The rise and fall of The SNP.

[jack D and coke]

1 hour ago, Smithee said:

Oh its on, Jockstrap vs Jack Shit and Snow, let's do this!

There’s a better one brewing than me and Strapoan...

But for this pandemic it might’ve been “Back of the Wheatfield 👊🏼“

Dam this Covid to hell

[Space Mackerel]

Where are all the Effie Dean fan club members these days?
 

 

 

 

[davemclaren]

1 hour ago, Space Mackerel said:

Where are all the Effie Dean fan club members these days?
 

 

 

 

So having English and Gaelic on signs is more confusing? 😜
 

i think it was Labour that started this policy anyway. 

[Space Mackerel]

18 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

So having English and Gaelic on signs is more confusing? 😜
 

i think it was Labour that started this policy anyway. 

Yep, you’re right about Labour Dave. 

[NANOJAMBO]

4 hours ago, Space Mackerel said:

Where are all the Effie Dean fan club members these days?
 

 

 

 

So, she can read Gaelic then. And she still got lost.  What's she doing out of the kitchen anyway ? 

[Space Mackerel]

1 hour ago, NANOJAMBO said:

So, she can read Gaelic then. And she still got lost.  What's she doing out of the kitchen anyway ? 

It’s almost like she’s completely made the whole thing up in her head, eh? 😁

[ri Alban]

On 02/09/2020 at 08:11, doctor jambo said:

You are from paisley and say you have a job

😲

🤣 Only born in Paisley. 

On 02/09/2020 at 08:21, Governor Tarkin said:

 

The only time folk from Paisley are on roofs is when gaining illegal entry into someone elses house.

It's good knowing how to open Velux windows from the outside. But again, only born in Paisley. 

[NANOJAMBO]

2 hours ago, Space Mackerel said:

It’s almost like she’s completely made the whole thing up in her head, eh? 😁

As a Scot I'm almost embarrassed by her but since she's a Tory liar she can **** off. 🙂

[Space Mackerel]

17 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

As a Scot I'm almost embarrassed by her but since she's a Tory liar she can **** off. 🙂

She’s going full double jeopardy on the stupid now. 😁

 

 

[Governor Tarkin]

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

 

It's good knowing how to open Velux windows from the outside. But again, only born in Paisley. 

 

👍

 

 

[davemclaren]

29 minutes ago, Zlatanable said:

 

Are you referring to a Lab/Lib Dem coalition government, in either 1999 or 2003? 

Yes. 

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, Zlatanable said:

This perfectly describes the government of Scotland, since 2014. 

 

The electorate get a chance to judge on that soon. 

[Space Mackerel]

25 minutes ago, Zlatanable said:

This perfectly describes the government of Scotland, since 2014. 

 

Scottish Labour started the Gaelic Road sign policy thinking in 2002 pal. 
 

It was in The Sunday Times. 
 

See here

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/scotland-in-two-minds-over-bilingual-signs-c6tqlcgpgs6

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

14 hours ago, Zlatanable said:

This perfectly describes the government of Scotland, since 2014. 

 

To be fair, it's the unionist on twitter who is too thick to understand road sign, written in their own language. They probably shouldn't be driving if they're that thick.

[ri Alban]

2 hours ago, Zlatanable said:

Hi @Space Mackerel, hope you are well.

 

I have a challenge for you. 

 

Start a thread about Scottish Independence. 

 

We already got to 60 pages of the Rise and Fall of the SNP, and thank you for your many contributions. 

 

 

This thread if fine. You know, they know, and I know, independence is but a year from now. Possible 18 months. So we'll continue with the Rise (To independence) and fall(Post Independence) of the SNP. 

[Space Mackerel]

8 hours ago, Zlatanable said:

Hi @Space Mackerel, hope you are well.

 

I have a challenge for you. 

 

Start a thread about Scottish Independence. 

 

We already got to 60 pages of the Rise and Fall of the SNP, and thank you for your many contributions. 

 

 

 

5 hours ago, ri Alban said:

This thread if fine. You know, they know, and I know, independence is but a year from now. Possible 18 months. So we'll continue with the Rise (To independence) and fall(Post Independence) of the SNP. 

Im with Aussie, this one is just dandy pal. 

[OTT]

Scottish labours irrelevancy in recent years seems to be able to be boiled down to their position on the constitutional question. I saw that its estimated 70% of Labour voters support Independence. How can you possibly expect to run your party effectively when you are at odds with such a significant proportion of your base? I suspect they are heading into Corbyn and Brexit territory. If they attempt to take a Switzerland stance on it (i.e leave it up to the individual MSP) then it will be as lukewarm and unelectable as Labour were in the last general election. If they continue to oppose it they are going to remain irrelevant as the Tories have positioned themselves as the party of the union.  

 

I think it goes back to the 'branch office' comments made by Johann Lamont. They're an accurate reflection of where the party were and still are. I don't think they can advocate a credible position, they're never going to back Independence because that would put them at odds with their parent party which leaves them as lacking any sort of credibility as a party that will represent the working class as they are effectively advocating a union led by the furthest right wing tory government in most peoples life times (I'm actually thinking it might be worse than Thatcher in terms of their views towards migrants). 

