SPFL and Covid ( Leagues 1 and 2 to restart )

[Spellczech]

2 minutes ago, MattyK82 said:

Absolutely. I should have added ‘and mainstream media’. Some of the reporting has been inflammatory, vicious, divisive and downright inaccurate. The list of journalists allowed at Tynecastle in future, you should be able to count on one hand. 

Agreed. It is time for a reckoning. We don't need the red tops - they seldom run anything positive about us. Just ban them. News tends to hit here as quickly or quicker than it reaches the media anyway. Keep the quality journos and ditch the garbage.

[jamboman9]

4 minutes ago, Smoked-Glass said:

Anything happened today 

Nah all quiet on the Western front  😬

[JamboAl1965]

Shouldn’t the Calpol three have asked SFA permission to litigate again us and Partick?  Shouldn’t that be investigated?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

8 minutes ago, Smoked-Glass said:

Anything happened today 

An Arab tried to noise up the board and failed miserably. Oh, and we set the record straight that our action is not directly against the Calpol 3.

[Ethan Hunt]

2 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

@Hagar the Horrible  @Ethan Hunt

 

If what you say about Clubs continuing to gang up on us is illegal then I can see us back in The COS in no time especially if the arbitration panel ignore it. 
I feel we are in our right to contact Lord Clark and highlight this unfair prejudice which is coming against us. Of course he may we’ll be watching from the wings and will step in if he feels it’s illegal.

It is further evidence - imo - that the SPFL (the company) is conducting its affairs - by allowing shareholders to act the way they are toward us - in a manner that is demonstrating unfair prejudice against us (encouraging and allowing other shareholders to essentially gang up on us). All that will be very technical arguments at the tribunal. We do not have to demonstrate what they have done/are doing is illegal, we need to demonstrate that what the have done/are doing is unlawful as there is no basis in law for them to have conducted some of their affairs in this manner. There is a difference between illegal and unlawful, and as I’ve stated lots of times there does not need to be an illegal act(s) to demonstrate unfair prejudice.

 

 

[Spellczech]

10 minutes ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

Why else would clubs continually elect Celtic and Rangers to the board in turn? Why else would Aberdeen vote to keep the 11-1 majority voting system? Clubs like St Johnstone voting for Celtic and Rangers’ best interests so they can get their fans to fill three of their stands four time’s a season. It’s utter pish.

TBH you also have to include Partick and Stranraer running to Rangers when Nelms got up to his side-deal shenanigans with money redistribution and promises of friendlies from "Big hitters"...

[Ethan Hunt]

59 minutes ago, Niemi’s gloves said:

Small but important question. Our statement today seems to imply that the SPFL is required to show utmost good faith (UGF) to the clubs (and vice versa) and similarly the clubs to each other. But my reading of the rule that has been quoted on here was that it isn’t  two-way: the clubs have to behave with UGF  to the SPLF but no mention of the other way round!
 

Is there another rule that requires UGF by the SPFL to the clubs? Shocking if not and presumably wouldn’t over-rule a general legal requirement to behave in a fair and unprejudiced way but....

As Doncaster frequently points out, the clubs are the SPFL.

[Don Dan]

2 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

It is further evidence - imo - that the SPFL (the company) is conducting its affairs - by allowing shareholders to act the way they are toward us - in a manner that is demonstrating unfair prejudice against us (encouraging and allowing other shareholders to essentially gang up on us). All that will be very technical arguments at the tribunal. We do not have to demonstrate what they have done/are doing is illegal, we need to demonstrate that what the have done/are doing is unlawful as there is no basis in law for them to have conducted some of their affairs in this manner. There is a difference between illegal and unlawful, and as I’ve stated lots of times there does not need to be an illegal act(s) to demonstrate unfair prejudice.

 

 

 Thanks for the answer👍

[Fozzyonthefence]

1 hour ago, Captain Canada said:

Where's the SPFL statement criticising the clubs for being in breach of a fundamental rule? 

 

Mr Admin Assistant will no doubt say it's nothing to do with him. 

