Wage cut for players and staff (Statement on 24/4)

[HMFC01]

8 minutes ago, busby1985 said:

They think they’ll be back, playing football again by July. Their players are in the same boat as some of ours by saying they won’t accept anything other than wage deferrals, they’ve been saying that since day dot of the shut down. PFA have been involved in this as well, just hasn’t made the press shock horror. 3 month, full deferral of wages for one player will be around 360k, say they have an average wage of 20k and 28 first team players, that’s 6.7million Of owed wages. McGregor, Kent, Goldson, Defoe, Morelos, Tav, Arfield, Jack, Gerrard all on over 20k a week. Crazy stuff. 

Seems abit vague compared to budges' statements.  Less questions asked by media by looks of it, just a straight statement.  I am guessing they fancy to still sell Morelos for £25 m to get them out.

 

I am wondering if Rangers have suspended the players wages currently.  Not really clear to me

[Footballfirst]

7 minutes ago, busby1985 said:

They think they’ll be back, playing football again by July. Their players are in the same boat as some of ours by saying they won’t accept anything other than wage deferrals, they’ve been saying that since day dot of the shut down. PFA have been involved in this as well, just hasn’t made the press shock horror. 3 month, full deferral of wages for one player will be around 360k, say they have an average wage of 20k and 28 first team players, that’s 6.7million Of owed wages. McGregor, Kent, Goldson, Defoe, Morelos, Tav, Arfield, Jack, Gerrard all on over 20k a week. Crazy stuff. 

 

I would guess that it is only a proportion that is being deferred as the statement says that staff "have volunteered to take a salary deferral for the next three months"  The lack of a quantum for the deferral leaves it open to be anything from zero to 100%, but I can't really see everyone quietly accepting 100%.

 

Two related issues would be firstly that they won't be in danger of failing to pay their PAYE or NICs if the deferral is substantial. The other is that it will have to be quantified in their accounts to 30 June as a current liability, so we will find out the quantum involved.

 

[busby1985]

4 minutes ago, HMFC01 said:

Seems abit vague compared to budges' statements.  Less questions asked by media by looks of it, just a straight statement.  I am guessing they fancy to still sell Morelos for £25 m to get them out.

 

I am wondering if Rangers have suspended the players wages currently.  Not really clear to me

They aren’t taken any wages (from what I know) for the next three months. They think they’ll be back playing by July. 

Edited April 6, 2020 by busby1985

[JamboAl]

23 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

Yes it is probably best somewhere in the middle. I get what you are saying about not punishing  a player for being injured but that should work two ways. 

 

I wonder sometimes just how eager some of these players are to come back from injury when they are getting almost a full salary? But then that is probably just me and how my mind works. I am sure you will agree Al.😍

I do agree.

Whichever method we use there are pros and cons.

There is no easy answer.

Edited April 6, 2020 by JamboAl

[HMFC01]

Ok, cheers 👍

[Guest ToqueJambo]

2 hours ago, Fozzyonthefence said:

16 or more wouldn’t work as we don’t have enough quality / bigger teams to make it work and also results in a lot more meaningless games.  It didn’t work before (that’s why we scrapped it for a 10 which was one of the most competitive and successful periods in Scottish football history) and it won’t work again. 
 

Having said that, I’ve come to accept that Scottish football would be shite irrespective of how big a league we have.

 

16 right now would include D Utd, Caley, Dundee and Ayr. All are more than big enough plus it would mean adding three very competitive derbies to the calendar.

[Cigaro]

16 gives us 30 games. Was there not talk of a uefa minimum number of league games when this was discussed a few years back?

 

16/18 for me. No stupid split. Home/away once each. Never happen though.

[HMFC01]

Next on the agenda.  What are the 2 Hearts players wanting from the club.  Today were suppose to be discussions with Budge and 2 mystery players (currently contracted).

