Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[Taffin]

2 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

The bottom line is that Johnson is stuck between a rock and a hard place of his own design.

 

the scientists want to put the brakes on (rightly or wrongly).

The devolved administrations want to put the brakes on.

Spaffer probably even wants to put the brakes on.

 

He can't. He's got no authority. He's a dead man walking and rather than making decisions on public health from a public health standpoint, he's making them on a political self preservation standpoint. Basically the ERG's offspring the Global Clean Brexit group of ****s like Steve Baker, Desmond Swaine, Andrew Bridgen et al are really running the country.

 

What a shambles. 

 

I don't get why he doesn't just do what the ERG types want completely. He's the leader of the Conservative party and any sort of restrictions of the ilk we've seen, or are being mooted are fundamentally against what they stand for. The electorate have given him a mandate to do so by voting them in.

[Victorian]

The people I'll be giving a shite about are healthcare professionals and all the people trying to keep businesses afloat and keeping people in jobs.  If people have become so abjectly self-absorbed that they think they shouldn't have to bear having a less than perfect Christmas then it is an indicator of how soft society has led people to become.  It's bred an army of ****ing imbeciles.

[Savage Vince]

9 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

No, stop making excuses for them. They have all been tested and they all failed. Devolved administrations have been more concerned with point scoring over Westminster and that's contributed to the whole thing being a fiasco.

 

 

 

What would three key examples of that look like? 

[Seymour M Hersh]

1 hour ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

The Covid plan was and is based on capacity in the health service. 

 

A capacity the NHS has been reducing in recent decades. 

[Mikey1874]

31 minutes ago, Costanza said:

I mentioned the collateral damage of lockdown which the WHO article is correct to point out but a zero covid/suppression policy doesn't mean constant lockdowns which is what we are doing.

Once you get infection rates down, you have tight border control, effective track and trace and mitigations to reduce the need for lockdown.
I mentioned earlier in the thread that I had a mate who lives in Hong Kong and they have had no community transmission since July and bar travel, life is normal.

For business, hospitality, mental health that is surely better than our approach, where we are 5 days from Christmas and we know restrictions are coming but don't know when.

I'm just fed up with the constant cycle of opening up and then restrictions. I was more talking about what I wish we had done at the start but accept that ship has sailed.

 

What has happened is because the new variant is reported as a danger, people have made their own choices in cancelling hospitality bookings etc. 

 

If the 'variant danger' had not been reported or commented on then the focus would be on the unvaccinated. 

 

Of course I don't know how real and serious the current situation is which is what the scientists seem to be saying. 

[SE16 3LN]

19 hours ago, Savage Vince said:

 

You must hate it down there. I mean REALLY hate it. 😁

 

No wonder you're so angry all the time. 😊

Just hate racists Subsidy Vince. No walls and border closures here, and no threats to nuke. 

[Nucky Thompson]

Joe Biden refuses to lock down the US despite omicron making up 70% of cases.

 

Mad Joe oot 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Nucky Thompson

[SE16 3LN]

18 hours ago, XB52 said:

😂😂😂😂 Talk about overreacting 😂😂😂😂. Saying London has huge numbers of cases is racist😂😂😂😂. 

No surprise which side you're on.

[The Mighty Thor]

25 minutes ago, Victorian said:

The people I'll be giving a shite about are healthcare professionals and all the people trying to keep businesses afloat and keeping people in jobs.  If people have become so abjectly self-absorbed that they think they shouldn't have to bear having a less than perfect Christmas then it is an indicator of how soft society has led people to become.  It's bred an army of ****ing imbeciles.

To be fair there was a bit of societal togetherness right back at the very start, which lasted all of about 2 weeks.

 

Since then the selfish, self-entitled types have hit over-drive pissing and whining about every single decision made, anything that remotely impinges on their very important lives which has brought us to where we are today, where the leader of the country cannot make the decisions he probably needs to make because he's afraid of either losing his job or worse still empowering the opposition to prop him up in parliament again. 