Would this be something that might be within the SPFL Compliance Officer’s remit to serve the 3 clubs a notice of complaint?  Can this be raised by a fan?  🤔

[Beast Boy]

4 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

TBH you also have to include Partick and Stranraer running to Rangers when Nelms got up to his side-deal shenanigans with money redistribution and promises of friendlies from "Big hitters"...

Symptomatic of the whole charade too, I suppose. It’s depressing that that is the only way most clubs can make themselves heard nowadays. The Brown family at St Johnstone and that clown who used to own Kilmarnock are amongst the worst of these charlatans imo. They are essentially the Devil’s familiars.

[Boof]

1 hour ago, Ethan Hunt said:

Might be an idea for you all to scrape the back of your necks, what is the going rate for brass nowadays? 😂😂😂

 

£2.20/kg

[colinmaroon]

According to the SPFL rules it would seem that Dundee Utd, in begging for money from other member clubs have broken them

 

I await the condemnation for this specific action from the SPFL board.

 

 

[zakred]

2 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

According to the SPFL rules it would seem that Dundee Utd, in begging for money from other member clubs have broken them

 

I await the condemnation for this specific action from the SPFL board.

 

 

Come on now. it was probably their idea.

[Nookie Bear]

13 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

Would this be something that might be within the SPFL Compliance Officer’s remit to serve the 3 clubs a notice of complaint?  Can this be raised by a fan?  🤔

The Compliance Officer only investigates matters raised on Sportscene. 

[neilnunb]

5 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

According to the SPFL rules it would seem that Dundee Utd, in begging for money from other member clubs have broken them

 

I await the condemnation for this specific action from the SPFL board.

 

 

 

 

Should be fined £1m or kicked out the league for bringing the game into disrepute. 😁

Edited July 10, 2020 by neilnunb

[Ethan Hunt]

8 minutes ago, Boof said:

 

£2.20/kg

They’ll be millionaires then 👍

[John Findlay]

15 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

Would this be something that might be within the SPFL Compliance Officer’s remit to serve the 3 clubs a notice of complaint?  Can this be raised by a fan?  🤔

SPFL, do not have a compliance officer.

The compliance officer comes under the jurisdiction of the SFA. Compliance officer acts on the behalf of the SFA, not the SPFL.

[pablo]

1 hour ago, kila said:

I’m curious why Bob is so keen to defend the other clubs and their fans while having a go at our own. 

 

It's absolute weirdo behaviour at best. Several posts one after the other too. Irony being all he's doing is exemplifying his point that there are arsehole Hearts fans, assuming that he is one.

[Jimmy Jimmy]

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but could not see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

Edited July 10, 2020 by Jimmy Jimmy

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

1 hour ago, John Findlay said:

I understand where you are coming from, but I disagree with you regarding the voting. One club, one vote is correct to me. Afterall James Anderson multi millionaire gets the same amounts of votes as me £37,000pa in all elections.

What needs changing is the ridiculous rules regarding 11-1, 9-3, 81%, 75% etc etc. It should always be a simple majority even if that means 22-20 all clubs, 7-5 in a 12 team premiership and 6-4 in 10 team leagues.

I agree with no artificial pitches in the top league, but I know that's unrealistic as they do generate much needed income for the Kilmarnock's Livingston's Alloa's, Annan Atheletic's, Falkirk's, and Queen of the South's. Even Spartan's are having a new artificial pitch laid as I type and I know how much income that generates for them.

Scottish football needs a leader, who is not afraid of the big Glasgow two, and tells them straight. You are part of Scottish football, you are both NOT SCOTTISH FOOTBALL. 

The only difficulty is of finding someone of that stature. It sure as hell is not Ian Maxwell or Neil Doncaster.

It makes it difficult when you have tiny clubs and big clubs trying to arrange a set-up which suits all of them. The disparity between Celtic and Brechin for example is massive and while I agree with one club one vote, I think the SPFL is carrying too many clubs, some of whom are basically amateur.

 

Also, with regards to voting I reckon 9-3 majority is fair. If it’s just a simple majority, there’s a risk that change becomes too easy and too many needless or dubious measures are pushed through. The whole thing needs a rethink though, no question.