 

I've made my thoughts clear earlier in the thread with the SNP, I'm not a big fan of the direction they are headed in. The NEC seems a monster they've let out and can't put away. However, until the constitutional question is answered then I think they will remain the only credible party in Scotland if you want a future that isn't dictated by an inward looking regressive tory government hell bent on severing ties with Europe and jumping into bed with Trump and his ilk.

 

Thankfully, I think Yes are in a good position to win, I think the early campaigning has already started and we're starting at 55%. Johnson isn't liked up here and the Tories are pretty much despised in most regions. If they are dumb enough to lead the Better Together (2.0) campaign then all the better and I do think they are arrogant enough to insist on it. I'm hopeful within the next 5 years we'll be Independent, back in Europe and the SNP will have served their purpose and we'll see a better more competent spread of politicians across the various parties. 

[Space Mackerel]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

Scottish labours irrelevancy in recent years seems to be able to be boiled down to their position on the constitutional question. I saw that its estimated 70% of Labour voters support Independence. How can you possibly expect to run your party effectively when you are at odds with such a significant proportion of your base? I suspect they are heading into Corbyn and Brexit territory. If they attempt to take a Switzerland stance on it (i.e leave it up to the individual MSP) then it will be as lukewarm and unelectable as Labour were in the last general election. If they continue to oppose it they are going to remain irrelevant as the Tories have positioned themselves as the party of the union.  

 

I think it goes back to the 'branch office' comments made by Johann Lamont. They're an accurate reflection of where the party were and still are. I don't think they can advocate a credible position, they're never going to back Independence because that would put them at odds with their parent party which leaves them as lacking any sort of credibility as a party that will represent the working class as they are effectively advocating a union led by the furthest right wing tory government in most peoples life times (I'm actually thinking it might be worse than Thatcher in terms of their views towards migrants). 

 

I've made my thoughts clear earlier in the thread with the SNP, I'm not a big fan of the direction they are headed in. The NEC seems a monster they've let out and can't put away. However, until the constitutional question is answered then I think they will remain the only credible party in Scotland if you want a future that isn't dictated by an inward looking regressive tory government hell bent on severing ties with Europe and jumping into bed with Trump and his ilk.

 

Thankfully, I think Yes are in a good position to win, I think the early campaigning has already started and we're starting at 55%. Johnson isn't liked up here and the Tories are pretty much despised in most regions. If they are dumb enough to lead the Better Together (2.0) campaign then all the better and I do think they are arrogant enough to insist on it. I'm hopeful within the next 5 years we'll be Independent, back in Europe and the SNP will have served their purpose and we'll see a better more competent spread of politicians across the various parties. 

 

 

Really good article here about the current state of Scottish Labour and its problems

 

https://www.thenational.scot/news/18700505.endless-sequels-labours-version-jurassic-park/

[Cade]

Cannae wait to bump this thread after the next election.

Can

Not

Wait

 

[Guest]

The biggest threat to the SNP would be labour getting their act together in Scotland.

 

Unfortunately, whilst they were still  rambling on about how hard done by the miners were 30 odd years ago they slept walked into their current state of near irrelevance 

 

[luckydug]

4 hours ago, Fun Boaby said:

The biggest threat to the SNP would be labour getting their act together in Scotland.

 

Unfortunately, whilst they were still  rambling on about how hard done by the miners were 30 odd years ago they slept walked into their current state of near irrelevance 

 

The only way Labour can get their act together is to support Indyref 2.

Most of what was a loyal support base in Scotland has fecked off to support the SNP. 

They did themselves no favours in 2014 by sharing a campaign platform with the Tories. 

I remember being on a bus alongside two 'better together' campaigners. On overhearing their chat it became obvious one was Labour from Musselburgh and the other guy a Tory was from North Berwick. 

I resisted the temptation to say anything until the Labour guy was getting off in Musselburgh when I said to my wife, that'll be Toryboys bit of rough getting off then. 😁

To me that summed up the relationship between these two parties. 

[Guest]

30 minutes ago, luckydug said:

The only way Labour can get their act together is to support Indyref 2.

Most of what was a loyal support base in Scotland has fecked off to support the SNP. 

They did themselves no favours in 2014 by sharing a campaign platform with the Tories. 

I remember being on a bus alongside two 'better together' campaigners. On overhearing their chat it became obvious one was Labour from Musselburgh and the other guy a Tory was from North Berwick. 

I resisted the temptation to say anything until the Labour guy was getting off in Musselburgh when I said to my wife, that'll be Toryboys bit of rough getting off then. 😁

To me that summed up the relationship between these two parties. 

If labour support indy ref 2, 3 4, etc they are no better than the green party. 

 

They need to stand up for those who believe in a United Kingdom not run by Conservatives.

