Budge update on Sporting Director role

[Prof]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

Why exactly is this you might ask.? It is because AB has so far refused to remove CL, AM, JD and LF from their roles which is stopping Stendel's team coming in because we can't afford it.

 

That my friend is why so many of us are making a fuss.

Why make a fuss about complete conjecture.

[wavydavy]

5 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

The model Hearts adopted when AB took over worked extremely well . Not sure why people chose to ignore that ?

Yes CL should have stepped down at the end of last season or he should have been told to . Moving upstairs and bringing in a new manager would have taken us back to the original model 

AB has already admitted she made a mistake there . 

What I am certain of both AB and CL had/have the interests of Hearts as their priority .

I think it is very sad that CL's time as manager has ended this way , whatever the reasons . 

The lynch mob mentality on here is shameful

 

 

I am sure their intentions are honourable and as they see it in the best interests of the club.

 

It is not compulsory however to agree with them and I am sure they are both long enough in the tooth to know that.

 

It is a discussion forum hardly shameful but then we are all entitled to our opinions or are we?

[Jamhammer]

13 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

In my opinion for all it's worth she is doing the same thing that she did before she appointed CL as Manger. Making all the right noises about looking for the best person for the job etc when she contradicts herself by then saying this. Quote from EEN. as I posted a few posts back.

 

We’ve got some important decisions to make and me bringing in somebody else new to the club, I don’t think that’s the best way of doing it.

 

 

On Nov 4th she said

Sporting director of Hearts will be one of Ann Budge’s most crucial appointments. The role will not be given to Craig Levein. The club owner is restructuring Riccarton’s football department and, while she will ask Levein’s opinion, a new man will soon be recruited under a new title.

and yet, when you actually read the article that isn't strictly what she says. I sincerely hope you are wrong and he is NOT given that role. Should Stendel get off to a stuttering start he will be blamed 100% and AB is leaving herself open to criticism.

 

Personally I think in your quote she is referring to MacPhee not Levein but that brings it's own issues. He's hardly blameless but, perhaps will be used in the SD role, which apparently utilises his strengths

 

 

Edited December 12, 2019 by Jamhammer

[wavydavy]

1 minute ago, Prof said:

Why make a fuss about complete conjecture.

 

How is it conjecture ?

[davie1980]

5 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

 

The lynch mob mentality on here is shameful

 

 

It's become a dark sinister obsession for a large chunk of our support now.

The feeling we need to cleanse all trace of him from the club.

 

The man has been removed from all first team duties but looking on here and on social media, it would appear some won't be happy until Levein is barred from crossing the Forth, everyone who has ever had a working relationship with the man is purged from the club, irrespective of their own merits and contribution to the club.

The only thing that matter is that these people have been in contact with Levein and must therefore be banished completely.

 

It's getting to the point people are becoming irrational. We have made the change, we took our time getting the right man in.

It would appear the support are behind the new appointment.

 

Now FFS, just back the new manager and drop all the negativity around Levein.

He'll be away in the summer and we can move on. But this lingering ill-feeling can do nothing to help the club when Stendel will want to move us forward positively.

[wavydavy]

3 minutes ago, Jamhammer said:

On Nov 4th she said

Sporting director of Hearts will be one of Ann Budge’s most crucial appointments. The role will not be given to Craig Levein. The club owner is restructuring Riccarton’s football department and, while she will ask Levein’s opinion, a new man will soon be recruited under a new title.

and yet, when you actually read the article that isn't strictly what she says. I sincerely hope you are wrong and he is NOT given that role. Should Stendel get off to a stuttering start he will be blamed 100% and AB is leaving herself open to criticism

 

 

 

The article I was quoting from is 10 December.

[Jamhammer]

1 minute ago, wavydavy said:

 

The article I was quoting from is 10 December.

I know but I was quoting the other one as I was surprised he was "jointly" carrying out the SD role with Austin temporarily. We'll see, in time I suppose.

[luckydug]

21 minutes ago, johnthomas said:

The model Hearts adopted when AB took over worked extremely well . Not sure why people chose to ignore that ?

Yes CL should have stepped down at the end of last season or he should have been told to . Moving upstairs and bringing in a new manager would have taken us back to the original model 

AB has already admitted she made a mistake there . 