[One five]

2 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but couldn't see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

Welcome aboard mate.

[Fozzyonthefence]

5 minutes ago, John Findlay said:

SPFL, do not have a compliance officer.

The compliance officer comes under the jurisdiction of the SFA. Compliance officer acts on the behalf of the SFA, not the SPFL.

Fair enough but my question still stands. She reportedly issued letters to us and Partick in respect of a rule breach so presumably could do the same if the C3 have broken rules?

[Poseidon]

1 hour ago, Hagar the Horrible said:

 

We tested in court that we must all use arbitration first, so arbitration we go, what we won in court was access to the documentation.  So that will set a precedent for future litigation disputes. The point we lost on was the SPFL are a person.  We also won on this NOT being a football matter. So there is no come back from the SFA compliance officer because we clarified all of that in a court of law, and if the SFA are not in a position to arbitrate it can/will return back to the CoS. And equally where the Judge ruled that this was in the interest to be heard in public, but his hands were tied by Article 99.

 

He did agree that it was a football matter but raised that some of the rules could certainly be questioned in law. I.e. getting kicked out for challenging stuff.

 

He also only allowed the release of papers due to the severe timescales, he said in normal circumstances the arbitration panel would grant/deny such requests.

 

 

Agree with the vast majority of the rest though👍

Edited July 10, 2020 by Poseidon

[Jimmy Jimmy]

Cheers although I do feel like a lot of it will go way over my head. To be truthful, I didn't really pay much attention to Scottish football when living at home but always liked to keep an eye on where our international players were plying their trade

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

4 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

Fair enough but my question still stands. She reportedly issued letters to us and Partick in respect of a rule breach so presumably could do the same if the C3 have broken rules?

I assume the C3 would argue that they’re defending action rather than taking it

[Niemi’s gloves]

26 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

As Doncaster frequently points out, the clubs are the SPFL.

OK, I’ll rephrase that. The SPFL rules expound at great length on the behaviour and responsibilities of member clubs but seem to say very little about how the SPFL Board and its senior officials behave. So my question is this: do the SPFL rules require that the Board and senior officials of the SPFL show utmost good faith to the clubs?

 

[weegie jambo]

4 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Cheers although I do feel like a lot of it will go way over my head. To be truthful, I didn't really pay much attention to Scottish football when living at home but always liked to keep an eye on where our international players were plying their trade

Don't worry mate, just read thru a few threads and you'll catch up. Welcome aboard

[cjambo1993]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but could not see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

 

Welcome to the most relevant football club in Scotland mate. I'm absolutely certain that you will not regret your decision, there is never a dull moment following Hearts.

 

Add into the mix that we have the best rivals a football fan could possibly ask for and you will not be disappointed. 😎👍

[Beast Boy]

21 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

The Compliance Officer only investigates matters raised on Sportscene. 

Or by Scott Brown.

[jamboiain13]

1 hour ago, WorldChampions1902 said:

After watching that greasy Sky interview of Doncaster, Band Aid need to re-release their Christmas single with the following lyrics:-
 

[Paul Young]
It’s Charisma time,
There's no greed but be afraid.
At Charisma time,
Neil starts a fight but still gets paid,

[Boy George]
And in Neil’s world, it’s empty,
Of Sponsor’s cash and joy
Stick two fingers up to the world
At Charisma time.

[George Michael]
But say a prayer
Pray for the diddy clubs
At Charisma time

[Simon Le Bon]
But when you’re being ‘done’
There’s a League outside your window
And it’s a League that’s run by Neil

[Sting]
Without any goodwill flowing
There’ll be bitterness for years

[Bono & Sting]
And Charisma masks the wrongs there
They’re the ‘elephant in the room’

[Bono]
Well thank god it’s them
Instead of you

[Boy George & Others]
And there won’t be ‘dough’ in Clubs accounts on Budgement Day
The greatest gift they'll get this year is Fife (Ooooo)
Where everybody knows, no Raith or Rovers ‘glow’
Do they know it’s Christmas time at all?