 

****s the lot of them. 

[Boab]

1 minute ago, The Mighty Thor said:

To be fair there was a bit of societal togetherness right back at the very start, which lasted all of about 2 weeks.

 

Since then the selfish, self-entitled types have hit over-drive pissing and whining about every single decision made, anything that remotely impinges on their very important lives which has brought us to where we are today, where the leader of the country cannot make the decisions he probably needs to make because he's afraid of either losing his job or worse still empowering the opposition to prop him up in parliament again. 

 

****s the lot of them. 

Well said. 

How on earth this idiot can be in charge at this time in our history is damning !

 

[Taffin]

1 minute ago, The Mighty Thor said:

To be fair there was a bit of societal togetherness right back at the very start, which lasted all of about 2 weeks.

 

Since then the selfish, self-entitled types have hit over-drive pissing and whining about every single decision made, anything that remotely impinges on their very important lives which has brought us to where we are today, where the leader of the country cannot make the decisions he probably needs to make because he's afraid of either losing his job or worse still empowering the opposition to prop him up in parliament again. 

 

****s the lot of them. 

 

Everyone's's life is very important to them, their friends and family. To everyone else, not so much, if at all, for the vast majority of people.

[escobri]

59 minutes ago, Costanza said:

The severity aspect is interesting, if the virus had a mortality aspect impacting a lot younger population I imagine that yeah, the anti vaxxers would be very different, probably because they are selfish pricks.

😂🥳. 

[XB52]

It's a bit sad when the whole of the UK is held hostage to the tory party internal squabbles. 

[Adam_the_legend]

1 hour ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

I see independent article quoting those who are double jabbed and then catch Covid are super protected and have 1000 times stronger anti bodies than those who are double jabbed alone.

Confusing though as does this not imply your better catching milder strain. 

You got a link? This is me so good to hear I’m super protected 💪🏻 

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, The Mighty Thor said:

That's not really the case at all. 

They've buggered things up at times but they've acted quicker and with greater conviction than Westminster. The message from the devolved administrations has always been clearer and more concise than the 'go to work, don't go to work' pish from spaffer.  

You just won't admit the devolved governments, particularly the Scottish one, have made mistakes.

No-one is disputing Johnson's hopeless, but that doesn't mean Scottish government can't be held to account.

Education/exam shambles, the pretence of closing border when they knew it wouldn't work, the airport quarantine shambles designed to be different, not effective, but just different, and the desperation to attend a COBRA meeting and then rush out to get on TV first, just to appear important.

The building of temporary hospitals, closing them and then saying we've no capacity, the shutting of EIC as vaccine centre, then having to reopen it, the blaming of students for spreading it, the slowness in getting covid passports online, the confusion over what's a cafe and what's a restaurant, the open defiance to being asked questions during press conferences, and there are many others.

Add in the tier fiasco and the unwillingness to place Glasgow in bottom tier, due to not wanting to offend her home town 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Malinga the Swinga

[Malinga the Swinga]

12 minutes ago, XB52 said:

It's a bit sad when the whole of the UK is held hostage to the tory party internal squabbles. 

Health is devolved so we in Scotland can do as we wish.

[Savage Vince]

34 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

Just hate racists Subsidy Vince. No walls and border closures here, and no threats to nuke. 

 

I'm almost certain that you don't hate racists at all. 😉

[Victorian]

21 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

To be fair there was a bit of societal togetherness right back at the very start, which lasted all of about 2 weeks.

 

Since then the selfish, self-entitled types have hit over-drive pissing and whining about every single decision made, anything that remotely impinges on their very important lives which has brought us to where we are today, where the leader of the country cannot make the decisions he probably needs to make because he's afraid of either losing his job or worse still empowering the opposition to prop him up in parliament again. 

 

****s the lot of them. 

 

Agreed.

