seems they are taking the piss or at the very taking the fans for granted

[Jambo-Fox]

2 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

so STH's lost 4 or 5 games last season and got no refund and STH's this season look as though they may only 14 streamed league games. Pretty garbage value for money and no interaction with the fans from the club to explain matters. In my view this is unacceptable and seems they are taking the piss or at the very taking the fans for granted

They are we!!

 

We are not fans we are the owners!

 

Well at least some of us are!

[soonbe110]

3 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

so STH's lost 4 or 5 games last season and got no refund and STH's this season look as though they may only 14 streamed league games. Pretty garbage value for money and no interaction with the fans from the club to explain matters. In my view this is unacceptable and seems they are taking the piss or at the very taking the fans for granted

10% reduction on this seasons tickets to make up for lost games last season. Was explained in sales email. 

[maroonsgotop]

1 minute ago, soonbe110 said:

10% reduction on this seasons tickets to make up for lost games last season. Was explained in sales email. 

that was a good deal if we had 40 games. I thought the discount was aimed at not knowing which league we were going to be in. It also later dropped to 5%

[maroonsgotop]

4 minutes ago, Jambo-Fox said:

They are we!!

 

We are not fans we are the owners!

 

Well at least some of us are!

doesn't feel like it

[soonbe110]

Just now, maroonsgotop said:

that was a good deal if we had 40 games. I thought the discount was aimed at not knowing which league we were going to be in. It also later dropped to 5%

When has a season ticket ever covered 40 games? 

[wattie exploited]

6 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

so STH's lost 4 or 5 games last season and got no refund and STH's this season look as though they may only 14 streamed league games. Pretty garbage value for money and no interaction with the fans from the club to explain matters. In my view this is unacceptable and seems they are taking the piss or at the very taking the fans for granted

exactly this as they got away with this for the season ending and seem to think if they ignore the fans we will forget about it !

its ok if they actually explained how they are going to sort this out 

some fans are fine with this and a lot aren't  

[3fingersreid]

What happens if ST’s have been bought on the “ pay half now , pay the other half in December” but the supporter says he/she can’t or won’t pay the balance ? 
Is it possible the club are going to find themselves a fair bit out of pocket ? 
I know of two people who aren’t going to pay ,solely on the multi ST household scenario , one of whom has said she’ll be paying the cheapest of her 4 tickets just to get access to the games via streaming .

[soonbe110]

1 minute ago, wattie exploited said:

exactly this as they got away with this for the season ending and seem to think if they ignore the fans we will forget about it !

its ok if they actually explained how they are going to sort this out 

some fans are fine with this and a lot aren't  

Judging by the poll results from a few weeks ago and comments on here lots of fans are fine with it and some aren’t. 

[maroonsgotop]

Just now, soonbe110 said:

When has a season ticket ever covered 40 games? 

How does 10% cover the loss of 4 or 5 games out of 18/19 games. For 10% to equate to those numbers would have meant playing 40 or even 50 games which of course you knew wasn't the case meaning as STH's we out of pocket

[soonbe110]

Just now, maroonsgotop said:

How does 10% cover the loss of 4 or 5 games out of 18/19 games. For 10% to equate to those numbers would have meant playing 40 or even 50 games which of course you knew wasn't the case meaning as STH's we out of pocket

The ad said ‘ the discount goes some way to compensating for the games outstanding from 19/20 season as well as the possibility of relegation’ I think. 
If you didn’t like what was offered you shouldn’t have bought especially if you hadn’t thought through what was likely to happen re COVID 

[wattie exploited]

1 minute ago, soonbe110 said:

Judging by the poll results from a few weeks ago and comments on here lots of fans are fine with it and some aren’t. 

that's what I said  

[soonbe110]

1 minute ago, wattie exploited said:

that's what I said  

No, you said SOME are fine with it and LOTS aren’t 

I said poll suggested LOTS are fine with it and SOME aren’t 

Big difference 

[wattie exploited]

Just now, soonbe110 said:

