Wage cut for players and staff (Statement on 24/4)

[Clerry Jambo]

4 minutes ago, droid said:

The worst Hearts team in living memory refusing to take a pay cut? Invoke clause 12 or whatever the **** it’s called and empty the lot of them. Guffy’s!!!

Word of the season mate Guffy’s👍

[EIEIO]

42 minutes ago, droid said:

The worst Hearts team in living memory refusing to take a pay cut? Invoke clause 12 or whatever the **** it’s called and empty the lot of them. Guffy’s!!!

Agreed.

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Clerry Jambo said:

Has Budge got time to deal with this now, with all these meetings lined up with reconstruction on the table!!

Ask her.

[husref musemic]

1 hour ago, GorgieRules22 said:

Empty the ****in lot of them, if your not willing to take a cut there’s the door.

As someone who got the boot from my job on day 1 of the lockdown I'm less than sympathetic shall we say.

[Leveins Battalion]

Not one of our team I would miss,every one of them are pathetic.Michael Smith aside a team full of hopeless gutless shitebags 👋

[Le Chat]

2 hours ago, Dagger Is Back said:

If they don't have the common decency to do the right thing, then it's just further proof that Leveins aim of recruiting people with the 'right character' was yet another failure to add to the regimes list

 

A good point.

 

1 hour ago, droid said:

The worst Hearts team in living memory refusing to take a pay cut? Invoke clause 12 or whatever the **** it’s called and empty the lot of them. Guffy’s!!!

 

A very good point and an even better word

 

[GorgieRules22]

Can the Foundation members who are on the board not update us with regards to the players being paid ? I’m really interested to know if they’ve agreed to this yet.

[i8hibsh]

Let this sink in:

 

We are getting relegated

We have little income at present

 

We are paying these jokers a handsome wage.

[theshed]

12 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

Let this sink in:

 

We are getting relegated

We have little income at present

 

We are paying these jokers a handsome wage.

 

When we are relegated hopefully half these jokers can be emptied although a few probably won’t want to leave even if they have a clause in their contract that lets them as won’t get same money elsewhere 

[Unknown user]

33 minutes ago, theshed said:

 

When we are relegated hopefully half these jokers can be emptied although a few probably won’t want to leave even if they have a clause in their contract that lets them as won’t get same money elsewhere 

We're not being relegated, we're being expelled.

[Forever Hearts]

7 hours ago, JamboAl said:

Ask her.

Good answer. 🙄

[The Old Tolbooth]

8 hours ago, GorgieRules22 said:

Empty the ****in lot of them, if your not willing to take a cut there’s the door.

Absolutely this! I’d keep hardly any of them! 

[Pasquale for King]

Two things I noticed today, apologies if it’s been mentioned. 
Serie B team Ascoli in Italy sacked their coaching team who refused to terminate their contracts with a settlement attached.

Gary Neville reckons there will be a thousand league 1&2 players out of contract come July who clubs won’t be able to pick up so to speak. 
 

[Mikey1874]

Will be some welcome good news and at least a small PR win for Ann Budge if she can announce this. 

 

Maybe an opportunity to set things straight too. And with the Championship and the need for cuts looking much more likely too. 

 

Start of the rebuild. 

[davemclaren]

12 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Two things I noticed today, apologies if it’s been mentioned. 
Serie B team Ascoli in Italy sacked their coaching team who refused to terminate their contracts with a settlement attached.

Gary Neville reckons there will be a thousand league 1&2 players out of contract come July who clubs won’t be able to pick up so to speak. 
 

Likely to be a lot if players out of a job in July. 

[Hectormasson]

22 hours ago, droid said:

The worst Hearts team in living memory refusing to take a pay cut? Invoke clause 12 or whatever the **** it’s called and empty the lot of them. Guffy’s!!!

Bin the lot ! F....g charlatans!!!!

[EIEIO]

6 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Likely to be a lot if players out of a job in July. 

Plenty ready and willing to replace our much loved first team squad. Every cloud has a silver lining. Time to be ruthless with the players if not the SPFL(though I'd rather we were).

[flem]

Ann Budge could win back a bit of respect with the fan base by invoking article 12 and clearing the deck of these impostors that claim to be football players.  

[willie wallace]

Even if she does not want to name anyone at this stage sbe could possibbly give us an Idea of the numbers(if any) who have rejected the offer .