[Marilyn & Glenn Gregor]
Tears to you

[Paul Young]
Raze the grounds for everyone

[Marilyn & Glenn Gregor]
Tears to them

[Paul Young, Marilyn & Glenn Gregor]
Underneath that ‘smoking gun’
Do they know that all their clubs will fall?

[Chorus: all]
Greed’s the word
Greed’s the word
Greed’s the word
Let them know it’s Budgement day again

Greed’s the word
Let them know it’s Budgement day again

 

I’ll get ma jaiket. 

 

 

brilliant!

 

[I.T.K]

40 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

As Doncaster frequently points out, the clubs are the SPFL.

 

 

He's slithery snake. 

[AllyjamboDerbyshire]

2 hours ago, Heartsmad1874 said:

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/joint-club-statement-1-2-3

Will be hard for the SMSM to spin that statement to fit their preferred narrative. Makes it clear that there was never any need for the three fall guys to get involved in expensive litigation, though it's their right to do so, and, importantly, that we didn't take them to court, it was their choice to go. Good to see, too, the use of the following, and I wonder if anyone from the SMSM will use it, other than Tom English, in anything they care to write about the statement. Hopefully, not 'letting it pass without comment' will apply in arbitration, also.

 

'We consider such an approach to be at odds with the fundamental requirement of the SPFL rules that the SPFL and each Club shall behave towards each other with the utmost good faith.  We cannot therefore let that pass without comment.'

[Beast Boy]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Cheers although I do feel like a lot of it will go way over my head. To be truthful, I didn't really pay much attention to Scottish football when living at home but always liked to keep an eye on where our international players were plying their trade

You’ve made a good choice. You will have ups and downs, but the good always far outweighs the bad. There is a feeling around the club that we are close to taking off again, after a period of lean times. All the infrastructure is now in place, and when we get it right on the pitch again, we should be a force.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

Just now, AllyjamboDerbyshire said:

Will be hard for the SMSM to spin that statement to fit their preferred narrative. Makes it clear that there was never any need for the three fall guys to get involved in expensive litigation, though it's their right to do so, and, importantly, that we didn't take them to court, it was their choice to go. Good to see, too, the use of the following, and I wonder if anyone from the SMSM will use it, other than Tom English, in anything they care to write about the statement. Hopefully, not 'letting it pass without comment' will apply in arbitration, also.

 

'We consider such an approach to be at odds with the fundamental requirement of the SPFL rules that the SPFL and each Club shall behave towards each other with the utmost good faith.  We cannot therefore let that pass without comment.'

I don’t understand why those three clubs took legal action separately. Makes no sense

[upgotheheads]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Cheers although I do feel like a lot of it will go way over my head. To be truthful, I didn't really pay much attention to Scottish football when living at home but always liked to keep an eye on where our international players were plying their trade

 

If you have never been to Tynecastle  you will find a modern stadium, steep stands tight on to the pitch, and an electric atmosphere which has been recognised throughout Europe as being one of the best. Enjoy (hopefully)

[Ribble]

1 minute ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I don’t understand why those three clubs took legal action separately. Makes no sense

 

Yeah me either, raise a joint defence and split the costs of 1 QC with the SPFL surley?

[AllyjamboDerbyshire]

Just now, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I don’t understand why those three clubs took legal action separately. Makes no sense

As discussed for a short while earlier, it appears to be a part of the 'Stockholm Syndrome' that has blighted Scottish football for as long as I can remember, and for a long time before that, I'm sure. No money, but afraid to 'let the side down' even though that 'side' is seldom on theirs when they need it.

[poultry]

Just now, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but could not see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

Welcome JJ , don't know if you knew but theres an Ulster Hearts supporters club on the go with a good few members. Should have a look if your on Facebook. Anyway hope you enjoy your new found club. HHGH

[Fozzyonthefence]

6 minutes ago, upgotheheads said:

 

If you have never been to Tynecastle  you will find a modern stadium, steep stands tight on to the pitch, and an electric atmosphere which has been recognised throughout Europe as being one of the best. Enjoy (hopefully)

Pretty much every team in the Premier League, except Rangers, enjoyed it last season!

