Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[vegas-voss]

36 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

China using their surveillance system to track and lock down the country. Now Europe likely to do the same, with cctv and mobile phone GPS. Mind when everyone slaughtered China for having this? 

Eaiser in China though as everyone has an id card and you cannot do anything without it.

Edited April 4, 2020 by vegas-voss

[Seymour M Hersh]

9 hours ago, GinRummy said:

I don’t have any if that shite but I believe you. I’ve seen enough on other folks phones etc to know I never want it. 

 

Totally agree this, JKB, is as far as "(un)social media" goes for me. 

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, vegas-voss said:

Eaiser in China though as everyone has an id card and you cannot do anything without it.

So should we. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

10 hours ago, DarthVodka said:

dubious stats, or the way they are presented. Smokers and former smokers could also be included in other categories-such as chronic lung diseases, or basically any other categories

 

basic logic should indicate that a smoker of 20 years would have a lower lung function to that of a never smoker same age, weight etc

 

the cardiovascular issues is a concerning one as they haven’t worked out a definitive reason why people who have these conditions are at a larger risk if the virus's main target is respiratory 

 

I wonder if it could have something to do with the reduced amount of oxygenated blood the lungs return back to the heart.

 

If there is a reduced amount of oxygenated blood due to the lungs being filled with fluid due to pneumonia then the heart has to work all the harder to supply oxygenated blood to all the major organs, this in turn would put extra pressure & workload on the heart, if the patient has cardiovascular disease or some other cardiac problems, then the heart may not be able to cope with the extra strain.

 

This is just my thoughts on why cardiovascular disease can be a major problem if you catch this virus, no idea if it's right or not.

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Jambo-Jimbo

[Angel eyes]

https://i.postimg.cc/xdTzmyLs/8-E973908-3-D45-4-E30-8160-C48250591-EE2.jpg

my mates dog working from home.

[kingantti1874]

100% convinced the U.K. gov is still perusing herd immunity, no other reason to still be allowing flight from virus hotspots like Madrid and NYC to be landing with no check and no quarantine and then disperse straight onto public transport..

 

also clear that there is now overwhelming evidence that masks do slow the spread of infection but we still deny it, purely because we don’t have the kit for NHS staff..

 

government are lying, dishonest murdering *******s who should face charges when this is over

[GinRummy]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/04/why-what-we-think-we-know-about-the-uks-coronavirus-death-toll-is-wrong

[Stuart Lyon]

4 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

100% convinced the U.K. gov is still perusing herd immunity, no other reason to still be allowing flight from virus hotspots like Madrid and NYC to be landing with no check and no quarantine and then disperse straight onto public transport..

 

also clear that there is now overwhelming evidence that masks do slow the spread of infection but we still deny it, purely because we don’t have the kit for NHS staff..

 

government are lying, dishonest murdering *******s who should face charges when this is over

I agree article in Times today

Britain has "painted itself into a corner" with no clear exit strategy from the coronavirus epidemic and needs to reconsider herd immunity, according to a senior government adviser

 

Its behind a paywall so can't get the detail. 

[GinRummy]

5 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

100% convinced the U.K. gov is still perusing herd immunity, no other reason to still be allowing flight from virus hotspots like Madrid and NYC to be landing with no check and no quarantine and then disperse straight onto public transport..

 

also clear that there is now overwhelming evidence that masks do slow the spread of infection but we still deny it, purely because we don’t have the kit for NHS staff..

 

government are lying, dishonest murdering *******s who should face charges when this is over

I’m maybe a few days away from this line of thinking. Getting angrier by the day. 

[Victorian]

Yes it is herd immunity,  but to be fair to them,   it's as an unavoidable byproduct.    There wont be a vaccine for over a year.    It's simply unsustainable to have a proper lockdown to limit infection for a year.     The compromise can only be to continue the delay phase for as long as is necessary to manage the 'peak' period,   as well as to continue to develop treatments,  testing and research.     

 

The longer this halfway house continues,  more and more people inevitably are infected.    The herd immunity results.     Ongoing serious cases will diminish in number and as result will hopefully benefit from a surplus of care and developed repurposed treatments.     Sporadic outbreaks should be easier to contain via better preparedness and... herd immunity (fewer and fewer never infected people to infect).     

 

That's the reality.     But it falls to bits if it turns out there is no resilient immunity.

[Seymour M Hersh]

I see the scientist whose report on CoVid19 was mostly responsible for the "lockdown" policy is now saying 2/3rds of the deaths attributed to CoVid would have happened in any case. I know I've mentioned Sweden before but I am really interested to see what happens there given they are the only European country not pursuing some kind of lockdown policy.  For one thing they are being 100% transparent with their logging of data. They have a website that gives you real-time information on deaths and new infections. Also they break the deaths down into from CoVid and with CoVid.  