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, davemclaren said:

Likely to be a lot if players out of a job in July. 

Ir's difficult to imagine otherwise.

Whether wages have been deferred or cut, for 3 months or so , it is against a background of virtually no money coming in and little chance of making up the shortfall any time soon.  That means clubs will have vastly reduced financial reserves or increased debt.  How can they soften the blow?

- get rid of (most of the) staff whose contracts are ending

- sell your best player(s) but who's going to buy and even if they do you can forget about current market value: it will be a buyer's market

- put up ST and walk-up prices but that could backfire

I'm sure there are many other possibilities but, when all's said and done, the money will most likely come out of the same pockets ie the fans'.

[davemclaren]

9 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Ir's difficult to imagine otherwise.

Whether wages have been deferred or cut, for 3 months or so , it is against a background of virtually no money coming in and little chance of making up the shortfall any time soon.  That means clubs will have vastly reduced financial reserves or increased debt.  How can they soften the blow?

- get rid of (most of the) staff whose contracts are ending

- sell your best player(s) but who's going to buy and even if they do you can forget about current market value: it will be a buyer's market

- put up ST and walk-up prices but that could backfire

I'm sure there are many other possibilities but, when all's said and done, the money will most likely come out of the same pockets ie the fans'.

Absolutely. Dark days ahead for professional football. 

[wavydavy]

So we all know that Ann loves a Statement so why doesn't she give us an update on wtf is going on with this greedy *******s that call themselves Hearts Players.

 

Irrespective of what is in their contracts are these guys blind?  Do they not see what is happeneing to others much less fortunate then them in the current dreadful situation.

 

We all know that a footballers life is a relatively short one and some of these guys will be out of work maybe quite soon and that is tough but what about the one's who still have  a fair bit of time on their contracts? 

 

Ann seems to be a person eager to show the club in a good light by many of the  things she has set up supporting either local groups or under privileged people and kids etc which is all admiralble.

 

On this basis it seems a number of our own players are showing a side of the club that totally contradicts what she is trying to do.

 

So get an update out there for us to see please AB.

[TheOak88]

On 16/04/2020 at 15:54, Leveins Battalion said:

Not one of our team I would miss,every one of them are pathetic.Michael Smith aside a team full of hopeless gutless shitebags 👋

 

Its difficult to recall a less likeable Hearts squad. 

[johnthomas]

Are players refusing to take a wage cut ?

It's like reading the Daily Mail on here half the time

[J.T.F.Robertson]

4 minutes ago, TheOak88 said:

 

Its impossible to recall a less likeable Hearts squad. 

 

My take.

 

[wavydavy]

9 hours ago, johnthomas said:

Are players refusing to take a wage cut ?

It's like reading the Daily Mail on here half the time

It's hard to tell as the media and our Chairman seem to be neglecting to say.

 

Our Ann who usually likes to make a Statement has dried up on this topic.

 

The last I heard was that a large number of players were refusing to take a cut and Fraser Wishart was fighting their corner.

 

Her original plans were that they would be paid in full until the end of this month.

 

She should just make them redundant in my opinion.

[JamboAl]

26 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

It's hard to tell as the media and our Chairman seem to be neglecting to say.

 

Our Ann who usually likes to make a Statement has dried up on this topic.

 

The last I heard was that a large number of players were refusing to take a cut and Fraser Wishart was fighting their corner.

 

Her original plans were that they would be paid in full until the end of this month.

 

She should just make them redundant in my opinion.

The last I heard was that she was negotiating with 2 players.  She had already said that any player with challenging circumstances should come and see the manager, HR or her.  If someone did have challenging circumstances it is unlikely they would wish the details splashed over the media nor exaggerated by some all too willing joke of a journalist.

 

You say AB likes to make a statement but so does Fraser Wishart and I assume you have not heard from him either.   Do you not think that suggests all are happyish or at least that we haven't reached an impasse?

 

Personally I think these matters should be kept in-house anyway and despite the emotional attachment supporters have to a club, that does not entitle them to know chapter and verse re what is going on between employer and employee.  Some things are confidential.

[BEDNAR BOY]

Know a bit about the players Union and Fraser Wishart is not liked ! 

Difficult to deal with, difficult to talk to and keen to take as much credit and media hype as he can by doing as little as possible.