[neilnunb]

I see Amiens have lost their case.

 

[AllyjamboDerbyshire]

2 hours ago, George Cowie said:

Except Stranraer , obviously! 
 

Hope we haven’t shot ourselves in the foot with that bit !

I think 'our position' includes the wherewithal to take that action. Stranraer obviously don't have that...so no shot to the foot

[OTT]

Its quite funny that Dundee Utd have inadvertently broken the rules  

 

I thought clubs would have someone on hand to advise on these matters? Like an in house lawyer who is fully clued up on the ins and outs of the SPFL/SFA rule book?

 

I'd be careful if I was Budge though. If we fight it hard it might inadvertently build support for them. If they've managed to get a pittance then just leave them with it, or possibly make the complaint afterwards. 

 

I'd be very interested to know which club can even afford to contribute (as will that clubs players!). You can't very well be asking players to take deferrals and cuts then be donating to a legal defence which has jack shit to do with you. Hibs for example, cuts and deferrals and have just spent £250k+ on a striker. If they've contributed I dare say the players will be livid. My guess is Ayr and Ross County though. Both Chairmen were pretty open about their dislike for us. 

 

[Cruyff]

27 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but could not see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

Welcome Jimmy Jimmy 👍 

[millerjames398]

27 minutes ago, Jimmy Jimmy said:

Morning all - newbie here so a bit of background info. Just moved to Edinburgh from Northern Ireland (one son in Aberdeen, one in Newcastle so here is in the middle) so have decided to follow Hearts mainly because of the high percentage of NI players here although Boyce rarely starts for NI.

 

I was going to do an introductory thread but could not see how to, maybe I have to serve a period of time first.

 

And as this was the biggest thread, I thought I would start here. What on earth is going on with Scottish Football.

 

My username is also a reference to my favourite Undertones song although it could be a tribute to our rich friend!

Welcome to the hotel California 👍🏼🇱🇻

[Gambo]

Clever straight to the point statement by Hearts/PTFC.

 

Just sticking to the facts. 

[OTT]

1 minute ago, neilnunb said:

I see Amiens have lost their case.

 

 

I wouldn't read too much into it. I think  the Belgian club have been saved on appeal? The SPFL are probably closer to the organisational set up in Belgium than France (pretty sure Belgian league is club owned or something), so pinch of salt IMO. 

All 3 nations laws are different so could well be that competition law in Scotland is much stricter than Belgium or France. I'm sure one of our resident legal eagles could investigate they are bored in lockdown

 

Trying not to get too up or down about it to avoid being too gutted if we do lose. We've not taken it lying down which is first and foremost what I wanted to see. 

[frankblack]

13 minutes ago, Ribble said:

 

Yeah me either, raise a joint defence and split the costs of 1 QC with the SPFL surley?

 

That is a point I've made several times.  The liability of the SPFL will be 1/4 now since there are 4 of them, and thus the member clubs (which includes the C3 too) will be due their 1/40th share of a quarter of the costs they would have faced if it was just the SPFL.

 

Could be a sore one for the C3.

[Poseidon]

Looks like in France the judge couldn't force reinstatement and so Amiens are resigned to playing in Ligue 2 but will still take it to the highest level and at least seek compensation if I've understood it correctly.

[Fitba' broke my Heart]

1 hour ago, Bigyan said:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.deadlinenews.co.uk/2020/07/08/bill-clark-reveals-support-from-fellow-spfl-clubs-as-raith-rovers-dundee-united-cove-rangers-remain-in-legal-fight-spfl-hearts-partick-thistle-scottish-fa-arbitration/amp/

 I'm catching up apologies for any repetition.

Bill Clark total ****ing roaster.

If he is that bothered what people think of him he should say why he voted the way he did and not be too frightened to put it into the public domain.

Unless of course he would not like his reputation to be fainted by the truth.

Or indeed, have it adversely influence the course of arbitration. 

 

[Spellczech]

46 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

The Compliance Officer only investigates matters raised on Sportscene. 

Probably the only football she watches...