What I am certain of both AB and CL had/have the interests of Hearts as their priority .

I think it is very sad that CL's time as manager has ended this way , whatever the reasons . 

The lynch mob mentality on here is shameful

 

Agree especially the last sentence👍

[wavydavy]

10 minutes ago, Jamhammer said:

I know but I was quoting the other one as I was surprised he was "jointly" carrying out the SD role with Austin temporarily. We'll see, in time I suppose.

 

[Randy Marsh]

2 hours ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

If the loser cares that much he should leave.

He cares more about his generous salary.  We are just a small provincial club after all.  If he really cared he should donate a fair wedge of his salary towards the FOH.  He probably doesn't even donate a fiver.

[1953]

26 minutes ago, davie1980 said:

 

It's become a dark sinister obsession for a large chunk of our support now.

The feeling we need to cleanse all trace of him from the club.

 

The man has been removed from all first team duties but looking on here and on social media, it would appear some won't be happy until Levein is barred from crossing the Forth, everyone who has ever had a working relationship with the man is purged from the club, irrespective of their own merits and contribution to the club.

The only thing that matter is that these people have been in contact with Levein and must therefore be banished completely.

 

It's getting to the point people are becoming irrational. We have made the change, we took our time getting the right man in.

It would appear the support are behind the new appointment.

 

Now FFS, just back the new manager and drop all the negativity around Levein.

He'll be away in the summer and we can move on. But this lingering ill-feeling can do nothing to help the club when Stendel will want to move us forward positively.

Well said, spot on!

[GinRummy]

27 minutes ago, davie1980 said:

 

It's become a dark sinister obsession for a large chunk of our support now.

The feeling we need to cleanse all trace of him from the club.

 

The man has been removed from all first team duties but looking on here and on social media, it would appear some won't be happy until Levein is barred from crossing the Forth, everyone who has ever had a working relationship with the man is purged from the club, irrespective of their own merits and contribution to the club.

The only thing that matter is that these people have been in contact with Levein and must therefore be banished completely.

 

It's getting to the point people are becoming irrational. We have made the change, we took our time getting the right man in.

It would appear the support are behind the new appointment.

 

Now FFS, just back the new manager and drop all the negativity around Levein.

He'll be away in the summer and we can move on. But this lingering ill-feeling can do nothing to help the club when Stendel will want to move us forward positively.

 

Dark, sinister obsession? 🤣😀🤣 Like a serial killer or something?

[Francis Albert]

33 minutes ago, davie1980 said:

 

It's become a dark sinister obsession for a large chunk of our support now.

The feeling we need to cleanse all trace of him from the club.

 

The man has been removed from all first team duties but looking on here and on social media, it would appear some won't be happy until Levein is barred from crossing the Forth, everyone who has ever had a working relationship with the man is purged from the club, irrespective of their own merits and contribution to the club.

The only thing that matter is that these people have been in contact with Levein and must therefore be banished completely.

 

It's getting to the point people are becoming irrational. We have made the change, we took our time getting the right man in.

It would appear the support are behind the new appointment.

 

Now FFS, just back the new manager and drop all the negativity around Levein.

He'll be away in the summer and we can move on. But this lingering ill-feeling can do nothing to help the club when Stendel will want to move us forward positively.

Some comments on here read as if it is normal for a sacked manager to hang around a club for months and be remain heavily involved in the club in ill defined ways.

Even Bill Shankly had to be told not to come to the training ground after he continued to hang around after he left the manager's job. 

Edited December 12, 2019 by Francis Albert

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, Mort said:

No issue, I was interested in your view, that's all.

 

If she still belives CL has any kind of "valuable input" then we would be as well packing the whole thing in.

 

Concerning, to say the least.

What a load of utter tosh and biased vitriolic tosh at that.

 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

Some comments on here read as if it is normal for a sacked manager to hang around a club for months and be remain heavily involved in the club in ill defined ways.

Even Bill Shankly had to be told not to come to the training ground after he continued to hang around after he left the manager's job. 