 

[wavydavy]

21 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

The last I heard was that she was negotiating with 2 players.  She had already said that any player with challenging circumstances should come and see the manager, HR or her.  If someone did have challenging circumstances it is unlikely they would wish the details splashed over the media nor exaggerated by some all too willing joke of a journalist.

 

You say AB likes to make a statement but so does Fraser Wishart and I assume you have not heard from him either.   Do you not think that suggests all are happyish or at least that we haven't reached an impasse?

 

Personally I think these matters should be kept in-house anyway and despite the emotional attachment supporters have to a club, that does not entitle them to know chapter and verse re what is going on between employer and employee.  Some things are confidential.

 

Thanks for the info AL.

 

I have to say that I disagree on keeping it in house. I don't mean revealing details of individuals salaries but just the fact that it has or hasn't been resolved.

 

She was quick off the mark to announce wage cuts but has been slow to provide updates so the confidetiality didn't bother her then.

 

Lots of Hearts fans will have had to take major cuts in their incomes and here we are asking fans to dig deep into buying season tickets for next season when we don't even know what league we will be playing in or if the players have helped the club.

 

So a bit of clarity on the players situation might help with this.

[it_hearts]

7 minutes ago, BEDNAR BOY said:

Know a bit about the players Union and Fraser Wishart is not liked ! 

Difficult to deal with, difficult to talk to and keen to take as much credit and media hype as he can by doing as little as possible.

 

If/when we are relegated,  i hope he doesn't try to put blame on us for sacking players. How come that  Wishart etc are not now having a go at spfl and teams voting for proposal? They must have got involved when the proposal first came out to say, this is going to make players unemployed.  This proposal cant go ahead surely. 

[JamboAl]

22 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

Thanks for the info AL.

 

I have to say that I disagree on keeping it in house. I don't mean revealing details of individuals salaries but just the fact that it has or hasn't been resolved.

 

If they are still in negotiation, there may be little or nothing to reveal.

 

She was quick off the mark to announce wage cuts but has been slow to provide updates so the confidetiality didn't bother her then.

 

There was no confidentiality about that.   I would imagine that was a commercial necessity and fans would soon have become worried about our very existence if she continued to pay full salaries from severely reduced revenue.  What should she have done?

 

Lots of Hearts fans will have had to take major cuts in their incomes and here we are asking fans to dig deep into buying season tickets for next season when we don't even know what league we will be playing in or if the players have helped the club.

 

The buying of STs is optional.  Don't do it if you don't want to.  The club have gone some small way to help by offering a 10% reduction and at least 1000 of our fans (who have already bought) are not too worried about that.  FWIW I shall also be renewing and from the POV of supporting the club I couldn't care less what division we are playing in.

 

So a bit of clarity on the players situation might help with this.

Are you seriously suggesting that unless she keeps you up to date with all that's going on internally, you'll pick up your bat and ball and go home?

Edited April 18, 2020 by JamboAl

[Beast Boy]

Won’t miss the vast majority of them.

[maroonsgotop]

football players living in a their very own bubble devoid from reality and in which they clearly do not give a flying toss about anything going on outside it. absolutely criminal

[luckydug]

Wish she would just invoke Article 12.

These players don't deserve any loyalty from the. Club. 

 

[johnthomas]

2 hours ago, wavydavy said:

It's hard to tell as the media and our Chairman seem to be neglecting to say.

 

Our Ann who usually likes to make a Statement has dried up on this topic.

 

The last I heard was that a large number of players were refusing to take a cut and Fraser Wishart was fighting their corner.

 

Her original plans were that they would be paid in full until the end of this month.

 

She should just make them redundant in my opinion.

So people know nothing but make judgements anyway ?

Definitely Daily Mail .

Negotiation ongoing , no statement .

That is wrong how ?

[jock _turd]

21 minutes ago, luckydug said:

Wish she would just invoke Article 12.

These players don't deserve any loyalty from the. Club. 

 

 

I know it is impossible but 1000% this! That shower of useless F'n no marks should be told they are getting nada until football recommences.

Edited April 18, 2020 by jock _turd

[jock _turd]

28 minutes ago, maroonsgotop said:

football players living in a their very own bubble devoid from reality and in which they clearly do not give a flying toss about anything going on outside it. absolutely criminal

 

Most of them will be sitting around there apartments having the odd snort now and then of the stash from their to the door delivery boys.

[wavydavy]

1 hour ago, JamboAl said:

Are you seriously suggesting that unless she keeps you up to date with all that's going on internally, you'll pick up your bat and ball and go home?