No, you said SOME are fine with it and LOTS aren’t 

I said poll suggested LOTS are fine with it and SOME aren’t 

Big difference 

you knew what I meant 

[soonbe110]

6 minutes ago, wattie exploited said:

you knew what I meant 

I didn’t. I thought what you said was wrong.  That’s why I corrected it 

[wattie exploited]

13 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

I didn’t. I thought what you said was wrong.  That’s why I corrected it 

i never seen the poll am just going on people that I have talked to and stuff from the forum here so what was the big difference exactly as it doesn't matter if its one person or a  thousand   people they all  deserve a answer   or do you think that they don't 

Edited October 9, 2020 by wattie exploited

[Jack Torrance]

17 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

How does 10% cover the loss of 4 or 5 games out of 18/19 games. For 10% to equate to those numbers would have meant playing 40 or even 50 games which of course you knew wasn't the case meaning as STH's we out of pocket

And remember they were giving new purchasers a 5% reduction so it wasn't really a 10% discount to existing holders. Just more marketing horseshit.

 

I've given the club a deadline in writing of 12 October for a refund to reach me after which I'll have no alternative but to pursue it elsewhere. Pretty disappointing there's been silence despite them having the time to work out a PPV agreement for this weekend. Shows clearly what they think of loyal supporters. They can ram it if they don't come up with a solution by then.

[maroonsgotop]

Just now, soonbe110 said:

The ad said ‘ the discount goes some way to compensating for the games outstanding from 19/20 season as well as the possibility of relegation’ I think. 
If you didn’t like what was offered you shouldn’t have bought especially if you hadn’t thought through what was likely to happen re COVID 

ah..........some way but nowhere near to what we lost out on. I think many would would have accepted that last season including myself due to what happened.

 

However, it is what has happened this season that has annoyed people especially to multi household STH's and Premium vs Bronze STH's etc. This has not been addressed. I could see what was happening and down graded my STH. However, this has impacted on many many others who purchased ST's believing they were getting into Tynecastle to watch games.  

 

Clearly it was the the Club who had not through the likelihood of COVID-19 when advertising ST's as I believe most people thought they were paying for at least 18 games they would physically be in attendance at Tynecastle for and it seems the Club thought the same.

 

Do you think multi household STH's should be paying the same as one individual STH

[Guest ToqueJambo]

 

1 hour ago, Jodami said:

I'm really not sure what constitutes sizeable as far as the club are concerned, I suspect it will be amount of cash rather than fans. I think the lack of discontent is down to people wanting to give the club every chance and other than here I don't know where discontent would be visible. 

 

The point is only the club knows. I find it hard to believe if a huge volume of complaints had flooded in, especially if they demanded refunds, that we wouldn't have heard something. Moaning about something and actively complaining and taking action are very different things.

Edited October 9, 2020 by ToqueJambo

[Jodami]

1 minute ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

 

The point is only the club knows. I find it hard to believe if a huge volume of complaints had flooded in, especially if they demanded refunds, that we wouldn't have heard something.

You're right, only the club knows. If there hasn't been a "sizeable" demand for refunds why have the club not just given people their money back rather than say senior decision makers are discussing the issue. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

5 minutes ago, Jodami said:

You're right, only the club knows. If there hasn't been a "sizeable" demand for refunds why have the club not just given people their money back rather than say senior decision makers are discussing the issue. 

 

Has anyone actually asked for their money back? Maybe they have refunded people and those people don't want to talk about it?

[MES]

Really sad. As a 3 season ticket household and family FOH contributor, I’ll not complain. But v poor communication from club will put a lot of folks off. I appreciate it’s not easy for the club, but they need us all on board. We all know how bad things are and with the correct message the money will continue to flow it, but if support is taken for granted, who knows where we’ll be?

[Jodami]

3 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Has anyone actually asked for their money back? Maybe they have refunded people and those people don't want to talk about it?

I have and they have not. 