I’m sure Levein would be told the same if that happened as well,  unless we think Stendel doesn’t have the guts to do it? Hopefully he has a wee desk somewhere  in Riccarton or Tynecastle to see out his final months. 

[Gambo]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/football/hearts/latest-hearts-news/ann-budge-reveals-hearts-sporting-director-duties-will-be-shared-craig-levein-and-austin-macphee-1337875

 

This part really tells it all for me.

 

Asked if there will be a quick appointment of a sporting director, Budge replied: “We’ve got some important decisions to make and me bringing in somebody else new to the club, I don’t think that’s the best way of doing it.

He is unsackable.

[Gambo]

7 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

I’m sure Levein would be told the same if that happened as well,  unless we think Stendel doesn’t have the guts to do it? 

Shouldn't be a situation Stendel has to even think about/deal with.

 

He has a big enough job sorting out the mess Levein left us in.

[JamboAl]

5 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Some comments on here read as if it is normal for a sacked manager to hang around a club for months and be remain heavily involved in the club in ill defined ways.

Even Bill Shankly had to be told not to come to the training ground after he continued to hang around after he left the manager's job. 

Shanks wasn't sacked from the club.  He left of his own volition and he himself decided not to keep going to the training ground because he sensed resentment.

CL now has  a redesignated job and would be required to attend Riccarton because I'm fairly sure that will be the place to conduct his new duties.

[Kev1998]

Al, other people have views on our esteemed ex leader, you seem to get all hot and bothered  with the nippy retorts

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, Gambo said:

Shouldn't be a situation Stendel has to even think about/deal with.

 

He has a big enough job sorting out the mess Levein left us in.

I think Frank was talking hypothetically. 😄

[mitch41]

16 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

Both Levein and McPhee have been relieved of their duties and put to work elsewhere in the organisation. Jury is clearly out for  a few weeks on Daly, Fox and Gallagher. Just give it time. I’m amused at the heat that Fox, Daly and McPhee get when our keeper coach has presided over four duds in a row, Hamilton, Bobby, Doyle and Joel. Surely he has been the key man when it’s been time to hire keepers? 

I can’t comment on Gallagher because he never picked them and sometimes you just can’t improve rubbish.

[Victorian]

Guys, guys,   ffs try to compartmentalise and give yourselves a break from the turmoil.     There's a good few ulcers on the way here.

 

Ffs.

[mitch41]

16 hours ago, tcjambo said:

I'll wager she made her fortune because she's smarter than you, analyses situations thoroughly and takes brave decisions. However, you enjoy wallowing in your righteousness lol.

Smarter at IT maybe smarter about football NO.

[JamboAl]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

Not at all I welcome other people's views which gives a balance as we all see things differently and often valid points are made which make sense.

 

You said the way to do it was at the AGM which to me inferred that I should not be asking these questions on here.

I meant the way to get answers is to ask at the AGM.  You can write all you like on here but you're only going to get other people's opinions not the answers you desperately crave.

[Bungalow Bill]

3 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

Smarter at IT maybe smarter about football NO.

Smarter than most on here, not even debatable. 

[mitch41]

12 hours ago, wavydavy said:

 

 

Mitch if you read my posts then you will know that I agree with you.

I wasn’t disagreeing with you and I’m sorry if I gave you and others that impression. 
On my post I’ve only had 3 responses that were not up to much regarding my point of view in fact they had nothing to come back with. 3 wee goes at me shows I’m spot on.

[GinRummy]

1 minute ago, Apache Mal said:

Smarter than most on here, not even debatable. 

 

Smart people make poor choices all the time.

[Boab]

Just now, JamboAl said:

I meant the way to get answers is to ask at the AGM.  You can write all you like on here but you're only going to get other people's opinions not the answers you desperately crave.

You sure.

If Ann repeated, word for word, her interview the other day, in response to a question asked about the SP role, people would still interpret her answer in different ways.

The AGM is not the Oracle it’s made out to be.

Vital, yes, but let’s be honest here, any answers AB gives on Tuesday will be twisted to suit agendas.

Stendel, metaphorically, hasn’t even kicked a ba’ yet !
This set up might work ! Who knows !

 

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

 

Smart people make poor choices all the time.