 

This is from an article in the Telegraph.

 

The former state epidemiologist, Prof Emeritus Johan Giesecke, is in agreement with Mr Tegnell, stating recently in an article for the daily newspaper Svenska Dagbladet: "The lack of reliable knowledge explains why countries choose to do things differently: nobody knows what really works, and they choose measures either on the basis of shaky data or for political reasons. 

"All models require that you enter numeric values for different parameters - values that we often miss and must estimate or guess."

 

Time will tell I suppose but the very least our Government could do is break down the figures in a transparent and honest manner.

[vegas-voss]

1 hour ago, kingantti1874 said:

100% convinced the U.K. gov is still perusing herd immunity, no other reason to still be allowing flight from virus hotspots like Madrid and NYC to be landing with no check and no quarantine and then disperse straight onto public transport..

 

also clear that there is now overwhelming evidence that masks do slow the spread of infection but we still deny it, purely because we don’t have the kit for NHS staff..

 

government are lying, dishonest murdering *******s who should face charges when this is over

Probably not advising mask use cause there are hardly any about and what there is the NHS need them.

[frankblack]

1 hour ago, kingantti1874 said:

100% convinced the U.K. gov is still perusing herd immunity, no other reason to still be allowing flight from virus hotspots like Madrid and NYC to be landing with no check and no quarantine and then disperse straight onto public transport..

 

also clear that there is now overwhelming evidence that masks do slow the spread of infection but we still deny it, purely because we don’t have the kit for NHS staff..

 

government are lying, dishonest murdering *******s who should face charges when this is over

 

There needs to be an independent inquiry into the government's slow reaction to impose lockdown, and the slow procurement and delivery of essential equipment like masks and ventilators.  In particular I would like clarification on how Dyson got awarded a contract to build ventilators in front of established manufacturers of ventilators who offered their services.

 

If there is any corruption at play here then criminal charges should be made.

Edited April 4, 2020 by frankblack

[ri Alban]

It has to be said, trust has evaporated since Boris took ill. He's gone up in my estimations. Credit where it's due.

[JimmyCant]

12 hours ago, GinRummy said:

Who cares what he does. He thinks he’s the star of his own film. Egomaniac. 

It’s got to the stage where the world would be a much more stable And safe place if a United States president was assassinated 

[Jeff]

1 minute ago, JimmyCant said:

It’s got to the stage where the world would be a much more stable And safe place if a United States president was assassinated 

 

Reckon the Brazilian fella hasn't got long left

[milky_26]

dont know if it as already been posted but 13 care home resients from same care home die in a week from covid-19

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-52165397

[JimmyCant]

25 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

It has to be said, trust has evaporated since Boris took ill. He's gone up in my estimations. Credit where it's due.

Was just thinking that the other day. As a staunch republican and nationalist I think his leadership and presentation during this has been outstanding. Okay some of the decisions and dilly dallying behind him havent been good but can you imagine Thatcher telling us we have to stay at home for 12 weeks or longer. We’d be marching en masse to london with pitchforks by now

 

He will probably Need to to toughen the stance on lockdown next week but he’s come across really well overall during this 

[Spellczech]

30 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

It has to be said, trust has evaporated since Boris took ill. He's gone up in my estimations. Credit where it's due.

Only one of them I trust is Sunak. 

[kingantti1874]

5 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Only one of them I trust is Sunak. 

you shouldn’t, he’s a snake, has destroyed flexible workers in U.K. overnight which happens to benefit his family’s consulting business

[The Internet]

17 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

dont know if it as already been posted but 13 care home resients from same care home die in a week from covid-19

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-52165397

 

Awful Sadly this thing will rip right through any care home or sheltered housing accommodation if it gets in.

 

Another 809 deaths in Spain too, lowest daily total for a week. Thinking is that they've hit their 'peak'.

[Spellczech]

4 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

you shouldn’t, he’s a snake, has destroyed flexible workers in U.K. overnight which happens to benefit his family’s consulting business

It has been HMRC policy for several years now to try to get as many people as possible onto PAYE so that business do HMRC's work for them. That is what IR35 is all about. Was not Sunak who did this, it was Osbourne.

[Toxteth O'Grady]

1 hour ago, Spellczech said:

Only one of them I trust is Sunak. 

I wouldn't trust anyone whose name is an anagram of Hi Risk Anus

[kingantti1874]

1 hour ago, Spellczech said:

It has been HMRC policy for several years now to try to get as many people as possible onto PAYE so that business do HMRC's work for them. That is what IR35 is all about. Was not Sunak who did this, it was Osbourne.