 

I,  amongst millions,  have seen my life change and my routines disrupted.  It's been a fundamental blight on most of us.  Early on I realised things were changing and I settled into a new routine and reconciled myself to a long wait until normality returned.  I didn't do this out of virtue.  It was automatic.  Forced upon me by circumstances I had no influence over.  Me and millions of people alike.  I suspect there was a cohort who never really did realise the sacrifices and changes they would need to make.  Plus another cohort who have more or less waved the white flag of defeat.  No longer prepared to believe themselves involved in the collective pain.

[theshed]

10 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

You just won't admit the devolved governments, particularly the Scottish one, have made mistakes.

No-one is disputing Johnson's hopeless, but that doesn't mean Scottish government can't be held to account.

Education/exam shambles, the pretence of closing border when they knew it wouldn't work, the airport quarantine shambles designed to be different, not effective, but just different, and the desperation to attend a COBRA meeting and then rush out to get on TV first, just to appear important.

The building of temporary hospitals, closing them and then saying we've no capacity, the shutting of EIC as vaccine centre, then having to reopen it, the blaming of students for spreading it, the slowness in getting covid passports online, the confusion over what's a cafe and what's a restaurant, the open defiance to being asked questions during press conferences, and there are many others.

Add in the tier fiasco and the unwillingness to place Glasgow in bottom tier, due to not wanting to offend her home town 

Forgot all about the tiers🙈🙈

Reading that doesn’t have hit home of what a shit show it’s been 

[Victorian]

People can go on about freedoms,  liberty and personal choices and so forth all day if they like but,  for me anyway,  spontaneity is freedom.  The ability and mindset to just do anything on a whim or without thought of rules,  restrictions,  hazards even.  

 

I don't think I'll ever return to the mindset of normal liberty until there's the same spontaneity.  Without it,  you don't have true liberty.

[1971fozzy]

48 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

yet you want to isolate all the black people 😂😂😂

😱 Where the hell did I say that ????   . I never ever said that and never would. You are a fekin disgrace. Be very very careful what you put next. For the 3rd time you call me out wrongly as a racist. When have I said a racist comment ? Never . Because I am not a racist you absolute bellend.   Let me keep this simple as I can for your feeble mind ….I AM NOT RACIST…….  I am blocking you and you are duly reported. 
 

Edited December 21, 2021 by 1971fozzy

[Lord Montpelier]

28 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

You just won't admit the devolved governments, particularly the Scottish one, have made mistakes.

No-one is disputing Johnson's hopeless, but that doesn't mean Scottish government can't be held to account.

Education/exam shambles, the pretence of closing border when they knew it wouldn't work, the airport quarantine shambles designed to be different, not effective, but just different, and the desperation to attend a COBRA meeting and then rush out to get on TV first, just to appear important.

The building of temporary hospitals, closing them and then saying we've no capacity, the shutting of EIC as vaccine centre, then having to reopen it, the blaming of students for spreading it, the slowness in getting covid passports online, the confusion over what's a cafe and what's a restaurant, the open defiance to being asked questions during press conferences, and there are many others.

Add in the tier fiasco and the unwillingness to place Glasgow in bottom tier, due to not wanting to offend her home town 

Agree. Vertical drinking was another classic. 

[Victorian]

What are peoples' thoughts and experiences on the timescales of things?

 

When this began,  I knew instinctively that it was going to be dreadful,  but I seem to remember holding some kind of belief that the worst would be behind us after 6 months or so.  No idea where that came from.  At the time,  if someone had told us it was going to be 2 years,  I would have been horrified.  Now,  if you believe some of the theorising about the current status of things,  we might only be at the centre point,  albeit Chris Whitty says things will get progressively better from now on.  From that basis,  yet another 2 years doesn't seem that bad,  on the prospectus of it finally ending by then.  The perceptions of time.

[XB52]

29 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Health is devolved so we in Scotland can do as we wish.