Harsh on Mitch I feel. 🤷🏼‍♂️😄

[Beast Boy]

On 04/08/2017 at 20:37, Thomaso said:

Levein was one of the classiest players I ever ever seen at Tynecastle. Had the great advantage of playing alongside Sandy Jardine and developed into a superb International player.

 

Tragic that an injury finished his career and I wonder if that experience effected his personality developing into a seemingly arrogant individual.

 

2 hours ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

My only beef with him is what he has done to our team and Club.

 

No, you also have a beef with his personality.

[mitch41]

13 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Harsh on Mitch I feel. 🤷🏼‍♂️😄

😂

[Thomaso]

2 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

 

 

No, you also have a beef with his personality.

Indeed - thanks for reminding me 👍

 

Trolling back to find posts in 2017. How sad! 🙈

Edited December 12, 2019 by Thomaso

[Romulus]

28 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

What a load of utter tosh and biased vitriolic tosh at that.

 

It was quite clearly a sarcastic comment and meant in the sense that we shouldn't be asking for anymore CL input given the damage he has already caused. You already knew that though. You seem to get overly protective about people raising concern over issues at the club for some reason.

 

This forum is a place to discuss all things Hearts, read opinions, debate. No point getting angry about things people say that you don't agree with. Calm down.

[mitch41]

21 minutes ago, Apache Mal said:

Smarter than most on here, not even debatable. 

Smart about economics doesn’t mean being smart running a football club.

[Beast Boy]

3 minutes ago, Cruickshank for Scotland said:

Indeed - thanks for reminding me 👍

 

Trolling back to find posts in 2017. How sad! 🙈

 

Was easy. All I did upon reading your post where you claimed it was only about HMFC that you had a beef with him, was Google:

 

"hmfckickback" "Thomaso" "Craig Levein" "Arrogant"

 

I already knew you were not telling the truth, so I was confident that search would toss up the results that proved it... First hit I think.

[JamboAl]

31 minutes ago, Boab said:

You sure.

If Ann repeated, word for word, her interview the other day, in response to a question asked about the SP role, people would still interpret her answer in different ways.

The AGM is not the Oracle it’s made out to be.

Vital, yes, but let’s be honest here, any answers AB gives on Tuesday will be twisted to suit agendas.

Stendel, metaphorically, hasn’t even kicked a ba’ yet !
This set up might work ! Who knows !

 

No I'm not sure.  I inferred she would probably shy away from business sensitive questions and I doubt if she would give too much info re employees' shortcomings, perceived or otherwise, but I'm sure she would explain as much as is reasonable.  We can't ask for any more than that.

Edited December 12, 2019 by JamboAl

[JamboAl]

8 minutes ago, Mort said:

It was quite clearly a sarcastic comment and meant in the sense that we shouldn't be asking for anymore CL input given the damage he has already caused. You already knew that though. You seem to get overly protective about people raising concern over issues at the club for some reason.

 

This forum is a place to discuss all things Hearts, read opinions, debate. No point getting angry about things people say that you don't agree with. Calm down.

Oh dear.  Backtracking when challenged.

Maybe I should have said "utter sarcastic tosh".

Is that better?

[Francis Albert]

30 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Shanks wasn't sacked from the club.  He left of his own volition and he himself decided not to keep going to the training ground because he sensed resentment.

CL now has  a redesignated job and would be required to attend Riccarton because I'm fairly sure that will be the place to conduct his new duties.

I didn't say he was sacked. Whether or not he was directly told to stay away the fact he felt resented seems to suggest he got the message he wasn't wanted. Unfortunately Craig I suspect has too thick a skin to feel resented.

Jock Stein was offered the chairmanship of Celtic Pools and got the message.

My point is people are being accused of being vindictive and worse for believing that a failed manager should not hang around the football department after he is sacked as if that was not the norm in almost every other case of a manager who leaves. 

[Romulus]

3 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

Oh dear.  Backtracking when challenged.

Maybe I should have said "utter sarcastic tosh".

Is that better?

What? I explained above what i meant, it was rather obvious sarcasm to highlight a point. One you don't agree with, great, who cares.

[Martin_T]

Haven't read through the whole thread, but I think the issue here is how this is being communicated.