 

I see you are back to your old form Al. Being locked up has got you back to your old reasoning.

 

If you seriously think that is what my post is about then you just carry on. 

 

I think most people will get my point.

[wavydavy]

22 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

So people know nothing but make judgements anyway ?

 

AB makes a statement and then doesn't follow it up with updates?

Quote

Definitely Daily Mail .

 

Don't get this comment, it's my opinion and I dislike everything the Daily Mail stands for.

Quote

Negotiation ongoing , no statement .

 

How long does it take to make a few changes to a contract? With others in the world having little or no choice in the matter it hardly shows them a s decent light

Quote

That is wrong how ?

 

I think under the circumstances it would help to give an update. As I said she was quick to point out at the outset what her plans were but no update.

 

I never said it was wrong that's your words I just thought an update would maybe help especially when she is trying to sell season tickets.

Edited April 18, 2020 by wavydavy

[Mikey1874]

I would suspect players were given a date / deadline to decide. 

 

Would think that deadline is coming up soon. 

[davemclaren]

22 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

I would suspect players were given a date / deadline to decide. 

 

Would think that deadline is coming up soon. 

Must be as pay day is looming. 

[JamboAl]

42 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

I see you are back to your old form Al. Being locked up has got you back to your old reasoning.

 

If you seriously think that is what my post is about then you just carry on. 

 

I think most people will get my point.

I see you are back to playing the man and not the ball.  Try just justifying what your moan really is.  You want to moan about something but you're not sure what.

A couple of posts back you seem to be criticising AB for making statements and in the very same sentence denouncing her for not making one.

 

 

Our Ann who usually likes to make a Statement has dried up on this topic.

[johnthomas]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

AB makes a statement and then doesn't follow it up with updates?

 

Don't get this comment, it's my opinion and I dislike everything the Daily Mail stands for.

 

How long does it take to make a few changes to a contract? With others in the world having little or no choice in the matter it hardly shows them a s decent light

 

I think under the circumstances it would help to give an update. As I said she was quick to point out at the outset what her plans were but no update.

 

I never said it was wrong that's your words I just thought an update would maybe help especially when she is trying to sell season tickets.

Posters ranting and raving about things they know nothing of . That is very Daily Mail , pleased to hear it doesn't apply to yourself .

If things haven't been settled (I agree they should be) surely she can hardly comment .

Tbh if she makes a statement she is wrong (and misquoted) if she doesn't she is wrong .

[wavydavy]

5 hours ago, JamboAl said:

I see you are back to playing the man and not the ball.  Try just justifying what your moan really is.  You want to moan about something but you're not sure what.

A couple of posts back you seem to be criticising AB for making statements and in the very same sentence denouncing her for not making one.

 

 

Our Ann who usually likes to make a Statement has dried up on this topic.

 

If that's how you read it then I didn't word it properly as that was not my intention or you misunderstood. I was inferring that she likes to make statements but on this topic has gone very quiet. 

 

I actually think it is a good idea updating the fans on what is going on with all aspects of the club. What I don't like is when she makes a statement and then seems to take an eternity to give any follow up. An example being when she gave her review of her side of the business and then said she would do the same for the "Footballing" side and it seemed to take forever.

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

If that's how you read it then I didn't word it properly as that was not my intention or you misunderstood. I was inferring that she likes to make statements but on this topic has gone very quiet. 

 

I actually think it is a good idea updating the fans on what is going on with all aspects of the club. What I don't like is when she makes a statement and then seems to take an eternity to give any follow up. An example being when she gave her review of her side of the business and then said she would do the same for the "Footballing" side and it seemed to take forever.

I don't think I did misunderstand.  You seem to want a statement when you want one otherwise she should keep quiet.  YOU think it is a good idea to update fans but if there's nothing new to report then what's the point?  If, and I say, IF she is still negotiating with players what update do you want?  

[wavydavy]

1 hour ago, JamboAl said:

I don't think I did misunderstand.  You seem to want a statement when you want one otherwise she should keep quiet.  YOU think it is a good idea to update fans but if there's nothing new to report then what's the point?  If, and I say, IF she is still negotiating with players what update do you want?  

 

This is totally made up by you where have I said she should keep quiet?