[SectionFJambo]

I e-mailed the club asking a question about it - didn't specifically request a refund as wanted to give them a chance/benefit of the doubt. Got a holding reply over 2 weeks ago now. The longer they leave it the more I'd be inclined to go the refund route.

 

The EPL today announced they are charging £14.99 for streaming of untelevised games and are getting it tight for the excessive cost. 

[soonbe110]

24 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

ah..........some way but nowhere near to what we lost out on. I think many would would have accepted that last season including myself due to what happened.

 

However, it is what has happened this season that has annoyed people especially to multi household STH's and Premium vs Bronze STH's etc. This has not been addressed. I could see what was happening and down graded my STH. However, this has impacted on many many others who purchased ST's believing they were getting into Tynecastle to watch games.  

 

Clearly it was the the Club who had not through the likelihood of COVID-19 when advertising ST's as I believe most people thought they were paying for at least 18 games they would physically be in attendance at Tynecastle for and it seems the Club thought the same.

 

Do you think multi household STH's should be paying the same as one individual STH

I paid for 6, same household in terms of watching.  When I renewed I didn’t expect to be in our seats until Xmas at the earliest based on what governing bodies and ‘experts’ were saying. It was definitely a case of the club needs renewals to survive and if all I get is football bcd on a stream then fine.  It was and is a personal decision and choice. Just needed to be thought through and whatever plays out plays out. Multi households is a tough one but in a lot of cases they will still use more than one ticket to view. Mine certainly will. There’s no easy solution to that one. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

4 minutes ago, Jodami said:

I have and they have not. 

 

You could start a thread for people who have done the same to keep track of responses from the club or otherwise. That would give the issue more profile on here at least and we'd get more of an idea of if this is a genuine issue for lots of people.

[wattie exploited]

1 minute ago, SectionFJambo said:

I e-mailed the club asking a question about it - didn't specifically request a refund as wanted to give them a chance/benefit of the doubt. Got a holding reply over 2 weeks ago now. The longer they leave it the more I'd be inclined to go the refund route.

 

The EPL today announced they are charging £14.99 for streaming of untelevised games and are getting it tight for the excessive cost. 

A lot cheaper at the moment than the hearts stream  for the league games it seems 

[wattie exploited]

3 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

I paid for 6, same household in terms of watching.  When I renewed I didn’t expect to be in our seats until Xmas at the earliest based on what governing bodies and ‘experts’ were saying. It was definitely a case of the club needs renewals to survive and if all I get is football bcd on a stream then fine.  It was and is a personal decision and choice. Just needed to be thought through and whatever plays out plays out. Multi households is a tough one but in a lot of cases they will still use more than one ticket to view. Mine certainly will. There’s no easy solution to that one. 

am sure there will be a loads of multi households  using the same stream  so only one STREAM  one ticket  would have been required as there is bound to be loads of kids who will watch it with their parents 

[iainmac]

2 hours ago, Jodami said:

I think that our fanbase are extremely understanding and patient with the club, often affording them the doubt when many wouldn't. I rather suspect its a sizeable amount which would constitute an unsustainably large refund and that is what is delaying any decision and communication. However, the club cannot present a principled stand on an array of topics and treat their core supporters so shabbily. Making difficult decisions is the reason people are appointed leadership roles, the disrespectful silence needs addressed now. 

 

The club shill you quoted said "no new threads have been started" - conveniently ignoring that this very thread is still going strong at 60 pages and any "new threads" would be merged with this one anyway.

 

I have it on good authority that the new CEO doesn't feel that the level of complaints received is anything to worry about. Instead of looking at the situation holistically and asking "what could we have done better?", it looks like a case of "batten down the hatches" and let the storm pass. Almost a bit like someone that previously worked at the SFA might do?

[SectionFJambo]

I expect you are right and they are probably sitting to see how many chase them up and/or go to banks with a view to issuing a few refunds if need be. The fans really cannot win in this one as if they go that route they lose their ST and take back from the club. If they don't they get shafted.

 

It's absolutely nothing short of disturbing that the club seem to think ignoring the issue and refusing to engage with the fans is the way to go though and really should be something FOH are asking if is the approach a fan owned (eventually) club should approach.