 

Hopefully get some news before it gets late.  Although I doubt the papers will get wind of it until Budge says it's ok in another statement. 

Edited April 6, 2020 by HMFC01

[Guest ToqueJambo]

29 minutes ago, busby1985 said:

They think they’ll be back, playing football again by July. Their players are in the same boat as some of ours by saying they won’t accept anything other than wage deferrals, they’ve been saying that since day dot of the shut down. PFA have been involved in this as well, just hasn’t made the press shock horror. 3 month, full deferral of wages for one player will be around 360k, say they have an average wage of 20k and 28 first team players, that’s 6.7million Of owed wages. McGregor, Kent, Goldson, Defoe, Morelos, Tav, Arfield, Jack, Gerrard all on over 20k a week. Crazy stuff. 

 

Interesting Rangers put a timeline on it. I don't think Aberdeen and Hibs did. What happens after 3 months if, as is likely, there will be no football on the horizon? Deferring wages indefinitely is really stupid, but deferring them temporarily could just mean delaying cutting wages or letting players go, except they would still be on the hook for a massive amount of deferred wages for players who may not play for them again.

[HMFC01]

Aberdeen said until September.  Hibs was 2 part payments, can't recall the dates but 1 is the end of this year possibly December I think the other next year maybe March?

Edited April 6, 2020 by HMFC01

[gorgie rd eh11]

 

 

 14 is the maximum the top division will ever be. Unless 4 old firm games are guaranteed it won't be considered.

[Footballfirst]

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

[HMFC01]

Cheers 👍

[Fozzyonthefence]

2 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

According to the headline it’s a pay cut (which it clearly isn’t), then the small print underneath contradicts that by saying it’s a deferral.  Red Tops at their best!

[Hungry hippo]

53 minutes ago, HMFC01 said:

Next on the agenda.  What are the 2 Hearts players wanting from the club.  Today were suppose to be discussions with Budge and 2 mystery players (currently contracted).

 

Hopefully get some news before it gets late.  Although I doubt the papers will get wind of it until Budge says it's ok in another statement. 

 

Ann Budge said she had been able to speak with all the players with the exception of two who she would speak to today. Got the impression there was nothing too different about those players other than she wasn't able to speak with them last week for whatever reason.

[HMFC01]

True, some were talking to their wives others were chatting to the pfa ☺️

 

Yeah it's probably just that.  O'well back to chatting about Uefa/SPFA 🤪

[RENE]

34 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

Helps with their cash flow.  Obviously hoping for extra money coming in before August....

[Lovecraft]

2 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

6 pages of puzzles,

 

 

Ya dancer.

 

Imagine I just bought a puzzle book instead and checked the internet for news.

 

Result!

 

🙂

 

 

[Lovecraft]

1 hour ago, RENE said:

Helps with their cash flow.  Obviously hoping for extra money coming in before August....

 Are you suggesting the puzzles aren't free?

 

 

[Last Laff]

1 hour ago, RENE said:

Helps with their cash flow.  Obviously hoping for extra money coming in before August....

Season ticket sales will be more than enough to see them through.  If not flog Morelos and then Defoe is away back to Bournemouth.  Kent seems a disaster for them mind you. 

[Pasquale for King]

23 minutes ago, Lovecraft said:

6 pages of puzzles,

 

 

Ya dancer.

 

Imagine I just bought a puzzle book instead and checked the internet for news.

 

Result!

 

🙂

 

 

I think it’s in the middle too so just swipe it out and don’t buy it 😜

[Pasquale for King]

21 minutes ago, Last Laff said:

Season ticket sales will be more than enough to see them through.  If not flog Morelos and then Defoe is away back to Bournemouth.  Kent seems a disaster for them mind you. 

Defoe has agreed a deal for another year I think, he’s done so that’s great news. Kent is good on the break and does well at Parkhead, they don’t really play on the break though 😱🤔😆🤪.