 

You are suggesting it is only ME that wants and update which is total nonsense. I have already said that I think it is good that she makes Statements to update fans on what is going on just as she did when she talked about having to take measures to reduce staff wages.

 

My criticism if it can been seen as such is that she can wait a fair time before providing updates as  previously suggested re the Footballing Side of the business and she is doing it now re the players wages.

 

I am only saying that it would be nice to have an update and if she is still working on it then say so. Quite simple really. 

 

I think it is a topic that is particularly relevent at the moment and she obviously thought so to when she reacted so quickly to reduce other staff wages which received a lot of media coverage. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

13 hours ago, wavydavy said:

 

Thanks for the info AL.

 

I have to say that I disagree on keeping it in house. I don't mean revealing details of individuals salaries but just the fact that it has or hasn't been resolved.

 

She was quick off the mark to announce wage cuts but has been slow to provide updates so the confidetiality didn't bother her then.

 

Lots of Hearts fans will have had to take major cuts in their incomes and here we are asking fans to dig deep into buying season tickets for next season when we don't even know what league we will be playing in or if the players have helped the club.

 

So a bit of clarity on the players situation might help with this.

 

Probably because everything now rests on the reconstruction thing. If we are finally relegated after all this carry-on, we'll no doubt be getting rid of a lot of players by whatever means possible through necessity. As long as we're in with a chance of staying up, decisions about many players will probably be delayed.

[JamboAl]

29 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

This is totally made up by you where have I said she should keep quiet?

 

You are suggesting it is only ME that wants and update which is total nonsense. I have already said that I think it is good that she makes Statements to update fans on what is going on just as she did when she talked about having to take measures to reduce staff wages.

 

My criticism if it can been seen as such is that she can wait a fair time before providing updates as  previously suggested re the Footballing Side of the business and she is doing it now re the players wages.

 

I am only saying that it would be nice to have an update and if she is still working on it then say so. Quite simple really. 

 

I think it is a topic that is particularly relevent at the moment and she obviously thought so to when she reacted so quickly to reduce other staff wages which received a lot of media coverage. 

She has issued one or two statements recently mainly to do with the SPL fiasco and keeping fans updated, presumably because there is something to say - or maybe because (to quote your good self) Our Ann likes a statement.  Since announcing the first cut (50%), she later came out and updated re furlough and a revised cut to maximum 30%.

That suggests to me that she does update when there is something to say.

If she issued a statement just now saying agreement had not yet been reached with the players who have not yet settled, you can be sure that the weegie press would have a headline like HEARTS PLAYERS IN WAGE STAND-OFF.  If she issued a statement saying good progress is being made, that could be giving false hope which could even prejudice settlement.

Acordingly I would have thought it wise not to say anything until there is something worthwhile to say and, bear in mind, it may the players/agents who are causing the delay in what are difficult times for everyone.

PS  If you want an update I suggest you contact Fraser Wishart.  He is the expert on wage cuts and you will have read his report on the Celtic cuts.....oh wait.

[wavydavy]

10 hours ago, JamboAl said:

She has issued one or two statements recently mainly to do with the SPL fiasco and keeping fans updated, presumably because there is something to say - or maybe because (to quote your good self) Our Ann likes a statement.  Since announcing the first cut (50%), she later came out and updated re furlough and a revised cut to maximum 30%.

That suggests to me that she does update when there is something to say.

If she issued a statement just now saying agreement had not yet been reached with the players who have not yet settled, you can be sure that the weegie press would have a headline like HEARTS PLAYERS IN WAGE STAND-OFF.  If she issued a statement saying good progress is being made, that could be giving false hope which could even prejudice settlement.

Acordingly I would have thought it wise not to say anything until there is something worthwhile to say and, bear in mind, it may the players/agents who are causing the delay in what are difficult times for everyone.

PS  If you want an update I suggest you contact Fraser Wishart.  He is the expert on wage cuts and you will have read his report on the Celtic cuts.....oh wait.

 

 

I take it youir tongue is firmly in your cheek with this comment.

 

Irrespective of whether we get an update or not I would sincerely hope that the players who are prominent in this are nowehere near our club next season assuming we have one. 

[JamboAl]

12 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

 

I take it youir tongue is firmly in your cheek with this comment.

 

Irrespective of whether we get an update or not I would sincerely hope that the players who are prominent in this are nowehere near our club next season assuming we have one. 

I agree in principle with your last sentence unless the player has genuine challenging circumstances.