 

John Smith will be turning in his grave at the  current state of play

[davemclaren]

8 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

If labour support indy ref 2, 3 4, etc they are no better than the green party. 

 

They need to stand up for those who believe in a United Kingdom not run by Conservatives.

 

John Smith will be turning in his grave at the  current state of play

Are they not standing up for them, but their ‘natural’ vote still remains swung to the SNP?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

Are they not standing up for them, but their ‘natural’ vote still remains swung to the SNP?

If they are, its not been very effective.

[Space Mackerel]

20 minutes ago, Zlatanable said:

I agree. 

The Rise and Fall of the SNP, is what we are living through. 

 

You can style it out all you want.

 

Sophy Ridge had a graphic on her show this morning saying the SNP current polling for Holyrood was 57%. 

Edited September 6, 2020 by Space Mackerel

[Beni]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

Sophy Ridge had a graphic on her show this morning saying the SNP current polling for Hollywood was 57%. 

 

Ooft. If the headbangers push through a no deal Brexit, Scotland will be independent and back in the EU before the ink is dry on their non existent deal.

[Space Mackerel]

55 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

If they are, its not been very effective.

Are you a Corbynite or Blairite Boaby? 

[Guest]

Just now, Space Mackerel said:

Are you a Corbynite or Blairite Boaby? 

Neither. 

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Fun Boaby said:

Neither. 

You’re a Labour man?

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

You’re a Labour man?

No

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Fun Boaby said:

No

Are we going to get our first admission on this thread of a Tory voter? 

[Guest]

Just now, Space Mackerel said:

Are we going to get our first admission on this thread of a Tory voter? 

Im a Council House Tory.

 

However, I can absolutely see the value of a strong labour party in Scotland.  

[Space Mackerel]

6 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

Im a Council House Tory.

 

However, I can absolutely see the value of a strong labour party in Scotland.  

What is a council house Tory? 
 

Did you read that article that summarised Labour? Even Ian Murray is on record that the Labour Party was destroyed in 2014 supporting Better Together but “it was the right thing to do” He said he would do it again as well. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

What is a council house Tory.

I grew up in a Council house and vote Conservative. 

[Space Mackerel]

2 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

I grew up in a Council house and vote Conservative. 

Ahh, I take it you don’t live in one now then? I thought you did. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

Ahh, I take it you don’t live in one now then? I thought you did. 

Nope. A very small - very, very small residence. Bought and paid for through nothing other than hard work.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

Nope. A very small - very, very small residence. Bought and paid for through nothing other than hard work.

Which, if the SNP had had their way years ago in replacing the council tax would have been dearer to live in than a family of 5 in a council house.

[Space Mackerel]

2 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

Nope. A very small - very, very small residence. Bought and paid for through nothing other than hard work.

Same as me then, sciatica and dermatitis all thrown in for the cause over the years.

 

So that’s your lot then, until Boris Johnson and Brexit is going to revolutionise your future?  

 

 

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Fun Boaby said:

Which, if the SNP had had their way years ago in replacing the council tax would have been dearer to live in than a family of 5 in a council house.

Are you not getting confused with the Community Charge or Poll Tax?

 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

Are you not getting confused with the Community Charge or Poll Tax?

 

Nope. Was about 15 years ago when they wanted to replace the council tax with an income based system. Thankfully they ditched it.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

Same as me then, sciatica and dermatitis all thrown in for the cause over the years.

 

So that’s your lot then, until Boris Johnson and Brexit is going to revolutionise your future?  

 

 

I've not a lot of time for Boris and voted remain

[Space Mackerel]

Just now, Fun Boaby said:

Nope. Was about 15 years ago when they wanted to replace the council tax with an income based system. Thankfully they ditched it.

Well that’s good, I remember going on marches and massive riots in London with Maggies Poll Tax. 

[Space Mackerel]

1 minute ago, Fun Boaby said:

I've not a lot of time for Boris and voted remain

Im not surprised, the Tory Party have jumped massively to the right and are basically full on English Nationalists now. He hates the Scottish working class.

 

 

[davemclaren]

1 hour ago, Zlatanable said:

I agree. 

The Rise and Fall of the SNP, is what we are living through. 

 

You can style it out all you want.

 

When is the rise stopping?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

When is the rise stopping?

2014

[Space Mackerel]

2 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

2014

It’s went up from 45 to 55% since then Boaby. 

[davemclaren]

3 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

2014

All downhill from there right enough. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Space Mackerel said:

It’s went up from 45 to 55% since then Boaby. 

 

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

All downhill from there right enough. 

By what measure? Not a decisive referendum.

 

As much as you would like Scotland to vote for separation, the majority of the country voted to stay within the UK.

[Space Mackerel]

2 minutes ago, Fun Boaby said:

 

By what measure? Not a decisive referendum.

 

As much as you would like Scotland to vote for separation, the majority of the country voted to stay within the UK.

Boaby, why do you not want to have full fiscal and domestic law controls closer to home?

 

Why do you want them in London where your MP’s are out voted all the time? 

[Space Mackerel]

Even Adam says so