 

16 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

😱 Where the hell did I say that ????   . I never ever said that and never would. You are a fekin disgrace. Be very very careful what you put next. For the 3rd time you call me out wrongly as a racist. When have I said a racist comment ? Never . Because I am not a racist you absolute bellend.   Let me keep this simple as I can for your feeble mind ….I AM NOT RACIST…….  I am blocking you and you are duly reported. 
 

Best thing to do with people like him

[Mikey1874]

Didn't expect this.

 

Never appreciated that the numbers refusing to vaccinate would stop us getting back to normal. 

[XB52]

31 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Health is devolved so we in Scotland can do as we wish.

Mucked up previous quote. Anyway

You know that's not true. Without borrowing powers we are severely restricted in what we can do. Only when England decides it wants more restrictions and releases money to do this can Scotland fully act. 

[Boab]

57 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Everyone's's life is very important to them, their friends and family. To everyone else, not so much, if at all, for the vast majority of people.

Speak for yourself, Taffin.

 

[Taffin]

5 minutes ago, Boab said:

Speak for yourself, Taffin.

 

 

If everyone's life was very important to everyone else we'd all live our lives very differently and we'd be in a constant state of mourning.

 

Is everyone's life very important to you? If so, do you live your life as such? 

 

More kudos to you, if so.

Edited December 21, 2021 by Taffin

[Malinga the Swinga]

7 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Mucked up previous quote. Anyway

You know that's not true. Without borrowing powers we are severely restricted in what we can do. Only when England decides it wants more restrictions and releases money to do this can Scotland fully act. 

Thank goodness it was muck up, I'm keeping out of 'racismgate'.

Disagree, we can do what we want and make our choices. If we lockdown, then use money we have for that and stop using it elsewhere. Quick suggestion would be to stop setting up shadow embassies as a start.

 

[Boab]

Just now, Taffin said:

 

If everyone's life was very important to everyone else we'd all live our lives very differently and we'd be in a constant state of mourning.

 

Is everyone's life very important to you? If so, do you live your life as such? 

 

Moe kudos to you, if so.

Of course family is paramount but in the context of a pandemic, there is no greater time for everyone to pull together. I would say the vast majority do, in following guidance anyway. 

In normal times probably less so, but we're not in normal times.

[Malinga the Swinga]

13 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Didn't expect this.

 

Never appreciated that the numbers refusing to vaccinate would stop us getting back to normal. 

I didn't realise so many people had such staunch beliefs that they would turn away from vaccination.

Thought there would be crackpot minority, but that educated sensible thought process would say vaccination far outweighs risk. Pre social media, I think it would have been far larger take up. 

If you'd told me March 20 that I would accept wearing mask on bus, in shops or going to restaurant, I would have laughed.

Not laughing now.

[NANOJAMBO]

12 minutes ago, Victorian said:

What are peoples' thoughts and experiences on the timescales of things?

 

When this began,  I knew instinctively that it was going to be dreadful,  but I seem to remember holding some kind of belief that the worst would be behind us after 6 months or so.  No idea where that came from.  At the time,  if someone had told us it was going to be 2 years,  I would have been horrified.  Now,  if you believe some of the theorising about the current status of things,  we might only be at the centre point,  albeit Chris Whitty says things will get progressively better from now on.  From that basis,  yet another 2 years doesn't seem that bad,  on the prospectus of it finally ending by then.  The perceptions of time.

I was In Rome in 2020 just before lockdown was announced and having seen what Italy had been through in the preceeding 3 months and the impact on life in Italy generally , I was sh*tting my pants when I got home. I wasn't suprised 2020 was a right off , given the hands off approach from Johnson and resulting empowerment of the knob heads to do what they want. I had some faith in the vaccines to get us out of it but that has been proved to be false : the resulting complacency in the UK is staggering and the knobheads are growing ever stronger, more vocal as they continue to be empowered by what they see & hear in Westminster. I fully expect another two years of this - and if the vax uptake isn't improved (and maintained) there is no way out of it. 