 

We were told on October 31st that Levein had been removed from the Head Coach and Director of Football roles, if the club had said at that point that he will continue to operate as Director of Football, there may have justifiably been some discontent but we would have as a fanbase, probably come to terms with it by now.

 

It is the apparent reluctance of the club, almost through a sense of embarrassment to confirm that CL still has a direct role at the club that is perhaps causing the frustration.

[Kiwidoug]

I'm looking forward to the OMT where, despite levein still lurking around, I can predict a confident 2-0 win to get Stendel off to a good start.

[JamboAl]

5 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I didn't say he was sacked. Whether or not he was directly told to stay away the fact he felt resented seems to suggest he got the message he wasn't wanted. Unfortunately Craig I suspect has too thick a skin to feel resented.

Jock Stein was offered the chairmanship of Celtic Pools and got the message.

My point is people are being accused of being vindictive and worse for believing that a failed manager should not hang around the football department after he is sacked as if that was not the norm in almost every other case of a manager who leaves. 

That is the root of your problem.

What other clubs do is not necessarily right (or wrong) and Jock Stein's skillset may not have been ideal (to him) to accept that job.  Red herrings!

[JamboAl]

4 minutes ago, Mort said:

What? I explained above what i meant, it was rather obvious sarcasm to highlight a point. One you don't agree with, great, who cares.

You do, obviously.

[Hansel]

Maybe budge is keeping one eye on the documentary that's currently being made and is trying to spice things up by keeping Levein the panto villain around.

 

 

[Hackney Hearts]

3 minutes ago, Superunknown said:

Maybe budge is keeping one eye on the documentary that's currently being made and is trying to spice things up by keeping Levein the panto villain around.

 

She's so smart. Always one step ahead.

[mitch41]

Did anyone think that Ann Budge looked uncomfortable at the Daniel Stendel press conference. Maybe she was worried that she was going to get questions on Stendel’s two assistants and why he was unable to bring the two of them with him. 
Also could it of been that she was worried about what Stendel might say about the future structure of the football department regarding Levein, McPhee, Daly, Fox ect.

Anyway Ann did look very up tight about something and I’m just speculating as to the reason.

Edited December 12, 2019 by mitch41

[Francis Albert]

8 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

That is the root of your problem.

What other clubs do is not necessarily right (or wrong) and Jock Stein's skillset may not have been ideal (to him) to accept that job.  Red herrings!

I am not clear why Craig's thick skin is the root of my problem I think it has been the root of many problems at the club.

My point was that it is not the norm for ex-managers to hang around and to believe Craig should not be hanging around isn't ourageous or vindictive. Even the greatest managers generally go when their time is up. The offer to Stein was an insult and to suggest he turned it down because he didn't feel up to it is also an insult.

Edited December 12, 2019 by Francis Albert

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I am not clear why Craig's thick skin is the root of my problem I think it has been the root of many problems at the club.

My point was that it not the norm for ex-managers to hang around and to believe Craig should not be hanging around isn't ourageous or vindictive. Even the greatest managers generally go when their time is up. The offer to Stein was an insult and to suggest he turned it down because he didn't feel up to it is also an insult.

Busby took up a similar offer at Man Utd. 

[Gizmo]

5 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

Did anyone think that Ann Budge looked uncomfortable at the Daniel Stendel press conference. Maybe she was worried that she was going to get questions on Stendel’s two assistants and why he was unable to bring the two of them with him. 
Also could it of been that she was worried about what Stendel might say about the future structure of the football department regarding Levein, McPhee, Daly, Fox ect.

Anyway Ann did look very up tight about something and I’m just speculating as to the reason.

It's quite simple, she does not enjoy press conferences or being in the limelight and has admitted to this.

She was further not enamoured by the Barnsley line of questioning from the weegie hacks.

[johnthomas]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

I am sure their intentions are honourable and as they see it in the best interests of the club.

 

It is not compulsory however to agree with them and I am sure they are both long enough in the tooth to know that.

 

It is a discussion forum hardly shameful but then we are all entitled to our opinions or are we?

Where did I say you had to agree with them ?

Where did I say it was shameful to disagree with them ?

Unbelievable how often people reply to posts without , apparently , having read them