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, HMFC01 said:

Aberdeen said until September.  Hibs was 2 part payments, can't recall the dates but 1 is the end of this year possibly December I think the other next year maybe March?

The other payment is June which is a strange time to do it as they won’t have any income then? Season tickets maybe?

Edited April 7, 2020 by Pasquale for King

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

Anyone heard if The Rangers are proud?

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

8 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

Not a pay cut FFS but the Record knows this

[Beast Boy]

8 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

According to the DR, the TRFC deferral is 50%

 

If that’s not a perfect illustration of the way the press in this country spin things in favour of two clubs whilst kicking us when we are down, then I don’t know what is.

 

It’s staggering that any Hearts supporters buy these rags. 

[The Real Maroonblood]

24 minutes ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

If that’s not a perfect illustration of the way the press in this country spin things in favour of two clubs whilst kicking us when we are down, then I don’t know what is.

 

It’s staggering that any Hearts supporters buy these rags. 

[salvo69]

So the headline is wrong but they are trying to say Sevco have done what Budge originally asked is to do so hopefully outrage from Boyd. If not he can call the rag liars

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, salvo69 said:

So the headline is wrong but they are trying to say Sevco have done what Budge originally asked is to do so hopefully outrage from Boyd. If not he can call the rag liars

That just shows the double standards the shitty weegie-biased rags practise.

[David McCaig]

This annoys me much more than it should... repeat x 1000 - A wage deferral is not the same as a wage cut and is not a meaningful long term financial saving for a club.

 

Any clubs taking the moral high ground at present on the basis of deferrals, will be regretting their actions hugely in 6-12 months time.

 

 

[EIEIO]

1 minute ago, David McCaig said:

This annoys me much more than it should... repeat x 1000 - A wage deferral is not the same as a wage cut and is not a meaningful long term financial saving for a club.

 

Any clubs taking the moral high ground at present on the basis of deferrals, will be regretting their actions hugely in 6-12 months time.

 

 

Deferrals are possible/sensible if there is a definite end date to the  crisis and therefore a start date for football again. At the moment this could be anytime between July and December even then with limited or no fans present. Financial suicide IMO.

[David McCaig]

17 minutes ago, EIEIO said:

Deferrals are possible/sensible if there is a definite end date to the  crisis and therefore a start date for football again. At the moment this could be anytime between July and December even then with limited or no fans present. Financial suicide IMO.

Even if its July,  there is still money being lost just now that will never fully be recovered.

[Ray Gin]

11 hours ago, Cigaro said:

16 gives us 30 games. Was there not talk of a uefa minimum number of league games when this was discussed a few years back?

 

16/18 for me. No stupid split. Home/away once each. Never happen though.

 

4 less home games is a lot less revenue for teams.

[jamboinglasgow]

30 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

This annoys me much more than it should... repeat x 1000 - A wage deferral is not the same as a wage cut and is not a meaningful long term financial saving for a club.

 

Any clubs taking the moral high ground at present on the basis of deferrals, will be regretting their actions hugely in 6-12 months time.

 

 

 

Yup, a wage defferal makes sense if it is a month or two before things return to normal. But that is not the predictions. 

 

I do think in Scotland, the way we were treated by the press, pundits and PFA scotland, when we made the choice to take wage cuts early, scared a lot of chairmen in Scottish clubs and made them do the deferral option to save face. This made players think this is the only way and not face the harsh reality.

 

Juventus players for example are pushing for a deferal but that could cost 90million Euros, which could mean the club need to sell Ronaldo (if any club are able to pay huge wages and fees soon after this ends.)

[Mikey1874]

12 hours ago, busby1985 said:

They think they’ll be back, playing football again by July. Their players are in the same boat as some of ours by saying they won’t accept anything other than wage deferrals, they’ve been saying that since day dot of the shut down. PFA have been involved in this as well, just hasn’t made the press shock horror. 3 month, full deferral of wages for one player will be around 360k, say they have an average wage of 20k and 28 first team players, that’s 6.7million Of owed wages. McGregor, Kent, Goldson, Defoe, Morelos, Tav, Arfield, Jack, Gerrard all on over 20k a week. Crazy stuff. 