I’m very aware trust me, only problem is businesses have not done HMRC work, they’ve bypassed it all together.
 

he had the ability to stop this and he did not, his family directly benefit from that decision that is also a fact, government policy has absolutely been influenced by their friends in big consultancies.

 

in this current crisis there flexible workers are excluded from the furlough scheme (the date was set at 29/2) becuase the knew the majority started PAYE after this date and Ltd Co’s are also excluded from the self employed scheme 

 

IR35 was all about “fairness” 😂  pay all of the tax of a permanent worker despite offering flexibility which means large periods out of work.  At the same time we have none of the benefits and none of the security. 

I have quite a few friends sitting  at home with no help whatsoever

Edited April 4, 2020 by kingantti1874

[milky_26]

i think that is 707 deaths in last 24 hours

[Spellczech]

38 minutes ago, kingantti1874 said:

I’m very aware trust me, only problem is businesses have not done HMRC work, they’ve bypassed it all together.
 

he had the ability to stop this and he did not, his family directly benefit from that decision that is also a fact, government policy has absolutely been influenced by their friends in big consultancies.

 

in this current crisis there flexible workers are excluded from the furlough scheme (the date was set at 29/2) becuase the knew the majority started PAYE after this date and Ltd Co’s are also excluded from the self employed scheme 

 

IR35 was all about “fairness” 😂  pay all of the tax of a permanent worker despite offering flexibility which means large periods out of work.  At the same time we have none of the benefits and none of the security. 

I have quite a few friends sitting  at home with no help whatsoever

I'm one of those people myself. I could furlough myself but would be restricted to the Director salary part of my income - so £561 pcm based on 2018/19. I decided not to bother as I don't live outside my means and am always prepared for a period of no income. I don't begrudge the Chancellor trying to help the majority just because I fall through the cracks as I knew the risks of opting out of employment law protections and had taken steps to mitigate them ie not living in a house I could only just afford, paying cash not credit for my car...

[Unknown user]

5 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

i think that is 707 deaths in last 24 hours

Sky are reporting 708

[Shanks said no]

46 more dead in Scotland. Obviously only the people who have been tested.

[The Internet]

Is it significant that the number of new tests done has gone down by about 1500? Less people going to hospital maybe?

[Marvin]

My neurosurgery op has been postponed. No indication for how long. I'm awaiting a shunt being inserted in the brain. 

[redjambo]

Travelling Tabby site now updated with Scottish stats.

 

https://www.travellingtabby.com/scotland-coronavirus-tracker/

 

Edit: I see that he hasn't updated some of the regional and other stats yet. Best to hold off until 3pm for the fuller picture.

Edited April 4, 2020 by redjambo

[SwindonJambo]

30 minutes ago, milky_26 said:

i think that is 707 deaths in last 24 hours

 

 

It is 708 deaths in the 24 hours up to 1700 yesterday. We report at 1400 daily, 21 hours after the end of the period measured’s cut of time. And as others have already said, this only counts deaths in hospitals. Who knows how many people livIng alone, lying dead and undiscovered in their homes? The number of positive tests is down a bit so there’s a crumb of hope to cling to.

[redjambo]

5 minutes ago, Marvin said:

My neurosurgery op has been postponed. No indication for how long. I'm awaiting a shunt being inserted in the brain. 

 

You hang on in there, Marvin. How long have you been waiting for the op?

[Marvin]

It was supposed to be next month for the pre op but postponed until further notice. 

[Norm]

19 hours ago, BlackJAC? said:

Anyone an ex smoker?  If so, maybe it's time to start again 😂:

 

Was talking about this to a mate, he said he read somewhere there was a thought that the sites nicotine attaches too are the same ones the virus attacks. They think this might cause a problem for the virus to them attach it self to the cell. Neither of us were sure how feasible that was or whether it was believable but thought I'd share it. 

[BlackJAC?]

Watford Hospital have sent out a critical alert. Not accepting any emergencies.  They're supposedly running out of oxygen.  A complete and utter farce if true.  This virus hasn't even began to hit the UK yet, yet here we are. Hospitals already struggling and on their knees because they lack the basics to fight this virus. This is what a decade or more cuts do to a HC system.

 

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by BlackJAC?

[highlandjambo3]

41 minutes ago, redjambo said:

 

You hang on in there, Marvin. How long have you been waiting for the op?