Unless there's a change of government , a change of message (and more emphasis on vaccines) and a change of attitude in a significant % of the population we 'll never move forward and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy for the anti vax brigade. 

Yeah, another two years of this. Minimum. 

[Victorian]

Good explanation regarding why it's complete folly to put too much faith in the belief that viruses decrease in virulence.  

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/dec/21/omicron-spreading-milder-virus

 

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

I was In Rome in 2020 just before lockdown was announced and having seen what Italy had been through in the preceeding 3 months and the impact on life in Italy generally , I was sh*tting my pants when I got home. I wasn't suprised 2020 was a right off , given the hands off approach from Johnson and resulting empowerment of the knob heads to do what they want. I had some faith in the vaccines to get us out of it but that has been proved to be false : the resulting complacency in the UK is staggering and the knobheads are growing ever stronger, more vocal as they continue to be empowered by what they see & hear in Westminster. I fully expect another two years of this - and if the vax uptake isn't improved (and maintained) there is no way out of it. 

Unless there's a change of government , a change of message (and more emphasis on vaccines) and a change of attitude in a significant % of the population we 'll never move forward and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy for the anti vax brigade. 

Yeah, another two years of this. Minimum. 

 

Vaccine refuseniks are a problem now but,  in theory,  it should change once everyone has had exposure to this type of fast spreading strain.  Natural immunisation for most should supersede vaccinations.

[Ray Gin]

27 minutes ago, Victorian said:

What are peoples' thoughts and experiences on the timescales of things?

 

When this began,  I knew instinctively that it was going to be dreadful,  but I seem to remember holding some kind of belief that the worst would be behind us after 6 months or so.  No idea where that came from.  At the time,  if someone had told us it was going to be 2 years,  I would have been horrified.  Now,  if you believe some of the theorising about the current status of things,  we might only be at the centre point,  albeit Chris Whitty says things will get progressively better from now on.  From that basis,  yet another 2 years doesn't seem that bad,  on the prospectus of it finally ending by then.  The perceptions of time.

 

At first I thought it would all be over in a few months.

 

6 months in, I feared we'd be looking at 5 years+ of going in and out of lockdowns and restrictions.

 

Once the vaccines arrived, I thought it'd all be over by around about now, with the only difference to our every day lives being an annual booster shot.

 

[NANOJAMBO]

Just now, Victorian said:

 

Vaccine refuseniks are a problem now but,  in theory,  it should change once everyone has had exposure to this type of fast spreading strain.  Natural immunisation for most should supersede vaccinations.

I've no idea what degree of natural immunity (if any) Omicron gives post infection but given Covid only provided short term immunity (if at all) last time I looked, it seems we're going to need several more pandemics before we get the much sought after herd immunity.

Happy to be corrected.

[Bindy Badgy]

6 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Vaccine refuseniks are a problem now but,  in theory,  it should change once everyone has had exposure to this type of fast spreading strain.  Natural immunisation for most should supersede vaccinations.

 

Natural immunity is throught to be weaker than vaccine immunity so people that refuse to be vaccinated on the gorunds that they've already had it are setting themselves up for a hard time.

 

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-natural-immunity-what-you-need-to-know

 

Quote

 

A mild case of an illness may not result in strong natural immunity. New studies show that natural immunity to the coronavirus weakens (wanes) over time, and does so faster than immunity provided by COVID-19 vaccination.

 

If I have natural immunity do I still need a COVID vaccine?

Yes, the COVID-19 vaccines are recommended, even if you had COVID-19. At present, evidence from Johns Hopkins Medicine and the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) supports getting a COVID-19 vaccine as the best protection against getting COVID-19, whether you have already had the virus or not.

 

 

[escobri]

4 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said:

I was In Rome in 2020 just before lockdown was announced and having seen what Italy had been through in the preceeding 3 months and the impact on life in Italy generally , I was sh*tting my pants when I got home. I wasn't suprised 2020 was a right off , given the hands off approach from Johnson and resulting empowerment of the knob heads to do what they want. I had some faith in the vaccines to get us out of it but that has been proved to be false : the resulting complacency in the UK is staggering and the knobheads are growing ever stronger, more vocal as they continue to be empowered by what they see & hear in Westminster. I fully expect another two years of this - and if the vax uptake isn't improved (and maintained) there is no way out of it. 