 

I wonder if deferring wages is partly a symbol of saying "look, we are financially sound". Maybe think it will help with investment.

 

Aberdeen, Hibs, Rangers all wanting / needing investment.

[Mikey1874]

37 minutes ago, EIEIO said:

Deferrals are possible/sensible if there is a definite end date to the  crisis and therefore a start date for football again. At the moment this could be anytime between July and December even then with limited or no fans present. Financial suicide IMO.

 

Deferrals are also okay if you have a strong business model and can adjust. 

 

Rangers maybe thinking of that new share offer.

[SectionDJambo]

1 hour ago, JamboAl said:

That just shows the double standards the shitty weegie-biased rags practise.

I always think that if they can lie or bend the truth like this for football, why believe anything else they may print?

It’s why I don’t buy papers like the Record, Sun or Express.

[busby1985]

34 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I wonder if deferring wages is partly a symbol of saying "look, we are financially sound". Maybe think it will help with investment.

 

Aberdeen, Hibs, Rangers all wanting / needing investment.

The info I passed on last night was wrong, the players have agreed a 50% deferral and not a full deferral as I suggested. 
 

So in 3 months time Rangers will owe their players roughly £3million in unpaid wages plus the prospect of no football returning at the end of the 3 months. I get why Hibs, Aberdeen and Rangers have went down the deferral route but like Budge said in her statement it smacks of hoping for a miracle. 

[jackal]

Deferrals are fine if you are paying a lower basic wage and clubs know they can afford to pay back with minimum fuss.

We have the problem of having a higher basic apparently so deferrals arent really an option. Im sure even after the wage cuts our players will be getting more than most other players in the league.

[Mikey1874]

Aberdeen players not furloughed as we know

 

 

[DETTY29]

17 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Aberdeen players not furloughed as we know

 

 

Photo a bit misleading as they all arrived in a public park to do the training.

 

Which naturally will have been within walking distance of their homes and none of them turned up by car. 

 

 

[Mikey1874]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

Photo a bit misleading as they all arrived in a public park to do the training.

 

Which naturally will have been within walking distance of their homes and none of them turned up by car. 

 

 

 

 

[DETTY29]

1 minute ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

Stevie May still at Aberdeen? 

[Mikey1874]

1 minute ago, DETTY29 said:

Stevie May still at Aberdeen? 

 

Good spot 

[Unknown user]

27 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Aberdeen players not furloughed as we know

 

 

I don't get it, hasn't their training facility opened?

[IveSeenTheLight]

10 minutes ago, Smithee said:

I don't get it, hasn't their training facility opened?

 

Its old stock photos, not from the alleged incident.

 

Apparently this was not an organised session by the club.

[Mikey1874]

Another club considering their squad going forward 

 

 

[Mikey1874]

Just now, IveSeenTheLight said:

 

Its old stock photos, not from the alleged incident.

 

Apparently this was not an organised session by the club.

 

Good stuff

 

We'll find out later I guess 

[TWF]

3 hours ago, Special Officer Doofy said:

If that’s not a perfect illustration of the way the press in this country spin things in favour of two clubs whilst kicking us when we are down, then I don’t know what is.

 

It’s staggering that any Hearts supporters buy these rags. 

Back in Antiquity, and when studying for Professional Qualifications, my preferred relaxed reading of choice was Dandy and Beano and occasionally Commando. During my working life and into retirement my preferred business reading was Financial Times, however I did have an avid liking for comics, and that's when I turned my attention to relaxed reading of Daily Record.. To this day it still provides me with significant comic relief 

[TWF]

3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Another club considering their squad going forward 

 

 

Michael Smith and Conor Washington and maybe Liam Boyce??????