I know the NHS are doing a fantastic job with the resources they have (my wife works in ICU) but, sometimes it breaks down.  We had an elderly couple call a few weeks ago to book a room at our place on Tuesday as it’s close to the main hospital in the highlands, the old boy was having an op on Wednesday and both due to travel back home on the Thursday, they come from the Isle of Lewis so a trip to the main hospital involves ferries & accommodation etc..... these two are in the vulnerable group as well, quite elderly (70ish) and a bit frail looking.  He walks up to hospital Wednesday with his overnight bag only to return an hour later saying the op had been cancelled.  The hospital had tried his home phone number on Tuesday but, they had already left to travel to the hospital..... I mean WTF, I’d have been raging, the old boy has a Mobil phone and the hospital has that number.

[jambo89]

2 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

I’m very aware trust me, only problem is businesses have not done HMRC work, they’ve bypassed it all together.
 

he had the ability to stop this and he did not, his family directly benefit from that decision that is also a fact, government policy has absolutely been influenced by their friends in big consultancies.

 

in this current crisis there flexible workers are excluded from the furlough scheme (the date was set at 29/2) becuase the knew the majority started PAYE after this date and Ltd Co’s are also excluded from the self employed scheme 

 

IR35 was all about “fairness” 😂  pay all of the tax of a permanent worker despite offering flexibility which means large periods out of work.  At the same time we have none of the benefits and none of the security. 

I have quite a few friends sitting  at home with no help whatsoever

Sorry if I’m missing something but haven’t the rule changes to IR35 have been delayed until next year?
 

Also, as a ltd company, can they not furlough themselves and claim back the 80% of their wages? 
 

Earlier in the thread I thought I was in the same boat as your friends (when the help for self employed was announced by the government) but having spoken to my accountant, it would appear ltd company / self employed personnel can furlough themselves. 
 

It is something I intend to do, as the pandemic has effected my income badly (I can’t see any income for the next 4-6 months). 

[OBE]

41 minutes ago, BlackJAC? said:

Watford Hospital have sent out a critical alert. Not accepting any emergencies.  They're supposedly running out of oxygen.  A complete and utter farce if true.  This virus hasn't even began to hit the UK yet, yet here we are. Hospitals already struggling and on their knees because they lack the basics to fight this virus. This is what a decade or more cuts do to a HC system.

 

 

 

Can't see them running out of oxygen, they'll have gauged how much they need for existing patient demand. Their supplies will be swiftly replenished and then some...hopefully.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Old Blue Eyes

[Cade]

UK death toll rises 20% in a single day.

 

Still no mass testing.

Still no contact tracing.

Still only half-hearted pleas to stay indoors.

Still NHS hospitals running out of equipment.

Still no exit plan, or any plan at all other than "see what happens".

 

[ri Alban]

What's this about thick feckers and 5g ?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

5 hours ago, vegas-voss said:

Probably not advising mask use cause there are hardly any about and what there is the NHS need them.

 

No need for a mask when the cheaper and more useless option is being advised in America, a bandana or a scarf, I've even heard that a t-shirt or some other cloth will do, as long as it covers the nose & mouth.

 

'The mayor stressed N95 and surgical masks should be reserved for health care workers on the frontlines of the fight. Instead, he suggested people use things like bandanas, scarves and other homemade options.'

https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2020/04/03/coronavirus-diy-face-masks/

 

[OBE]

6 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What's this about thick feckers and 5g ?

 

Burning 5G masts that also house current critical hardware for 3G and 4G comms.

 

We astonishingly have a growing enemy within.

Edited April 4, 2020 by Old Blue Eyes

[Cade]

11 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

What's this about thick feckers and 5g ?

Fear and stupidity is a powerful combination

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by Cade

[ri Alban]

3 minutes ago, Old Blue Eyes said:

 

Burning 5G masts that also house current critical hardware for 3G and 4G comms.

Eh? Ffs

 

Just now, Cade said:

Fear and stupidity are very strong motivators 

 

Who started it, there must be an original source and if they're from The UK, get them jailed. 

[OBE]

1 minute ago, ri Alban said:

Eh? Ffs

 

Who started it, there must be an original source and if they're from The UK, get them jailed. 

 

The growing menace that is fake news.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Not seen this mentioned on here.

 

BJ has invited other party leaders to help with the coronavirus fight.

https://metro.co.uk/2020/04/04/boris-johnson-invites-opposition-party-leaders-coronavirus-briefing-work-together-12507647/

 

In otherwords, he's saying 'Help!' we haven't got a clue or when the blame game starts you lot will be right in the smelly stuff along with us.

 

Probably both tbh.

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Old Blue Eyes said:

 

The growing menace that is fake news.

Very dangerous.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

5 year old child amongst the latest victims.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52165443

 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

8 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Eh? Ffs

 

Who started it, there must be an original source and if they're from The UK, get them jailed. 

 

Don't know where it all started, but celebs have joined the bandwagon, there is even an online petition against 5G spewing all kinds of conspiracy shit.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/amanda-holden-slammed-scaremongering-shares-21810620