Unless there's a change of government , a change of message (and more emphasis on vaccines) and a change of attitude in a significant % of the population we 'll never move forward and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy for the anti vax brigade. 

Yeah, another two years of this. Minimum. 

Yet some of the countries with the highest vaccination rates are still fecked, yet here you want for more people to get the vaccines to get us out of it. Out of interest how would you try and persuade someone to get vaccinated? 

[Victorian]

2 minutes ago, Ray Gin said:

 

At first I thought it would all be over in a few months.

 

6 months in, I feared we'd be looking at 5 years+ of going in and out of lockdowns and restrictions.

 

Once the vaccines arrived, I thought it'd all be over by around about now, with the only difference to our every day lives being an annual booster shot.

 

 

 

Whitty's theory about another 2 years on a progressively better journey sounds bearable.

[escobri]

Just now, Bindy Badgy said:

 

Natural immunity is throught to be weaker than vaccine immunity so people that refuse to be vaccinated on the gorunds that they've already had it are setting themselves up for a hard time.

 

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-natural-immunity-what-you-need-to-know

 

 

Biden has told the unvaccinated in America to expect death this winter, should cheer a few up on here if they were to die.

[Malinga the Swinga]

2 minutes ago, Bindy Badgy said:

 

Natural immunity is throught to be weaker than vaccine immunity so people that refuse to be vaccinated on the gorunds that they've already had it are setting themselves up for a hard time.

 

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/covid-natural-immunity-what-you-need-to-know

 

 

Absolute opposite of Independent article. Beyond a parody, they're just guessing.

[Malinga the Swinga]

Well we have our sports announcement. 500 fans maximum. Pointless number for top level clubs, just pointless.

[NANOJAMBO]

1 minute ago, escobri said:

Yet some of the countries with the highest vaccination rates are still fecked, yet here you want for more people to get the vaccines to get us out of it. Out of interest how would you try and persuade someone to get vaccinated? 

Actually, you're right : lets develop vaccines and not use them. Makes sense now. 

On your second point - I'll leave that to behavioural pscychologists. I personally have no interest in engaging with refuseniks. 

 

 

 

[Victorian]

It's a build up of natural immunity to the up to date strains + they're already working on polyvalent vaccine designs.  

[kila]

2 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Well we have our sports announcement. 500 fans maximum. Pointless number for top level clubs, just pointless.

 

FFS

 

[Bindy Badgy]

8 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Absolute opposite of Independent article. Beyond a parody, they're just guessing.

 

Do you have a link to the Independent article?

 

Without any further digging, I'm inclined to go with something published on John Hopkins University's website over an article in the Independent.

Edited December 21, 2021 by Bindy Badgy

[escobri]

1 minute ago, NANOJAMBO said:

Actually, you're right : lets develop vaccines and not use them. Makes sense now. 

On your second point - I'll leave that to behavioural pscychologists. I personally have no interest in engaging with refuseniks. 

 

 

 

Aye cos no vaccines have ever been put in the bin, they are bought and paid for so get them in your arm and forget about your new dodgy ticker.

[NANOJAMBO]

Just now, escobri said:

Aye cos no vaccines have ever been put in the bin, they are bought and paid for so get them in your arm and forget about your new dodgy ticker.

Yeah. 100%. 

Why bother, eh ? 

[kila]

Incredibly frustrating to even have had the booster but be denied football.

 

Surely they can have 8000 at Tynecastle... 500 is just pointless

[redjambo]

1 hour ago, XB52 said:

It's a bit sad when the whole of the UK is held hostage to the tory party internal squabbles. 

 

It's not the first time. And it won't be the last.