 

It's not the first incident but the trust and relationships between the club and the supporters seems to be slowly being broken. It might be 100 fans or so at a time however eventually the impact will add up.

[Tams bird]

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

[3fingersreid]

45 minutes ago, Tams bird said:

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

It might if you took it through the payment deal Hearts offered ( through a third party) as it’s a credit agreement , if you paid cash or put it on your own card it shouldn’t . 
 

[Jack Torrance]

56 minutes ago, Tams bird said:

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

It will but if you're unhappy with the situation regarding the goods being misrepresented you should be approaching the credit company to ask them to resolve it.

 

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/businesses/complaints-deal/consumer-credit/goods-services-bought-credit

 

 

Edited October 10, 2020 by Jack Torrance

[iainmac]

3 hours ago, Tams bird said:

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

 

Think the agreement (contract) will be between you and the finance company - not Hearts.

 

They won't be interested in anything other than you repaying them in full - don't go there!

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

3 hours ago, Tams bird said:

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

Don’t even think about doing that. A world of trouble

[Jodami]

11 hours ago, iainmac said:

 

The club shill you quoted said "no new threads have been started" - conveniently ignoring that this very thread is still going strong at 60 pages and any "new threads" would be merged with this one anyway.

 

I have it on good authority that the new CEO doesn't feel that the level of complaints received is anything to worry about. Instead of looking at the situation holistically and asking "what could we have done better?", it looks like a case of "batten down the hatches" and let the storm pass. Almost a bit like someone that previously worked at the SFA might do?

That is disappointing if that's the case, it does sound like the MO of the SFA though. The whole concept of doing things better and accepting mistakes seems alien at the club. The hubris of our leaders over recent times means they believe unfortunate things have just happened to us and they carry zero responsibility for the decisions they make. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

11 hours ago, SectionFJambo said:

I expect you are right and they are probably sitting to see how many chase them up and/or go to banks with a view to issuing a few refunds if need be. The fans really cannot win in this one as if they go that route they lose their ST and take back from the club. If they don't they get shafted.

 

It's absolutely nothing short of disturbing that the club seem to think ignoring the issue and refusing to engage with the fans is the way to go though and really should be something FOH are asking if is the approach a fan owned (eventually) club should approach.

 

It's not the first incident but the trust and relationships between the club and the supporters seems to be slowly being broken. It might be 100 fans or so at a time however eventually the impact will add up.

It’s not surprising. The club never face up to anything, which is why Budge had to be dragged kicking and screaming to sack Levein (and then kept him on board anyway while trying to give the job to his equally woeful assistant)

[henryheart]

13 hours ago, wattie exploited said:

i never seen the poll am just going on people that I have talked to and stuff from the forum here so what was the big difference exactly as it doesn't matter if its one person or a  thousand   people they all  deserve a answer   or do you think that they don't 

 

The last time I looked the poll indicated that 30% of season ticket holders were unhappy. OK, it is a small sample, but if this reflects the overall position then there are over 3,000 unhappy people out there.  

[Tommy Brown]

4 hours ago, Tams bird said:

If were paying up your season ticket and stopped will that put you on the bad credit list with other companies (or what ever its called )?

 

You will get credit black listed, so definitely, not a good idea to do.

 

Not sure, who the chasers would be, Hearts of Finance Company.

 

If you do similar to a golf club membership, it's the golf club who are left with the debt, not the finance company. As an example.

 

[redjambo]

12 hours ago, iainmac said:

 

The club shill you quoted said "no new threads have been started" - conveniently ignoring that this very thread is still going strong at 60 pages and any "new threads" would be merged with this one anyway.

 

I have it on good authority that the new CEO doesn't feel that the level of complaints received is anything to worry about. Instead of looking at the situation holistically and asking "what could we have done better?", it looks like a case of "batten down the hatches" and let the storm pass. Almost a bit like someone that previously worked at the SFA might do?

 

Good post, IM.